Imagine you were executed centuries later.
You're just like, oh, people are celebrating this.
You're on a Russell Stover box of chocolates.
Yeah, and they're just giving each other chocolates.
Sacrificing our time.
We are negative fertile with each other.
And they look rushed and they look stressed.
And I'm like, very good.
Very good.
I literally feel my blood boiling.
I feel it like, Valentine's Day is kind of a letdown.
Hello and welcome back to Hot Pursuit, a podcast about creating conversations where nothing is off limits.
This podcast is produced by Asian Boss Girl.
I'm Em, and I hate boxed chocolates.
I'm Jen, and Valentine's Day really gets in the way of my takeout order wait time.
I'm Madeline, and I love waiting tables on Valentine's Day because that's when you make bank chin.
It is no mystery based off our outfits that today we are talking about Valentine's Day.
So I thought it would be interesting to give just like a brief history lesson about why Valentine's Day is Valentine's Day.
And it's actually kind of crazy.
So I asked ChatGPT this morning to give me like a four point summary of what Valentine's Day is where it came from.
And it has its origins in ancient Rome.
And they used to do this ritual in mid-February called Lupercalia.
It's a It's a fertility festival involving goat sacrifices, running around half naked and ritualized matchmaking.
I think ancient Romans were kind of crazy.
So that's what it started off as.
I'm sure it was like way more violent too.
How did those three things fit together?
I don't know.
I'm sure it's something- After the goat sacrifice.
I'm sure goat sacrifices like here, may this cover, I don't know.
The new match to be made.
Yeah, I guess so.
Like maybe if I sacrifice a goat- Then you would find your match.
The fertility God will give me more babies.
I'm not sure.
The roman empire.
I mean, i think about the roman empire a lot.
This is this is why they say it's the roman empire.
The roman empire, really.
It really influences a lot of our everyday lives calendar, judicial system, valentine's day.
So much, so much.
We are so influenced by the roman empire, Anyways.
Do you have more?
Yes.
So then it evolved into there were one or two saints in the Christian church, early Christian martyrs named Saint Valentine.
Saint Valentine. saint valentine and it said there's like a legend that says there was a priest that secretly married couples when marriage was banned for a soldier and yeah it's kind of cute it's kind of romantic but then it's also to honor some martyrs and so later on there's like of course a christian rebrand of pagan rituals We love to do that.
Christians love a rebrand.
And they're like, let's stop the goat sacrifices.
Let's just make this about love.
Let's just make this about commemorating these two saints that were martyred.
And then... Wait, so they were martyred for... I don't know what they were martyred for.
Maybe just being Christian.
I'm not sure.
Their faith.
Definition of martyr.
Their names were Valentine.
And I think there was something to do with love.
And then further evolved into medieval poets who made this holiday, and like this celebration romantic, and thus centuries and centuries later.
Now we're buying box chocolates and red roses from Walmart.
And here we are talking about Valentine's Day on our podcast.
So it got passed from, like the Romans, to some martyrs, to some poets, to the throes of corporate capitalism.
And it's always that way for every single holiday.
To fertility.
You know cheers here here huzzah, ah.
So yeah, it's kind of crazy how an ancient roman ritual has evolved into all of us wearing pink um, and people having disappointed february 14th.
I wonder what the St
Valentines would think of the holiday.
They'd be like, what the heck?
Because when I was researching this, there was also very graphic drawings of their executions.
And I was thinking, if I were in their shoes and I saw my name slapped onto a holiday celebrating my martyrdom, I'd be like what is going on?
Like, I died for this?
Imagine you were executed centuries later.
You're just like, oh, people are celebrating this.
You're on a Russell Stover box of chocolates.
Yeah, and they're just giving each other chocolates that, like, taste really bad.
Wow.
I know.
I'm speechless.
Yeah.
A fertility ritual sounds amazing.
I would like to observe one.
Anyways.
So does wine and chocolates make you more fertile?
Maybe.
I mean, the wine and dining.
So the martyrs believed in their faith in their God.
Do we believe in Valentine's Day?
Do we believe in pink and chocolate?
In what sense?
What do you guys think of Valentine's Day?
I've always been happier celebrating it with my friends rather than a romantic interest, because I feel like if I had a boyfriend and we were celebrating it, there's a lot of expectation, kind of crowding the day to make it like the best day ever.
It's kind of like birthdays.
It's kind of like Christmas.
You're just like, am I going to feel the most love on this day?
So for me, I think I love a Galentine's Day like where you're dressing all cute and pink with your friends and then you just tell each other how much you love each other.
I think that is the most meaningful for me.
Like us now.
Yeah, like us.
Every day is Valentine's Day on the Hot Pursuit podcast.
We dress up and tell each other how much we love each other.
I know.
No fertility ritual that we have been invited to, unfortunately.
In fact we are negative, fertile with each other.
I love holidays in general, like i love every holiday i do.
I love an excuse to celebrate.
So i think valentine's day has always just been a fun way to buy some cute things, send some cute things, give some cute things and have an excuse for it, because i think every day is so, can be so like mundane and you have your routines and stuff that a little break in, like a pull out the fur coat, pull out the you know, just an excuse to do it up a little bit.
I think it's spice life, so.
And a lot of day for special activities.
What kind of special activities?
Just like wearing an outfit.
When you said special activities, I was like, she got invited to a fertility ritual that we were.
I know.
I'd just be like going to dinner with your friends.
That is a special activity.
You said it with a glitter in your eyeballs.
Guys, get your minds out of the gutter.
Listen, we started off with fertility.
So like, when you see Target, like the day after Christmas, Target starts to like like, populate its shelves with the with, like all of the valentine's day decor.
Do you get really excited?
I don't get excited.
I get excited.
Actually, you know the day that I love the most is on Valentine's Day.
This applies for like Mother's Day too.
I love just seeing all the men frantically buying roses.
Yeah, like last minute.
Yeah, it's like 5.30.
They need to pick up their woman at like 630 and they're just digging for something that looks good yeah, and they're all waiting in line uh, and they look rushed and they look stressed and i'm like, very good, very good.
Mother's day morning is the same way too costco.
On a mother's day morning weekend they're holding, yeah.
So any holiday whose responsibility is a man's to make good, we'll probably end up in disappointment or just last minute planning.
And we have some stories for you in the next segment.
But that was just, it just popped in my head.
Am I right?
Am I right?
That's why they're there at 5.30.
W's in the chat.
So how do you feel?
Only feeling a type of way, it's true, like mother's day, like what, what you said?
Mother's day, valentine's day, my birthday, just if you leave it up to a man, no bueno, i feel we could talk about this in another episode.
There's a lot to unpack.
I have lots of anger and bitterness in my heart, But let's talk about love.
I think I feel kind of neutral about Valentine's Day.
I find it fun, but I don't have to go out of my way to do something.
Like I totally enjoy a Galentine's Day.
I totally appreciate if a dude is going out of his way to do something for me.
But I think I hoped for a lot of meaning from it when i was a kid and then with every passing year i thought to myself this really don't hit.
So i don't really see why people are anticipating it and i just to see the corporations try to sell things off of it.
And that kind of dampens any excitement that I could have had.
So I also, but I also hate hearing from men that it's just a marketing ploy.
Like it doesn't mean anything.
Why don't you do something in Valentine's day?
Like that, that pisses me off.
Hasn't happened to me.
But like when I have to hear people say that, I'm like, stop being a Debbie Downer.
You're annoying.
And spend your money because you need to show the girl that you care.
Who cares if she believes this marketing ploy?
Do you care about her?
Okay.
So, you know, exactly.
I have not been the victim of that, but I mourn the girls that have because...
They just want to feel special.
And it's just a little act of love.
And it's literally set aside.
It's a day set aside so you don't have to remember.
There's so much stock.
There's so much inventory.
It's not that hard.
It's not that hard.
I know so many women who are married that are close to me whose husbands don't celebrate Valentine's Day for that fact.
And I'm like, will it kill you?
Will it kill you to go to the store and spend $25 and that's it?
You don't even have to get chocolates because they're bad.
The flowers like.
Listen, if you think that that, if your take is that valentine's day is a marketing ploy, that's fine.
Make it up to the woman another day every single year and then i'll shut up.
But i don't see that happening.
And it's not her, it's not your anniversary and it's not her birthday.
Challenge up to you.
Girls always want flowers.
I, it's true.
I could talk for hours about this.
It's also we had a family friend's parents that the dad will buy it the day after because it's on sale.
I hate that so much.
And it makes me really upset.
I love a good deal, okay?
Yeah.
But it's different.
It feels different.
And it feels different when it's like, oh, I got it because they're on sale.
And that's just like, there's the frugal mindset, the communism mindset that...
The emotions of getting it on that day don't matter.
So it's different.
Because you could get it for cheaper the next day.
It feels so different.
It cheapens the entire gesture.
I would rather you actually just don't buy the flowers at all than to get the 50% off ones for me.
Yeah yeah, because that means like oh, you're not worth 25, but you might be worth 125, like maybe i could budge a little bit on that.
Oh my gosh, i literally feel my blood boiling.
I feel it like rising to the top.
I also agree that valentine's day is like a marketing thing.
We don't get a day off work for it, But it's a nice excuse to like celebrate love.
So why wouldn't you do it?
And in the service industry, always full reservations booked out and you're like I'm gonna make money tonight.
So, you know, I don't know.
It gets flowers.
Yeah.
I love hearing about couples that do creative things.
If they don't do the traditional, go out to dinner.
Like one friend, they'll always order in sushi.
It's their tradition that they've made because they don't want to participate in the corporate capitalism.
They're like, we always order sushi from this favorite spot.
And it's sweet, but they're doing something special.
So it's more like the excuse to do something special, and it doesn't have to look like what you've been told it needs to look like.
But the expectation is it has to look this way.
Yeah.
I was thinking about how, like No one is disappointed after July 4th because no one has expectations about how July 4th is going to feel
That's true, yeah.
But February 14th, you feel like you're going to feel a certain way.
And then when you don't, then the disappointment, then the gap in expectations.
There's a lot of room for disappointment.
That's why it's similar to birthday blues and stuff.
Yeah, that's a really good point.
Anybody on July 5th is like, man.
You know, I wish they used that other firework.
That hot dog really wasn't as decadent as I thought it was going to be.
No, but I have had that thought before.
I'm like, I wish there were better hot dogs.
They'd sheep down on these hot dogs.
But I digress.
Like, oh, the fireworks aren't as good as I thought they were going to be.
Like, no one cares.
Because the subject of the celebration is the country, which is like a whole other.
That's not all.
But when you expect it to be you, basically.
Yeah.
To feel special.
Yeah.
Okay, so now that we are properly riled up, why don't we share our best and worst Valentine's Day memories?
Let's start with the worst.
Let's get into the juicy juice now.
My worst Valentine's Day is when my friend that is single with me for so many years finally got a boyfriend.
I was like...
She's like, it's been nice.
It's been good.
I'm gonna go celebrate now.
But it was actually very exciting, because she hadn't dated someone for a very very very, very long time was so excited i felt like we were like kids again, like picking out her outfit and her sweater.
They went to fogo de chao very fancy.
He got her like roses and she sent me all the photos afterwards.
So it was just a normal tuesday for me where the takeout took way too long.
I got Thai takeout, it was great.
The takeout took too long.
But yeah, we'd always for years done like things together.
Like Valentine's.
She was your designated Valentine's Day person.
Yeah.
For like 10 years.
Yeah, exactly.
And then she got a boyfriend, so it was very exciting.
It was exciting for her, but you can't help but feel something for yourself.
You have to be behind.
When you were sitting alone eating your Thai takeout, what were you thinking?
All I was thinking was, it's just a Tuesday.
It's just a Tuesday.
Did you feel anything about yourself?
Actually, with Valentine's Day, the question that always is like I hate this question.
It's like what are you doing for Valentine's Day?
And you're like, either have plans or you're like, I'm gonna go get some takeout, you know?
So there's just this moment of like, I guess I'll do my nighttime routine extra long tonight.
You know?
Yeah.
Did you feel anything about like being single on that day?
Yeah, I think there's a feeling of being left behind, especially when so many friends have gotten married, but then the few that are still single start to also fly from the nest.
You're like, oh, I'm just still holding down the camp here, you know?
Yeah.
It kind of reminds me of like those shows where someone is alone and they celebrate their birthday and they have a cupcake and they light their own candle and they blow it out.
You're just like, here I am.
I could just see you sitting in the dark. watching my shows.
I love love.
What did you feel when you would celebrate Valentine's Day with your friend previously?
Oh, it was so fun.
It was so fun because we would always like, for weeks in advance, be like what should we do for valentine's day this year?
So like we made it a thing together um, and had the best time, like take the cute photos and like do A lot of those years we're in Seattle all the time.
Seattle does not dress up, but we'd be like we're going to wear the booty heels that no one is wearing out in Seattle.
Once again, that excuse to do something special is so great.
Having that close connection and companionship together with someone is so meaningful.
And then she left.
You suck.
They're still together.
It's very cute.
Oh, are they married?
Not yet.
OK.
They're in their dating phase.
Not yet.
Yeah.
Wait, so when was your first year alone?
Was that recent?
Yeah, it was last year.
That was your worst Valentine's Day.
Oh, Jay.
I thought it was going to be like, oh, back in 2019.
No, it was last year.
No, it was last year.
Oh, well, you can spend it with me this year.
Sure.
I have no plan.
We can do a special social thing.
Are you free?
I'm free.
Hey, you should come over.
We're hanging out.
Let's go.
Okay, so.
Valentine's.
That was my Valentine's Day.
Lonely Jennifer gave us.
Lonely Jen.
A story of.
Getting her tie take out.
That took so long.
Oh, it took a long time?
I would imagine that just because you're competing with all the other couples who are there at the restaurant.
And then I'm walking out to go pick it up and like everyone's, all the girls are in their dress.
I'm in my sweatpants.
It's like this bad time is about to hit.
Brutal contrast on Valentine's Day.
Seeing like, yeah, who is out. and who's just grabbing dinner to go back into their hole.
Oh, gosh.
Oh, okay.
I have one.
It was a few years ago when I was dating my ex, my most recent ex.
And we were long distance at the time.
So I think in his head we were going to celebrate when he visited, because he was going to come the week after.
But he didn't tell me that.
So he, I think he had plans.
So I'm not sure he said he did but February 13th, I cause he hadn't talked about it yet, or or like, mentioned any plans.
So I texted him.
I was like, so what are we doing tomorrow?
And he was like, oh, we're not doing anything tomorrow.
And I was like, what do you mean we're not doing anything tomorrow?
He's like, well, I just thought it would be better to like celebrate in person.
And I'm like, okay, yeah, I get that.
But I would still like to celebrate on the designated day.
And he was like, he said this, I don't believe that it was true though.
But he said, I wrote it in the last card that I sent you because we used to be pen pal.
We used to like send each other cards because it's like a long distance thing.
He was like.
I wrote it in the last card that we wouldn't celebrate Valentine's Day on the day, but that we would celebrate the week after.
And I was like, well, you didn't put it on the card.
I grabbed the card and I was like, where is it?
Where is it on the card?
And he's like, oh, I thought I wrote it.
And I was like, I don't believe you.
I don't believe you. but whatever.
And I was just like, even if you did write it on the card, I still would not be okay with that.
And I would have been like, no, veto.
We're celebrating it on the day.
So of course I was really mean to him.
So I made him feel bad and then he he did like um, like frankenstein, together something the next day, but it was because, like all like the florists were like booked out, all the flowers were gone.
He did order me flowers, but it was like i don't even think they had normal sized roses anymore, they had these like tiny ones, and so the bouquet that was delivered to me was like this small.
It was like this small.
And then, literally right after my roommate's boyfriend walked in with this huge, this huge, like massive display of roses.
It's not something you get from the store.
It's something you order specially.
It was huge.
And I was like, Emily, don't compare, don't compare, don't compare.
And I had to like run into my room and just cry because I was like, oh my gosh, of course I set up.
Well see, OK if it's left to a man, you just don't know with the planning.
But i was like, sitting there with this tiny bouquet and i was like this is the smallest bouquet of roses i've ever received, and not like i didn't want to be ungrateful, but i mean it was just like comparatively and you know i shouldn't compare, so like in my head i felt bad that they were so small, but i also felt bad that i was comparing as well.
And So we eventually FaceTime and we did the whole Valentine's Day and he had nice jazz music playing and then a poster of all of his favorite pictures of us that he had pasted onto a bigger poster board.
It was sweet.
I really appreciated the effort after.
I made a huge fuss about it, but I just remember feeling awful.
That's the thing too.
Like we mentioned another episode that we were talking about bachelorette or bridesmaids, and like bachelorette parties.
And we had mentioned how much of this would happen if Instagram wasn't a thing, if you didn't see it.
And yours was like a real life comparison, right?
But like, how many people are comparing to things that they see online and, as a result, are unhappy with it simply because they just see something else?
Like would they have been happy if that was it?
I mean, yours is a little different, but you seem to be the recipient of small rose bouquet.
She gets a lot of miniature bouquet.
Also for the men that are watching this if you're watching this, never get a bouquet of white flowers.
Oh, yeah.
Oh, my God.
I don't think they realize what that means.
They're just like, oh, white looks nice because it's not red.
Maybe let's do something different.
Let's shake it up a bit.
But it's literally those are funeral flowers.
It means death.
It means death.
And it's so surprising how many times guys have gotten us like white, like a bouquet of pure white roses.
I'm like, do you want this relationship to die?
Yes, and like, my very close friends have also had that experience.
So like, don't ever do that me.
I am close friends.
I got the, i got the bouquet and i literally sent it to emily.
I go well, i guess this ain't working.
He has communicated his intentions.
He wants us to die.
I wonder if they like look online and just see the like millennial homes with like all white beige and like oh, maybe.
Oh, it just exposes how little effort you are willing to put.
Like yeah, it's like the girls want so little.
They just want to feel special.
That's it.
Yeah.
I refuse to give men that concession that they don't know any better because like, if they really like something, they will do their research and they'll make sure they get it right.
And it's just a very simple chat GPT.
What kind of flowers should I avoid?
What kind of flowers should I get?
It's just so simple.
Or just like ask her best friend what kind of flowers she likes.
They're not expensive.
Trader Joe's has really nice bouquets for like less than $20.
It's not expensive.
Yes.
And if you really want to wow them, just...
Yeah.
Or if you go to Whole Foods.
If you go to Whole Foods, you can like pick out all the different filler flowers and you bring it to the desk and they make it for you for free.
For free.
Yeah, it's free.
You don't even have to pay for it.
And it looks better because they don't put that little tag on it.
It's in this really nice like burlap, not burlap.
I know what you're talking about.
The brown thing makes it look so weird.
Butcher paper, yes.
Butcher paper, yeah.
It looks craft.
Artisanal.
My ex used to do that, which is why I was very disappointed with the tiny ones that he sent me.
I was like, I know you can do better.
I know we're long distance, though.
But what are these?
The gap in expectations.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
How about you Mads?
See, I don't have a particularly negative memory of Valentine's Day, but the thing that keeps popping on my mind is one of the more recent ones that I had with a boyfriend.
And the reason it pops up is because it was just so unmemorable.
But, like the thing is, I don't remember any of my valentine's days other than, like what we're gonna say is the best one um, but it's just so like uh yeah, like the the whole holiday is just so.
In what is the word insignificant?
Insignificant yeah, we don't even get a day off of work for this yeah, so i just feel like the whole holiday is insignificant.
But then i don't want to be a debbie downer, so i'm not trying to like say that all the time, you know um, but yeah, i remember like he got me flowers and then he like stuck them in a vase, which i was like wow okay, you took the next step, but then it was literally like still in the rubber band.
Oh wait, I remember that.
And then stuck in there.
And the vase was, like, was way too small.
You know?
And, like, at that time.
It's just awful.
I just thought like, well, this is really nice, I guess.
But then like, I have to take it out and then cut- You have to like redo it.
Yeah, you have to like cut all the- And he put it in his face.
That's really cute.
Yeah, yeah, it was cute.
It was also, it had the sticker of $6 on the bottom.
So I was like, okay, thanks.
Oh my God, it was not even like a like a clear glass, you know, like a white clear glass vase it was.
It was like a colored one, which is fine but, like i think i remember this, it was like it was like purely half jar, purely minimal effort, but the fact that there's a vase like you thought that that was gonna do something.
Yeah Yeah, that was it.
And I mean, I was happy, but I don't know.
What else did you do?
I don't remember.
I think we like maybe went to dinner or something, but I do remember feeling afterwards well, That was that.
You know what I mean?
It did not feel any different.
I think other days that we had planned dates felt more special than Valentine's Day.
Because Valentine's Day you're out there fighting the crowds and fighting for your life to get a reservation.
It's just not.
It's just not my vibe, you know.
Yeah um, so it wasn't like bad per se, but if you were to ask me about this valentine's day, i'd be like whatever.
Yeah, so maybe that is most indicative of how i feel about it inconsequential.
She said yeah, and it's like i got that out of the way.
I guess that's what it is.
Yeah, check the box Yeah.
I've had, like, other Valentine's Days, I guess, with dudes.
But, like, they were dudes.
Boyfriends.
Plural.
And they were pleasant.
They were fine.
They were nice.
I think you just, like, would hope that there is something better to say than it was nice.
Yeah.
You know what I mean?
But let's flip the script and ask about our best Valentine's Day experiences.
I'll go first.
Okay.
Yeah.
Okay.
So my most fond memory of Valentine's Day is being in elementary school and creating your paper little bandwagon to receive those yeah, to receive your valentines from all of your schoolmates, and then some of them have candy and i didn't get like secret admirers or anything, but they just it was your one chance to express how you felt about someone.
So if they were special like i, like the way you draw, you know like that was the time to like write that, or like you're so, like i love recess with you, you know it was just so innocent and so sweet and i remember feeling so much joy with no pressure then, and like it was fun decorating your receiving vessel.
It was fun writing the notes to people, like i can't wait to make their day by saying this nice thing about them, and then you get to add stickers and hearts and if you are rich you can add candy, which i didn't do.
But like you know, it's like a day of permission to express Yes.
Yes.
And then you get to sit and everyone gets to sit at their little desks and they get to open their little boxes.
And it's so fun.
And then you get to eat candy at the same time.
And who doesn't love candy?
Like in class.
In class while you are receiving positive words about yourself on fun, words of affirmation day on fun, printed like colorful postcards yeah, do they do that anymore at school?
Oh, i don't know.
I don't know.
Oh, they better i.
I haven't been to walmart in a while.
This can be our assignment this year.
We each have to buy a box of kids valentines.
I love them and exchange them, and they always have like a little tab where you can like pop it in.
Like there's like, you put the candy and then you pop the other side into the tab.
It's so fun.
I remember it was a whole thing too to pick out, like go to the store and pick out which ones you wanted.
And they were always themed, like I was a corporate capitalist.
Like Lord of the Rings Valentine.
But they were really like punny.
And they'd be like Gandalf being like, You shall pass.
You were right.
It was punny.
Very godparent.
They were all super punny.
And you could pick your favorite one, like the Little Mermaid one or the Cinderella one.
And so it was like a personality expression.
Oh, that girl loves the Little Mermaid.
I know who this is from.
Yeah.
And then the boys always have like a thicker card stock that has a little sheen on it.
A sheen on it.
And then there's other ones that have a little bit of iridescence to it.
You know like they can reflect in the light.
Yeah, the iridescence.
I see it in my mind's eye.
Yeah.
And then there's also like more down to earth ones.
There's like the Hello Kitty ones.
Yeah.
Some of them I remember, this one that I remember once that came with stickers.
A.K.A. with stickers.
Or like a tattoo.
Or they scratch and sniff.
It's just like little fun experiences that you get to...
They were very fun.
Yeah.
I remember decorating the mailbox as a whole thing.
It was a whole activity.
I think this is just like the teachers trying to keep us busy.
We also bring in shoe boxes and then we cut out.
You cut out the little, the hole.
You cut out the hole at the top and then you like put them in.
Yeah.
And it was like a whole activity where you would like have your little baggie of your Valentine's and you're like no.
I also remember picking out the, because in the cards there's always the prettier ones, the fun patterns, versus the uglier ones.
And I always pick the prettier ones for my friends.
I was like, these ones go to these people.
I would pick the prettiest one for you.
Wait, did you ever write one to a boy you liked?
No.
Did you ever pick a pretty one for the boy?
I don't recall.
I don't have any memories.
That's kind of bold.
Of boys in elementary school.
That's rather bold.
But I think the thing for me that was most special about those was, like everyone always put from and to
So, you know, like, this one was meant for you.
Like they picked this one out for you versus the generic yeah, yeah.
And like they sat down and wrote from la la la to emily, and even before you have the ability or not ability, but just like before you are expected to like write things, you can just like add a star or a heart to the people that are extra special, Write their name in pretty cursive or something you know.
Even if like the Valentine's already written for you.
What would be the closest adult equivalent to this?
The activity?
Commenting on someone's Instagram post.
You look hot in this pic.
Words of affirmation.
I think just writing letters.
Given freely.
I think it was also neat.
You had to do it for everyone too.
There wasn't like a, I'm only giving seven to my friends.
It's like, everyone got one.
Everyone had a full mailbox at the end, no matter.
Did y'all schools ever do the flower thing?
Mine did.
That's part of my memory.
Okay.
What is the flower thing?
You've sent flowers to people.
You buy flowers to people and they deliver it to their home room in front of everyone.
Yes.
Yes.
Dang.
That's crazy.
And the people who don't get one just don't get one.
They just sit there.
They just sit there so it could be the greatest time ever or the worst time ever.
Yeah, i like i've never really liked that.
I forgot about that.
It's kind of savage.
The equivalent yeah, that's the adult equivalent is we're like only you get one yeah, and even as a person receiving one, you feel bad because you receive like five and this person right next to you like got nothing, Yeah.
It's the meanest practice.
That's fucked up.
Yeah.
Anyways.
Yeah.
But tell us your story.
Well, I related to that.
I remember sometimes people get one, like a single one from like unknown.
Oh, the unknowns were so, and those are so juicy.
Juicy.
Yeah.
It'd be like, to Katie, from, and then blank.
And they'll go around and be like, did you send me this one?
Did you send me this one?
And then one of our friends.
One time was like we should troll and send one to our friend that's unknown.
And then tell her later.
It was fun.
But can you imagine receiving an unknown rose?
Actually, ours were carnations because they were cheaper.
They were carnations, yeah.
Were they white?
They were red, yeah.
Red and pink chard carnations.
Not even a rose.
But what was part of your story?
Oh, my favorite Valentine's Day was when I was in high school and it was my high school boyfriend.
And it was just, I went to boarding school and so there was no way to like go anywhere.
And you actually couldn't leave campus without getting permission.
There was no Amazon Prime or anything.
So I don't know how this dude got his hands on like a tiny box of like.
I remember it was Russell Stover, with a Snoopy on the front, and we couldn't leave campus because we were boarding school.
So like he just shows up to the dorm and i walk out and he's like i have something for you.
It was this little box of chocolate yeah, and then we just like walked around and like sat on a bench and ate them together and then they i remember they tasted like what, like not so great chocolate.
It was like yeah yes, the effort, and also because it was hard to get, like where he would have to like sign himself out, go to, like take the bus and go to town to like get them somehow or ask a teacher.
I don't know how he did it, but It was so sweet.
He was committed.
So committed.
And it was just so innocent.
I didn't have any expectation.
And it was just a surprise.
And it was just sweet.
And I remember feeling like, what?
This is like his full effort that he could do.
Yeah.
And that was the sweetest thing ever.
And I also remember saving that box like well after Valentine's Day and had it on my desk in my dorm room.
It was very cute with Snoopy on it.
Yeah, because it's not the chocolate.
It's the effort that went in and the thought behind it.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Because if it was just like an arbitrarily given Snoopy box of chocolates, you probably wouldn't care less.
Yeah.
But you just like the effort.
I was like, where did you get this from?
Do you still have the box?
We're at boarding school.
Yeah, do you still have the box?
We can't leave.
No, I don't have it anymore.
Did you toss it?
I think I kept it for the longest time.
Oh, when you broke up.
I was like, oh.
So that's my favorite memory.
It was sweet, it was innocent, and the effort was to the fullest.
When have you felt that feeling since?
Ooh, actually a close...
Second to a story that came to mind was just a surprise care package in the mail from a friend, like two, three years ago.
She's already like married in a relationship.
And I feel like so many times.
Galentine's is often with your single friends, but to be thought of by a friend that, like had her own thing, had her marriage, but was still thinking of me, was really sweet.
I opened it and like all these like gold, not gold, pink and red foil like dove hearts fell out.
And there was like bath bombs and candles in there and it was a sweet card.
But it was special because she had her thing but was still considering and thinking of Yeah.
Me, you know?
Yeah.
Yeah.
So that was a close second, I would say.
Wow.
Surprise out of the blue.
Little bit of effort, but went so far.
Aww.
Yeah.
That's like a textbook, I feel like, experience of Valentine's Day.
When you least expect it.
Simple.
Yeah.
Simple.
What about you, Em?
What about you, Em?
What's your favorite Valentine's Day, your best Valentine's Day?
My best Valentine's Days plural have always been parent-led.
So growing up my parents like we never asked them to do this and we never expected them to do it, but every single Valentine's Day we would wake up.
It was kind of like Christmas, but red.
So we would wake up and we would walk to the kitchen and my my dad and my mom would set out either flowers or they would always set out these like strawberry whoppers for my sister and I And like we loved it.
Cause it's strawberry.
You don't get that all the time.
I think it's like only for Valentine's day.
They would get us like strawberry Whoppers and you just see, like two sets, because it's for me and my sister.
And then like a small gift and then a red envelope with 20.
That just changed the game.
Yeah yeah, it was so sweet.
Yeah, i got money, but there was.
It's like there's this cute little puppy that my, my dad got my sister and i still have it.
I think it's in my closet right now it's out of battery, but it's like the one you squeeze and when you squeeze it it says i rough you.
Oh yeah, i rough you and that's so cute.
Obviously it's been like 15 years so i don't think it works anymore, but i still have it because it's just like the sweetest thing.
We've got to find a battery replace it.
Yeah, it's so cute.
Yeah, and so every single valentine's day they would set out one candy and one little gift and one twenty dollar bill.
Yeah, in a home ball, in a home ball.
It's that simple.
If a guy did that for me, i'd be like this is awesome, thank you.
Immediate marriage Money yeah, it doesn't even have to be flowers.
I actually don't really like.
Like if someone were to get me a dozen red roses and a box of Russell Stovers, I'd be like you're just following the recipe.
You're not giving any thought into this.
So I feel like what my parents did for me was really special, because I know it took a little more thought.
He probably like walked around Walmart a bit and like stared at a bit, pondered should I, should I buy this?
Should I buy that?
And so it was really special.
So I still have yet to top that experience with a man.
Oh, so that was mainly done by your father.
Yeah yeah, i think my dad important to know.
Yeah, and that's the level of effort.
Like you met you imagining him, like picking out these things for you, Like knowing you would appreciate the little punny guy.
I see him in the store squeezing the little dog and being like, ha, this is funny.
Emily would love this.
This is so her. whatever the Asian father version of this is so her.
Yeah.
And instead of like, Oh, let me get her these chocolates.
He's, he's thinking like, I know she doesn't like these chocolates.
Let me get her these strawberry whoppers.
Cause there's so much better.
And yeah, every single time I see whoppers, I think of my dad.
Oh yeah.
Malt balls.
I don't even know if they make the strawberry ones anymore.
I haven't seen them.
There was one year he had to get us just normal chocolate and peanut butter because they didn't have them.
Oh wow.
Yeah.
But it was just, it's always been a really fond memory.
A core memory, if you will.
A core memory, yeah.
So there was also one year he got us like luggage tags, but they were pink.
Yeah, so it's just like themed.
Your father is elite.
He did a lot.
He's a good dad.
It takes so little.
It really does.
So little.
It just takes like 30 more seconds of thinking, like also the creativity.
The creativity really matters so much, i think, and gift giving in general, but it's it's like this is for you, taylor made for you, and you know that that gift they know wouldn't work for anybody else.
The best kind, all we want, i think, is just like to be thought of yes, when you least expect it, and then be thought of intentionally for you.
As a symbol that they know you.
You're not replaceable.
You're not just a woman that they can like go to the store zombie, and then get this and satisfy their duties.
Which is still what they do.
Which is still what they do.
Which is still what some of them don't even do all the time.
They get it on February 15th.
Yeah.
So this has become an episode about how men cannot even do the bare minimum.
JK, maybe.
Maybe not.
I think they can.
They can if they care.
Yeah, if he wanted to, he would.
It's that simple.
Okay, so how much love do you actually feel on Valentine's Day, whether it's from your parents or your girlfriends, or your romantic interest at the time?
I feel that this is of course it's a designated day of love, but I never feel like extra loved on Valentine's Day.
I feel like there's so many moments throughout my year where I feel thought of and considered way more than if I were just to like wake up to flowers and then have gone to dinner just to like satisfy that duty.
It's kind of a letdown.
Yeah, because there's expectations of feeling loved and there's expectations of like this should be a day where I'm showered with love.
But if everyone's trying to feel that way, I feel like no one really has capacity to give that out to someone else, because they're trying to feel the same way, you know.
So everyone's just take, take, take, take, take, take, take.
Which then begs the question, why do we feel that way?
Why do we expect to feel such love in exorbitant measure?
Because it's not even realistic.
Like like, when do you even feel that?
You know, i was thinking about how, like i think valentine's day and birthdays in the way that i feel about them sometimes and the way i hear people talk about them feel very similar.
Um, people will often share about the birthday blues and it feels more okay to voice, like i always just kind of am disappointed by the end of the day on my birthday And the common denominator is like the lie we've been told of what this should feel like is just wrong.
But if everybody buys into that, you can't help.
But also think like do I kind of want to feel that way too?
And so even as much as like a Galentine's Day is really cute and really fun and these little gestures mean a lot, they still are bumping up against this other thing that I always feel, which is like, should I be feeling more?
Is there supposed to be more of that that's supposed to be happening?
And we're all just running from that by trying to do a gesture to fulfill something.
A void has been created by, I don't know who, maybe marketers.
A void has been created that will never be satiated.
But the chase is worth enough because I think also the anticipation up until Valentine's Day is part of the experience of Valentine's Day.
It's like prom.
Prom is actually like kind of fun, but what's also more fun is honestly like the three weeks leading up to prom.
Getting ready for it.
What outfit are you going to wear with your boyfriend?
I mean with my friend that I was mentioning that had her first Valentine's Day.
I was like Picking out her outfit together.
How are you going to do your hair?
Where is he going to take you?
That's part of the thrill.
And then you get to the day and you're like, well, the steak was kind of overdone.
She literally was like, the food was not that good.
And we just came back and had some wine.
Sounds like the Met Gala.
A void has been created by I don't know who, but it's there and we're all trying to fill it somehow.
Like, if you think about it, the best times you have with your partner or with your friends are when you guys are completely comfortable with each other in sweats, just watching a movie.
Someone makes everyone tea.
Everyone has like a bowl of ramen.
You're just super comfortable.
But I feel like with these holidays it's almost like they're promising this extra feeling that you get if you go to a nice dinner.
If you get flowers and like when has a nice dinner ever been?
Like comfy cozy comfortable, and you feel like your truest self there.
No, you're putting up a front.
You're putting on a full face of makeup, you're on your best behavior.
And, of course, when you're like so buttoned up and like zipped up, like that you're not gonna feel open enough to receive love.
You're not gonna feel open enough to give love either.
So I just don't feel like, like this is all just a money grab, I guess.
It's not really for, it's not for the people.
It's not by the people.
Is Valentine's Day not American?
It's not very American.
I don't know.
They market it as love, but do they truly understand what love feels like?
I don't think so.
Wow.
I feel like the best type of Valentine's Day if I'm thinking about a Galentine's Day is like gifting my friends, maybe like a sweat set matching sweat set that we all wear together.
And then we put on a fun little rom-com.
We all get some tissues.
One of the things I think about related to all of this is how we we vacillate between desiring like stability and comfort, and then excitement and something that feels different and special.
And so even the same way with travel and trips, I think it also is like the same root thing, which is a void is created.
You think you're going to feel a certain type of way on a mountaintop in Santorini watching a sunset, but then you get there and it's freaking cold and you're like I want to go back inside now because the wind is whipping my hair, you know.
You're not comfortable.
Yeah, but it's so true.
It taps into this desire of like, every day I just wear my sweatpants.
I'm with my partner on the couch watching something.
So maybe if we get dressed up and go eat cold steak, you'll feel something.
Maybe like a change in routine.
Yeah.
The desire for a night to feel special.
Let's do something special.
But then I think like maybe that mismatch is like, what does special mean?
And we follow a formula, but maybe special is you get to have your strawberry wafers and like.
Yeah.
A special gift.
Like that is actually more special, but we don't know what special means.
We want special.
Yes.
Because routine is hard.
And we think special will feel better.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And more satisfying.
Oftentimes the most special or memorable moments are not necessarily planned.
Like they are things that happen together with you, with someone that you care about.
And that could be when you are in sweatpants or it also could be when you are out.
But I think trying to orchestrate a moment of special feeling is not to be disregarded by any means because, like that is when that hits.
It's like so much greater than anything else.
But the success rate of that and i think, like the expectation of what that is going to be like versus looking for those special moments in your everyday are there's a little bit of a chasm there and it's kind of like how can we appreciate what the special is and look for it, no matter where it is, no matter like what you're doing, versus like pouring all of your expectations into an orchestrated moment which probably is going to have a lower success rate anyways?
Yeah.
Like you can't engineer special, but you do need to put in effort to make special possible.
But you also can't expect it will Yeah.
You just, you can't like perfectly formulaically.
Yeah.
You kind of just have to like, this is an effort.
This is our setting.
Anything goes.
Yes.
Anything goes.
And hopefully between the two of us and our magical relationship, we'll find a special moment.
But I feel like with with, like a dinner or something it's almost like, and you're supposed to feel special now.
And then once you get it, you're just like, nothing's happening.
And then it leaves room for so much disappointment.
Like I don't actually feel anything.
I just notice the wind right now going on my skirt.
Yeah, I'm wearing a short dress and heels, holding this dang rose and I'm freezing and I can't wait to get back to the car.
Yes, yes.
But I feel like the most special memories are made from planning something that is like very meaningful for just the two of you personally.
It doesn't have to be because we're a couple or because we're friends, we have to do this.
But, like me and Mad, sometimes we go on walks and it always like builds into something really beautiful, because like we play really well and so we like find a leaf, Or like we'll find leaves to crunch.
And like, that's like the special moment.
Sticks to break.
Yeah.
Yeah.
We'll find sticks to break.
But it's not like, okay, at this intersection, this is where it's going to feel really, really good.
The leaf right there is about to hit.
But similarly, you do. both go and choose to go out and go on the walk.
So similarly, it's like the couple needs to go out or the friends need to go out and like put in the effort and they can't sit at home and expect it to happen.
They've gone out, but the moment could happen whenever.
Yeah.
Like if you go to a restaurant and you don't have a conversation at all, then what's the point?
$90 beef Wellington.
That's about it.
It kind of feels like practice or creativity or just like trying to hone a new skill for anything.
Like the more reps that you get in, like you never know what's going to take off.
You never know what's going to be that special moment, but you have to try.
And the more you try like the more success and the more the more you'll be able to figure out what is going to increase your chances of special.
Yesterday, me and Em went on a walk and we picked dandelions for each other and it was so cute.
But then she shared a story about how her dad got mad at her when she was younger for blowing dandelions.
So then we went to the middle of an intersection That was empty.
To be mindful of everyone's lawns and we blew them in the middle.
So they would just land on the concrete.
Into the concrete.
That's magical.
Yeah, no, but it was, because it's that, like the act of that is so romantic, right?
But then it's like we made that our moment yes, and it's like the effort is has to be there yes, and it's infused with the story that she told me, and then us thinking we're being mindful of other people whatever, but it was so fun and so special yeah yeah, yeah.
And then yeah, one time jen bro took me on a date.
It was so special as well.
I was jealous when i heard about it later.
Excuse you,
She's like the best date. date.
To pay for everything.
It was similarly spontaneous, too.
Yeah, it was spontaneous.
We didn't know what to eat, and so we got ramen.
We were thinking we were going to just eat popcorn and eat at TED.
And then I was like, I'm hungry.
We had a headache.
So then we sat with a view of this film premiere across the street on like this fourth floor of a building, slurping ramen, late for the movie.
Yeah, tend to be like it's really good, right.
Wow, it's really beautiful.
Okay, we gotta go.
We were literally watching a red carpet as we were like eating ramen and then we were late for the movie and they scolded us.
But that's like a memory we share.
So like creating moments but also letting the memory unfold.
Unfold before you.
Before you.
Trusting the relationship.
Instead of forcing the moment.
Trusting each other versus trusting the moment that you're trying to engineer.
Yeah.
And you can do that any day.
Yes.
Yeah.
But Valentine's Day specifically, it just there's just so much pressure attached with it.
So I feel like for this Valentine's Day I think this episode is coming out just a few days before.
If you're still planning.
I feel like it would be great to just be a little bit mindful about the relationship you guys share and create great special moments.
Maybe skip the dinner altogether.
Maybe save the traffic stress.
Picnic.
Free.
Free.
Picnic in the living room.
Yeah, create the vibes.
Yeah, create the vibes.
It could be so fun.
String lights do a lot.
Fort.
Fort.
We made a fort.
We made a fort.
Yeah, a few weeks ago, we made a fort.
It was so fun.
It was so fun.
With your entire stash of chips.
And we just pretended like we were our nine-year-old selves.
It was so fun.
It was really hot underneath the blanket, but it was really fun.
So I think the creativity.
Yeah.
Don't feel stressed out, but think.
Just think a little bit more.
Yeah.
If you're feeling lonely or a little bit sad, think about why.
Is that because you are expecting that you shouldn't feel this way?
Because even if you feel lonely or sad on like a regular Monday, it probably won't hit as hard as it is on valentine's day, because you think on valentine's day i should be happy, but i don't know, it's all, it's an arbitrary day.
A little bit of perspective.
Just a tuesday.
Yeah, at least you're not sacrificing a goat.
Yeah, For us Valentine's Day is kind of let down.
So we would love to hear from you.
If you agree that Valentine's Day is let down, please drop a comment.
Let us know your perspective.
If you disagree, that's fine too.
Let us know.
We're ready to argue.
But happy Valentine's Day.
Happy Valentine's Day.
We love you guys so much.
Thank you so much for joining us.
Follow us on Instagram, TikTok, at the Hot Pursuit Pod.
We're also on YouTube and all the podcasting platforms.
Hit the subscribe button.
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And thank you for joining us for this conversation.
We're really bad at this.
We need to practice.
All right.
Hot Pursuit out.
Hot Pursuit out.
