You're listening to Women at Work from Harvard Business Review.
I'm Amy Bernstein. I'm Amy Gallo.
Something our former co-host, Nicole Torres, told us last year when we were talking about personal branding, inspired this episode.
Well, as soon as you said personal branding, I thought of something very different and that might just be like time in my life and what like my closest friends are talking about, which is like women change their names.
And that affects your personal brand and how do you handle that decision.
I'm like having a lot of these conversations now with friends who are getting wet and some are changing their names, some are not.
And we always have very interesting discussions about why or why not and how that affects their professional lives.
So that is also a big part of branding that women have to consider.
Totally. I mean, if you're interested in getting married in the first place, current numbers about what percentage of women are making which decisions about their maiden names are sort of hard to come by.
But Pew Research Center just published new findings.
The day before we're recording us about trends in the US based on a survey they did earlier this year.
It may be what did they find?
Well, what they found really surprised me, just looking at the report now, but what Pew found is that most women in opposite sex marriages and by most 79%, that's a lot for fits basically.
So they took their spouses last name when they got married.
All right, guess how many kept their own name kept their last name?
Well, is it the opposite of 79%, 21% or so?
Nope, nope, that would be logical, but inaccurate.
Another 14% kept their last name and 5% hyphenated both their name and their spouses name.
So I started wondering about the Sarah Green Carmichael's of the world, so our former co-host, Sarah Green Carmichael kept from maiden name and then her husband's name.
Hasn't it? Yeah, without a hyphen.
And that is just 1% of the respondents.
So you said it was 79% of women in opposite sex marriages who changed their name.
What about women in same sex marriages?
Well, the Pew Center says they didn't get enough of a sample size to find that out.
So we don't know. Increase your sample size.
Because I would like to know.
One more finding that I'd love to share is that among women who have never been married, a mere 33% say they take their husbands last name.
Really? Yeah. And then the other finding that I find so interesting is that the number of those who are not yet married saying they'll keep their own name, they keep their last name.
23%. Remember, it was 14% of people who are married.
Yeah. Interesting. But a full quarter of respondents said that they're not even sure yet.
Right. Right. Yeah. Was there anything in that study about whether career aspirations affect or like anything about their career affects that decision?
Well, this is me scanning the article.
I'm not seeing anything about career hang on.
Closer as we get is that far more women with some college or less took their spouses names 83% than did women with a postgraduate degree.
That was just 68%. Mm-hmm.
Is there anything about what influences their decision?
No, it's really a readout of the numbers.
The numbers. That kind of analysis.
Yeah. It'd be interesting to know what factors for that 79% or even the 14% are those even who hyphenate?
What influence that decision?
Yeah. I would love to know more.
I think we're going to get into that, though, aren't we?
Yeah. So Amy G, when you and Damien got engaged, did you consider giving up Gallo and taking his last name?
Which I just learned. I've known you for years.
Yeah. I just learned his last name.
Yeah. His last name is Vania, and my name is Amy.
It's a long A with a long A.
So it wasn't going to sound pretty Amy Vania.
But I have to be honest that never even crossed.
Like, it was just not an issue.
Like, I have always been Amy Gallo.
It's almost one word. Mm-hmm.
The idea of changing that seemed so foreign to me.
And you are not Amy V. I'm not Amy V.
I'm Amy G. You are. I'll be honest.
I had very strong feelings about taking a man's name that just didn't sit well with me.
Like, it just felt, and I mean, I reasoned, of course, like, my current name is also a man's name, my father's name.
And at one point, I even considered my parents are divorced.
My mom kept my dad's name.
So she and I have the same last name.
And at one point, I consider taking her maiden name as my last name to sort of give it like the matrilineal line.
But then I was like, well, that's just my grandfather's name.
But there's no way around that it's some man's name.
Right. And so I decided, you know, I've been Amy Gallo for a really long time.
I can't imagine being anyone else.
Right. And it is your name.
Yeah. So you got engaged.
How far along were you in your career?
I'd been working like 12 years at that point, so just over a decade.
So how did that factor in?
I mean, that's already a substantial amount of time in.
Yeah. And I'd like to say it was a big factor.
But I don't think I realized then the consequences of changing my name, like what the potential consequences and risks could be to my career.
Right. That I'd invested 12 years of my life into building a reputation, making connections, establishing myself as Amy Gallo.
And like, I don't think I thought about the costs of switching partly because it wasn't a real consideration to change.
But for professional reasons, I'm really glad I didn't.
I think about how much my current career is influenced by those first 12 years.
And it's a lot. Yeah. I have mentors.
I have people who knew me in previous jobs.
I have things I wrote under my name from that time.
Right. To have all of a sudden different name.
Just I wouldn't have been comfortable with that cost.
Yeah. It's disruptive to say the least.
Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. What about you, Amy Bee?
Did you and Dan talk about changing your names when you got married?
No. But same-sex couples didn't really do that back then.
And anyway, it was never even a consideration for us.
Why wasn't it consideration?
Well, for one thing, we were both deep into our careers.
We both had our professional identities.
I was 35 when we got together, and Dan was 40.
Right. But same-sex couples didn't take each other's names.
That was not yet part of the then brand new tradition of getting married.
Right. Right. That brand new tradition.
That's an oxymoron. First marriage wasn't available to us.
Yep. And then when it was, there's no way that I then in my 40s would have changed my name.
Yeah. That is late in the game.
It's way too late in the game for me and for Nennet as well.
We talked about getting matching motorcycle and stuff like that, but nothing about our names.
Perfect. Perfect way to cement the bond.
I do know people who've not hyphenated or even kept like Sarah Green Carmichael, kept their, I keep calling it original name.
Their name, I don't even know what to call it.
Made in names also sounds terrible.
I keep saying her own name.
Yes. As if that's a distinguishing factor anyway.
Yeah. The name they had at the time of marriage and then added.
But I know people who actually created and I know a couple of same-sex couples who created a new name based on their last name.
One of my favorite was pearl mine and voles.
And they changed their last name to pearls.
P-E-R-L-Z. I was like, that is a cool name.
That's a cool name, but that's like three times.
So disruption. But you know what?
Good for them and how brave.
Yeah. I also know another couple, opposite sex couple, where the husband really wanted to raise the kids with his faith and not his wife's faith.
And she said, that's fine, but they're going to, in that case, they'll have my last name.
And that was the trade they were willing to make.
So it was an negotiation.
Yeah. It's funny that both their kids are teenagers now.
And I asked them recently how they, the adults, how they felt about the name for faith, trade, and they're like, it's worked out really well.
Yeah. Amy, G. U and I have been talking about ancient history.
But sitting with us today is none other than Hannah Bates, our associate producer and friend, who is about to get married, right?
When you get married. Yes.
June 15th, 2024. It's also our dog's birthday.
She will be in the wedding.
Nice. Yes. It's a must. Our dog was in our wedding.
Oh. I love that. I would actually consider having a wedding, if I got my dogs in it.
You just get remarried every time you get a new dog.
Oh my gosh. Yeah. So Hannah, you know, Nicole brought up a whole question of personal brand when you're thinking about a name change.
And I wonder how personal brand, your career, just the kind of breadcrumb trail you've left of Hannah Bates.
How does that all factor into your decision?
So many thoughts and feelings.
But I think it's better if you hear all of those thoughts and feelings in the context of this conversation I had with three other women who've either gone through or are currently going through this same decision-making process.
My name is Tanya Paul, which used to be Tane Gupta.
My name is Sayaka Hara, but it used to be Sayaka Kawano.
And my name is Alex Shore, and it's staying Alex Shore.
Well, Alex, you and I know each other because we work together.
And you're leaving soon, and I was thinking last night, I was like, this is the first full blown conversation I've ever had with Alex.
And now I'm sad that I won't get to do that anymore.
I know. But that's how we know each other.
And then you brought Sayaka to us?
Yes. So me and Sayaka, when we were 21 babies, we started working together at, well, she still works for the company at my old job.
And we've been friends ever since.
So like six, seven years.
Oh, that's nice. And Tanya, you're no stranger.
It's a women network. Yes.
This is your third time.
This is my thought podcast.
Do I look excited to be here as always?
Oh, love it. All right. Well, I've brought you all here today to talk about changing your last name or not.
And that was something that I think, like, pretty immediately, like even before we got engaged, I knew I was going to keep my last name just because I feel very attached to it.
It's baits. It's that one syllable.
Like it just punctuates.
I feel like my name. And I just, I don't know.
I really like it. And also, my dad passed away.
And that's his last name.
So it keeps me connected to him professionally.
I did take my career into account when making this decision.
Also, I'm a musician. So that is a consideration.
I do have music goals that maybe someday, like I will want, I just want everything to be under Hannah Bates.
But then also at this job, like my name is in all of the credits of the podcasts.
And if I want to remain in podcasting, I feel like, I don't know, it's just more convenient to have my last name stay the same.
There's no confusion there, like, who's Hannah Bates versus Hannah Mortimer?
Like, I don't need to worry about connecting the two of them.
So that's kind of how I came to the decision.
But for all of you, how did that decision come up for you?
And what were you thinking about?
Tanya, why don't you start?
So for the longest time, I didn't even think about it.
The decision came up. The day we were setting on our computers, trying to register a marriage.
And this was all during COVID.
So everything was online.
And then I saw the big question pop up.
Last name now, last name after marriage.
I was like, oh my god, this is where I have to decide.
You know, work was a very, very big contributor to that decision because I had that feeling, you know, everything I've done in my life, I have been known by that person.
And if I become this new person, then who am I really going to be?
And I was expecting people to see me differently.
I was expecting, like, I walk out of, you know, washer or like a car cleaning facility.
I'm a new person. I was expecting that.
Hmm. So how did you expect people would treat you differently?
So I think it was more to do with how my family is and how my husband's family is.
Because I think a family is associated by their last names primarily.
My family is a little more impulsive, a little more traditional definition of fun, just getting out of bed and planning.
This is what they want to do.
And my husband's family is their plan more.
So I was just like, am I going to lose myself?
Am I going to just because I am part of a new family now?
Right. But I not be part of my old family in those traits, in those characteristics.
So I think that was who I was worried I would become.
Not like I don't like it.
It's just it wasn't me. Hmm.
So I think that was what really concerned me about making the change.
So it was more about how like your families would look at you differently.
Um, a mix of that and also how I would look at myself, I think.
So if I look at myself differently, if my family street me a little bit differently, then why wouldn't my coworker street me differently?
That's kind of where I think I went into that chain of thought.
And it's like they don't know who I am anymore.
I think I was just overthinking, to be honest, at that point.
I've read a bunch of research and preparation for this episode.
And people have thought and overthought this for their jobs.
And I don't feel like so.
I feel like you definitely weren't overthinking it.
And like for sure a valid consideration.
Like will people treat me differently?
Yeah. I don't know if I'm allowed to jump to the part now, but I really do think nothing changed.
I still am the same person I was.
I still go by my first name, majorly everywhere like work.
Everybody knows me by Tanya.
Nobody really uses my last name before or now, unless they're introducing me for the first time.
Like I was when you were meeting someone new.
They from that point on are only and ever will know you as Tanya, up all.
Yeah, I think that is sunk in, but that was actually one of the reasons why I did change.
Because as talking to my husband about, I've spent four years in the industry.
Everybody knows me by this name and what happens.
And he just looked at me.
And of course, men don't think about this so much.
But he just logically said, you've spent four years in the industry.
And you have another 30 to go.
And since then, I've just had that perspective open up to me.
Yeah. And sure, it hurts sometimes that people don't know my old name, but they know me and I'm still the same me.
Right. And like nobody looks at me differently.
At least I think nobody looks at me differently.
Sayaka, what about you?
What went into your decision to change your last name?
So similar to Tanya, I never even thought about it real deeply until we were at the point of signing papers.
Of course. I'm also Japanese.
It's really common in Japan to change your last name.
And I like the idea of having like a family unit.
But I think also the choice of changing my last name was maybe a bit of an illusion.
Because until prepping for this podcast, I didn't know that Japan had strict laws of name changes.
They require you to have one of the same last name.
It could be yours or your partner's last name, but everyone has to have the same last name.
Interesting. Yeah. And it's really interesting too.
Because I talked to my mom about this a little bit too.
You also don't get marriage papers in Japan.
The way that you like prove your marriage is by family registry.
So you can just imagine a document.
There's like your last name is at the top.
And I kind of list your spouse, your kids.
And that's kind of how you handle everything.
So you can kind of trace your ancestry that way too.
Interesting. And so I think my mom and my grandma had more of an emotional time when I legally got married.
Because you have to do documentation to kind of remove yourself from your family.
Documents. Oh my god. Oh, wow.
Yeah. To start like a new family, essentially, with your partner.
So that was really interesting.
I feel like I was just signing papers.
Like, you know, we've been dating for a long time.
I think it was no surprise that I was getting married.
But I think when my mom was again choked up, I was like, oh no.
Like, what did I do? Yeah.
That's wild. That it's literally you're like legally removing yourself almost from your own family.
Yeah. Did you know that before you?
Yeah. Kind of. Yeah. Like here, it's like social security.
It's like your way to identify.
But I feel like whenever you do anything, you have to have your family registry to kind of prove your identity of sorts.
And this is a little morbid.
But when you like pass away and you, you know, have a gravestone, it's usually a family gravestone that you get buried into.
It's not your individual once.
It's very much tied to the idea of family and the idea of having a same last name.
Oh, wow. And I'm like, because of this podcast, I'm like, oh my god, I never thought so much into it.
Yeah. But I guess that being said, even though things did catch me by surprise, I think, I don't regret changing it.
Even though right now, I feel like I'm in the weird end between like, I haven't fully transitioned into my new name.
I feel like even when I was signing in downstairs, I probably signed with my old name.
So I feel like I have a dual identity still.
So Yaka, remember how people in the office found out that you changed your last name?
Yes. So I'm legally married.
My wedding's next year, though.
As soon as my name changed legally, I reported it to HR so that, you know, for tax reasons, pay steps, all of that.
But the HR team was like, your email, that has first and last name, you have to go through IT if you want to change it.
So I'm like, you know what?
I'm just not even going to deal with changing my name publicly or internally within our company until maybe my wedding rolls around.
And then one day over the summer, I don't know what triggered it, but my Zoom, Slack, everything that we use in our work, had my new last name on it, except for my email.
I woke up to a lot of messages from people being like, what happened?
Like, I didn't know this happened.
And all of a sudden, I'm like, I have no idea.
Like, I'm so sleepy. I know.
Horror is on. My new last name is on some stuff.
But things like email is still my old last name, just because we work with some people externally.
And I have like contract and things like that, where I don't want things to get lost in the mix kind of.
Yeah. So I feel like a spy sometimes, because people can't find me.
That's hilarious. And Alex, what about you?
Yeah. So I guess I have always thought, kind of like, you Hannah, that I wanted to keep my name, because it's so short and to the point, like, my full name is Alexandra Shore, but everyone calls me Alex.
No one calls me Alexandra.
And I just love the way Alex shore sounds.
It rolls off the tongue.
It does. And even in work settings, this is kind of funny and embarrassing.
People will call me like, a show.
And things like that. So it's like a nickname.
I feel like I've almost acquired at school or work.
And I have like that. Yeah.
And so my fiance's last name is Youngshofer, which is very long.
And it's also German. And every time we go somewhere, and he has to spell out his first name, Johannes, and his last name, Youngshofer, it takes probably 10 minutes to go back and forth, spelling out the full name.
It's a lot of letters. It's a lot of letters.
And then people will ask, oh, is that a German name?
Oh, what does it mean? And then we have to explain.
It means a young hard worker.
Things like that. And so it is cool.
But when I thought about changing my last name, if I was changing it to Alexandra Youngshofer, I feel like I would be taking on some of that identity and some of those questions, like go with it.
And it's not part of my heritage.
So I just thought I'm just going to keep it Alexore, simple.
I like it. It works in all situations.
So I like Alexore. I'm a fan of you keeping it for what it's worth.
Thank you. Tony, I have a question for you specifically.
On your LinkedIn, it says formerly Gupta.
Yep. Does it still say that?
You got it right. Oh my god.
It does. Yeah. I think I use formally for about a year.
And Lingness still says that because my professional connections from before know me as Gupta.
So I feel like I'm going to keep that for a little bit.
But it doesn't really hurt anybody.
But even in my current place of work, I changed my email signatures.
Everything said formally for about a year.
And then by then I knew like nobody really called me with my last name anymore.
So I was like, OK, I think this is time.
Yeah. So like a year was like a good enough.
Yeah. But I also did not change my name immediately after getting married.
So I took about a year and a half to start making the change.
And then we like in say, I guess case, I actually had the wedding a little bit after our legal registration in the US.
So I feel like after the wedding, I got more comfortable my skin.
Even though when I got my new passport, I was like, who is this person?
That was that was a month before the wedding.
And I was freaking out just looking at it.
I was like, this is not me.
And then something just changed in me after the wedding.
It just felt like, oh, you know what?
This is my family now. And I think that feeling that that became so beautiful, that I just became more accepting.
And the immense amount of work that came with the logistics offered just became easier.
Because I was like, I know the day, OK, we're a family.
And that made the difference to me.
It's really nice. So you feel like you really identify with Tanya, Apple, Apple.
Yeah, with Tanya, Apple now.
That's the hardest part.
I think I do. But I think it's more about maybe it's bad thing.
I don't know. But I think I just kind of focus on Tanya more so.
And then the rest just, you know, I think it's coming to me now.
I don't speak my whole name so much anymore.
It happens still. Like, like, like I said, I think sometimes I just sign the whole name and I don't realize it.
Yeah. And it's like reassuring to hear you say that because my wedding's coming up.
And I'm just manifesting it for myself.
I feel like I'm in that weird in-between stage.
Right. But I feel like once we have the wedding and it's like official and it's, you know, it's a beautiful feeling.
I know. I'm so excited. I feel like right now you're like both and neither.
Exactly. Yeah. I'm just floating till the wedding.
So before we all came into the studio today, we all read this article by Dory Clark called, how to change your name and keep your professional identity.
And in it, she goes through some advice for doing so, like announcing the change.
So you should send like an email blast to your colleagues, letting them know that your last name just changed.
She also talks about taking an online inventory of where your maiden name shows up.
So that could be like your social media accounts or your email accounts.
And she recommends like updating all of those at the same time so you don't confuse people.
So did any of you do anything that she recommended?
Did you do Tony? So I actually made a spreadsheet.
Oh, okay. I made a list of categories and places where I needed to change my name.
Yeah. So it started with like social security, you banking, HR, previous HRs, you know, like I had a list.
We're just still open to date because there's some things that I still haven't changed.
Like airlines, rental cars, you know, like those kind of things.
So I did do that. And when I was changing it at work, I gave my managers a heads up like, hey, if you see this name, it's still me.
So they knew it. And then when we had the next like team meeting, the office meeting, I just casually announced, hey guys, if you see this name, it's me.
And so on. And people, I think everybody knew by then that I was married so it wasn't really like a shocker, like you would have to do that.
But I did let everybody know.
And then I had forwarding setup by IT.
And what else did I do? I think I had a signature, you know, in my signature I had a list statement saying that this is my new email, please make sure you update a address book and stuff like that.
I think the advice from the article about like really announcing it yourself that your name changed is probably one that I'm going to take account into soon.
Because I feel like it causes a lot of mess and confusion.
Sayaka isn't really a common name, but people still message me being like, I can't find you like in our system.
Like where did you go? So that's the one that I would definitely take away from that article.
I remember when my mom changed her last name for the second time, like 10 years ago, she said that for a while it was kind of nice that people couldn't find her.
She's like, oh, check out her a little bit.
But then after a while she's like, okay, this is concerning.
So, but I'm curious, Alex, you're not changing your last name, but people might notice that you're not changing your last name.
Like is there anything you're going to do?
Like are you gonna announce like, by the way, I'm staying out like sure or anything like that?
Honestly, when I was reading the article, I was happy because I'm like, wow, I don't really have to do any of this.
But to the point of announcing it, I'm starting a new job and I'm taking time off for my wedding.
And so I guess when I start my new job, I'll just tell them, hey, just so you know, I am getting married this month at the end of the month and I'm not changing my last name.
I probably will announce it at least to the core.
People on my team that are new, just so they know that nothing will change.
But there's no sense in doing like a wider announcement to people.
Yeah, I literally thought of you, because I feel like starting a new job would be a clean way.
Yes, start a new email, like new everything.
So I envy you and that sense.
But I do wonder if people, and I don't know if this is actually, if this would like impact you in a new real way, but if people are just gonna assume that short is your husband's last name, that's not your main name.
I don't really know what that means, but just yeah.
I had a really interesting conversation with one of my fiance's friends who is married.
And him and his wife have been married for like two years, I think at this point, and she still has not changed her last name, but she intends to.
And part of the reason she is kind of putting it off is because she is in med school, she's gonna be a doctor.
And she's like for the longest time of always imagined.
When I become a doctor, I'm gonna be doctor her last name.
And not doctor, his last name.
She's like, I paid for med school.
I did all the hard work. My name deserves to be attached to all of that.
And if I changed my last name, it became doctor, his last name.
And it's almost like I'm giving him some of the credit.
And she's like, and he didn't do shit.
He didn't do anything, you know?
And it got me thinking about even my last name.
I am not a doctor and I did not go to med school, nor did I pay for med school.
But I still feel like I have worked hard in my career.
And I don't wanna give Danny any of that.
Like that is not his, that is mine, you know?
And maybe it depends on the industry.
You're in and what you do for work.
But that definitely got me thinking about all of the things I attach to my name.
And it's interesting to think about.
If I can ask, why would you feel like you're giving him part of your life or your credits, the credits that are to your name?
Why do you feel so? Because it's his name, I guess.
And let's say if I changed my name to Hannah Mortimer, like Hannah Bates did the work to get here, not Hannah Mortimer.
And maybe that is me overthinking it a little bit.
But yeah, I think that's why.
Okay, that makes sense.
I was curious because I know that a couple of my other friends who did not change their name thought that way.
And I guess I couldn't fully comprehend that.
It's almost like, I feel like it's too late.
Like I'm just Hannah Bates in the world.
Now, it's very not. And Hannah Bates I will stay in a thing.
So I wrote a study that said, almost 40% of all marriages end in divorce.
Alex, have you thought about like, if you ever get divorced?
Like, oh, well, at least I get to keep my last name because I've thought of that.
Yeah, I mean, it definitely makes it easier, I guess.
And I think if we get divorced, I'll just stay the same and move on.
It's like a prenup with yourself.
Like, it all spills. You keep your name, your identity.
I think that's all I have.
Thanks, guys. It was really nice.
It was good. Yeah. Thanks, everyone.
After the break, Nicole joins me and Amy's to finish this episode she started.
So Nicole, we're here because you raised this question.
So I think I need to put out there that I'm not married.
Nor has marriage been proposed to me.
But I do think about just this idea of women changing their names pretty often.
Like we talked about in the last show.
And I've been going to a lot of weddings.
A lot of my friends are getting married.
They're grappling with this question.
Me personally, I have never thought I would change my name because it is really tied to my identity and my professional background.
I met a certain point in my career where I think my name matters to me.
But I would change my name for a really cool last name.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
There are very strong, good reasons for a woman to want to be rid of her family name.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
I would change my name for a little bit.
Yeah, thank you. But to help keep you up at night.
Yeah, but I do wonder on the career front.
Not to change the direction of the combo.
I feel like maybe it makes more of a difference changing your name when you're thinking about a career where people know your name.
Versus where you might be applying to jobs or changing industries or something.
I think there are situations where a new name you might think of that as like helping your brand.
Like a negative way to look at it is I was reading articles about women who change their names because like there's a lot of name discrimination out there and they find it easier to apply to certain jobs if they have white sounding names.
Right. Yeah. And it's interesting.
I learned from the conversation that Hannah had.
Who was it who has like had just learned that in Japan there are like there's a law that you have to take.
Sayaka. Yeah. And that both spouses have to have the same last name or a same name and they can go either direction.
There are a lot of countries too where like there are laws on the books where you cannot change your name after marriage.
So it's like it's a very cultural and geographic thing as well.
Like in Italy you can't women don't change their names and China women don't change their names.
So it is very cultural. It's kind of interesting to think about how I don't know.
These conversations might be different depending on where you are.
I'd also love to know in Japan what percentage of people end up going with the woman's last name versus the man's.
Because in my head I'm like I bet they're defaulting to the man's last name.
But I don't know. I haven't looked into that.
Right. Well I don't think my husband, I don't think I ever occurred to him to change his name.
Oh. To my last name. Like and it's surprising to me actually that we haven't gone to a place where it's a question that gets asked more regularly.
A friend who just got married recently.
We talk a lot about work and careers and she's very career driven.
And I asked if she was changing her name.
She was like no. And she told her now husband that she was not changing her name.
But she said in the conversation she said, but you're welcome to take my name if you'd like.
And I thought that was really great.
He didn't, but maybe he thought about it for a little bit.
And we could have more conversations like that.
I asked Danny. I was like would you ever take my last name?
But even when I ask it, like it's kind of a joke because I know he never would.
But he was like absolutely not.
I was like, well, why not?
Because it's my name. And I'm like exactly.
Did he want you to take his name?
He says he like doesn't really care.
But I know he does a little bit.
He's like, it'd be nice.
But I get it. And like I'm not heartbroken about it.
So he may occasionally get called Mr.
Gallo. And he loves it. Me too.
But it is, it's, he loves it in that it seems funny.
Right? Like if I got called by his last name.
No, it would see it as funny.
Yeah. Yeah. Nicole, what are you getting out of this episode?
What should we all be taking from this episode?
You set us up to have this conversation.
Tell us. Oh, God. I mean, I think I really changed my thinking.
I had always thought that I would not change my name.
But I would really wonder why my peers, my close friends, would change their names.
You know, I asked my sister in law, like, why did you change your name?
And I just learned a lot more about like there are so many reasons why people change their names.
And they're all so valid.
Yeah. I'm sort of taking away.
You do you. Yeah. Just do it thoughtfully and carefully.
Yeah, exactly, exactly.
That's our show. I'm Amy and Gallo.
And I'm Amy Bernstein. And I'm Hannah Beats.
Popping back in to say that I learned the percentage of married couples in Japan who take the man's last name.
It's 95%. According to Stanford's Asia Pacific Research Center.
So in case you were wondering, because I was.
HBR has more podcasts to help you manage yourself, your team, and your organization.
Find them at hbr.org slash podcasts.
Or search hbr in Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen.
Women at Works editorial and production team is Amanda Cursey, Maureen Hoek, Tina Toby Mac, Rob Eckhart, Erica Trucksler, Ian Fox, and Hannah Beats.
Rob and Moore composed the scene music.
Thanks for listening. Email us anytime at women at work at hbr.org.
Bye. Bye. Bye.
