podcast.
Hey everyone, it's Dan bringing you another Sporkful reheat.
Actually, no, I'm bringing you two in one.
This is two classic Sporkful episodes in one reheat.
First up is my conversation over lunch with Phoebe Robinson.
She is an incredibly funny comedian, a writer, an actor, and podcaster, and also...
By the way, one of the best Instagram follows around.
These days, Phoebe is on tour for her latest stand-up show.
For dates and tickets, go to PhoebeRobinson.com.
Then later in the show we're going to revisit my conversation with husband and wife comedians Natasha Leggero and Moshe Kasher.
You might know them from their Netflix special or long-running podcast, The Endless Honeymoon, where they dispense relationship advice.
Today's reheat.
They help me and my wife Janie as we try to resolve some of our marital conflicts involving hand soap and hosting dinner parties.
Of course, as always, if there's an episode you want us to pull out of the Sporkful deep freezer a classic from the archives drop me a line.
We take requests.
Send me an email or voice memo to hello at sporkful.com.
Tell me your first name, location, what episode you want to hear, and why.
Thanks so much, and enjoy.
This episode contains explicit language.
I think I might do the Cubano.
All right.
There's a fruit relish, so there you go.
That's healthy, yeah.
It's basically a salad.
Oh, my God.
This is comedian Phoebe Robinson.
You know her from Two Dope Queens and her current podcast, So Many White Guys.
That's so with three O's, by the way.
What are you thinking, Dan?
I'm torn.
Are you thinking Brekkie?
I mean... I don't think so.
Oh, wait, they have biscuits and gravy.
Yo, yo, yo, yo, yo.
Should we get that?
Yeah yeah yeah, i gotta do that.
You can't because i was.
I was tempted and maybe i'll.
I gotta try some years.
Then why don't i get the cubano?
Yeah, and you get that, and we can go halves.
That's great.
Okay, i'm so excited.
All right, today on the sporkful, we're hanging out with phoebe robinson.
She and I will trade strategies for eating big meals and tight jeans and we'll talk about how to share food on a first date in a way that isn't creepy.
Plus, Phoebe tells me why certain foods are off limits when she's eating with someone who isn't also black.
As was the case with her ex-boyfriend.
I never ate watermelon in front of him.
Like, I'm like, I just can't.
Even after three or four years?
I'm like, I know we're together, but it's just, I don't know.
It's just like a weird, society just makes me feel weird about stuff.
Stick around.
This is The Sporkful.
It's not for foodies, it's for eaters.
I'm Dan Pashman.
Each week on our show, we obsess about food to learn more about people.
As I said, Phoebe Robinson is a comic, but she's also a writer, actor, and podcast host.
For several years she co-hosted Two Dope Queens, along with her good friend and fellow comedian, Jessica Williams.
The show started as a podcast, now it's an HBO comedy special.
Welcome to Tudor Queen!
The audience was right there with us and it was just like wall-to-wall laughs.
Talking to these guests, it's a dream.
I was surprised at how bougie John Stewart was with the pizza.
Generally, pizzas are warm.
In the last few years, Phoebe's career has just gotten bigger and bigger.
She played Ciara in the film What Men Want earlier this spring.
When Michelle Obama went on her book tour, Phoebe interviewed Michelle on stage at several events.
And season four of Phoebe's podcast, So Many White Guys, just launched.
Yes, babies!
Phoebe Robinson here.
I'm back with a brand new season of So Many White Guys with WNYC Studios.
You know the show where I do a bunch of hard-hitting interviews with incredible people who aren't just a bunch of white guys.
Yeah, that one.
I mean you can call me the Christiane Amapour of Comedee, the Diane Sawyer of Podcast, the Connie Chung who didn't get married to Maury Povich.
I mean, girl, what you doing?
Anyway, I dig up stories.
On the show, Phoebe interviews a wide range of smart, funny guests.
Everyone from Terry Gross to Tyra Banks.
But no straight white guys.
Not until the last episode of the season when she interviews just one token straight white guy.
One season, it was Tom Hanks.
Phoebe and I met up for a late lunch at the General Green restaurant in Brooklyn.
She's been so busy with so many work projects.
I asked her how that stress affects her eating.
There was like a month where I was just ordering takeout every day to like my apartment.
It was like from a burger joint, from like Italian place, like Thai food.
And I was just eating, eating until I felt like I couldn't move.
It's not good.
What are some of your go-to's when you're stressed out?
Oh my gosh, I have a lot.
Okay.
So smart food, popcorn is like one of my go-to's.
I'm like, it has the word smart in it.
So it's like, it's not horrible, but it's like definitely horrible.
Like sun chips.
Yeah.
They put the word sun in it.
That sounds natural and healthy.
No, it's awful.
So like that.
And I really, like, I love, like, a nice penne vodka.
You know what I mean?
Just, like, sit at home with that.
The sauce gets like all up in the holes of the pasta into the penne and it gets like all yeah, you gotta mix it around.
Yeah, but then I'll do things where it's, like...
Sometimes I'll, like, stress eat healthily, which I always think is, like, ridiculous.
Like, I'll be like, I'm just going to eat really green today.
So it's just like salad, salad, apples, smoothie.
It's just like...
And I'm just like in the bathroom for like three hours.
It's like you literally just ate a farm.
What are you doing?
So sometimes my body would be like, all right, you got to release the stress some other way.
But yeah, those are like anything that's carb heavy.
I really carbs make me feel good, which i know is a horrible thing.
To say no, i don't, i don't know, it just feels you're being a little hard on yourself.
No, but you're not talking about heroin here.
Okay, it's gonna, i know, but i feel like like emotionally eating, which is what i do sometimes.
It's like not the healthiest thing to do, but you're right.
It could be drugs and it's not right.
It's like, you know, all things in moderation, including moderation, you know, like.
Most eating is emotional in one way or another.
I was working from home all day yesterday.
I couldn't wait to eat the next thing I was going to eat.
I was like, oh man, I'm going to go to work for a couple hours.
I'm going to eat something else after that.
It's going to be great.
Those are the highlights of the day.
Yeah, that's true.
It's hard for me to do... an appetizer and an entree.
That's a lot.
That's a lot.
And I wear skinny jeans.
And skinny jeans like look great, but they don't really like allow you to eat.
So I have to like not eat all day, and then I can wear like cute clothes and then just be like a monster for dinner.
And then do you ever end up having to like unbutton your pants?
Oh, yeah.
The other just just just and I had dinner.
We went to an Italian place.
We got like pizzas and like whatever.
And I think I had I had a show and she was going to go to a concert.
And so we were waiting for our Ubers outside.
I was like, all right, I got to button my pants back up.
And she was like, what do you mean you have to button your pants back up?
I was like oh well, if I want to go to a hearty restaurant, I'll sit down, unbutton my pants, cover it with a napkin and I can eat.
Such a good move.
Yeah, she's like, wait, is this a thing?
She didn't know about this?
Yeah, I was like, this is a Phoebe thing.
Wow, damn sure right yeah, she's never, she doesn't.
She's like this is bizarre and i'm like well, how else do you eat good food in public in massive quantities?
Yeah yeah, i have like different settings on my belt.
Yeah, like i have like the default, like normal morning setting and there's like the you know big meal setting and there's like thanksgiving dinner setting.
You know, That's the only way to live.
But she was just like, this is insane behavior.
And I'm like, I had the best meal.
Well, I'm with you, Phoebe.
I don't think that sounds insane at all.
Thank you.
This is a safe space for you.
Thank you so much.
And she's always talked openly about dating and relationships in her comedy.
This clip from Two Dope Queens comes from a period when she was single.
Phoebe tells Jessica Williams about an experience she had on Tinder.
And so it was a good conversation with the first guy.
He's a chef.
So we're talking, everything was like, fine, like, oh, like, when's your birthday?
Like, what are you into?
Really cool.
And then he was like, I don't know where he's like, what's your background?
I was like, oh, okay, my background, like where I'm from, I'm from Cleveland, Ohio.
And he's like, LOL, no, what's your ethnicity?
And I was like, black?
Like, you saw my picture, right?
You said he was white, right?
He's white and so i go black and he goes caribbean or american boo and i was like american sup and that's very trump rally of you and i want you to kill it.
Very trump rally, go on.
And he goes ll nothing, you're hot either way and i was like Sick.
Die in a fire, like kill yourself.
Yeah, detonate yourself, bro.
You need to start saying just crazy shit.
Maybe I should.
You need to just be like, I'm pure white.
I have this condition.
Oh, here we go.
Oh, look at those fries.
You can put that in front of me.
We're going halfs, though.
Oh, my God.
Oh, my God.
This is great.
Thank you.
Can we get two small plates and can we also get one extra biscuit, please?
Yeah.
Thank you.
I'm so glad you said that, because I didn't want to be rude, but I was like I'm not sharing this biscuit with you.
It's definitely not happening.
No i, i was.
I was anticipating that because also yeah, thank you, just feel free to stick your hands into my fries at any time.
Okay cool, how should we do this?
Because this is like messy um, scoop it onto your plate, we should get um.
Yeah perfect, we should probably get a spoon too, so i can spoon some gravy.
Oh my God.
This is, this looks so good.
Phoebe, I love that you and I are not shy about sharing our food together.
What are your feelings about sharing food on a first date?
Sometimes there can be boundary issues with that.
You just have to ask, and then it's fine.
I'm so down with sharing food.
Do you have preferred methods of sharing?
Because on a date, it can be a little bit like...
You know you ask for some.
It's one thing if the person cuts off a piece and puts it on the side of your plate.
Yeah.
Or they just say, here, stick your fork into mine.
Yeah.
Or they could put the bite on their own fork and then hand you the fork.
Yeah.
And that's sort of like a little bit more intimate.
Right.
That's a lot.
I like the, like, you just dig in, get a little bit.
What about if a guy handed you the fork?
Okay.
It's his fork.
Okay.
So let's say I take my fork, I stab a piece of food, and then I hand you my fork.
So it's a fork that I've already used.
There's a certain level of intimacy there.
I'm okay with that.
But you're still controlling it.
You're not being fed.
Right.
Like, but don't feed me.
It's like, cause I don't want, it's too like out of a movie or something.
It feels, I don't know.
It just feels weird.
Yeah.
I think the only time feeding is acceptable is if like.
The bite has been composed on the fork so precariously that switching the handle could lose the bite off the fork.
And if you're really in a, that's dangerous.
Yeah.
That's dangerous territory.
You don't want to waste food.
Right.
You don't want to drop it, ruin that perfect bite.
Yeah.
So I'm like, I'm slowly trying to get back out into the dating stuff.
It's just hard because I work a lot.
I feel like things have changed, like, so much.
And I'm a proud-ass feminist, like, for sure, for sure.
But I'm like, if a dude doesn't pay on the first date, I'm like, that is some bullshit.
Shit.
Are you kidding me?
Right.
You're not going to pay.
And what they just like, how do they actually navigate that?
Well, I've had someone be like they want.
You know, some guys are like well, you know, like we'll just like go like Dutch.
And I'm like.
This isn't a fucking field trip to Six Flags.
Like, I'm not going Dutch with you.
Like, we're adults, and I'm not like, you have to pay for everything.
But, like initially, I gotta like get the cute outfits and like put makeup on and like do all these things to look great.
You can like pay, but I also.
I but I also do feel like some guys have probably been burned.
We're like some girl who probably wasn't interested in them anyway.
Go out to dinner, they get like an expensive thing off the menu and then you like never hear from again.
Like that is, you have to be reasonable.
Like if you're gonna, I don't want a guy to spend 100 on me on a date.
That's absurd.
And on a first date, you're expecting him to pay.
Would you be conscious of how much the thing you order costs?
Mm-hmm.
For sure.
I'm conscious of that.
And I also, I don't do the fake reaching for the wallet.
I don't, I don't do it.
You're not even playing.
No, because I don't want to be like, because if you do it, then they might be like, oh, okay, great.
And then you're like pissed.
I'm like, I'm just, I just chill.
I just like wait.
Like, we're just going to hang out, but I'm not.
I'll sit here all night long.
I'm not going anywhere.
I know.
Coming up, Phoebe and I talk more about dating and restaurants.
Let's pick things up with another clip from her show with Jessica Williams, Two Dope Queens.
I've been going on more auditions, which has been fun, but it's also been kind of weird because I'm getting sent on a lot of like best black girlfriend parts.
You mean by best black girl?
I was like, eh, girl, get it together.
It's like...
So what are your parts like?
So my character, I'm like, the character who like, just sits at home and waits for, like my white best friend to come home and download about her life.
Okay.
And I'm just, like, watching, like, Moesha.
Hold on.
That's crazy.
Wait, I want to do it.
I want to do it.
I want to do it.
I want to do it.
So you're home already, and I'm coming home because I had...
I had the craziest date with, like, Patrick Wilson or some bullshit like that.
Oh, my God.
Hey, girl.
Hey, Sequoia.
I had the craziest.
That way Phoebe feels when she goes on auditions is kind of like the way she feels sometimes when she goes out to eat.
And we walked in and I was the only person of color there who like wasn't waitstaff.
And I was like, and I go, this is why I don't eat in this area.
Cause this is like literally always like what happens.
And like We were walking and like everyone was just like staring at me in a way, where I was like this is New York.
Like you haven't seen a black person eat fucking pasta before.
So it's just like stuff like that where I think I'm much more conscious of like where is this restaurant located?
If it's like in an area that's not like particularly open to people of color, then I like won't eat there, which is like a bummer, because i'm sure i'm missing out on some good food, but that's the thing that makes me.
I don't want to be stared at and like just watching just people color, just waiting on white people but they can't necessarily afford to eat at the place.
I'm just like that.
That makes me sad.
But so I know you mentioned your ex was white.
When you guys would go out together.
Were there ever times you would be at a restaurant where one of you would feel more comfortable than the other?
I think for both sides, yes.
Can you give me an example of each?
Yeah, I just think like...
We weren't like a predominantly white neighborhood.
They would always be like, what's this?
What do they mean to each other that they're eating at this restaurant?
Are they like coworkers?
Are they like friends?
Are they roommates?
And so that would just be like, no, this is my boyfriend.
Yes, we're on a date.
People date.
And they don't have the same skin color.
It's fine.
But I think like.
It was always worse like.
Walking around.
That's like when people will like.
Heckle us.
Or like say things.
And be like.
Like I had this one guy go.
Why aren't you dating an African prince?
And I'm like.
Where is he?
You know.
But it's also like.
Why does it matter that I'm dating like a white dude and vice versa?
And so that was always kind of like frustrating, like because we'll have like a good date and we'll like be walking home.
And then like someone says that you're like.
Can we just get like a night off where it's like fine and like no one is paying attention to us?
We just got to soldier on.
Like it's way better than it was in the 60s.
So I don't want to, you know, like we couldn't have been at the same restaurant in the 60s.
Right.
Which I guess is like consolation, but also like a backhanded consolation.
Is that like yeah, backhanded compliment to the present?
And what was the situation where your boyfriend was the one who felt less comfortable?
I think?
Just in general, it's just like he didn't want to feel like oh, people were thinking like oh, who's this?
Like white dude, and like why is he coming up in here?
I think he maybe might have felt more like the whole gentrification, like worry, like I don't want people to think that like I'm some rich kid who's like living off of mommy and daddy.
And I'm going to come in here and like change this whole scenario.
It's like he was like a teacher.
He's not like, you know, we're like same equal in terms of income.
So I think that was like his concerns.
Like he didn't want to feel like people perceived him as a threat.
So I think it was just kind of like it's just, we were just always in our head just being like I hope everyone thinks everything is OK with us.
So I think that was more the thing that he felt.
And I guess it's just like you talked about it, sort of like the sort of the exhausting feeling of like what white people think.
It's got to be like, you know, like tipping.
Mm hmm.
I'm an amazing tipper.
Because you want to combat the stereotype.
I over-tip all the time, yeah.
So when we leave this restaurant, should we leave a really big tip, or should I pay and leave a really bad tip to try to do the opposite stereotype?
No, we have to leave a really good tip.
Okay, alright.
Because they let us be here.
That's true.
You know, so we gotta like...
Help pay their rent.
All right, I'll tell them it was your idea.
Please.
Right?
Like, Phoebe Robinson said I should tip this much.
Everyone should start doing that.
My black friend, Phoebe Robinson.
She's like, oh, okay, cool.
Please sign all checks that way going forward.
That would be awesome.
That's Phoebe Robinson.
Coming up, I speak with husband and wife comedians Natasha Leggero and Moshe Kasher.
We'll discuss their marriage and their podcast.
Then I'll bring in my wife, Janie, and turn to them for some relationship advice.
Stick around.
Time to cook up some advertisements.
Welcome back to A Sporkful Reheat.
I'm Dan Pashman.
Whatever it is in your podcasting app, please do that thing.
It's the best way to ensure you'll never miss an episode, and it's good for our show.
So please go ahead and do it right now while you're listening.
Thank you.
Now let's hear my conversation with comedians Natasha Leggero and Moshe Kasher.
Yeah, so you guys may know this already, but this is a food podcast.
But we also like to have fun and get to know people by talking about food.
So our motto is it's not for foodies, it's for eaters.
Great.
So no special food expertise is required.
Well, we're big eaters.
We might even be foodies.
What makes you say that?
Well, one of our main pastimes is exploring and finding great restaurants.
So, I mean, what else is there?
That does sound like foodie talk, Moshe.
Yeah, I mean, how else could you qualify?
I don't know.
Wait, can I ask you, have we begun?
Yeah.
Oh, we're doing, oh, okay.
Hey, Natasha, we're turning it up.
Well, I was saving a story about why we're foodies for when we do the podcast.
Listen, we were not even just if you're listening right now, what you've heard the last 45 to 90 seconds is us when we're off.
So buckle up because things are about to change.
Now, what was your question?
This is The Sporkful.
It's not for foodies, it's for eaters.
I'm Dan Pashman.
Each week on our show, we obsess about food to learn more about people.
Today on the show, my guests are husband and wife comedians Natasha Leggero and Moshe Kasher.
They often perform stand-up together, as they did on Netflix in what they called their honeymoon special.
In one bit, they talk about Natasha's conversion to Judaism before their marriage.
I was raised Catholic, and it's much easier to become Christian.
Yeah, it's a really complicated thing to become Jewish, but Christianity, Christianity.
You just have to walk to a mall and walk by a lady's footlocker and they hand you a Bible and then you're Christian.
That's all that's involved.
Jews are like, there's a lot involved.
Why do Jews make it so hard to convert?
I don't know.
We don't want you.
But you would think they would want more members, since that membership drop-off that happened a while ago.
I am Jewish.
I can say that.
Later in that honeymoon special they call couples up to both, roast them and offer relationship advice.
Now Natasha and Moshe are offering similar types of advice in their new podcast, The Endless Honeymoon.
They do also perform and work separately.
Natasha is well known as a creator and star of the Comedy Central show Another Period.
Mosher wrote a funny, powerful memoir called Casher in the Rye, a play on his last name.
The subtitle is The True Tale of a White Boy from Oakland Who Became a Drug Addict Criminal, Mental Patient and Then Turned Sixteen.
As I said, Natasha and Moshe have their own podcast, which was quickly evident when we spoke recently, because they started off asking me questions.
What do you think is the most delicious fast food item item?
Like like like, not from like from a specific place.
Yeah, i'm not asking for the greatest fast food place, but i'm talking the greatest dish at available at fast food.
Uh, I know what mine is.
Are we talking old school greasy fast food?
Any.
I would probably go the burger at Shake Shack.
Okay.
Shake Shack burger.
That's a pretty good New York centric answer.
If you want me to go like old school fast food, I would say the Burger King chicken sandwich.
Oh, okay.
Have you had the In-N-Out burger?
I have.
I've spent my time in California.
I think In-N-Out is good.
You're being condescending.
I can feel it.
I can feel it in your tone.
But Shake Shack, to me, the bun is better, but the patty's a little salty.
What about you guys?
I want each of you to tell me your favorite fast food dish.
Okay, mine is going to be a little controversial.
But I would say that the chicken whatever the chicken in the chicken soft taco at Taco Bell is, whatever that slew of redness is is honestly one of the most delicious things not only that I've tasted at a fast food restaurant, but that I've ever tasted.
Moshe.
It's so good.
It's so good.
Listen, the engineer here at the studio is nodding demonstratively yes.
Just so you guys know.
Then it must be true.
Yeah, it's got to be true.
Mine is a cheeseburger at In-N-Out Shake Shack Close Second, and then any other fast food I will not eat.
Except I do remember thinking a Chicken McNugget was good.
Those are pretty rough.
Rough?
I don't know.
They just don't feel like... Sometimes they're like different colors.
I know.
Did you know this?
And I don't know if you had an agenda for this interview, but it looks like that's over with.
Eventually, the conversation did settle into some semblance of order.
I started off by asking Natasha about the foods she ate growing up.
I'm from Rockford, Illinois, and I didn't really even have sushi until I was like 23.
Yeah, no, the fancy restaurant that Natasha used to eat at was the local Beef-A-Roo.
Beefaroo is like Moshe thinks it's so funny because of the name, but it's a Rockford staple and it's like a
It's like where you get roast beef sandwiches to go.
It's like a drive-in.
Okay, gotcha.
But there's a lot of online.
There's a lot of reviews of Beefaroo people giving reviews in their car.
Just a guy in his car.
In Rockford.
Yeah, making deep eye contact with a camera going, Burger King?
Nope.
Nope.
Beefaroo.
Wendy's?
Nope.
Beefaroo.
And it was a very compelling argument, honestly.
It made me want to go.
You would not like it.
And am I right, Natasha, like your parents split up when you were pretty young.
So you it was you and your mom was working.
So it was like you were you were kind of the mom figure to your younger brothers.
Yeah.
Well, yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, my mom was very present, but also, yes, I was kind of in charge of the cooking and.
I would iron and I would pack their lunches.
And we all went to Catholic school, so I had to iron their uniforms.
Oh, this is so cute.
I cleaned.
I babysat.
I always had a job.
I worked at a grocery store.
I had two paper routes.
The good news is, things really changed one night, when there was a big ball that was being held in the center of town.
And her stepsisters got invited, but she didn't, but she snuck off.
I was kind of in charge of making dinner every night.
So what I would make is this little thing called Lipton rice and soup mix.
And it's like a packet or it's like Lipton rice dishes.
Oh, yeah.
When Natasha and I first started dating, she straight up bragged unironically.
She's like, no one. can open an envelope of food and make a dish with it better than I can.
No, I'm good at microwaving.
I know the right dishes that can be microwaved.
I'm pretty much an expert in all things.
Like I know how much water to measure.
I know like I know you don't want it too watery.
So I would make one of these Lipton rice dishes for my brothers every night.
And then we would go out to eat.
There was one restaurant called Lino's, an Italian restaurant we would go to.
And then there was one Chinese restaurant called The Great Wall.
Oh, and didn't your grandma?
No Thai, no sushi.
Oh, my grandma made the salads at one of the Italian restaurants in town.
Well, tell them about it.
It's an interesting story.
Oh, yeah.
So my dad told me that she was older.
Or no, she didn't have a sense of smell.
Oh, no.
She didn't have a sense of taste.
So she would make the salad and then have to smell it to see if it was right.
Is that how the story goes?
That's what he said.
What's your recollection of the story, Moshe?
I don't know.
I remember hearing it and being intrigued.
But when Natasha just told it, it felt like a lie.
Did it not feel like that to you?
No.
I remember my dad because my dad made us the same salad when he came to visit and he told us the story and then said how she would sniff to see if there was enough oil vinegar onion, etc.
And it's the old style Italian salad which has, like hard boiled egg, chunks of meat cheese, olive oil pepper pepperoncinis balsamic, that kind of thing.
Her dad came up to me the other day.
He's like a, you know, classic Italian guy, pinky ring and all that.
And he's like, you know, probably has had limited interaction with the Jews.
Although he does live in Florida now.
So maybe there's been some more.
And he goes, he's like, now Moshe, do you like garlic?
I was like, yeah, I like garlic.
He's like, how about linguine?
Do you know what linguine is?
I'm like, yeah, John, I know what linguine is.
He's like, now, do you like?
I mean, it was like basically a guy going, do you like stuff that's good?
Do you like good stuff at all?
Yeah, I do.
So that's a bit of Natasha's backstory.
Today, she's moved beyond food and packets.
She's into sushi, for example.
But Moshe is the one who's really into food.
And he's always been that way.
When he was a little boy in San Francisco, Oakland, for his birthday every year.
Keep in mind, by the way, that I was raised with a deaf mother, a deaf single mother who was on welfare.
So we're very poor as she tells you this tale.
But also all Moshe wanted for his birthday since he was a little kid is to go to a fancy restaurant.
So his mom would take him on his birthday every year.
Yeah, she would say like... To a place they couldn't afford.
Once a year we would go to like a kind of a high-end restaurant and we would have like a special meal on my birthday.
So I've been, you know, obnoxiously and pretentiously sucking juices off of my fingertips since I was a very little boy, on welfare in Oakland.
Since we're roasting people right now, Moshe, why don't you explain your...
Your diet, what foods you can't eat.
I don't want to get into that.
It's a food podcast.
Here's the deal.
I don't eat pork or shellfish ever because, you know.
That's a Jew thing.
That's a Jew thing.
And I just, you know, saying.
You'll eat regular chicken.
I'll eat regular chicken.
But only kosher beef.
Only kosher beef and lamb and stuff.
And then you won't eat fish that have fins in a certain way.
I don't eat—well.
I'll try to avoid all the non-kosher fishes, although I can't really keep track of what they are.
Like, isn't swordfish not kosher?
Swordfish, I think, is one of those borderline ones.
Yeah, that's exactly right.
In fact, I think the conservative Jews eat swordfish, but the Orthodox don't.
Yeah, like, it depends on which rabbi is cooking for you.
Yeah, if it's a Charlie Tuna, he's all for it.
Right.
And then I try to avoid dairy products just because – Except for dessert.
Except for dessert.
But I also really like cheese and it's very complicated.
But I don't like raw tomatoes, and that has nothing to do with ideology or my body.
It's just the way that I am.
Do your quasi-kosher habits actually have anything to do with religious belief, or is it more like cultural?
Like this is how you were raised and at a certain point it's just too weird.
Well, the answer is kind of yes to both.
Basically –
The reason I started making dietary changes with pork and shellfish and kosher stuff is not necessarily because I believe it has any intrinsic value, but because I wanted to infuse my eating, especially my consumption of meat, with slightly more mindfulness.
And I thought you know here, I am a Jew.
I might as well take this system of mindfulness to reduce my meat consumption.
Since I want to do that anyway, why not infuse, you know, spirituality of some sort even into my eating choices?
Um, Moshe, why did you want to go to fancy restaurants when you were a kid?
I don't know why.
I guess I had like a strangely developed palate when I was a kid.
There was always something that was really exciting about going to a restaurant especially, I think, because we were so poor.
And so primarily we were it wasn't really sustenance eating, but it was definitely, like you know, co-op.
In bulk bags of beans and things like that, so that when I got an opportunity to experience food, not necessarily as just a staff of life thing but as an experiential thing, it was like super exciting to me and always was.
I don't know where I got that from honestly, because I'm kind of the only person in my family who's like could be classified as like, a foodie.
Right.
There was a story that that I read, that one of you told about a time kind of earlier in your relationship when you guys stayed at a hotel in New Orleans.
Well, Moshe and I, like when we first started dating, we started realizing like, okay, how are we going to, because like I like to stay at nice hotels and Moshe thinks that hotels should cost $100 a night.
And so I would just.
I guess, lie to him about how much it costs.
So you would book the hotel and not tell him that it was as expensive as it was.
Oh, no, no, no, no.
That's such a charitable interpretation.
She would book the hotel and tell me a price.
That was a lie.
That was not the price.
But then you'd only have to pay, like if I told you it was $200, you only had to pay $100.
Because I always tell them, please don't mention the rate when we check in.
And then I also tell them, please make sure you don't put a bill under the door.
Right.
But then this idiot put a bill under the door.
Right.
And we did get into a fight.
It became a big fight because it was – I felt slighted or wronged, because it was of the dishonesty or whatever.
But it ended up – I think this is what you're getting at.
It ended up with a nice peaceable kingdom solution, which was that I would pay –
Even though now we have joint checking accounts, we still do this.
I would pay for all of the meals and she would pay for all of the hotels.
And I would never ask how much the hotel was.
And it created a harmonious area in our relationship where there used to be friction.
And what's funny about it all is I really thought that I won.
But now I realize we eat three times a day.
We stay at a hotel room maybe like 10 times a year.
I think I got the raw end of the deal actually.
But is it –?
Are you also most of the one where like eating at –, like having some sort of power or control or say, over the restaurant, is more important to you than it is to Natasha?
It sounds like.
Like Natasha, you care more about the hotel and Moshe, you care more about the food.
That's true.
That's exactly right.
And I think we both sort of identified that.
We identified that like and I feel like a lot of couples when they fight their fight.
You know they always say that couples are having like the same three fights over and over again.
And that was definitely true for us.
We're having the same fight about the same issue.
And we just found a way to sidestep the issue altogether.
I don't think we've really had an argument about money since.
You hear that story and you can understand why Natasha and Moshe have a podcast where they offer relationship advice to other couples, right?
Well, coming up.
We turn this podcast into their podcast when my wife, Janie, calls in for advice.
Stick around.
Hope you're hungry because it's time for some ads.
Now back to my conversation with comedians Natasha Leggero and Moshe Kasher.
Janie will join us by phone in a few minutes.
But first, we have a little more ground to cover.
As you heard, Moshe is Jewish.
Natasha converted to Judaism when they got married.
I wanted to get their quick takes on some Jewish culinary staples.
So I picked a few entries from Tablet Magazine's list of the 100 most Jewish foods and told Natasha and Moshe it was time for a lightning round.
All right, let's do it.
Lightning round.
Okay, lightning round.
First up, Hydrox cookies.
That's a Jewish food?
Those are the ones that don't have pork in them.
Right well, Oreos are now kosher, but originally Oreos were not kosher and actually Hydrox came first, before Oreos.
Yeah, I remember we could eat those, and I remember there was a Muslim kid in my class named Khalil and the one thing we bonded over was that we both couldn't eat Oreos.
So yes to Hydrox, yes to Khalil, yes to Islam.
Natasha?
I don't know.
They seem like they might be dry.
Without the pork fat, without the gelatin or whatever it is?
Yeah, I'm good.
All right, next one.
Don't get it.
Why?
I know so many people who are like, it's so delicious.
And then every time it comes, it's like wet crackers.
I know.
I want to like it.
It's a food that I want to like.
Another one on the list.
The used teabag.
What?
These are the top foods?
Wait, is this the top sex positions?
No.
This is how bad Jewish food is.
Tablet insists that this is a Jewish thing to make tea from a teabag and then put the teabag aside and save it so you can use it to make tea again later.
That doesn't sound like a Jewish food.
It sounds like a Jewish stereotype.
I know.
Although I have to tell you that my wife...
She makes herself tea in the morning and the teabag stays in the glass and she refills the water over the course of the day.
But she would probably say that it's just because she likes it not too strong, not because she's – well, she's pretty frugal.
She may be trying to save money.
And it's a bargain.
Right.
All right.
One more for you.
Yep.
Rosh Hashanah, the Jewish New Year, is coming up.
Sure.
Apples and honey.
The best, best combo of all time.
What's even better is what you serve it with, which is grilled cheese or fried foods.
Wait, no, that's Hanukkah.
Wait, didn't we have apples and honey and then also we had grilled cheese with it?
That had nothing to do with Rosh Hashanah.
That's what we had on hand.
Okay.
That was so good.
I believe it was Maimonides who said... No, but that sounds like a great idea, though, Natasha.
I think that you're right that the cool crisp of the apple and the sweetness of the honey would go really well with the grilled cheese.
I think that makes total sense.
And also...
Grilled cheese with honey on it is not bad at all.
Yeah, we should always do that for Rosh Hashanah.
Really good.
You haven't mentioned the greatest Jewish food of all time for my money.
Which is what?
Which is, if you leave aside the potato knish, is chalent.
That is my favorite Jewish food.
It's basically Jewish stew, and it's the most delicious thing we've done.
Matzah ball soup, that's what I pick.
That's pretty good.
Matzo ball soup's your favorite, Natasha?
Yes.
How fluffy or firm do you like your matzo balls?
Great question.
Thank you.
Firm but fluffy.
Oh, great answer.
I don't want it falling apart.
I like that.
It's going to be like a ball sitting in the pit of my stomach eventually, but you don't want it to be hard.
Right.
So maybe you like a bigger matzo ball that's going to have more textural variation between the perimeter and the center of the ball.
Yeah.
Greenblatt's in L.A. has a really good one.
So, in the spirit of your podcast where you take calls from couples, I am very pleased now to bring in a special guest live on the phone from my house.
It's my wife, Jamie.
Yay, Jamie.
How exciting.
We hear you like a dirty teabag.
I was listening.
Actually, in my house, the whole family shares one teabag.
I don't know if that's legal, but we like it.
Janie, I was struggling to say for sure.
That's listed under Jewish foos.
Moshe suggested that it's a Jewish stereotype.
Do you reuse the same teabag throughout the day because you like the way the tea tastes or because you like to save money on teabags?
I think a little bit of both.
You know, in the morning I need like the strong caffeine and then.
Yeah, I feel like it's kind of wasteful.
I don't like the tea so strong later in the day, so I'm not going to keep opening it.
I don't want to open up a new tea bag and then only keep it in the water for a minute and throw it out, so I'll just reuse the same one.
Sure.
I mean, tea bags are expensive.
You doing PG tips or what?
Yeah, what's your tea game look like?
Lemon lift is what I use in the morning, and then I love lemon at night.
Wow, you're healthy.
That's your jolt of caffeine.
That's impressive.
Sometimes you just need a little lemon lift in the morning.
Have you heard of coffee, by the way?
I feel like I need coffee at, like, 2 o'clock in the afternoon.
Yeah, yeah.
But sometimes, like, if I'm home in the afternoon, you'll say, like, oh, I'm really tired.
And, you know, as if they're like, what?
If only there was a solution to this problem of feeling tired.
And I'll say, well, would you like me to make you a cup of coffee?
And you'll say, oh, right, coffee.
That's the thing.
And then I usually make you a cup of coffee and then what happens to it?
I mean, I drink it, but it sometimes sits there for a while.
I think we're getting into your pet peeves.
Yeah, right.
I don't know what you want me to say.
Do you want me to say I drink it too fast or not fast enough?
Yeah.
Well, I often find half of it sitting around the kitchen like six hours later, and then I have to dump it.
You guys seem like what I would call a happily married couple.
Moshe and Natasha, is there information that I can, like, you guys take the lead here now.
Pretend it's your show.
Like, what questions do you have for us?
Janie, do you have a pet peeve?
Yeah, what do you guys fight about the most that is not your fault?
Nothing is my fault.
I believe her.
But what's your most common fight about?
That, you would say, is not because of something you do, but because you know.
Well, I don't know if Dan would say it's probably not a common fight, but there is something that I do that really drives Dan kind of nuts.
You know, one of my pet peeves is that I really don't like when dispenser like soap or lotion dispensers like the pump doesn't go to the bottom so there's like a lot left but you can't pump it out.
So i put water like the soap and like the dishwashing stuff, i put water in to the bottom of.
It sounds kind of like your tea situation.
Yeah, i know well, This is seeming oddly familiar.
You're like, if I can't get the last little drips of soap, I'll just dip a little teabag in there and swirl it around.
So, Dan, you don't like it when she does that?
I wouldn't like it either because then it waters everything down.
Exactly.
I go to wash my hands.
I want suds.
I need to see suds and soap on my hands to feel like I'm cleaning them.
And I go and I squirt the soap dispenser on my hand.
And also...
Because the water is well, because the water down soap is, of course, more watery.
It shoots out of the soap dispenser with more force.
Yeah.
So you press down the dispenser and it shoots out this like soapy water that hits me like in the shirt, like drills me in the chest.
It drills you in the chest, Sam?
How weak-limbed are you?
He's like, oh!
Soapy water!
The wound is deep, Moshe.
It's very deep.
I'm doubled over on my kitchen floor.
Crawling to a matzo ball to just ladle a little bit of soup on it to get some more energy for the rest of my day.
Okay, but you know what, Jeannie?
I'm actually on your team on this.
I agree that it's very wasteful, and I also— It is better for the environment.
I will water down a little bit of soap.
But I also, Dan, I relate to what you're saying.
I like a little bit of thickness.
Oh, my God.
I have their answer.
I have an answer for her, but I want to hear Dan's.
Yeah, Dan, what's yours?
Dan's thing first.
What do you think you guys fight about?
Um—
Well, here's a good one.
So, like, when we're going to have people over...
We both like we both do a lot like to we're both doing a lot to get ready.
I like to do the food because I'm sort of like the one who's I mean, Janie is a good cook, but I sort of enjoy cooking more.
But I sometimes get a little bit like worked up about you know, I want the food to be just right and I want it to be delicious and I want people to eat when it's hot.
By a little worked up, he means like days of anxiety.
Believe me, we're on your team.
We heard the drill me in the chest snippet.
So we believe you.
So it's something that we struggle with, because I want to be relaxed when we have people over and I want to hang out with friends and socialize and all that.
But the flip side is that we wake up at 7 or 7.30 in the morning.
We have kids, so we're up.
People are coming at noon.
And to me it's like to get ready for – sometimes it's 10 or 15 people coming to our house from 7 am to noon is not that much time to cook and clean and get the house ready.
And Janie will be like looking at her computer, checking Facebook for an hour.
She's like we have plenty of time, we have plenty of time.
And then at a certain point she suddenly freaks out and says, oh my god, we have like they're gonna be here soon and I'm like yeah, I was been trying to say that we need to like pick up the pace here a little bit, so I feel like sometimes my anxiety is justified.
Okay, I got you.
Can I take this one?
Yeah, Tosh, please.
Okay, so you chime in, but I just feel like I have an answer.
Thanks, hon.
I will.
I just felt like you drilled me in the chest rhetorically.
Okay, well, I found out about these things.
I know this is very obvious, but they have all these little things that are like these foam things you can buy.
And all you do is put in a little bit of soap and it automatically comes out as a foam.
It like mixes with water.
You can put a little bit of soap and water in it.
And then it mixes, and so you always have like a nice foamy thing.
It's got the aerator pump that kind of like foams it.
Right, right, right.
Okay, all right.
It's kind of awesome.
I bought it.
I put a little bit of Dr. Bronner's in it, and I had like foamy soap for like weeks.
It's great.
Wait, but what about the other thing, which is that Jeannie's out here like painting her nails and getting a tan and going for bungee jumping lessons and going for a swim in the sea?
And then Dan's there like, honey, the matzo ball soup, the matzo balls haven't been rolled yet.
Well, Moshe and I also entertain.
And what I usually do is do everything and then give Moshe a few little things he's in charge of.
Like I say, Moshe make a playlist, and then he would make like the best playlist, way better than I could ever do.
Like we have a Hanukkah party every year and he made like this playlist that was like Part Jewish rock mute, like any, any Jewish rock stars, and then like actual Jewish music.
That was really good.
You just found all this great stuff.
I think that what Natasha is getting at.
Delegate what you're good at.
Yeah, when Natasha's getting out of something that we've been – it actually comes back to the fight about the hotel and the restaurant is that we've been very good at figuring out the things that the two of us are capable of doing and setting our expectations exactly there because, like 90 percent of fights between people are because – uh, expectations that you already know aren't going to be met are not met and you're going why are my expectations not been met?
So genie will probably always lag on making the matzo balls dan, so probably you need to get up at six instead of seven and not get up at 7 and wonder where is Jeannie.
Because she's busy trying to get a bargain.
She's so pumped up on Lemon Lift that she can't stay in the house one more hour.
She's got to run that energy out.
And Dan, you don't know what it's like being a woman.
She wants to have her nails painted for the party.
I made up the nail painting thing, I think.
I thought that was the issue.
Janie gets showered and dressed in about 12 minutes, so she's not someone who requires a lot of primping.
I think she's just more of a procrastinator.
Is that fair to say, Janie?
Yeah, and I think that we are pretty good at –
Like division of labor.
Dan's in the kitchen, but I'm setting up the table and putting the chairs out and, you know, maybe getting the drinks ready.
But I do save it to the last minute, which stresses him out.
And it stresses me out, but I think that's just, I save everything to the last minute.
So I think that's just.
Kind of how I operate.
You know, there was a saying in 12 step groups.
It was my resentments are directly proportional to my expectations.
And I think that that is probably true.
Lower your expectations.
Well, just, you know, you already have the information, Dan.
It's not ever going to change.
This is Jeannie is the woman that you married.
And so get up at six and start rolling them balls.
That was not what he wanted to hear.
I'm sorry, dude.
So who's doing what, Janie, for our next barbecue?
Dan's doing it all.
You're cooking the pork chops and Janie's buying the foam.
Well, how expensive is this foam dispenser?
Get out of here.
Just to put it in terms that you'll understand, it's about probably will cost you about 42 teabags.
Well, Moshe, that's about two years worth of teabags.
That's a lot.
You're right.
I said too many.
I overshot.
There's no way you guys.
You know what?
Maybe you guys should look into relationship counseling.
All right, Janie, thanks so much for calling in.
You're great.
Thanks, Janie.
Thanks, Janie.
Love you.
Thanks.
Love you.
Bye.
Love you.
Bye.
All right, well, Moshe and Natasha, thank you guys so much.
I love all your work.
I love the podcast.
Oh, thank you.
Thanks again, you guys.
Really appreciate it.
Take care.
Thank you.
Bye-bye.
Bye-bye.
That's Natasha Leggero and Moshe Kasher.
Their honeymoon stand up special is on Netflix and their new podcast is The Endless Honeymoon.
This show is produced by me, along with senior producer and Sani and associate producer.
Our engineer is Jared O'Connell.
Music help from Black Label Music.
Our editor is Peter Clowney.
The Sporkful is a production of Stitcher.
Our executive producers are Daisy Rosario and Chris Bannon.
Until next time, I'm Dan Pashman.
I'm Rachel from Scotch Plains, New Jersey, reminding you to eat more, eat better and eat more better.
This reheat was produced by Gianna Palmer.
The team that produces the Sporkful today includes me, along with managing producer Emma Morgenstern and senior producer Andres O'Hara.
Our engineer is Jared O'Connell.
Music help from Black Label Music.
The Sporkful is a production of SiriusXM Podcasts.
Our executive producer is Camille Stanley.
And hey, did you know you can listen to The Sporkful on the SiriusXM app?
Yes, the SiriusXM app has all your favorite podcasts, plus over 200 ad-free music channels curated by genre and era.
Plus, live sports coverage.
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And there's interviews with A-list stars and so much more.
It's everything you want in a podcast app and music app all rolled into one.
Right now, Sporkful listeners can get three months free of the SiriusXM app by going to SiriusXMcom slash Sporkful.
Until next time, I'm Dan Pashman.
