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Hey everyone, before we start this episode, I just wanted to clear something up really fast.
During this episode, at one point, I talk about Ian and Myra picking up one of their victims at a liquor store.
I refer to the liquor store as a packy, P-A-C-K-Y, because in New England, especially Boston, that is slang for package store aka liquor store and it comes from the prohibition era I promise you can ask any New Englander.
That's what it means. I wasn't referring to a person.
I was referring to a building. That is very clear in how I say But I wanted to clear that up because I know words mean different things in different parts of the world. and i would never want anyone to think that but i think we can look at the context that i used it in and know that that's i was referring to a building And that if you know us, you know that we are not at all racist.
So... I will never use that word again on the podcast because I don't want to confuse anybody.
But just know that New Englanders use weird words like bubbler for water fountain.
And, you know, package store or packy for liquor store.
So I'm very sorry if anybody was a little jarred by that word because they didn't know that we use it for that building.
But just listen again and you will see I'm referring to the building.
I am not referring to a person. And yeah, I just wanted to make sure that was clear because the last thing I would want to do was have our UK listeners think I'm a shitbag.
So I promise you that's what it means. I'm born and raised in Boston and that is just in my vernacular.
So, again, I will not use it on the pod because now that I know that it's very jarring for our UK audience, listeners and beyond to hear and that it's different than what it means here, I won't use it because...
Why would I ever want to offend you guys?
I just wanted to put that out there. for letting me know and thanks for educating me on that because it looks like none of us knew what the other person called it or what it had what it referred to in different parts of the world so I think we all learned something here and I hope you enjoyed the episode and It's a terrible one, but we'll get through it together again soon. was not referring to a person, New England slang.
I'll even post a link to some articles in the show notes just to make it very clear.
So on to the horrific tale of Ian Brady and Myra Hindley, part three.
Hey weirdos, I'm Ash. And I'm Elena. And this is Morbid.
This is very morbid. This is the morbidest of all.
Guys, part three. of the Moore's murders is going to be the worst one, I think.
Because guess what? It's not even over at part three.
Elena has an announcement. spoiler alert there's gonna be four parts to this because were you gonna say that at the end No, I was going to say it.
It's not even a spoiler. Well, we're going to have four parts because Let me say this first, just in case everybody's like, no, I'm not waiting for another part.
I'm going to give you your closure at the end of this.
We're going to get to the sentencing. So I'm not going to leave you with some crazy cliffhanger that you're like, Now I have to wait two days to hear it.
Your closure is coming, but so much happened after. the sentencing and after they were put in prison, I feel I would be remiss not to do an entire episode on what happened after that.
That would be very remiss of you. So think of the fourth episode as kind of like bonus information.
It's not stuff that you're like... I'm not going to leave you on a cliffhanger so you feel screwed at the end of this.
And the fourth episode will be coming out on Wednesday because that's our release schedule.
So Wednesday. At the end of the day. Wednesday it will come out, I promise.
On Wednesday. We release on Wednesday and Saturday.
Wednesday, Saturday. So it'll be there Wednesday.
It's going to be, you know, part four will be... Part four will be a little more like... it's yeah it's not as heavy we're not going to hear about any more murders so it's like Are we really just going to hear about Anne and Myra arguing with each other over the details? kind of like the crazy things that happen in prison with them so that'll be more of like a whoa okay so that's that's cool you know those whoa Well, I think we should start off with a little bit of lighter news before we really dive into the hellhole that we're about to be in.
Bring you up to crash you back down. Exactly.
If you don't have social media or you're Ron Swanson and you're off the grid. it's okay yeah we get it i'm gonna tell you right now the exciting news that you may have missed We have partnered with like a merch team and we have. new merch.
We have actual merch. Actual merch. Like, it's so exciting.
Don't worry. We're still working with Murder Apparel.
Yep, murder peril is part of it. To this whole new thing that we're doing.
Because we love them. I mean, we could never let go of murder peril.
We have a special place in our heart for Murder Apparel.
We're essentially family. Yeah. our coffee date yeah so fun it was wonderful well the new merch website if you didn't see it on social media is shop.morbidpodcast.com.
Again, that's shop, S-H-O-P dot morbidpodcast dot com.
There's hoodies, there's t-shirts, and we're working on like a ton more.
As we get new things, some things are going to filter out.
I mean, we're going to give you... ample time to see what's there right now and order some stuff but just know that it's not gonna be there forever.
As we introduce new stuff, other stuff is gonna get filtered out.
Yeah, and we'll constantly be adding new designs and new styles and new items, so just we'll keep you updated on all that, but check back whenever you can. and you know it's fun it is fun we're already working on new stuff like right now yeah we feel so excited that we actually have like real merch to give So exciting.
And that we don't have to send it out from our living room.
Yeah. We have finally made it. Finally that we can.
Well, that's not even true. I have one more shipment to send out.
Don't worry. there was like a little problem with the distributor, but I'm getting it sent out.
But now we don't have to do that. And that's great.
No. But now that we've gotten that like exciting news out of the way, let's go womp, womp, womp.
Yay. So when we last left you guys in part two, we had heard about the murders of Pauline Reed...
John Kilbride, and Keith Bennett. And they were equally horrifying all across the board.
Yep, we heard how Ian and Myra have a very specific way of going about things.
They plan it out to a T. Myra fucks up the plan myra fucks up the plan a lot but somehow they keep getting away with it and they kill the rape and bury children on Saddleworth Moor.
That's their thing. They do continue to do that, but this next murder... of leslie ann downey oh no 10 years old is the one that i began part one mentioning because it's the one that first of all deviates... it's the first one that deviates away from what they've been doing because what they've been doing the first three times was they you know they pick out a kid They lure that kid in with the promise of something because they want them to help them find Myra's lost glove on the moors that's means so much to her and because kids are always wanting to help you that's how they they just preyed on that i was gonna say preying on a weakness They continue to prey on weakness and prey on the helpfulness and kindness and naivete of children, which is nice.
But they now bring this child to Myra's home.
Oh, so that is very different. Very risky, very... out of the ordinary.
Yeah, very horrible, I'm assuming. No, it's important to say here that Ian and Myra don't live together.
They stay together a lot. So they're essentially living together.
Myra lives with her gran. Oh, she does? So this home that this happens in...
Her gran lives in this home. So she's like, this is like very Jeffrey Dahmer-esque.
Yep, sure is. And Ian was also living with his mother and his stepfather, his birth mother and his stepfather.
So they're like 20 somethings living at home, bumming off their parents and murdering kids in their parents' house.
That's the worst kind of 20-something-year-old you can have live in your house.
There's a 20-something-year-old that's going to murder kids in it.
Did Gran ever, like, come out and say anything?
She heard things. She did. Yeah. We're going to hear that.
Oh my god. Yeah. Poor Gran. Poor Gran. Poor everyone.
We're also going to learn that the Hindley gals are kind of just fuck ups all together.
Oh, really? Yeah. Maureen's. Maureen's a fuck-up too?
She's a fuck-up. I mean, she's not... She's not a murderer?
I abduct, rape, and murder kids fuck-up, but...
She's a fuck up. Okay, let's go. I'm ready.
So let's do this. So... We are going to start by introducing somebody who doesn't become a victim.
Well, not a murdered victim of them, but she's important.
Okay. so this is a girl named patricia hodges hi patricia she's 12 years old Her mother was Elsie Masterson, and they lived a couple of doors down from Myra's gran's place.
Okay, so this was in like an apartment-y kind of building.
So... She often went over to Myra's house, where Ian and Myra often were.
She would go over there, she'd hang out with them a lot, she would bring her toys over there.
By all accounts... Ian and Myra didn't hurt her.
Interesting. But then, maybe they did. Okay.
So. i'm so confused i know they would take her to trips to the moors a lot And they'd like go have picnics.
They also gave her wine a lot. And she was 12. which I would argue is hurting but like whatever I mean but then again I'm from America and I know like in New York that's very different so but like when it's them giving yeah i don't want anything that they're giving i think it's I think it's them giving kids wine that I'm like, but yeah, they would give her wine a lot.
So. Myra claims that there was nothing sexual, nothing inappropriate about their relationship, but...
At a Medico Legal Society meeting in November of 1967, There's a weird comment that was said about this.
They said, so this is what one of the people that were part of this meeting said.
Quote, they had shown some affection towards the little girl, Pat Hodges.
They had also shown some of their sexual perversity towards her because she had been subject to assaults in the presence of Myra.
Now, there is no more information about that.
To me, that sounds like she saw Ian and Myra like they did something in front of her.
No, she was the subject of assault in the presence of Myra, meaning Ian assaulted her.
In the presence of Myra. Okay. And we will see this could, so at first when you hear this, you're like, oh my God, what else?
So nothing really came out of that. But then we bring back someone from a previous part that can shed a little light on this, maybe.
Whom? Ronnie Sinclair, the ex, aka Myra Hindley's Ex-fiance that they were gonna murder so I just didn't do it.
What did he say? So Ronnie Sinclair was sitting in a pub and one weekend around where they lived yeah ian comes walking into the pub and he doesn't know ian So Ian walks in.
Does Ian know him? Ian knows him because remember, Ian had done the reconnaissance.
He was going to murder him. Oh, yeah. He was following him to work.
He knew his whole schedule. Forgot about that.
But Ronnie doesn't know Ian. So he walks in, Ian sits next to him, starts chatting with him.
Eventually, he brings up Myra, his girlfriend, and Ronnie's like, oh, shit.
Okay, like, that's my aunt and just realizes he's like, oh, awesome.
We were going to get married. I think he's like, oh, you're the you're that guy.
Yeah. Yeah. So then Ian starts bragging about his life of, like, breaking into homes and stealing shit and how he's so good at it and he makes so much money at it. and basically tried to get Ronnie in on a job with him.
He was like, oh, do you want to be like a lookout?
You can make some money. No, thanks. And Ronnie was like, no, thank you.
So then Ian breaks out this fucking photo and he's like, well, are you into this? takes it out of his jacket, Patricia shows him this photo and he's like, Hey, do you like this kind of thing?
It's a naked young girl bound and gagged.
Ronnie said he thought the girl looked to be about 13 and he was horrified.
So he was like, Nope, I don't like that.
Like, no, thank you. That's not my thing.
And Ian ignored that and said he took the photos himself and he was like, the girl's fine.
Like she agreed to do it. And he said he had more like that.
And Ronnie was like, no, I'm good. Yes, still not my thing, bro.
Like, just, nope. Shouldn't be anyone's thing.
And he also so then Ian also asked him, do you know any girls who will pose for me?
No. And he was like, what? And then he said, I prefer 16 to 20 year olds, but like, I'm really down for anything.
I love that he just like offered all of this up.
Well, Ronnie's like, what the actual fuck?
So Ronnie's like, good day, sir. I came here for a casual beer.
Well, now it's speculated that the girl in that photo may be Kat Hodges.
And it's never been, like, confirmed. But that, to me, seems like something might have happened there.
Yeah. There's no way that girl was hanging out with them and something bad didn't happen.
No, I just don't. They're too... I mean, I hope... to everything that it didn't, but it just doesn't seem that way to me.
They're not the kind of people don't do something to a child.
Exactly. And later, Patricia testified. She said, we went up to the Moors together about once or twice a week they took wine up with them they took wine with them nearly every time so it sounds like they really liked wine I mean, same.
Well, like I said, they drank a bottle a day together.
I mean, not same. And you know what? It affected both of them later in life, so don't do that.
Oh, did it? Yeah, they were real sick later in life.
A bottle of wine a day is a lot of wine.
And they were heavy smokers, like they were...
And they were killing people. So I think just all of that was probably not great for the skin.
For the complexion. Yeah, no, it's not. Thank you.
Why are there ridges on Risa's peanut butter cups?
Probably so they never slip from her hands.
Could you imagine? I'd lose it. Luckily, Reese's thought about that.
Wonder what else they think about. Probably chocolate and peanut butter.
So during, they did a reinvestigation of the case in 1987, like long after they had been caught.
And Myra told an investigator, Peter Topping, who he's the one who took like her famous confessions.
He got a lot out of her. But he got a lot of bullshit out of her, too.
And everybody kind of looks at it to be like, oh, look what Myra said to him.
Because she is just a lot of bullshit. Yeah.
Well, she said to him that both she and Ian had like what she called an affectionate relationship with Pat.
Uh-huh. Which is like, I don't want an affectionate relationship with Myra Henley.
And she said, no, absolutely not inappropriate, not sexual at all.
And she said, but like, when we would all go in the car, she sometimes would sit on Ian's knee.
And Ian didn't do anything. And I'm like... yeah i don't love that no so that's just showing you a little bit about like They didn't just kill kids.
I'm pretty sure they were doing lots of other things and those kids were not being murdered.
Yeah. So they were just all around shit bags.
Ew, this is making me feel so yucky. So after we have that, because Patricia does come back during the trial, just like briefly, but I figured it was important to say.
Now we're going to come to Boxing Day in the UK.
Okay. Is that the day after Christmas? Yes, December 26th.
This was 1964. The record that would be associated with Leslie Ann Downey's murder, because remember, they have to have a record for everything.
Yeah. was Girl Don't Come by Sandy Shaw.
Okay. Now, Leslie was 10 years old when she was murdered.
She was petite build, um, She was 4 foot 10 inches tall.
She had curly brown hair and blue eyes. Oh, my gosh.
She's like the cutest little nugget. Beautiful.
I mean... That picture of her smiling with those little chubby cheeks.
She looks like a baby doll. It destroys me.
She looks like a cabbage patch. it destroys me and i think i like tweeted about this last night because i had to step away from this particular case, like this murder.
You were texting me. Elena was literally like, I...
Just want to let you know that tomorrow is going to be horrible.
Yeah, I was like, this is going to be really bad.
Like it's a bad. and I had done the rest of the case like this part and then I had I had left Leslie's moment for last because I just couldn't couldn't get to it to get through it I had read it a million times before and it always bothered me.
It's haunted me since I first read it. kids at that point either.
My goodness. Now it's just way too much remains.
So bad. But I'm going to give it to you guys because one, her story should be told and two, it's my job.
So I'm going to do it. so she was beautiful we posted a photo we'll post another one yeah her mother ann west let me just tell you this woman i she has since passed away but you're really gonna me up huh You just want to wrap your arms.
I don't know how she survived how she did.
I really don't. So her mother Ann West said about Leslie, she always did as she was told.
She came in from school at night. and she would go up, change out of uniform, make her bed, come down and do her homework.
She was perfect. She was absolutely perfect.
Oh my god. That like her saying that like hurts.
It's like... So when Leslie was abducted, the evening she was abducted, she was wearing a red tartan dress with lace trimmings.
Stop. She was wearing a pink cardigan over it, red shoes, a blue coat and she was wearing a string of white, a necklace with white beads on them And her older brother Terry had given it to her the day before for Christmas.
Why does everything have to be so horrible?
I swear they knew these things somehow. So what happened on Boxing Day was Leslie went to a fair with her neighbors.
Her older brother, Terry, was supposed to go with her, but he became sick with the flu that day and he couldn't go.
Mm-hmm. So the next door neighbor, Mrs. Clark, was going to take her own children and said she would take Leslie and her little brother Tommy with her. and Mrs. Clark was like oh don't worry and like the mother she was like I'll watch them like they're not gonna go alone That's why her mother allowed her to go without her present.
Unfortunately, at the last second, Mrs. Clark decided not to go and sent the kids by themselves.
And didn't tell Anne that? Nope. so okay it wasn't long before so they got to the they got to the fair They lasted for a little while.
There's only so much to do when you have so much money in your pocket.
They all had a couple of coins. So they ran out of money.
They got kind of bored and they were like, all right, let's go back home.
And I I think everything I read was like, they went back home for tea, which I was like, I love the UK.
I was like, that's amazing. But they wanted to go back.
But Leslie... Was like, I really want to like hang out at the fair a little more and just like see everything.
So I'll catch up with you. No. So they left and she stayed.
Never leave your friends alone. I know. These were all like young kids.
But the last person to see Leslie alive, aside from her vicious murderers, Myra Hindley and Ian Brady, fuck both of them, was bernard king who was 11 at the time and he was attending the fair yeah he said he saw myra hindley wearing a dark wig and he said she was holding leslie's right hand and leading her willingly out of the Oh, that's haunting as fuck.
And he says that he was like knowing what I know now.
Like, he was like, I was 11. I had no idea what I was witnessing.
And he said she wasn't kicking and screaming.
She wasn't dragging her out of the fair.
To me, it just looked like somebody walking.
He could have thought it was her mom. Yeah.
He was like, I didn't think anything of it until I saw later and was like, holy shit.
That's what I saw. Horrible. So what they did was they used another ruse to play... kids need to help adults what did they do they dropped boxes near Leslie and And then they were like, oh, can you help us?
And she was like, oh, yeah, I can help you bring them to your car. sweetest little being ever.
Exactly. So then I think that what they did was they asked her, you know, can you help us load them to our house and then we'll bring And she was like, sure, I can help you do that. now Ian says he wasn't there for this whole ruse part because he was like that wasn't my thing like Myra was the one to lure them in I was the one to pick them up afterwards.
Myra says that, so he says Leslie was already in the car when she came to pick him up.
Okay. Like, she had done that part by herself and they met up.
Now, she says that Ian was with her when they did the box thing, so... who fucking knows with these two shit stains like they're just they're always trying to fuck each other over they begin the whole thing trying to save each other and then they go The total opposite of trying to fuck each other over.
So who knows? Either way, they got her out of the fair.
Yeah. Unfortunately, willingly. which is how that I think that's one of the things that's so bad about this case is like all these kids were led like honestly like myra said herself like lambs to the slaughter yeah They had no idea what they were in for.
They were children. How could they have possibly...
They just wanted to help. Conjured up. What could happen to them?
That's the whole thing is they just thought they were going to help and like go home after.
Yeah. So it's just so fucked up. So meanwhile, Leslie's mom, this just, I had to include this because this just shows who she was. and this just, this is gonna hurt your heart.
Leslie's mom had made a bunch of snowballs to throw at Leslie and Tommy.
When they got home, she was excitedly waiting for them.
Oh, my God. I just got chills. chills oh this one's so bad so leslie was brought okay this is where it's gonna get really bad okay And I'm going to get through it.
I was like, can you do it? But like... Fuck.
Okay. So Leslie was brought to Myra's gran's home where her gran was visiting her uncle Jimmy for the night.
She was gone. And the 16 minutes of tape tells us what happens next.
16 minutes. is this just an is this like an audio recording this is an audio recording okay and they don't they only recorded them trying to take pictures of her get undressing her oh god and terrifying her for 16 minutes before you said the actual audio has not been released.
It has not been released to my knowledge.
Everything I've read says that it hasn't been released to the public.
Gotcha. There was a point when Ann West did say she wanted to release a portion of it for a documentary because she wanted to show it.
Look how vicious these monsters are. Right.
And to tell her child's story, but they determine that it's too harrowing. for the public to hear.
Wow. Yeah. So she is heard at the beginning of the tape. screaming and crying.
She's pleading with them to let her see her mummy.
Oh yeah, you said that in the beginning.
Like, that's fucked up. appeals to God at one point and pleads to God.
She literally says, God, help me, please.
They're heard through the whole time they're trying to force a handkerchief in her mouth.
Ian is terrifying and cruel on this tape.
He doesn't say a lot, but what he says is... Chilling.
Chilling. Myra says a lot of the stuff, but Ian is very terrified.
Are you gonna say what they say? So he's trying to force the gag into her mouth and he keeps telling her to shut up.
Both of them are telling her to shut up.
She's crying and screaming the entire time.
At one point, he tells her if she keeps struggling, he's going to cut her neck open.
Oh my God. she's a 10 year old mm-hmm who's crying for her mother mm-hmm like how I don't understand.
He's the depths, the depths of depravity.
He really is. Like both of them. That's what they wanted out of this.
That's the sick part. This is what they got off on.
Especially, I will say especially Ian. Ian got off on cruelty to children.
Yeah. That's just what he got off on. Myra, I think, just like got off seeing Ian get off.
Exactly. So it's fucked up on a whole different level.
So he tells her he's going to cut her neck if she doesn't stop struggling.
Myra, who later pretended she was a member, was not as evil as Brady.
And didn't she say she wasn't even there?
Oh, yeah. She comes out with all kinds of stories. she is heard being just as cruel and says at one point, as the child is screaming and crying for her mother, and at one point is like, please just let me say something.
Please just let me say it. Like she's trying to talk.
Fuck. And she says, in your mouth, hush, hush, shut up or I'll forget myself and hit you one.
So, Myra, fuck right off with that shit that you are being manipulated by Ian Brady.
You are this crazy. cruel motherfucker who looked a ten-year-old in the face while shoving a fucking gag in her mouth. and told her you were going to fucking hit her.
Like, yeah, and you weren't there. And you're going to... Her supporters...
People supported her? I want to start a group that's like punch a Myra Henley supporter.
Because honestly, if you supported this shit... fuck off she had supporters she had tons of supporters who thought that she was being railroaded and thought that she was manipulated by Ian Brady and poor fucking Myra.
She would never have done this without him.
That's mind-boggling. And that she was being unfairly represented in the press.
And it's like... We don't need the press.
This is audio tape. Yeah, listen to the audio.
Like, are you kidding me? Wow. So at one point...
Even not alone, I wanted to run out of here.
At one point, she tried to call them mommy and daddy.
And I think it was possibly to appeal to some kind of humanity in them.
To be like... Because a normal adult would hear a child calling you mommy or daddy and would be like, fuck, what the hell is happening here?
Yeah. But... With them, it just fed their evil.
Like a yucky thing. The audio tape ends after they had bound and gagged her and stripped her naked. oh my god uh the song's jolly old saint nicholas and the little drummer boy i can be heard playing uh they then took this is like makes me want to i'm like i'm like nauseous I was honestly like that.
I had to step away. Like I'm nauseous right now.
And I'm giving you a very... generalized overview is that i really don't like kid cases like i don't want to do it for a long time i don't like this one i really don't but this case is so necessary to tell.
Um, They then took photos of Leslie naked in several positions in Myra's room.
She was sexually assaulted, raped, and then she was murdered.
There is debate about exactly how she was murdered because when she was found it was difficult for them to tell.
I will get into it in a minute. But of course, as always, Myra... you know, the bullshitting anal fissure that she is.
She said that she was looking away the whole time because she was nervous that Leslie's screaming would be heard through the open fucking window.
Why was the wind like what? Well, that's a lie right off the bat.
Yeah. As Dr. Alan Keatley points out in his book, there's no way they would have left a fucking window open.
They planned everything down to a letter.
And somebody would have heard her and been like, what the fuck's up? there's just no way he would have been that careless I'm like genuinely like very not nauseous right now like i feel like i'm gonna barf i'm glad we got through that part of it because I needed to get out of my fucking brain and I need to never look at this again.
She's a lying sack of shit. Like that's I mean, like we said, she can be heard throughout the entire audio.
So fuck off. And I hope she's, I honestly hope that Myra Hindley is getting the same exact treatment that Leslie got. in hell or wherever the fuck she is right now i hope it's a daily occurrence yeah same Because, oh, it's so, this is such an infuriating case.
It's just disgusting. I'm so angry. It's just like disgusting.
It truly is. It truly, truly is. Like, I'm not kidding you.
I would kill her myself. Oh, yeah. I think about Ann West and I mean, all these all these parents, but like Ann West.
Just this is. Like she probably. Did she have to go to like the trial?
Oh yeah. Because I don't know. I wouldn't be able to sit there without trying to murder. her well don't worry with my bare hands and ann's very vocal and i just want to hug her each time Well, then Myra said, so first she said she was looking out the window and she'd she didn't know what was happening she didn't see her killed she didn't see her raped she didn't see any of it Then she says, oh, no, you know what?
I was in the bathroom after the photos were taken and I was running a warm bath for her.
Oh, you were running a warm bath for her?
Before you killed her. How sweet. How nice of you to do before you brutally murdered her.
Really? Like, that's what you were doing?
So she said she waited in there for a while.
And then she came out and saw Leslie face down on the bed, dead.
And she had clearly been raped. But she was like, I didn't hear anything.
I didn't see anything. Of course not. Really?
Like, you're in a small, like... apartment yeah but you didn't hear anything like okay Cool.
Now, on the stand later when they got arrested, the Attorney General basically told Myra, with this story that she was full of shit.
And even he was like, even if you were looking out the fucking window, it's a tiny room.
Right, like you heard something. This is not like a concert hall.
Like you're in a room with her. Like you knew exactly what was happening.
Then they mentioned that she had literally, they were like, you literally threatened to hit her on the table.
Like we all heard it. We heard you. And what did she say?
You weren't trying to calm her down or anything or not being a part of it.
You were actively participating. and terrorizing this 10-year-old.
You're sitting here pretending you're not?
And she responded with on the stand, quote, I wouldn't have hit her much.
I wouldn't have hit her much. Myra Hindley, ladies and gentlemen.
I wouldn't have hit her much. I wouldn't have hit the terrified fucking ten-year-old that I abducted from a fairground.
And was trying to gag her and strip her before brutally murdering her.
I wouldn't have hit her much. Only once or twice.
What the fuck there's so many parts of this that I just how also I
Imagine an attorney cross-examining her and just being like, I don't know how he didn't just walk out of the courtroom and be like, I quit.
I'm done. I'm done. For real. Like, there's no speaking to these two people.
I would... I would... I don't even... I don't have words.
It's... It's one of those situations where you are just speechless, blown apart, like it blows every part of you.
So Ian says, of course, that Myra is lying through her fucking teeth. he says yes she was in the bathroom she participated in everything She helped me assault her.
She held her down for me. And then she herself strangled her with a length of cord while I held Leslie down.
Oh, so he does implicate himself as well.
Like he was like, he says we were equal parts of.
Right. He's evil as fuck, but at least he's fucking up front about it.
That's the thing. He's evil on a... galactic i mean a galactic level but at least he's like yep i am i'm gross He then said that she would take the cord out in public later. like, at pubs and anywhere and, like, play with it because she liked knowing what it was and that other people didn't know what it was.
That reminds me of... I forget the lady's name, but the case where they were on vacation or something and she would wear the necklace.
Yes. With the blood on it. And she just liked knowing that that was there.
Erica something. Yep. And he also says, yes, there was a bath run.
I had her run a bath, but he said it was very quick.
It didn't take a long time. We ran it so that we could wash Leslie's dead body in there and get all the fibers and dog hairs.
That's what I thought. too. Like, he's like, I'm not even gonna pretend to you like I was gonna give her a bath.
Like, he was like, I... murdered her and then was gonna wash her body so they couldn't connect her back to me like he's being honest like That's what I was going to say when you said the bath was being run.
Yeah, he was like, because we had never killed in our own home before, so I figured we had to do much more here.
So they then tried to bring Leslie to the Moors to bury her, obviously, but the weather was bad.
It was snowing like crazy. So they brought her back to Gran's house.
And then they realized that they had to make sure Gran didn't come back because Myra was supposed to go get Gran. and bring her back home that night.
So Myra drove to her Uncle Jimmy's house and told her she couldn't bring it.
He was like, She was like, I can't bring Gran home because the roads are really bad.
And he was like... But you have to drive home anyway.
And you just drove here. Like, you just drove here to tell me that and you're driving home.
Why can't you just put her in the car? And she was like, can't do it.
Wouldn't you just call and say that? Wouldn't that make a lot more sense, you moron?
Later, he was like, okay. Later, he was like, now I know.
Right. But obviously at the time I was like, that's weird.
And I don't know what to say. And sometimes when people are like that, you're like, I'm not even going to argue.
Yeah, I'm just not even going to go into this.
Meanwhile, poor Leslie's mother Anne and stepfather Alan are losing their minds with worry.
They called the police around 10 p.m. They were knocking on doors and frantically searching outside for her in the bad weather.
All the while, Leslie was lying naked, dead, and face down on their bed while they slept in another room.
Oh, my God. Yeah. They just threw her on the bed, face down.
And figured we'll take care of it tomorrow.
Let's go to sleep. We'll figure it out tomorrow.
That's so, that's beyond fucked. So the next morning, Ian and Myra were able to get out to the moors because the roads had cleared.
Ian ran out with the shovel to get the grave ready.
It was near Pauline Reed's grave. Oh wow.
While Myra was waiting with Leslie's body in the car, a police officer pulled up beside her.
And he said, is everything okay? Is like everything cool with your car?
Like, do you need a jump or anything? She's like, yeah, no, it's running well.
There's just a dead body in here of a child.
Yeah, nobody... She said something about needing to wait for her car to start properly or she was letting like spark plugs dry out or something.
She made some kind of bullshit. Yeah. And he was like, okay, cool.
Just drove away. Why does that always happen in like the most gruesome cases?
Imagine that cop later. That's like Ed Kemper.
Yeah. Like he got stopped with a head in the backseat.
Oh, my God. Yeah. I gotta go. I'm calling in sick for the rest of this.
Okay, bye. Yeah. You know? So Ian buried Leslie naked with her clothing on top of her. and put the strand of white beads that Terry had given her on top of that.
And she was so excited about that necklace.
And it was like her older brother and her poor older brother, Terry, like feels such immense guilt for having the flu.
And not being able to go. Nothing you did wrong.
Nothing he did. But he's like, if I was there, like this wouldn't have happened.
It's like, I can't. No, you know who I'm mad at?
And I feel like everybody has a right to be mad at it.
The mom that let them go by themselves and didn't tell Anne.
What the fuck, Mrs. Clark? If you're in charge of somebody else's kid, you need to tell the parent exactly what you're doing with their kid.
Exactly. like if anybody gets mad at me for that I don't care no that's honestly she fucked up I think this is a universal truth like you don't fuck with other people's kids no that's why my kids are never going to sleepovers or like anything with anybody else I'll be like your friends can come with us but that's it but you're not going anywhere no sorry bye So a couple weeks later, they took photos of themselves smiling together standing next to Leslie and Downey's grave. wow yep police dragged waterways and canals um the fair was completely torn down alan west was Questioned, of course, because dads are always being questioned.
Especially a stepfather, like I said last time.
Yeah, and Leslie's family actually moved out of their home because they couldn't bear to be in it anymore because it just had too much memories.
Right. Now, apparently Anne, Leslie's mother, allowed one of the photos to be shown publicly for the first time. in that documentary that I mentioned.
I don't have the name of it. I don't even know if it, like... if you can find it but i'll for part four i'll let you know if i can find the documentary okay It's about the case.
It's from 1999. She agreed to parts of the tape being aired, like I said earlier.
Yeah. But they were like, the public can't hear this.
She agreed to all this because she wanted to show how evil these two were. and she wanted the world to know this is what they did to my baby.
Yeah. Don't let them out of jail. Don't have support for them.
Don't have sympathy for them. This is what they did.
Right. And she's right. So later, they found Myra's fingerprints on the photos taken of Leslie Ann, because she had fucking looked at them after Ian developed them.
So again, If she's going to pretend that she was there unwillingly, and was just going along with what Ian was telling her to do, then why did you look through the photos later?
Right, like what did you get out of that?
Because you're just as fucked up as him.
Exactly. It's insane. So she later said, quote, I don't even want to know what she fucking said.
She later said about it when they asked her, you know, like, Why are your fingerprints there?
Because she said many things like I'm so ashamed like fuck right off.
And she'd be like, you know, I don't know what to say, blah blah blah.
But then she said one final thing that was like a nice dig at her mother.
She wrote or she said, quote, the girl shouldn't have been out at that time of night.
Are you kidding me? So... She shouldn't have been out.
So that makes it okay for you to do what you did?
Because, like, so it's her fault now? Well, and if you feel that way, why wouldn't you offer her a ride home and bring her home then?
Like this is why Myra flicks from like innocent to like depraved innocent to depraved in the public so much that it's That's why when she was going for parole, it was like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
So Ian said about Myra, when she was trying to get the parole later, She regarded periodic homicides as rituals of reciprocal innervation. marriage ceremonies, theoretically binding us even closer.
Yeah. As the records show, Before we met, my criminal activities had been primarily mercenary.
Afterwards, a duality of motivation developed, existential philosophy melded with the spirituality of death became predominant. we experimented with the concept of total possibility.
Instead of the requisite Lady Macbeth, I got Miss Elena.
Who's Miss Alina? Miss Alina, sorry. Oh.
And actually, I wrote, who is Miss Alina?
Yeah. Who is the Salina? She was the empress who reigned next to the emperor Claudius in ancient Rome.
Oh, Claudius was famous. And she was known to be super promiscuous and also known to order Claudius to execute literally anyone that she just didn't like.
So he's saying, I thought I was getting Lady Macbeth and I got...
I got more than I bargained for. Yeah, which is like, he loved it.
I was going to say, yeah, that was like his jam.
In a letter to Dr. Alan Keatley, Ian said that at this point, after they had killed Leslie and Downey, they were bored. they killed four kids and you know now they wanted something new what do you want so my he said this is crazy he said they discussed at length the psychological and logistical mechanics of creating a small race war.
What? A la Charles Manson. Yeah. They did it before him.
Yeah. Yeah. What? They did it before him.
Yep. They were like helter skelter. And then he said, however, we had no political or racial motive.
What? Just for the funsies of it? He said, to us it was simply an existential challenge. an end in itself.
And then he said, we also discussed and researched the existential challenge of derailing an express train.
So they were like, we got real bored with killing kids.
You know, we were over that. So we decided we could either start a race war or we could just derail a train and watch everybody die.
Okay. Okay. Like, just, you know, Wednesday things.
I keep shifting in my seat. I'm sorry if you're hearing it.
I'm just so uncomfortable. It's just uncomfortable.
Now, during all this madness with Leslie and such, David Smith, who is married to Myra's sister Maureen at this point, Oh, you said they had just gotten married.
Yeah. They have they now have a baby girl named Angela.
No, thank you. And they were apparently in love with Angela.
They were very happy as a family. David said he felt like his whole outlook on life had changed.
He was very doting. He also said Ian and Myra didn't give a shit about their daughter. uh myra never held her like that's her only niece of her sister's supposed to be her best friend yeah that's weird And it's her little sister.
That would literally be like me not wanting to hang out with your kids.
Your kids. And actually, they were like... The way David put it was like, there was no like... loving and doting like Uncle Ian and Auntie Myra like they were just not into it at all.
And she was an infant. That's like unfathomable to me.
Whenever you're pregnant, I literally lose my shit.
Well, that's a normal response to somebody you love having a baby.
But April 24th, 1965, and this is really sad, Maureen and David Smith's daughter died at six months old.
Oh, no. She died of bronchitis. They were devastated.
Yeah. And the two couples started hanging out more because I think Maureen was just looking for her sister's comfort.
She was like, I just need somebody. And it kind of organically just helped them numb the pain.
Of course, they started bringing them to Saddleworth more.
Fucked up. And many times they brought them to grave sites without them knowing just to get kicks out of it.
That's not funny. Yep. This is after their own baby had just died.
They're bringing them to grave sites of children they've murdered.
Yeah. so now they're hanging out with Ian and they're hanging out and Ian and David would sit and drink and chat Ian kept trying to get David into the robbery house breaking kind of thing.
He's always trying to recruit. Like, always be closing, Ian.
But I'm like, also, are you even doing that anymore?
Yeah, like, just... do it yourself like why are you constantly trying to recruit everyone around you it's a lot He figured it was a good way for David to make money because David was struggling to get jobs.
So he was like, yeah, you can make money with me.
And David was like, eh. I'd rather do it the honorable way.
Like, sure. Actually, David was no... No Boy Scout himself, but I mean, he was not this bad, but...
It's not like he was like, no, sir. He was just like, I don't know.
I'm a little nervous about that. But then Ian, according to David... asked him if he was capable of murder.
Ian all of a sudden just came out and was like, hey yeah so you should do some robberies with me like it's super easy you can just be like a lookout Do you think you're capable of murder?
I also love that, what's the, David is his name?
He's like, I'm a little nervous about like breaking into these houses.
And he's like, But what about murder? You think you could do that?
We'll start small. You want to murder a child?
Like, what? That might be easier. Yeah. than than a robbery you know what to ian that's probably like the starting point he He's like, let's murder a child.
That's very easy. And then we can move on to robbery.
Bananas. It's insane. And David was like, well, and he was like, uh, and Ian was like, cause I've done it. and he was like what now and he said I've done it I've killed three or four you don't really believe me do you Their bodies are buried on the moors.
You and Maureen were sitting near one of them.
Oh my God. Can you imagine? That's so fucked up to do to someone.
I'm not laughing because it's funny. I'm laughing because I'm so uncomfortable.
Oh, there's going to be a lot of nervous laughter and like weird emotions happening here.
Like everybody's just got to go with it. because I'm sure honestly I'm sure you're listening right now being like so we all get it we're all in this together oh yeah you guys were sitting near one lol can you you're just sitting there drinking with your brother-in-law and you're like uh what now what the fuck eventually he did convince David Smith to commit a robbery with him And he was like, and honestly, David probably agreed out of fear because he was like, well, now I know that you mean it. murdered someone.
So Ian said he said a bunch of times that he was like, you know what?
I was nervous that David was a little too scared to go through this.
He wasn't he was too much anxiety, didn't have the nerve.
And he was like, you know what? I got to test him.
I got to make sure that he's going to be someone who's not going to run and bail at the like slightest scent of danger, you know?
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So he said he was going to take him to the, he was like, at first I thought I'd just take him to the Moors with a victim that I grabbed, you know.
And he said he was going to try to hand him a gun to shoot the kid.
And if David wouldn't do it, he would ask for the gun back and then shoot them both in the head.
But like why are you even involving David?
Like what is the point of that? I don't get it. i think is it to add to the excitement because they were bored of killing the i think it was to add to the excitement and I think it was also some weird thing where he felt I feel like he got off on the fact that he was, like, kind of corrupting Myra's sister.
Okay. Yeah. Which was an important person in her life.
Because he liked her. And he also liked her.
So I think it was like a mixture of just getting her involved in some way.
Okay. I feel. And just corrupting people in general maybe.
It almost seems like he wanted to start a community of like.
Just fucked up people doing fucked up things.
Yeah, do Charlie Manson, I guess. Hello, we're the community of fucked up people doing fucked up things.
How can we help you? Established 1966. How can we hurt you?
How can we hurt you? So the robbery was in a few days and David was acting more and more nervous about it.
Every time they brought it up, he was like, yeah, totally.
I totally understand the plan. This is exciting.
So Ian was like, all right. We're going to test him because I think he'll crack, but I'm not going to do that Morse thing because I don't have a victim picked out and it's a big thing.
Also, anybody would crack. Yeah, you know, anybody would crack for that.
And so he told David that they could practice the robbery by, and I quote, Rolling a queer.
What does that mean? Which meant convincing a gay person to come back to the house by like... acting that they wanted to have sex with them and then just robbing them.
And at this time in the 60s, it was illegal for like homosexual acts.
So they could rob a gay person by promising them sex acts or doing sex acts with them and then robbing them.
And they knew they weren't going to get in trouble with it because that person wasn't going to go to the police because they would get in trouble because.
Holy shit. Because life is just one big fucked up medley.
It's just like layer after layer of shit in this case.
Damn. So October 6th, 1965. Oh man. Edward Evans would be the last victim of Ian Brady and Myra Hindley.
The record that they purchased and that they would think of for this one was Bob Dylan's It's All Over Now, Baby. blue no you don't ruin bob dylan for someone they did it no they sure okay i'm glad it was that song though because i don't really like that song I'm glad.
So Edward was 17 years old. He was one of three children to his parents Edith and John.
He was a good kid all around. He was an apprentice engineer, actually, at AEI. electrical works on Trafford Park Estate.
When he was murdered, he was wearing a white button up shirt, jeans, brown dress shoes and a nice suede jacket because he was going out that night.
Yeah. That particular evening he was going to be meeting his friend Michael.
And they were going to go see Manchester United play Helsinki.
At Old Trafford Soccer Stadium. I knew that Man United was going to play part in this.
Did I not? That Man United. I love how you just were like, you know Man United.
Because my stepmom is like a huge Man United fan.
I love it. So, yeah, he was going to meet his friend Michael.
They were going to go see the game. All excited.
Well, his friend bailed at the last second. damn it he was like out at a bar waiting for him and he just didn't show up So he was pissed.
He was like, that sucks. I had like a whole night planned.
Yeah. So Ian and Myra were out to get wine.
And Ian walked out to get the wine, like, in this basically, like, a packy.
I don't know what they call it in the UK.
I don't either. But... I'm excited to know.
Probably a liquor store. I'm probably like, is something weird?
We're like a packy. A packy. And they saw.
And so he sees Edward outside of it. And he was like.
That's the guy. I'm going to get that guy.
So he asked him if he wanted to come to his place and have some drinks.
And Edward agreed because he, again, his night just got fucked up.
He was like, sure, why not? so he asked him you want to come back he says sure and he acted he did he and he said it he was like i acted like i wanted to have sex with him Well, and Ian was gay.
Or excuse me, bi. And actually, most people think that he was actually like gay.
He was not bi, but that he was just like... Myra does look like a dude.
She sure does. So it's very possible. I get it.
But he said, you know, I made it very clear to him what I was looking for and he was into it. so when they got in the car he was like oh this is my sister to my about myra yeah because he's like i wanted to make it as and again A woman always makes people feel a little less threatened.
Yeah. And all these kids, you see a woman, you're always told, be scared of scary men.
You're not really told as a kid, be scared of scary women usually my kids to be scared of everything yeah basically so he says myers's sister Myra drops them off at her gran's house.
Where's gran tonight? And, oh, gran was home.
Oh, goody. And Ian told her to get David Smith at Maureen's house.
He was like, go get David Smith or their house because they're married.
And to wait a bit there before she returned with him.
Okay. Now, allegedly, it appears Edward and Ian did have sex.
Uh-huh. This was while Myra was getting David Smith.
Myra went to get Maureen or went to Maureen and David's with and she used some excuse for why she was there that night.
Like she told her like, oh, I had to tell you this.
Yeah. And so then she was like, hey, David, can you walk me back home?
Because the streetlights are out and I'm nervous.
Yeah. So he agreed and he took a walking stick with him and this had a string attached to the end of it.
I was trying to look up pictures of this kind of thing and I couldn't really find anything that makes sense, but basically it's like a walking stick. and it had a long length of string on the end of it.
For why? It's important in a minute. Okay.
Because at first I was like, what? The town of Agde in France is famous for sun, sand, sea and sex.
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The town's mayor, a respected pillar of the community, has been arrested for corruption.
His wife claims he's been bewitched by a beautiful clairvoyant.
Then there's the mysterious phone calls that local people have been getting.
I am the Archangel Michael. The whole town has been thrown into chaos.
As the mayor is unable to carry out his duties, I would like to address you all.
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But as soon as David and Myra show up, Brady led them into the living room where Edward was sitting on a couch.
Ian walked up behind Edward with an axe that he had hidden and came down with it on his skull.
Just boom. Out of nowhere. He said Edward turned at the last second to look at him and the blow went a little to the side.
Otherwise, according to him. It only would have taken one hit.
Oh, okay, Anne. But instead it took 14. This is Ian's telling of what happened next.
Oh, wait, also, you're in Gran's living room and you're slaughtering somebody.
Oh, yeah. And Gran yells down at one point, like, hey, what's going on?
And I was like, don't worry about it. Yeah.
How did they clean that up? Sorry. Go ahead.
We're getting there. I'm sorry. So Ian's retelling of what happened.
Evan screamed out as I rained down blows to his head.
He was writhing on the floor to protect himself.
Myra was in the room watching. The two dogs were excited and barking in the kitchen.
Myra's grandmother had been woken up by the noise and shouted down to ask what was happening.
Myrus shouted something in reply, but I was too occupied to know what it was.
Evans was still alive after I hit him about a dozen times.
I went into the kitchen to fetch a length of electrical flex.
I put a cushion over his head and strangled him by wrapping the wire around his neck.
Evan stopped gurgling. It was suddenly quiet.
The walls, floor and carpets were splattered with blood.
I handed the axe to Smith so that his fingerprints were on the handle.
I lit a cigarette and muttered something about it being the messiest murder I had ever committed.
Myra made a comment about the terror in Evan's eyes as he was being flayed.
No she didn't. Of course she did not. I don't think she said anything.
No she wasn't even in the room. She wasn't even in England at that point.
Nope she wasn't. She was actually in Germany that day.
Yeah, she was totally gone. So she had taken an Uber and she was out of there.
So yeah, this is just Ian... like axe murdering someone just for the hell of it.
Yeah. There's literally no reason for this.
Not that there's a reason for anything. But what?
Like, you just hit an axe and just... what in somebody's gran's house that's the other thing it's like you didn't you who thinks of everything you didn't think this one through to be like well that's gonna be messy Right.
So that's so bizarre to me. It's very bizarre.
And that's how you can tell that they were unraveling.
Right. Like there's always that point you can see where it was just, they weren't going to go for much longer.
They were going to fuck up and this is their fuck up.
So then they took his wallet, his shoes, and the murder weapon into, I think they put them in a bag.
And they put them in an upstairs bedroom somewhere.
And then they spread a white sheet on the floor.
They placed Edward's body on the sheet. He then took that string from David's walking stick because he's trying to tie David to this.
Yeah. And he tied Edward with it into a fetal position.
Oh, God. They then carried him upstairs to store in a spare bedroom to be disposed of the next morning.
You know Gran was lying there, like, what the fuck is going on?
Because she knew that her kid was evil, or her grandkid.
Why? is my ugly as fucking sin, grin bitch downstairs with that gaunt looking motherfucker.
And someone's screaming. And now you got my other stupid granddaughter's stupid husband down there.
Like, I'm just, this poor old woman, she raised them.
Seriously. She fucking raised them and this is what they do to her?
God damn. Well, I need to know why Maureen's so fucked up and I feel like we're approaching that.
It is. Actually, so you know what? I'll give it to you now.
It might come up in part four. So because I said it now, I don't want to be like... cliffhanger basically later Maureen does end up having more kids and And she turns into a complete shitbag and neglects them and like malnourishes them and they get taken away from her. she malnourishes yeah she like doesn't feed them they're all under six years old she has three of them Three boys under six years old.
She leaves them alone in the house to go, like, party.
Like, she's a shitbag just like Maureen is.
What the fuck? Or just like Myra is. Who gives a fuck?
They're both bitches. where was david do i find out later you will yeah you'll find out where was david David factors into a lot of this.
Ew, David. Ew, David. So then they got to cleaning because of course now there's a big mess to clean up.
Like on the ceiling, like how do you clean the ceiling?
So Ian said, It took the three of us almost three hours to clean up the blood in the living room using buckets of soapy water and rags. the carpets were the most troublesome I found it incomprehensible that the police couldn't find traces of blood on the carpets This incompetence led them to assume that I had taken up the carpets before Evans arrived in preparation for the slaughter.
Even Smith said that the carpets were down all the time.
Apparently, they couldn't find any blood, but I don't think forensics was really...
At its height in the 60s in the UK. But so they sat around.
After this, after they cleaned everything up, all three of them drank together, smoked some cigs together.
And they discussed plans for disposal because now what are we going to do?
Yeah. They agreed that they would use David's recently dead infant daughter's baby carriage. to transport Edward's body because it wouldn't arouse suspicion.
And he agreed to this. What? They wrote the plan down.
I repeat, they wrote the plan down. Well, he's a Capricorn.
Of course they did. I'm not sure. And then they put it in Ian's wallet.
I believe, yeah. Like, you wrote the plan down.
Yeah. of shit i've ever heard though but i believe that i know i do too but like fuck so around 3 or 4 a.m David is like...
A fucking wreck. And he's trying to hold it together in front of them and act like it's totally fine.
Because the adrenaline is slowly wearing off. well and he just did not want any part of this to begin with he got like bamboozled into this yeah they just tricked him into being a witness of this murder yeah and he's like And so he's trying to act like, yeah, this was fun.
Can't wait to do it again. Like, yippee.
So around 3 or 4 a.m., he's like, you know what?
I'm going to go back to Maureen. If that's cool.
Can I go now? I'm going to go get some sleep so I can help you guys out with this fun disposal plan tomorrow.
I'm like, whoa, can't wait for that. And he said he was absolutely terrified.
And he thought he was he was like, I thought they weren't going to let me leave.
I thought he was next. Yeah. And he said he walked away, just walked down the street after they were like, OK, they let him go.
And he walked until they couldn't see him anymore.
And then he broke into a sprint and sprinted all the way home.
I believe that. He immediately told Maureen and she said he was like dry heaving and vomiting.
He was so upset. Oh God. They immediately called the police.
Yeah. And October 7th, 1965 at 6.07 a.m.
Constable Keith Edwards answered the phone call where David told him, hi, my name is David Smith.
There's been a murder. David Smith is the one who brought down Myra Hindley. and Ian Brady.
Wow. They bamboo. him into witnessing a murder and he immediately went home and was like, well, we're gonna call the police now.
It makes me so sad that Maureen turned out to be such a shitbag because they could have been heroes.
I know. We could be heroes. But they weren't true.
Yes. Just for one day. Yes. But and actually they were never treated as heroes because everyone thought David had more to do with this than he was letting on.
Do you? What do you think? I don't think he did.
The investigators don't either. Okay. Was he like a great person?
No. No. But did he have anything to do with any of the murders?
No. No. I don't believe that at all. I wonder why people thought that.
I think it's just because they, well, and Ian and Myra lie and say that he was part of things.
Ah. So there's people. Oh, yeah. Let's trust those guys.
They've been such a beacon of honesty so far.
So when the police arrived, David told them the entire story.
He included, you know... That Ian has told me he's killed before three or four times.
He said this body's buried on the moors.
He's got guns in the house. Like he gave them all of it.
He was like, here is all the shit you need.
Right. Please, please help me. And the police said he was genuinely terrified.
Yeah, of course he was. He thought he was next, I bet.
In fact, they said when they pulled up in the police car he dove into the police car because he was like, I'm afraid they're around.
Like, they probably were. Now, Superintendent Bob Talbot dispatched...
24 uniformed and six plainclothes policemen to block the surrounding roads around Myra's grand's house.
Good. And the rest went to Ian and Myra's doorstep.
Okay. Now, no one was out of the house by 8.30 AM when they were all waiting.
Yeah. Because Ian was planning to call in sick at work and Myra was going into work to not arouse suspicion.
Right. Because he was like, we can't. Fuck up our routine.
You have to go to work. The only reason he wasn't going to work was because he hurt his ankle the night before.
Oh my God. And like a little bitch. He was like, my ankle hurts.
You know, one time I worked an entire shift. with a sprained ankle in heels.
Not Ian Brady. And my manager was like, you can go home now.
Not Ian Brady. So they, so yeah, so Myra was on her way out.
She wasn't going to be leaving until around close to 9 a.m.
So they were just kind of waiting for someone to open up. open the door.
Yeah. So Talbot, the superintendent, he sees a bread delivery man and he asks him if he can borrow his uniform.
In a tray of bread. And he goes up to the door and just knocks on the door as a bread delivery man.
Wait, who does? The police officer. The police superintendent walked up to the door to be like, yeah, here's your bread also you're arrested so he went up there he knocks on the door and Myra opens the door Because if they walked up and just knocked on the door, those two were going to fucking go out in a blaze of glory.
You know that. Oh, 100%. But... If he's walking up as a spread delivery man, the door's gonna open.
Myra loves fucking carbs. Exactly. Who doesn't, really?
So Myra answers the door and in the way he describes it, it just made me laugh because he was like, She looked about 35.
She was 23. I told you she's a rough 22 sister and now she's 23.
I just love that little dig like she looked more than a a decade older than what she actually was.
She did. When you told me she was 22 in the last part of the part before, I was like, Excusez-moi, I don't think she ever looked 22.
I think she came out of the womb looking 35.
35 is generous. I was going to say, 35 is like young.
I'm 34. So at 35, I'm like, that's very nice of you to say.
You also look... 18 and a quarter. She looks a rough, like, 50.
Yeah. She really does. In a rough 50. I'm not saying 50 looks bad.
She at least looks like 40-something. Yeah, in a rough 50.
40 cents she's like a drugged out 40 yeah it's no good so She just answers the door and he's like, hey there, I have some bread.
And she's like, that's weird. We don't need bread.
And he's like, cool. I'm just going to come in your house because I'm a police officer.
He was like, thanks for opening the door, honey. so he's like hey where's your husband and she was like i don't have a husband and he was like where's the man that lives in this house and she was like there's no man in this house and he was like and he just looks behind her and he's like what's that man sitting on the couch in there and she was like Was that Ian?
Yeah, it was just Ian sitting on the fucking couch in the living room.
Like, there's no man here. There's no man here.
He's like, I have eyes, ma'am. He was like, there.
He's right there. What about that one? Well, so they just walk in and they're like, yeah, so we know that you did this.
They walk in. Ian is sitting on the couch, like wearing barely anything.
Sharting? Because he's like scared, I bet.
Like sharting his pants. Your face. Sharting.
I was like, what? Where did that come from?
I'm like, is he sharting his pants? No, he was not.
He was writing a letter to his boss to excuse him for work that day because his ankle hurt.
And he did not stop writing that letter as the police walked into the house.
Okay. He finished writing the letter. Don't know why, because he didn't need it.
But OK, so he's sitting on the couch and they were like, all right, we're going upstairs.
We're checking these rooms. They go to open one of the bedroom doors, the bedroom. door and it's locked so they're like open this up and she says the keys are at the office and it's I'm not going to go to the office and get you those keys.
Uh-huh. And they're like, no, they're not.
And they're like, what now? And Ian, without even looking up, said, you'd better give him the key.
I got a fight got out of hand last night.
It's upstairs. Oh. No. So he's literally like, yeah, there was a fight.
It's upstairs. And they were like, what now?
So they did get into the room and they found Edward's body.
Is this what reminded you of... The Twilight murders?
Is this why you thought of it? Yeah. Okay.
It made me think of it. Now, Ian had planned... Ian... and Myra had planned to go down shooting.
Yeah. ever caught they had a very well worked plan that they were going to grab a gun and they were just going to start shooting police officers.
Cool, cool, cool. That was what they were going to do.
Normally, he had his revolver under his bed and under the pillow bed that they slept on.
Yeah. He was sitting on the bed. He bent down to tie his shoes because they told him, get dressed.
Like, you sickly looking motherfucker. Get dressed.
We don't want to look at your, like, gay hair.
So he starts putting up, he starts putting on his outfit and he's tying his shoes and he reaches back. to grab the revolver.
Well, he realized that last night when he and David Oh.
It was bothering him and making it hard for him to maneuver, so he took it off and threw it in another bedroom.
How many fucking bedrooms are in this apartment?
The revolver that he, I think he threw it in the bedroom that he put Edward in.
Okay, yeah. But he was, so normally it would be under the bed and he could just reach and go.
Not today, Satan. little thing that one little and he swore till the very end if i had just put it under the bed I wouldn't be here.
But here I am. I kind of believe that. And I kind of believe it.
And those police officers are lucky men.
Because that would have been bad. That's a literal not today Satan.
And they're planted. together was to kill anyone who tried to take them out.
And then if it got too crazy and they couldn't do that, they had a murder suicide pact.
Right. He was going to shoot her in the head and then blow his brains out.
But he couldn't. But he couldn't do it. So when they searched the rest of the home, they found the plans that they had written for disposing of Edward.
They found books on sexual perversion and they found notebooks of Ian's where he had written the name John Kilbride.
Oh. And immediately, they're like, oh, fuck.
Like, what? What have we here? Because they're just looking at, they had no idea that John Kilbride was going to be involved in this.
They were like, wait, what or any of the other so now they're like holy shit now we have to really look through this So they were both brought in.
Ian was charged with Edward Evans' murder.
Myra was released after questioning because they didn't have anything on her.
Mm-hmm. And she stayed with her mother for four days.
Those were her last four days of freedom.
Oh, good. And in those days she destroyed evidence.
Damn it. Of course she said that she had burned a ton of envelopes without looking to see what they were.
She didn't know what they were. But Ian was like, no, she knew what they were.
Why else would you burn them? she burned them she knows what was in them and then he said actually some of the stuff in those envelopes would have helped you locate keith bennett's body And they never located Keith Bennett's body.
That might not even be true. He might just be saying that to be a dickhead.
He probably was. The luggage ticket that would lead to the pieces of luggage that he had left at the railway station. station, those luggage that he would put like all the fucked up shit in that like Myra was like, I never saw what was in those.
No, you did. Meanwhile, you probably took half the shit that wasn't.
Exactly. The ticket... So it's the luggage ticket that you would need to go get those luggage things was shoved into that prayer book. that she was given on her first communion there in part one when she converted to a new religion.
Yes. remember i said that prayer book that white prayer book was gonna come back they had put the fucking luggage ticket Which the luggages were the things that contained the Leslie Ann Downey tapes and photos. were in her fucking prayer book.
That's bananas. And then later she's gonna try that religious shit again. when she put the fucking ticket that has naked ten-year-old girl photos in the thing that's connected to it in her fucking prayer book so that whole religious shit that she pulled later i'm like you weren't religious like you're the most sacrilegious mother you're the most blaspheming evil human on planet Earth.
Are you kidding me? I am getting so hyped.
It's insane. So she couldn't get that prayer book back because police officers were guarding her gran's home.
Because it was still a crime scene. So she couldn't go in there and get the prayer book.
Right. That was one thing she couldn't get. get rid of well and she was hoping they just wouldn't look in it but she had displayed it Because she liked being like, look at how religious I am.
I am one with the God. But knowing that she had this fucking terrible thing in it.
Right. Because it was like how they would put those pictures and like... Exactly.
In the album to fuck with people. Right.
Right. Well, they found it in their book eventually.
What have we here? They go to the luggage and they got the luggage, open it up.
They found the photos of Leslie and Downey and the tape and all they needed.
Oh, my God. 3 p.m. Monday, October 11th, Myra Hindley was charged with Edwards' murder.
Oh. And she was brought back in. Okay. So four days later.
While they were doing interviews, the police learned about Patricia Hodges. the 12 year old that lived a couple of doors down from her.
And they learned that she went to the Moors a ton with them.
And they were like, holy shit, can you please walk us to where they used to bring you?
Because it might be where these kids are buried.
Because they love to do that shit. So Saturday, October 16th, police went walking They pointed out a few things and they started looking through the photos that were like in this bag because some of the photos also were the photos they took of them at the Moors.
Right. They went with what Patricia Hodges was showing them, which they always went to certain spots.
So it's like very over and over. Well, on this October 16th day, they discovered Leslie Ann Downey's body using all of those different methods.
Her mother Anne had to identify her body.
She had to look at two photos that Ian had took of her and had to listen to a minute of tape to identify all of it.
Alan West, her stepfather, said that he would have done it, but he wasn't blood relation and they wouldn't let him.
Oh, my God. But he said it always bothered him that he didn't get to shoulder that burden instead of...
Because he said, I would have taken all that burden from her.
I never would have wanted her to have that.
Well, realistically, he probably was like her father, like.
Oh, yeah. You know what I mean? Oh, he said he was like I and he said I would have taken that like a bullet.
For Anne. Right. Which just like... You wish that they would have just let him.
Like... Can't you just bend the rules a little bit?
Just let him do it, man. Like, have you heard the fucking tape?
For real. It's just... So after being charged with Edwards' murder, Ian was brought into an interview room alone.
And this was after they found the luggage.
This is after they've now discovered Leslie's body.
He doesn't know this. Oh, my God. So, Detective Chief and Superintendent Arthur Benfield And Superintendent Rob Tyrell.
It's either Tyrell or Tyrell. I like Tyrell because Game of Thrones.
Tyrell is fun. We'll go with it. They came in and they just stand there for a second and just look at them.
Hey, bud. I mean, he's just like, whatever, because he's so cool and so above everybody.
They come in and they just toss Leslie's socks, shoes, clothing, and the necklace on the table in front of them.
Mm-hmm. And they informed him that they found these buried on the moors.
And they were like, you know what else we found?
We found these on top of her body. And they said, you know what's weird?
We also found photos of her. in your luggage at the railway station when we took that ticket out of that prayer book. which you left out for everybody did he shart then he didn't So they said, do you want to say anything?
And he said, not at present. Yeah. So they said, okay, cool.
We just want you to listen really quick to this tape we found too.
But he probably enjoyed that. So they started.
So they go to tap and he goes, I know the tape.
Yeah, because I made it. Because he was like, I don't give a shit.
And he listened. They said he listened with his head in his hands. like he wouldn't look at them that's interesting and then he said he said okay i took the photos of her and that's me on that tape And he said, but when she left my house, she left alive. why would he even say that and they were like wait what and he said she was brought to me by two men David Smith and another man ah and I took the photos of her that's what we agreed I wanted the photos I was like sure charge me with that that's my deal I sent her on her way and they took her and that was the last I've seen her.
So now he's saying David Smith killed her.
Uh-huh. So they were like, okay. So they do the same technique with Myra.
They throw the clothes in front of her. They do the whole thing.
Because they're not going to have the same story.
They start playing the audio tape and she just says, I have nothing to say.
And they were like, do you, what? They're like, no, no, no, you're going to say something.
And she said, I'm ashamed. That's all she could say.
So then they do the same thing to David Smith.
Because now he's been implicated. So now they're going to do it.
I had to hear that. David Smith started sobbing when he heard the tape.
Because, yeah. He hasn't heard this like this.
He was not present for that. Right. So he starts sobbing.
So they're like, yeah, that's quite a reaction.
I believe that that's probably genuine. Right.
So then October 21st, 1965... Both Myra and Ian were officially charged with Leslie and Downey's murder.
Good. So after Leslie, they'd started looking further into these photos that they found in the photo albums and in the luggage.
And these are the ones of them posing on the moors because now they found Leslie through them.
So now they're like, this is real. These are grave markers.
So they realized, you know what, we got to really take these seriously.
So Detective Joe Munzi, who had a very special interest in the case of John Kilbride.
Like he was very focused on that case. He wanted so badly to solve it.
He had done a recreation of the case, like, of his last day.
Right. Just to try to find something. And his brother...
I think his brother Terry was the one that volunteered to play John in that recreation.
Oh. And so they went like hard to try to find this.
And John is the body that they've never found?
No, Keith is the one. Keith is. Okay. And they did find John.
Okay. So Detective Joe Munsey, he had the special interest in John Kilbride.
He was walking out there with Inspector Chaddock and crime scene photographer Mike Masheter, I believe. uh so they took the crime scene photographer mike masheter out there because they wanted to use the photo that they had that they could like put it up and see where this site was which the moors are like 400 miles like you know like it's vast That's crazy that they were able to identify it.
It's insane. So they ended up because they stumbled upon a place that looked just like the photo.
Yeah. And then they had Mike take a photo so they could compare the two photos so they could really make sure.
Is it really the place? And so they stumbled upon this place and they look and they're like this is the one of Myra holding Puppet the dog and it's the one where she She's looking at the ground underneath her, like she's crouched on top of it.
Now, they were like, this is it, this is exactly it.
So Chaddick, Inspector Chaddick takes a stick And he just pushes it into the soft ground there and he pulls it back out.
And he holds it up and the smell of decomposition is on the end of the stick.
Oh, no. It was John Kilbride's grave. The investigators brought his shoe to his home. for his parents to identify first, and his brother Terry later said, Quote, it broke my mom's heart and my dad just sat in the chair with his head between his knees.
God, I can't imagine. Yeah. His mother, Sheila, was the one who made dinner for him every night and bought him the presents for his birthday.
She had to go identify him at the morgue that day.
And she said she could tell by the football button she had sewn onto his jacket that that was him. because he was very decomposed.
It had been over a year. And he had also been in a grave that had water running through it. oh no yeah so when questioned about the photos of her crouching and happily gazing onto the grave of John Kilbride, which they were able to determine that the date of that photo was after he was buried there.
They were able to tell that. So they questioned Myra about that and she denied it.
No, I didn't know that he was there. We have a picture.
She was like, yeah, weird. I had no idea he was there.
They're like, oh, okay. I would stab her with the football buttons.
Well, so what, this is pretty amazing, I think.
So what Detective Joe Munsey did, because he was getting sick of her shit.
Yeah. And he was like, okay, that's cool.
So he put together a random little album with just random photos of her and Ian and just like, normal photos and then he interspersed photos of Leslie and John's decomposed corpses variously like through this good So he's flicking through it for her and she has no idea when another one is going to come.
Just like what they did to people. Exactly.
So she turned away when she saw them and said, I don't want to see anymore.
But he was like, OK, asshole. And he was like, OK, no, I'm going to push this even further into your face.
So he put it even closer to her and he was like, oh, no, honey.
Look right at what you did. So eventually she screams, take them away.
I'm not looking at them. I would hit her over the head with them.
Like, not only are you going to look at these because I don't even give a quarter. of a fuck about your sudden delicate constitution that you have suddenly grown.
Right. That you somehow have just grown out of nowhere after murdering innocent babies.
But now I'm going to use a fucking... One of those purple...
Elmer's glue sticks that little kids use.
I'm going to fucking stick them to your eyeballs so you don't have the fucking choice. since their parents, who identified them in the horrific state at the goddamn morgue, will never have the choice to look away from the images in their mind of their babies like that for the rest of their fucking life.
There it is. You asshole! Yeah, take those away from me.
Take those away? I don't want to look at them?
Do you think Ann West wanted to look at her fucking child being... used pornographically by you two sick fucks.
You know what they should do? They should literally just hang them up every day in her cell.
They should take an Elmer's glue stick and stick them to her fucking eyeballs.
But she couldn't see them, though. I don't care.
No, I know I want her to see them. Fuck her.
I know. I want her to see them. Let's burn her eyeballs with a fucking lighter.
No, let's not. God damn it. So that she can see them in her cell every day.
That's better. So... So he didn't say all that.
You're like, let's hurt her. He didn't. Oh, I want to hurt her.
Oh, I do too. I want to hurt her. I just said I want to stab her with the football buttons.
I want to hurt her with everything I have.
I truly do. So then, like I said, he didn't say all that.
Yeah, no, he didn't. No, but he was real annoyed with her.
So he just kind of like stepped off. And then he looked at her, and without any context, he just started quoting a Bible passage.
And he said, Suffer, little children, to come into me, and forbid them not for as such is the kingdom of God.
And then he left. And she was like, what the fuck?
Yeah. Because he was trying to like... Because she's making a total mockery of religion by pretending that she like her fucking prayer book with that shit in it.
And she's trying to pretend she's still very much like she goes back and forth because on the stand she wouldn't swear on a Bible.
Interesting. Which is fine if you're not religious, because I probably wouldn't either.
But she says that she is. Then she has a prayer book that she's like, what...
I can't. So he was just using it as like a good like, can you refuse to swear on the Bible?
Yeah, you can. Oh, I didn't know that. You can and you can use your own like if you use the Quran or you use the, you know, any other kind of like book of worship.
Holy book. So when he did this with Ian, because he did the same thing with Ian.
Yeah. He was totally unaffected by the pictures.
He was like, whatever. That's not funny.
I didn't mean to laugh. And then he was just like...
Okay, yeah, we did intend to take that photo of John Kilbride's grave.
Like we thought it was funny. Yeah, because he just was like, yep, that's what we did.
And then he was like, and you know what?
I did kill Edward. Like, I definitely did that.
And I hit him like 14 times. And then he was like, I did take the photos of Leslie.
But like I said. David and the other guy.
So he stuck to that. He stuck to it. Myra, so they're sitting and they're waiting for their trial.
While this is happening, Myra sent a letter to her mom saying, can you send me some like better heels?
Because hers were trampy looking. Her heels?
Yeah. That's what's important. Okay. And then...
She had her lawyer ask the court to allow her to get her hair done and dyed.
Because, and I quote, this is what they sent to the court.
Her dark roots are becoming very obvious.
This fact has been the subject of press comment. which is naturally a source of irritation to our client.
It's irritating to you that your roots are growing in prison because you're in prison because you murdered children You know what's irritating?
You Murdering children. Also, I... How did they find a hairdresser that was down to do that girl's hair?
Well, it was denied. Like, what? I'd be like, fuck you.
No, you... Oh, my God. You know what? I would do her fucking hair and I would leave that bleach on and I would keep...
Keep reapplying and reapplying. I'm being like, it's not lightening.
It's just got to press. That bitch would have... I've given myself scalp erasions because I love to be super blonde.
I would give her... so many scalp abrasions that she would just be a scalp abrasion well i wish you were here for this fuck me too because no one thought to do that well But it's just the fact that they were like, it's really irritating her that the press is commenting on her dark roots.
Like, she's got dark roots that are not just hair, my friends.
Her dark roots run deep. Yeah. Right from the womb.
Oh, shit. So December 2nd, 1965. Can you imagine being a lawyer?
No. I understand fighting for certain things.
Yeah. You're going to fight for this bitch's hair?
Yeah. No, I'd be like, I quit. I'd be like, no, we're not going to do that, Myra.
Go ahead. Sorry. Sorry. So Ian was charged with murder and Myra was charged as an accessory after the fact.
That does change later. Okay. But initially that's what the charges were.
I was like, I don't like that. Now, during the committal hearings in early December – and committal hearings are where they determine whether the case is going to be held in open court, basically –
They were protected behind glass. And actually a journalist took a photo of them that I had never seen before until I looked at this photo. up after reading this.
Oh, well, because you always see like the normal photos of them that everybody's seen like that.
Yeah. You know, the the ones of them on the moors and the ones they took at the police station but this was a weird like candid one it was just weird is it the two of them together they weren't allowed to take photos and so he got they got in trouble for publishing this but it's them standing in court together next to each other and there's glass around them and it's just strange to see them in like a public setting I guess I don't know what it is it's like very weird but we'll post it for sure Now, and they put glass for their own protection.
Yeah. During one of the hearings, and this just, this like, just my heart.
So during one of the hearings, Ann West was on the stand and she's answering things and then all of a sudden she just... stopped and she looked at Myra and she said, I'll kill you.
I'll kill you. An innocent baby. She can sit staring at me and she took a little baby's life.
The beast. And then she just kept calling her a tramp before dissolving into sobs on the stand.
I feel something. Meanwhile, while this is happening, Ian and Myra are holding hands and comforting each other.
And Myra whispered to him, I'm not a tramp. oh my god oh my god you are the tramp I hate her so much.
I'm not a tramp. And I'm not a tramp. And then Ian was like, no, you're not a tramp. oh my god like that's what you're worried about right now you're both you're both tramps you was a tramp you are both tramps you're worse than a trap i can't even think of what you are fucking I would have broken the fucking glass.
I would have killed her right then and there.
You can just imagine Ann West, like, just...
Can you imagine being, like, I would not be controllable.
Yeah. So Leslie's biological father, Terry.
Yeah. Because remember, Alan is her stepfather, right?
Terry and her uncle Patrick, they attended these hearings as well, obviously.
And they wanted to kill these two, obviously.
And they attacked a police car outside that they thought had Myra and Ian in it.
Oh shit. But what happened was because the mobs outside of these things got so...
Yeah. I wish they had just let them out.
I was going to say, they should have just let them out.
Just let them out and let the crowd take care of it.
In certain cases like this, parents should be allowed to kill their children's murderers. oh I believe come at me I believe wholeheartedly yeah That if you are, I mean, there's audio tape.
Yeah. There's photos. It's proven. There's evidence. if that happens you should be as a parent you should all be allowed in a locked room with that person to destroy them.
Just do whatever you want. To destroy them.
I would support that 100%. Well, they attacked this police car.
And what had happened was they had used decoys.
Damn it. And Ian and Myra were still inside waiting for that to happen.
They were like tackled down by police, obviously.
And they were told, you know, you can't do that.
I'd be like, I can do whatever the fuck I want for the rest of ever.
I'd be like, oh, no, I'm definitely going to murder them.
Just so you know. Thanks, though. But so Terry said, he said, I would have smashed their heads in if I was given the chance.
Same. Now, December 8th, David Smith took the stand and he got immunity for his cooperation with the case.
So he could not be charged for this. I don't think he should.
I don't think so either. December 16th, there was bad weather.
So they had to, so Ian and Myra had to spend the night in cells under the courthouse instead of being transported back to the jail.
So they asked. So in the morning, well, they wanted to, but they're like, you're fucking high if you think you're going to stay. together.
And then one of the guards got called over by Myra and she was like, can I have some makeup for the morning?
What? And he was like, what? He was like, no.
No. Here's a Crayola crayon, bitch. Do with it what you will.
Oh, no, he didn't even give her that. You know what he gave her?
He said, no, but here's some hot tea. And he had poured salt in it.
Oh, my God. That's awesome. I love that.
Which is like, I want to shake your hand.
Yeah. Enjoy, bitch. That's so awesomely just like because she thinks that she's going to. here's your hot tea bitch and then it has salt in it that's the piping hot tea bitch end of march Myra got to have her fucking hair bleached.
They allowed it. Who did they find to do it?
No idea. Why did she not burn the shit out of her scalp?
No idea. I would have hurt her. So Tuesday, the 19th of April 1966, that's when their trial began.
Because it was during the committal hearing, obviously, they were like, yeah, we need to hold a trial.
I'm shook that she was allowed to get her hair done.
It really bothered me. That's insane. Why was she allowed to bleach her hair?
What judge was like, you know what? Yeah.
It doesn't make sense. So the trial judge who was a different judge is Judge Justice Fenton Atkinson.
They were charged only with the murder of John Kilbride, Leslie Ann Downey, and Edward Evans because they did not admit to Pauline and Keith.
Until 20 years later. Well, had they found Pauline at that point?
Did they even know about? They didn't find Pauline for 20 more years.
Wow. And Keith they have never found. Right.
So at this point, Pauline's family had no idea that she was involved in this.
So Maureen got on the stand during the trial and Maureen testified.
This is the thing. At first you're like, yeah, Maureen.
And she just goes, shit. What did she do?
Maureen testified against her sister at trial. and said she said she's pretending she wasn't familiar with certain places like the market where they got John Kilbride.
Yeah. She had said on the stand, Myra, that she had never been to that market before.
Her sister said, oh, no, she was very familiar with that market.
Yeah. Like, that's a lie. And she said they had also discussed Leslie's disappearance one day together because it was in the newspaper.
Right. And Maureen had mentioned how her mother must be such a wreck.
And she said Myra laughed. And she was like, and it bothered me ever since.
Yeah. She also said Myra hated children and babies and was disgusted by her own baby.
And she was like, and that's just the way it is.
Myra was pissed about this, sent a letter to their mother being like, can you believe her?
Her mother was like a total enabler too.
I was going to say, I would be like, I'm not writing to you anymore.
I'd be like, you're real gross. See you later.
David and Maureen did admit on the stand that they were getting money from a newspaper deal about this case.
So that didn't help people thinking they were being shady because once money becomes involved, they're like, well, whose side are you on now?
Right. Because now you have a horse in the race.
Now you have a horse in the race. So while the John Kilbride case was being tried, because they went like...
They did the Edward Evans, then John Kilbride, and then Leslie.
I'm glad that they all had separate trials.
Yeah. So while John Kilbride case was being tried, Ian and Myra were passing notes to each other and giggling with each other.
The entire time. And why was that not stopped?
Not real sure. Ian took the stand and said the same thing about Leslie with David and the other, because this was after the John Kilbride one.
He said the same thing about Leslie with David Smith and the other man.
He said, I didn't kill her. She left my house.
That's what he said on the stand. but he fucked up what did he say twice what did he say he said he put and this is awful he He put a handkerchief in her mouth and a scarf to cover her face, like half her face.
And then he said the words just before the end.
And the judge was like, whoa, whoa, whoa.
The end of what? Right. And it's not like Ian was like, oh, the end of the photo session or something.
He literally was like, uh... Her life. And then he said, maybe when I was opening the tripod.
And he was like, that's not the end of anything.
Like, why did you say the end? And he was like, I don't know.
And then he was just allowed to keep going.
Okay. So that was the first thing that they were like, oh, okay.
And then he said the phrase, after completion, we all got dressed and went downstairs.
So what does that mean? Completion of what?
Like you rape? her is what you're saying and then he denied he even said that in one jury member because he denied it then he His attorney denied it.
And one juror stood up and was like, uh, nope.
He said it. I was here. Hi. We were here.
So he knew he fucked that up. So that there tells you right there that he was like, yeah.
Right. You're dumb. Well, about Myra on the stand, when asking about her, he said...
I mean, Myra's such a fucking idiot because this dude is such a dick.
He said, quote, she was my typist in the office.
I dictated to her in my office. This tended to wrap over, I guess.
And it's like, what the fuck? Like he's acting like he's like, I'm going to save you.
And then on the stand, he's like, I don't give a fuck.
She just did what I asked. I just dictated that tramp.
So Myra took the stand next. And Myra showed no genuine remorse during this trial.
She tried, but it did not come out right. sociopath so she can't.
In fact, she stuck her tongue out at someone at one point on the stand.
You're shitting me. And Ian smiled many times at the judge.
Like, the judge would look over at him in the box and he'd just, like, give them a big cheesy smile.
Oh, my. And then Myra on the stand, and she contradicts this about a hundred different times.
She said, quote, I made my own decisions and never made me do anything I did not want to do.
Oh, she literally says that. So you fucked yourself by saying that sister.
So then after she claimed, when they asked her about the Edward Evans murder, she claimed that she was in the kitchen When it all happened, she heard his screams and she threw her hands over her ears and was horrified.
Oh, I'm so sorry. now go through that she now she first said that that she was in the kitchen and ian agreed Because Ian is, the whole plan here is that Ian knows he's fucked.
Ian knows that he's going away forever. He's never getting out.
He's fine. But he said, I knew Myra could get out if we played our cards right.
And he wanted to do that. And his whole thing wasn't even for her.
He wanted her to tell the story. He wanted his story, his horror story to be told.
Like he wanted to become the boogeyman. So it literally had nothing to do with her at all.
I love that. And so he was trying to get her off. so he was making sure that he was agreeing with things like yep she was in the kitchen later he says no she was in the living room right They discovered arterial blood spatter on her shoes.
So she was not in the kitchen. It wasn't like any kind of other blood spatter and you only get that when you're near an actual pumping artery that's flying out blood.
And she tried to say that those shoes were just left in the room, but there was no blood inside the shoes.
So feet were in the shoes when that happened.
So good try, honey. But so she said she put her hands over her ears and couldn't listen to it.
It was so horrifying. The attorney general said... this court has heard more than one scream in the room where you were and she said yes and And then the attorney general said, the screams of a little girl of 10 of your sex, madam.
Did you put your hands over your ears when you heard the screams of Leslie and Downey?
And she said, no. Are you kidding? Because they were like, oh, okay.
So you're this delicate flower who put their hands over their ears because you heard this... like 17 year old screaming in the other room but not when you were in the room while she was screaming and you were shoving a handkerchief in her mouth and telling her you were going to smack her.
That make sense to you? And she was like...
Yeah. She was like, yeah, you're right. Cool.
And then she's like... No, I was just, I wasn't there.
And she immediately said she feels shame, all that.
And they responded to her, your shame is a counterfeit shame, Miss Hendley.
Yes. I love that. Like you're a fake ass bitch.
Literally. That's exactly what that translates into.
Use a fake ass hoe. So on May 6th. Ian was found guilty of all three murders.
And Myra was guilty of the murders of Leslie Ann Downey and Edward Evans and guilty of harboring Ian Brady, knowing that he had killed John Kilcoyne.
Okay. Why? Because they just couldn't connect her to actually murdering John Kilbride.
Okay. but they could to the other two. They were both sentenced to life in prison because four weeks before they were arrested...
The death penalty in the UK was abolished four weeks before.
Well, you know what, though? I'm glad that they had to live in their cells.
It's true. I know. But it's like if any two people deserve to hang for their crimes, it's these two.
100%. It is absolutely. And the families deserve to be able to. have that well Myra was later described during the trial as quote a quiet controlled and passive witness who lied remorselessly That's how they described her.
In 1994, Arthur Benfield, the retired police superintendent, said, She should have hanged.
She was pure evil. It might be fair for her to rot in prison.
Yeah. So all these inspectors see her for what she is.
They're like, don't All these trained people.
Exactly. Like, don't even think about it.
Ian went to Durham prison and Myra went to Holloway prison.
They went to separate prisons. Yeah. Seeing each other after they were sentenced was the last time they saw each other again.
Bye-bye. uh myra was immediately attacked in prison was she because they put her into like this like solitary at first because they knew that it was gonna be bad too bad when she was released in a general population 10 inmates invited her to a card game oh my god And she was like, cool.
And then they just beat the shit out of her.
Incredible. Because child murderers don't do well in prison.
LOL. What happened to Ian? Yeah, so she then asked for solitary and they were like, no and they were also like you're gonna be in here for a long time you can't be in solitary for that long right But they did assign a guard to walk around with her.
She couldn't go anywhere without a guard next to her because people tried to kill her.
So she did lodge an appeal saying that it fucked up her chances of a fair trial to be tried next to Ian.
Uh-huh. So she's already turning to be like, he's fucked up.
But you chose to be with him for your life, so you probably should have thought about that.
Well, they were also like, no, honey, you were exactly who you were during trial. right in fact you told us on the stand that he never made you control anything And they also said, and Ian actually tried his damnedest to make sure that you weren't implicated in anything.
Right. Fuck right off with that. So question mark question mark question mark.
Thank you for trying. Come again. But don't.
Well, she also got a special privilege, which pisses me off and it pisses everybody off.
To what? She got her grand. like her gran was able to visit her because she was dying oh gran But honestly, I think she should have had to miss out on seeing her gran ever again.
Yeah. You shouldn't. No one gives a shit.
Maybe people just felt like Gran wanted to see her, so that's why they did it.
I'd be like, no, it's not good for you to see her when you're dying.
I know. Absolutely not. grand look at what she did in your house yeah it's no so ian spent 19 years in prison prison where he was beaten by inmates and had to be put in solitary for the remainder and escorted by a guard as well.
Then he was eventually, after the 19 years, transferred to Ashworth High Security Psychiatric Hospital.
This was in 1985 and he stayed there until he died.
Why did he get moved to a psychiatric hospital?
Because he had lots of psychiatric problems.
Oh. That'll do it. Yeah. For the first three years that they talked through letters because they corresponded weekly.
That wasn't allowed. No, it totally was.
They did break up a couple of times through prison. what like you're broken up because you can't be together like that's stupid Well, they also petitioned to get married because married prisoners, one get to see each other and they had petitioned earlier, even before they were sentenced to prison, because if you're married to each other, you are not forced to go on the stand and testify against your spouse uh-huh so that was denied though yeah bye they're like no no no this is not a holy now i'm going to end this part with this really crazy thing that they did They used to write secret codes in their letters because they never do anything, you know, normal.
So they had something called the 678 code.
Okay. And if one of them underlined the date, on the letter, it meant that there was a secret code in this letter.
How did they like even figure out what that meant between the two of them?
I have no idea. So the secret text would start on the sixth line that's the sixth the seventh and eighth words would be the first two words of the message Okay.
Then the seventh and eighth words on each remaining line would be the rest of the message.
You have to give it to them. Like, they were smart.
They really were. I mean, I'm sure Ian came up with this one.
Yeah. Way later, when they broke up, like for good, and they started really going at each other, which we're going to talk about in...
Part four, because it's a lot of fun. I can't wait.
They started really coming at each other.
Ian was like, well, I'm just going to reveal all the things in the secret codes that in the secret letters that we wrote because she's a fucked up individual and I can make sure that you don't give her parole because she wrote me some fucked up shit.
And she freaked out when she heard this. to do damage control ahead of time because she knew what was in the letters.
What did she try to do? How is she going to get rid of that?
So she said, oh, well, just so you know, if he ever releases this, he did like to have me sometimes write him like, things that would like arouse him sexually and it was usually stuff about like hurting kids So she used to write fondly.
And like... in sexually explicit ways about harming children.
And now she's like, uh... He just wanted me to do that.
Please don't think that it's me who's doing that.
And it's like, oh, bitch, you just showed all your cards.
Because also when she did that, Ian was like, bitch, I wasn't going to reveal it.
Right. Like, he just did it because he knew.
Like, she's going to out herself. It's fine.
Wow. Like, he's manipulating her from his psychiatric hospital.
So I'm just going to read you one letter. that they wrote to each other that has a secret code in it, and the secret code was written by Myra.
Okay. So this is what the letter says. I'll tell you the letter and then I'm going to read you the code.
Okay. I've been thinking for a while, why don't you ask if you can go to the church on Sundays so we can at least see each other there?
You get someone to help with this. See the governor if necessary.
There are places in the chapel for people in your situation, Ian.
So ask someone to look into it for you. Now, this is when they were being held in jails and they were in the same jail, like before the trial.
Okay. there's someone here who goes with two officers she's in here for killing her own children and also for attempting to throw acid in her boyfriend's face Jesus no one likes her she's on rule 43 of course your mention of facial expressions in your last letter I could have seen the one on Brett.
His face was a picture when you stared him out.
So now I'm going to read you the code. Yeah.
Why don't you get someone to throw acid on Brett?
Brett was Leslie's four-year-old brother.
Oh my God. Oh my God. Oh my God. Oh my God.
Oh my God. Yep. She was requesting. that he had one of his criminal people out on the outside throw acid on Leslie Ann Downey's four-year-old brother.
I gotta go. Are we done? And that's the end of part three.
Fuck. And part four... is going to be the discovery of Pauline Reed's grave, which was a long time coming.
We're going to talk more about Ann West.
We're going to talk more about David Smith.
We'll talk about Ian and Myra's correspondence and how it became oh so sour later i can't wait to hear them turn on each other because Oh, yeah.
We're going to talk about their health failures and how they both died because it's... Did their livers just, like, fall out of their eyes? assholes no so much it's chef's kiss especially especially Ian's because he wasn't allowed to die and it's like my favorite thing ever he wanted to die so badly and they wouldn't let him.
It's amazing. That's actually incredible.
It's great. So trust me, there's some good stuff coming after that.
I'm excited to see the picture of them in the glass.
And we'll post that on Instagram. We'll definitely post that.
But I know this one was tough. Yeah, it was.
But we're through the toughest, everybody.
Now we're at the part where we can all skip along to the beat together.
Now we're going to be at the bonus information that I just feel like it's...
It's information that's important to this case because it's a really unique case and it's a unique relationship they had.
It's wild. It's a unique situation all around.
So I think it's important to talk about that and her bids for parole.
Yeah. How it was stopped by the families, how the families banded together.
It's just... It's all going to come in part four.
And part four will be on Wednesday. I promise.
By the end of the day on Wednesday. By the end of the day on Wednesday.
So hopefully everybody can take a deep breath. and go ahead and follow us on instagram at morbid podcast hit us up on twitter at a morbid podcast send us at gmail morbid podcast at gmail.com and make sure to buy our new merch at shop.morbidpodcast.com Yippee!
We hope you keep listening. And we hope you keep it weird.
But not so weird that you're just pirating, Hindley, because I gotta go.
Myra. Myra and Leonie and Brady. They're weird.
Too weird. Gross. Thank you. If you like Morbid, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.
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