Previously onCereal. Youknow, at first I waslike, haha, youknow,stop.
But you don't have hisaudio.
You don't hear the officersaying, police break itup.
So you guys don'tworry, I'mnot,listen.
I'm not going to presscharges.
It doesn'tmatter. You'refine.
Like you'll just be seen as an irritant now in thiscase.
Well, it's anobstructionist.
You don't want to get a reputation forthat.
No, you'llbe. Not guilty ofthat.
That'sfine. But you still have to go throughthis.
From this American life in WPZChicago, it'scereal.
One courthouse told week byweek, I'm SarahCanig.
First thing I said to myself when I looked at the list of felony judges in Kyoga Countywas, holycow, that's a lot of Irishnames.
Well,truthfully, that was the second thing Isaid.
First thing I saidwas, where are all theJews?
Secondthing, so manyIrish.
There's JudgeCorrigan, another JudgeCorrigan, Judge HollyGallagher, Judge ShannonGallagher, Judge KellyGallagher, JudgeSeanese, JudgeSheen, JudgeMcClellan, JudgeMcCormick, JudgeMcDonald, JudgeO'Donnell, and JudgeDonnelly.
Second to the Irish are theItalians, namelyRusso,Russo,Russo, andRusso.
Judge JohnJ.Russo, Judge JosephRusso, Judge MichaelRusso, and Judge Nancy MargaretRusso.
At the end of the list is JudgeSatula, and hercousin, JudgeSatula.
Andfinally, JudgeSinanberg.
Iknow, sounds like Mike HannaJudge, which he's actuallyItalian, married toSinanberg.
Theupshot, in a courthouse where the majority of the defendants isblack, out of the 34 felonyjudges, 32 arewhite, two are AfricanAmerican.
Early on in my reportinghere, I was on the 19th floor of the JusticeCenter, and I wandered into the courtroom of Judge DanielGall, just in time to hear him set and singsomeone.
I think it was four years that I was about toget.
I didn't recordit, but I tooknotes.
You'repathetic, the judge wassaying.
You'repathetic,dude.
My father had asaying, I shouldn't say this incourt, but I'm gonna sayit.
You're a bullshitartist.
You're criminal and aliar, and you've used the system all yourlife.
Then the bullshit artist says to JudgeGall, aliar, acheater, that's not what I built my lifeon.
Don't come in here and make these prettyspeeches, Judge Gallsays.
You've got what's called a mortal characterflaw.
The mansays, I'm not gonna let youdown.
I left the courtroom a little wiggedout.
I'd never heard a judge talk to adefendant, quite likethat, raw andbrutal, and confusinglyintimate.
As if these two men were locked in a personalargument, rather than a legalone.
The man up on thebench, tight andsmall, acting the enragedparent, the other chin up butshamed, trying tomalify.
A judge's job here when it comes to sentencing is broadly speaking to punish the offender and to protect thepublic.
There are sentencingguidelines, ofcourse, spelled out in excruciating detail in the Ohio RevisedCode.
And I'd assume the guidelines meant that sentencing was fairlymechanical.
A certain kind of charge would produce a certain kind of sentence plus or minus a little wiggly room in the margin to account for special circumstances or whateverelse.
But it's not likethat. County judges in Ohio have a lot of leeway andsentencing, a lot ofdiscretion, to interpret what punishment consistsof, what danger to the public lookslike.
Leewaydiscretion, that's power by anothername.
Today's episode we're gonna spend it all in one place in Judge Gall'scourtroom.
And we chose hisroom. We is ourproducer,manual, Jochi andI.
Becausefrankly, it's sometimes thrilling inthere.
The shock factor alone is worth the price ofadmission.
But also because hisroom, more than any wesaw, laid bare this prodigious power that judgeshold.
And the many ways they can wield that power to try to get what theywant.
A manual is gonna tell part of today'sepisode.
He actually moved to Cleveland forus, went to the Justice Center almost everyday.
He'll be reporting some of thisseries.
So you'll hear from him throughout and hang on to your hat'sAmerica.
A manual went to high school and college inOhio.
But he sounds like anEnglishman, longstory.
Here's amanual. It's been about fivemonths, off andon, watching cases in Judge Gall'scourtroom.
Thanks verymuch. That's a record 6-1-1set.
And so I can say with confidence that this is a typicalday.
So do you have any common sense atall,dude?
Why didn't you just pullover?
Most of what's happening in Judge Gall's courtroom in any courtroom are pleas andsentencing.
Charles of theexception.
So this one I'm startingwith, a sentencing for a 19-year-old I'm gonna call to Rell isn't unusual in anyway.
To Rell was caught driving a stolencar.
He led the police in achase.
He put guilty about a monthearlier.
And now he was back in front of Judge Gall forsentencing.
So let's back up for a secondhere.
Please tell me who's in thecourtroom.
Is that your mother in the far corner to theleft?
Yes.Hi, how are youtoday?
To Rell's family is sitting backthere, which is usually a good thing for adefendant.
He's meant to telegraph with there are people who can keep the defendant inline.
Should he or she bereleased?
Who else is here with yourmother?
Hissister?Okay,hi, how areyou?
Judge Gall greets to Rell's sister and another sister andbrother.
Ben turns back toTorell, starts to turn out a lecture anyone with better behave siblingsaside.
When you're not injail, do you live with those finepeople?
Yes. Well that's too bad for them isn'tit?
Because you've been pretty much of a badguy.
You're too nice sisters and your nicebrother.
They don't have theseproblems, dothey?
But you bring grief to theirdoor, don'tyou?
Don'tyou? You tellme. Judge Gall looks at Torell'sPSI, pre-sentencinginvestigation, which is details about Torell'sbackground.
Is your father in thepicture?
I seehim, Torellsays. What does thatmean?
You don't live withhim.
They were divorced when you werefive.
Correcto?Yes. Does your father have a criminalrecord?
Torell says not that I knowof.
Has he been to thepetattachoo?
He's a decentguy. What's he do for aliving?
You don'tknow, well you don'tknow, well he sort of deserted you in thefamily,right?
Are your brothers andsisters, the full brothers andsisters, your stepsisters?
The full brothers andsisters.
And your parents divorced when you werefive.
Is thatcorrect? If you're hearing a sharp noteof, I don'tknow, racial stereotyping in judge callsquestions, an assumption on the part of the judge that this black family is rudeless andunstable, that all these kids must be fromdifferent, possibly incarceratedfathers.
Yeah. I'm guessing Torell hears ittoo.
I'm quite certain he's aturnie, John Stan and hisit.
He's standing just behindTorell, at the podium in the middle of acourtroom.
He's got onehand, at the back of Torell'sneck, and the otherfirm, the untorell'ship, as though he is physically trying to steer Torell throughthis.
Mother, do you want himback?
Yeah. Take a look atyou.
Torell's mothersays,yes, she wants himback.
Plus, shesays, Torell's son needshim.
Right, that was the other thing youmarried.
No. Are youworking?No, you'renot.
You're in the kind ofjail.
And you've been in the kind of jail howlong?
Howlong?Okay, so when I ask you if you'reworking, you don't work in the kind ofjail.
You don't support yourchild.
And you had a baby of whatage?
18. Was that a smartmove?
That wasawesome, a baddecision,right?
So let's justreview. Judge Gawr lists for baddecisions, fat led Torell to thismoment.
And he's not altogetherwrong.
A lot of bad decisions won'tplay.
Finally, Judge Gawr sentences Torell to four years ofprobation.
Not a terrible outcome forhim.
Considering Judge Gawr could have given him almost three years inprison.
Judge Gawr explains for terms of Torell'sprobation, periodic drugtesting, get ajob, and he tax on one lastcondition.
He tells Torell that if he has another child out of wedlock but he can'tsupport, he will consider that a violation of hisprobation.
Mother, are you with methere?
Thankyou. Your mother's talked about thatresponsibility.
It's responsibility to thecommunity.
I'm not down with you having kids and dumping them up and getting to grave and the shoulders and the taxpay.
I know some people don't think that's politicallycorrect, but that's myview.
That's myview. And if you demonstrate your responsibility to thiscourt, I will send you to the pettent.
You get a job and believeme, you're going to pay child support to your own support for every child that youhave.
Torell doesn't sayanything.
Hisattorney, JohnStanner, thanks Judge Goal and his courts is cryingout.
No one in the room points out that what Judge Goal is just threatened to do isunconstitutional.
He can't punish Torell for having achild, notlegally, but this is the sort of thing Judge Goaldoes.
As the daycontinues, he puts the same condition on two moredefendants.
If you're on probation to me and you have more kids out of wedlock than you can afford to payfor, I'm going to send you right back to theinstitution.
As far as Iknow, Judge Goal has never made good onthis.
He issues threats all thetime.
We're going to tap your cellphone.
We can test your hair follicles for opiates rightnow.
It's allbluster. The attorneys knowthat.
And what they also know is that as long as you don't piss himoff, Judge Goal isn't an especially toughsentence,sir.
All of the punishments he handed out on this day were reasonable for thisbuilding.
He put people on probation whom he could have sent toprison.
And the people he did send toprison, he said he'd consider giving earlyrelease.
So for defenders and theirattorneys, the strategy in Judge Goal's courtroom is endure whatever he loves atyou.
Don't challengehim. Don't triggerhim.
And you'll probably come outokay.
That's what a defense attorney like John Stanut is trying to convey by squeezing to realshoulders.
Just holdon. Don't sayanything.
We're almostthere. Can he see me onesecond?
Back in hisoffice, Judge Goal's got souvenirs fromIreland.
A lot of the judges have Ireland stuff in theirchambers.
He's also got one of those powderthings.
Yessir.Hi. There are a lot of golfballs.
Yeah. That'd be funny if I had a slip and fall case from your golfballs.
You have to get a visitingjudge.
Judge Goal is at homehere.
He's nestled into the building along with the sons of other prominentClevelanders.
On his floor are two other judges whose fathers were also countyjudges.
Judge Goal's own father was a Cleveland City Councilman and later countytreasurer.
Judge Goal started out as a defense and civil attorney and then ran for Judge in1992.
County judges are elected inOhio.
He hasn't lost an electionsince.
There have been four ofthem.
He's known around here as a TVjudge, controversiallyentertaining.
The way hetalks, the way he reacts instantaneously tostimuli, it's why the Cleveland.com reporter sometimes parks himself in Judge Goal's room on a slow newsday.
A recentheadline, woman convicted and murderconspiracy, calls Judgeracist, gets lifesentence.
Here'sanother. Judge compares man acquitted of murder charge to Las Vegas shooter atsentencing.
Note the word acquitted ofmurder.
And thatone, Judge Goal said that if the defendant had pulled a gun on him on JudgeGoal,quote, I would have busted a cap inyou,unquote.
The defendant's name was DemagioCallahan.
Judge Goal said he remembered this guy from a previous casebecause,quote, he's got an Italian first name and an Irish last name and he's abrother.
He'll often call black defendants brother anddude.
Asin, you got a bit of anattitude, go get abrother.
Emanuel told me that in eight months of watching hiscourtroom, the only black person he didn't hear Judge Goal call brother or dude was amanual.
He uses terms like babies mama and babiesdaddy, which impossible for a white guy to do without making the whole roomcringe.
He has no truck with politicalcorrectness.
He's up to use the term racecard.
If you throw it down in hiscourtroom, he says it is not going towork.
I.e., woman calls judgeracist, gets lifesentence.
He'll work the black lives matter movement into his colloquy as apun, Iguess.
His black life didn't matter toyou.
Didit, he'llsay, has said more than once to a black defendant regarding a blackvictim.
Judge Goal knows he'sblunt.
Knows he's scurrying not toquibble, but I'd say crossing various lines constitutionally andsocially.
He says he's been called all thenames,misogynist,racist.
But he says that is the price he pays for trying to connect withdefendants.
Now I have been criticized in the past for maybe using a little slang or being a little bit too casualsometimes.
But I'm talking to a group of people and I want to speak to them in theiridiom.
In language that they canunderstand, not inlegalese, not in footnotedreferences, in Jerry and say just heydude, getreal.
I mean I really want them to understand me and understand that I understandthem.
He's doing something upthere, hesays.
He's not just afunctionary.
Say what you will about Judge Goal's personal views and his manner and histemperament, and I will say many thingshere.
But he is notcynical. He's fundamentally optimistic in a way that he can fix what'sbroken, defendant bydefendant.
And I really think I know these people sometimes better than they know themselves and I share this information confrontthem.
I make them think about theirlives.
Every day Judge Goal is seeing all these depressing stats mademanifest.
It's almost always there in thePSIs.
He'll see that the defendant's parents were drug addicts orabusive, couldn't or didn't take care of theirchildren, maybe ended up in prisonthemselves.
And now thisperson, a product of foster care and a board of education with kids of his or herown, comes before Judge Goal having committed acrime, sometimes a horriblecrime.
It's a rotten family cycle and Judge Goal wants to breakit.
He told amanual, that's why he's asking defendants about theirchildren.
You ask me why I ask people how many kids theyhave.
Yeah. Why gothere? Because it should be an issue of socialconcern.
It's not politically correct to ask people how many children theyhave.
Why I don'tknow, I think perhaps because some people think it disseswomen.
It's not aboutthat. If I believe that most of the people are in here because of abuse or abandonment or neglect as achild, and Ido, then I want to see to it that there aren't kids that are just born and left by themselves inabandoned.
Youknow, some people wouldsay,well, you're amassageist.
Wait asecond. I'm defending little boys and little girls who are brought into this world and raised in foster care for the rest of theirlife.
What do you think their chances ofmanual?
And what percentage of the kids can be born into poverty before we don't have a middle classanymore?
Or there's a permanentunderclass?
Sotheory, meetpractice.
Please tell me you don't havechildren.
I don'tknow. This woman had pleaded guilty totheft, he explains she has one child and a second on theway.
Who's the first baby todie?
Judge Gahl gave her a couple yearsprobation.
This is on aMonday. Over theweekend, Judge Gahl had read an article about the percentage of children born onMedicaid.
After the Macy's woman left thecourtroom, he started talking aboutit.
Anybody see the story in the paper about the percentage of children born in this country onMedicaid?
Anybody seethis? I don't even want to know a moment of defenseattorney.
NewMexico, Ithink, is 50percent.
He toldthem. And the national average is over 50percent.
I believeit, said aprosecutor.
We'd hear Judge Gahl cite this statistic from the bench several times as the months wenton.
Judge Gahl is one of the most transparent judges in thebuilding.
His worldview seemed woven into everyproceeding.
He liked the old daysbetter, when Cleveland wasbetter, and America wasbetter, when people were morerespectful, moreresilient, lesswhiny.
Now we're dealing with a generation raised on ADHDmedication, which did who knows what to their brainchemistry, and thesemillennials, nourished on participationtrophies, think they're owed something from the rest ofus.
All ofthis, this wholebuilding, the 13,000 felony cases moving through the criminal court eachyear, Judge Gahl traces it to a frightful shortage of personalresponsibility.
Sentencing inOhio, the recent history ofit, is similar to what's evolved all over thecountry.
Back in themid-1990s, when we were freaking out about rising violentcrime,Ohio, like manystates, revamped its sentencinglaws.
It redefined certainfelonies, made some punishmentsharsher, and got rid of parole for mostcases.
And I'm going to shamelessly over-simplify for asecond, because the reasons why Ohio's prison population climbed are complex and superinteresting, by theway, but just now it didclimb, mostly because people began serving longersenses.
In1974, Ohio prisons held 10,700people.
By2011, they held almost 51,000people, a400%increase.
That'sexpensive, more than a billion and a quarter-dollar isexpensive.
So thatyear,2011,Ohio,again, like otherplaces, swung back the otherway.
It passed new legislation aimed at unpacking theprisons.
It gave judges more options for diverting low-level felons to alternativepunishments, and broadened the opportunities forprobation.
That suits Judge Gald justfine.
He likesprobation. He likes lengthyprobation.
I probably put more people on probation than any other judge in this courthouse.
Yeah, because I can always put them in prisonlater.
Right? And I keep my eye onthem.
probation gives Judge Gald ongoing control over people'slives.
It's his best hope for getting them tochange.
And I probably have it any onetime, anywherebetween, I don'tknow,I, youknow, a couple thousand people on probation tome,50% of people on probationviolate.
Probation, what insiders call gettingpaper, rather thantime, is what most defendantswant.
But probation has its ownhazards.
Probation here is actually called community controlsanctions, emphasis on thecontrol, which is why I have heard defendants tell judges they'd rather pay a big fine or just do some jail time and get it overwith, rather than beyondprobation.
Onprobation, you'reout, but you're notfree.
You are still tethered to the courthouse.
And the conditions of your release can worm their way into almost every aspect of yourlife.
They can dictate who you livewith, where youwork, whether you can have a beer afterwork, whether you can go to your uncle's funeral or your niece'swedding.
It's so easy to slipup. A dirty urinetest, a missedmeeting, maybe you get indicted on a newcrime, and you're back before JudgeGoll.
That's why he's got more cases than most judges in the building because of all those probationviolations.
We watched one violation hearing for a woman namedVivian.
I know you quitewell. We've talked on five or six occasionsnow.
Correct? Are you with mesimply?
So I feel like anoverview.
Judge Goll doesn't know Vivian prettywell, but he knows herspecs.
She's29,single, threechildren, her youngest is three monthsold.
A couple of years ago in2015, she pleaded guilty to felony drugpossession.
She got caught with a small amount ofcocaine.
Rather than convicted of thefelony, Judge Goll granted her what's called anILC, intervention in lieu ofconviction, work sort of likeprobation.
The idea is if Vivian can do everything she's supposedto, her case will goaway.
The list of requirements issignificant.
Reportweekly, undergo drugtesting, complete intensive outpatient drugtreatment, go to AAmeetings, obtain asponsor, get counseling at herGED.
She's done everything except stayclean.
A recent drug test showed she'd beenusing.
This is her fifthviolation, her sixth time before JudgeGoll.
And I'm telling you that you got to deal with the drug problem or you're going to lose your job and your children are going to live in ahopper.
Judge Goll takes time withVivian.
For a matter that another judge might have dealt with in five minutestops, Judge Goll spends 20 minutes talking toher.
That's a dog's age in thisbuilding.
He spends through the usual jazz aboutbabies' daddies and bad decisions in the welfarestate,Medicaid, New Mexico's72%.
But he also seems sincere about trying to helpher.
He boars into the detail of herschedule, asks about herjob.
She works nights in the kitchen of a casino for $10 anhour.
Badidea, he tellsher. That's exactly the kind of place where you're going to be offeredcocaine.
You need to stop the second shiftwork.
I think it's certainly over forVivian.
Ido. If you could get up and get the kids off and get the kids daycare and work during the daylight hours so that you and the children can rest at the sametime, you need to gethonest.
You'reworking, you'reworking, youknow, 16 hours a day without the help ofanybody.
Three months ago at another violationhearing, Judge Goll got fed up and sent Vivian to jail for a week to try to scare herstraight.
That didn'twork. Today she's desperate not to get lockedup.
She's worried she'll lose herchildren.
Her comportment isdeft.
She knows not to beg inhere, not towhine.
She admits herweakness, flags herstrength.
She tells him all on her own she's enrolled herself in an intensive outpatient drug treatmentprogram, anIOP.
I just feel like I should do better and I can dobetter.
And if you give me theopportunity, I promiseyou, I know I've done wrong numeroustimes, but I've been working myself for10,9,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8, and I'm going to do a little bitmore.
I'm going to do a little bitmore.
I'm going to do a little bitmore.
I'm going to do a little bitmore.
I'm going to do a little bitmore.
I'm going to do a little bitmore.
I'm going to do a little bitmore.
I'm going to do a little bitmore.
I'm going to do a little bitmore.
I'm going to do a little bitmore.
I'm going to do a little bitmore.
I'm going to do a little bitmore.
How can we best help you getbetter?
One of the drug court judges is JoanSinnenberg, who has a social workbackground.
Actually, she's the recovery courtjudge, which is a docket for people struggling with both mental health and drugproblems.
And it is a different vibe overthere, just reallyfast.
I'm going to showyou. I was with her one day when she popped into that courtroom to sayhi.
Hi. How areyou? Another judge was substituting for her because she was tied up on a murdertrial.
The participants sat in the jury box and on thebenches, the atmosphere was casual andwarm.
See all ofyou. I miss you alot.
Do you miss metoo? Are we missingher?
No,no, that's not what I'm going tosay.
Right? I loveyou. On the rightleg.
On the rightleg. On the wayout, Judge Sinnenberg ran into one of the recovery court participants in thehallway.
Got himCraig. Gave him a bighug.
He'samazing.Yeah. You have been your one of myinspirations.
This program isamazing.
Little hectic andstressful, butamazing.
Soproud. This whole experience isamazing.
I'm so proud ofyou. You have come sofar.
Nice,right? No one gets torn down in drugcourt.
No one is asked why they'repregnant.
I'm not saying it's a cureall.
Ohio has been devastated by the opioidcrisis.
But research shows that programs like these are the best way we've found to help people with drug problems stay out of the criminal justicesystem.
So Vivian's attorney asks for drugcourt.
And the probationdepartment, which is staffed with substance abuse specialists and socialworkers, they're well regarded aroundhere.
They are also recommending Vivian for drugcourt.
But Judge Goll flicks that ideaaside.
As if drug court is going to do something different than what people have alreadydone.
It's as if he'ssaying, I gotthis.
I deal with addiction all daylong.
Vivian's just got to buckledown, stay thecourse.
She doesn't need drugcourt.
She hasme. Vivian's attorney doesn't push back much onthis.
He even seems to agree with JudgeGoll, what difference would itmake?
Onedifference. In drugcourt, she'd have one defense attorney dedicated to her case who'd follow her progress and update thejudge.
But this guy is her fifthattorney.
Each time she has to appear before JudgeGoll, she's assigned someonenew.
First, there was a publicdefender, LindaRico, who negotiated the ILCdeal.
Sincethen, it's been assignmentlessattorneys.
There's CharlesMorgan, then JimHolflick, and AaronBrockler, your representative at twohearings,actually.
Today, it's JosephO'Malley.
Theirgoal, all ofthem, is to keep Vivian out ofjail.
Other thanthat, they don't have much of a stakehere.
They're not thinking too hard about how she progresses with drug treatment or what would work best forher.
They're getting paid $100 for thishearing, and the moment'sover, she's not their clientanymore.
Today, Judge Goll ends up putting Vivian on house arrest at her ownsuggestion.
I'm sure Vivian would like this interaction with Judge Goll to be herlast, butalas, she ismidstream.
A month fromnow, she'll be indicted for theft for using a friend's creditcard.
And anotherhearing, Judge Goll will tell Vivian she's out ofcontrol, and he'll send her tojail.
She'll spend 51 daysthere, while the credit card case gets sortedout.
She'll plead guilty to a couple of first-degreemisdemeanors.
Judge Goll will tell her she'sweak,indulgent,selfish.
He'll tell her to quit thetears,sweetheart, and he'll give her a suspended jailsentence, more homedetention, plus two yearsprobation.
Now, instead of three A-A and A meetings aweek, she must go to four aweek.
Two monthslater, she'll violateagain.
Thistime, she'll beg for inpatienttreatment.
She'll tell Judge Goll her cousin died three weeks ago from anoverdose, and she'safraid.
I needhelp. I needhelp.
She'll say it seventimes.
I need to learn to get through thissickness.
You call it asickness, and I call it acrime, he'llsay.
He'll send her tojail. Onceagain, she will leave her threesons, who by this time are nine yearsold, six yearsold, and nine monthsold, with theirgrandmother.
After Vivian has spent 66 days lockedup, her ninth assigned lawyer will write to Judge Goll asking him to let herout, and Judge Goll will release Vivian fromjail.
He'll put her on probation for another year and ahalf, and now she must attend five A-A and A meetings aweek.
Judge Goll is trying to helpVivian, at least I think heis, butconsider, if Vivian had gone to drugcourt, that new theft charge would have been rolled into her existingcase.
It would not have affected her status in drug court atall.
If she'd been in drugcourt, it's unlikely she would have spent even one day in the countyjail, much less 127days.
If she'd been in drugcourt, and if she'd used anything like the other drug courtparticipants, almost all ofwhom, backslide andstruggle, she would have graduated from that program in about 13months.
As itstands, she's been embroiled with Judge Goll for three and a half years incounting, for fewer than five grams atcocaine.
This is possibly the most profound and least examined question in thebuilding.
Whatworks? The court doesn't gather statistics onsentencing, and that's true for most of thecountry, by theway.
No data thatsays, defendants in Chaioga County do better after six months of probation than after three years ofprobation, or in terms ofreoffending, four years inprison, yields better results than seven years inprison.
We just don'tknow, which I found rather astounding when I realized no one is trackingthis.
The court keeps extensive data regardingefficiency, how many cases are moving through whosedockets, and howquickly, which I'm not knockingefficiency, it'simportant.
That's why people here are generally not waiting years and years for their cases toresolve, and that'sgood.
But there's no database locally or nationally that shows whatworks.
So each judge in the building has to muddle it out for him orherself.
Judge Cassandra Collier Williams put it to me thisway.
There's 34 judges uphere, and it's like 34 differentcities.
Of course judges here aren't just wingingit, or mostly they're not wingingit.
They're basing their decisions on the sentencing guidelines and on their professionalexperience, but they're also making decisions based on their lifeexperience, on where they come from and who theyknow, and where theylive, and what theyread, and what it is they holddear.
Duck into variouscourtrooms, and you feel it rightaway.
Mr.Cook, how old areyou?
I need to just speak up just a littlebit,okay?
That's Judge Collier Williams on the 23rdfloor, taking aplea, case of Fologna's assault with agun.
She painstakingly lists forMr.
Cook all the rights he's giving up by not going totrial.
Withgentleness, she makes double sure he understands what she'ssaying.
Okay, so what's the total time we're looking at the possibility of the 11 years from five to 11years?
Iunderstand.Okay.Finally, she lectureshim.
Thankyou, I accept your plea of guilty to count three and find youguilty, they'reon.
Justkidding, she'sdone.
Nomust, nofuss. Though we have seen her dothis.
You have 30 days to raise yourvote, and she'll prevent to your probationofficer, and now you're required to vote in allelections.
And the reason why I do that is because people died for thisright.
Judge Collier Williams wants felons to participate indemocracy, like everybodyelse.
But she actually stopped doingthis.
Ever since the ACLU had a little chat withher,again,unconstitutional.
Judge Michael Donnelly on19, he'll only discuss please on therecord, no backroom set insingles.
Judge JanetBurnside, down on16, finds she's giving people accused of serious crimes longer and longer prisonterms, because she's so struck by the sheer violence she'sseeing.
But forprobation, she swingslight.
She wants to get people off of court supervision as quickly aspossible.
Few yearsago, the probation department started using what are called evidence-based practices to determineprobation.
You ask a bunch of questions to try to figure out a defendant's risk of recidivism and then tailor the conditions of probation to his or her level ofrisk.
A PowerPoint I saw in the method included a slide thatsaid,quote, avoidthreatening,lecturing,arguing,shaming, orsympathizing.
But judges don't have to take the probation department'srecommendations.
They'reoptional. Judge Kathleen AnnSattula, back up on23, says she uses the evidence-based thing onlysometimes.
Her philosophy is akin to JudgeGoll's.
She toldus, shortprobation, that's throwing a personaway.
She'll typically give five years ofprobation, super strictconditions, 98 A meetings and 90days, forinstance.
And if you miss aday, you have to startover.
She owns her reputation as a toughjudge.
Wakeup! What mean would be the tamous thing we heard to describeher?
But I gottasay, we didn't see that somuch.
She wastough, but we didn't get the feeling her toughness wasself-serving.
We watched the sentencing of a youngguy,19.
He'd stolen a bunch ofcars.
Other guys wereinvolved, but they didn't getindicted.
It wasintense. She asked thedefendant, you live with yourfather.
So why didn't he pay yourbond?
250bucks, and you could have gone home monthsago, instead of sitting in jail all thistime.
Youknow, we called yourfather.
He said he didn't know youraddress, or where youstay.
That's acrisis.Yes,ma'am.
He wasfirst. You're standing here allalone.
There's no whois, there's nomarquee, and even your father doesn't want to stand here withyou.
Does this tell yousomething?
Do you have any thoughts about this in yourhead?
Yes,ma'am. What are they sharing them withme?
I'm going down the wrongpath.
Yeah. Bigtime. By theend, they're talking about his futureplans.
She mentionscollege. I don'tknow.
Can one stiff talking to change the trajectory of a teenager'slife?
I don'tknow.Maybe. When I ask judgeshere, how do youknow?
How do you know if what you're doing isworking?
They talk about the people who comeback, just to visit or who write letters or whom they see on thestreet, who say thank you for being hard onme, or thank you for giving me achance.
You helpme. I have my kidsback.
I'm doingwell, which must be great for a judge tohear.
But rigorousevidence, itisn't.
For JudgeGoll, I wasn't exactly sure what he needed to see from a defendant in order to declaresuccess.
I came upon the case of RishanEllis.
I'm going to go to the nextone.
Why not find out with generous welcome offers that include a seven-day freetrial?
Go to nytimes.com slash freetrial.
When Judge Goll sentencingsomeone, the principal thing he's looking for isremorse.
Emmanuel and I have heard him say these two phrases dozens oftimes, acceptance ofresponsibility, demonstration ofremorse.
Rehabilitation can't begin until there's some acceptance ofresponsibility.
Some candor with thecourt.
Some demonstration ofremorse.
Acceptance ofresponsibility, showingremorse.
Judge Goll did not invent thesephrases.
They come from federal and state sentencingguidelines.
And they soundbedrock-ish.
Like they're probably chiseled into the courthouse wallsomeplace.
But inpractice, they'recontroversial.
Because acceptance of responsibility or showing genuineremorse, what does thatmean?
What's that supposed to looklike?
It'ssubjective. Some judges willsay,well, you playedguilty, so that's taking responsibility rightthere.
That's enough forme. But in Judge Goll'sroom, a pleaalone, definitely notenough.
He needs to hear you sayit.
Evenbetter, he wants to feel you feelingit.
If youdo, it's a good bet your sentence will belighter.
If you deflect responsibility or stay mum on thesubject, the sentence could beheavier.
The starkest example we saw of this was the sentencing of a guy named Ray-ShanEllis.
Ray-Shan was31. He'd been a defendant in many cases ever since he was ateenager.
Some charges he'dbeat, some hehadn't.
In the yearbefore, he'd picked up a newcase, or caught a newcase, as whatever onesays, as if it's avirus.
Anyway, Ray-Shan caught a newcase.
Seriouscharges, feloniousassault, weaponsviolations.
It was a messyincident, but the gist was that a guy shot a gun out the window of Ray-Shan's car while Ray-Shan wasdriving, and a fight had brokenout.
Earlyon, Judge Gaw made it plain he thought Ray-Shan should pleadguilty.
But Ray-Shan said he wasn't the instigator of thisdebacle, and what'smore, he had tried to de-escalate thesituation, to break up thefight.
He'd been scared for his ownlife, hesaid.
Ray-Shan took the case totrial, and hewon,mostly.
He was acquitted of the most seriouscharge, feloniousassault.
But he was convicted on two weaponscharges, both of which carried the possibility of prisontime.
Because of the gun in thecar, even though it wasn't Ray-Shan'sgun, and he didn't fireit, the jury found he was still criminally responsible forit.
Immediately after theverdict, with the jury still sittingthere, Judge Gawlaunched.
Ray-Shan, hesaid, you should have resolved this case a long timeago.
You,sir, are going to be looking at the harshest possiblefact,okay?
Because I'm not going to put on ascreen, a person that's so dysfunctional anddestructive, that doesn't understand that you should have resolved thiscase, without risking 23 years on the first cap in fact in theguilty.
26.26. I want to pause on this for asecond, so the perversity of the moment can sinkin.
Judge Gaw is angry at Ray-Shan for refusing to pleadguilty, for risking huge prison time on an assaultcharge, for which he has just beenacquitted, notguilty.
That's what's dysfunctional anddestructive, refusing toplead, and that's what makes Ray-Shan deserveprison.
A monthlater, a manual went to Ray-Shan'ssentencing.
We were curious to see what he was going toget.
It was a Mondaymorning.
Ray-Shan was one of his first cases of theday, and already Judge Gaw was workedup.
You get indicted and you don't admit yourresponsibility.
You don't demonstrate anyremorse.
You know you're going to go to prison on a probationviolation, because I told you that through yourattorney,right?
He's going togo. Ray-Shan had been in probation at Judge Gaw in this new casehappened.
That's partly why it waspissed.
Judge Gaw starts listing a rest after arest, charge aftercharge, dropped ornot, that Ray-Shan faced ever since he was ajuvenile.
When he and Ray-Shan'sattorney, JohnMazzannon, started really getting the facts of the currentcase, John'sexasperated, and not for tendexasperated.
You often see attorneys performing anargument, but you don't often see a realone.
John is insisting that Ray-Shan had tried to do the right thing to keep the people around him from gettingshot.
He's getting hot with thejudge.
What is it supposed todo?
You're not going to have alawyer, but you're just supposed to doit.
If I can'tauthority, this goes on andon.
Ray-Shan is facing five and a half years on the probation violationalone.
Never mind the new charges he's just been convictedof, which could add another four and a halfyears.
So ten years total if the judge wants to stick it tohim.
His fighting is nothelping.
Finally, right as Judge Gawsays, so your sentence to Ray-Shaninterrupts.
Ray-Shan takes out a four-page letter and beginsreading.
YourHonor, justGaw.Later, back in hischambers, Judge Gaw read parts of the letter aloud tome.
I've been in acriminal.
My point of view has been clouded since I was first charged at 16 yearsold.
And I have been angry eversince.
I have finally opened my eyes and saw and came torealize.
I have been wrong for 15years.
It has humbledme. This experience has helped save my life and awaken me to my self-destructiveillusions.
You are an outstandingjudge.
I'm going to remind you of what you said that I could be yourson.
And I'm not assuming that asfavoritism.
That comment truly touched me and made me look at youdifferent.
I originally perceived you to be prejudiced and never expected you to show me your human personaldecency.
I recognized the wisdom and help you imparted on me that I was wrong and you had been trying to reason with me to consider my choice to associate with the criminal lifestyle and it goes on and on andon.
In thecourtroom, Ray Sean read his letter for more than sevenminutes.
When hefinished, Judge Goal wasstunned.
It'sreally, youknow, in this letter I've been doing this for 35 years and that's sort of like the criminal equivalent of the guy who's broke withdress.
He said he wanted to get the letter laminated and read it from time to time because he found itinspiring.
A visit to thecourtroom, such asmyself, might consider Ray Sean's letter a brilliant strategic move while also wondering whether Judge Goal had just beenplayed.
But Judge Goal believed the letter wasgenuine.
He wasmoved. He said to RaySean, it's not possible for anyone to fake what you justsaid.
The letter was gratifying for JudgeGoal.
Of course itwas. But I think it was also maybe vindicating for him because I had been there to hearit.
I'd also been in a room a few weeks earlier when a defendant had called Judge Goalracist.
Judge Goal knew I'd been squinting uncomfortably through the herrings and thestereotyping.
And now he wasproof. Goal's methodworked.
Judge Goal was emotional about itafterwards.
He mentioned a Bible story about the good thief who wasredeemed.
He chokedup.So, there may be some redemptionhere.
He's certainly youngenough.
And if he changes hisattitude, he may amount tosomething.
He may makeit. Because of theletter, Ray Sean cut his own sentence roughly inhalf.
Judge Goal was going to give him six and a half or seven years hesaid.
Instead, he gave himthree.
And he told RaySean, come back in six months and apply for judicialrelease.
What's known as shockrelease?
A way of cutting someoneloose, he's learned his lesson after the shock ofprison.
So, sixmonths, hesaid, file amotion.
Maybe I'll shock youout.
6 Months to theday, JohnMazzannon, Ray Sean'sattorney, did file a motion for shockrelease.
Judge Goal held ahearing.
Ray Sean and Mazzannon werethere.
But it lacked the magic of thesentencing.
Instead, Judge Goal trawled Ray Sean's criminal record all overagain.
So much prior involvement with thesystem.
Cruelty toanimals, that jumps off thepage.
Anyone that would do that to ananimal.
Ray Sean pushedback. It wasn'tme.
I was 14 years old and someone shot a cat on my porch with a BB gun and I didn'ttell.
What about the aggravated robbery in2001?
Well, thatone, I didn't doit, but I wasthere, so I gotcaught.
And then the crime athand.
Judge Goal accused Ray Sean of knowing about thegun, of putting other people indanger.
Ray Seansaid, it wasn't likethat.
Judge Goalsaid, why are youminimizing?
The Gettysburg address wasn't echoing in anyone'sears.
Judge Goal denied Ray Sean's motion for judicialrelease.
I'm denying your motion for shock probation at thistime, hesaid, because you are not acceptingresponsibility, and therefore you're not demonstrating anyremorse.
Try again in sixmonths, he toldhim.
See if your attitude haschanged.
After it was allover, I talked to Ray Sean about how this whole thing wentdown.
He told me he still hadn't made sense ofit.
Judge Goal had all but promised to shock him out if he did well inprison, and he had donewell.
Six months earlier when he wrote theletter, he said it was partlysincere, partlypolitical.
He knew he'd need to stroke Judge Goal'sego.
He behaves like aking, hesaid.
He wants you to honorhim, you can become adigester, and he may think about chocolate some coins off histable.
But at the hearing for shockrelease, he figured they were past the stage of flattery andtheatrics.
So he was taken aback when Judge Goal started in on the details of hiscase.
Ray Sean said he kept trying to talk tohim, man toman.
I respect you as the individual in the position that you'reholding, because you know I'm being accused ofsomething, and I need you to be a professional and look at thefact.
And by the way with the evidencehere, he just automatically already knew like it doesn't matter if you'reinnocent, I want youguilty, I kept trying to pale him like there's adifference.
There's more to thisstory, and I don't know what you want me to tellyou, but that's the honestguy.
Ray Sean didn't feel as if Judge Goal were leading him down the road toward responsibility andredemption.
He felt as if Judge Goal simply wanted submission for its ownsake.
Ray Sean said JudgeGoal,quote, struck me as nothing less than a raging slavemaster.
And I just had to let him know in such a nice way what I'll really hurt in the skin as to muchlike, I ain't thatguy.
I ain't noslave, I'm not scared ofyou.
And youknow, and Iwas, youknow, a lot of times I kept tellingthem, I don't agree withyou, I don't agree with what yousay.
And he just didn't likethat.
So he wanted it his way or noway, and it was just like that hisnight, your way or noway.
But it is Judge Goal's way or noway.
That's the maddening corkscrew of Ray Sean'sposition.
Judge Goal shouldn't require him togravel.
Ray Sean's right aboutthat, but there's nothing Ray Sean can do aboutit.
Because Ray Sean is the one who broke thelaw.
Everything Judge Goal's doing islegal.
If you'rewondering, does Judge Goal ever get in trouble for the way he runs hisroom?
Has he ever rainedin?Well, let me tell you about this one last case justquickly.
It was back in2015, so I wasn't there forit, but I do have atranscript.
A guy named Carlton Hurd was indicted forshooting.
He said he didn't doit, he wanted to go totrial.
After being postponed a fewtimes, Day of Trial finallycomes, and Carlton Hurd's attorney asks for anothercontinuance.
Because he saidMr. Hurd had just informed him a half hour ago that he's been covering up for the realshooter.
So now they need more time toinvestigate.
Judge Goal does not take kindly to this motion tocontinue.
He thinks this last minute is a goodthing.
He thinks this lastminute, new evidence claim isbogus.
He's sure they're just trying todelay.
He does what hedoes, which is to excoriateMr.
Hurd for being black among otherthings.
Your black life didn't matter toyou, didit, and your child's going to growup, and I'm speculating now just like you did without adad.
Did you have afather?No, says CarltonHurd.
No, of coursenot, says JudgeGoal.
Butthen, even by Judge Goalstandards, Judge Goal veers out ofbounds.
He says to CarltonHurd, you're either going to go to trial rightnow, are you going to pleadguilty?
Carlton Hurd hadn't asked for a pleadeal, and the state had not offeredone.
Nomatter. Judge Goal comes up with his own deal for CarltonHurd.
Hesays, if you plead no contest to the indictment rightnow, I'll sentence you to 14years.
Quote, if you take the case to trial and areconvicted, you will do multiples of 14years.
Because if you're convicted of thesecharges, that's what youdeserve.
You deserve to spend what could be the rest of your life in the state penalinstitution,unquote.
What's it going tobe? Carlton Hurdsays, I'll go totrial.
His mom blartsout,no. Carlton says tohurt, listen to what he justsaid.
14 years seemed like forever toCarlton.
His little daughter would be 18 when he gotout.
But his mom was hearing the othernumbers, multiples of14, if he's convicted attrial.
They confer for a bit off therecord.
Then Judge Goal tellsthem, atlength, about another case hehad, in which he offered a coupleof,quote, knuckleheads a deal they didn'ttake.
I had the same conversation with them I'm having withyou.
They sat right there right in thatchair.
I toldthem, Isaid,look, you can do 15 years or if you're convicted of all this otherstuff, you're going to get consecutivetime.
They both got sentenced to 78years.
Judge Goal asks again whether Carlton wants toplead.
I didn't doit, says CarltonHurd.
Judge Goalsays,look, you want to go totrial?
Go totrial. You have a beautiful suiton.
You can sit there and maybe the jury will think you're a great guy and you're notguilty.
What do you want todo? There's apause.
Allright, let's bring the juryup.
Judge Goalsays, the jury's on itsway.
If they walk into thisroom, my deal with you isoff.
I'll takeit, says CarltonHurd.
It was like an hour'severything.
That'sCarlton. When I asked him why he said yes to theplea, he told me his mother persuaded him they could fightit.
That they couldappeal, which theydid.
Because it waslike, what he wassaying,like, we just knew that's not nothing that a judge really could besaying.
He ain't part of you saying and doing none ofthat.
The Court of Appealsagreed.
I got the sense reading their decision that the justices were straining to contain theirdispleasure.
A plea is supposed to beknowingly,intelligently, and voluntarilymade.
That's thestandard. The fact that Judge Goal participated in the plea byitself, that's not necessarilyunconstitutional.
But the way Judge Goal didit, concocting the plea on hisown, without even asking the prosecutor the defenseattorney, then you add in thepressure, thethreats, the way he made it obvious he thought Carlton was guilty before even seeing a scrap ofevidence.
The only thing Carlton Hurd could have knowingly and intelligently concluded the Court said was that he was unlikely to get either a fair trial or a fair sentence after trial from JudgeGoal.
Under thosecircumstances, they said the plea was notvoluntary.
It wascoerced,unconstitutional.
They vacated the plea and then took the extraordinary step of ordering that Carlton Hurd's case be reassigned to a differentjudge.
The first fullness of the Court of Appeals decision wasremarkable.
Then something more remarkablehappened.
Thissummer, almost three years after being lockedup, Carlton Hurd went totrial, this time in front of Judge JohnRusso, and he was acquitted of allcharges.
So, what does this mean for JudgeGoal?
For themoment,nothing.
I asked Judge Goal whether he felt he'd screwed up in Carlton Hurd'scase.
Hisanswer,no. Tome, hesaid, this isn't a case about an innocent man being railroaded by thesystem.
It's a case that clearly demonstrates how a defendant and his attorney manipulated the system of justice to their benefit and beat a murdercase.
Attemptedmurder,actually.
The day Carlton wasacquitted, I called JudgeRusso.
He'd presided over thetrial, but he's also the administrative judge for the Kayahoga County Court of CommonPlease.
He's not Judge Goal'sboss, but he is the public face of theCourt.
I caught him on his cell right when he got home from thetrial.
Is there any consequence for Judge Goal because ofthis?
Imean, there isn't fromme, so Idon't, youknow, he's acolleague, and so I don't recommend him or sanction him in anyway.
After the verdict when Carlton Hurd wasacquitted, Judge Russo had apologized tohim, said coercion has no place in thesystem, etcetera.
Judge Russo clearly disapproved of how Judge Goal had handled thecase.
But now on the phone withme, he was sounding rather melee aboutthat.
What seems frustrating is that there isn't some automaticnow.
Review or someautomatic.
Yeah.Something,investigation,something.
Imean, I've seen him do this in his courtroom to otherpeople.
Andyes. It'swrong. And if any of you are just doingthat, somebody needs to be made aware ofit.
Imean, that'sit. There's aprocess.
So whatever that processis, it has to be started bysomebody.
I would argue that Judge Russo is asomebody.
I talked to another Kayahoga County judge who was outraged by thiscase.
He's asomebody, a couple of attorneys on this case who might also spoketo.
There are somebuddies.
The court of appeals judges who ruled in thiscase.
What about those somebuddies?
If any of these some buddies is afraid of reprisal from JudgeGoal, they can even complain anonymously to the Ohio SupremeCourt.
There's a state board on grievances and discipline that has the authority to investigate and sanctionjudges, disbar them ifnecessary.
Judge Goal has actually been through that process once before in2010.
I won't give you thedetails, but suffice it to say the Supreme Court justices were appalled by what Judge Goal had done and said in thatcase.
And then they gave him a fairly minorreprimand, a sixth month suspended suspension of his lawlicense, meaning he was able to stay on thebench.
As of rightnow, I've not heard that anyone has filed a complaint with the Supreme Court against Judge Goal because of Carlton Hurd'scase.
Nothing about the case has been reported in the local newspaper or onTV.
No one's picketing outside hiscourtroom.
So Judge Goal's not tooworried.
He's been on the bench for 27 plusyears.
I take my role as protecting the peace and dignity of the state of Ohiovery, veryseriously, and I wasn't elected to bestupid, hesaid.
If he's being liedto, he's not going to sit back and pretend it's nothappening.
I wasn't elected six times to be adumbass,unquote.
As long as the voters keep voting for himthen, he's going to keep on keepingon.
And he'sright.Yes, there's the appeals court and the disciplineboard.
Butreally, every sixyears, it's the voters who have the finalsay.
And most of the votershere, here andeverywhere, it's understoodthat,eh, what do theyknow?
Fordecades, they've seen the same Irish and Italian names on theballot, almost allDemocrats, what's a ruso over a Corrigan over aGallagher?
How could you even keep themstraight?
Mostly, the voters are casting their ballots and then stayingfar, far away from the felonycourthouse.
It doesn't touchthem, and they don't touchit.
Until there's a shockwave, a crime and punishment shock wave that billows out across thecity, thecounty, thecountry.
That's next time onSyria.
Syria was produced by JulieSnyder, a manualJochi, Ben Calhoun andme, with additional reporting by IdaLi-Skowski, editing on this episode from IraGlass, NancyUpdike, and Hana JaffeeWalt.
Whitney Dangerfield is our digitaleditor, research and fact checking by BenFalen, sound design and mix by StoNelson, music clearance by AnthonyRoman, Seth Lind is our director ofoperations, Cyril Staff includes EmilyCondon, JulieWhitaker, CassieHalley, and FrancisSwanson.
Our music is by Adam Dorne and HoweWilner, with additional music from Matt McGinley and FritzMyers.
Our theme song is by NickThorburn, remixed by AdamDorne, special thanks to Gypsy Eskabar and measures forjustice, ColinSweeney, CoreySchaefer, ZoeRoot, and the Justice Programs Office at American University School of PublicAffairs, DavidBrown, KellyMitchell, and Julia Leskerinsky at the Rabina Institute of Criminal Law and CriminalJustice, Sarah Andrews and Scott Schumaker at the Ohio Criminal SentencingCommission, BrianHoffman, and the pretrial justiceinstitute.
Finally, the art on our website was made by AdamMaida.
He created the mural for this episode and Maid Studio to theanimation.
Please check it out atcerealpodcast.org, thatcerealpodcast.org.
Also thanks to StudioRodriguez, who did the webdesigns, in particular BenAverl, JulietWang, or Levite and CoyWong.
