Hey everyone, I'm Andrea Canning and we are talking Dateline.
Then we'll answer some of your questions that you had and comments from social media.
And there were a lot.
Blaine, thank you for sharing Jay's story with the world.
Yeah, of course.
Of course.
I really, really enjoyed telling the story and getting to know him while reporting on this.
Yeah.
I feel like we all really got to know Jay from your story and then some.
I mean, that was one of the best datelines I've seen getting a glimpse into that person's life.
You know, it was very rich.
Could you just recap the story for us first?
Jay Lee was a young man from Jackson, Mississippi.
He went to Ole Miss.
He graduated in three years, and he was preparing to enter grad school.
And he was just—I don't even know if vibrant can capture who he was, but he's somebody who lived life to the fullest.
He was an out-and-proud gay man.
I mean, he was very, very well-known in the LGBTQ community.
He was just very vivacious, but also had this— desire to give back to communities.
I mean, I think one of the details that really struck me was that on the day that he disappeared he was set to hold a baby formula drive.
It was something that he had organized, and then he went missing.
And that was one of the big clues that let his friends know okay, something's going on, because he would never miss this.
So he goes missing.
It was his mom's birthday.
And he didn't call her.
And so immediately his mom knew, okay, something's wrong.
They reach out to Ole Miss police and police go look at his apartment.
They come across security video that shows that he left his apartment, came back and then left again early in the morning.
And they noticed that he's holding his cell phone like this, right?
The same way that we would all hold our cell phone if we're talking to someone on speaker.
Mm-hmm.
And police put together this case that Tim Harrington ultimately killed.
Jay Lee, strangled him to death in his apartment, wrapped his body in moving blankets and duct tape and dumped him about an hour and a half outside of Ole Miss because he was concerned that he was going to out him as being gay.
Wow.
And in the first trial.
The first trial ended in a mistrial because one juror just couldn't get over the fact that there was no body.
Investigators still hadn't found Jaylee's body.
Not too long after that though Andrea, they found Jaylee's body, and they were headed for a second trial, and he took a plea deal.
I mean goodness, he put the family out of their misery.
From that perspective, you know, from having to sit through a trial again, from having to go through all of that.
And it spared Jaylee's mom from having to testify again, Miss Stephanie.
She would have had to take the stand again.
Blaine, you know all these missing persons cases.
You know they start with a text that doesn't go answered a phone call that doesn't get returned.
And everyone feels the same, I think, in the beginning.
Like, oh, they're busy.
They'll get back to me.
And then in this case, and eventually, sadly, In a lot of these cases, they don't.
In this case it was interesting because right off the bat this hit me because Miss Stephanie's birthday is July 8th, which is my dad's birthday.
And so I thought right away I was like the first thing on my mind on July 8th when I wake up, I have to call my dad.
You know, this is a special day.
You don't ever forget your parents' birthday.
And so you know.
It was just so understandable that a mom with a son like Jay would expect that phone call very quickly.
That's exactly it.
So it's funny you say that.
My birthday is July 9th.
And so I thought like, okay, like as a mom, like that just hit me too, right?
From like a mother's perspective.
Yes, this was an incredibly close family.
I mean, talking, texting every day throughout the day, which again, college kids.
Kids, you don't typically see that with their parents, right?
And so for on her birthday of all days, he's like radio silent.
She immediately said, oh, no, no, no, no, this isn't right.
In fact she and her husband, Mr Jimmy, they were driving down to Biloxi to kind of just go on a little vacation.
And she said, no, turn the car around.
We need to go to Oxford.
We need to go check on him because something is wrong when she kept calling him and when his location was off.
She just knew immediately.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mother's intuition.
Yes.
And you know what I love the most is Jay.
Being gay, his father being a pastor, you know that he was so accepted by his family.
And I love what the dad said, be who you are or nothing at all.
I mean, I think that this – there were so many aspects of this that you could look at this story and just have a bunch of stereotypes, right?
Like, this is the South.
These are very – I mean, very, you know, God-fearing religious family.
Dad's a minister.
All of these many things.
And again like – you know, being African American, like a lot of times like this, you know when you're looking at, especially when it comes to religion in the Black community, like not typically and historically very accepting of the LGBTQ community.
And so all of these things, though, that was not the case with the Lee family.
I mean, Jay had no fear in being who he was.
It did not impact his relationship with his mom or his dad or sister or anybody in the family.
And they were just as beautiful and as loving.
And I asked Tayla during our interview, we talked for like three plus hours.
And I said, where did that confidence come from?
And she said it was our family.
I mean, we knew that we were loved.
There was not a moment that we walked outside of that house, that we had any question as to whether we were loved, whether we were supported.
And she said and especially their mom, really instilled this confidence and just kind of like no no no, this is whoever you are.
Whatever you do, do it confidently.
And it was so beautiful to see that really, really come to play.
As I got to know Jay, throughout the course of the story.
He was very clearly a fun person, right?
His style was amazing.
I mean, his sister and I talked about it.
Like, he would dress.
He was just out there.
And his dog alone.
His dog, Lexi.
Yes.
I mean, the dog with the pink goggles.
Yes.
Lexi would come to class.
Lexi was, I mean, Lexi was just an icon, right?
But yes, he performed in drag shows.
We actually went to one of the shows where he would have performed in the course of shooting this, which was a fun and amazing experience.
You have all these like young college students.
And then we walked in with our cameras and we're decidedly older than college.
And so, I mean, they were kind.
You look like you're in college, so.
He blended right in.
I'm jealous.
It was just funny.
It was hilarious to be in the midst of it.
But it was cool to just see his world and see his community and everybody being there.
It was really special.
Yeah.
If we all could have that much confidence, you know.
That's true.
I'm sure people saw him and thought, you know, I can –
I can do this.
His friend Jose, actually told me Jose, who we met in the story.
Told me that it was Jay Lee who inspired him to go perform in drag shows, inspired him to be open, you know kind of about who he was.
So he really was a beacon for a lot of people right there in Oxford.
When we come back, we've got an extra clip from Blaine's interview with Jay's parents.
You know, the thing that I thought early on was I thought, could this be a hate crime?
Right?
It's, you know, it's interesting.
And I thought about this, too.
When I spoke with Jose and Braylon, they talked about the fact that before Jay Lee went missing, there were two murders of transgender people there in the state of Mississippi.
And so they were thinking, okay, like what is happening?
Like could this be an attack on the community?
And so it did kind of put a lot of people in this kind of place of just fear and like trying to watch out, while at the same time wondering if police were going to do anything about this.
I know that that was a big concern for friends and family as to how the police would handle this because, you know, Jay is a person of color.
Jay is gay.
But it was the opposite reaction from the police, the Oxford police chief.
He was...
Mr. Emotional and Mr. I'm not quitting until I solve this case.
And I'm like, he was amazing.
When it comes to emotion, Andrea, you know this.
I mean when we interview like police chiefs prosecutors, like all these folks, it's not often that you get to see like just true emotion tears from them, right.
But like that happened several times when I was speaking with Chief McCutcheon.
Certainly happened when I was talking with Ben Creekmore, the DA.
I mean, they were tearing up thinking about the moment that they found Jaylee's body, the pain that the family went through.
And you know, Several things.
One, Oxford is a college town, right?
Like everything revolves around Ole Miss.
And so you think about OK, like either I have college age kids or my kids will one day be in college, or you can kind of just put yourself in this feeling of, oh my God, I don't know where my child is when they've gone off to college.
And I think any parent can kind of identify with that.
And that's a terrifying thought.
Yeah.
I also think that for Chief McCutcheon and Mr. Jimmy, Jay's dad, faith really bonded them.
I mean, they both talked about times that they would pray together.
They both talked about times when, I mean, the police really put a lot into this.
The chief told me at one point OK, it's like we're going to take an ibuprofen, get some rest, and then we're going to get right back at it.
Like they were going around the cough, drink some coffee, you know, and we're going at it.
And so they were putting their heart and soul into this.
And it gets hard for them.
They weren't able to find Jay, right, or bring his remains home.
And so we saw this kind of back and forth where they were really leaning on each other through the course of this.
And I have to say one thing that's interesting, that didn't make it into our story Chief McCutcheon had actually met Jay Lee at one point, about six months before he disappeared.
Yes.
He told me that there was this kind of roundtable that they had for community leaders, and Jay was doing an internship at Child Protective Services there in Oxford.
So Jay was part of this meeting.
And he comes in, he sits down, and the chief said immediately his personality was just on display.
He He was like, I'm J. Lee.
Who are you?
OK, great.
I mean, just talking to people like this is what we're going to do for the kids.
And he said that left a mark on him.
And so then when the missing persons case came in, he said, oh, my God, like, I know this kid.
I remember him.
Right.
And so you put all these things together.
And yes, it was it was certainly something that was emotional.
I was like cheering him on, you know, as you took us through this investigation.
He just he's an amazing man.
Yeah.
And also some really good, there was really good detective work in this case as well.
Good observations.
I wouldn't have noticed the phone.
You know, when I watched it I didn't think about the phone being, you know, flat like that, that he was on the phone with somebody.
And then we get into, you know, the technology of it all.
And we hear this over and over and over again these police departments, families trying to get messages, information from social media platforms like Snapchat, and they get shut down again and again, and again.
And I just did a Dateline where they had to hire – they hired some professor who was essentially like a hacker, you know professor slash hacker who like got into it or whatever.
And so I was so – impressed with Jay's parents and this Jay Lee bill that they're working on.
I mean, I can't think of a better way to honor his life, if they can get this passed, that you know that law enforcement can get access to you know to people under 21 into their social media accounts and beyond.
I mean, that is so smart.
It is.
It is.
And to I would say it seems like a common sense type of thing, because if you want to find where a young person is not to sound old, if you're trying to find a young person, but social media is the way,
I mean, right?
Like he was communicating through Snapchat, the way that most of us would communicate via text, right.
And so that is easily the quickest digital footprint, the quickest way to figure out where they are, who they've been talking to, what they've been doing.
And you know, in talking with Mr Jimmy he was just like this was a constant, just source of torture for them, because they knew something had happened.
It wasn't this question of oh gosh, maybe he's – no, they were like something's happened to our child.
Yeah.
They're waiting day after day after day after day.
They want to bring him home.
And they're fighting this kind of battle of we know our son is always online.
We know he's always out here posting.
Let us get access and we can tell you exactly what happened.
And that was just so hard for them.
It's not like anybody's asking for hey.
We need to just be able to get into everybody's social media at all times.
No.
If a person goes missing and they're underage right, and we're talking about a missing person's case where days count, where moments count, hours count.
Then let us in.
So we'll certainly be following it, though.
I look forward to a follow up on that.
So you know it was.
Khaled said something that was quite the foreshadow when he told Jay that stay away from the deals, you know the downloads, because they're trouble, he said.
And you know you can see that right on one hand, because you're not – one of the things about Jay is that he was his authentic self and that's why he was happy.
Yeah.
When I always – you know, I believe – how can you be happy if you can't be your true self?
Yeah.
Not only that, you're living in a constant state of fear that somebody is going to discover who your true self is.
And so what does that do to your –
What does that do to your nervous system?
What does that do to the way that you walk through life?
If you're always waiting on a domino to fall, for your secret to be exposed, for this kind of carefully created facade that you've put up to just completely be shattered.
I was struck, Andrea, by the incredible parallels between Jay Lee and Tim Harrington.
Both of them from Mississippi.
Both of them go to Ole Miss.
Both of them headed to grad school.
Both of them had bright futures.
Like, let's be very, very clear.
Jay Lee and Tim Harrington.
I mean, Tim Harrington.
Tim, too.
Yes.
Started a moving company.
He's got a profitable little business.
He's on podcasts.
He's in interviews.
He's in the Black Student Union.
He's kind of that kid that you know when you get to college you're like oh, who's the upperclassman that I look up to?
Oh, he was one of those people, right?
I mean.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Spent time in his church, influential father, influential grandfather, this whole package.
And again, very similar to Jay Lee, families rooted in faith.
Both fathers were ministers, right?
Like all of this going on.
Very, very similar.
And there was a very big difference in that Jay was living authentically and Tim Harrington was not.
And that made all of the, that really made all the difference.
And the fact that their lives intersected in the way that they did was just unbelievable.
Yeah.
I think that there's so much to be said about, yes, being your authentic self.
And I think that In this fear that that message that, you know, he confessed, set him off.
I want to be able to say that I had you on the down low.
It's the question of, gosh, what are people going to think of me?
What are my family's going to think of me?
And of course, I'm not inside Tim Harrington's mind.
I didn't speak with him.
Of course, we tried to.
His parents, his mom actually sent me a brief email and just said we're going to let you know the attorney, speak for our family and certainly understand what they're going through.
Right.
Like this is a very difficult situation for them as well.
So the biggest problem, as you mentioned Blaine, off the top, was that they had not found a body, right?
They had not found Jay's body in the beginning, of course.
Then they make that horrible discovery.
And we have some extra sound from Jay's parents their interview with you about finding Jay's body, their son and what happened after that.
Sure.
You talked about once Jay was found, even just by his skeleton, you could tell that was your son.
And you were very intentional about wanting to say your own goodbye to him, touching his remains.
Can you tell me a little bit more about that?
Well, you know, we oftentimes I don't know probably you know in most religions about this Pentecost.
You know, oftentimes you know they touch on the forehead prayer.
They just let them touch his forehead and you know, you want to know that I love him.
And, you know, you want to make sure, you know, I see you.
You know he knew.
You know he knew that mom and dad love them and the rest of the family love them.
You know, sometimes we can't always get what we want.
I would love to have seen him grow up and you know the more and do things in, you know, within this country or abroad, you know just.
I felt like I had confidence that he was going to be extremely successful.
I mean maybe you know, just a dad just got a lot of confidence in his son or whatever, but I just believed he was going to be definitely somebody.
I think he was just what God wanted him to be.
And he touched people's lives.
He made a difference.
And I think for you guys, he's going to continue to make a difference.
And he will—I do feel he will make a difference with this possible bill that will help other young people who go missing.
Wasn't that just the most heart-wrenching thing though, to hear him say—I mean basically, he's saying that he kissed— the skeletal remains of his son, right?
In this like, I want him to know that he's loved.
I want him to feel that he's loved.
And so again this through line of just like this deep love that these parents have for their kids, that was right there until the end.
And I think that one was one where I've done now a good number of just these interviews.
That one just really touched me when he said that like gave me chills and kind of just rocked me in my core, because I can't imagine just a father having like this is all that's physically left of your child and wanting to still show that love and that embrace.
Absolutely.
I think that –
Them telling Jaylee's story.
I know was something that was difficult for them, but I'm so grateful that they did, because they really were able to bring him to life in such a way.
Yeah.
I was going to say the same thing.
I'm so glad they did.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That put me back to my first job, which was in Mississippi.
It was fun to hear again Miss Stephanie, because I remember when I moved to Mississippi everything was Miss Andrea, Miss Andrea.
And I was like, I'm not used to that.
I've never heard anyone in my life call me Miss Andrea.
But that's how people would address me, which was hilarious thing is.
Mind you, i don't do that in every interview, but it was just something about sitting down.
They just gave them i just like you can't just be stephanie, you're miss stephanie, you're mr jimmy, it's just.
I love that.
I love it.
I also said i also love how you said it was something.
I wrote it down.
It was like oh, full boil with Tim right in the interview room, because usually I say it's getting hot in the kitchen and you came up with full boil.
So I'm like, okay, good.
We've both got our ways that we want to say when things are getting hot.
Exactly, exactly.
We're going to take a short break and we'll be back to talk about your questions and comments from social media.
Thank you.
Let's talk about some of the social media comments and our viewers' comments and questions.
Would love to.
You know we got so many comments from people on this one, people saying they're moved to tears about the story.
What a great job you all did.
So let's start with Barbara Teed.
She says there was another Dateline episode about an officer on the DL, married with a baby, had an affair with a gay resident.
He stopped on patrol and murdered him when he threatened to expose him.
Oh, gosh.
Yeah, this was Keith's episode before Daylight.
Okay.
And this was a Missouri college student named Jesse James Valencia, murdered in 2004 by the police officer he was secretly seeing.
So this, again, goes back to the dangers of DL, what Khaled, you know, talked about.
Yeah.
I've got to say, too, real quick, along those lines.
So this was an episode.
I actually had a watch party, if you will, of a bunch of maybe like 30 35 friends came together and we all watched it because I really wanted to get people's reaction.
I wanted to see how people received it.
And I have to say, when the download thing, when Khalid mentioned that everybody was like oh like, people were kind of like oh, we know where this is going.
It's going to be somebody who's you know, who's closeted, who's not trying to like people.
Just saw that conversation.
And also we just want to say not everyone who's in the closet is bad or has rage issues, or you know.
We're not trying to say that.
This is like all people who are not ready to be their authentic self.
Yes.
But we just are saying it happens.
I'm very glad you made that point because that's very important.
Yes.
Yeah.
Winston at Pee Wee.
Winston said what I was thinking no body, no DNA.
You know, definitely like there was some reasonable doubt there.
I mean, there were a lot of things, you know, that they didn't have before the body was found.
Yeah.
I think that you know, even if there's no body, sometimes you can look and say okay, there were traces of blood.
There was nothing.
There was no physical evidence.
And, you know, I mean, they summed it up perfectly.
How do you, you know, convince a jury of murder when you can't even prove that someone is dead conclusively?
Like a judge had declared Jay Lee dead at that point, had legally declared him dead.
But again, no body, no traces of DNA, anything like that.
I should point out too, there was a significant amount of time almost two weeks, about 10 days or so between when he went missing and when police ultimately questioned Tim Harrington.
And so police have said that was a lot of time for him to be able to disinfect his truck, clean things out, like clean away any traces of whatever may have been there.
And so that's what they pointed to.
But at the end of the day, yes, a tremendous amount of reasonable doubt for sure.
Yeah.
Nasty Smith said, I knew the duct tape would nail him.
Leah Jarrett Hedgepeth on Facebook asks, what happened to his doggie?
Oh, Lexi.
Lexi went to live with Taylor, Jay's sister, and lived actually.
This is unbelievable, but she brought Lexi to Oxford for our interview.
And we were supposed to meet Lexi, but things went over.
And then we said, okay, we'll meet her next week when we come back to Jackson.
She died.
Lexi died.
Aww.
Three days after our interview, completely unexpected, and we were going to meet her.
But she lived a long life.
She was 23 years old.
That is a long life for a little dog like that.
And also, given the family's feelings about God and religion, Jaylee and Lexi are together again.
Mm-hmm.
Yes, absolutely.
Absolutely.
Absolutely. and on our podcast, After the Verdict.
And she says I'm grateful the Dateline community gets to see these officers caring, good humans doing the right things and the right way for the right reasons.
Most that wear the badge are good humans.
Grateful these particular humans were on this case.
Thank you.
I'm glad to hear that, Lisa.
Thank you for writing that because you're right.
I mean, like we said earlier, I'm so glad that we were able to just really shine a light on their heart through this process.
Of course, their investigative prowess, their work, all of that, but just show their heart in who they were and the type of emotion and genuine caring that they brought to this case.
And on a different note, Dateline will be off for the next few weeks for the Winter Olympics.
And Amy Gatch on Facebook asked with the Olympics airing for the next few weeks, what will you do during this time?
Will you take time off or work on other stories?
Time off?
Time off?
What is this you speak of?
What?
We will be working.
We will be, gosh, shooting.
I know I've got shoots.
I'm sure you have shoots coming up.
Oh, yeah.
I mean, it's what we do, right?
Just keep working.
And then as soon as the Olympics are over, we'll be back at you with new episodes.
That's what we're doing.
We're working in the off time to make sure that we've got all the new episodes ready to go.
Just fire them out the gate.
Exactly.
Blaine, thank you for this.
I want to say very special dateline because it really was.
A lot of ground was covered in a lot of different societal issues with this one.
So thank you.
That means a lot to me, Andrea.
It really does.
So that's what we hoped to do.
So I really appreciate you saying that.
Thank you.
That's it for Talking Dateline this week.
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