I'm Gilbert Cruz, and this is the Sunday Special.
We're spending this last couple of episodes of the year looking back on some of the big cultural moments of 2025.
Today, we're talking movies.
I have two extremely knowledgeable colleagues here with me.
Alyssa Wilkinson is a movie critic at The Times.
Hello, Alyssa.
Hello, Gilbert.
And Nicole Sperling reports on the movie business.
And she joins us from Los Angeles very appropriately.
Welcome, Nicole.
Hello.
How's it going, guys?
It is going great.
So, in the grand and very long tradition of movie podcasts, I am going to start with an incendiary question that probably has no clear answer.
Is this the last year for movies?
No.
It better not be.
We'll be out of a job.
Come on, Gilbert.
Absolutely not.
The pipeline is full.
We have no idea what will happen when this massive deal closes, whoever becomes the buyer.
And we can, of course, talk about all that stuff.
But no, we've got movies.
People go to movies.
It still is a business.
People love movies.
People love movies.
We all love movies.
Nicole, you're referring to the deal.
When you say the deal, you're talking about the Warner Brothers deal.
Who's going to end up with Warner Brothers in the end?
Is it going to be Netflix?
Is it going to be Paramount?
We're definitely going to talk about that.
But I want to spend most of this episode talking about the actual actual movies.
And we'll get into Wither Netflix.
Alyssa, you put out your list of the best movies of 2025.
So I want to start with your number one movie.
Possibly it was also my number one movie, even though no one cares about my list.
This is One Battle After Another.
Pat and Eyelash.
Good morning.
There are no hands on the clock.
Why?
Because they're not needed.
Why?
What time is it?
You know, I don't remember that part.
Let's just not nitpick over the password stuff.
Look, this is Bob Ferguson, all right?
Paul Thomas Anderson's film starring Leonardo DiCaprio, Sean Penn, Tiana Taylor, Chase Infinity.
Tell us very quickly what the movie is about and then tell us why you loved it.
So One Battle After Another is about a lot of things, but I guess in brief, it's about a group of revolutionaries who wind up going into hiding, and then it kind of jumps forward.
And it's about the daughter of one of the revolutionaries kind of gets embroiled in a I don't want to spoil it, for people gets embroiled in something.
I'm not gay, if that's what you're saying.
I didn't say that.
I'm not a homosexual.
I did not say that, but I see the lifts in your shoes.
Oh, you are a smartass.
And there's a lot of running around that occurs.
Really what it's about, as the name kind of suggests, is that every generation has to fight its own battles.
And every generation of activists tries to kind of idealistically win and then winds up handing off their battle to the next generation.
But yeah, so it's.
You know, it's only very loosely based on a Reagan-era Thomas Pynchon novel Vineland.
But it's been updated to the present.
And I love this movie for a lot of reasons.
One of them is that I love all of Paul Thomas Anderson's movies without fail.
You're in the bag.
I... Yeah, it's very hard for me to not love PTA.
But I also think that this one just feels very assured.
It's got amazing performances.
It's just... It's a beautiful film.
And it's also thrilling and exciting and compelling and all of those things.
So...
I have yet to run into anyone who saw it and didn't think it was terrific. in one way or another.
Nicole, are you that person who did not think it was terrific?
No, I loved it.
I enjoyed it so much and walked out of it and said, well, that's our best picture winner.
And I still think that's the case.
It's interesting because from a business standpoint, it's a challenge, right?
It was an expensive movie.
It was Paul Thomas Anderson's largest budget.
It made $70 million domestically.
It made $200 worldwide, which sounds like a lot of money.
But when you factor in the marketing costs...
And you factor in that they split revenue with the theaters.
This is not a huge win at the box office.
Yet, this is a movie that will have a long life.
Because if you didn't see it in theaters, you're going to see it when it hits HBO Max.
You're going to see it after the Oscar run that it goes on.
This is a movie that's going to live in our culture for a long time.
And so there's the argument to be made that sometimes...
You know, studios need to take these risks to make big original films.
It doesn't happen that much anymore.
And these are the kind of movies we should be supporting if we want to see more of them.
And if it's any sign of what the movie business is going through right now, it's unlikely we're going to get a lot more movies like this one.
Yeah.
I loved this movie so much.
And...
I can't wait to see it like four more times.
You know what's amazing about it, too?
It's increasingly rare, I think, for movies to instantly give us a few phrases or memes that everybody kind of latches onto and talks about.
And this one, there's a line that Benicio Del Toro says.
I've had a few.
A few what?
He says he's had a few small beers and this is cropped up as like a wonderful little sort of marketing tactic.
But I've even seen art house cinemas starting to post things saying like come down and have a few small beers with us.
Yeah.
And I love that.
You know, that's that's great writing or great directing.
That's great.
That's a great film.
Did you go to the culture department holiday party?
I sure did.
What did you have to drink?
We had a few small beers.
I'd love to talk about another absolutely fantastic movie that came out this year from the same studio.
We're going to be talking a lot about Warner Brothers, maybe not ironically, which was Sinners.
I thought y'all was dead set on buying the place.
More time I spend with y'all, the less sure I am you boys are serious about it.
Ain't no boys here.
I just grown men who grown men money and grown men bullets.
This is a movie that has stayed all year in the conversation for, you know, this is one of the better movies of the year, let alone big studio Hollywood movies of the year.
And it's one that potentially is going to be in the awards hunt.
It made a ton of money.
Nicole, do you want to tell us about sinners?
Yes.
So Sinners is from director Ryan Coogler, who we know from Black Panther and from Fruitvale Station back from the beginning of his career.
He has been able to make both arthouse movies and big movies.
It's a vampire movie.
It's also a movie about racism.
It's also a movie that has a ton of music in it.
And it's really sexy and fun.
And it's a really good time at the movies.
And what's crazy about it is it's also completely original, never been heard of before.
It made $280 million in the U.S.
It's in the top 10 of the box office, which no one ever would have predicted.
If you had seen the lineup of movies that were coming out this year, no one would have ever said yes Sinners, that's going to be in the top 10.
Never would have thought that.
It's a massive hit.
Michael B. Jordan's fantastic in it.
He plays two characters.
He should win.
Who does he win for?
Both.
Yes, he's amazing.
Good question.
The movie's tremendous and it's really fun.
And it is another example of a studio taking a risk.
It's really kind of amazing that they scored with two really original, very different films from auteurs really at the top of their game making really good movies.
Sinners was a sort of top 10 box office hit for the year.
It also was in an equally important top 10.
It was in your top 10.
And so this is important, because the movie came out in April and it's been on people's televisions available to see.
And it was a sold out public screening in the middle of the day.
So this movie is still making money in the theater.
That's how popular it is.
Which I just think is tremendous.
There was also a moment this summer where I felt like every bar I went to had sinners playing on the television in the corner.
I've been at a lot of dinner parties where people have argued over what it is about and what it means.
I just thought this is a genuine... cultural phenomenon.
And how impressive is Ryan Coogler for being able to make the studio do this?
That's as Nicole was saying.
It's very hard to get a studio to let you have this kind of creative control.
Both of these films, One Battle After Another and Sinners, are both WB movies.
They're both Warner Brothers films.
And obviously, the sale of Warner Brothers is the big entertainment story of the year.
Nicole, you went on The Daily earlier this month when the news actually broke and talked about your reporting around that.
I'd encourage our listeners to go check that out.
The thing that I'm thinking about is that this comes at the end of an incredible wild year for Warner Brothers.
We're all focusing on what's happening now.
But if you look at the arc of how this company and we're talking about this company on this podcast because of the movies they put out
If you look at their arc, it's it's been fascinating.
Can you remind us where we were with Warner Brothers at the beginning of this year?
Yes.
And specifically about the movie studio itself, because it's run by Mike DeLuca and Pam Abdi.
They're the co-chairmen of the studio.
And they, at the beginning of the year, were facing this crisis sentiment that I think had been prompted by insiders at the studio that were suggesting that they were gonna be out at any moment.
They had a rough 2024, a rough end of 2024, where they had Furiosa.
Then they had Todd Phillips' Joker sequel, which I really put that whole movie out of my mind so quickly.
Anyway, sidebar.
And so there was rumors that they were getting canned at any time.
And it was really like the drumbeat for it was really loud.
And it was kind of really harsh.
It just felt really kind of mean.
And this was right up until Minecraft came out.
Yeah.
And then Minecraft was this big, huge hit that I don't think a lot of people expected.
It prompted all these memes.
People were throwing stuff in theaters, which I'm sure the theater owners were super pleased about.
But it became like a big thing where everyone had to show up and go and kids were showing up at movie theaters.
This was a Minecraft movie.
It came out two weeks before Sinners, early April, based on sort of open world game.
And it was just a box office sensation.
It was.
It's the number one movie of the year.
So that happened.
Then they had Sinners, which on paper, again, was not going to be a box office hit.
You know it's an expensive kind of art housey kind of movie because it had a lot to say and had all these things.
And then that, again, a huge hit.
They have had this string of massive hits all through the year.
They had weapons and they had final destination and we should talk, we could talk about all these movies and suddenly this movie studio has had just a run that we haven't seen in in this business in a while from one studio.
And then, of course, superman 2, which not superman 2, but superman also, which superman as well, superman as well which was also a massive hit.
They had this incredible run And it's still going and Oscars is likely going to go in their favor.
They did really well at the Golden Globe nominations.
And so we, you know, have this crazy success story for a company that is now going to be either part of Netflix or part of Paramount in the next 12 to 18 months, whenever and if this deal gets done.
You mentioned a lot of movies there.
I think we should dig into some of them.
I think so.
Minecraft movie aside, which, again, biggest hit of the year.
I took my son to see it.
Chicken jockey for life, et cetera, et cetera.
I'd love to talk about Superman.
Which we love.
There's a code to close the rift, but it's too complicated to hack.
Luthor will have the code at Luthor Corp.
Just give me a minute, I'll get Krypto and we'll go... You brought that dog, man!
Yeah, I didn't want him killing my parents' cows came out uh, mid-july.
This was um, directed and written by james gunn who, in addition to you know, being the the creative mind behind this movie, is also now the creative mind behind the entire dc comic book project and universe at warner brothers.
I mean one thing, that?
Okay.
So i loved this movie to the extent that i believe i put a critic's pick on it when i reviewed it.
Um, I just enjoyed watching it.
It has a very funny sense of humor and it has a visual sense, too.
I mean, several of the of the best jokes in it are actually visual gags.
And I knew where I was all the time when there were fight scenes, which I can't say for virtually any Marvel movie.
But also one thing I loved about.
This movie and what it indicated to me is something James Gunn has said in his taking over of this, which is that we will make the movies when I feel like the screenplay is ready.
And I have not always felt that out of Marvel.
Sometimes it's felt like they're making the movie because well, they have to get the next puzzle piece in place, because they've got a production schedule to stay on.
They have those events where they announce all the dates and it's like This is when this movie is coming out.
This is when this movie is coming out.
And, you know, we don't know what movie is coming out in this state, but there will be a movie.
There will be a movie on this day.
And so, you know, for me, that signals someone who's thinking about these as films.
And you know ironically, the times I've felt that in the Marvel Universe it's been like the movie directed by ryan coogler right, um.
So this one just feels like a movie that has thoughts in its head and it's, you know, saying something.
It actually says something real and you know, as soon as i saw it and i'm sure you know you felt the same way i thought oh, this is going to kick up controversy.
It did, and it still went on to make a ton of money.
How are you not mentioning the dog?
Oh, and the dog, of course.
Barry the lead.
Crypto.
Crypto the dog.
Crypto with a K. He's such a good boy.
I'm so sorry, Crypto.
He's such a good boy.
Oh, he is the best dog.
Yes, I'm sure Crypto was responsible for at least $300 million of the box office returns.
Nicole, what is going to happen to...
It's going to be a nice little tile on Netflix's home screen.
No, we don't know.
Yeah.
This is kind of their reboot.
As you said, they're under new leadership with James Gunn and Peter Safran.
And so far, so good.
They're showing that they are making movies.
That people want to see, and Supergirl is the next one on the list.
That is part of the reason why Warner Brothers is an attractive acquisition, because they do have a huge library of assets, including the whole DC universe is one of them.
And so that's why Paramount wants them, and that's why Netflix wants them.
I mean Netflix has said that they're going to keep Warner Brothers' theatrical operation going, going and they are going to keep putting movies in theaters.
We have no idea how long that will last.
And we have no idea how committed they are, even though they are saying so because they have never been big fans of the theatrical movie going experience.
They want movies to come to their platform as quickly as possible.
And, you know, they're saying all the right things to get the deal done.
And then the answer will And we also don't know who's going to be the buyer.
So if they get it, we'll cross that bridge when we get there.
There's so, so much is going to happen in this story.
I would love to talk about another great movie that just happens to be a Warner Brothers movie, which is Weapons.
We're talking about 17 kids in one classroom and none of them talked about it.
We got how many parents in here and none of us saw it coming.
I want to know what happened in that classroom.
Why just her classroom?
This is a horror film that came out in August, written and directed by Zach Kreger, who had previously done a movie called Barbarian.
It stars Julia Garner, Josh Brolin, famously now Amy Madigan, and a bunch of other people.
And, you know, it's been a great year for horror movies.
It's sort of always a great year for horror movies.
And this is...
Yet another movie Nicole, as you were saying, that's not based on preexisting IP came out of the gate with a trailer and a poster that I feel like immediately obsessed people.
And people just, it was an experience to see this movie in a movie theater, which I did not do.
And I am bummed out about it, but I saw it in a house with a bunch of people who had not seen it before.
And we're not going to ruin the end here, but there comes a point at the end in which people are just standing up in the house and clapping.
Amazing.
It's absolutely incredible.
I saw it in a theater.
I went to a normal, like an Alamo draft house to see it.
Do you have anything to drink?
I had a few small beers, in fact.
Okay, good.
And I was seated between a bunch of people I didn't know.
I went by myself.
So I was between all these ladies and they were screaming, which was really the best way to see it.
But then I was at my local wine bar and they were like, we're going to throw weapons on.
Which they did.
And so everyone in the room seemed to have not seen it except me.
And I can tell you that is also a great way to see it.
Oh, my God.
It was delightful.
Alyssa, you have the best moviegoing experiences.
And they all involve small beers or small wines or small wines.
I unfortunately saw it on the airplane because I'm super...
I'm super chicken when it comes to scary movies.
So I was like, I got to watch it.
But in this case, I'll be fine.
And then I was wanting to scream, too.
But I kept it all tamped down.
I mean, the one of many interesting things about this film is that it's a horror movie in quotes, but it's actually it's mostly just a suspense mystery that has a couple.
Yeah.
Of horrific elements.
There are a couple of jump scares.
There are actually not that many.
And then, you know, there's sort of a grand guignol ending in a sense.
But a lot of this is just sort of like, what is happening?
What is going on?
Where did these kids disappear to?
Yes.
Yes.
And Zach Kreger's background is in comedy too, which I think really comes out in this film.
Just the timing is impeccable.
There's a scene again I don't want to spoil it, but there's a scene involving a door and some scissors, where everybody, the timing is just, it's perfect.
Like the way everything happens, you're spun up.
I mean, I've seen it a couple of times and both times I was like I thought you were going to say the scene with the syringes.
Well, there's not two.
Okay, maybe it is a horror movie.
You know, Barbarian also is one of the most terrifying movies I've ever seen.
But, you know, comedy and horror are just two sides of the same coin.
Well Barbarian, if I'm recalling correctly.
The end of that movie is terrifying and hilarious at the same time.
Yes, yes.
It is a terrifying and hilarious movie.
So, yeah, if you know how to make people laugh, you know how to make them scream.
Yeah.
All right, let's take a little break.
And when we come back, we're going to talk about witches, good ones and wicked ones.
We're going to talk about Avatar, Fire and Ash, one of the big movies of the year that has just come out.
And we might even talk about some great movies that you haven't heard about yet or haven't had a chance to see.
We'll be back in a second.
So, Nicole, we've been talking a lot about Warner Brothers.
We were talking about movie-wise, how great their year was, but it actually has been, at the same time, a bit of a crummy year and certainly a crummy fall for many other studios, many other movies.
You know, our colleague Brooks Barnes wrote a story in mid-fall about how October was just the bust of all busts.
You know, it was the worst October at the box office in almost 30 years.
You had movies like The Smashing Machine.
A third, for some reason, Tron movie, the Springsteen movie, The Running Man, Roof Man, you know, movies that sort of had movie stars and all just sort of went went, floppity flop.
What what happened there?
I mean, Hollywood could not catch a break.
It was like everything they threw at the screen just didn't stick.
Whether it was a big sci-fi movie like Tron, whether it was a biopic about a beloved musician, like the Springsteen movie, whether it was movies starring Margot Robbie, Colin Farrell, Channing Tatum, Jennifer Lopez, Austin Butler, Robert Pattinson, Emma Stone, Russell Crowe, like name all these famous movie stars that people usually run out to the theaters to see and nothing hit.
And it was really grim.
And it's, I don't know if there's one explanation for it.
I think there's many explanations.
I think we're living in an era where Getting people's attention has become harder and harder.
I think if critic reviews come out, social media spreads super fast.
Like you know if you have a hit or a bomb before something even debuts.
Marketing can no longer hide that any longer.
It's just the movie business has always been a really tough business.
This fall felt like it was almost impossible.
Yeah, it was it was a bummer fall.
But all of a sudden around Thanksgiving time, something happened.
I've heard it said that people come into our lives for a reason.
Wicked for Good, the sequel to the first musical about, you know, Glinda the Good and Elphaba the Wicked Witch came out and made a ton of money.
It's not going to make as much money as the first one, but it was this, you know, pink and green injection into the box office.
I feel like it desperately needed it.
We had a whole episode here on the Sunday special about Wicked for Good.
Neither of you were on it.
So I'd love to hear any thoughts if you have them.
I mean, I did not.
I was not.
So into it.
I enjoyed the first one more, but I, you know, am happy about people going to a theater and enjoying a movie.
Yeah.
The marketing for this one is the previous movie that everyone saw.
So I think that accounts for for, you know, box office.
And it is the kind of movie that I think will have legs like people will still be seeing it into the holiday season.
So I continue to find Ariana Grande in particular delightful in this movie.
And it's made $300 million in the U.S. so far.
So it's not exactly, so it's doing great.
Not a flop.
Not a flop at all.
And also, how do you go bigger than the first Wicked movie when it comes to marketing?
I mean, that was an insane marketing push.
Like, that was really tremendous.
Alyssa, what did you think about the politics of the films?
I mean, it has them.
It gets much floppier in the second one, I think.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, it's funny because these are movies kind of very explicitly about fascism.
Yeah.
I don't know if it's as obvious in the second one.
Did you feel for the animals in the same way that Elphaba did?
I feel like this is a trap.
Yeah.
It's not a trap.
It's a setup for a transition, which is to talk about our next film, which is about animals.
I felt deeply for the animals, but not the way that I feel about crypto.
Crypto with a K. Let's talk about Zootopia 2.
Okay.
Unfortunately, Karen has chosen to see Joel's smile as a sign of aggression.
This one came out right before Thanksgiving and holy cow.
So many people went to see it.
I did not know that there were this many people who had been waiting so long, you know, for the further adventures of Judy Hopps and Nick the Fox.
I mean, it's quite a beloved movie in my household and my teenagers are almost no longer teenagers.
So there's something sticky about this movie that really brought people back to the theaters.
Did you guys see any of the screenings that were happening in China, where they were letting people come to the theaters with their pets and watch it with them?
It's amazing.
Yeah.
I don't know how I feel about that.
I love that.
Like what kind of animals?
I think mostly dogs.
Horses.
Yeah.
I have a very large dog that almost is like a mini horse.
So if he had come to the theater, it would have been quite a scene.
Can a cat like stay still for a movie?
Do they have the attention span?
I think cats can do whatever they want.
I mean this does raise something, which is that it feels like there's I hear this from parents all the time that there aren't enough movies for children ever in theaters.
And it seems like many parents are desperate to have something to do with their kids, especially when the weather is bad.
And a movie is a nice thing to go do.
And every time there's like a halfway passably decent movie for kids in the theaters.
It makes a ton of money and everyone seems really surprised by this.
Um, but i feel like when i was a kid, there was a movie, a new kids movie, in the theater like every weekend and yeah they're.
You know where are they?
I don't, i don't know.
So Zootopia has been great for Disney, which has had a bit of an up and down year.
And this month is another huge, huge, huge sort of Disney film.
Avatar, Fire and Ash, the third film in James Cameron's super colorful Pandora set series of films.
I got you two.
You okay?
What is that always say?
It's always stick together.
No, the other one.
That's right!
Solis never quit!
Do people care about Avatar?
We make these jokes.
Does Avatar have a cultural footprint?
And apparently it does.
Apparently it does.
They make so much money.
Yeah, I have, you know, seen it.
It's an Avatar movie.
It's about the folks on Pandora.
The Na'vi.
The Na'vi and the humans.
And it's about colonialism.
And this one's very much about family.
Also political film is what you're saying.
I mean, such as it is.
I am not a huge fan of these movies.
They kind of leave me cold, but they are eye-popping.
They remain eye-popping.
Don't even bother seeing it if you're not seeing it in 3D, which actually is a great thing for theaters, obviously.
But, you know, James Cameron made one of the greatest movies of all time, Titanic.
Yeah.
And this movie and the previous movie, Avatar movie, have elements that are definitely kind of him taking things he did in Titanic and doing them on Pandora.
You know, there's pleasure to be had in watching that.
Alyssa, do you know how many times I saw Titanic in the movie theater?
25.
That's way too much.
Zero.
It was in theaters for like a year and a half.
That would impoverish someone.
No, I saw it in the theater six times.
Yeah, I mean, it was on my sight and sound ballot as one of the greatest movies of all time a couple years ago.
I don't think there's a better Hollywood movie like ever.
Yeah.
It's the platonic ideal of a Hollywood movie.
King of the world.
Nicole, James Cameron.
He just keeps doing it.
Everyone, you know, makes fun of him.
He's like, another Avatar movie.
Oh, Titanic.
It's going to be a bust.
What is this?
And then he wins.
He wins and he's the, you know, hero of the movie business.
Like him and Chris Nolan are the guys who are so dedicated to the theatrical experience.
Like, thank God for those guys.
Yeah.
If we didn't have those guys, like, would we still have movie theaters?
I mean...
They're the ones who keep making these enormous spectacles that have to be seen in theaters.
And you have fans who are just so obsessed, especially with Avatar, who have to go over and over because they're so addicted to that world of Pandora.
And remember when the first one came out and how people were just going constantly?
I mean, it was insanity.
And so why wouldn't he just keep making these movies and living in this world and still trying to get?
Oscar love for the motion capture performances by his actors, which doesn't seem to be resonating with the Academy in an artistic way.
But he's still fighting that battle too.
Nicole, how do you think the movie business is going to end up feeling about this year as a whole?
Oh, that's such a loaded question.
I think the biggest concern right now for the industry is what is going to happen with Warner Brothers.
Consolidation is not good for any industry, and that's true of Hollywood as well.
Ironically, what we have seen this year has been kind of astounding.
We've seen a lot of lows that we talked about, but we also saw a lot of highs, with films that were completely original, that are not based on IP, that are not the things the tried and true Hollywood formula that have done really well.
So if like, we didn't have all these outside economics of which company is carrying which debt and which shareholders are upset about the performance of a certain company, we would have had a year that really shows that, like taking risks and And being imaginative and original really pays off.
I mean, if we were just dealing with strictly art, we'd be in such a better place.
But instead the commerce has really taken over in such a profound way that we're going to see a business that has already contracted keep contracting.
And it's not going to be great for artists.
It's not going to be great for all those people that have dedicated their lives to making movies.
And so...
Right now, things are not so super in Hollywood.
You know what, Nicole?
I think you're absolutely right.
However, we are not going to end this episode on a down note.
We are going to all go around and recommend some amazing films that we saw this year.
Yeah, we are.
And I want to start with Alyssa, who wants to talk about a little ping pong player.
Little ping pong player played by Timothee Chalamet in a movie called Marty Supreme.
Hey, it's Marty Mouser.
I'm in the Royal Suite.
I saw you in the lobby yesterday.
Wow.
I've never talked to an actual movie star.
You know, I'm something of a performer, too.
It is about a young man in the 1950s who is on a quest to become a champion ping pong player.
It is sort of like Uncut Gems in that it's like a two and a half hour panic attack.
But in like the best way possible.
I had so much fun with this movie.
And honestly, the early reviews or the early responses had been so positive that I kind of went in with my arms crossed.
But it totally won me over.
It has the best performance I've seen out of Gwyneth Paltrow in years.
An amazing like Fran Drescher performance, which is not something I was expecting to say this year.
Yeah.
Great music from the 80s mostly on the soundtrack.
It's just if you liked Uncut Gems, you're going to like Marty Supreme.
But even if you didn't, you should give it a shot.
It feels like something you should be watching this time of year.
Nicole, you want to talk about a film that has won a ton of awards this year.
So far, it won the top prize at Cannes this summer.
It is by one of world cinema's, you know, most acclaimed directors.
Yes, it was just an accident by Jafar Panahi, who's an Iranian filmmaker.
And he did win the Palme d'Or at Cannes.
It was acquired by Neon and they have released the last five or six Palme d'Ores, giving Tom Quinn the nickname of Palme d'Oracle.
And it's- heard that.
That's beautiful.
And it's a tremendous film that Panahi shot in Iran, kind of undercover.
To make a movie in Iran today, you have to submit your script to the officials.
And that is not something that Mr Panahi, who has spent time in jail for making movies, was willing to do.
So it was a run and gun operation.
It's about a group of people who have previously been in prison and they think they found the man who tortured them, and they're trying to determine if it is in fact that person.
It's actually funny.
It's really well done.
And it has so much to say about...
Who are the evil ones and what kind of, and how you behave in these kind of situations and how do you forgive and all these kind of very interesting questions.
And it's tremendous.
And Panahi, I believe, will likely get a director nomination from the Academy this year.
It's it's that good.
Well, I agree with all of that.
I also just really respect Panahi and his gumption.
Every movie he's made has been phenomenal.
And you know I've been seeing them at Cannes for years, but he's not been able to be there because there's always been a travel ban or he's been under house arrest or in prison.
And this was the first time that he... has been traveling.
And he was here in New York for the New York Film Festival.
You know, I was able to see him in conversation with Martin Scorsese and it was clear how much you know Scorsese respected him.
So it's just, it's a great film.
I hope people really make a point of seeing it.
I hope so, too.
And I, you know, I recently saw this one, and it's a tight sort of social thriller, almost.
And say the last two scenes of this, you know, it's hard to do a great ending.
And it's just a knockout.
I mean, it's emotional.
It's incredibly tense.
It's sort of scary in its own way.
It's incredible.
And the increasing internationalization of the Academy over the past few years, resulting in Parasite winning Best Picture and, you know, movies directed by non-American directors getting Best Director nominations.
I think is just going to continue, you know, with this or with a film like Sentimental Value or other films like that this year.
Yes.
Also an excellent movie.
Now, listen, tell us about the Shaker musical.
I know.
A musical drama about the 18th century founder of Shakerism is perhaps not a movie anybody ever expected to exist.
Certainly not me.
I actually grew up right next to the Shaker settlement that Ann Lee founded upstate.
So I was delighted when I heard that this was happening.
The movie is called The Testament of Ann Lee.
Wow.
Hunger and thirst I hunger and thirst after true righteousness It stars Amanda Seyfried as Anne Lee.
It's written and directed by Mona Fassville who, among other things, was co-writer of The Brutalist last year.
And it is a weird movie.
I don't know how else.
I've never seen anything like it.
The thing I've been telling people is that it...
In any other hands, it would be a horror film.
It's a biopic, essentially, Cradle to Grave.
And it's about a woman who is very idiosyncratic.
She's got her own ideas about what it means to be devoted to God, what it means to live a pure life.
And that's basically the movie.
So you're just watching this one woman and it's sort of all in on her and her ecstasy through through her devotion.
It's probably not for everybody, but it definitely, definitely was for me.
And it has beautiful music, beautiful dancing, incredibly committed performance by Amanda Seyfried.
And I think if any of that appeals to you, it's a movie you should definitely seek out.
And it is one of those movies that I think really benefits from you being smaller than the film.
Like you want it to be big on the screen so you can kind of be overwhelmed by the experience.
Nicole, you have a film that I'm embarrassed to say I had not heard of.
It's called Come See Me in the Good Light.
I wrote a column about this.
Excuse me, do you know how much we We both wrote about this movie?
Because I think we were both very struck by this movie.
All right.
Well, I got my face.
Anyway, this is the movie called Come See Me in the Good Light.
And it is about the poet Andrea Gibson, who passed away this summer from cancer.
Last night I was reading the beginning of this to Megan.
I said, if I was a documentary filmmaker, I would definitely begin the documentary work.
With the beginning of this poem as a voiceover, as something was happening and Meg's like well, what would be happening?
And I'm like, I don't know, maybe my funeral.
And then you hear Meg's like, no.
It was so awkward.
The most gorgeous, life-affirming, uplifting film that you could see about someone battling cancer.
It may seem like a hard sell, going in that you don't want to watch a movie.
That's this sad, but it actually.
You will sob your face off.
I will tell you that ahead of time.
But you come out of it feeling kind of different because of how they process tragedy and sorrow and end of life.
And this is a person who has dealt with a lot of things through the entirety of their life, but actually felt awakened when they received their terminal cancer diagnosis.
And Their poetry is really it's simple and deep all at the same time.
It's very accessible.
It's really a tremendous film.
Dolphin swims, as riveting as those things may be.
None of them ignite me as much as what most of us were taught to think of as the little things.
These are my biggest, tiniest dreams.
It was at Sundance.
It won the Audience Award at Sundance.
And it's a movie to watch actually at home.
It's kind of I interviewed Andrea and Megan back at Sundance and they kind of that's what they wanted.
They wanted this to be a movie that you watch at home, because they let you into their home and it's kind of the perfect place to watch it, like under the covers.
Just sit there and let all the emotions out, let everything you're feeling like come to a head right there watching it.
It's really a profound experience.
Okay, that actually does sound amazing.
Yeah, it's pretty wonderful.
And Andrea's poetry is also woven into the film.
So if you're not familiar with Andrea Gibson's poetry, you will be introduced to their poetry.
It's great.
I would like to make a plug solely for the biplane sequence at the end of Mission Impossible, the final work.
Oh, I thought you were going to say Train Dreams, but also Mission Impossible is good.
And the second, the submarine sequence, but the rest of that movie was not particularly good.
No, it wasn't.
But it's streaming now.
So if you just want to watch the last half hour, you see Tom Cruise once again put himself, you know.
President of movies.
You know, put himself on the verge of death for our entertainment and edification.
You can and you should.
Also a big proponent of the theatrical experience, that guy.
Yep.
He loves popcorn.
And coconut cakes at the end of the year to send to all his friends.
Yep.
Oh, I can't wait to get mine.
All right.
We are going to take a break.
And when we come back, we will end as we do and as we have every week with a game.
Okay, Alyssa and Nicole, we are going to end this episode, as we end every episode, with a little game.
I have three rounds of movie-related delights for the two of you today.
Please put your hands on your buzzers.
Are you both ready?
Yes.
Sure.
I'm going to need more energy from you, Nicole.
Okay.
I'm ready.
I'm excited.
Okay.
And action.
Round one is called Global Recall.
Movies are increasingly a global business.
American movies are often released under different titles in different parts of the world.
In this round.
I will give you the real, actual title under which a popular American movie from this year was released abroad.
And you give me the American title of the film.
Are these all going to be French because they're the craziest ones?
I have a terrible French accent.
No.
Okay.
This sports biopic was released in Turkey under the title Fighting Legend.
Alyssa.
Smashing Machine.
The Smashing Machine.
That is correct.
In Germany, this star-studded romantic dramedy was called What Is Love Worth?
Anyone?
Nope.
The answer is materialists.
Oh, of course.
Materialists.
Of course.
All right.
This genre spoof, which I know you both love, was released in Belgium as Is There a Cop to Save the World.
Nicole.
Naked Gun.
The Naked Gun.
That is correct.
Great.
Great work of cinema.
You got one.
Great work of cinema.
Everyone go see it.
Ideal snowman sequence.
This classic blockbuster, re-released this year for its anniversary, came out in France with the title The Teeth of the Sea.
Nicole.
Jaws.
Jaws.
That is correct.
That's a great title.
The Teeth of the Sea.
I prefer that.
The Teeth of the Sea.
Yeah.
That was round one.
Let's go to round two.
Don't say I didn't Warner you.
The sale of Warner Brothers is big news here at the end of the year.
Big entertainment companies merge and buy each other all the time.
And that can make for some really weird business relationships.
So in this round I'm going to name a company and you tell me if that company has ever in its history been owned by Warner Brothers.
Okay.
I feel like I might lose this round.
Okay.
Let us begin.
The movie review site Rotten Tomatoes.
Alyssa.
Yes.
Yes, that is correct.
Rotten Tomatoes is owned by Flixster, which was owned by Warner Brothers from 2011 to 2016.
I feel as a critic, Alyssa, that was yours to know.
So I'm happy for you.
Yeah, I unfortunately have thought too much about Rotten Tomatoes.
Next clue.
Dairy Queen.
Alyssa.
No.
No.
No is correct.
Okay, good.
Mary Queen is owned by Warren Buffett's company, Berkshire Hathaway.
Nice.
Next, Six Flags.
Nicole.
Yes.
Yes, that is correct.
Time Warner owned Six Flags for a couple years in the 90s.
Next, the Internet Movie Database.
Alyssa.
Yes.
Yes.
Incorrect.
IMDb is owned by Amazon.
Oh, yes.
Oh, right.
All right.
The Atlanta Braves.
Nicole.
Yes, because Ted Turner owned it.
That is correct.
When Time Warner acquired Turner Broadcasting System in 1996, it also acquired his ownership stake Ted Turner's ownership stake in the Braves.
All right.
Final round of this game is...
Final round of the year.
Round three is called the GCU, the Gilbert Cinematic Universe.
Have you ever wondered what your favorite movies of 2025 would sound like if they starred Gilbert Cruz?
I certainly did not.
But our crack team here has inserted me into some of this year's hottest movies.
I'm going to play you a clip.
You get a point if you can name the movie.
Another point if you can name the character I'm playing.
And a third point if you can name the actor that I replaced.
Wow.
So there are three possible points for each question.
Oh, boy.
Okay.
Are you ready?
Yes.
Roll it.
Chicken jockey.
Nicole.
It's Minecraft.
It is the Minecraft movie.
Do you want to go for the other two points?
No.
Name the character I'm playing and name the actor I replaced.
No, I think that's where my knowledge ends.
You don't even know the actor.
I mean, I can say Jack Black, but I think that's wrong.
Jack Black is correct.
Oh, yay!
Very good.
Alyssa, do you know the character name?
I have no idea.
Jack Black plays the character name Steve.
Oh, yeah.
I actually knew that.
What an imaginative name.
Famously.
Okay.
Nicole, great job.
Thank you.
Let's go to our next clip.
I'm punk rock.
You are not punk rock.
I like the Strangle Fellows, the PODs, and the Mighty Crabjoys.
Those are pop radio bands.
They're not punk rock.
The Mighty Crabjoys suck.
Ah, well, a lot of people love them.
My point is, I question it.
This is so embarrassing.
This is amazing.
Nicole, you buzzed in first.
Okay, I think it's caught stealing.
What?
Oh!
Oh!
Nicole, that is incorrect.
Oh.
Alyssa, you can steal.
This is Superman.
This is Superman.
I mean, Superman at this point.
I am Superman.
That is correct.
I was debating between Superman and Clark Kent.
I am Superman.
And it's David Cornsweat.
David Cornsweat.
You got three points there.
Great job.
Great job.
We're going to just keep it going here.
All right.
Next clip.
Where y'all from?
Just down the road.
And how far is that?
North Carolina.
North Carolina.
Y'all clean?
Sir, we believe in equality and music.
We just came here to play.
Spend some money.
Have a good time.
Here, I'll show you.
I pick for robbing clean.
Alyssa.
Okay, it's Sinners.
Correct.
And it's the Irish vampire, but I can't remember his name.
And I'm also blanking on who the actor is.
Gashin Bigora.
You don't know who it is?
No, I'm blanking on his name.
Yeah, I don't give a bet.
Nicole.
It's Jack O'Connell.
Who's he playing?
The Irish guy.
The Irish vampire whose name is?
The Irish vampire.
His name is Remick.
Remick.
Remick.
Okay.
Okay.
We're going to see how they score that.
Yep.
All right.
Next clip. but I whispered him and he came true.
We said one day, that was our deal.
What does that say on the refrigerator?
We are not keeping this thing.
Ohana means family.
Family means nobody gets left behind or... Or forgotten.
Lilo and Stitch.
Yes, it's Lilo and Stitch.
It's Lilo and Stitch.
Who am I playing and what actor did I replace?
I don't know.
Lilo or Stitch.
I don't know.
I don't know.
I refused on principle to see this movie.
I don't know.
Okay.
I'm playing Lilo.
Oh, very good.
Stitch is not the verbal.
Stitch is the alien.
And I replace the actor Maya Kealoha.
Oh.
Okay.
Yeah.
Last clip.
Let's make this one count.
Okay.
Okay.
I had a long day, ma'am.
Yes, I did.
Excuse me?
Trash.
Yes, ma'am.
I had a few.
A few small beers.
Yay!
Alyssa!
It's one battle after another.
It's Benicio del Toro.
And I cannot for the life of me remember the name of the character.
Nicole, do you recall the name of the character?
No, but it's my favorite performance of the year.
Sensei Sergio.
Sensei Sergio.
But it's the best line of the year as we've established.
It is.
Thank you for that.
You're very welcome.
Thank you both for being so game to participate in that.
We have a winner, and it was incredibly, incredibly close.
Alyssa, you have won.
You won by one point.
Oh, congrats.
Thank you.
So close.
Alyssa, you win an actual prize.
That prize that I'm going to bring out of this bag here.
Oh, it's in a black bag, folks.
It's a small black bag.
Another good movie this year.
It's a small...
Cheap, mass-produced, golden trophy with my face on it.
We call it the Gilby!
It will join my previous Gilby.
Wow.
I love the branding of Gilbert on this whole show.
I had no idea.
As do I, I have to say.
It really is.
It's shocking.
Alyssa, Nicole, thank you for joining the final episode of the Sunday special.
Alyssa, thank you so much.
Thank you for inviting me.
Nicole calling in from sunny Los Angeles.
Thank you so much.
Thank you for having me.
Today's episode was produced by our quiz master, Alex Barron, with help from Tina Antolini and Kate Lopresti.
It was edited by Wendy Dorr and engineered by Daniel Ramirez.
Original music by Dan Powell, Marion Lozano, Alicia Baetube, and Diane Wong.
Special thanks to Paula Schumann.
Well, that is a wrap.
As I said, this is our last Sunday special.
It has been a real blast coming to you every Sunday here for the past several months.
I hope you all enjoyed it.
I host another weekly podcast over at the New York Times Book Review called creatively enough, The Book Review Podcast.
Come on over and give it a listen.
Happy New Year, everybody.
Bye.
