My name is Emily and I'm a psychologist and regular guest on The Imperfects.
I was proudly born and raised on Wurundjeri country and now live, work and raise my own children on the lands of the Wajak Noongar people.
I'm inspired by the strength and endurance of the world's oldest living culture.
We at The Imperfects pay homage to traditions of story and in particular its role in healing when we share and create space for stories on this podcast.
Together with The Imperfects I acknowledge the Wurundjeri people of the Kulin Nation as the traditional owners of the land on which this podcast was recorded and extend my respects to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples.
I acknowledge this land always was and always will be Aboriginal land.
Well guys, this is an unprecedented first ever episode of The Imperfects.
Yes. I love that you said unprecedented because it's relevant to when I was in year 11, my English teacher, Mr.
Collins had a word of the day, every single lesson he had with us and the first one he ever gave us, we had to get an exercise book just to write them down was unprecedented.
Yeah. Well, this relates exactly to that experience.
Next one was abundance.
Let's get back to unprecedented.
So today, if you're watching the video version of this episode, you'll notice that there are empty seats next to the three of us.
That is because an abundance of seats that are not being sat in.
Very good. Very good.
I'd written you off.
Here you are. Thank you, Mr.
Collins. And the reason for that is because we are going to bring on some of the people who work on the show behind the scenes of The Imperfects for a very special six way discussion.
First ever. First ever.
Sex chat. No, no, we are not.
Technically, not technically.
No. No way. It will be a sex chat.
No, it's absolutely not huge.
You need to change your notes because I know you've got some slides ready.
Do you want to change?
A lot of research for this.
Yeah. More than ever.
Sorry. Just to be clear, I wasn't.
That wasn't a very, very odd comment.
Yes, it was. You don't get to decide.
Yeah, there's like a sex tet.
A six piece. A six piece orchestra or something.
Six of us. Six of us talking.
So that's why I'm saying sex chat.
Hence why you called Tim Minchin in an episode I just got a sex threat because he's good at six things.
Yes. Exactly right.
I'm not sure that was clear to him to be honest.
Yeah, it wasn't clear to me either.
Yeah. Yeah. We need to clear that up with Tim and clear.
We're not talking about that.
We're just there's six people talking, which I thought could be referenced.
Let's move on. And just to back up what Josh said, Hugh, you should never be the judge of what is weird or not on this show.
I get to decide. I think I agree with that.
That's fair enough.
So for those who heard a few weeks ago, a very first version of this episode, get in Volney.
And this is another get in Volney.
It's time to open up.
Are you sure it's not a sex chat?
No, Hugh, it is not a sex chat.
What is it, Hugh? It's time to lean on your friends.
Yeah, nice. But not in a sexy way.
Hugh, let Josh speak.
It's time to be vulnerable.
And why, Hugh, why do we be vulnerable?
Because, baby, vulnerability leads to a stronger connection.
That's right, baby.
The imperfects are getting Volney.
And to get Volney today, we will, of course, need to invite the other members of the of the team on.
So as they enter the arena, the reason why these guys are here is going to be sex of us.
The reason for that is because I wasn't in the office, but Josh, you were.
You guys all just started chatting about exams.
Yeah, yeah, I think the idea was brought up that maybe we should do an episode about exams and exam pressure because of the amount of pressure that a lot of teenagers are feeling at the moment, and we just started talking about it as a group and the stories and it was so real for everyone in the team
could just go back to what it felt like to be an exam time.
And we realized that A, everyone had really good insight and reflections on what they went through, and also that the whole point of it is to kind of be in a workplace in the end.
And so why not bring our workplace on to the pod to talk about it?
So we got six different stories.
Yeah. Short stories.
I believe this drop this week.
Can we can we abandon replacing six with sex?
So should we introduce the 12s out there?
Just trying to relate to young people.
Yeah. Why don't we start?
Yeah. Yeah. Talking to the team.
Okay. Well, let's start with to my left going clockwise.
We have bridge Northeast.
Okay. Executive producer on the show.
Yes. Hi. Good to see you.
Thanks for coming in.
She's always very formal.
Good to see you too.
Sometimes when we really say something funny, you can hear Bridget giggling.
Yeah, that's it. It's usually it's the goal.
It's the goal. You know it's landed pretty well if Bridget say the laughing or bawling.
Yeah. Either way, it's like, this is gone great.
She's on the floor crying.
All right. Then we have Bella Northeast who is our assistant producer.
Hi. Welcome to you.
Thanks. How are you feeling?
I'm very nervous, which I think is on brand.
Yeah. Okay. As in for you normally or just like for this, what we're doing?
Both in general and now.
And then we have George Martin who is our man.
He's our cool man. He's a cool man.
Everyone's cool, man.
He's our, well, what do we call you?
I don't know. I just do it.
George is good. Edits all the episodes, does all the videos, does all the social media.
He's a very busy person.
Is my north star for how I'd like to dress, but I can't come too old.
Coolest man. Coolest man, you know.
Oh yeah. So if George is your north star, Hugh is a Bridget and Bella your northeast stars.
Oh, that's good. I did think of that yesterday when we were talking about north stars.
We should call it a northeast star.
Yeah. Didn't say it.
Well, you've met the team, they're all here and we're talking exams.
So I guess we're all going to tell a story about exam time.
Just a quick story about exam time because it never really goes according to plan.
There's no such thing as the perfect exam.
And I think often when something goes wrong in the lead up to or during, it can really throw you.
But I think if you kind of expect or you hear these stories, you go, oh, well, something's going to go wrong at some point.
And I just, that's life.
That's what happens.
That's also very, this is very nice, isn't it?
I can care to have everyone here.
Love it. Well, I'm in, on the, yeah, I can go to on the, um, on the morning of my English exam.
I'm pretty sure it was English.
It was definitely one of my exams.
I'm almost certain it was the English one.
I remember waking up at about 4 am or five because I was like being a crazy party dude or something coming home.
Yeah. I have to hear your party stories.
Raven. It must have been five, would have been five or six in the morning.
I woke up. I'd left, it was a warm night and I left my window open, didn't have flywire screen and I woke up to a possum on my bed and I completely, at first I thought I was imagining it, then I completely freaked out and like shook the doona and it darted into the cupboard and I panicked and shut the cupboard.
And then I was like, I don't know, how am I going to get this possum out?
I've also got to get, like it was sort of early morning.
I sort of got up. I didn't know what to do.
I think I didn't tell mom and dad.
Why? Because I was like, I was thinking about the English exam and I left and went and did my English exam, left the possum in the cupboard with the knowledge that the possum was still in the cupboard.
But I was so, I was also, so that was kind of, um, thrown me.
That's a huge distraction and not enough sleep.
Yeah. And then I was also like told to hydrate, hydrate, hydrate.
And I drank so much water that I went to the bathroom maybe like six or seven times during the exam and I didn't finish the English exam.
You didn't finish? No.
Because you were distracted by the possum.
Possum and piss. And piss.
I should say that, but yeah, I let that when we got home, I like open the door and the possum ran out.
Not still in there?
No, it's okay. But it was, yeah, it was a bit of a horror start to the English exam.
I didn't do a very good English exam at all.
Terrible. Not surprised.
I didn't finish. How did you feel when you didn't finish it?
I was pretty devastated.
Yeah. I was, I thought I had a massive failure.
Um, and I, and because it's that first exam, I was like, God, this is, you've already stuffed up the first one.
Like how, like sort of coming back from that.
Are the rest going to go?
Yeah, yeah. So it was pretty, it wasn't a good feeling.
And especially when you walk out and everyone else is like talking and it's like, how'd you go?
With the questions what you wanted.
And then when you say you didn't finished, everyone's like, what?
And I can't believe it.
So that's not a good feeling either.
I think everyone can relate to coming face to face with a possum on their bed before an English exam.
I think it's pretty common story.
So I think it's also worth pointing out for people because a lot of people, if an exam doesn't go well, they think, well, what's going to come in my life now?
It might be worth pointing out that your job is now words.
Kind of. Yeah. Storytelling and words.
Yeah, that's a good point.
I think hopefully today in this discussion, we can, like it's a tricky one because if you've worked really hard for your exams and they go, well, that's awesome and well done and good on you.
But I think it's also, hopefully we can also show that if you don't do well at exams, if you don't do exams, if you haven't had a good year or whatever, there's always another way to end up in the work that you want to end up doing, whatever that is.
And who cares if you don't know what it is now?
Yeah. I can definitely relate to that feeling of I felt like such a failure at the end of my exam.
Yeah. The one I'm thinking of is my year 12 drama solo.
Do you mean solos in like solo performance?
Yeah. So yeah, in your 12, I actually don't know if it's still the case with drama, but you had to do a seven minute solo performance and you devised it over the year.
I remember I did this as well.
It had to be exactly seven minutes.
You couldn't go like a second over, if you did, they would cut you off.
So. That's like real life.
Yeah, exactly like real life.
I've never been that position again.
But I was, I got a bit swayed in year 12.
My careers, people kind of were like, you should do maths and science because we need more women in maths and science.
And we didn't have a lot of people at our school.
So I ended up doing subjects that I didn't really love.
I did physics and I did two different kinds of maths.
And I was with all the boys in the class.
I didn't really have my friends.
And I really didn't like it.
I felt like I had something to prove in those classes.
And then luckily I did drama as well, which felt so much more like me and I could be myself and I loved it.
And I picked this drama solo, so you get like a list of characters to choose.
And I still remember mine.
It was this woman called Annette Kellerman, who was like a swimmer, like a champion swimmer and a vaudeville kind of silent movie actress from like the 1920s.
Wow. You don't get to choose.
You get a list and it was one of the options.
And my performance had to have like singing in it.
It had to have dancing.
Oh, sorry I missed that.
So she's the character you're playing.
Yeah, she's the character that you have to play for the seven minutes and you have to kind of like make up all the actions and all the words and all the stuff that you'll do in that seven minutes.
Is there footage of this somewhere?
God I hoped a lot. And I loved drama and I felt like myself there and all year I'd been telling like the teachers and everyone had been telling me like, your solo is going to be great.
You don't have anything to worry about.
This is going to be an A plus.
And I had built my expectations up really high and I just I didn't have anything else to kind of go off.
So I just believed them that I was going to be fine.
But I remember when we had to go to do the solo exam, we all got in a bus and I drove to this kind of like a community hall not far away.
And there were lots of different rooms and the students would go into the room and there'd be like three or four judges sitting at a table.
I remember this. And you had your kind of like space and you could only carry a couple of props in and you'd get set up and then the timer would start for your seven minutes and you'd just have to go.
And I got in and maybe I didn't realize like how nervous I was or I just was leaning on the expectation of like, I'm going to be fine.
But as soon as I started, as soon as that timer started and I started to like do my thing and start singing, I just had no voice.
Like it just it just disappeared.
I mean, are you using you got nervous or just you couldn't?
I don't know. Like I'm not sure.
Like I just couldn't think I couldn't speak.
In your defense, Annette Kellerman was from the silent movie era.
I should have went on that.
But she yeah, I couldn't I had this like raspy kind of like voice coming out and I just remember making eye contact with the one of the judges, the only woman judge on the panel.
And I could see the worry in her eyes and I could see how bad she felt for me.
And I was like I can't there's nothing I can do.
I have to do seven minutes.
I have to keep going.
I couldn't stop and I couldn't get a drink of water.
So I pushed through and I did seven minutes and it was awful.
Like it was so bad.
And then I got out like afterwards and I just felt so low.
Like I felt like a complete failure.
I felt and like I think what was worse was that this was like my favorite subject and this was something I was thinking maybe I could go into this after school and I just completely butchered it.
But when I got out, I saw all the other students and they were so excited and they were happy and they were just thrilled at how it had gone.
And I saw my teachers congratulating them.
And I just I was so embarrassed and I was so ashamed.
I just buried it so deep down and I walked up to them and I just lied.
And I said, yeah, mine was great.
I would have done that too.
Totally fine. Mine's good.
And I just wish so much that I hadn't done that in that moment because when I got home, I didn't tell family.
I didn't tell friends.
I like I just buried it for so long and didn't give myself a chance to process the failure or even accept that it had happened.
Instead, I just kind of like clocked that up to this is evidence that you're not good enough.
This is evidence that you're not worthy and that you shouldn't do this as a career.
You shouldn't even go into it.
And it just it kind of ruined it for me a little bit.
And then I think instead of going, I've just had a bad day.
I've had about seven minutes.
My voice didn't work.
Yeah. If I and like you can you can still try again at this field, this career.
Yeah. And yeah, if I if I just spoken to one person, if I could spoken to a parent or if I'd spoken to a good friend, they would have said exactly that.
They would have said, it's OK.
These things happen.
Like you probably just needed to have some water and take some deep breaths before you went in.
But instead I internalize that failure as like, you're not a performer.
You're not good at this, which has like ended up having quite a big impact on me, I think, because it's only recently I started to seeing a psychologist and like not because I was very depressed or anything, but just because feelings and stuff were coming up, especially working in like a very performative
field for my whole career with with performers.
And we started to talk and all these memories.
The drama solo was one of the memories that was coming up.
And I told her that it feels like I've been wearing this really heavy necklace of self -doubt where every bead on the necklace is like a moment or a memory or an experience like the drama solo that I've gone, that's evidence that you're not worthy or you're not good enough.
And it was amazing.
Anita, the psychologist, she got all these posted notes out when I told her that and she started writing on yellow posted notes.
All of the memories that I was telling her that were all these beads on this necklace.
And she put them on the floor.
And then as we were talking over the over the sessions, she started getting blue posted notes and writing different things on them.
And I couldn't see them until the end of the session.
And then at the end, she was like, there are two necklaces.
You've got this one that you've decided is evidence of, you know, you're not good enough.
But throughout the sessions, I've been telling her other things where I'd push myself outside of my comfort zone, where I'd gone and exchanged or asked for a job or gotten a promotion.
And she wrote them all down on the paper and she's like, you can choose which necklace you wear, and you're not made up of just like these string of experiences that you've decided to say one thing about yourself.
And it felt so much lighter since then.
Awesome thing today.
Yeah. Yeah. It was really freeing.
Can I borrow the blue necklace?
I'd love that. That sounds great.
But yeah, it's a wonderful lesson for anyone out there that you can have a bad couple of hours, it doesn't really reflect your ability at all.
We were laughing before about how an exam is just like it's the most ridiculous concept, really.
It's bizarre. It's like you're going well, at least in my memory of it, like for an English exam is different than a drama exam, but like an English exam or any of those sorts of sit down at a small desk.
I don't know what they do now.
But in when I was in year 12, it was like huge hall, little one person desks.
You kind of walk in like military style, sit down, basically get frisked on the way in.
And then you sit down and then it's like time starts and then teachers are just like slowly walking up and down the aisles, like observing you and you're trying to like write like a creative story.
But yeah, it's just such a bizarre environment.
And even but I guess like the thing with drama, though, I guess it is that is quite a similar environment to an audition.
That is exactly what an audition is.
So in a weird unhelpful way for this conversation, that actually is probably pretty good, pretty good preparation for what it is to be an actor.
But even then decide like, no, the thing is, if you do a bad audition, you go, that's a bad audition.
I've got another one coming up with an exam style.
You're like, I think especially at that age, if you don't share what happened, like exactly what you said, say beautifully, like you start to believe the fact that that seven minutes is actually what I'm, that's actually me.
That's who I am. Yeah, it seems so clear now that why not just tell somebody?
Why not just share it?
Because even if even if they didn't know the right thing to say, I would have felt lighter having just said this happened.
And yeah, yeah, I mean, it's also like it's kind of a good example, really.
Because as most actors know, it's like you go to you do hundreds of auditions and most of them will either be bad or you'll think that they're bad because you didn't get the job.
But the job, it seems, of being an actor at least is to keep doing it and not take each individual one personally, if it doesn't work out, even if you like stuff it up.
It's like, oh, I was just one about audition.
Yeah, it seems like a more realistic approach would be to have 15 of them across the year that you have to do.
Yeah, exactly. So that I think the waiting is one of the thing that's tricky.
Like I nothing, nowhere near as devastating is the story you just told.
But like I threw out all of it was kind of the opposite of you.
I was really into science and physics especially.
And I had a really good couple of years of physics.
I did really well in all the like class work and was set up to do really well.
And then I completely I had a bad day and completely butchered the exam and it was worth like 70 percent of your mark or something.
Yeah. So like I stuffed up one day out of the two years and it made me believe, oh, you're actually not cut out for you wouldn't be able to handle physics at uni.
You're not smart enough.
You're not. And a story started about of negativity, of like all the deficits and how bad I'm at that.
So definitely don't consider that as a career because I had one bad day.
I know it just makes me think actually of because I look back on my high school days and now I would consider my part of what I do is is being a writer.
But it but I didn't when I was in the year eleven and twelve, I I didn't have any and I'm not but it's not false modesty.
I just did not have a unique voice at all.
Like I think the stuff that I wrote was pretty vanilla and just safe, I'd say.
And it wasn't until years later that I actually found like a unique voice, like what my actual unique voice, which is based off dozens of other like voices that I admired, you kind of create your own thing.
But I think I think definitely in school, I felt like I'm not I'm nothing special.
There's nothing interesting about me because I haven't figured it out.
And and then eventually it kind of got to a point where I was like, oh, actually, that's that's something that feels unique to me.
And then and then that's such a good feeling.
But it took I don't think I got that till I was like.
It's like late twenties, I reckon.
And it's crazy that like we we put the pressure on ourselves to have like figured out a unique voice in high school.
Yeah, yeah, high school.
Yeah. Thank you for that.
But I think that's a very generous, very generous story.
About you, Bell. I sort of started getting like good at school when I was about 15 and I had some other stuff going on in my life.
And so school was this environment where I could really control everything that I did and I could do it well.
I could write, which was something that a lot of other kids couldn't do.
And so English and history and all that came quite naturally to me.
And I really enjoyed putting in the effort and building an argument and things like that.
And then it started to become part of my identity.
So it was like, oh, that's Bella and she's really good at school.
And I really ingrained that into myself.
And then that expectation of, oh, that's Bella.
She's really good at school.
She is going to do really well in exams.
Oh, God. And I, I sort of like I was like, oh my God, I have to, I have to be this person.
I have to be this person that everyone thinks and expects me to be.
And I became so neurotic in my study habits that I would use school as an excuse to miss 18th to miss sporting commitments, to miss anything else.
Because I was like, oh no, I have to do school.
I'll sacrifice it and it'll be really good.
And I'll show everyone that I am as good as they think I am.
And it got to a point where my English teacher in the last week, every day I'd hand him like two practice essays.
And he was like, absolutely no more.
Every day you would hand in two practice essays.
He refused. He's like, you're fine.
You're ready. It's fine.
Please go outside. Go for a walk.
Sick of reading. Hard to read all these essays.
Yeah. So I was like, okay, okay.
But I didn't really like think about it like that.
And then I had all of my exams are in one week and I remember the few nights before the results came out.
I was so nervous. I did not sleep at all.
I was so like, this result is going to either validate me to everyone that I know and be like, Oh, Bella is good at school.
And yeah, her results show that.
And then they came out and they were pretty good.
Like I was pretty happy for about half an hour.
And then I was like, this weight that had been on me hardened.
And it was like, for the rest of my life, I'm going to have to live up to this potential that I've said.
Yeah. And because I was so studious and so focused on everything, like I read the VCE guidelines and I knew every dot point on that guideline.
And I had all that knowledge in my brain.
And then it sort of cemented this thing that if I don't know absolutely everything about what I'm doing, I won't be good enough.
And people will find out that I'm just faking it.
It's like you got a good result.
So it's like now, now don't squander that opportunity.
Don't squander that opportunity.
Make sure that you live up to that potential that you've set.
I think some people might have a tendency to go the other way when school finishes and I've got the result, just go, I'm exhausted from that.
I'm going to be something else for a bit.
And sort of, I've actually never heard that before, but I guess that'd be a common thing as well.
Yeah. And I was exhausted and I should have taken time out, but I just, you know, mom and dad are so proud of me.
And they're thinking about all these things that I could be.
And I'm like, I'm not that.
I can't be the person that you think I am.
For example, what, like, what kind of things were they like?
Like a politician or a world leader or like a thought leader or like what are those lofty, lofty, the world leader.
That's lofty. No pressure, but we think you could be the world leader.
There isn't one at the moment, but you could, you could do it.
And it like, oh, it means so much that they think so highly of me.
But I was like, I am not that.
Oh my God. I could not.
I am, I have no idea who I am.
I have no idea what I want to do.
And there was this good mark that said, no, you should push yourself and keep doing this, you should keep this ridiculous schedule of studying and, um, like saying no to everything else.
That's, is there, so one of the things that has become apparent and I would say almost become part of your like at work profile is that you read really quickly and, and I, and I, and it just is occurring to me now as like, is there a part of you that feels like, oh, now if I get hands at a book, I have to
read it really fast because that's now I'm the read fast person at work.
A little bit. Which is not, no, no, no.
It's a lot. I do love reading.
I really do love it.
But um, but just wonder whether or not like, could there be a similar situation where if, if you're like books being sent in and maybe bridge asks you if you can have a read of it and, but then you're like, Oh, but I had, I was going to go out for dinner tomorrow night.
Is there ever pressure on you that you feel like, I know, but if I don't read it quickly, then I'll let the team down or because, you know, I'm the expectation is that I read fast.
Yeah. And that's absolutely nothing on you guys.
But I do struggle because I find validation through work and through like praise of that.
So like, keep giving me praise.
Like it's so lovely.
But um, same with me.
Um, but I, I find it so much easier to say no to friends and to say no to employers or colleagues or lack.
Yeah. At other jobs.
Like I just, I had to know everything and I had to be across everything because if I could do that, and if I could be that person that fixed everything, then people would still want me around.
That's it. That's I think that's just a wonderful thing to share.
Cause I think a lot of people will experience that.
And I think we all know we're doing a great job as your employer when we asked you to read a book and you go, I can't, I'm going for dinner tonight.
That'd be success for us.
I would love to hear you say, when I say, what's the research on this person?
You go, I don't know.
I was effort in with my friends, reading your books.
And ideally when you do say it, if you could be wearing sunglasses and smoking a cigarette, that'd be really cool.
George, thank you so much.
How about you, George?
Yeah, so I, I went through the ACT Canberra system, um, which I've learned is different.
So we didn't actually do exams at the end of the year.
Well done. I see too straight to parliament house straight to the public service round about maintenance, so we just went through year 11 and 12 and we did assignments and everything counted and there was no big pressure on the end of year exams, which in hindsight was, it was great.
Um, so for me, so I'm all good.
But I did, I loved media growing up.
Like that was the thing that I just fell in love with from since year seven.
Went into year 11 and 12 and wanted to do media and do, you know, make videos and actually got a day.
Wasn't a very good student in media.
Yeah. Mum actually sent me a report card the other day.
Just to remind everyone listening, George is now in charge of pretty much all of our media.
So I think she was saying like, look, look at what you've done.
Um, look where you are.
Like I am in my dream workplace, um, with you guys and yeah.
Didn't have, didn't have the best results going through school.
Well, that is, that's amazing.
I love that so much questioning the employment.
Yeah. Who was anyone at your school?
But then, um, finishing year 12 went to a uni, tried that for a bit.
I didn't love it. And so I dropped out of that and did film school.
And one of the things that I've learned getting into the industry is to contact a lot of people, try and just be a good person, more than have good talent or good skills.
And just get on people's radar.
I messaged a few production companies and people that I'd been following, um, one of them being a very good friend of mine now, Josh, Josh Jansen, Josh Jansen.
And then we caught up for coffee and then started making things together.
Um, then I met you Ryan.
Yep. And on the daily talk show.
Yep. Cause I went on as a guest as a guest.
Yep. And Ryan has always been just a hero of mine.
Like, you know, your, your stuff, I was the reason why I loved making videos in year seven.
Well, that's really cool.
You seven. Must've seen your year eight videos.
Yeah. So we used to turn up to school and just want to make real stories.
Like that was just like, that's what I wanted to do.
And so then when we met on that other podcast a few times, a couple of years later, you just emailed me out of the blue and said, Hey, we're looking for someone to do our socials.
Um, at the imperfect.
At the imperfects. Would you became, I was like, Oh my God, this is amazing.
Like, and that's when it clicked to me that because I was like, Ryan has been in the industry forever, I look up to him and yet for whatever reason, I was one of the people on his radar.
The only person that's amazing.
Like, so I think that was a real shock to me because, and that's what I've been telling people, um, lately is just to put yourself out there as much as you can.
Meet as many people as you can.
And you'll probably get on someone's radar and there's a lot of people that are busy and don't have time to do something, but if you're available, then it's great.
And I'm so happy to, to be in this team now.
And it's like, oh yeah, I can't believe it.
It's, it's so interesting that cause it kind of does illustrate that.
Um, and this, and we're talking about media here, specific to this.
This probably doesn't go for surgeons.
Um, but, but it's like when you know, when people are looking for people to work with them, like we were looking for someone to look after the social media stuff, um, we're essentially looking for someone who has a certain set of skills and on one hand, of course you're looking for someone who can do
the job, like he wants someone who can do the job, but what is as important, if not more important is you're looking for a good person.
And there's no, there's no grade for that in high school.
Yeah. Like they, they, they might give out, you might get a ribbon or a badge or some sort of award at some point, but that is not the thing that is encouraged and is not the thing that you're kind of like judged upon necessarily at the end of high school, but I would argue, and I think everyone in here
would agree, and I'd say most people would agree other than like, yeah, like very highly skilled things that require skill and precision, like a surgeon or something, but being a good person and being kind and prioritizing that, that is, it is the, it is the un it's, it's spoken about, but it's not enough.
It's not, yeah, it's not spoken about enough as to how important that is.
Yeah. How many doors that will open for you.
Do you want to go to work with people that you like to hang out with?
Like that's, I think that's everyone we've brought onto this team.
Like anyone we probably will bring on in the future is going to be a great person first, and then hopefully good at making a podcast.
I think it's interesting you bring up the surgeon thing, though, cause I was, I wanted to mention that, um, a friend of mine, he, this is going back to the exam thing and also alternate paths into getting into certain industries.
One of my best mates, his marks that he got in year 12 wouldn't have been good enough to get into any medical school.
Um, and then, and he didn't even know that he wanted to be a surgeon or a medical person at that point in his life.
He did media with me for a year, then he jumped across and did a, um, construction like management course for a bit.
And it wasn't until his early twenties, he started to start, actually, I think I want to go into medicine.
So it worked really hard.
Did the whatever it's called, gam?
Started really hard for that, got in as it works so hard and he is now a surgeon.
Um, and he's, he's, he's such, such a brilliant person.
So intelligent. But he, and he's a brilliant surgeon.
He's like doing so well and killing it, but he's, according to his marks, he got in year 12, he wasn't good enough.
And I think it's proof that if you, and he didn't know what he wanted to be in year 12, but he, he certainly got there later on.
If you know what you want at some point in your life and you decide you want it and you work hard enough towards that and, um, be a good person, you'll get there.
It's not about what happens now in year 12.
Yeah. There's always another way.
Always another way.
If you want to. Yeah.
And I think like, it's also okay to not know what you want to do.
Cause, cause after the drama thing, I thought, Oh, I may as well just go into physics.
I think I've signed up for a physics course.
And I remember I did two weeks and I was in the library, um, at Monash and I was holding the physics textbook, which was like as big as my head.
And I think I cried for about five minutes, realizing like, this is not what I wanted to do at all.
And I only, I only got into media cause I had a friend at another university who was like, why don't you come hang out with me for six months and just join this course.
And then I eventually found something that I liked, but.
However, I have heard a story that your physics degree helped you in an interview.
Didn't isn't there a story about an in job interview?
Yeah, you had a job interview with Hamish Blake and Tim Bartley and right.
I thought you were there, but you weren't in the room.
I don't really remember it, but I think Tim Bartley said, as I was working on a Hamish and Andy TV show.
Tim Bartley is someone who I work with and have worked with for a long time in my TV world with all the Hamish and Andy shows.
Yeah. And that's where Ryan and I met.
So I, I left radio and had gone to work in television and Ryan and I met on that Hamish and Andy show.
And I don't know if it was in the interview or it was when I was already working there, but it was like a travel show and we were doing all these like wild kind of sort of stunky sketchy kind of things in different countries.
And for some reason there was some physics thing.
I think it was about like central fugal force or something like that.
And Hamish is really into his science and he knows a lot of stuff.
Hamish is one of those annoying people who was extremely funny and very smart, particularly with maths and physics.
And he said something and I can't remember what it was, but I instantly knew it was wrong and I didn't think, and I just corrected him in front of like the room.
And I've been told people were impressed.
Tim Bartley is like, we have to, I know why it was told to me.
It was like, she's got the job.
She's correct damage in front of everyone and she was right.
She's in. You never know what scarix of information and learning will help you.
That's true. I feel like this conversation, we set out for it to be a people who are doing exams and, and to make you feel okay about, not everything hinges off, off the back of this exam, but I feel like this is also going to be a useful thing to listen to after exams, like as in what happens next
and where you go next.
To encourage people to listen to it twice.
It's good for us. Including all the ads.
Yeah. So my story is funnily enough.
It's it's English, just like Josh, it's English.
Exam related and it's animal related.
So we would catch to get to school.
We would catch the 109 tram down Whitehouse road, down Whitehouse road.
Shout out to the 109.
And the tram stop, I haven't checked recently, but the tram stop was, I think someone put the bench seat in the wrong place, so they, they put it on the foot path, but to sit on it, your legs were out onto the road.
It was way too close and it's a main Whitehouse road.
It was a main road with the tram, obviously.
So it's quite hectic.
So you would have to sit there and really tuck your legs under the bench to make sure.
Anyway, it was the morning of the English exam.
It's English back then.
It might still be now.
I don't know, but it was the first exam and I was feeling quite anxious because the first exam and I was sitting there and a dog came running over to me.
And it was like sort of jumping off on me and I, I tried to show it away.
And so I went off you go.
And I did the shoeing thing, but I, the shoeing motion was shoeing it towards the road.
And I, and so it ran onto the road and it got hit by a car.
And I looked around and there was no owner and the tram was coming.
And my exam was I had to, I couldn't miss this tram.
And, because they won't let you into the exam if you're late.
Yeah, or she's killed a dog.
So I, luckily at this moment, this, not likely for her, but a lady came around the corner and I was just standing over the dog that was on the ground and the person who had hit it had just driven off.
Oh, this is a real ethical like moment.
It's like, it's like a real question of character.
No pressure. Well, I possibly failed this exam because I looked at her and I went, oh, a car just hit your dog.
She goes, what, what do you mean?
And I said, I, I just hit the dog and the tram had just stopped and the driver's just looking at me and says in like to go, you have to get on it, we're going.
And I looked at her and I went, and I went, I'm, I'm so sorry.
I didn't say because I shoot it in this direction and I'm, I'm pretty sure the dog was alive, but it looked like it'd been pretty badly injured.
Yeah. And I, I said, I'm so, I'm so sorry.
I have to go to school.
And she was really upset.
And I got on the tram and I like, and I thought it'd be nice if I waves.
I was like waving as a train drove off, like waving to her, like, this will make it fine.
So I had to go to, to my exam with that, like a similar animal animal.
That is much more traumatic than mine.
How was the car didn't stop after it hit a dog?
That's awful. Maybe on the way to an exam.
But yeah, it was, it was, um, that stopped as I hit it.
And then like sort of looked at me and then just sort of drive around.
It was awful. Oh my God.
So, and I don't remember if I did English was my subject.
That was the one that I had to, I knew I was going to do well on that.
And that was, to be clear, this, there wasn't your fault.
It was the driver hit the dog.
You didn't eat. It's not your fault.
At the time I'm sitting in the English as I'm going, I think that's my, if I didn't shoot the dog away, like why didn't I want, I love dogs.
I don't know why didn't a dog jumping on me.
I just, yeah, but yeah.
But in I was rationalizing during the exam going, this is all happening during the exam going, but it would like, there's nothing I could have done then.
The owner was there.
She was able to pick the dog up.
It was a small dog and yeah, there's nothing I could have done then.
I don't think I should have written about it.
It would have been a great exam in the English exam.
This is what this just happened.
This just happened.
Yeah, it would have been a straight into right if it was analysis of it, of a novel that I just read.
Fuck that. Just happened to me.
Tim Winton's latest book.
Do you remember how you felt after the exam?
Like, did you, you know how you did?
Did you manage to go?
I actually don't remember what Mark I got.
I don't have no recollection, but I remember finding it very, very difficult to concentrate in the exam.
Very difficult. But the thing I wanted to say also, because I feel like the conversation has, so I guess that is just a lesson in like things can go wrong.
And that's like, now my job is telling stories.
I'm this too. And, and I may not have done as well as I wanted to in the English exam.
And so when I, when I finished year 12, I had a scholarship that year, that whole of year 12, which was a pretty, it was a Victorian student sport.
It was a cricket scholarship.
Oh really? And that took, that was like training, like that was three or four mornings a week.
And then it was three sessions after school, like, so it was like a massive commitment and I was always away.
I was away a lot throughout year 12 playing cricket.
And I, there was a careers advisor at the VIS then.
And I can't remember their name.
The marks I got, I think were possibly a bit more than a lot of people who were doing sports scholarship playing through a cricket at the time, I think.
And she was quite excited about it.
And she said, you have to do this course, neuro psychophysiology.
And I didn't want to, I was like, I don't want to do that.
That that's not what I want to do.
And she said, you have to, you got those marks.
Don't waste those marks.
You got to do this.
And I went, okay. And as at Swinburne university doing this course, that I could barely spell it.
So I don't know how I thought I was going to pass it.
And I, and I battled.
I had no friends got nothing in common with the people doing it.
And it was, it was two of the most miserable years of my life.
First year and second year.
Cause I was doing a course that I didn't want to do.
I wasn't good at it.
Um, I just want to be a primary school teacher so desperately.
And, but I was like, well, an adult told me I should be doing this and not waste it.
So I just sort of believed them and trusted them.
And it took me, um, to us 22 to go, no, I want to be a primary school teacher.
I'm doing that. That's just what I want to do.
And so I think the lesson is there is to do what really lights you up.
Like people will give you advice and that's nice of them, but listen to what you truly want to do and follow that.
And if you don't know, that's fun too.
Yeah. Yeah. Totally.
I had told me to us 30 to go, I think I'm going to do this resilience project thing.
Yeah. So there's, you got a lot of time and you got a lot of time.
And it is a process.
It's a process. Like you probably wouldn't have gotten the start of the resilience project if you didn't become a teacher.
Um, I think just one thing I do want to say was just come to mind very quickly.
Cause this originally was a chat about exams.
It, with the resilience project now, we've hired, I think nearly 40 staff and with a podcast now that we've got a team of like six, never once ever during a recruitment process have I said, can I, can we just see their marks from your 12 please?
I just want to check before we employ them, can we just check what they got in every single exam?
And I don't care. Like I've never, no one does really.
It's like what kind of person you are, what evidence have you got that you're going to be good at this job?
And to me, that's never had it in your 12 ever.
Um, and I think that's an important thing to say.
Yeah. And it's, and I, I think depending on the school you're at or the type of friends, your group of friends, it's a discussion for a bit after school.
Like it is a discussion for a bit and it can feel like if you didn't do well, it can feel God, everyone's asking what school you went to.
What school would you go to?
I had you go. What, what, what score did you get?
And that might stick around for a bit, but it doesn't last long.
Like pretty soon it's just like, no one cares.
Yeah. No one cares.
But I, in, in saying that I think it's important to know that people have.
Currently, a lot of people out there would have spent the last two years working so hard for this.
So I think it's important to.
Like I think it's, they're a tool that like exams in school is a tool to help you get to the next bit in life.
And if that tool doesn't work for you, that's totally fine.
Yeah. And there are others out there that will help you get to the next bit.
And if it does work for you, that's awesome because that's a way that you can open a door to a career that you might like.
Yeah. So. And if you are studying hard and you get great marks, that is amazing.
And you should be very proud.
Yeah, absolutely. Um, yeah.
Amazing. Well, this has been very fun.
Oh, loved it. It's a, it's a imperfect record for the amount of people on the podcast at once.
It's huge. Six of us.
Usually my favorite ever sex chat.
Yeah. You got some weird kinks, bro.
Time to bring in the theme.
It's really not, I don't know why you're thinking this is sexy.
This is just getting lonely.
You know, it's opening up.
It's, it's leaning on your friends.
It's, and what, why is vulnerability good here?
Because it leads to authentic connection.
So I should have said that in a more.
Sexy way. Sexy way.
George Bell and Bridge.
Thank you so much for joining us.
It's, uh, it's so lovely to have you guys here.
I think from now on, we'll just interview our guests with all six of us at the table.
That won't be hard to edit at all for George.
And, um, genuinely good luck, everyone with your exams.
It's, it's, it's gonna be, you're gonna have a great time.
It's really fun. Bye.
Fourteen.
