With no fees orminimums, banking with Capital One is the easiest decision in the history ofdecisions.
Even easier than deciding to listen to another episode of your favoritepodcasts.
And with no overdraftfees, is it even a decision that's bankingreimagined?
What's in yourwallet? Termsapply, see capital1.com slashbank, Capital One NA memberFDIC.
When you think about thefuture, what kind of technology do youenvision?
Whatever the futureholds, artificial intelligence will undoubtedly be at the heart of itall.
Join Graham Class as he hosts season 2 of Technically Speaking and IntelPodcast.
And here from the Minds TransformingHealthcare,retail,entertainment, personalcomputing, and more with the help ofAI.
Tune in every other Tuesday and explore the latest technology that's changing our world today and creating a more accessibletomorrow.
Listen to Technically Speaking and Intel Podcast on the iHeartRadioapp, ApplePodcasts, or wherever you get yourpodcasts.
Welcome to Stuff You ShouldKnow, a production ofiHeartRadio.
Hey and welcome to thepodcast.
I'm Josh and there's Chuck and Jerry's heretoo.
And this is Stuff You Should Know withpodcasts.
Are youdoing? I'mgood.
I'mgood,you. I'mSchwabie.
No, areyou?Yeah. I'm a little beatmyself.
Is it just life or did you stay up till 5a.m.
drinking?No, it's just hitting right around the old naptime.
So, youknow, I'm withyou.
Do you ever dose off all yourstudying?
No, butI, youknow, I still try and catch a short nap every day and on recording days that sometimeshappens, but today I was not ableto.
Gotcha.Well, what would retire eventually tosay?
I'll sleep when Iretire.
Hey, so what do you want to talk abouttoday?
Imean, I prepped for a show on JaneGoodall.
So didI. And she's thebest.
Sheis, sheis, she iswidely,roundly, basicallyglobally,universally, probably seen as essentially a greatperson.
Yeah, I think she's cherished and for good reasonafter, did you watch the documentary for this atall?
By theway.No, Ididn't.
The future one from2017,Jane.
Yeah.Yeah,no, Ididn't.
It'sgreat. It soundsgreat.
I read a lot about it as Ido, but I haven't seen ityet.
I had to watch itstill.Yeah, it's reallygood.
Highly recommended if you're listening and if this is me hearing abouther, youknow, inspires you to learn more at all because it's a great documentary offootage,beautiful, beautiful color film stock from back then when she was doing herstudies.
And it'snot, it's not like anairy, it's it's narrated just by herthoughts.
And this beautifulscore.
And it just showsit. It's justreally, really lovely the way it playsout.
That'sawesome. I heard the car chasing the middle is reallygreat.
Yeah. Didn't expectit, but verygood.
So,um,drive,drive,drive.
Yeah. So we're talking JaneGoodall.
For those of you who don't know who Jane Goodallis, she is one of the world's foremost renownedprimatologists.
And she did it the old-fashioned way by going out into the jungle and learning as shedid.
It's called the School of HardKnocks, Ithink.
Yeah. That's the thing about JaneGoodall.
She had a high school education when shestarted.
She did not go tocollege, not for awhile.
And a guy named LewisLeakey, a famousanthropologist, took a gamble on her on purpose because he was looking for somebody who couldnot, who was nottrained, purposely not trained so that they weren't bringing a bunch of preconceptions to them to studychimpanzees.
And Jane Goodall fit the bill as we'llsee.
She's loved animals since she was akid.
And after just a few months started excelling at it and eventually changed how the world seeschimpanzees.
We didn't know much about thembefore.
We had a lot of assumptions aboutthem.
And Jane Goodall showed that they werejust, let's just turn those on on theirheads.
Yeah. How's that for anintro,baby?
That's prettygood. Thankyou.
Dowe, Imean, do we get more specificeven?
Oh, I thought we'd get specific as we went alongwith.
Sure, goahead.Yeah, so she was born in 1934 in England to her mother Margaret and her fatherMortimer.
Go ahead and forget I even said father Mortimer because he was not around much and he does not figure much in herstory.
He divorced when Jane was about16.
But especially after watching thedocumentary, if we're going to salute JaneGoodall, we are going to have to salute her mother because her mom was the one who waslike,hey, you want to figure somethingout?
Then go figure it out and go learn it and go do instead of talking aboutsomething.
Go out and do it because no one else is going to do it unless you doit.
And who cares that it's the the 1940s and 50s who cares that you're a younggirl?
Just go out and do itJane.
By God and shedid.Yeah, she very famously encouraged her to go dance on therain, feel the rain in her skin because no one else will do it foryou.
That'sright. And like yousaid, and this is what maybe set her apart from other scientists at thetime.
Sheloved,loved, and lovesanimals, like capital L O VE.
And that sort of flew in the face of the dispassionate history of how you studyanimals.
Yeah, biologists typically approached animals totallydetached, totallyunemotional.
They wereaware. Supposedto.
That was how they were trainedto.
And it makes sense in a way because there was a widespreadfear.
And there apparently stillis, among hardcore biologists and otherologists that studyanimals, that we humans have just a great propensity for anthropomorphizinganimals.
And how can you study animals if you're just essentially presuming that they're behaving likehumans?
Youcan't, if they're doing something that's actually not human-like and you're just misinterpretingit, you're being misled by youranthropomorphism.
So there was areal, the work around that they figured out was to just look at themdispassionately.
They're justanimals. I don't care what their namesare.
I don't care anything aboutthem.
I'm just going to study them as dispassionately as possible in the hopes of preventing fromanthropomorphizing.
That was the predominantview.
Andagain, it still kind ofis.
It's completehogwash.
The idea that there's just no inner lives toanimals.
And apparently there's still some academics that cling ontothat.
But it does make a little bit of sense where if you're worried about projecting your own feelings and values and emotions and thoughts onto the animals you'restudying, then just don't get attached to theanimals.
And that's what she enteredinto.
You know what yousaid?What?
They don't care what their namesare.
Well, I'm sure they have names likeRagnor, theconqueror.
It's probably a pretty regular name for acow.
I would thinkso. But you'reright.
But she flew in the face ofthat.
She loved animals as achild.
She would just spend hours and hours and hours as a young girl drawinganimals, talking aboutanimals, writing aboutanimals.
And not just birds are fun because theyfly.
Like observingthem, like a little miniaturescientist.
So she had recollections about bringing worms to bed when she was atoddler, atoddler, like one of her firstmemories.
Another was when she went to watch a hen laying an egg and like document that wholeprocess.
Spent five hours in a hen house as a young girl and her parents couldn't find her and hermom, youknow, called thecops.
They thought she had wanderedoff.
Yeah, and I saw very pivotally when she wasyounger.
I'm not sure whatage. But she was a young kidstill.
She was fascinated with the pigs that she saw in the Englishcountryside.
And she wanted to hang out withthem, but they would always runaway.
She taught herself to be super patient and to sit and get them to come closer to her and eventually feed them and won their trust thatway.
And that would later serve her very well when she started to studychimpanzees.
Yeah. And infact, that patience in thedocumentary, youknow, you mentioned LewisLeakey.
He was a very famous paleontologist and anthropologist who gave her her break in the 1950s when she met him inKenya.
I guess we should say she got there because she graduated from high school and waslike, you knowwhat, I'm not goingto, we can't affordcollege.
I'm going to go get a couple ofjobs,hustle, save money so I can go to Africa and study on myown.
But she got there andLeakey, she said part of the reason she got the job was because he wanted someone with monumentalpatience.
IE somebody who would sit there for what ended up being five months before she even saw chimpanzeesbasically.
Man, that guy would be like a senior VP at Zippercrooter just based on that one pic hemade.
Yeah, forsure. If you were aroundtoday.
Did you likethat? That was a little buzz marketing for one of ouradvertisers.
They have been around in a while so maybe they'll comeback.
Soyeah, Lewis Leakey apparently she started out as a secretary forhim,right?
Yeah. And then I guess he found out that she wanted to do animal studies and hesaid,okay, here's yourchance.
We're going to send you to Tanzania to studychimpanzees.
We don't know much aboutchimpanzees.
We want you to go find out all aboutthem.
And so at age 26 and 1960 she arrived in Tanzania with her mom because the Tanzaniangovernment, I believe it was still a colonial government at thetime.
If not then at least a transitional governmentstill.
They required a shaperone for someone in herposition.
So she brought her mom along who'd been a great supporter and booster all her life like yousaid.
And they also very importantly had a cook who was a local namedDominic.
And within a very short amount of time both her mom and she came down withmalaria.
And they were very fortunate to have Dominic from what I saw because he helped nurse them back tohealth.
Yeah, forsure. He was abig, it's kind of like part of the family from what Igathered.
That's what I gatheredtoo.
This is at the Gombe Stream GameReserve, which is now the Gombe Stream NationalPark.
And her mom didn't stay toolong.
She was there about four months but while her mom was there she helped set up a either set up or work with a medical camp there to help provide medical services tolocals.
So her mom was getting inthere, getting her handsdirty.
Eventually would leave to go back toEngland.
And Jane stayedthere. She was not withLeaky.
Didn't stay there withher.
He set her up with hisjob.
Also,apparently, was making passes at her because Jane Goodall and this kind of popped up throughout her career was a very pretty young scientist at a time when that was fairly unusual Ithink.
It's especially where she was located and she waslike, no thankyou.
Dr.Leaky, I'm not interested but I appreciateyou, youknow, entrusting this position to me atleast.
But handsoff. He said that's what I wanted tohear.
Yeah, I'm sure you wanted to hear justthat.
So apparently she got set up with six months of funding initially and she started to get really worried because at least three months passed and she was spending all day every day with a couple of locals who were walking her around the jungle looking like pointing out like this would probably be a pretty good place for chimps to showup.
This tree has a bunch of fruit onit.
They'd sitaround. The chimps wouldn't showup.
They did showup. They were covered up byleaves.
She couldn't see what they weredoing.
If shegot, if she moved to get a little closer she could get a betterview.
They would all runaway.
That was when she sawthem.
Like shewas, her research was in greatjeopardy.
Shewas, you have to have chimps to study to get more funding and continue yourresearch.
So she was starting to get worried by month three orfour.
And I guess finally she won the trust of at least one group enough that they wouldn't run off when she would just kind of show up and hang out and feed or watch themfeed.
And I saw that one of the reasons or one of the ways that she won the trust of the chimpanzee groups that she was observing was by kind of behaving likethem.
Like she ran around barefooteverywhere.
She would hang out in the trees for a long periods of time and just kind of tried to treat them or behave as if they were her peers rather than study subjects or testsubjects.
Yeah, Imean,she,um, thoseone, at one point in the documentary she's talking about the dangers of where she was in these poisonous snakeseverywhere.
And, youknow, all men are ways in which you could die out there doing what she wasdoing.
And shewas, and it didn't sound naiveeither.
She justsaid, youknow, I felt like I wassupp...
And she's got that great British accenttoo.
So itjust, everything sounds sogreat.
But she said she felt like she was supposed to bethere.
And that if she just treaded carefully and respected the land and the creatures aroundher, then they would like allow her to staythere.
Like these snakes were not going to come bite her and send her away because she'slike, I'm supposed to behere.
And it was really kind of a lovelything.
She really seemed like she fit in such that finally five months in with time runningout, a champ named DavidGreybeard.
Obviously she's giving them these names and he had to come look like me a littlebit.
He had this little greybeard.
Trustedher. He was the first one of that group allowed her to get closer and closer andcloser.
He eventually stole somebananas, came back for morebananas.
And he was the one that said to the otherchamps,hey, thislady, she's not toobad.
Look ather. She's overthere.
She's got a lot ofbananas.
She's hanging out and the footage of her and we'll get to whether or not this was the correct thing or notlater.
But the footage of her dead still holding bananas out in her hand and seeing these very large chimpanzees coming up and taking them from herhands.
And the way she's acting is breathtaking because nobody had done thatbefore.
Yeah, I was going to say today you could see somebody doingthat.
And the reason why you could see someone doing this because Jane Goodall was the first to doit.
Exactly. She had noidea.
She had no frame of reference for whether they were going to be violent toward her or whether they were going to throw their poop at her orwhatever.
She had noidea. So that was a real risk that she was taking by interacting with them thatdirectly.
And then in addition to it beingrisky, it was driving any academic who was aware of her work completelybaddie.
But because that is the nextman.
That's not all what youdo.
Not only do you not get attached tothem.
You certainly don't feedthem.
You don't interact with theirinfants.
You don't give themnames.
That was anotherone. DavidGreybeard.
Yes, I'm going to go with you and assume that that wasn't his actual name that she gave him thatname.
And that was driving like academicscrazy.
Like she was doing everythingwrong.
And yet it was starting to really pay off inaces.
Yeah, they'relike, you're not supposed to namechimps.
And she'slike, have you ever petted achimp?
Chump. It's like it'sworking.
Yeah, it really didwork.
Like, thanks largely thanks to DavidGreybeard, at least atfirst, who like you said to this lady's allright.
And then her patients and then her feeding them an endless supply ofbananas.
All those three combined to win over the trust of large groups and families ofchimpanzees.
Should we take abreak? I think weshould.
Allright, we'll be right back with more on Do You Know Who right up tothis.
Are you still keeping your cash in a traditional savingsaccount?
Ifso, you could be earningmore.
Muchmore. Infact, at public.com's high yield cashaccount, you could be earning an industry leading5.1%APY.
There are no fees or balancerequirements.
And you can access your cash whenever youwant.
Plus, you get up to 5 million FDICinsurance.
In otherwords, you can earn5.1% APY with the flexibility and security youdeserve.
It's time to take your cash out of a traditional savingsaccount.
It's time to take advantage of one of the industry's best interestrates.
There are nofees,period.
And you get up to 5 million FDICinsurance.
Start earning5.1% APY on your cash atpublic.com.
5.1% APY is at5.21. Subject tochange.
All investing involves risk ofloss.
Rokuage services offered by Public InvestingInc.
Member FinRUNSIPIC. Not abank.
See public.com slash disclosures formore.
Hi, my name'sJosh. I'm from the podcast TheImperfects, where we interview well-known people who look like they have perfectlaws, but like most ofus, infact, all ofus, they're often far fromit.
We interview people like James Clea and AdamGrant.
What do you do with the feeling of being animposter?
It's really tempting to trust your own judgment over otherpeople's.
What you're forgetting is that other people see you moreobjectively.
And I think what that means is if multiple people believe inyou, it's probably time to believethem.
Listen to The Imperfects on the iHotRadioapp, ApplePodcasts, or wherever you get yourpodcasts.
My name isCurly. And I'mMaya.
And welcome to The Super Secret BestieClouds.
Podcasts. A super secret club where we talk about super secretthings.
Yeah, like secrets that aresuper.
That's when itis. In eachepisode, we'll talk aboutlove,friendship,heartbreak,men, and ofcourse, our favoritesecrets.
Get inhere! How's yourspirit?
My spiritis, it'spopping.
I waslike, text youreggs, I'mlike, touch theblame.
Eagle will have you crying over a closed door that had nothing behindit.
And Isay, beyourself, havefun, and have a goodgiggle.
Listen to The Super Secret Bestie Club as part of the Microtruta Podcast Network available on the iHotRadioapp, ApplePodcasts, or wherever you get yourpodcasts.
As the number one audiocompany, iHeart Media gives you access toall.
Everyaudience, liveconversations, trustedinfluencers, and the insights and data you need togrow.
iHeartMedia is your accesscompany.
Go to iHeartResults.com formore.
Okay,Chuck.So, Jane Goodall is feeding chimps bananas at thispoint.
She's namedthem. Names all ofthem.
Imean, she really kind of had to get very creative with thenames, because she would identify a family lineage by like aletter.
So, like the Ffamily, all of the members for generations all had first names that began withF, like flow or flossy or Fabian orFreud.
And that's how she kept track ofthem.
Butagain, other academics would have just given themnumbers.
Like, maybe they all started with the samenumber, something likethat, but certainly notnames.
And from observing them thatclosely.
And I guess interacting with them probably had a lot to do withit, but interacting with them allowed her to get thatclose.
And by interacting thatclosely, she was able to see things that up to thatpoint, people had no idea chimpanzees were capableof.
One of the first things she realizes is that they have a huge inter-kick complex social system withhierarchies, like Isaid,families,alliances,territories, like all sorts of stuff that people just did not realize chimps were capable of engagingin.
Yeah, bigtime.Communication-wise, she found out there were at least 20 different sounds that they were making tocommunicate.
And that's in addition to any kind of body language or behaviors they may exhibit toward oneanother.
She was the first person thatsaid,hey, these guys aren't just eating bananas and berries andthings.
They areomnivores. They're eatingbirds.
They're eatinginsects.
They're eating babybaboons.
Sometimes she would figure this outlater, much to herdismay.
They would eat otherchimps.
But the big finding that she came out with that shook signs to its core was that she observed chimpanzees engaging in objectmodification, which is basically sort of proto-tool making when they would take blades of grass and sticks and things and strip them down or bend them or clump blades of grass together and shape them in certain ways to stick into ant hills most effectively and efficiently to draw out ants to eatthem.
And she waslike,hey, wait aminute.
Like the big differentiator up until this point in the history of evolution between us and them is that we usetools.
That's all everyone talkedabout.
We use tools and animals don't and that's what makes usdifferent.
She's like right here in front of myface, they are using objectmodification, which is basically atool.
Yeah. Like you saidit, it shook the scientific world to itsfoundations.
That was just such a huge finding that Lewis Leakey declared very famously that we must redefinetool, redefineman, or accept chimpanzees ashumans.
That's how big of a deal itwas.
Itwas, but I mean up to thatpoint, like yousaid, people just tools made ahuman.
Anything that could make a tool technically qualified ashuman, everything else couldn't maketools.
So it was a bigdeal. And then on top ofthat, tome, even moregroundbreaking, is that they realized that different groups of chimps used the same tool in differentways.
And that like say one group would use the short stick to get turnmites on it to eat them one byone.
Another group would use the longer stick to let a bunch of them walk on and then eat it like a corn cobprobably.
And that they would pass how to do that down to differentgenerations.
And that'sculture. And it's most basic definition that qualifies asculture.
And I saw it compared to how Westerners useforks, but people in Asia usechopsticks.
They're both the sametool.
They're used to implement to get food to yourmouth.
But they're justdifferent.
And they're passed down through theculture.
They're culturaldifferences.
And that's the same thing with the different ways of using a turnmitesstick,right?
And that isculture. So she discovered that chimps have cultures aswell.
And some of them open their presence on ChristmasEve.
Some of them wait until Christmasmorning.
Or all kinds of things sheobserved.
Yeah. That was a big surprisetoo.
They were terrible at wrapping presentstoo.
They were sosloppy. Another bigsurprise, well they just used the funny papers fromSunday, which can you blamethem?
Another big surprise was in 1962 when NationalGeographic, the Nat Geo Society that is sent afilmmaker, a Dutch filmmaker named Hugo von Lawick there to film herwork.
She was not thrilled at thisidea.
She really enjoyed her solitudethere.
She did not want some dude mucking up theworks.
And kind of quite honestly spoiling her scene that she had going onthere.
She really enjoyed climbing trees and being alone and not having to deal with some jerk with thecamera.
But she knew that's where the funding camefrom.
They needed this footage if she was going to continue to getfunding.
She put up with his guy chain smoking and throwing his cigarette butts around in thejungle, which upset her verymuch.
But she waslike, this guy really lovedanimals.
He was alsohandsome. And she said it became pretty obvious pretty soon that I was also the subject of his films long storyshort.
They fall in love and make ababy.
Right. That they nicknamedgrub.
Did you seeanywhere? Why they nicknamed their kidgrub?
I could not findit. I would assume because of a grubworm.
But what did hedo? Like did he was he famous for writhing around on the dirt or something likethat?
Why would you name your kidgrub?
Well, Imean, this kid was raised in thejungle.
I imagine all he did was writhing around in thedirt.
Okay. Imean, there's footage ofhim.
He's he was literally raised in a jungle in acage.
Soundsbad. But it was a big pin that they had previously used foranimals.
And she decorated it all up for for her son just to keep himsafe.
It was verylarge. It was like alarge, youknow, pin less than a than acage, but technically it's acage.
And the other thing she said too was that having her own human baby really helped herresearch.
It made her understand the how chimpanzee mothers behaved and viceversa.
And she said it really just added a lot to her her understanding of the familygroups.
Hey, that's prettyneat.
So around thistime, sowhat, that was the early60s, Ithink, that her husband showed up and her son was born in the late60s,1967.
Okay. In the I think in1963, National Geographic essentially told the world that Jane Goodall existed in what she wasdoing.
There was an article cover article called My Life Among the Wildchimpanzees.
And she was starting to recount this is the thing that she would become most advanced at in addition to chimpanzee studies is telling the rest of the world about chimpanzees in order to get the world to keep from driving chimpanzees and other animals intoextinction.
That was her kind of secondlove.
Yeah, forsure. Andagain, theystarted, youknow, her the fact that she was an attractive young woman came up in the press and the articles were framedas, youknow, beauty in the beast and a Nat Geo cover girl and stuff likethat, which it bothered hersome, but she did realize that that got more attention and that that inspired young womenbe, youknow, to develop interest in science and stuff likethat.
And so she waslike, it'sfine.
This is what we're dealing with here in the 1960s and it'sbringing, youknow, attention to mycause.
Right.Yeah, she would have a really good kind of a feel forthat.
And like I keep speaking over in the past10, she's notdead.
She just turned 90 in April and she seems to be doing justfine.
Her foundation says she still travels about 300 days a year doing speaking appearances on behalf of chimpanzees and nature and earth ingeneral.
A good example of her kind of figuring out or knowing a good PR piece when she seesit, her opportunity when she sees it came in1987.
I'm GaryLarson, who did the farside.
One of the great comic strips of alltime.
Youknow, ohyeah, they're that's going to be a subjectsoon.
Okay. So he did a far side one one comic panel or one panel comic of a female chimp grooming a malechimp.
And the caption is the female chimpsaying,well,well, another blonde hair conducting a little more research with that Jane Goodalltramp.
And the Jane Goodall Institute found out about this and sent Gary Larson a cease and assistletter.
And that's where everythingended.
No,no,no, of coursenot.
You're just beingcoy. Goodall was out oftown.
Apparently she got back intown, heard aboutit.
Thought it was very funny saidGary, you can tear up that cease and desist letter and book your ticket forAfrica.
You're goingin, you're goingin, you'regoing.
And that's whathappened.
She reached out tohim. He they they he came outthere.
He actually gave the institute permission to use the cartoon on T-shirts forfundraising.
She wrote a preface for one of his book collections and it turned into like this schoolfriendship.
Yeah. So prior tothat, we kind of jumped ahead a littlebit.
But prior tothat, she in addition to that National Geographic coverstory, less than 10 yearslater, she released her first book in the ShadowMan.
And this is around where she really became like a sciencecommunicator, which she's beenforever.
She was one of the earlyones, pre-saganeven.
Imean, she released this book in 1971 and it was telling the world again about all of the stuff she had found about chimpanzees and really just revolutionizing our understanding of chimpanzees and animals ingeneral.
And her work was so significant thatremember, she only graduated highschool.
Cambridge University came in knocking andsaid,hey, you want aPhD?
Because we got a seat for youhere.
Come takeit. And she thought about it awhile, consult GaryLarson.
Hesaid,hey, I haven't met youyet.
This doesn't make anysense.
And finallyagreed.Sure.
I'll take a PhD course with youguys,Cambridge.
That'sright. She got a degree in the study of animal behavior that's ethylogy in1966.
Now we're all over the place of thetimeline.
It'sfine. I hope everyone gets what it's following thestory.
Sure. For about fiveyears, she worked at Stanford as a visiting professor inpsychiatry.
Also became a visiting professor of zoology at Tanzania's University ofDarest,Salam.
While all this is goingon,though, she's notlike,oh, by theway, I'm just leaving Gombi for years and years at atime.
She was basically there from1965.
It was herhome. It was her emotionalhome, her spiritualhome.
She feltvery, very tied to Gombi into that specificarea.
And youknow, that was where she started a family and was raising ason.
It was herplace. So I didn't see thedocumentary.
Did they cover why sheleft?
Was it because of herson?
Because I saw that she was conflicted and realized she had to decide raise a son or studychimps.
Yeah. He had to beschooled, formally schooled inEngland.
But also there was the issue of hermarriage.
We might as well talk about itnow.
She started to travel some with her husband to other places for him to film because he didn't get all this work through netgeo.
Eventually, his work with them completely driedup.
So he had no reason to be there other than the fact that his wife was there and loved herwork.
But it was at atime. And he was one of these guys where he waslike,hey, youknow, work comesfirst.
And I hope you can supportme.
She did that for a littlewhile.
And then she said by that time in a very Englishway, shesaid, we had begunbickering.
And that seemed to be the kindest way to saythat, youknow, their marriage was kind of on fragileground.
And they would eventually part ways because of that and because of life andwork.
And it just seemed like it didn't workout.
Gotcha. So five years after shestarted, she established the Gombi Stream Research Center again in the Gombi WildlifePreserve, a gamepreserve, which means you can go huntthere.
She very fortunately met and married a member of parliament in Tanzania named DerekBryson.
And he happened to direct the country's national parks and went presto-changio and turned the game reserve into a national park protecting Gombi and itsinhabitants.
Prettycool. It is prettycool.
Unfortunately, he passed away from cancer five yearslater.
And from that pointon, Jane Goodall was a swing in sololady.
That'sright.And, youknow, I'm sure it was a tragedy for herlife.
But she's sort of ended up being married to her work and seemed very happy tobe.
She spent decades and decades at the GombiCenter, publishing hundreds ofpapers, all kinds of researchers and doctoral students have done field workthere, gotten their PhDs throughthere.
She is still veryactive, like yousaid, as part of the Jane GoodallInstitute, which is basically run byTanzanians.
And hasjust, youknow,she's...
It's easy to thinknow, like yousaid, like you see so many documentaries and so much footage of people doingresearch.
And just no one had done this stuff to that degree at thetime, as far as just living among theanimals.
And it can't be overstated how revolutionary this ideawas.
This26-year-old, youknow, young British woman was justlike,yeah, that's what I want todo.
Want to climb a tree and be withthem.
Yeah. And Lewis Leakey had a knack for picking the right people for this kind ofwork.
He also hired two other young women over theyears, DianeFosse, who studied gorillas inRwanda, who is very memorably played by Sigurny Weaver and gorillas in themist.
And then another woman named BarutéGaldekas, who studied orangutans inBorneo.
And when you put Diane Fosse and Baruté Galdekas and Jane Goodalltogether, you had the group that were known as thetri-mates.
Prettyfunny. We just couldn't not mentionthat.
It was just toogreat.Yeah.
Imean, we didn't give him thatname.
No,no. We were just really making itclear.
Yeah. SoChuck, we're starting to have a little too muchfun.
I say we need to take a break and recomposeourselves, come back and just get seriousagain.
Allright. Are you still keeping your cash in a traditional savingsaccount?
Ifso, you could be earningmore, muchmore.
Infact, at public.com's high yield cashaccount, you could be earning an industry leading5.1%APY.
There are no fees or balancerequirements, and you can access your cash whenever youwant.
Plus, you get up to 5 million FDICinsurance.
In otherwords, you can earn5.1% APY with the flexibility and security youdeserve.
It's time to take your cash out of a traditional savingsaccount.
It's time to take advantage of one of the industry's best interestrates.
There are nofees,period, and you get up to 5 million FDICinsurance.
Start earning5.1% APY on your cash atpublic.com.
5.1% APY is a 5.21 subject tochange.
All investing involves risk ofloss.
Rokuage Services offered by Public InvestingInc.
Member Finn-RenSIPIC, not abank.
C public.com slash disclosures formore.
Hi, this is Hugh here from the Imperfectspodcast, where we chat to well-known people whose lives seem perfect from theoutside, but through ourdiscussions, they share the vulnerabilities and imperfections that make them who theyare.
We chat to people like James Clear and AdamGrant.
You could have an potential to be a betterpartner, to be a betterfriend, improve as aparent.
There's so much discussion of how do we build ourcareers.
When are we asking the question of how do we build ourcharacter?
Listen to the Imperfects on the iHeartRadioapp, ApplePodcast, or wherever you get yourpodcasts.
Hi, I'm KatieLowez. And I'm GuillermoDiaz.
And now we're back with another season of ourpodcast, Unpacking theToolbox, where Guillermo and I will be rewatching theshow.
To officially unpack season three ofscandal.
Unpredictable, you don't see itcoming, it's awild, wildride.
The twists and turns in seasonthree.
Mesmerizing. Butalso, we get to hang out with all of our old scandalfriends, like BellamyYoung, ScottFoley, TonyGoldwyn, DebbieAllen, CarrieWashington.
So manypeople. Even more shocking assassinations from Papa and MamaPope.
Andyes, Katie andI, famous teeth pulling scene that kicks off aromance.
And it was peakTV. This is new scandal content for youreyes, for yourears, for yourhearts, for yourminds.
Well, suit upgladiators, grab your big old glass of wine and prepare yourselves for even more behind thescenes.
Listen to Unpacking the Toolbox on the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcast or wherever you get yourpodcasts.
Allright. So earlier in theepisode, you mentioned a family made up of the letterF, whereshe, youknow, this is how she named and cataloged these groups and thesefamilies.
And it would help her keep track ofthings.
And we're going to tell you a little story that Libya dug up about the Ffamily, led byflow, who was the mama to her youngchildren.
And flow was pretty instrumental in and good old understanding of just how these chipped familiesworked.
And then later through the just beyond thefamily, the whole group and local culture of thatfamily.
Right. And the whole group that they studied that the flow and her family were members of was the KesehKayla.
And there were other groups that ended up beingstudied, if not by a goodold, but by other research scientists and doctoral students who showed up over thedecades.
But Keseh Kayla was the group that that she kind of made her name on and did her research onoriginally.
And like yousaid, from studying these these families soclosely, she watched like how generationsinteracted, sometimes with their own kingroup.
Like flow had a son namedFabian, who overthrew his youngerbrother, who's overthrown by his younger brother Fighin to become the dominantmale.
And she noticed like becoming a dominant male of your family or yourgroup, I shouldsay.
There's not one set way to doit.
So I'm doing it by some chimpanzees do it by being kind and calm in the face ofaggression.
Others do it through sheer force andbullying.
Fighin was known to just basically do it throughtrickery.
Like he would lead others in the group away from food and then run back and get ithimself.
Somehow he became the dominantmale.
But by studying these chimpanzees thisclosely, she was able to kind of see individual personalities and how those personalities work together to create asociety.
Yeah. Andit's, youknow, it's like Game of Thrones up in therebasically.
Yeah. He had flow's daughterFighin.
She became the dominantfemale.
She gave birth to ninekids, one of which was a daughter namedFlossy.
So this isFlossy.Grandbaby.
Flossy ended up leaving that group for a neighboring community called the Matumbacommunity.
Another one of her children wasFreud, born in71.
Freud grew up and then along with Fighin and Fighin helped him rise within thathierarchy.
Even though he was like not really cut out for thejob, became the dominant male in1993.
So like families are leaving communities joining up with others who had previously left thecommunity.
They're kind of grooming successors and like propping up other chimps is like helping them become the leader and the dominant male orfemale.
And it's just fascinating for her to sit there and like document all thisstuff.
Yeah. It's veryMachiavellian.
Totally. Now we have to talk about Frodo who was one of Fighin'ssons, one ofFloss' grandsons.
He was born in1976. And he is one of the more famous chimpanzees of all time because he was bad to thebone.
If you believe in chimps having an internal life and empathy and awareness ofothers'experiences, then you would consider Frodo amurderer.
Straight upmurderer.Totally.
I've seen it argue that he should be considered amurderer.
He was just thatbad.Yeah.
Imean, he killedpeople.
Hedid. So he deposed hisbrother,Freud, back in1997.
And he was one ofthe, he was the one I was citing when I said some of them do it just through sheer force andintimidation.
That wasFrodo. He didn't have a lot offriends.
He didn't have manyalliances.
He was just the biggest chimp and the meanestchimp.
Andhe, from a youngage, he started bullying JaneGoodall.
I think I don't want to anthropomorphizehere, but I'm quitecertain,100%certain, infact, that he noted Jane Goodall was the person in charge of thehumans.
And he targeted herspecifically.
He attacked other humans over theyears.
But JaneGoodall, they said that he would have a certain look on his face that he reserved just forher.
And he put her in for some of the worsttreatment.
Almost broke her neckonce.
And she said kind of famously that she was alive because he wasn't trying to killher.
That he was just trying to show her who wasboss.
And that if he wanted herdead, she would be dead rightnow.
Which, youknow,again, not to use the Aword, but it sounds like he had respect forher.
Yeah,yeah. In away, like a kind of a backhandedway, I wouldsay.
He allowed her tolive.Right.
I guessso. Or maybe he neededher.
He let Gary Larson live in 1988 when Gary Larson got his armyanked, giving him a legitinjury.
So that happened aswell.
But verysadly, Frodo was probably most well known for killing a toddler or 14 monthold.
In2002, it was the daughter of a park attendant who was visiting with hiswife.
And he killed this 14 month old and partially ate this 14 monthold.
And people spoke up and werelike,Hey, you need to kill this champ and take himout.
And Janegood, I'll went to batform.
And it'slike,basically, it's a champ being achamp.
And we're the ones that arehere.
And, youknow, there's cars killing kids all over theplace.
Youknow, go out and take all the carsaway.
That's called a straw manargument.
Itis. There's a thingthough.
One ofthe, remember I said I saw it argued that like he was a Frodo should be considered a murderer or certainly couldbe.
I think the same person who made that argument was had been a researcher atGambie.
And arguedlike,yes, we need to killFrodo.
He's amurderer. Like he didthat.
He knew what he wasdoing.
He's amurderer. We need to put himdown.
And she argued that they intervened when the chimps werestarving.
They intervened when they needed medicalattention.
But they're not going to intervene when the chip murders a humanbaby.
It just seemed like a pretty goodargument, Ithink.
At the same timethough, if you're Jane Goodall and you'relike,well, chips are kind of like humans and humans are kind of likechimps.
We don't kill Frodo when he eats chimpbabies, which theydo.
So why would you do that for a humanbaby?
It seems a little out of touch to mewith, youknow, human society ingeneral.
But I guess I get both sides in thatcase.
Yeah. Imean, that's one of the things we should talkabout, Iguess, is that later in hercareer,she, youknow, she basicallysaid,hey, if I had it to do overagain, I would do itdifferently.
We probably should not have been feeding these thingsbananas.
We probably shouldn't havebeen, I shouldn't have been holding baby chimps like they were human babies and petting them andstuff.
And I should have maybe been a little more dispassionate in my work because if youwant, youknow, really accurate data and resultslike,again, you shouldn't be handing them food andstuff.
So, youknow, she came clean about the things that she felt like she had her missteps over the years as aresearcher.
So I take my hat off to her forthat.
And verysadly, it lookslike, youknow, it's possible at least that they're staythere, they'reinteractions, they're just merely being there could have been one of the factors in what was known as the Gombi chimpanzee war when in1971, there was kind of a full on war between two groups of chimpanzees that played out right in front of hereyes.
Yeah. So the dominant male of the Kessikela groupdied.
And I guess he was holding the gluetogether.
This guy was like Tito orsomething.
And the groupsplintered.
I think nine adults and their kidssaid, we're going to form our owngroup.
And they took over the southern half of therange.
And the original Kessikela or the remainingKessikela, they stuck to the northern part of therange.
Atfirst, I think over theyears, the males started making aggressive sounds and gestures to oneanother.
And it became clear that they were no longer treating them as a kingroup.
Youknow, these were no longerfriends, even though they had been super type friends when they livedtogether.
These were now enemies and trespassers andencroachers.
And the whole thing came to a head starting in 1974 whenGodi, one of the members of the tribe that had broken away and took up in thesouth, was just sitting there eating fruit and six Kessikela males ambushedhim.
And he tried to get away and they got him and they beat him to death over a periodof, Ithink, about 10minutes.
And that kicked offthe, what are known as like yousaid, the Gombi chimpanzeewar.
Yeah. And then other wars had been documented since then in different areas between differentgroups.
And like Isaid, youknow, part of the reason was they were being sort of choked out by humandevelopment.
Part of it was because there was a more stressful atmospherethough.
Right. With people there watching and observing and doing what she wasdoing.
So Idon't, I'm not going to say that really tarnished herwork.
Ifanything, it did show that they observed something else that they didn't know had previouslyhappened, which is they could be very territorial and go to war likethis.
But since thattime, she has just been a tireless advocate for animals over the ensuingdecades.
Like yousaid, into her early 90s now with the Jane Goodall Institute that is based in Virginia has 20 offices around theworld.
And she continues to write books and speak into TEDtalks.
And she's just still kickingit.
Yeah. She had a podcast called the Jane Goodall Hopecast that she launched during thepandemic.
And then as soon as she couldstop, she stopped the lastepisode.
It came out in2022. She's veryfamously, her quote was thatsucked.
Yeah. By theway, when I said she's still kickingit, I meantkicking, but like not just kicking it on thecouch.
That's what kicking itreally.
Kicking an oldschool.Yeah.
Now she's just still veryactive.
And I just have a lot of respect for thelady.
She'sawesome.Yeah. She is an awesomeperson.
Andyeah, she gets criticized by people in academiastill.
But like I said at theoutset, she's just the world lovesher.
Like she's done so much good that whatever misstep she has or whatever weird side she takes in moralquandaries, like the world just forgivesher.
And it's like it's JaneGoodall.
She does good for the planet and has the whole time essentiallyagreed.
I feel I don't know more about JaneGoodall.
There's a lot to read about her and byher.
And you can listen toher.
Hopecasts. I presume they didn't erase all of theepisodes.
And in themeantime, while you're looking all that stuffup, let's go ahead and kick it old school with listenermail.
Let me call this the ballot of grit because that is what Ed callsit.
Okay. In the subjectline, heyguys, I'm a self-described band of grade I shouldsay.
I've never considered myself a conscientious person to the full meaning of theword.
However, I do consider one of my strengths is beingresponsible.
My opinion is that it's an insult for a greedy person to be confused with beingconscientious.
Conscientiousness is a luxury for the already bright-minded person in myopinion.
I believe most intelligent people who are successful are equally gifted withconscientiousness.
Agrit, on the otherhand, is the ugly twin ofconscientiousness.
It's the pathless travel tosuccess.
It's how I got through college to earn an engineeringdegree, even though I graduated with a lowGPA, barely scraping by manyclasses, and had to retake some because I didn't pass to beginwith.
My road was less traveled than it was a toughone.
I worked 40 hours a week for five years while I supported myself incollege.
And I was compared to my peer graduates with whom I lived at home with their parents who had the funds to build proper projects forcourses.
Grit isinvisible,guys.
It can't be measured comes fromwithin.
Grit is what you have when you succeed withoutconscientiousness.
Love theshow. That is fromEd.
I think Ed is a pseudonym for AngelaDuckworth.
I think this is Angela Duckworth'swriting.
It's good to getemail.Yeah, that is goodemail.
I get for you forpersevering.
Hets off toyou,man, forsure.
I admire anybody whoworked, put themselves throughcollege.
That's reallysomething.
I likeme.Yes, I admire you forthat.
Oh, the first part was paidfor.
Then I was on myown.Hey,man, even a littlebit.
Socount. That's hard todo.
Youknow? That wasfine.
Way totables. I appreciateit.
Allright, just forgetit.
I'll direct my comments toward Ed onlythen.
Allright.No, I appreciateit.
I appreciateit. If you want to be like Ed and give us an email to argueover, we love that kind ofthing.
You can get in touch with us viaStuffPodcast.com.
Stuff you should know is a production of I HeartRadio.
For morepodcasts, my heartradio, visit the I Heart Radioapp.
Apple podcasts are wherever you listen to your favoriteshows.
Hi, this is Hugh here from the Imperfects podcast where we chat to well-known people whose lives seem perfect from theoutside.
But throughoutdiscussions, they share the vulnerabilities and imperfections that make them who theyare.
We chat to people like James Clear and AdamGrant.
You can have hidden potential to be a betterpartner, to be a betterfriend, improve as aparent.
There's so much discussion of how do we build ourcareers.
When are we asking the question of how do we build ourcharacter?
Listen to the Imperfects on the I Heart Radioapp.
Applepodcasts, or wherever you get yourpodcasts.
My name is Curly and I'm Maya and welcome to the Super Secret Bestie Cloudspodcast.
A super secret club where we talk about super secretthings.
Yeah, like secrets that aresuper.
That's when itis. In each episode we'll talk aboutlove,friendship,heartbreak,men, and ofcourse, our favoritesecrets.
Get inhere! Listen to the Super Secret BestieClub, I Heart Radioapp, apppodcasts, or wherever you get yourpodcasts.
If you want togrow, you've got to step out of your comfortzone.
Joinme, JennaColopas, for season three of my podcast OverComfort.
Every week I'll be having honest conversations with some of my favoritefriends.
This is like me actually first time talking aboutit, my mom is gonna literally killme, but I'm so sorrymom.
We're opening up about the goodstuff, the vulnerablestuff, and the cringystuff.
