discussion keeps the world's turning this is round table you're listening to roundtable with myself plate young I'm joined by Steve Hatherly and at you shouldn't in the studio coming up imagine being asked to do something you really don't want to do but you still say yes because you don't want to upset anyone sound familiar you might be caught in the cycle of people pleasing.
Constantly putting others needs first, even when it drains you.
But why do we do this and what does it really cost us?
And… spotlights, subtitles, and serious screen time, Beijing is the main stage for movie magic this week.
Come with us as we dive into one of the 15th Beijing International Film Festival's most captivating picks, recommended by Mr. Steve Hatherly.
Our podcast listeners can find us at Roundtable China on Apple Podcast. Got a question that's keeping you curious?
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Now let's switch gears.
Have you ever caught yourself agreeing to a favor when your gut says no, simply because you didn't want to disappoint someone?
If so, you may be struggling with people -pleasing tendencies, a pattern that can drain your energy, confuse your priorities, and even strain relationships.
But why do we do this?
So, what does being a people pleaser exactly mean?
Casual to hardcore?
Yeah, there's a scale I suppose, right?
There's a spectrum here.
And also I think we need to divide people pleasing at the office and then out in your regular life.
because I think to a certain degree it happens a lot at work, right, saying yes to things that you don't necessarily want to do, but you end up doing them anyway because it may have been a boss or someone of authority that asked you to do it.
But just in general people -pleasing means that you are constantly agreeing with people with their suggestions, with their opinions, with their requests, you're giving into their requests, and you're doing this not because you want to, not because it's the kindness of your heart, it's not because you believe what you're saying.
You're doing it because you want their approval or you want their admiration or you want their respect.
You're not doing it out of your own beliefs.
Oftentimes, too, people who are people pleasers will apologize for things that aren't their fault they'll take the responsibility because they don't like the idea that someone else feels bad so they'll apologize for it and then they may even blame themselves not necessarily because they think they're at fault but they'll take it because they don't want the other person to think ah you are the problem this was your mistake this was your hmm I think in some way a lot of us has that kind of personality trait and to me at least you know I am the one who don't really like a lot of conflicts and in that case
maybe a lot of times it will just it will be hard to say no when people are asking you to do something that's another characteristic of people pleasers is that they find it difficult to say no to people they just want to make them happy another characteristic is you might change your personality a little bit depending on who's around you because you want to be accepted by a particular group so you might behave in a way that you think will make the people in that group happy which is not truly staying true to yourself and then And what it comes down to is that your own value depends on how other
people see you more so than how you see yourself.
All these points that you guys have made, they're valid.
But to me, I still think that, I suppose for our listeners out there, maybe somebody is holding a virtual pad maybe on their smartphone, on their bei wang lu, and they're doing the checklist. Do I check this one, that one?
But actually, I think if we have a little bit of these traits, I don't think it's a problem.
It doesn't necessarily qualify as people pleasing.
Because like what you just said just now, like the changing of personality a little bit, for example, of course, when you're dealing with your mom who you've not seen in a while, you want to be a little bit more like nice or maybe when you're hanging out with your girlfriend or a boyfriend or a husband or wife, you want to be a little bit more accommodating and you're acting differently to your co -worker and that's all fine.
To me being a people pleaser when it is casted in a negative light, it's more like oh it's really drained you.
It's a significant emotional cost that you're paying and you're not happy with that.
And that's the key right?
The first point you made there was having a little bit of these characteristics is okay right?
Yeah Absolutely, having a little bit of these characteristics is wonderful, but to a point where you're damaging yourself or your own opinion of yourself, when you're not behaving in a way that you'd really like to behave, that's when it gets to the point where it's a problem.
Sometimes you don't even realize that you have that kind of personality and also when you are going too far to you know please others can leave you feeling maybe emotionally depleted stressed and also anxious and in that case you it is a unhealthy personality yeah it's um you know how dogs have a personality right where they're not sure about that I didn't know oh yeah they're puppy and they just always want to make you happy right that's what their mission in life is basically and And sometimes, people can have a personality like that.
The hard thing is, is that usually people pleasers are really nice people.
Everybody loves them, right?
They're often the nicest person in the room, but this again can come at a cost, at a personal cost. I don't know if you have a similar Chinese expression.
We have a term, doormat, in English that refers to a person that people just walk over.
That's why I called it doormat, right?
Oh. You have that personality where people will just take advantage of you.
They will get you to do things, because they know.
They know that you will not say no. And they see that weakness in you if you want to call it a weakness, and they'll exploit that.
And if other people are taking advantage of your personality or your niceties or whatever in those types of scenarios, that's also when it becomes a problem.
It is. And if we go back to the people pleaser willingly or unwillingly living life like this, why do people do it?
Well, I think there's a lot of different reasons why they might do it.
And the number one reason might be that they were raised that way.
A lot of adult people pleasers, they began as people -pleasing children.
They were taught consciously or maybe subconsciously that they only earned other people's admiration and affection when they did as they were told.
And they were taught that their worth or their identity is directly tied to some sort of external acceptance or external validation.
And I think that's easy to understand because kids, they want the admiration and the love from their family members, but also when they go to school, they look up to their teacher, they want the admiration, the respect from their teachers.
So it's easy to understand how someone can cross that line of having a kind of healthy attitude about doing nice things for other people and also doing them out of some sort of obligation.
What you just described, I'm afraid, sounds dangerously similar to what a lot of Chinese kids go through as we grow up.
And I've been reading some case studies of mental health problems with really young Chinese students these days and a few of those case studies had something to do with well when you are a child or you are a teenager and you're not a mature enough to construct your own identity or see your own self worth.
And it's natural that we seek validation, this sense of worthiness from our parents, our family, the teachers, et cetera.
And one girl, she has completely lost her urge to go to school.
And one thing she said was that she always thought that her parents would only love her because she's So she's a kid that obeys and is as well behaved.
Also that she has good grades.
And if she doesn't have these things, then she doesn't feel like you're qualified, you're worthy to be loved.
But also I can see when parents are doing this parenting, they're kind of in a predicament as well.
cause you want to, I think most parents would want to make their kids feel loved and valued, but also you're kind of teaching them as well, the rules in life, how to interact with people and all those things.
So it's kind of difficult to dance on that rope, walk that line as well.
Yeah, it's a fine line.
And it can come from other people, not only family members, like parents and not like teachers, it can come from other students too.
I had a friend and he's still a very good friend of mine.
And we were having a chat one day about his personality.
And this is a few years ago, so in our adult years.
And he was saying that when he was a kid, he wasn't the popular kid in school, so he didn't get invited to a lot of things, which made him feel bad about himself.
So it transferred over to his adult years where people would invite him to things and he would say yes, even though he consciously knew I don't want to go to this, but yet he found himself saying yes to try to make up for all the times that he didn't get invited to things when he was a kid.
Psychology is super complicated, isn't it?
It is. Oh, this brings back some dark memories.
Yeah and also I think the boundary or the differences between just being nice and helpful and people pleasing is that when you are trying to do something for others in order to just find validation or just maintain that relationship and to get acceptance and then this may be developed to a personality of being a people pleasing you know and these kind of people will have also that kind of traits of being low self -esteem, overachievement, strong need for control sometimes because they want to make sure that everything is under their control and perfectionism to, I think, in this way they can maybe
to... It is achieving their things and achieving things that they understand as things that is good.
Yeah you might be Thinking well, this doesn't sound that bad, right?
I mean just somebody asks you to do something for them and you don't really want to do it But alright, I guess I'll do it anyway, this doesn't sound overly harmful, right?
But again, we're talking extremes here and this can lead to a lot of pent -up anger and frustration inside the people person the person who's doing the pleasing and this is because they will put other people's wants and needs in front of their own and that can lead to anger towards themselves if that makes sense right because deep inside they don't like this part of their personality if they're of it.
And then when you have that pent -up anger inside you, then that can manifest itself in a million different ways.
You never know how that's going to come out of you later.
Also that frustration, I think it adds up.
Yeah that's what I mean.
That resentment grows, but it's almost like resentment for the other people, but yet it's also resentment for yourself because you're the one who's actually making the decision.
And then How is that anger gonna come out?
And who's gonna be the recipient of that kind of anger?
It's very complicated.
Yeah, and when you say that, I suppose for somebody who's not in the shoes of a people pleaser person, might think, well, why can't you just say no?
And then this got, really sent me down a rabbit hole of a Chinese culture and international stuff as well.
When I look at this I don't know if this says much to do directly with people pleasing but in China sometimes it's when people feel I'm afraid of losing face or I'm afraid of making the other person uncomfortable.
And I was like does this have anything to do with people pleasing?
Before I share what I I think Yu Shun, do you see what's going on here?
Yeah, that has something to do with this person is hard to say no. So they cannot reject a lot of things because they don't want to lose their face or make other people upset.
Or it is just a strong desire to be liked in some ways, right?
Well, I think this mian zu thing, apparently it's even incorporated into the English dictionary, this face issue in our Chinese context and culture.
It's deeply tied to social reputation, dignity, and maintaining harmony in social interactions.
So in this case, the pressure comes from, when you think about it, external expectations, social norms, and the importance placed on the so -called saving face rather than a deep psychological need to please others.
So, people pleasing as a psychological phenomenon that we're talking about today could be more of that internal need of approval, but this mobukaimians, although sometimes it can feel very visceral, but it's very much the surrounding that is the censor of the pressure, I suppose.
But that's also changing in Chinese society.
And I have to look up to our fellow Gen Z young people from time to time.
I suppose, as urbanization in this country continues to push forward, automized society continues to become something that I think young people are very used to nowadays then is breaking up that traditional tight -knit social network or the social fabric that maybe people feel that you're you're under that social pressure maybe in smaller cities or the rural areas this is still very much alive and true but in big cities especially let's say if you change jobs you change cities, you move, you can reinvent yourself every time, to a certain extent.
So, yeah. Or you can repeat the same mistakes that you made before, which happens sometimes too.
I think what you mentioned before about the saving face, not wanting to make the other person feel bad, I think I understand that, even though it might be an aspect of Chinese culture.
Because if you're a person who's saying—let's think of a relationship, right?
Albeit a friendship or a romantic relationship.
If you're not comfortable saying no to the other person, then you might be doing that because you're afraid that you might be putting the relationship at risk.
Either the friendship or the romantic relationship.
And then if do that early in the friendship or the romantic relationship you start to set a precedent.
And when that precedent is set it's very hard to break that precedent and that could be another reason for it is that you're worried that, oh if I say no this person isn't going to like me anymore and they're going to leave me.
That could be, that's going a little deeper into the psychology but I think that might be a part of people pleasing too.
Yes. Yeah, that is also a part of showing maybe vulnerability, because when you are having that kind of fear of showing your vulnerability, it can actually suppress your true and authentic self and cause you to maybe hide your feelings, which can also lead to inauthentic interactions and over accommodating others, and that is absolutely unhealthy, I would say, no matter it's for a romantic relationship or friendship.
Yeah, well we've established that people pleasing isn't inherently bad, it can be a natural expression of kindness and empathy, especially when you're trying to maintain harmony or help others.
The problem arises when it becomes a pattern that compromises your own wellbeing.
So what do you do if after listening to this part of Roundtable, and you're like, yeah, how can I change this?
Yeah, just practice saying no, that would be a good tip.
Hopefully the next invitation you receive isn't to something awesome.
If it is, delay your saying no until the thing that comes that you don't really want to do.
But practice saying that.
Put it at the forefront of your mind, right?
Like Yushin said before, these are often decisions that we make when we don't even realize that we're making them, right?
So make a conscious effort to use the word no to someone.
Be careful, obviously.
you know don't hurt your workplace or situation anything like that but you could try doing that and then prioritizing you over other people self -care setting boundaries knowing that your time is important your energy is important your feelings are important keep all of those things at the forefront of your mind and practice them to letting other people know that you're on a journey of self -care and all this stuff and you know that could be a path to discovery oh yeah that sounds really polite and nice by the way and um the canadians we're well known for our manners yeah that's a good reputation to
have and i remember one sentence that from one of my uh a series that i really like that's scott adam's family i think oh it's called wednesday i mean the main character yes wednesday right yes and she has a really really cool and bossy sensei i don't need your validation Oh yeah, yeah, exactly.
Just imagine and remember that sense in your mind.
I don't need your validation and everyone, to be honest, everyone in your life could be a passersby through the whole of your lifetime, you know, even though you've known him for like 10 years and compared to the whole time of your lifetime, it's just a small part of your life.
In the end, people pleasing is a delicate dance between kindness and self -sacrifice Otherwise, while it might be natural to want to bring joy to others, it's crucial to remember that true respect starts with respecting yourself.
Learning to say no and setting boundaries isn't selfish.
It's a powerful act of self -care that ensures your giving your best, not your leftover.
Coming up next, the 15th Beijing International Film Festival is pulling focus in the film world, and we've picked one film that truly caught our eye.
Curious? Stay tuned.
Looking for passion?
How about fiery debate?
Want to hear about current events in China from different perspectives?
lives, then tune in to Round Table where East meets West and understanding is the goal.
You're listening to Round Table with myself, Hyung Young.
I'm joined by Steve Hatherly and Yu Shoo.
The reels are spinning, the stars are out and Beijing is basking in cinematic glory.
The 15th Beijing International Film Festival is rolling out the drama and dazzle and we've What a film that might just still your heart or shake your core.
That's what I felt when I watched it!
Steve, what's your recommendation?
This is the 1995 film by David Fincher called Seven.
Have you seen it, Yuxin?
Yes, unfortunately no. Unfortunately no?
In Chinese it would be called Xi Zong Zui.
Also the Seven Deadly Sins.
Yeah, that's what it's referring to This is starring Brad Pitt and Morgan Freeman.
It's an old movie Thirty yeah Thirty years old it's it's a neo -noir crime thriller and The story follows two detectives one is Brad Pitt one is Morgan Freeman And they're on the hunt for a serial killer who justifies his homicides as embodiments of the seven deadly sins.
You should know, as you said.
There's lots of themes going on in this movie, morality, corruption, the battle between good and evil that's happening in these kind of modern day decaying urban environments.
There's so much happening in this film.
The acting is spectacular and I loved it.
Still, this is one of my favorite movies of all time.
Why do you love it that much?
Well, first of all, when they made the film, they didn't expect that people were going to like this.
They thought it was going to fail because they thought when they did the screening for this movie, they thought, oh, this is too dark.
This is way too dark.
I mean, literally the movie, you're constantly in darkness.
It's raining almost every single day in the film.
It's always raining, and it's always dark outside, except for one very important scene that I won't tell you about, but for me, that's one of the reasons that I love it so much is because a lot of times movies or TV dramas, they'll go with that theme of darkness a little bit.
They'll dip their toes in the darkness pool.
Seven dives straight into the deep end.
You are on the edge of your seat along with the detectives.
You, as the viewer, are feeling the same tense feelings that the detectives are feeling and there's only certain moments in the film.
One of them is when Morgan Freeman goes over to Brad Pitt's house.
He and his wife invite him over for dinner.
And, of course, it's raining outside but that's a moment that lets you kind of breathe and catch your breath.
And then they go straight back to trying to catch the killer again.
So, you're in it with them.
It's one of the reasons I love it so much. Yeah, and I have to admit this was not the My favorite film by David Fincher, my favorite was Fight Club, also Brad Pitt yes and of the same director but it came out a few years later but anyhow, David Fincher is the king of what you mentioned Steve, neo -noir aesthetic and that's the low lighting shadowy frames, monochrome, tones and a generally desaturated palette that evokes unease and tension and I remember watching this film visual language as a teenager for the first time, and so much violence.
I loved it, and it was the first it was eye -opening and for our Chinese viewers, Seven was never shown on the big screen in China until now.
At the 15th Beijing International Film Festival, audiences finally get to experience this Classic in 4K, that means sharper images, deeper shadows, and every chilling detail just as David Fincher intended.
And just quickly, don't think, roundtable suggested this fun family film.
I'm gonna bring the kids.
Do not let your children anywhere near this movie, you'll scar them for 30 years or more.
And if you are not the type of person who loves a really dark, twisted film, this one might not be for you either.
But if you do enjoy that kind of storyline, I think I can almost guarantee Seven will become an instant favorite of yours You know that Ideas of you've all been introducing, you know intertwining the seven deadly sins and their storyline and the plot Really intrigued me and you got it.
You got to see this movie Yeah, and also this kind of a re release of the high -definition and it could be so exciting to see that classic movie to be you know sharper and more immersive with a high definition yes so at the Beijing Film Festival not only are there awards being handed out there's also many wonderful movies that you can check out at the same time so It's it's a moment a thrill ride for film lovers and a sharp reminder.
Movies still move us, shake us, and perhaps deserve their places in our lives.
And that brings us to the end of today's roundtable.
Thank you so much, Steve Hatherly and Youshun for joining the discussion.
I'm Hai Yang. We will see you next time.
