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And now, onto the show.
From Data Rails, this is FPNA Today.
Hey, everyone. I wanted to pop in with a quick note ahead of today's episode.
We've recently received some feedback from our listeners.
We've had some special requests for more grizzled financial analysts on the show.
Not that we don't love our influencers and leaders, but we heard from our listeners that they want to hear more insights from the trenches.
So, this is a shout -out to anyone in FPNA, grizzled or not, who would love to join us on the podcast.
If you know someone who's making waves in FPNA or if you'd like to come on yourself, just drop me a message on LinkedIn.
In this episode of FPNA Today, I spoke with Bruno Olivera Silva, a brand new CFO who spent 18 years in the FPNA trenches.
We discussed his diverse career journey and how his experience in sectors like manufacturing and aviation has shaped his financial approach.
Bruno shared valuable insights on managing costs in an industry with external demand constraints and emphasized the role of business partnering in driving FPNA success.
We also explored Swiss sports, post -pandemic transformation, and the integration of data analytics and operational planning.
Let's dive in. Bruno Olivera Silva, who was recently promoted to CFO of Swissport, the world leader in airport and aviation services, brings a wealth of knowledge and leadership to the table.
In his role, Bruno leads not only the FPNA function, but also oversees M &A, financial transformation, strategic pricing, and commercial partnership activities.
He has an MBA in finance and controllership, an FMVA certification from the Corporate Finance Institute, and is working towards his ACCA qualification.
Bruno is deeply skilled in financial modeling, valuation, treasury management, and strategic planning.
He's committed to driving growth and sustainability at Swissport, continuously striving for excellence and impactful financial solutions.
Bruno, welcome to the show.
I am very honored to be here, honored to be the first Brazilian in your show, right?
I was going to say we discussed, yeah, we discussed before we came on.
You are our first Brazilian, so welcome.
We could spend the whole show probably talking about the Twitter ban.
I guess we'll focus on finance instead.
Yeah, let's go. Thank you.
Thank you for the opportunity.
Yeah, we've been talking a bit before the show and talking a little bit about your career journey.
I was wondering if you could walk our audience through your career journey and the diverse industries you've worked in, and how sort of moving across these different industries and countries, how that's shaped your approach to FB &A.
No, yeah, sure. I had the opportunity to work in banks, in the automotive industry, in technology, in the agro business too, in Brazil, in the food industry, working in startup, and now I had the opportunity to be in the aviation industry.
So in the end, finance is finance everywhere, right?
But having the opportunity to understand these very different kind of businesses and how we can create value in all of them, it's a unique opportunity to apply where you are, right?
Because you can gather these different approaches, the different views, and apply in such an unique view.
So I really believe that when I understood that I needed to change my career from finance transaction function to this strategic finance, that's where I really became more relevant to the companies that I work.
And I really believe that my game is stepped up when I work in manufacturing, that you have a sea of data in this wholesale view, and you need to understand where you need to focus, right?
I love that you mentioned manufacturing because through most of my career, I didn't work in manufacturing.
And then when I got into consulting, I started picking up some clients who were in manufacturing.
And it really, it's not just your FB &A, it's your controllership.
It's the accounting is more complex.
And it really, if you can work in a manufacturing environment, a lot of other areas seem a lot easier.
No. And the taxes, that you have a way, a very complex environment, and even more working in Brazil that has such a complex tax and government structure.
Yeah. And so manufacturing has its challenges, and I'm sure aviation does.
And I'm thinking about working in these different industries with operational challenges.
And obviously all industries do have this, but managing costs and aviation when you don't really control demand, and kind of working through these operational challenges.
How has that influenced your approach to finance?
We talked before the call about business partnering, and all the challenges and everything.
And so just, I would imagine seeing these different industries and these different challenges, you've had to tailor your FB &A approach along the way.
Sure. Sure. The example that you gave, for example, for Swissport, that we don't have too much control on our demand because the airlines, they control their schedule.
And we, as service providers, we need to adapt and to be sure that we are cost -aligned.
So we need to be very good on managing our costs.
That's the key. When I understood this movement in Swissport, also it's very important to understand where are the business going, how can we evolve the way, the things that we are doing.
To be very good on managing costs, we need to be very good on transforming our business, on doing things better each day, on the future better.
I think that, for example, considering the complexity of the seasonality of the travel industry, it's a very important factor, too, to have a good planning.
Maybe not a very like three or five years plan, but if you plan very well, you're three to six months ahead, you have great chances to be successful.
Identification of metrics and everybody in the company being locked in and understanding the same metrics is so important.
And when, you know, I'm thinking about cost management, I'm assuming, you know, pretty tight margins, so managing costs is very important.
When you're working with these external demand constraints and you've got to optimize cost management, what are the key metrics that you're tracking?
How often are you reporting on these metrics and what are the most important?
Maybe talk a little bit about some that might be, if you have examples of leading indicators and which ones are lagging indicators.
When you're talking to the rest of the C -suite and to management across the company, what are the key metrics that everyone's focusing on?
Yes. Take a look, Glenn.
At Swissport, we have a very well structured FPNA and analytics team.
These are two separate teams and the analytics team has been working very well with us to be able to provide us information from the operations because the most important thing for Swissport is safety.
We need to ensure that we are serving the aviation industry with a safe operation and also with a very high standard of operational excellence.
So there are a lot of information that we can track daily from the airports, the details of the flights, what was the, if we are achieving the SLAs and what is the perception of our clients regarding any PS with several aspects in these surveys that are applied weekly.
Of course, the financial results are there, format with the quality of the operation and the perception of the flights on it.
So it's not by chance.
And when we go towards the financial view of this, we can understand that talking about the KPIs, right, we can compare, for example, amongst our regions, amongst the countries, Swissport is present in around 60 countries in the world today.
So we have a comparison basis of which countries are very well, which countries are not needing to evolve.
So when talking about KPIs, once we are a service provider, our major costs are of direct labor.
So that's where we are always having our I close, but also on fleet management costs and SG &A.
So using the right KPIs, direct labor revenue, rose margin, and also some other specifics from the industry is the key for striving.
And you mentioned in there that you've got the FP &A team and then the BI or data analyst team being separate.
And then I'm guessing they've adopted sort of the same business partnering approach like the FP &A team does.
So there, tell me a little bit about the FP &A team working with the data analysts and how that flow of information goes and how much direct access FP &A has to information versus how much they're dependent on BI pulling that for them.
Sure. We cannot depend on IT to do most part of our job, right?
But also we need to respect the IT governance and all the limitations and the policies that the company has.
So when we are developing new models, when we are developing new views and exploring this sea of information that huge companies like Swissport has, the key is not just about the information and the modeling, the details on it, but what is the question that we're trying to answer?
We need to, for example, explore one, two, three key problems, create hypotheses for these problems, do like an exploratory analysis, and then try to answer these questions, these important questions, these possible value adding questions to the business.
So I think that FP &A just is not of course just about analyzing data and modeling and everything, but FP &A needs to be able to answer questions that the business needs to know to step up and to keep bringing value to the business.
And do you see FP &A end up crossing over because some of the data they need and some of the audience that they're reporting to is outside of finance.
Do you see the FP &A team crossing over?
I'm picturing two VIN diagrams of the BI group and the FP &A group, and I'm imagining there's a lot of overlap.
Is it difficult sometimes to know where that line, is it a hard line or a blurred line on the type of reporting?
I'm thinking about things establishing your data lexicon and everybody understanding this, reporting from the same source of truth and understanding all that.
Is FP &A pretty involved with the BI group, with defining all that?
Yes, yes. The point is that FP &A almost transitions between everything.
We are a focal point, we are a communication focal point almost all the time.
And mainly when we are talking in our country management, as I am in Mexico today.
So when you consider that FP &A needs to drive this communication, as I said, we need to direct the data people to help us to answer the questions of the business.
So I really understood in the last years the importance of the business partnering and how can we leverage and transform a company making FP &A the center of this communication.
So we need to show people where the money is and how they can increase value addition to the business.
So I think that that's how finance can make a difference.
Yeah, I agree. And this is, being able to do that, hopefully it's the kind of thing that helps finance move from this sort of reputation as a cost center to a real value add to the business.
And when you have that good partnership with BI and have strong teams, that's great.
Because sometimes you can have a lot of fancy dashboards and a lot of things in finance and 2000 different views from the things.
But from my experience, almost all the time, if you have the right analysis, you're going to see.
Yeah. And business partnering, and we talked about this before the show, it's so important and it's really making a difference.
And when I started my career and when you started yours, business partnering wasn't a term that we were using back then.
But we did talk some about how these cross -functional relationships can help really drive success.
Can you maybe give an example of how some of those cross -functional relationships, either at Swissport or at prior companies, how have they driven success in your FBA initiatives?
In a lot of companies that, and I'm talking about global companies and large companies, you can use examples of small and medium companies that has different areas, different business lines, different regions or geographies to manage.
We need to make people talk between each other.
As I said, when finance, when FBA is in the center of this communication, driving the value addition horizontally and vertically, we really make a difference.
So we can use examples of business that have geography management, regional management, and the simple benchmarking of some KPIs and making people have changed best practices and change the initiatives that everyone is doing.
It's in the sample of how quickly you can make the ones that are not that well step up in the show.
So I really believe that the communication is the key for finance.
Yeah, absolutely. It's nice to think about finance getting out of that ivory tower where you're just sitting in front of your keyboard, just modeling things out based on historical data or whatever, and really partnering and working across with the other teams.
Yes. It's very interesting, this dynamic, to manage this dynamic.
It needs to be structured, cannot be informal.
This is very important too.
Do you ever see power struggles with that crossover and overlapping?
Do you ever have to deal with a turf war or working with BI of, oh no, this is ours, we report on this, you stick to your lane.
Do you have any examples of areas like that where you've had to overcome that friction between different groups?
Yes. This often happens.
Because when finance is in the middle of this communication, it's very common that finance also try to over manage the things.
But we need to respect these boundaries with other areas, with operations, logistics, commercial.
So we need to influence into a point where they can put energy, but we need to respect these boundaries in this limit.
So when you create a trustable relationship, these will make easier this influencing and this business parking road.
So this can make a lot of difference to make people trust you.
Yeah. And since you've been doing this a while, I'm thinking about, it's been a few years that we've been talking about business partnering and sort of this new model.
Have you seen the other departments warm up to understand the value they're getting from FP &A rather than just, oh, well, they're reporting on the whole company?
And thinking about that pushback of, I remember the first sort of business partnering sort of embedding relationship I had in other departments was pretty early in my career.
And the initial response we got was, why is finance coming in and poking their nose in my business?
I'll report on my side.
I don't want finance in here.
Do you see any of that still?
And how have you seen that change over the years as FP &A and business partnering has really shown other departments that there is value to working this closely with finance?
No, I got it. I got it.
I have a good example.
I work in a Brazilian multinational cosmetics company.
In the finance structure, they have inserted one finance manager with a team inside each area.
This is not common.
It's not that common.
And this is kind of the dream, right?
This business partner role, it was very kind of turned organic when you have a finance manager inside operations, for example, that becomes a very good partner of the operations director, the operations team.
And you really break this poking view for being able to apply the business partner.
You cannot have people seeing you as the pointing finger one.
They need to see you as a partner, as the business partner role says, right?
This view of the company that have been when they decided to have finance inside like a finance cell inside of each area, really make it way more easier to make each area understand that all the decisions that are made in the end of the day, they have to be financially evaluated.
So sometimes when you have just a central FPNA or a small team in FPNA, it is really hard to ensure that the most part of the decisions in the areas are being evaluated with this financial view too.
Yeah. And I'm also thinking, so we're in the middle of budget season now, and I'm thinking about when in the old days.
You're thinking about budget, right?
Yeah. And in the old days when we budgeted it, it felt, and it's different.
There's the top down approach from the bottom up, and then there's what most people do meeting in the middle, but I think pre -business partnering versus now, I guess, walk me through the budgeting process.
Swissport or one of your other companies, but I'm thinking about having this business partnering and how you're going through and how you iterate through the models.
What kind of tools do you use?
Is it a lot happening in Excel or in your ERPs?
Walk me through the budget process, and in particular, how business partnering is helping in that?
No, of course. For example, here in Swissport, we are doing yearly business plan that directionally puts us where we need to be in the budget processes.
And this facilitates a lot because we do a business plan more high level, seeing the most important QPIs.
Where should we go with the commercial growth?
Where should we go with the margin profitability improvement?
So when we start doing the budget, we already know where we need to go.
So this saves us a lot of time because a lot of companies like to do a zero -based budget.
This is good in some aspects, but it's bad in others because people in the ERPs commonly have a lot of dreams.
When we receive templates or information, we need to be the bad ones and cutting the most part of it.
So when you have a business plan, we already show people where we need to go because we decided to do it together.
So this is a very good difference on making the business partner role in the high level.
But when you go to a more managerial level of the business partner, I think we go back to what I said.
That is, finance needs to show people where the value is.
And once people understand that working together with finance, we can leverage the results, we can leverage the inclusive, the perception of the achievement of that area, but not just because finance help it, but because we work together to achieve it, they realize that finance being close in every
part of the process and mainly in the budget process is very valuable.
So it's way better.
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So when you do that business plan, are you starting with, okay, here's our revenue trend and you factor in the seasonality and you say, if you just continue the trend, this is where we're going to be on revenue, but then maybe you layer in whatever your projects or plans are on top of that.
And then assuming you do this for each region or each business line and all that.
And then from the business plan, do you just say, well, these are our margins.
Let's focus on tweaking costs.
Our goal is to reduce cost of services by X amount.
Is that sort of the structure that happens in the business plan, and then you translate that into the model from there?
Yes. Once we don't have too much control on the demand, we need to understand where the demand is going to draw everything in the board of it.
But also we need to understand where we have more opportunities to grow the business.
And this is very important.
And also connect this with several transformation projects that we are working that can help us to accelerate this margin capture that we seek to.
When we talk about transformation, we talk about, for example, projects that will help us to make operational planning better, to make a better roastering, to build without fails.
So what can we do to ensure that we are capturing 100 % of revenue?
What can we do to ensure that we are being the most effective as possible when executing the costs amongst the stations, amongst the airports?
And how can we see this?
And that's why we do a business plan before the budget.
Because you can see where we are going in a not that detailed level yet, and then in the budget, we deploy it.
So this yearly business plan process has been working pretty well.
It is the second year that we are doing and is working amazing.
And what's the timing on that?
So what is your budget season?
You start with the business plan mid -year, are you on calendar year or fiscal year?
Yes, we are from January to December.
So the conversation starts in May to June.
We finish in July, something like this.
Then we used to work on our forecast to the age two, and then finishing this forecast, we start the budget process.
That's where we are right now.
We just kicked off in the budget process, and we are hoping to finish in the end of November.
Gotcha. And when you're doing your budgets, do you factor in, do you model out macroeconomic expectations and sort of the exogenous outside of the business factors as you're doing that?
Will you run different scenarios for each of the regions?
This is the plan we have to hit, but then you also have to plan for other potential eventualities.
How do you handle that process?
Yes. We analyze a lot of things in this view of risks and opportunities.
We do this firstly in a macroeconomic field.
For example, in support, it's very important the inflation, because this corrects the most part of our costs regarding labor, and also to understand, for example, what are the projections on minimum wage adjustment, because in a lot of contracts, these also are drivers that will impact our costs, and we
need to understand how much of these we can translate to revenue.
So we are all the time analyzing the possibilities of the renewals of the contracts, of where we are going on this margin side, on where my costs are going to be, and how can we work to translate it to the revenue.
This happens during the whole year, because we not only have contracts that have their timing starting in January.
We have, for example, contracts that have anniversary in the middle of the year.
So these negotiations with the clients, with the airlines, are going during the whole year.
Okay, so I want to shift to another part of what your focus has been in your career.
We talked a little bit before the show, and right before the show, I know you've got to leave right after this and go to a meeting on your ERP, but as I talk to more and more FP &A people, it's interesting how much technology is a part of what we do, and how the tools that we're using, the tools that we
need, how much we, not just being finance people, but we also have to have some level of software and data understanding and all that.
But we've been talking for, I don't know, 30 years now about digital transformation, to the point where nobody wants to hear that anymore.
But at first, we thought, well, we'll do this once and then we're done, but really, it's just an ongoing process.
And I know a big part of what you've done in your career has been on financial transformation, business transformation.
Maybe talk about the role of that in your career, and maybe if you have any examples of a very complex transformation you've been through, and how you sort of see that as kind of ongoing.
We're constantly transforming and evolving in finance, and back office across the business.
Yes, I really believe that the most complex set of projects that have been is the current wave of transformation that we are living in in C -Sport right now.
You may know that considering the pandemic in 2020, the aviation industry was very, very harmed.
And we are somehow, since then, creating kind of a new company.
So it's a huge opportunity to be close of the global management and to be part of this moment.
So we have a lot of parallel projects going on at the same time.
We invested a lot in the robust structure of transformation globally.
This is making a difference to be able to push a lot of things at the same time.
And it's really hard to do it, to make people across the 60 countries almost that we work on, to make them have the same view of value addition, of dividing themselves between the daily operations, the daily finance, and support us on the evolution of the projects.
So we have projects in HR, we have projects in operations, we have projects in finance, and everything is going on at once.
It's crazy. Yeah. And it's never ending.
And now everybody's talking about how are we going to use AI in our business.
And different businesses may be set more on industry and size.
Different businesses are going into AI at different paces.
And there is sort of a...
Some people are diving in right now, and others are taking a more cautious wait and see approach.
And I'm saying, it's in traditional industries, and you're seeing more people take this wait and see approach to leaning into generative AI.
I'm wondering, have you guys been working with any generative AI tools at Swiss port, or even if not generative AI, maybe some machine learning, sort of traditional AI to focus on forecasting or anything on the back end?
Yes. There are some machine learning embedded in our operations projects.
This is going to help us to understand, for example, how could we do better the roastering planning.
We have airports that has like a hundred daily flights.
In Brazil, we have...
For example, you can compare Brazil, the VCP airport in Cancun airport in Mexico.
We have almost a thousand employees in each of these airports.
So there's a lot of things happening all the time in the same time, and we need to be sure that we are being the most efficient as possible.
So using this help of the AI and the machine learning is the key to accelerate this evolution.
But in the daily basis, we are still evaluating how could we support the local teams to have tools like these.
By the moment, we are not exploring that much.
Well, on that note, looking at where FP &A is today and what the impact of AI might be in the future, what do you see as the most critical skills that FP &A professionals would need to really focus on over the next five to 10 years?
There's the classic skills, but is that evolving?
Are you seeing that the skill set is poised for a change?
What would you recommend for FP &A where they would focus to improve their skills?
But at the moment, I will not say something specific to you, like in a specific tool or knowledge that you need to have, but I'll give a tip that really helped me a lot that I really tried to learn a lot of different things, but mainly understanding, okay, what we have new now.
This example of AI that is not that new, but we need to understand that finance will not be the ones that are going to develop things in AI.
We cannot do the BI job, but we need to know where we can achieve, where can we go with all these tools that are available in the market and that are available in a daily environment.
So I think the most important for an FP &A professional is to explore to understand what can be done to this whole set of Swiss knife that you can have, but to understand what is the moment of the company that you are, what can really be applied, not just like a dream of AI and everything, but what can really
be done in your company to make your process better.
So a very good example that I give is, okay, I think that should be mandatory for FP &A professionals to understand how to work with Power Query, for example.
Okay, we need to stop using that.
Okay, we can do a lot of formulas.
It's okay, and we're going to talk about formulas a little bit.
I know that is a traditional question in your show.
That's right. I talked a lot about it, so I really need that the finance professional needs to know where can we go.
We need to be the visionaries.
We need to have a vision.
The tool that you're going to use to apply this vision depends on a lot of things, depends on your company, depends on the strategies, depends on the moment, depends on the team that you have.
You need to evaluate which way, which pathway it will be better for you to succeed.
Yeah, I think the tools are going to keep evolving and changing.
So being, obviously, the ones that are the stalwarts that are going to be there, you need to be very good at those and adding in Power Query and some of the other tools that are out there.
But I think that as more and more of the sort of more mindless tasks that we used to have to do, I think more of those are going to be automated.
And to me, for finance professionals, I mean, we all took finance in our degree.
I mean, we all took statistics in our finance programs, but really kind of leaning in a little bit more to statistics and understanding kind of the law of large numbers and what you can do with it and when certain models might apply.
And then I'm not saying become machine learning engineers, obviously, that's a whole different skill set, but sort of understanding the basics of how data science works and being able...
Part of that is education and part of that is partnership with the BI teams and really having that relationship with them so they can explain to you, this is a K -means clustering algorithm, and this is what it does, and this is when it's useful.
And being able to have that rapport and be able to sort of talk the talk will really help, because I think we are going to have more time to kind of lean into that.
So understanding what the data scientists are doing and how we might benefit and knowing what to ask them for to help us with our forecasting.
This is a very strong sentence.
Know what to ask. And this connects with what I was saying, that we need to know where we want to go.
For being able to be in that vision that you have, you need to create this roadmap to success and know the tools and know where to go.
Maybe not to know exactly how to model and how to create a pharma in SQL and, I don't know, Python, whatever we are talking, but help driving the technical teams to evolve to your vision.
Yeah, well said. All right.
Well, I think we could go down, especially down Transformation Road, all day.
And it's work that's never done, but it's key to be able to keep adding value.
So appreciate the work you're doing there.
This is a never -ending pathway.
So I really admire, for example, the Brazilian company of cosmetics called Volticario.
They have a very, very first -class data team, and they are doing things that no one is doing in the world.
We can really invite our audience to research a little bit about the data work of the Volticario team, and they will understand that.
How could also the data be an accelerator, the data team and the IT team being an accelerator of a lot of understanding of these kind of questions that I was saying that finance needs to help as answering, too.
But if you have a good data team, this is going to happen a lot, way faster.
And that's something I'm very passionate about, too.
As listeners will notice, I've gone down the road of talking a lot more about data.
But it is, we're learning how to use it more, and it is becoming more and more a part of what we do.
Well, we're getting towards the end of the show, and we always like to bring it back to our guests at the end.
And one of the things that we always ask, there's kind of two questions that we ask of everyone.
And the first is, we dove straight into your professional background and everything, but we didn't really talk anything on the personal side.
So what's something that not many people know about you?
Maybe something that they couldn't find just by Googling you real quick.
Okay, just let me see.
And well, my first first job, I was a boarding clerk in the shipping industry.
And I used to visit the vessels in Port of Santos.
That is the Latin America largest port.
So this was a very, very good experience.
But then I got tired of working in the old times of the day, and the night, and noon, and everything.
So I joined a Brazilian bank.
That's why that's where I started my finance career.
And I played guitar since nine years old.
There's something interesting too.
And I've been in 2021, if I'm not wrong, in the financial modeling World Cup.
I placed it in the 2021 season in the fifth place in Latin America.
So it was a very, very fun experience to be a helpful help to Andrew and to Queensman that runs the worldwide in the Brazilian version of the financial modeling World Cup.
So that's great. That had to be a blast.
Somehow that slipped by me in your bio.
That's pretty exciting.
And great credential.
Yes. I know. It was for fun.
It was not for anything else and it was very interesting, for example, to work in different business and a lot of things that they bring as the challenge that we have monthly.
So it was really nice to do.
That's great. Well, since you've done all that, and since you went and since you have your FMVA, and because you came up through FPNA through the ranks to CFO, we know you're in Excel with.
So the next question that I have for you is what is your favorite Excel function and why?
Okay, let's go. I wasn't sure about this, what to answer here for you.
And since this morning, I thought a lot about this yesterday in the night, but I really, really like what we can do with some product.
So I think how versatile is this formula?
So it's amazing that you can do a lot, a lot of different things with some products.
That's great. That's great.
And that's a common one we get to.
So yeah, well, this has been great.
It's been good to kind of, you know, this summer we've been focused a lot on more on the data side and AI.
But it's good to remind that it's great to talk about this, but there is our core job of being FPNA professionals.
And even, you know, even at the CFO level, it's still a big part of our job more than just leaning into AI like I have been.
So really, it's felt good to kind of get back to our roots and talk FPNA with you.
And I guess, you know, congratulations on the recent promotion to CFO and for our listeners out there, how can our listeners connect with you and learn more about your work?
Yes, you can add me up in my link heading is slash B O Silva.
It will be a pleasure to connect with people.
And just finishing, I really liked everything that we discussed here.
It was an honorable opportunity to talk with you.
I'm really great fan of the show and wrapping up everything that we said, I really believe that we need to understand the company's language and the moment of the company that we are.
So all your narratives, your projects, and everything that you're going to work through, you need to adapt to understand, okay, where we are, we are, we are crawling, we are walking, we are already running.
So understanding where we are is the key to not be frustrated.
So you're gonna work exactly on what we need to work.
And you're gonna evolve and bring people with you faster if you are very conscious of what you can do right now, what we can do tomorrow, and what you can do in the next years.
Very well said and great advice to close out the show on.
So thank you again, Bruno.
Thank you. Thank you, Glenn.
