Hey there, I'm Asma Khalid.
And I'm Tristan Redman.
And we're here with a bonus episode for you from the Global Story podcast.
Every day we focus on one story, looking at how America and the world shape each other.
We recorded this episode last week ahead of the FIFA World Cup draw here in Washington DC, and it is a fascinating look at the growing bromance between President Trump and the president of FIFA.
And if you like this episode, you can hear more from us by searching for The Global Story wherever you listen to podcasts.
At today's 2026 World Cup draw at the Kennedy Center here in Washington DC, millions of people around the world will be watching to see who their country will face in a bid to win the biggest trophy in the sport we here call soccer.
And today, it won't be players lining up to shake hands and collect a medal.
Instead, the winner will likely be President Trump, who is widely predicted to win the very first FIFA Peace Prize.
The prize was created by the sport's most powerful man, Gianni Infantino, and it's the latest in a series of spectacles which skeptics see as an attempt to cozy up to the American president.
I would like to thank President Trump, with whom I have a great friendship, and to assure him that together we will make not only America great again, but also the entire world.
And this all is raising questions about what it means for FIFA as a supposedly politically neutral organization.
From the BBC, I'm Asma Khalid in Washington, D.C.
And today on The Global Story, what happens when the lines between politics, diplomacy and sports are blurred?
The Global Story Can I have you introduce yourself?
Dan Rowan.
I'm the sports editor for the BBC.
Dan, it is great to have you with us in real life, in person, here in the studio, in our bureau here in Washington DC, because you're not normally here but you're in town to cover the World Cup draw that's taking place at the Kennedy Center for a big moment here for us as Americans, because you know, it's not every day we get to host this major soccer tournament.
And I should say soccer.
I know you all say football, but, you know...
I think it will sound very much like I'm just trying to be an inauthentic Brit if I say football.
So I will say soccer.
That's right for the draw itself, which will be a very grand occasion full of pomp and ceremony no doubt they always are.
And, of course, this is the host country, or the three host countries, we should say, for next year's World Cup, because it's not just here in the US, but also.
Mexico and Canada.
There'll be an onstage show featuring celebrities, entertainers.
There'll be legendary ex-players.
There always are.
Heidi Klum and Kevin Hart will co-host the event.
There'll be live performances from Andrea Bocelli, Village People, Robbie Williams.
Village people, the YMCA people.
Indeed.
And that, I think, speaks to... That's a favorite Donald Trump song.
Absolutely.
And I think it speaks to a Trumpian influence and theme, perhaps, to what we're about to see.
You've covered a lot of these draws before.
Yeah, yeah.
I've covered every World Cup now since 2006 in Germany.
Does this one feel different?
Well, it is different.
I mean, it is absolutely different.
It's the biggest ever, 48 teams rather than 32.
So it's been expanded.
It's the first one to feature three co-hosts.
And so having matches spread out over the whole of North America Mexico, Canada and the US will feel very different indeed.
And yeah, it's going to make more money than ever before as well.
I think it will feature challenges the like of which perhaps the World Cup hasn't encountered in the past two
So there's an awful lot for us to sort of wonder about.
And I think some of that will come through with this draw.
And I think politics is going to have a major presence.
Can I ask you about that?
Because I'm a longtime political correspondent here in Washington and I think the politics of this is what I find so interesting that this draw is going to happen at the Kennedy Center.
You're going to have the president of the United States there.
I think it's worth pointing out to listeners that the World Cup last was here on U.S. soil in 1994.
And to my knowledge, Bill Clinton didn't attend that.
He didn't preside over that draw.
So to me, that's really notable, the politics of this all in this moment.
Yeah, and I think, you know, it's no surprise, really, I think that Trump's there.
After all, we're here in Washington.
It's going to be at the Kennedy Center where he's chair, of course.
But, you know, he's made this World Cup a focus, I think, of his second presidency.
And it will coincide with the 250th anniversary of U.S. independence next year as well.
And I think now football gives him an international global platform and he's recognized this.
My understanding is there's also this new element to the draw this year the Peace Prize, the FIFA Peace Prize.
Absolutely, yes.
Now this was announced by Gianni Infantino, the FIFA president, last month, after Trump lost out on the Nobel Peace Prize the one that he really wanted, of course to the Venezuelan opposition activist, Maria Karina Machado, just a few weeks earlier.
Now, Infantino had actually called for Trump to be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize for his efforts in Gaza.
And then in Miami, on the same day that the two men had spoken at this business conference, Infantino declared that the body was launching their own annual version, this FIFA Peace Prize, to award individuals who have taken exceptional and extraordinary actions for peace.
He said.
Now FIFA's given no details about the process for choosing a winner or what criteria will be used, but the recipient is widely expected to be Trump.
It would be a major shock, I think, if he didn't end up being awarded it.
And I think, you know, Trump would say he deserves it for his role in trying to end conflict.
Others would have a very different view and say it's a pretty brazen move frankly, by Infantini designed to curry favor with the president.
How do FIFA officials feel about this new prize?
I'm just kind of curious about this idea of a FIFA Peace Prize seeming to be created out of the blue and, you say, likely directed for President Trump.
It's interesting.
I've just come from a press conference held by civil liberties campaign groups, human rights campaign groups.
Human Rights Watch has written to FIFA, in fact, actually asking them how this came about.
And they believe that the FIFA Council, its main governing body, wasn't consulted.
It wasn't involved in any of the criteria.
And it has been reported that you know senior officials at FIFA are uneasy about this because you know it does mark a departure from tradition for the draw, which is typically, you know, all about football.
And I think it does begin to blur those lines between this sporting organisation and politics.
But Infantino will say it's deserved, if indeed it is Trump, and Trump will no doubt say he deserves it too.
So you've mentioned Gianni Infantino a few times here, and I do want to know a lot more about his personal relationship and friendship with President Trump.
But before we get into that, can you just tell us a little bit about Infantino himself?
Sure.
Who is he?
Where did he come from?
Well, he's the most powerful man in football right now.
But he was born in Switzerland in 1917 to an Italian immigrant family.
He studied law and he joined UEFA, which is Europe's football governing body, in 2000.
He became its secretary general in 2009.
And for years, I remember covering FIFA in those years.
He was very much cast in something of a supporting role to UEFA's president, the former football legend Michel Platini.
But then, in 2016, he managed to maneuver himself into becoming the FIFA president, when he was elected to replace that man, Sepp Blatter, when he was forced to step down.
It was a corruption scandal, right, at the time?
Absolutely, a huge scandal.
It was a massive crisis that the world governing body found itself in.
It had become embroiled and mired in this huge corruption crisis.
Wow.
FIFA in crisis.
Seven senior officials have been arrested in dawn raids at a luxury hotel in Switzerland.
When several football officials were arrested by police in Zurich during the FIFA Congress, one of the biggest moments in that body's history allegations of £97 million in bribes and questions about the Qatar and Russia World Cups.
Now.
It forced Blatter to resign, and it also ended Platini's hopes of succeeding him as the head of FIFA.
Now, both denied wrongdoing, and they've actually since been cleared of corruption charges.
But a path opened up for Infantino, and he seized it.
And at the time, FIFA's image and its reputation was on the floor.
Sponsors were deserting the organisation, they were losing money, they were fighting legal cases.
I want to work with all of you, together with all of you, in order to restore and rebuild a new era in FIFA.
A new era in FIFA where we can put again football in the center of the stage.
He promised to clean up the organization's image and reputation and steer it away from the scandals of the Blatter era.
And so I think when, if I can recall back to 2016, when he came into power, there was a great deal of support for him and a feeling that he did represent something of a clean start.
Can you give us a quick rundown of what the president of FIFA does?
What's the job entail?
Well, he represents football globally.
And he is the leader of an organization that represents more than 200 national associations representing countries around the world.
So, you know, that position has for a long time carried with it a diplomatic element.
He has often cozied up to powerful figures, geopolitical leaders.
So, for example, he did this with the Emir of Qatar, who were the World Cup hosts in 2022.
He did the same with the Crown Prince of Saudi Arabia, who have been awarded the right to stage the World Cup in 2034.
They were unopposed, in fact.
And before that, I remember him being very friendly with Russian President Vladimir Putin doing kickabouts in the Kremlin when they hosted the World Cup in 2018.
And so he has got form.
But I think what we've seen with Trump in recent years is a relationship, an alliance, which probably goes beyond anything we've seen with other leaders that he's encountered in the past.
Well, to that point, I've heard President Trump describe Infantino as my friend for a long time.
How did their friendship begin?
It's interesting, isn't it?
They both were elected in 2016.
So there clearly are parallels in their rise to power, respectively.
And the following year, in 2017, the two men spoke about bidding for the 2026 World Cup.
Trump said that he had been won over by this potential for global interest.
I think it's going to be something really very special.
And Johnny, maybe I'd ask you to say a few words.
And then I think it's after that, the relationship between the two men really develops.
You know, you had Trump hosting Infantino at the White House.
Thanks, President, for welcoming us here.
It's a great honor to be here.
And thanks for everything you are doing to support our sport as well.
That was in Donald Trump's first term.
There is this interim period where we had a different president.
Joe Biden was president from 2020 to 2024.
And I believe Infantino did visit the White House during the Biden years.
But we see this really warm relationship with President Trump.
And we see this.
You know, when Donald Trump was inaugurated for a second term in January of 2025, Infantino was there at the inauguration.
And again it underlines this alignment between the two men and the importance to Infantino of the World Cup here.
And also at that time, the inauguration, bear in mind it was a few months before the Club World Cup.
Now this is this newly expanded tournament.
That again, is another idea of Infantino's to generate more money for FIFA.
The United States hosted... the Club World Cup, right?
Can you remind us of how we may have seen Trump's influence around that and what consequences, if any, that may have had?
Well, there was one very obvious visual example of the sort of Trumpian influence on a sports event and that came at the final where Chelsea, the Premier League team from England London, won.
And Trump presented the trophy, as would be the case with many other sports events and um using, you know, a leader, head of state to do that.
But what would usually happen almost always is that that leader would then, having presented the trophy, leave the podium, leave the stage and allow the limelight to fall on the winning team, but he didn't.
Infantino appeared to try and sort of usher him away as he walked away, but trump wasn't having any of it and and remained in the middle of of the chelsea team to to the sort of confusion and surprise of some of them.
Clearly, what do people make of that moment in the sporting world?
I think it underlines the fact that Trump likes to be the center of attention.
That doesn't come as any surprise, does it?
But I think he does genuinely in this second term he seems to have really noted the potential for sports events of that kind to provide that global exposure on the international stage.
I was at the Ryder Cup a few weeks ago in New York.
And he turned up there as well and didn't just sit and watch from the stands.
He walked down to the first tee and stood literally a few feet from Bryson DeChambeau, one of the US team players, as he teed off.
And I think you know Trump clearly sees an opportunity with sport to appeal to his base, his supporters, and project a certain image to the outside world.
But And I think sport looks upon these things with a degree of unease.
I think a lot of athletes are quite uneasy about this.
And we've seen this play out indeed, during his first term, haven't we in the States where he's invited certain NFL or NBA teams to the White House, winning teams, and some of them haven't wanted to appear because of the controversy over certain policies?
I think what he perhaps has figured is that with football, or soccer as he'd call it, there's not so much opposition potentially for him to get involved in those kind of moments.
Yeah.
So as this relationship between Trump and Infantino has really kind of blossomed, it seems like they're quite close buddies now.
Have there been questions about the depth of that relationship from people within FIFA?
There have, yes.
And a good example of this is when Infantino joined Trump on a tour of the Middle East, and he arrived more than two hours late for his own FIFA Congress in Paraguay.
This was back in May.
And there were UEFA delegates.
That's Europe's football governing body who were furious about this.
In fact, they staged a walkout, those representing Europe.
And they accused the president of prioritizing what they called private political interests, which does the game no service and appears to put its interests second.
Infantino, in response, said that this trip had been crucial as it allowed him to represent football in important discussions with world leaders in Europe, politics and economy.
But, of course, what it does do is it leads to further questions and scrutiny over whether Infantino should be forging this close alliance with a global leader, especially one who is, according to many, as divisive as Trump is.
And I think we have to remember that FIFA does have rules on political interference.
It tells national associations that they shouldn't allow politicians to interfere with their footballing matters.
And And I think, you know, therefore he stands accused of hypocrisy by some.
And I think some officials privately are expressing concern at FIFA and UEFA about this relationship with Trump.
I mean, if we look even beyond May, at that point where it seems like some within FIFA had questions and concerns about Infantino's relationship with Trump, if we move into the fall.
I remember this because I was rather extensively covering the story around Gaza and Israel and the ceasefire peace deal.
And we see Infantino pop up again.
Yeah, this was a summit that was meant to be for world leaders in Egypt, in Sharm el-Sheikh, I think, where the Gaza peace plan was signed.
And then Infantino's photographed on stage.
And I think he was the only sports official at the summit and the only one without a political role.
You know, there he was posing for photographs with Trump and with the Egyptian president.
Well, football's role has to be to support, has to be to unite, has to be to give hope in the region.
He promised to launch a fund to rebuild infrastructure in Palestine to help reconstruct sports fields destroyed in Gaza.
Facilities will help to bring football back together with the Palestinian Football Association in every corner of the country.
Said he'd been invited by Trump again.
But I think again, it just shows that he wants to appear alongside Trump at every opportunity, no matter where it is.
It's interesting.
One human rights group has been really critical of this, saying it was deeply troubling that he'd abandoned Infantino.
All pretense of political neutrality, a neutrality that FIFA itself says it stands for and says it upholds.
You know, and again I think Infantino, if you look at some of the things he's said in the past.
He himself has said that it's important that sport and football are kept apart from politics.
And yet his actions tell a different story and they do jar with that.
So we've been discussing a situation in which Infantino has been trying to promote you could say football, soccer diplomacy on the world stage.
And there have been, at the same time, I will say concerns about how the Trump administration's policies here at home on American soil might impact the actual tournament itself.
Can you talk us through those?
Of course.
Yeah, he's made a series of policy decisions and statements that I think could have a impact on the tournament.
If we think there's going to be the sign of any trouble, I would ask Johnny to move that to a different city.
We have a lot of cities that would love to have it number one and we'll You know.
Last month, at a meeting of the Oval Office, Trump suggested he might even try and move host cities if he has concerns over safety and security.
And he asked Infantino if that could be done.
Johnny, can I say we will move.
I don't think you're going to have this problem, but we're going to move the event to someplace where it's going to be appreciated and safe.
Dan, can I pause on that real quick?
Is it traditional that FIFA would come into an agreement with a host city, for example, like Boston or LA?
Correct.
I think FIFA officially are those who have the contract agreement, the host city agreement, as opposed to the president or the White House.
But nonetheless, this is what he said and it has inevitably caused a great deal of confusion and concern.
And, on the one hand, you know, perhaps it shouldn't come as that big a surprise, given that Trump has made security and Democrat-run cities such a feature of his tenure.
You know, one can only imagine the disruption it would create if you know suddenly that was taken away from them or there was moves to do that.
I think, you know, opponents of Trump view this as another example of sort of him being oppressive.
And I think it's easy to see why there are concerns about what fans might encounter when they come and also about football kind of being associated with these policies.
Today I am signing a new executive order placing travel restrictions on countries including Yemen Somalia Haiti, Libya and numerous others.
In June, Trump signed an executive order banning nationals from 12 countries from entering the US.
As you know,
We will not allow people to enter our country who wish to do us harm, and nothing will stop us from keeping America safe.
That's what I was going to say.
Just in the last couple of days, we've seen the Trump administration announce additional moves, not just on people who've entered the US through asylum, but even looking to review green card applicants.
Basically, there have been additional steps around immigration, security and vetting that they want to take.
Do you have a sense, or has FIFA at all talked about, what that might mean for not just fans but players?
So Iran and Haiti both have qualified for the World Cup.
And both are on that travel ban list.
They are, indeed.
And we don't know who might be added to it.
So you know, this executive order exempted athletes and coaching staff traveling to the World Cup and indeed the Olympics in 2028 and the Paralympics.
But the fans could still face a ban.
You know, and is that fair?
You know, if a country can't have any traveling fans supporting it, is it put at a disadvantage?
Has FIFA directly addressed those concerns?
Lev Infantino has been asked, and he's not going to oppose or criticize Trump.
He just simply says that, you know, security is crucial.
Yeah, I think safety and security is the number one priority for a successful World Cup.
And it's going to be a tournament that welcomes the world.
We said it the very first time we met, Mr President, America welcomes the world.
America will welcome the world here.
But again, it does somewhat jar with these policies.
And indeed last week the Iranian Football Federation said that they wouldn't be sending anybody to the draw after a lack of visa guarantees for their delegates.
Trump has previously said that, you know, Iran is the source of terrorism around the world.
And that's what lies behind the justification for this decision.
But you know it's not reassuring for those countries involved that officials have already been denied visas for just the the draw, let alone for the actual real thing.
And I think another issue is that some countries whose teams have already qualified have very long wait times for visa appointments.
There are certain countries where, if you're applying for a US visa, you're having to wait almost a year for an appointment.
Now The White House has announced that US embassies will give visa appointment priority to fans with tickets.
But it's unclear still whether these new rules will cover ticket holders from countries that are effectively banned from traveling to the US.
And I think also you know this anti-immigrant crackdown that we've seen, it has appeared to have extended to football.
ICE and Border Patrol agents are likely to be at matches, according to their social media posts.
Customs and Border Protection posting, let the games begin.
CPP will be suited and booted, ready to provide security for the first round of games.
Because we have had occasions with ICE agents attending matches during the Club World Cup.
In fact, some human rights groups have given examples of people being arrested and taken away while attending that event.
Instead of enjoying the day watching football with his 10- and 14-year-old sons, the father, an asylum seeker, was arrested, turned over to ICE, held for three months in New Jersey's Delaney Hall detention facility and then deported.
And so I think, you know, that is a concern and it may well deter certain fans from coming.
So these are all examples of potential impacts.
And then you've got the tension that exists with the co-hosts.
I mean, it was only recently that Trump said he might launch strikes, as he put it, against Mexico in order to stop drugs from being trafficked into the US.
And we've had the trade...
Tariff tension with Canada as well, the other co-hosts, and Mexico indeed.
And so it does create some concern, given the rhetoric and given the tension that exists between Trump and these two neighbors.
Is it unusual for FIFA to work closely with a government to put on the World Cup?
Or is that typical of what FIFA has done for previous World Cups?
It is.
There has to be a degree of collaboration with the host country.
But I think this feels, as we've discussed, closer than ever.
But would FIFA agree if he demanded it?
I mean, given the closeness of the two men, it is quite difficult to imagine Infantino kind of standing up to Trump.
And I think this is one of the concerns with this very close relationship is does he have the ability to actually object to certain things if he has to?
Certainly, FIFA officials and executives, when they've been asked, have sort of downplayed it and they've made the point that it's FIFA's jurisdiction and that FIFA would make such a decision rather than Trump.
I think it's fair to say Dan, a lot of Americans are really excited about the World Cup coming here.
Soccer has been growing, I think, and its popularity here.
You know, it's certainly my kids are any metric.
They are very excited about this all.
But one thing I find really interesting is that soccer has been so popular around the world for so long, certainly amongst you Brits.
What's the reaction been here to this global institution FIFA, that is supposed to be apolitical now, not just coming to the United States, not just courting Trump, but it seems ostensibly potentially using a vehicle like the FIFA Peace Prize to flatter the United States president?
What does this mean?
What has the reaction around the world been?
I think those who have been following FIFA politics closely are maybe worn down somewhat by instances like this.
And what for people who don't follow football may appear outlandish or brazen.
Those of us who have been following FIFA for a long time are kind of used to it, really.
And if you look at the way Infantino has treated world leaders, whether it's Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Russia and now the US, it is consistent.
But I do think that the draw will help reveal further the closeness of that relationship.
The awarding of the Peace Prize, for example, the fact that they'll play Trump's favorite song on stage, the fact that he'll be there at all.
And I think more and more people will kind of wake up to this and ask what it means.
It's clearly mutually beneficial to both parties.
Trump wants a really major moment to project his image.
The Football World Cup provides it.
Infantino needs a really lucrative tournament.
The North American tournament provides it.
Whether this is a PR exercise or whether it's genuinely based on mutual admiration and affection.
Who knows?
I think it's going to be tested in the coming months and indeed during the tournament itself.
But I do think major questions will hang over this tournament because of that.
How well-concerned visitors will be, whether host cities could be changed.
And I think there is this danger that an organisation that's meant to be politically neutral could become too politicised, that there is this blurring of sport and diplomacy, that this alignment between FIFA and MAGA, between Infantino and Trump, really undermines this insistence that football exists beyond politics.
And if you talk to civil liberties groups, as I have, and human rights groups here in the US, they do say that FIFA risks becoming a stage to authoritarianism.
Then it could undermine the integrity of the tournament.
FIFA insists, as does Trump, that this is going to be a unifying event that's going to welcome the world.
But unless that's proven, then I guess those words could prove hollow.
But I think Trump needs this event to go well, and that may also partly explain why he's developed this relationship with his counterpart at FIFA headquarters.
Well, we will see how it all pans out.
Dan, thank you so much for joining us.
And good luck covering the draw.
Thank you.
I'm sure it'll be exciting.
I'm sure it will.
That was Dan Rowan, the BBC sports editor.
You can follow all the live coverage of the World Cup draw at bbc.com.
And if you want to hear more about international tournaments, take a listen back to our episode from last week on the scandal hit Miss Universe and what it says about modern femininity.
The producers on our episode today were Sam Chantarassak and Arun Keller.
This episode was edited by Bridget Harney and engineered by Travis Evans.
I'm Asma Khalid, and folks, that is it for today's episode of The Global Story.
Thanks as always for listening, and we hope you have a great weekend.
