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Thanks for listening to The Sporkful.
Be sure to tune in each week for new episodes on Amazon Music.
Or just ask Alexa, play the podcast The Sporkful on Amazon Music.
Well, Paola, I think of you as sort of being a person who's ready with a hot take.
Certainly on Instagram, you're someone who doesn't hold back.
You've got opinions.
The read on me is crazy.
I just met you. What's going on?
This is the Spork Bowl.
It's not for foodies, it's for eaters.
I'm Dan Pashman. Each week on our show, we obsess about food to learn more about people.
And this week, we are taking your calls about your food -related disagreements and disputes with your loved ones.
Hopefully bringing some peace and resolution to your homes.
And we're answering your cooking questions and responding to your hottest food takes.
And before we get into it, I want you to know that if you have a food feud with a family member or friend.
friend, or maybe a hot take to share or a question you want to ask, I want to hear from you.
Drop me a line at hello at sporkful .com.
Now, I am but a humble food podcast host. I can't solve all your problems myself.
I need some help here.
So joining me for this episode, first off in Washington, D .C., we have Paolo Velez, author of Bodega Bakes, Recipes for Sweets and Treats, inspired by my corner store.
Paolo's book was named for the New York Times 16 Best Cookbooks of 2024.
Paolo worked is a pastry chef at the famous dessert spot Milk Bar for many years.
You may also know her from Instagram, where she is at Small Orchids, and she is the chef -owner of D .C.'s Bar Providencia. Hello, Paola.
Thanks for having me.
Great to have you with us.
Our other special guest today is here in the studio with me in New York.
You've heard him on the Sporkful before.
It's James Park, a .k .a.
Jamesy World, on Instagram.
Last year, he published Chili Crisp, 50 -plus recipes to satisfy your spicy, crunchy, garlicky cravings.
We also collaborated on several extremely delicious recipes in my cookbook, Anything's Possible.
Hello again, James.
Hello, hello. I'm very excited to have both of you.
I think that the two are going to complement each other very well as we sort of dole out advice and hot takes and all that.
Because I feel like on Instagram, at least, you have, you know, sort of like complementary personalities.
I think of you, Paola, as being someone who has opinions and isn't afraid to share them.
I mean, I have ADD, so like I have opinions because I can't stop thinking.
you know, yeah. James, I also love you on Instagram and you're sort of more warm and fuzzy vibes.
Yeah. I'm always like making sure everyone is happy.
All right. Now, before we turn to listeners, I want to stay with the two of you for just a minute because each of you brought a hot take.
Now, Paola, I know you have a very hot take in Bodega Bakes in your cookbook, a hot take on vanilla.
Let's hear it. So I believe that imitation vanilla is better than vanilla extract and I will die on that grave. Wow.
The totally artificial, what's that called?
Vanillin or something like that.
Yeah, thank you. I'm very Spanish, so I was like vanillin.
And I'm like, wait a minute, that's not right.
This feels like an almost sort of like pancake syrup versus maple syrup kind of debate.
Oh, I literally, I'm pretty sure there's going to be some like avid bakers that are are going to listen to this and say this lady is out of her mind she's crazy go f yourself and i'm going to be like a booga booga booga because i don't care please defend yourself why do you like it i want to understand your decision oh for sure for sure for me it's a it's a budget thing and also like think about the applications that we normally use vanilla for it's cake it's chocolate chocolate -based cookies, et cetera.
And usually, right, if you have really strong flavors, i .e. espresso, peanut butter, chocolate, or even like things that are very delicate within their own selves, vanilla will be forgotten.
You're going to lose the flavor is what you're saying.
Exactly. All right.
Exactly. So I truly believe that unless if you're making like delicious milk -based, you know, flans, panacotta, et cetera, or things that the vanilla can be the star in, don't waste your money.
Use the vanilline. Then why are you adding?
Because it's American -style baking.
And it's just become one of those canonical things that should be in everything you bake.
And I respect vanilla.
I respect vanilla a lot, right?
Even just to harvest it, let's say from Madagascar, if you get Madagascan vanilla, it takes nine months to become a pod, right?
And then it takes nine more months to become an extract, right?
So that's a lot of time to become something really delicious.
It's not boring. It's one of the flavors that I believe needs to be championed, and we use it as a marge page, kind of add it, and it doesn't matter, with cinnamon, with this, with that, and you cannot tell the difference.
Go make something with cinnamon and vanilla, but take out the vanilla.
It'll still taste like what?
Cinnamon. I think you make a strong case palette.
So basically what you're saying is, you know, use the really good stuff when it's a featured star ingredient in rare cases.
Yes. every other time there's no point I think I think you make a strong case all right James agrees there you go James what's your hot take okay my hot take is everyone should embrace savory oats okay okay I feel like oats is something that people still feel like they have to eat it vanilla or you know like sweet literally or figuratively vanilla yeah but oh my god savory Savory oats will change the game.
Give me an example.
Give me a savory oats recipe that you love.
So one of my favorite savory oats recipe that's also in my Chili Chris cookbook is that it has miso, chili Chris, kimchi.
And like, I feel like oats is a same thing as like any type of grain.
Think about rice or think about, I really like flavorful porridge.
And sometimes it takes a while to cook the porridge, but like oats, it only take like five to eight minutes.
and it absorbs all the liquid in a way so you can really use any leftover soup.
I make savory oats with leftover kimchi stew that I was talking about, chicken stew, and I just add all the flavoring that has like chicken powder, soy sauce, like oyster sauce.
Then it becomes this amazingly flavorful dish that I feel like people, I think because of their culture, they think of oatmeal as like something bland.
They just have to eat it as breakfast. Or something sweet.
Something sweet. Apple, cinnamon, maple syrup.
But once you get out of the mindset, there's so many possibilities that will make you fall in love with oats again.
Well, that's very interesting.
I wish I could. It's a texture thing.
I'm so sorry. So you don't like oatmeal, period?
You don't like oatmeal at all?
So we drink it as like almost like a drink.
Do you like porridge?
I like Korean porridge.
Yeah, I eat that. It literally tastes exactly the same.
It's something about it.
There's something in there.
I wish I could blindfold you and just, like, feed you what I make.
And you're going to be like, oh, my God, this is so delicious.
And I'm going to shock your mind.
Like, literally, I would be like, why are you feeding me oatmeal?
You know, literally.
You're not going to know that it's oatmeal.
It will bubble from my spirit from the depth.
I will bet you $100.
I'll be like, hmm, James.
All right, take it easy, everyone.
Oh, I cannot wait. I cannot wait.
To be continued. you.
We're going to have to choose.
Powell, the next time you're in New York, we're bringing you in studio for a blindfolded oatmeal taste test. Let's do that.
All right. Let's do it.
You guys ready to hear from some Sporkful listeners?
I'm ready. All right, we're going to get into the food fights in a bit, but let's start with some hot takes.
Here's the first one.
Hey, Sporkful. My name is Ola, and I live in Denver, Colorado.
My hottest food take is that I think the broccoli stems are way better than the fluffy tree bits.
I think that the stems are perfectly crunchy and full of better flavor.
My husband very strongly disagrees.
He prefers the crumbly tree bits.
So it works out pretty well because when we have broccoli, we just trade and I get all the stems and he gets all the weird little tree parts.
Obviously he's wrong about this, but I would love to hear your take.
Related food takes are that I also prefer the stem of the asparagus to the tip.
And I think the best part of a watermelon is that last bite of pink into the white.
I just think it has the best texture to flavor combo in the entire melon.
Would love to hear your take.
Bye. Well, clearly Ola in Denver likes crunch. She's very focused on the crunchiest parts of every food.
James, what's your take on the broccoli stem as opposed to the florets yes to broccoli stems but I think it needs to be chopped or prepared in a way that is really maximizing its best texture I think it would be really nice if you finally chop so that like in the room of more soft tender florets like you get this like a surprising crunchy bite so I really think you should utilize a whole broccoli for that but I also don't want to pick a side of like stem is better than the other because i think both of them have like amazing flavors and texture and that's why we get broccoli as two different parts
so you should get the stem like i'm also for team crunch all right paula broccoli stems where do you stand can we just like touch base on the the watermelon though oh my god i was like excuse me i agreed everything until you stop really I love that part no it's a little bit tart it's okay and extra crunchy it's very watery you would choose that over the pink like fleshy watery that explodes the wonderful juice in your mouth yeah so like the pink part is like what you would give to somebody that you love the white part is your enemies you know what I mean like it's just like sure I will eat it
because I don't want to like you know leave too much pink on it but I wouldn't say I would choose that over over the watermelon i agree that i would not rank that as the best bite of the watermelon but i do enjoy it and i like the contrast that it provides to the softer sweeter juicier parts i like the firm crunch of it i like the tartness and bitterness that it adds you know like when i'm cutting a watermelon for my kids i'll snack on the on the rindy parts and then grab a couple sweet parts and go back and forth i mean look i don't like yucking anybody's yum because my stuff might might be weird. But yeah,
that one was like, I definitely had a reaction.
I was like definitely agreeing.
I'm like, wait a minute.
Let's go back to that.
It made me backtrack.
It made me backtrack.
All of a sudden I was like, I hate stems. So back to the broccoli, I love the florets, right?
But I also love the stems done in different applications, right?
Like when you're roasting broccoli, I want a little more stem, you know, Because the floret does shrivel up a little bit, but that's the best part.
When you roast it, the shriveled up floret is like, mmm, that's nutritious.
Wow, you know what I mean?
But there's no difference to me because I feel like the more stem, the more broccoli I get.
But the floret has more of the broccoli flavor, if that makes sense.
So I think we all agree that we like broccoli stems, but you've got to put thought into how you're going to cut the stem because it should be cut in such a way that it's going to cook in a way to provide some kind of textural compliment to the rest of the broccoli.
Coming up, we'll take a live call from a couple with a food dispute about the correct doneness of food.
James and Pallie, you want to stick around?
I'll be here. Of course.
All right, we'll be right back.
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I've told you a lot about the behind the scenes of the making of my cookbook, Anything's Possible, but I think there's one detail I left out, and that is that I tested every single recipe in that book on my Samsung range.
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Welcome back to the sporkful.
I'm Dan Pashman. Last week on the show, I took a trip to the Metropolitan Museum of Art, but I was not there to see exhibits.
In fact, I didn't even go inside.
Instead, I talked with Dan Rossi, who sells hot dogs right outside the front door of the Met, which is considered the most coveted spot for a street food vendor in all of New York City.
In fact, it's so coveted that Dan has to sleep in his van next to his cart every night so no one takes the spot.
Now, Dan's got a long history as a food vendor in the city.
Back in the 90s, the city took all but one of his vending permits away, leaving him destitute.
But Dan didn't give up.
I still got one permit they left me.
I said, you know what?
I'm going to sell hot dogs.
But it doesn't sound like that was the end of the troubles.
That was the beginning.
Dan tells me his whole story and the secret to making a really good hot dog.
That episode's up now.
Check it out. Now back to our call -in episode.
I'm joined once again by cookbook authors and beloved Instagram food personalities, James Park and Paola Velez.
Hello to both of you.
Hello, hello. Hello.
All right, let's take a couple more questions and hot takes.
Then we're going to get to our live callers.
here's a voice memo.
Hey Dan, Evan from Washington DC here.
I, for most of my life, ate the entire shrimp tail and all.
They were not the heads, but I would eat the tail.
I did not know that was weird until I got to college and then was uniformly ridiculed by everybody.
And then I went home and found out that my mom and brother also do this.
And so I was trained as a child not to know this was weird. And that got me thinking, what are some other weird foods that people eat?
I've recently found out that a friend of mine eats the peanut entirely, shell and all.
To me, that is far weirder than eating the full shrimp.
Thanks. Love the show.
Paola, what's your take?
What do you think of this?
So I'm of the camp of not eating the tail.
I just don't like the texture.
But I also like, Like, there's people that I know that'll eat, like, head and all, and I'm like, are you unwell?
You know? Like, at least just, like, prep me.
Like, prep me, right?
Like, I don't mind if you love it, but, like, give me a little warning.
I'll be like, I eat it all.
You know what I mean?
Like, that way I know that I'm, like, instead of, like, freaking out and passing out, you know?
Let me ask James. James, what do you think?
I'm the person who eats the whole thing, and you just call me I'm unwell, and I'm unwell.
No, no, just let me know.
I'm just saying, like, because in America, we got everything ultra processed.
We're not used to eating things that look at us.
Are you including the head, James?
Yeah, that's where all the, like, amazing flavors are.
So, like, if it's just, like, a poached shrimp, which usually it's just the meat and the tail part, you don't really see the head part.
But like when it's like grilled prawns or grilled shrimp with the head and everything, you know, the lobster or crabs, like the rows are like where all the flavors are.
The same thing as shrimp.
Like when you are taking a bite of like a perfectly roasted a whole prawns or shrimp, all the flavors are in the head part.
And like that is where people are missing out.
And honestly, like when I do eat out with my Asian friends, we're all fighting over the head because we all know where the flavors are.
We kind of grew up eating like that.
But when I'm eating out with like non -Asian friends, they leave out like all the parts, like chicken wings.
Like they leave so much meat on the bones and like, you know.
That's not me. That's not me.
So I feel like shrimp, you should really like, I mean, I get it.
It's not for me. Which I respect.
Sometimes I want to make sure that they experience the flavors I don't even eat the mustard in crabs Yeah, I don't eat that I'm fanning James James is looking faint You can have all my seafood guts No You could have it all That makes me so sad The two you need to go out to eat together, James So you can get all her shrimp heads Yeah You are my floret to my stem Oh, I think I just got proposed.
I have eaten shrimp heads, and I agree with you.
Like, if you have not grown up with it, then I understand that I think that it's just unfamiliar to you.
But, like, I had aguachiles in Southern California, and, like, with the whole shrimp and the head and, like, that super acidic, super spicy broth.
And I ate the head, and, like, it was a little bit of a mental thing to get over the texture, which is not something I'm accustomed to.
But I loved it. And I eat shrimp shells.
I'm with you, palace.
sometimes they're a little pointy going down your throat but i first of all like if you're at like a pass or derv situation like i don't want to hold all the shrimp tails in my hand i'd rather just eat them i like the crunch there's a place right around the corner here in midtown manhattan called cafe china great chinese restaurant they've got a kung fu shrimp it's like a fried shrimp with szechuan peppercorns and peanuts and tons of garlic that doesn't have the heads but it has the whole shell on the shrimp and then it's fried it's battered with the shell underneath the batter And the crunch. So good.
When you bite through the fried exterior and then the crunch of the shell, and then you get into the tender, meaty shrimp on the inside, and you get the crunchy peppercorns and the peanuts.
Well, I think the outer shell is softer than the tail and the head, though.
I don't mind doing that.
Like, I will eat that before I, like, chomp on a head.
I think you two are both more advanced shrimp tasters than I am.
But I think we'll have to agree to disagree, like you said, you know, to each his own.
Yeah. All right, we got one more voice memo from a listener that I want to cover.
Let's hear it. Hey, this is Dan in Oregon.
I think the heuristic of I cook, you clean, or you cook, I clean is in need of an update.
Leaving aside the fact that some people like cooking more than others, so it's not usually the chore that cleaning is, the main problem I see is that I cook, you clean doesn't give me much incentive, despite our best intentions, to be judicious in the amount of utensils I use, if I clean up as I go, if I put ingredients away, etc. So I think a better agreement might be something like I cook, and I'll clean the kitchen, and And you set and clear the table, you handle the leftovers, and you start and empty the dishwasher.
Something along those lines I think would be a little bit better.
Paola, what are your thoughts on the idea of I cook, you clean?
This is a common arrangement in many households.
One person cooks dinner, the other person cleans up.
What are your thoughts on this idea that it needs to be revised?
Well, I think that they feel like it's tit for tat and it shouldn't be that way.
I think we need to boil it down to clean as you go, right?
Right. So there's not like this giant pile of dishes, et cetera.
But also like saying like, oh, like I'll clean the dishes and then you load the dishwasher.
So who's doing the dishes?
So you want good sis to set the table, take care of the leftovers, load the dishwasher, which is doing the dishes.
And then what? You just eat?
That's not fair. You know, I don't think that's fair.
It's very imbalanced.
So I say, you know, clean as you go.
and then also whoever cooks, yes, they can relax after their meal.
We're of the family that like when we finish our meal, like we don't leave dishes for the next day.
We just do the dishes.
And for my husband and I, it's the same way that we set the table, but then everybody comes together and does dishes, right?
And we kind of like pack all the food.
And then we go about, it's like so much faster if we all do it together.
But what do you do if someone in your family isn't as thorough at washing the dishes as you are and then the pots are drying and there's still crusty bits on them because they didn't scrub well enough.
I mean, that's what the dishwasher is for, right?
But I'm saying that certain things get washed by hand.
Yeah. Like big pots and pans we don't usually put in the dishwasher.
They take up too much space.
But there could be crusty bits and those need a little elbow grease.
And sometimes, some people try to help me wash the dishes, and then I find crusty bits on things later, and then I say, now I'm just going to have to wash it a second time.
James, you're nodding.
What do you think about this issue?
See, I feel like there's so much of like, okay, I cook so you clean, so the person who's cleaning feels like they have more job.
When it comes to cooking and enjoying, it's really hard to put it as 50 -50, and I think we just have to accept that.
because sometimes I feel like I have to use more pots than usual to execute a dish and I would get complaints from the whoever is supposed to clean.
I'm like, oh, like, why are you using more pots and dishes that I normally would have?
So it's like there's so much tension around this.
So I feel like we should just kind of have every part of it a little bit, have the other person involved.
So like from the planning part, I know that cooking is not just cooking.
You have to think about what you're going to cook.
so you have to go out grocery you have to prepare so there's a lot of different elements that the other person who's not doing active cooking can be a part of so if you're sharing those kind of duties from the beginning to the end maybe two people can feel like there's less of an imbalance of a task but this is more like our together duty I agree with that I'll actually take it even a step further James I think about this meme that I see on social media all the time that someone posted has been reshared a billion times uh someone wrote cooking together is not romantic move out my way it's like
not everything has to be shared okay whether you live alone or with a whole big family or anywhere in between like having a home requires all kinds of work cooking and cleaning and maintenance and errands and chores and laundry all of the things that are required to just like maintaining a home and some people are better at some of those than others some Some people like some of those chores more than others or at least dislike them less than others.
And so ideally, all the people who live in the house are contributing equally to the overall work of maintaining the house.
But I like to cook more than my wife does.
I enjoy it. She doesn't really enjoy it.
And I don't love washing dishes, but I don't mind it.
And I'm better at it than she is.
She mostly folds the laundry.
I almost never fold the laundry.
She's in charge of laundry.
So, like, it doesn't bother me that I'm almost always washing the dishes because she's almost always doing the laundry.
So, like, not every task has to be shared 50 -50.
I agree. But sometimes, like, you know, Dan said, it's like the compromise happens so quickly and effortlessly.
Like, I'm the only person that mops in the house because I just know my husband doesn't like that.
You know what I mean?
Like, he just doesn't like the idea of the mop.
Like, I don't even think about it.
I'm just like, I just mop.
Like, that's my thing.
But, like, if I ever have to take out the trash, I might die.
You know? Like, the smell is disgusting.
And also when I lived in the Bronx, I grew up with like the metal trash cans and there was like a raccoon in there.
So I have PTSD. I'm not going to no trash bin.
I don't want to touch that.
So my husband has to take out the trash.
All of these are applicable to you guys because you have another person to divide the task.
I am here speaking on the people who live by themselves, who have to do everything by themselves.
It's really difficult.
So it's nice that you guys can share a task.
But, you know, I cannot.
So, like, shout out to everyone who lives by themselves and has to do all the tasks by themselves.
That's right. The flip side is, though, no one's going to tell you you're doing it wrong.
That is true. All right.
Now it's time for us to try to help resolve a food dispute.
We have a live call coming in.
Are you ready to take this?
I'm so ready. Hi, who's this?
Hi, this is Sheila.
I'm from Vancouver, B .C.
And I'm here with my husband, Brent.
All right. Hello, Sheila.
Hello, Brent. Say hi to my friends Paola and James here.
Hey, hi, Paola. Hi, James.
Hello. So what can we do for you?
What seems to be the issue?
Well, we have an issue about the doneness of our vegetables.
I come from a Cantonese background.
My mom always cooked our vegetables lightly, and Brent comes from a family where he liked his vegetables more well done.
To me, they're very soft and mushy and not as palatable.
We share our cooking responsibilities half -half.
So usually when Brent cooks, he'll take my broccoli out early so it's less well done.
And in the end, I end up eating cold broccoli, which I don't like.
How long have the two of you been married?
28 years. And Brent, setting aside Sheila's editorial comment about how she doesn't like your vegetables as much, do you agree with her basic characterization of how you like your vegetables?
Yep, I would say that that's accurate, yeah.
She uses the word mushy, cooked to oblivion, various other insults.
But the truth is, I sort of like it cooked medium rather than really lightly cooked, which is the Cantonese style.
Brent's a vegetarian, so we don't eat meat.
And even before when he did eat meat, he did like his meat more well done.
He likes his pasta more well done.
I like al dente, which is, I think, the instructed way of eating pasta.
I mean, what you say is true.
I mean, whatever cuisine, whatever food we're talking about, whatever we're cooking, these issues crop up.
Like with pasta, if the package says al dente, 10 minutes, it's...
Sheila will set the timer for 10 minutes.
I'll sneak in there and add a couple minutes, because I like it just a little more than well -cooked and al dente.
Oh, did you know he was adjusting your timer, Sheila?
That's subversive. Yeah, he adjusts not just the timer, but it's the temperature of the pot as well.
Oh. Yeah, he sneaks in there all the time.
He really does. What culture did you grow up, Brent, just so that I have an understanding?
I grew up in Washington State in a fairly small town.
My background is Irish and Scottish, and my parents, I mean, cooking for them wasn't quite as important as it is for us.
We had a big family.
They would just cook casseroles and mashed potatoes.
Which is delicious and comforting.
Right. So that's where you grew up with Brent, but you also have lived in Asia.
Is that right? Yeah, we've lived together in Hong Kong, Taipei, and Shanghai for more than 20 years.
So even having grown up with one certain culinary background, I'm surprised that it hasn't had more of an impact in changing your tastes.
Me too, Dan. I'm very surprised.
I want to know what's a dish that you guys can agree on that it's good because I feel like there's a lot.
I'm sensing a lot of disagreement, but I want to understand both of you in a way.
What is like a dish that you guys can come together in a way?
we both like this. Any kind of baked casserole.
Yeah, like the enchiladas we had last night.
Enchiladas or lasagna, anything that you put in the oven and bake until it's done, we'll agree on.
Okay, so Sheila, I guess you are okay with the doneness if you're eating a dish that doesn't have a lot of crunchy element, like enchilada, for example.
Yeah, no, you know what?
I like all kinds of foods.
You know, I like casseroles.
I like, you know, stews.
But I also like the the crunchiness of salads and lightly cooked foods too.
Brent, do you like the crunchy element or is the crunch usually the texture that doesn't bring you pleasure as much?
I'd say that's accurate, depending.
I mean, obviously in a salad or certain other foods, I do like crunch. But in vegetables, no, I don't really want the vegetable's texture to be present.
So do you prefer French fries or mashed potatoes?
Ooh, that's a good one.
I mean, I'll always say mashed potatoes, especially with cream and butter.
I knew it. And Sheila, French fries or mashed potatoes?
Ooh, I'd say French fries, honestly.
Okay, there we see.
Another component to this issue is I like to eat my food hot.
Brent likes to eat his food room temperature.
It's the same way that my mother -in -law, we like to eat our steak medium.
She wants it well done, you know?
And we've adapted to make sure that we are everybody eats at the same time family, but we're also everything needs to be like steaming hot, like burning your mouth family.
So, like, how do you adapt for those two different cook temps?
So I actually understand.
Right. Do you have kids?
Yeah, we have two kids.
We have two daughters.
How old are they? They're 22 and 24.
And what's their take on how do they like their meats and vegetables cooked?
Okay, so Brent is a very big personality in our family.
So he's kind of gathered them over to his side of the fence.
I think they both prefer things more well done than I do.
So you're outnumbered.
I'm outnumbered, but I cook.
But you have the control.
I probably cook more.
I cook about 60 % of the time.
Brent cooks 40. Gotcha.
But how does that feel, Sheila, that the kids have gotten the way?
I feel betrayal. You didn't, like, train them young.
At least, like, if you have two daughters, you have to have one person on your side.
Yeah. I know. The dog was on my side.
All right. So, James, what advice would you give to Sheila and Brent?
Okay, so, if I were in your situation, I would find ways to add crunchy elements.
Like, seems like you're already outnumbered, sadly.
So, like, you know, I think what I would do is, like, add, like, crunchy toppings for, like, broccoli.
Or, like, whether it's fried shallots or, like, fried garlic chips.
Crushed peanuts. Yeah, crushed peanuts.
I think there's a way to add other texture elements of something that's considered, like, soft. So, like, for example, mashed potato, like, you know, give them without any topping, but you could have it with, like, some, like, fried garlic chips or fried shallots, so that you are finding ways to add that texture of pleasure, but that is just kind of if you want to be peaceful and just kind of make everyone happy.
But, as Brent said, you are the one who kind of can rule the kitchen, so make them figure out their problem.
So I think you should just cook whatever, And you've already put up with three different people who are against you.
And life is too short for you to just keep making things peaceful.
So sometimes, okay, Monday, Wednesday, Friday, you eat what I want.
And then they get to deal with their problems on Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday.
So I think it's all about communication.
But since you like the doneness, and to be honest, I think I'm on your side, Sheila.
Thank you. No, I'm absolutely on your side.
But, you know, sometimes you have to give up certain things for the peace, but other times you don't have to do this.
And, Brent, listen to your wife, who's right, and just kind of like, okay, almost, I don't know, blindfold yourself and just like enjoy the texture and the flavors that these like vegetables have. have and i think if you allow yourself to be a little bit more open -minded there's going to be a point where you could really open yourself up like oh this is like the flavor and texture that i was missing out okay that's good advice paula what do you think so i'm married we live in the world of compromise and mediation you know so i would suggest actually starting brent's cook time before you start
yours Sheila so like same dishes same applications but you know if you like your pasta a little more al dente maybe you invest in like a little strainer that goes in the pasta pot that you then add your pasta to so that the girls and your husband can have their softer pasta and you can have your more al dente pasta same thing with veggies right so let's say you're roasting veggies.
You start them for Brent and the girls and then you add your veggies later and just make sure that you remember which side of the pan they're on, but you'll also, you'll feel it, right?
Texture -wise, right?
And you just adapt the cook time.
If you know that to get Brent's ideal, we've been talking about broccoli today, 20 minutes for broccoli, right?
But you like yours a little more crunchy, more al dente, then 20 minutes, you know, you start that timer and right Right when it gets down to that five -minute mark, you toss yours in.
So now, inherently, you just created a different texture within the same cooking application.
And then also that makes everything come out at the same time.
It eliminates that heat issue.
So instead of pulling it out first, you're adding it later, and then everything is hot.
That's actually pretty much the advice I was going to offer, which is to add your food later as opposed to taking it out earlier.
Sheila and Brent, I hope this has been helpful to you.
I think this is a pretty good technique.
It involves a little more work.
But, you know, if you want your vegetables done two ways, if you want to put in a little extra effort, I think this is a good suggestion.
So, Sheila and Brent in Vancouver, best of luck with your next stir fry.
Thank you so much. Thank you very much. Appreciate it.
We'll give it a try.
Okay, well, we have covered a lot of ground here.
I hope we've helped some sporkful listeners in the process.
I've got to say, though, you know, when we first started, I thought you were going to bring the hot takes.
And, James, I thought you'd be more warm and fuzzy.
But I think I underestimated you, James.
I think you had just as many hot takes.
Yeah, I mean, like, food makes me very emotional in many different ways.
So, definitely, I have a lot of emotions coming out when someone says something that's so dear to me.
Like, savory oatmeal.
I'm literally going to travel to, like, Washington, D .C.
and mouth -feasio my savory oatmeal.
All right. Well, I think we have covered a lot of ground here.
I hope we've helped a lot of Sporkful listeners.
Before we wrap up, I do want to remind folks listening that we are always on the lookout for people to call in with food -related disagreements and disputes, questions, hot takes, whatever it may be.
Please send me a voice memo with your issue to hello at sporkful .com.
My thanks to Paola Velez and James Park.
Paula's new cookbook is called Bodega Bakes.
She also has a bar in Washington, D .C.
called Providencia. Bon Appetit named it one of the best new bars of 2025.
So if you're in D .C., check it out.
You can find her on Instagram at Small Orchids.
Thank you, Paula. Thank you.
And James' cookbook is Chili Crisp on Instagram.
He is at Jamesy World.
Thank you, James. Thank you for having me.
While you're following people on Instagram, follow me.
I often share behind -the -scenes photos and videos from podcast tapings, things I'm cooking and eating, and a lot more on Instagram.
I am at TheSporkful.
Next week on the show, we have a brand new update on one of our most beloved episodes ever.
It's all about a sandwich shop in Aleppo, Syria that we went searching for years ago.
Well, as you know, there's been a lot happening in Syria.
The Assad regime has fallen.
A lot has changed. We are going to get an update on Shadi Martini, the main character of that story, and on the sandwich shop.
And we're going to start off by rerunning the original series to catch up anyone who missed it, to refresh your memory.
And then the following week, roll right into the update.
While you wait for that one, check out last week's show with the hot dog king of New York, Dan Rossi.
He's been selling hot dogs and one of the most coveted pieces of real estate in the whole city.
And he has had a fight off the cops, City Hall, and other vendors to keep his turf.
That one's up now. And hey, did you know you can listen to The Sporkful on the SiriusXM app?
Yes, the SiriusXM app has all your favorite podcasts, plus over 200 ad -free music channels curated by genre and era, plus live sports coverage.
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It's everything you want in a podcast app and music app all rolled into one.
And right now, Sporkful listeners can get three months free of the SiriusXM app by going to SiriusXM .com slash Sporkful.
This episode was produced by me along with managing producer Emma Morgenstern and senior producer Andres O 'Hara and producer Chantel Holder Our engineer is Jared O 'Connell Music help from Black Label Music.
The Sporkful is a production of Stitcher Studios.
Our executive producer is Camille Stanley.
Until next time, I'm Dan Pashman.
And I'm Bresson from Edmonton, Alberta, reminding you to eat more, eat better and eat more better.
