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Welcome, everyone, to another episode of Dear Headspace.
I'm Robin, and with me today is Dora and also Headspace therapist, Samantha.
And we will be answering your questions about how to deal with panic and distress.
and feelings of resentment toward your partner when you don't agree with their decisions.
We also have a question from a young Headspace listener who wants to know what to do after his friend moved away.
All right, let's dive right in.
Have you ever wished you had a wise meditation teacher on speed dial?
Or a therapist you can call after a long day?
Or a mental health coach you can lean on for advice?
Someone to help you see things differently?
Welcome to Dear Headspace, a podcast where I sit down with headspace experts and we answer your questions.
Well, hello, Dora and Samantha.
I am loving this combo today.
I mean, we got three strong ladies in the house.
That was quiet strength, Dora.
How's everybody doing today?
Good. Good. Yeah, I'm good.
You're going to need to convince someone, I think, that you are good, because that did not sound it, Samantha.
I'm going to leave it with you, but I'm hoping by the end of this episode, we're in a different space.
How's that? Tell them how you really feel, Sam.
Come on. We will be, you know?
All right, well, you've heard the topics for today, and I'm intrigued.
So I think we should just, like, get right to our first question, which is from Tori.
Here she is. Hi, I'm Tori from South Africa.
and firstly I want to say I'm a huge fan of Headspace.
It's been a part of my daily life now.
I've been dealing with depression and anxiety pretty much all my life.
I've been taking medication for it for almost 10 years now but when life gets really stressful I tend to have severe anxiety attacks.
When I find myself in this state, I'm too distressed to get my phone and find an appropriate meditation I can use.
Is there a technique or mantra or anything at all I can use in these moments that might help bring me out of my panic state and into the present?
Thank you. Thank you for your question, Tori.
I mean, I just have to start by saying that's a lot and we're with you and we're sending, you know, love and energy your way.
So, Dora, Samantha, what are your initial thoughts here for Tori?
Well, first, Tori, thank you so much for just calling in and sharing that.
Like, that takes a lot of bravery and courage to reach out.
And one thing that I really appreciate is that you're reaching out while you are not in the moment of panic.
And I think being able to do these things not in the moment of panic really like reassures us, like tells our brain we can do the thing that we need to do to stay safe and healthy and keep our nervous systems stable.
and it's really hard to to manage panic.
And there are some things that you can do, you know, grounding techniques.
And one of the things I always like to do or suggest is to just being aware of your senses and naming something you can feel, touch, see, hear, smell.
And it helps you helps to remind you that you are safe.
And there's one thing that I do when I get into moments of like sort of anxious panic or distress is I just sort of I have a thing that I repeat to myself and I say I am safe I am grounded in the present moment I belong in this space and I've been doing it for years and so it is something that immediately
like calms me and lets me know that I have the skills to manage what I'm feeling you know I would always just sort of start there.
Yeah I love that because I feel like we talk so much and Dora I'm curious your thoughts on this because we talk so much on this show about it being a practice and i find that like you know like when i'm anxious or like it's a day later when i'm like why didn't i do that thing where i put my hand on my
heart or why didn't i try the stop technique and i feel like i've been hosting this show for what like two and a half years now since we started it and it's just only now occurring to me in those crisis moments so i'm like i'm applauding tori for knowing themselves so much to know, oh, I need something
in this moment. Yeah, yeah.
And I'll just echo what you shared, Samantha, around knowing when to do these practices outside of when we're in moments of crisis, because we are, as we practice in our everyday life, hopefully we're building our inner resources and capacity to be able to handle those bigger moments of panic and distress.
And so I always encourage my students to not just practice the deep breathing stop technique when you are having an actual panic attack, because in those moments, as someone that has suffered and lived with panic attacks for a long time, it's so hard to remember.
Right. And I love the idea of using words.
Something I'll tell myself often is I'm alive.
Right. Because I can feel really distant and far from my body in those moments.
I also love what you mentioned around grounding.
I think a lot of the times in meditation, also in talk therapy, too, we focus so much on working with the mind and we forget about the body that is carrying and responding to whatever it is that is causing that distress.
So I would also just add tending to your body.
So deep breathing is great when we are hyper aroused, right?
When our breathing is fast, we can take some longer, slower, deep breaths.
A deep breath that I love is the vu breath.
So as you breathe in, on the exhale, you just say vu.
And you can actually feel your nervous system start to settle and ground and center.
I would even say, you know, maybe this is controversial meditation teacher.
not to do meditation right away because there is a science around how meditation can be more activating and triggering in the moment because someone that is dealing with panic and anxiety, their mind is going to reflexively go back to moments of distress because it's all about cultivating attention,
right? So taking care of your body before you even try to meditate because you may find that meditation is not helpful and is not allowing you to feel properly resourced and regulate your mind and body in those moments.
What's the science behind the vu sound?
I feel like I had read somewhere that humming is something about calming, but is it in that vein?
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So our vagus nerve, which is the rest and digest part of our nervous system, runs from the base of our brainstem all the way down to just where our tailbone is.
So think about all the different organs that are along that pathway.
And so as we breathe in and we do that vu sound, we're activating the vagus nerve, and that is also activating these other organs in our bodies that are commonly right.
If you've ever had a panic attack, you know your chest is tight, your stomach has the butterflies.
And so I imagine in those moments, like the vagus nerve is connecting to all those organs and kind of opening them up so that we can actually feel the calming and healing effects of our own breath and voice.
I think that's really powerful.
So it's all connected.
It's just connected to the vagus nerve that's in the body that signals that we're safe and centered.
Yeah, I'm definitely going to be doing some boo sounds.
Yeah, it's great. Highly recommend.
Can we do it right now?
Do we have enough time to do this just so that you can feel it?
Okay, so take a deep breath.
We're all doing it?
Yeah, all going to do it.
So take a deep breath.
On the exhale, making that boo sound.
Emptying the breath out of the body completely and then allowing the inhale to happen.
So breathing in. And again, making that boo sound on the exhale.
So we'll do it one more time.
Inhaling and exhaling.
And then just notice how you feel in this moment.
Feels good, right? Yeah, I feel like tingly.
up in my head yeah but I also I will admit I did get up a little in my head I was like this is like like I'm not a good singer yeah I mean I was like a little pitchy like yes and I hear this all the time from people and I'm always like your fear of looking stupid is getting in the way of healing did
you know what I mean it's like I can't hit that falsetto like just do the breath and I'm out here like yeah I'm giving it all I got help help me do it and see what happens oh that's so lovely it's like there's a lot of things but I love what you're saying like both of you but about practicing it it
went in the moments when we're not there to try to so it'll be more like it'll be more available for Tori when you know she's in the middle of it I think that's wonderful absolutely oh all right we're tingly moving into the next question I really love that thank you both um and thank you Tori and good
luck that we just Again, I echo what I said at the top.
We're sending vu vibrations your way.
Okay, let's take our next question from C.
Hi, dear Headspace.
This is C from Australia.
The past year in 2023 has been filled with many ups and downs as my family of four, including myself, moved overseas to try and create a new life and one that is different from how we grew up in the hope of offering something different for our kids.
But merely five months into our new life, noting that job search can be tough, I found a job, but my partner struggled with securing one and he decided this is not for him.
So by the end of 2023, he brought the kids back home with him while I stayed behind to make things work since I was the only one with the job.
I genuinely enjoyed my new life no matter how tough it felt because it seems like a step towards making choices that really reflect my own personal values rather than what is dictated by societal norms and I've learned so much.
Every day I question my purpose for staying behind though when my kids are not here and yet I know I really want to be able to cover something different for all of us.
I guess I'm also still feeling a lot of resentment towards my partner for living.
They say to be true to yourself and to live a life that feels genuine to you and not for others but i feel like i really struggle to find peace in my situation when i realized my values are so different from my partner i feel like no one can really help me see the light at the end of the tunnel so i
decided to record this and i look forward to hear what your advice would be thank you Thank you for your question, C.
This is a really big question, and there's so many different aspects in this, from relationship communications to the resentments and the feelings.
I mean, let's start with the communication side of things, because, I mean, that's the first thing that jumped out at me is, like, are you talking about this with your partner?
So I'm curious what y 'all think.
Like, I mean, I'm in a relationship, but like newly in a relationship.
And so I'm looking towards y 'all to let me know how do you navigate having different values from your partner?
Because it's something I'm still actively learning about.
And I'm not afraid to say that whatsoever.
But I'm curious if that's come up with you all in your own relationships around, you know, having to choose yourself versus also considering someone else's feelings.
I mean, all long term relationships are built with that.
That's all of it. Yeah, we're all on like growth journeys and the more you grow, especially when you've been with someone for a long time, my husband and I are getting ready to celebrate 17, 16 years of marriage and we've known each other for 24 and since I was 17.
But in that time, like one thing I have noticed is just about myself is I have learned, I mean, I was 17.
So, of course, where I am now, I have grown to be so many different versions of myself.
And it always has been important for us to be able to communicate when things friction comes up because not because we're doing anything, but because we are different versions of ourselves that have to meet each other and choose each other and communicate all over again.
Over and over and over again.
Over and over and over and over again.
And sometimes it's every day.
Sometimes it's twice a day or three times.
It just depends. And one thing that stood out for me, though, is like the cultural aspect of this conversation with C.
And that really plays a part in how we show up My husband is Nigerian I am Black American And so there's a cultural nuance there Of having to learn a different dance And so it sounds like, see, they came here And so once you come to a different culture You learn different cultural ways And maybe align
with some of those and have to work through that.
But it is really hard to choose yourself in these situations all the time.
Well, because there's like all those day -to -day things like you were just talking about, Samantha, like the re -choosing, like you don't close the kitchen cabinets, things like that.
But then there's these big things like whether or not you want to have children or whether or not you, where you want to live, how you want to live.
And oftentimes in those conversations, at least from my experience, only one person wins like and maybe win is the wrong word but one person has to compromise because it's you can't be c can't be living in two places so those questions need to be discussed more than anything and there needs to be boundaries
put around them so if i'm c and i'm saying okay i am willing to stay apart from the kids and you for this period of time while you search for a job here.
I'm willing to, you know, have you go back for this period of time, but then I want you to come back or I need you to be traveling back and forth or we need to or these are this is how long we'll stay apart for.
And there needs to be a compromise to me in the middle because it is unfair and is going to build resentment if one person is making all of the sacrifice and the other.
Now, we don't know the other side of it, but like this is a conversation that may even need to be mediated, you know, because it's it has to be fair and it has to be fair to both parties.
Yeah, yeah. I think, too, like I know we're talking about like the marriage and communication, but if we're just centering C and thinking about the need to give yourself some grace and some self -compassion, even even forgiveness for the decisions that you made and you may feel like you regret those
decisions or not. But on the journey to knowing you and getting to know you and staying true to yourself, there's a lot of self -work that has to be done.
And sometimes in doing that self -work, it can really take you farther away from your partner and your partner has to be willing to meet you where you are at the work that you've been doing.
Absolutely. Absolutely.
I keep thinking about kids.
It's like sometimes in my head I have this visual of like you're together to compromise to meet in the middle because it is unfair and is going to build resentment if one person is making all of the sacrifice and the other.
Now, we don't know the other side of it.
But, like, this is a conversation that may even need to be mediated, you know, because it has to be fair and it has to be fair to both parties.
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I think, too, like I know we're talking about like the marriage and communication, but if we're just centering C and thinking about the need to give yourself some grace and some self -compassion, even even forgiveness for the decisions that you made, that you may feel like you regret
those decisions or not.
But on the journey to knowing you and getting to know you and staying true to yourself, there's a lot of self -work that has to be done.
And sometimes in doing that self -work, it can really take you farther away from your partner.
And your partner has to be willing to meet you where you are at the work that you've been doing.
Absolutely. Absolutely.
I keep thinking about kids.
It's like, sometimes in my head, I have this visual of, like, you're together, together, together.
You have kids, and then you start to drift, and then there's a point where they get older and you have to choose to come back.
You have to be like, hey, remember me?
We've been in triage for a very long time.
What are the things we liked about each other?
What are the things that we, like, there's the coming back to one another.
But I also heard in this question some guilt.
Like, there's, like, a moment where C was like, and I'm enjoying this new life, however.
And so, Dora, I'm wondering if you could speak to that piece a little bit about like how you like you're making the best of the situation.
That doesn't mean you should feel bad about it.
Yeah, I think what's coming up for me in this moment is seeing if we can orient ourselves to noticing and focusing on what is going well in this moment.
If it's for a period of time that you are away from your family and this is just it for the time being, knowing that it's not going to last forever.
Well, how can you then focus on the good of this opportunity?
What can you and even including your partner in that as well?
So it's less of like, I'm enjoying all of this good stuff and you're over there, but it's like that could be an opportunity for you all maybe each week to come together and just focus and remind each other around like, what's really working for us right now?
What have we discovered about ourselves?
What have you been enjoying?
What have you been discovering?
And using that as an opportunity for connection.
I think guilt sometimes can be seen as like a bad and like a really negative thing, but also can be really motivating in moments as well to take action and to, you know, spark change and transformation.
So I would say if possible, if it feels good, just to see if you can focus on what's going well and what's working out for you rather than what's not working out, because it's so easy to get caught up in, you know, I'm away, I'm out with my kids, this isn't working out, I don't know.
And then it's like you miss out on the opportunity that's right in front of you.
Years later from now, you may be like, wow, I wish I really would have enjoyed that opportunity when I had it.
And I think one of the worst, I think for me, one of the most unpleasant things is regret.
So that's where my practice really allows me to like be present in the moment so I can enjoy what's happening because I don't like that feeling of regret at all.
Yeah. I mean, I just want them to sit down with someone and navigate it because it's just like regret just builds.
Yeah. And resentment can really build as well.
And that's a house of cards.
Yeah. And I think that's been long term relationship.
It's so easy to have like hurts upon hurts upon hurts.
Yeah. Like you just need a clearing.
I think it's also reminding me of like how resentment can come from unmet needs as well.
And so I think this could be an opportunity to make sure that both of your needs are being met, you know, individually and also together as a unit, because that quite often will lead to resentment around like, I wish you would have done this or you should be doing this or like all these expectations
that we may have and not realizing that there's a part of us usually connected to the heart that is like yearning and desiring for certain things.
And when that's not met, there can be so much like anger and frustration and guilt around that, whether it's towards ourselves or towards our partner.
Yeah, well, that's why I have so many questions about like, has C asked about this?
Has C expressed their needs, said what they want, what they need?
Because it is a completely different conversation if the needs are being ignored or if they have not been expressed.
Because I know that sometimes I'm very guilty of not of just being like, you should know them at my breaking point.
Right. And like not saying, hey, I'm edging up here to a point where I'm going to be not my best self.
Can you help me? Like, and that's very difficult for me to be able to do.
Yeah. Oh, my gosh. Yeah.
Communicating needs.
I think that's a cultural piece, too.
Like, you know, learning to communicate needs.
I love that. We'll see.
We are with you, and we hope this gets better.
I'm sending communication vibes and boundaries and all the things you need to take care of you so that this can be sorted in a way that works for your family.
All right. We will be right back.
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All right, here is a question from a young Headspace community member named Logan.
Here we go. Good morning.
My name is Shona and I'm here with my son, Logan.
we're sort of avid users of Headspace we use it for sleep meditation etc.
Logan has a little question for you.
Hi Headspace so my friend has moved schools and I'm quite upset about it because he was a really good friend and I've had experiences of my other friend going to a different school and not, well, being in contact with me anymore and I just don't want that to happen again.
Is there any tips you have for me for feeling better or just anything I can do to get myself to go and get ready for school?
So Logan struggles a bit with school and this has been a little blip for him and I think he's been going on about sending you guys a message.
And so he just wants to, he does his guided meditations, but if there's any special breathing techniques or anything extra, you think that might help him with being able to deal with the loss of his friends moving to a different school.
Thank you so much. oh thank you logan and and thank you mom for like creating a space for logan i mean it's how lovely that you have such an access to be able to talk about your feelings at that age just absolutely lovely and i'm so glad that you trust us enough to come to us with your question yeah
school is hard i i probably went to i went to like 11 school different schools before i had graduated from grade 12 because we moved a lot with my mom's job.
And I think a part of me would get excited.
But then there was a stint where I actually had made friends.
It's like the longest I've ever been in one school.
I think it was like for four years.
And I remember having to leave and just like it was a new emotion.
I'd never felt so sad in my life.
And they made like this big surprise party for me and like all of this stuff.
And I was like, wow, like these people are actually my friends and that part of myself is like here right now being like it is I just want to honor and acknowledge that losing friends and friends moving away is out of our control but it really really really hurts and it leaves an imprint and it also reminds
us of the capacity to care and love other people I didn't know that I could love people like that like such big feelings in such a small person and I was like what's going on?
I don't like how this feels.
Yeah but I still have the letters that everyone had given me back then and the little like board that they made me with like photos and so I would say write a letter and just share how you're feeling so that your friend has it because I know that they'll keep it and maybe that can facilitate a way for you
all to stay connected.
By the way you know I still have a letter from my friend Roger Park, who was one of my very good friends in the fourth grade and moved to Los Angeles.
I still have the letter in an old photo album.
And I just recently reconnected with him on Facebook.
It's just it's a hard time because you're trying to like, it's like there's a power imbalance.
You're just you have to go to school and you've got to go do what you're told and you finally find someone who's like you and then they go.
I mean, from As a parent, the one thing I want to say is like, there is more than ever ways to be connected.
Like back in the day, we were like, you can't call long distance.
And it was just over.
It's too expensive.
You don't call long distance.
Like my kids, like my daughter, one of her very good little friends in elementary school moved away.
They kept in touch on Facebook, Facebook Messenger.
My son had a friend who moved across the country and they played games together, like using Discord so they could talk in headphones.
there are more ways than ever to stay in touch while you go out and maybe join clubs or look for, try to find your other people.
But there are ways that they're kind of a stopgap if that's helpful.
Yeah, I just appreciate this conversation.
And Logan, my heart is just pouring out for you and mom, you too, because you're having to navigate this with Logan.
And I have had, I just visited one of my friends, and she's been my friend since middle school.
We didn't move away from each other until we were adults.
But I think that it is hard every time I see her and leave her to come back to Georgia.
And this applies, regardless of the age, is this feeling of abandonment.
And it sounds like there is some fear that are feelings of like you're being abandoned to now find new friends.
And so being able to navigate that and just tell yourself, here are the facts.
I'm not being abandoned.
I have an opportunity to find new friends, or there are ways that we will stay connected or find new ways to stay connected that will be fun and engaging.
Our parents may be able to find time for us to meet with each other, But when someone has loved before and maybe not talked to you like in this instance, it's easy to attach this situation to that one.
But this is not that.
Yeah. It's funny because it's like this, Logan, this reminds me of a very grown -up question, which is, is it better to have loved and lost than never loved at all?
And, you know, the idea behind that is like you open yourself up and you let somebody, we're all making faces here, but you let someone in and you love them.
And there's all that wonderful thing that comes with the love and all the joy and the memories and the intimacy, like that closeness you feel with your friend and that like like -mindedness, like, oh, you like this?
I like ice cream too, like all those things.
But then it also sets us up for the loss that, you know, that can happen if a person moves or situations change.
So it's like it's you're asking such a big question that we all think about in infinity forever.
Yes. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm just thinking about the loving kindness practice and sounds like Logan is a seasoned meditator.
And you can find a bunch of different loving kindness practices in the app.
But the beautiful thing about loving kindness is this ability to send well wishes and friendliness and kindness and compassion to people that are in our lives.
and also people who aren't maybe physically present.
And so I encourage you to try that out, sending well wishes to this friend.
May you be healthy, may you be safe and protected.
May you live with ease and well -being because that can be a really beautiful way to stay connected.
I'm forgetting what meditation it is by Andy in the app, but he talks a lot about how oftentimes it's just the mind that can make us feel as if we're so separate from other people because then we have to add in the judgment and the rumination and the worrying and the overthinking and then that makes
us feel so so alone and so loving kindness can kind of counteract that thinking and reconnect you in a really special in different way so highly recommend maybe you and your mom can do it together and just share what comes up for you logan because it will be helpful as more distance is created in this friendship
and logan will you let us know how it goes we would love to hear from you okay you two that was just that was so lovely all of these were so lovely I'm gonna take a second to say to Samantha how we doing I want to ask you again Samantha how you doing and see if it's changed from the top of the episode
much better okay okay yay yay well I am so glad to hear that Samantha I mean like it's just doing this with y 'all it just every time I feel so much better after we just sit in the space and talk because it's just we're all so together and speaking of together.
Sometimes we're offering advice here in Dear Headspace, but there may be folks out there who need something a little bit more beyond meditation.
And Headspace is now offering mental health coaching that's available right within the app.
And what's really lovely about it is you're going to get one -on -one support from your very own coach, and it's going to be tailored to your needs.
Yep. Mental health coaches are trained professionals, and they are available to work with you to co -create goals and support you in achieving them.
Wait, hold on. I'm sorry.
I missed what you were saying because I was very busy signing up.
I'm only partially kidding.
Okay, moving on from my problems.
I wanna say thank you to our callers today for reaching out.
Tori, C and Logan, we just, we really appreciate you.
And if you have questions for us, go to sayhi .chat slash Dear Headspace and follow the prompts to record.
And that link is always in the show notes.
And guess what? If we use your question on Dear Headspace, you're gonna get three months of Headspace for free.
Three months. I'm excited to receive all the different questions.
And as always, y 'all know the drill.
Take a moment to sit back, maybe take a nice grounding vood breath and enjoy the soothing sounds of an indoor fireplace crackling.
And as you listen, allow your thoughts to drift wherever they may want to go.
Until next time, stay happy.
Stay healthy. and be kind to each other.
Thank you. Thank you.
All right.
