Hi, my name is Wanda Sykes, and I feel indifferent about being Conan O'Brien's friend.
Fall is here, hear the yell.
Back to school, ring the bell.
Brand new shoes, walkin' loose.
Climb the fence, books and pens.
I can tell that we are gonna be friends.
Hello and welcome to Conan O'Brien.
Needs a Friend joined by my good friends, and I put that in quotation marks.
Oh, come on.
Well, I'm sorry, your employees.
Sona Movsesin.
Good to see you, Sona.
Good to see you, too.
And you would be David Hopping.
I am.
Yeah, that's correct.
Thanks for being here, David.
Sitting in for Matt Gorley on paternity leave.
And Sona, I'm told that you had kind of an exciting moment recently.
You went to.
Exciting moment.
Well, you went to Disneyland, yes?
Can I say I have been to Disneyland so many times.
I've never seen anyone dressed up like Geppetto walking around.
Right.
And you do this bit about my dad.
Your dad has a big mustache.
And he looks kind of normal.
He's a white haired gentleman with a white mustache.
He always has reminded me a little bit of Geppetto.
And I used to do a long riff about how he carved your brother.
Yes.
And, well, you know, we had some good times, meaning I was laughing and you were staring at me.
Yes.
Yeah.
But I had a good time.
And that's cool.
You also got into like, oh, Danny, my real boy.
He's my real boy.
You're shortening it now.
Danny wanted to be a real boy.
Yeah.
Danny.
Yeah, he carved a puppet and Danny wanted to be a real boy and he was swallowed by a whale.
Okay.
Anyway, that's neither here nor there.
Yeah.
But you had this moment, you sent me this picture that blew my mind.
Yeah.
You went to Disneyland.
Oh, there it is.
And tell the tale.
Tell the tale.
Well, Geppetto is just walking around.
I don't know.
And you've never seen a Geppetto before.
I've never seen a Geppetto walking around.
Because it's not a character.
There's Goofy.
Oh, there's Goofy.
Oh, there's Mickey.
Oh, there are some of the princesses from some of the newer movies.
Yes.
Iconic figures.
Geppetto.
I know.
Geppetto is a tradesman.
Geppetto is a woodworker.
He's got a, you know, and so I've never seen a Geppetto.
Do you see Geppetto much?
I actually haven't, but I live there.
David practically lives at Disneyland.
You never see Geppetto.
You're walking and you run smack into Geppetto.
Yes.
And you know, what do you have to do?
So I like immediately, shockingly, there was no line to go meet Geppetto.
Oh, no one, no one wanted to hang out with Geppetto.
The old Italian man who is a day laborer.
I know.
I'm like, Anna and Ilsa are walking around.
Moana's walking around.
And then you have Geppetto, and no one cares about him.
No, of course.
No one.
He actually, when he walks into the park, they put him out when they want to get people out.
Yes.
When it's time to close the park, they say, release Geppetto.
And he says, I'm making the puppet.
I'm making the puppet.
And people just go streaming out of the park.
Yeah, they do.
And then, wow, we closed right at six.
Closed early.
Yeah.
So I ran right up to him and I never.
And he's never had anyone do that.
Yeah.
Was he curious as to why you were happy to see him?
No, I think I was like Geppetto and nobody else was saying that.
And then I went up to him and I asked if I could take a picture.
And I'm I'm I put my arm in like I interlock my arm around.
I'm so happy in this.
I'm so happy.
And this is the worst thing that I did.
And I sent it to you.
And you said this is me hanging with my dad at Disneyland.
I was so delighted because it proved to me that my riff is actually a pretty good one.
This is what your dad looks like to me.
I'm telling you, it does.
It does.
This is what your dad looks like to me.
This is not what my dad looks like.
He looks a lot like that guy.
He just doesn't have the glasses on the tip of his nose.
Yeah, yeah.
But I mean, that's what your dad looks like to me.
Well, and then also, I mean, we kind of- Because my eyes turn everyone into a cartoon character.
That's what your dad looks like to me.
So we cut him out of this picture, but Mikey ran in with me, even though Mikey had absolutely no idea who this was.
And probably frightened.
Big fuzzy man.
Yeah, well, he just saw this big... Frightened.
Well, he's... Geppetto, look.
Look at that guy.
That's not something a kid goes, yay!
Yay!
He just thought it was his grandpa?
Yeah.
Oh, my God.
I know.
I mean, you know, he's a guy who's probably being driven out of business.
What?
Oh, no.
Yeah, because they're making puppets in China now that are much cheaper.
Yeah.
So Geppetto is a beleaguered figure now.
And the tariffs are making his material really expensive.
Tariffs are totally fucking over Geppetto.
I know.
And Geppetto's like, what did I do?
This isn't good.
And then he goes to the store and there's tons of cheap puppets flooding the market that are from other countries, you know.
Anyway, I hate... You hate what?
Don't hate your father.
No, I love my dad.
Don't ever hate your father.
I love my dad.
Why did you say you hate your father?
I said I hate it when I play into your bits.
And, you know, as soon as I sent that text, I was like, why am I calling my dad Geppetto?
You kind of threw your dad under the bus.
I did.
And I'm sorry to Gil.
Well, I win.
Okay.
Because here's how I win.
I got to see you link arms with Geppetto and call him your dad and you feel badly about it.
And so, and your son is scared.
I win on every level.
Every single level.
Well, congratulations.
Yep.
Oh, my God.
And if anyone wants to see that picture, you can go to Team Coco podcast on Instagram and it'll be.
It'll be there for everyone.
Yeah.
Yeah, it is.
That should be your Christmas card next year.
It really should.
No, no boys.
It's just me and Geppetto from Disneyland.
All right.
Well, very excited today.
My guest today is an Emmy award winning comedian, actor and writer who stars in the new movie Undercard.
She's an absolute legend.
Wanda Sykes, welcome.
But even the universe didn't want me to make it here today because my car broke down.
As I was leaving, it wouldn't start.
So the universe was saying, don't do this.
Why are you going?
Come on, man.
The radio came on and music was jamming.
It was like, isn't this cool?
Just sitting in your driveway, listening to some Sade.
Why are we leaving?
Then the sun broke through the clouds.
It's like, man, you're right.
Wow, your car has a self-esteem function.
Yeah.
Do not lower yourself.
She would rather sit in the car than be here.
Yeah.
Okay.
Well, I want to say you killed me a couple of weeks ago.
I don't know when this comes out, but you were on the Golden Globes and you destroyed me.
You were so funny on the Golden Globes.
Thank you.
And you're just there and you're accepting an award for, I believe it was Ricky Gervais.
Right.
I was presenting for Best Comedy Special.
Yes.
And you said afterwards, Ricky won and you had to accept on his behalf.
Uh-huh.
And you said, I accept on behalf of God and the trans community.
Thank God.
I thank God.
Thank God.
Did you ever hear from Ricky?
I have not.
I have not heard from Ricky.
That was just fantastic.
But you always are.
You're just.
But I would hope Ricky would got it.
He got a laugh out of knowing him.
You know, I don't know him, but knowing his work, I'm sure he got a good laugh.
He'd have been happy with that.
Yeah.
Or not.
We'll never know.
But it's a real gift to just be able to always be yourself.
When you get up, you're always Wanda Sykes 100 percent.
I mean anytime I've seen you in your career.
Your comedic voice is so sharp, and so you and no one else can do that.
And I'm thinking when you were first getting up doing standup comedy, did you have access to that?
It took me a while to figure out how to be this Conan guy up there.
Right.
And I'm wondering what early you would have been like, because I know you.
You were getting up there in the probably 86, 87 around then.
Right.
87.
Yeah.
Um, I think we all start out like doing Seinfeld, you know what I'm saying?
It's like observational, uh, comedy.
And, uh, we, I, that's what I was doing.
It was all about just writing jokes that I thought Hey, isn't it funny when you know this happens or what.
But it was never uh about me or uh it like into my uh, you know persona.
It was just what's on paper, the jokes.
That's it.
You know?
Yeah.
Um, it, it was later, uh, uh in life I guess when you get confidence and it also was when I uh was going through a divorce that's when it was like fuck it let's go you know then it was more me yeah that came out and I was like oh this this is who I'm going to be this is who I am and also uh it's it's easier to just always be yourself you know in a way you could say that I'm kind of lazy really I don't Really?
Right?
That's the moral here.
Really, I'm lazy.
But that's where really great stuff comes from.
Yeah, why give you something else?
I'm just doing me.
I'm just going to do me.
But it is funny how I know me early on I was always echoing what I had grown up watching and what I loved.
And so there'd be times where I'm not me yet.
I'm all the things that I really loved.
And then it takes a while.
All that stuff just gets shed and eventually it gets melted down and eventually you start to come out.
But it's a process.
And that's where it just really helps to get time.
Did you have your like comedy outfit, like your comedy uniform?
Like this is where I have to have this because this is I'm funny wearing this.
Like I wear hats.
I put a hat on.
I thought this is funny.
This is good because if I bomb, I can blame it on the hat.
Sure.
It's not funny.
So if you were about to go on and you think yeah, if you were about to go on and you couldn't find the funny hat, you'd be like I can't go out.
I can't go on.
Robinson cursed me out.
Like, I mean, he just ripped me apart because when I moved away from hats, then I needed a sweater.
I need like a.
You know, not a Cosby sweater, but like a but, you know, where people go, oh, that's a nice sweater.
So Keith and I were we were in Philadelphia.
I was going to go to the Funny Bone and I didn't have my sweater because we went to the movies.
And then I thought we would go back and get my sweater and go to the club.
He's like, no, we're going to direct the club.
I can't go to club.
I don't have a sweater.
And he's like, what do you mean?
I said, I need my sweater.
He's like, you look fine.
I said, no, no, no.
I got to get my comedy sweater.
And when I said that, he just ripped me apart.
And he was like, I'm not going back.
And he took me to the club and I had to go on without the sweater, without the hat.
And I did okay.
So that's when I was like, okay, I don't need these things.
Did you have that?
You know what?
I think my version of that was my hair.
I think...
The reason I was always when I found out in my teens that my hair was kind of springy and I could have this big shelf hanging out over the front and I started combing it up like that and kind of rockabilly and just and then, but also part game show host.
And I think a lot of that was, don't look at me, look at this.
Do you know what I mean?
It was, my hat came with me, my comedy hat.
And you know you look at some of the early late night shows and I.
There are ones where this thing is coming out like three feet wide.
And it's going way up in the air.
And you're thinking, people at home must have just been saying, what is wrong with him?
He looks like a fool.
Your hair's in everybody's shot.
Yeah, exactly.
Every time I turned around, the guest, Mr. T, would get hit in the face.
It's just so funny how everybody...
It's this self-hating thing which is very natural, but we don't think we're good enough, especially when you're that, when you're starting out and you think I have to.
I need all this extra stuff to be able to go up there.
And then later on.
Now I've been going to these different clubs to try out Oscar material and I'll just.
I don't even know what I'm wearing.
I'm just wearing a t-shirt sometimes.
I'm not fixing my hair.
I'm not doing anything because...
It took me decades to say, okay, I'll just be me.
But I mean, it took a long, long time.
Yeah.
But here's the other thing, because I do the same thing.
If I'm working out material like I'm working on my next special and I'm at the Brea Improv, I'm going to go just like this.
Yeah.
Because I don't want the audience to have expectations.
Like if I put on something nice, then they're going to be like, oh, we're getting a real show.
But if I just come like this, nah, I got a notepad.
I just walked off the street.
That's why I'm doing the Oscars.
I'm going to host the Oscars in a slanket.
In the breaks, I just lie down.
You know, I never knew this.
I mean, I was thinking about you yesterday and today.
That's scary.
That makes me very uncomfortable.
That's why your car wouldn't start.
That makes me very uncomfortable right now, thinking about you and where do you live?
You know where do you live when they said hey, wanda's here out in the parking lot, then you started thinking about me.
I don't like that.
I don't know.
I'm i'm good about this stuff okay, but that your dad's uh was an army colonel yes, and so you grow up and mom a banker, so you grow up in strict family.
Uh, not necessarily That's what I mean.
That would be the cliche, I guess, is that they'd be strict people.
I mean, I grew up in a strict family.
My dad was like a you know academic and scientist, and my mom's a lawyer and strict, in the sense that One of us going into comedy wasn't maybe their first choice.
Right.
You know, but beautiful, lovely people, but real good Catholics, church people.
So I'm just curious if you had that experience.
They were, you know. black people in the South.
So there was always some type of structure and they were strict, but we had fun.
We?
You know they were my dad would.
He was serious about his job, but when he got home he'd take his uniform off and you know he was dad.
And also, my dad hustled, man.
He had side jobs and everything, you know.
That's how I fell in love with bowling, I guess, because he would, on weekends, clean the lanes.
Yeah.
So, yeah, so it was strict from that, you know, looking on the outside.
But yeah, inside you know yeah, they were, just like you said, a lot of values church, all of that.
So, no, someone saying, hey, I'm going to go do comedy.
Yeah.
The question was, so what was that college I paid for?
What was that about?
Why did we do that?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's natural.
And now my mother, I talked to her yesterday.
It was so funny.
And she said, you know, I don't understand.
Like when you went in college, why didn't you just take like performing arts?
Why didn't you go in?
Oh, so now, you know, you're putting it back on me.
Yeah.
I wasted, you know, it's still going back to college.
Like I wasted college.
What did you study?
Marketing.
Marketing.
I was like, I didn't know what I wanted to do, but I was like, oh, no science.
Yep.
Marketing.
That's me.
That's it.
And then you worked for the NSA for a bit.
That's really funny.
And okay, here's my question.
Because a lot of us, before we get out in front of people and start trying to be funny, we have these jobs where you're kind of funny at work.
Were you funny at the NSA?
I was funny at the NSA.
Okay.
I was, I was funny at the NSA.
I killed.
Think of the huge security breaches.
Think of the terrorists that weren't caught because you were busy joking around.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, you know, you're funny, you're funny at work.
And did you have people around you saying, Hey, you got to get up there.
You got to go.
Yeah, I did.
Um, But I was serious about the job.
But we would have a good time.
But I also knew... It got to a point where I was like, I can't do this.
This is not going to be my life.
Because you would see the people who was on their way out to that retirement thing.
And one dude, he would just...
He would just look at the stocks.
That's all, you know, all day.
And I was like, saving America, aren't we staying?
You know, it's like, here we go.
Saving America.
So what was your big break?
You're doing comedy, and then you did a... Was it a contest you entered, or was it the Coors Light?
Coors Light Super Talent Showcase.
Yeah.
Showcase, their radio station in D.C., sponsoring it.
And I was like, you know what?
Let me write some jokes and go audition for this thing.
So you're still at the NSA at this point.
Oh, yeah, I'm still at the NSA.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so you...
You go up, you do this, you enter.
And how did it feel?
Did it feel right, right away?
It did.
Yeah.
It felt right.
Like, you know, oh, wow.
Okay.
These people, you know, you get that first laugh and it's like, oh, okay.
This is, this works.
Yeah, I didn't win, but I was really happy with the way it went.
And it felt like I belong here.
And Andy Evans, he was the emcee.
And he was like, where did you come from?
I haven't seen you in the comedy clubs or anything.
I was like, yeah, I haven't been to a comedy club.
And he was like, okay.
He just became my mentor.
He would show me around comedy clubs and stuff.
Would work with me on material and stuff.
So, yeah, and just everything just felt right.
And then I know that I bombed silly the next time.
Right.
Which is classic.
Which is classic.
People turned their chairs around.
Oh, my God.
And they were bolted to the floor.
Yeah, exactly.
It was like, I got to get up.
You can just get up and turn around.
No, no.
No, no, no, no.
Fam, you could just leave.
No, I got to make a real statement.
When do you you start opening for Chris Rock?
Is that right?
Is that maybe you do it for a while and then you is that was that a bit of a level up?
Yes.
Yeah.
By that time, I left the NSA and was living in Jersey, I guess, to be closer to New York.
And I opened for Chris Rock when he was he was about to bring the paint.
Yeah.
Yeah, and that was a big come up for me.
I guess because he remembered me when he got his talk show.
Yeah, Chris Rock Show.
Yeah, and asked me to submit some writing samples.
Yeah, so you were a writer on the Chris Rock Show, which was great.
And then you guys win the Emmy.
Mm-hmm.
Which is still very bitter for me.
I'm sure.
Because I know we were nominated.
And then Chris gets up and says, well, I think Conan should have got this.
And I wanted to stand up and say, then why can't I have it?
Oh my God.
But- And when Chris said that, we all went, shut up, Chris.
Shut up, Chris.
But-
But if, yeah, you can't be bitter when the Chris Rock show wins.
You just can't be.
It was so great.
And so I... Not if you want to win that NAACP Image Award.
You can't.
That would slip right through your fingers too, didn't it?
I was so close.
But I stood up in the audience and I said, why?
Why?
And then I think I said on camera, when will the white man...
Which was a mistake.
Yeah.
Remember that?
And then you were like, Conan.
And I'm like, you're right.
Conan.
That was a bad idea.
It's been thousands of years.
When is it our turn?
Oh, wow.
But anyway, people are now looking.
Did I really say that?
No.
What did you learn working in a writer's room?
Well, AI can make you look like you did.
Yeah um, when did you?
Because i always think i don't know if you had the same experience, but once i got into a writer's room, i felt like i had been fish that had been flopping around in the desert for the first you know 20 something years of my life, and then someone put me into a pond.
That's what it felt like to me.
Did you feel that way about being in a writer's room?
You know what?
I was the only female writer and the guys that I was with they were so supportive and Yeah, so I kind of just felt like I was at home.
Actually, you know who was a really big help?
Because I would write things, and they were just like these long monologues.
And Louis C.K., he was on the show, and he looked at my stuff.
He goes, Juan, you have a lot of jokes.
And he knew me from stand-up.
He said, instead of writing these long rants, he said, Look at the newspaper and just write a joke on an article.
That's all.
He said, this is what this is.
He says, and then, you know, if you got a sketch bit, do that.
OK, great.
And then every week I was just getting jokes that you show up and you think oh it's, I'm writing for Chris Rock.
So I need to write this big, long monologue.
You don't think that it's just kind of a rant.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I need to write like this thing that goes on for a couple of pages.
Right.
Right.
Right.
So then once I got it, I'm like, OK, you know, I can follow directions.
I got it.
Yeah.
What's a real discipline too, because on Saturday Night Live they used to say we do all our weird sketches in the week.
And then on Saturday, they would say, come in in the morning and write weekend update jokes.
And just to supplement.
You know whatever Herb Sargent and whoever was at the update desk was doing at the time.
It was Dennis Miller, I think.
Yeah, and you'd sit there and you'd just be going through the news and you started.
I started to learn right, this is, this is something i hadn't really done before, but i see the game.
There's a game to this and you just got to try and figure it out, but it was a great discipline um, and so you do that.
And then what happens after you're done with the chris rock show, what was the next step?
Steve Martin had a show, The Downer Channel.
And I had a meeting with him.
And I'm like, it's Steve Martin.
I'm going to do it.
And when he pitched me the idea of the show, I was like, oh, God, this is awful.
This is going to be awful.
And I don't even know if I'm right for this.
I'm like, but it's Steve Martin.
So I was like, yes.
And...
We did the Downer Channel.
And then from there, I forgot what happened after that.
You lost a whole 15 years.
It says here you were in a coma for a while.
I think I worked on my hour.
That's what it is.
Yeah.
I went back to stand up and I was working on my hour.
And that's when I think Tongue Untied probably came out.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
That process of getting an hour.
I don't think people realize, because now the way entertainment works and streaming the minute, someone has an hour, sometimes even before they really have an hour.
Before they have an hour. they need to come out with their hour special.
And the minute it comes out, people can say, that was great.
Where's the next one?
Right.
And it used to be.
If you think about the history of this whole thing, people would develop vaudeville.
They develop their hour and do it for 40 years.
Yes.
And now it's, that was great.
Yeah.
And so it's like a band that has their first album and it's everything they've been playing for all those years and people are like that's fantastic.
We need the next album in six months.
Yep.
Yeah.
And they're like, huh?
I can't.
So that's a huge achievement to get that first hour.
Yeah.
And I'm, you know, I take at least three years.
I think three years is the shortest time that I've turned around and did another hour.
I usually take at least four or five years.
You know, it tore with it.
You got to.
You know when it's special.
I mean, there's hours and then it's special.
And I remember, when I shot my first hour, the advice Chris Rock gave me.
He said make sure it's special.
Don't go up there and do a set, do a special.
Like, okay, all right.
Well, and then, you know, thinking about it, okay, now I get what he was saying.
Because, you know, you can watch some stuff and you go, okay, that was an hour.
Yeah.
It was an hour.
You legally met the requirement.
Yes, exactly.
Great job.
It clocked in.
Here is your certificate.
Yeah, yeah.
Clocked in.
You have had this really great career where stand-up's your first love.
Until now.
Until terrific.
Things have gone great.
What are you talking about?
Until I got here.
Oh, this.
Oh.
Oh.
Look, present dip accepted.
This is a low point.
This is a low point.
I gotta bounce back from this.
When people do the podcast, I can see them often texting their agent while I'm talking to them.
And it's usually what happened or we need to talk.
It's time for a comeback special.
Everyone does their comeback special after the Conan podcast.
So about that dancing with the stars.
Curb your enthusiasm.
Obviously, you have such a strong, undeniably unique comedic voice.
And I can tell, like...
You with Larry is just if someone long before you did it, if someone had just said Wanda and Larry, I'd have been like, oh yeah, that has to happen.
Is that how you felt when that came about? you know, big fan of the show.
And I knew that one of the producers on the show and she said, we got to get you on there.
I'm like, okay, I would love to.
I said, but look, I can't audition.
I said, I'm horrible at, you know, in the audition process.
I said, and I don't, it'll just kill me if I'm like, just not funny in front of Larry David.
I can't.
So don't, please don't put me through that.
I said, just, I'm just going to be a fan of the show.
She's like, OK, all right.
And then she said, hey, we're shooting around the corner, you know, from you.
So why don't you come over to this car dealership because we're shooting here.
And and Larry just wants to say hi.
I said, oh, I get to meet him.
She said, yeah, yeah.
OK.
So I walk in and there's a Larry and Larry goes, hey, Wanda, I know that tush anywhere.
I was like, what the fuck did you just say?
And I said, why would you say that?
And we just got into it.
He goes, you got the job.
I'm like, what?
She tricked me into auditioning.
Hey, by the way, we were rolling.
What is so funny, that's hilarious, but also when you hang with Larry, you're in the show.
He is that guy.
And you can be with him just hanging out at a party and he'll come in with a plate of food and you're talking to people and you're like, don't you kind of hate it when people interrupt you with a plate of food?
And you're like, you're doing a bit.
You're doing a bit and you say, no, no, no, I'm just saying you're like, there's no camera here.
But it's delightful because you get to be if you're in his life, you're on that show in some way.
OK, yeah, that's how it feels like.
But yeah, you were just perfect.
Yeah, I enjoyed it.
But I don't like being around him, though.
London, nobody does.
Right?
Nobody does.
He likes making you feel uncomfortable.
Like at lunch, I'm walking in and I see him coming and I'm like, oh, shit.
I don't want to sit with him.
I don't want to eat with Larry.
He always has to eat alone.
I don't want to eat with him.
I go sit over with the grips.
I'm like, I'm not.
No.
No, we should make it clear.
No one wants to hang out with him.
He's always alone.
Okay.
He's always alone.
All right.
Because I think he loves to be, he loves to be annoying.
He just loves to, I mean, he loves that, hitting that frequency.
And he's so good at it.
He's the best.
The best at it.
I want to talk about your personal life for a second because I find it interesting.
I know you talked somewhere about how you thought coming out was important.
It helped you get up in front of people and you felt like be more honest or before you had been holding back a little bit.
Is that the case?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Before, you know, I knew that I had this, you know, secret or whatever.
Mm-hmm.
And so I had to have somewhat of a protection.
And it's just sitting there in the back of your brain, you know.
So it's like, I don't want to push too much because somebody might yell out, you know.
You're a lesbian or hey, you're gay.
You know, so it's like, OK, I don't let me just at arm's distance.
Let me, you know, protect myself.
But once I came out, it was like windows down, you know, back, you know, let's let's let's go.
So I just felt I just liberated that there was nothing that I had to hide.
Yeah.
It's like you were carrying something.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Or it's like a version of the funny hat or the sweater.
It's just like, no, no, no, this is me.
And yeah, there's nothing you can say now to you.
Know that that would, you know, hurt me or whatever.
Yeah.
People shout that at me a lot.
A lot.
You're a lesbian.
It's usually just Sona.
It's usually Sona.
Sona follows me in the clubs.
Well, maybe you shouldn't have gotten the tattoo.
And I know I've met your wife.
She's French.
Yes, she is.
And is there a culture clash there?
Because with the French, you know, just like your wife, she's from this very different situation.
How does it manifest itself in your relationship?
I mean, everything.
I mean, even from like just I mean, food alone.
It's you know, there's no snacking.
So, yes, snacks.
They don't do that.
I gotta, like, sneak and get my snacks.
You know?
Like, I would, like, go in the car, eat a couple of tape chips.
And I come in the house, she was like, is that, uh...
I smell, is that chips?
Is she smoking?
I'm sorry, I saw you did.
She doesn't smoke, it's just how I see her.
I see her.
It's just how I see her.
She has an invisible space cigarette, yeah.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
That is fantastic.
Yeah, it's the three meals, but they're great meals, you know, because it comes with wine and champagne, you know, and there's like a little pre-meal, you know pre-snack, before the meal.
Maybe if you had wine with your potato chips, you would be okay with it.
We've done that with champagne.
You're there with your pringles?
She's like, time for the apero, you know.
And there's a little, like, some pistachios, maybe a little saucisson and some champagne.
I said, oh, I can get down with this.
This is...
Now we're talking, you know, and then you have your lunch, and then you get to do that again for dinner.
You get to have a little pregame for the dinner.
They know a thing or two in France about how to live.
Yeah.
That we haven't figured out.
Right.
We were in Mexico and she wanted to buy these bowls and she was, you know, Just you know, going back and forth with the guy.
She also speaks Spanish.
So she was going back and forth with the guy.
And, you know, the guy was like 700.
And she was like, no, four.
And the guy was like, all right, you know, four.
So and I heard that he asked her where she was from.
She said, oh, Belgium.
Right.
So she said she's from Belgium.
So we get outside.
And I'm like, why did you tell that man you're from Belgium?
She's like, well, I didn't want the French to look bad.
Anyone would think badly of the French.
I'm like, that's the kind of shit French people do.
That's exactly what French people would do.
I'm not going to take responsibility for that, no.
Now you've got teenagers, twin teenagers.
Do they think you're funny?
Will they give it up?
Uh, my kids, my kids are very wary of giving it up for me and I get it.
They're like, uh, they're very happy to put me down.
Um, and rightfully so.
They do it.
They love doing it.
Olivia was like two, about two years ago to yeah.
Mother's day.
She gave me a pet rock.
I haven't heard of those.
I think those were big in like 1976, the Pet Rock.
Yeah.
And you could decorate it.
You could put like the googly eyes on it and little crazy hair on it.
And she was like, isn't that great?
I was like, you know, my mother would have thrown this at me if I had given her a rock.
I said, you are a very blessed little girl right now.
But she thought it was funny.
But, you know, to do that.
So it's that type of thing where they know what I do and they know that people know me.
So to them, they feel like it's their job just to bring you down a little bit, just to chop you down a little bit.
So I, you know, I get it.
They did come to a show this summer.
I did a little European tour and they came to the show in Paris.
And they were the first to backstage and they were like, oh, mom, that was so cool.
That was great.
Oh, good.
Wow.
You know, so they enjoyed the show.
Yeah.
But mom at home.
No, I'm not funny.
Yeah.
Yeah.
They don't give it up at all.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's better that way.
I think so too.
Wouldn't it be creepy if they're like, you're just so funny.
Yeah.
What?
Yeah.
No, I'm not.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It was so funny.
Lucas went through a little phase when he was like maybe 10, because you know we're down in the streets and some people you know like hey Wanda, you know, Wanda Sykes, what's up.
And they would go, why are they...
Why are people yelling?
I said, I don't know.
They just, you know, maybe that's somebody I went to school with or whatever.
I would try to downplay it.
Lucas went through this phase for like three months.
Whenever I walked in the house, he would go, why the sides?
Get it up.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Make some noise.
He just said, that's how people do it.
So he's like, why the sides?
That would be creepy.
Yeah.
That would, yeah.
Yeah.
Let's talk about the movie, because this is I was saying.
Your standup is your feels like that's your lifeblood, but you're a good actor.
You are a very good actor.
And this opportunity to do this film, how did it come about?
Undercard.
Tamika Miller, the director and co-writer of the script.
She reached out to me and she's like look, I have this project.
It's for you.
I wrote it with you in mind.
I would love to send you the materials.
I'm like, OK, all right.
And I read the script and looked at the materials.
I was like, oh, I said, this is good.
And so I called her.
I said, so Queen Latifah said no, right?
And she's like, no, I'm telling you, this is I had you in mind for this.
So I was like, you know, I don't know if I can pull it off.
I said, I've never done a drama.
And she's like, believe me, I think just trust me, you can do this.
And, you know, we met and kind of like went through the script.
Yeah.
And I was like, OK.
And, you know, she just had so much faith that I could do it.
I'm like, well, I'm going to prove her wrong, you know.
Really?
You have faith in me, huh?
Well, watch this.
I'll show you.
Yeah, but you do a very good job and your character, whose name is No Mercy that's her nickname you have this world-weariness that seems real, like you're dealing with a lot.
Your character's dealing with a lot and you're getting evicted and you're going through some intense stuff, and you're going through intense stuff with your son and you aren't putting any comedy air quotes around it at all.
Do you know what i mean?
Which, i think, is that's another scary thing to do, right?
But uh, you did it really well and i don't know what is it like for you to sit and watch yourself in this situation where you are so not going for laughs.
Did that feel scary at all to you?
Oh, absolutely.
Absolutely.
I know, like, after a take, she would say, okay.
And I said, you sure?
She's like, yeah, I got it.
And I'm like, yeah, but what, you know... is there something else that you need?
She's like, Wanda, I got it.
Let's come on.
Let's move on.
Uh, but for for me to go back and watch.
I couldn't go watch the takes, you know, and I'm glad she didn't say you want to see it, you know.
So, uh, I didn't see it until it was, until it was, you know, completed.
And then uh, my notes, a lot of my notes were more about.
We were just, you know, the story, moving the story.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's so interesting because you go along in a situation where you know when something's working because you hear this very specific sound, but then you're in a situation where that is not the goal anymore.
I mean in the limited experience I've had doing any kind of acting, it's been well.
Where's the laugh?
And you're like, there isn't one.
You moron.
Yeah, yeah.
You moron.
There's no – and you really need to shed all of that.
Put it away, because that is not the point of what we're doing anymore.
Right.
And this has nothing to do with that world.
And so that's always a new level of terror, because you know, especially when you're trying these things and you know you're not – you're not 25 and you're like okay, I've done some standup and now I'm going to try this.
It's just a whole, you've, you've been relying on a certain rhythm for a really long time.
And now it's this, it's, uh, I don't know.
I found it terrifying anytime I've had to be in that kind of situation, you know?
Yeah.
Yeah, it is.
Um, But I knew I couldn't do it.
You know, I was like, Wanda, you cannot do the wink at the camera.
You can't.
Just one.
You can't, you know, you just, yeah, you have to lock it.
It's the only way this thing is going to work.
And the crew, everyone who worked on that film, they were, you could see them like rooting for me.
That's nice.
The cast, everyone, you know, after that first day, they was like, oh, this bitch can act.
OK, come on, y'all.
Let's move faster.
Hey, come on.
Come on.
You know, she ain't bullshit.
Come on.
Everybody.
Come on.
Come on.
I mean, everyone.
I mean, everyone just like, oh, shit.
All right.
We might have something here.
Let's go.
Yeah.
So are you interested in doing more?
That's always the question you'll be getting a lot is the acting?
You know just film acting.
You know doing this kind of.
It's going to be project by project based on that.
You know, I'm not looking for another dramatic role.
You know, I like making people laugh.
I want to, yeah, comedy is my, that's my love.
So I, you know, that's what I'm looking for next.
Wanda, congrats.
You're getting great reviews.
Undercard is in theaters now.
And I want you to come back soon because I love talking to you.
You're hilarious.
And you're also I know you to be a really great person.
So it's always a delight to hang with you.
Thank you, Colin.
I hope now you're no longer indifferent.
Well, you know, I love you, but we'll see.
All right.
Now, David, you very kindly last night drove me out to Covina.
Yeah.
I am trying out some material and I went to the Chatterbox, which is a terrific comedy club that Laurie Kilmartin told me about out in Covina.
And so you said, hey, I'll give you a lift very kindly.
And you and I were driving and I tried to play- my tunes through your car.
Yeah, you said you wanted to be the DJ.
I wanted to be the DJ.
And you said, well, just use my phone because it's already hooked up.
Yeah.
So I got a brief glimpse.
It was the biggest regret of my life.
I got a brief glimpse You know, because I see all of my you know, I have my DJ list.
Yeah, it's all rockabilly songs and then the clash.
And then, you know, it's just this it's it's all this different stuff, stuff from the 90s.
But it's it's pretty fast rock.
Yeah.
And, you know, sort of jet-fueled rock and roll, percussive.
And then you said, just use my phone.
And you hand me your phone.
Why I did this, I don't know.
And I can see your Spotify.
Yeah.
And what did I see?
The first thing I saw.
First thing, I hand him the phone and I just hear, oh, my God.
What?
Oh, no.
What was the very first thing?
It was a Hilary Duff playlist.
And then I recently went to the Pantages to see The Notebook, the musical.
So I was listening to it.
I did too.
The very first thing I saw was The Notebook and then like seven songs from The Notebook.
Yeah.
That's a great soundtrack.
It is.
It is a great soundtrack.
I'm not aware.
Oh, okay.
What are the songs like?
Is Notebook a song?
No.
Notebook.
Notebook.
I fill you with my thoughts.
You're a notebook.
Nixon was a crook.
You were a notebook.
Okay, so what?
It's based on the movie.
It's not a musical about a notebook.
It's based on the movie.
It's a beautiful musical.
It's like picture if you and Ryan Reynolds were singing and that bit you did with him for the notebook.
Where I made out with Ryan Reynolds?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, listen, that was first thing I saw.
Then there's a lot of Hilary Duff, who I think is lovely.
I love Hilary Duff.
Who doesn't?
Yeah.
And and then I started flipping through.
You just had.
Oh, well, I'm going to see the Backstreet Boys next week.
So I had them on there, too.
All right.
You know, it was fascinating.
A quick glimpse into how we're different.
A little bit.
A little different.
Just a little bit.
Just a little bit.
A little bit.
And no, it wasn't, I don't judge.
I'm not a judge.
Oh, you're not judging.
Who are you talking to?
I'm sorry.
Let's take a poll.
Who thinks Conan judges?
I am not a guy who judges.
No.
I don't see how we're different.
I only see how we're the same.
Who is this guy?
This is the guy I wish I was.
Is it the guy I am?
No, it's not.
I hate this guy.
No.
Yeah, I was.
How long?
I mean, what else would I have found if we had gone through?
Seriously, let's talk about what else I would have found if I'd kept scrolling.
Oh, God.
Well, you would have found some audio books.
I'm listening to one called You'll Never Know.
What's that about?
It's like a murder mystery kidnapping book.
Okay.
It's really good.
Okay.
You would have found some like, you know, any music that a 15-year-old girl listens to.
Some Sabrina Carpenter.
So I get the most excited text from you the other night because you got last minute tickets to go see Hilary Duff.
Yeah.
And you lost your mind.
I was.
Which was very sweet.
I like that.
Dare I say it was the greatest night of my life.
But you've seen me perform.
Oh, dare I say it was the greatest night of my life.
That's quite a dare.
It was in the same venue I've seen you perform at the Wiltern.
Oh, she did a show at the Wiltern.
Yeah.
So you said you saw her and that it was transcendent.
It was like the crowd was incredible.
She was amazing.
She did all the throwbacks and some new ones from the unreleased album that you guys are all excited for.
We should get her in here.
I act like I could just summon her.
No, this isn't one of those things where I... That's so sad.
David just looked like I've arranged to have her here.
David, who do you think I am?
Aren't you like the Oprah of comedy?
No, I'm really not.
That's so funny.
You looked for a second like, oh my God.
Well, David, guess what?
We have a surprise for you.
Oh my God.
I can have a publicist try to get her on the podcast and she'll probably say no.
Oh uh no love, love to have her here, but she was a big part of your growing up.
Everything yeah, all her music.
What was the show?
She was on lizzie mcguire, lizzie mcguire.
They were supposed to bring it back and then it didn't happen.
We're all devastated.
Oh, the lizzie mcguire movie a classic.
Okay, she was also in agent cody banks agent cody banks you've watched.
How do you know agent cody banks?
How did you know that?
I was a big investor?
All right,
Put everything I had into it.
Oh.
Did okay.
Yeah.
No, I don't even know why I know that.
I just remembered her being in that movie.
We were traveling somewhere and it was on.
Oh, I think I watched it.
It's one of those movies where I watched some of it over someone's shoulder on a plane.
Without sound.
So creepy.
Conan!
So creepy.
That's a weird thing to say.
Everyone does that.
To just look at someone.
Everybody watches.
You're on an airplane flight and someone usually on the other aisle, like one or two rows up, is watching a movie and
You're too lazy, that being me, to like, oh, I'm supposed to go find which movie I'm going to watch.
But I just start looking over someone's shoulder and they're usually about a third of the way in.
And I just start watching it without sound and trying to figure out what's going on.
No one else has done this here?
I've done it.
Eduardo, have you done it?
I've definitely peeked over to see what people are watching.
I've peeked over, but I'm not like full on watching.
No, I'll kind of watch it because you kind of try and figure out what's going on.
Oh, okay, I see.
Cody's got to get his way out of that volcano.
Oh, look, there's Hilary Duff.
She must be the love interest.
I don't know.
You just watch those things.
I've watched many movies like that.
It's also way better than what happened to you on a plane, where someone was watching you and saw you on the plane.
Yeah, I've had that.
I've had that experience where someone was watching a monologue of mine and looking over.
And if the joke was good, they would turn and give me a thumbs up.
I can't hear it because they've got their headphones on.
And they were watching my monologue.
And I had this is a bunch of years ago and they were watching.
It was when they had, you know, it's TV.
Yeah.
So they're watching the show that was dropping right then that I had taped a few hours before.
And this person kept, they would turn around, and I can just see me making stupid gestures and looking like a fool.
And then you can tell my rhythm.
And then I hit the punch line and the person turned to me on the first one and gave me a thumbs up.
And I'm like, oh, well, that's good.
And then I saw them.
I was trying to rack my brain because just a few hours later, what was the second joke?
Was the second joke any good?
And then I kind of had a bad feeling.
And I can see, I know my timing and I see that I finished that joke and the person turns to me and did the eh gesture and i'm like are we gonna do this the whole flight?
Good one, not so good one, uh anyway.
So i had that experience but i really do like watching someone else's movie and trying to figure it out.
My last flight, so i'll get this.
I was watching heated rivalry but i like i'm on a flight so i like sat with my phone like this blanket over you and wait, so you're basically watching.
Is it porn?
It's not porn.
Stop taking away from the show.
I'm not trying to.
It's tender and it's sweet.
No, but there's nudity.
The first two episodes especially has nudity.
The first two episodes are like real fun.
There's butts.
Well, we talked about this.
Yeah, we talked about that.
And I think everyone's talking about heated rivalry now.
They don't need any help from us anymore.
I think we got them safely launched.
You did it all.
It isn't a movie you can comfortably watch or a show you can comfortably watch on an airplane.
Yeah.
Same thing happened to me.
I'm watching the show Industry, which I love right now.
And there is and it's kind of all going fine.
It's about finance.
But sometimes there's some sex scenes and there is a, all of a sudden, a reveal where she's wearing a huge strap on.
And I I like jumped forward in my seat to block.
But the people next to me saw what I was watching.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, they probably just thought, you know uh, suspicions confirmed yeah, but el creepo in seat 7d, it's way better than the time where so the dark knight rises had just come out, and it was that time where it was on planes but you couldn't watch it anywhere else.
It was out of the theaters but wasn't on streaming and i just really i spent i'm not kidding probably an hour and a half just watching the bane scenes, because just over and over.
And then i realized what i was doing and i looked over and the woman next to me was I was horrified, like trying not to look at me.
And I realized, oh, yeah, I've just been watching Bane for an hour.
Why were you just watching?
He's cool, man.
Bane's cool.
Come on.
You would just like finish it and then just rewind to that.
Yeah, because.
Yeah, exactly.
I was molded in the dark.
What?
You just forwarded to the scenes with Bane.
Yeah, those are cool scenes.
Bane's cool.
Come on, guys.
I'm not the only guy who thinks Bane's cool in here.
Not at all.
All right.
Well, I think we're out of time.
The rap late is on.
That linger.
That is weird.
Okay, so.
Wow, I completely derailed that.
No, that's okay.
I'm sorry.
No.
We can't cut that.
I thought we were all sharing scenes.
We can't ever cut that.
I thought we were sharing stuff of us on planes.
When I rewatched Heated Rivalry, I forward to the sex scene.
Like a normal person.
But like I just didn't know, people forwarded it to like all Bane scenes in the Dark Knight Rises.
Not everybody.
Bled.
All right.
Listen, I'm proud of everyone here.
I don't even know why I said that.
Oh, this is just a segment, right?
Yeah.
Okay.
So there's no fun thing at the end where I go, our next guest.
No, you just say bye.
I so don't know what happens on this thing anymore.
That's okay.
Listen.
You're doing your best.
You know what?
You should be proud of your set list of music.
Thank you.
You know what I mean?
It's yours.
It means something to you.
It means nothing to me.
No.
And I judge you for it negatively.
You're welcome for driving you to Covina last night.
It's just literally a few streets away from my home.
Peace out.
Conan O'Brien Needs a Friend, with Conan O'Brien, Sonam Ovsessian, and Matt Gourley.
Produced by me, Matt Gourley.
Executive produced by Adam Sachs, Jeff Ross, and Nick Liao.
Theme song by The White Stripes.
Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino.
Take it away, Jimmy.
Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair.
And our associate talent producer is Jennifer Samples.
Engineering and mixing by Eduardo Perez and Brendan Burns.
Additional production support by Mars Melnick.
Talent booking by Paula Davis, Gina Batista, and Brit Kahn.
You can rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts and you might find your review read on a future episode.
Got a question for Conan?
Call the Team Coco hotline at...
And if you haven't already, please subscribe to.
Conan O'Brien Needs a Friend wherever fine podcasts are downloaded.
