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Start your journey at thehawaiian -islands .com At Space Studio Behind every difficult emotion is a need.
It's just an unmet need that we haven't identified yet.
Have you ever wished you had a wise meditation teacher on speed dial?
Someone you can call after a long day.
Someone you can lean on for their advice?
to listen and help you to see things differently.
Welcome to Dear Headspace.
Hi, folks. We are sitting here for another episode of Dear Headspace, a podcast where I sit down with a Headspace meditation teacher and we answer your questions.
Once again, I'm Robin Hopkins and I am with my partner in chat, Sam.
Hi Robin, so happy to be back.
I'm so happy to have you here.
For those of you listening, what you don't understand is that when Sam and I start talking, it is very hard to stop and we just go and I was like, we gotta hit record. We got to get going here.
Yeah, it is. It's so effortless to chat with you.
It's so delightful.
So, Sam, you must know this but we get just tons of questions from people wanting to know more about you guys, about you teachers.
And so we came up with some rapid fire questions so that people can get to know you.
Are you down for this?
Cool, I'm ready! Alright, first question.
What is the weirdest place you have ever meditated?
In a bathroom. Really?
Like on the toilet, yeah.
If you weren't a meditation teacher, you would be?
Probably a nurse.. I almost went to nurse practitioner school, to be a psychiatric nurse practitioner.
Oh, I could see that.
Okay, what's your favorite thing to do when you are alone?
Well, honestly, it's like in the bath, watching like last night, I watched a really, not great rom -com that just came out.
In the bath? In the bath, yeah.
I just take a bath.
I had my lavender bubble bath and I watch on my phone while I'm just soaking in the bath and I could stay in there for hours, like two hours.
Where do you put the phone?
Because I have deep, deep fears that I'm going to drop it into the tub.
I have like a little stool in the bathroom, so I put it up there.
But sometimes I'll just hold it, you know?
Look at you living on the edge Sam.
Okay? Favorite song and why I feel like that's a hard question.
It is a hard question You know, what comes to mind is this Dave Matthews song called number 41 I love that song so I listen to it at this really particular moment in my life when I was like 14 and I just thought it was so beautiful and I listened to it over and over and over and over again and Yeah, I still really enjoy it.
The songs just like burn in your brain when that happens Yeah.
Yeah. All right. Favorite cereal.
Oh, okay. Of course.
Special K with berries for reals.
I do. I love, I love it.
I'll have to tell you, my daughter's gotten really into the, um, the special case with berries recently.
And I feel, I don't want to call it inflation, but there's a lot less berries than there used to be in special care.
I just feel it. I just, yeah.
That makes sense. I haven't had it in a really long time, but, um, yeah, I want a lot of berries in each bite.
Okay, when was last time you had your heart broken?
Oh my God, this is a really horrifying story, but no it's not.
I dated this guy, oh, my brother's gonna kill me.
It was a friend of my brother's, and he's 10 years younger than me.
Ooh, I had a girl. Yeah.
Had just turned 30.
Anyway, it was very bizarre that we had this intense connection.
and then within three months he was in school, like he was still an undergrad at a college far away.
And yeah, it was just really painful when I realized, of course this is not gonna work.
And - He's a junior in college.
Yeah, exactly. Because he's in physics right now.
Yeah, yeah. Priorities are slightly different.
Yeah, well, okay, our last, and this has been so much fun, our last rapid fire question, which we have not done rapid in any way shape or form, But we knew this was gonna happen, Sam.
What's your sleep schedule like?
These days, I try to go to bed before midnight.
So I usually fall asleep around 11 .30, 11 .45.
I meditate before, usually.
And that really helps, helps me fall asleep.
How about you? What's your sleep schedule?
Oh, Lord, I mean like I go, I tell my kids I'm off the clock around nine.
And then I come in, I listen to an audio book, And I lay down and I play Candy Crush, because I need something to do while I'm listening.
Yeah, otherwise, I completely fall asleep right away.
And I might make it 1520 minutes, sometimes a half hour if I leave the light on, when sometimes I fall asleep with the phone falls out of my hand.
And then I'm up between like 530 and six, usually.
Wow. Um, okay, so back on track, we, we have questions that need and answer.
Yeah, we have questions.
We have very excellent questions that need answering.
So today, people have asked questions about sleep, such as how to handle losing sleep while adjusting to adulting, wanting to know more about our sleep casts, and a question from our youngest caller in to date about why it's hard to fall to sleep.
And these questions, they are right on time, since this week, it's going to be World Sleep Day.
Oh, and I almost forgot, we have one other question about what to do when you see younger family members making mistakes.
And I think the answer is not gonna be but in, but we'll see.
Yeah, let's get the party started with our first question from Taylor.
My name is Taylor. I'm from Durham, North Carolina.
And I recently graduated college.
I moved to a new city and got my first apartment and I just started a new job remotely.
With all this change, I feel like I can never keep up with the adjustments to being a new adult.
and my routines are all out of whack, especially my sleep schedule.
You know, I rarely wake up feeling well rested.
I'm either up late thinking of all my responsibilities or I wake up in the middle of the night and I can't go back to sleep because of these anxious thoughts.
Which in turn make me more anxious because I know I need to be well rested to handle the things I'm stressing about.
I just, I don't know, I'm wondering how could I use mindfulness to pause my thoughts, at least throughout the night so I can sleep?
Thank you guys so much. I'm looking forward to hear from you.
That is such a great question.
And what were we just talking about, about racing minds?
Right. It's so refreshing too, just to I can hear it in Taylor's voice, just this understanding and this willingness to see and witness what's happening within herself, instead of trying to push it away.
She's willing to work through it, is what I hear.
And just like an acknowledgement that where they are in their life right now is a stressful time.
I mean I feel like we have to start there like I feel like that first job or even if it's the first couple of jobs you've been on the schedule of summers off you're in school and then all of a sudden the expectations of you are totally different in the way that you have to be in the world is totally different and that it's not pass fail, there's not the help that you get in school.
So it's like, that's stressful.
That's so true. You just made me remember the community and the support that was involved in my school experience.
I went to UCLA and they had like the career center, the psychological services, we even had an acupuncture and massage clinic every Wednesday or something like that.
and there was just somewhere you could turn to get help and also find someone to help you adjust your schedule if needed.
So that is a huge adjustment, going from college life to work life.
What comes to mind is the importance of being really gentle with yourself, and making time, during times of change and transition, the meditation might feel, your meditation practice might feel very different.
I think of when I sit down to meditate as, you know, the way I would sit down with a friend and let that friend vent about what's going on in their life.
So if you're sitting down with yourself and you're going through a lot of changes, your mind might be louder and more busy than you're used to, because there's more material to process, there's more, there are more emotions to process that are coming up.
So changing and shifting your expectations a little bit, and if you can let go of expectations completely, that's ideal.
Good luck with that, Taylor.
I'm just kidding. But we have expectations, of course.
We can't help it. Our brain is very smart and very dumb at the same time.
It's an organ that just kind of is an associative machine that looks for patterns, puts together what happened the day before, the week before and then projects it into the future.
Right? There's just certain mechanics.
I like to think of the brain that way, is like there are mechanical things happening that are not personal.
It's not like we did anything wrong or we're not good at meditating.
It's just our brain doing what our brain does.
So yeah. Adjusting expectations a little bit and giving yourself some extra time to process if that's what you need.
So maybe, and I've been working on this too.
I'd like to go out in the evening and not do anything spectacular, by the way.
I like to go to board game meetups and discussion groups.
You're so wild, Sam, you really are.
But sometimes I have to forgo my board game meetup to, like, take time to journal or take myself to a café and just, like, let myself process what's going on.
And sometimes you have to make those decisions around, harder decisions around how you're your free time during times in life when there are big changes happening.
Yeah. That's a really interesting note, and it's something I've never thought of.
I always think of it like I can do everything that I always need to do or want to do, and then I'm just tacking on some meditation, or some journaling, you know, and that's going to fix everything.
And that's a really great note to say you might need a little more.
Yeah, behind every difficult emotion is a need.
it's just an unmet need that we haven't identified yet.
That's why we're having the emotion in the first place.
Something's either been violated like an expectation's been violated or we're not getting something that we're used to having.
I mean if you think, we could really dissect this down to each emotion and think about it, because it can feel overwhelming to try to identify the needs behind an emotion.
but nonviolent communication is a method of, it helps you communicate when there's a difficult conversation, but it also helps you to identify what caused an emotion, what the emotion is, what the need behind the emotion is, and then what do you want to do about it?
It's a really great framework for that.
That's fantastic because if you take it back to Taylor, I mean, we don't know Taylor, so we can't be sure, But you can imagine that Taylor's feeling overwhelmed, anxious, uncertain, not knowing what's going on in the workplace or what they're used to doing, maybe a little fearful that they're not doing it right, worried about judgment.
I mean, there's a whole host of stuff that can happen when you walk into a new environment.
And you know, like we were saying earlier, it may not be the most supportive environment.
And even in that, like, let's take the emotion of confusion.
An unmet need is certainty or some level of certainty, right?
So then you have a path forward. You can say, what's something I know to be true?
What am I certain about at this point in time?
I'm certain that I enjoy where this job is going, what aspects of the job you really that drew you to it and that you feel really good about.
So you start to create your own narrative about what you are certain about and then And that feeling, that emotion settles a bit because it's getting what it needs.
You know, I think informational meetings with people or like checking in with your friend groups can be really, really helpful because you aren't alone in this.
There's an entire group of people who graduated or started a job just as you did that are a resource.
Exactly. Yeah. I mean, that support is vital.
Just being able to know with certainty again that you're not alone and that you're processing it in a certain way, and others are processing it in their own way.
But you can learn from each other.
When you have the discussion, suddenly there, instead of one way of handling it, which is your own instinct, now you have other possibilities just by hearing other people's stories about how they're managing that transition.
And as it relates back to Taylor's question in sleep, you know, you mentioned at the top during our lovely Rapid Fire session, that you do your work at night.
Like you do journaling and stuff, and that might be helpful for Taylor to do the SAM schedule where you're kind of downloading some of the stuff so when you go to bed, it maybe isn't so heavy.
I think we think of sleep too as a separate thing that's supposed to work.
It's like, I need to sleep so it's gonna work.
And we get very mad when it doesn't work, right?
Yeah, exactly, like hunger, right?
we're like, if our hunger is like overactive or underactive, it's like, why is it not working?
I think it's important to remember, to reframe basically how we look at sleep.
Because sleep is a reflection of everything about us.
It's a reflection of our, what's going on in our lives, what's going on in our bodies.
I mean, just, it really is like the ultimate mirror.
And then it also is affected by things we can't control, like genetic predispositions to things and illnesses and temperament and all kinds of things.
So not to feel like you're doing anything wrong when you can't sleep.
I think it's so easy for us to turn toward ourselves, turn on ourselves and go, oh, I'm doing something wrong.
And then making that time to journal and to process and to talk to people because journaling and talking accomplish similar, They're very, very similar effects, if not the same effects, right?
It's like, you're processing what you're going through.
I think it slows your brain down too.
Yeah. There's something about the, in your head, you can have an argument with yourself that goes 150 miles an hour and you end up nowhere.
But when you have to write it down, at least for me, it slows my thoughts down and it allows me to see connections that I might not see if I'm too busy, like, you know, in a knock down drag out with myself.
Yeah, it's so important to make time to honor your efforts.
So before bed, even if you just close your eyes for a moment, sitting up in your bed, and you go, Taylor, wow, what did you do today?
You got up, you answered that email, you took a moment to breathe when, when something felt difficult, and you just kind of give yourself like a gold star for each of the little efforts that you made without judgment.
you know I did mention get out of bed because some mornings that is really rough yeah so just kind of letting yourself recount the efforts of the day and your strengths like how did those efforts reflect your persistence or your kindness or your patience right and just kind of calling out some of those strengths and really kind of reassures your your worried anxious mind that you are there are things happening right there is progress being made and you are showing up with these with these beautiful qualities well you got this taylor we're with you and um you know don't be afraid to let us know
how it goes and six in six months taylor's gonna be like yeah no i'm a vp now everything's good exactly sleep like a baby exactly okay let's go to our second question here Here we go.
I'm Carol Edwards, I'm from Orange, Texas.
My question is when you see younger people in your family making some of the same mistakes you made when you were young and you want to so badly keep them from going down those hard roads, but you know you have to let them make their own way and learn their own lessons.
It's just so hard. What can you do to help yourself with that?
Thank you. This is a, this is a hard, hard question.
I just, like, I love, Carol, listening to your voice because it's, I can feel how, not just frustrating, but like the, um, it really is deeply painful to see someone you love going through something difficult that's avoidable.
That you know is avoidable from your own experience.
It's like you can see the hole and they're about to walk right into it.
And you're like, if you could just turn left, just don't, and it's like they have to, sometimes they have to walk into the hole, which I hate.
And especially if you're a parent, you're used to, your role has been to protect them since the day they were born and to make good decisions for them.
And then they start to transition into, you know, this age where they have more autonomy and you can't make every decision for them and you can't protect them from everything.
And, you know, what first came to mind for me was like, when your child or you're someone younger than you, like a sibling falls in love with someone who you know is not good for them.
Right? The worst. I don't fret about it.
I have younger siblings, and I've seen them get into relationships then.
I just had a, I never say it's not going to work out, but I have a strong, strong intuition.
Yeah, but what I try to do is remember times where I fell in love and Everyone around me said it wasn't gonna work out and I and a little part of me knew also wasn't gonna work out But there's something to be learned from every relationship you enter.
Yeah, and it's like a it's almost like a magnetic pull and I think there's a way to If someone I keep focusing on relationships I wish I could ask Carol like what specific behaviors where she's noticing.
Yeah, well, because think about it, it could be taking a job you don't think they should take or moving across the country, it could be any number of things.
Exactly. So coming back to your own lived experience and remembering yourself at those ages and remembering what it was like to feel compelled to move across the country or to take some action that you felt compelled to do, I think that can be really helpful in relating to younger relatives, just putting yourself there.
And I did this with my stepdaughter.
We were talking about friendships, and I recounted what it was like for me, at her age, to deal with certain difficult friends, or feel insecure about my body, or whatever it was.
And I let that be the moment, just speaking about it, to the extent she was interested, but not giving advice.
Because I could see that she wasn't ready for advice, She didn't want advice.
Her brain literally, her attention would have turned off the minute I started telling her what I think she should do.
So it's kind of like, yeah, negotiating that moment where you have their ear.
I don't know how old, Carole, the relatives are that you're talking about, but if they're teenagers, there's that balance where you have them for a moment and you don't want to lose that precious moment of safety and trust that they have in you in that moment.
I mean the extreme case of this reminds me of like 12 -Step.
Like you cannot help somebody to a program until they're ready to be helped.
Until they're open.
Until they want to, until they're asking for help.
So it's like I think like that also circles back to what you were saying of just you kind of get in there what you can get in there but it can't be forceful and it has to be open and then there has to be some peace.
One thing, one beautiful practice that came to mind that I use a lot too when there's something happening with someone I love that I can't control is using phrases of loving kindness and imagining them doing well.
Like I like to use the phrase best self.
What would it look like if my best self showed up and their best self showed up and we had a conversation.
What would that feel like?
What would they say?
There's a lot of healing that can happen especially when this is a person you're in relationship with but they're not available.
They're not in the right frame of mind to have a conversation with you.
Even if the person has passed away, it's still a healing practice to do.
But you can also just use phrases of loving kindness.
Close your eyes and think of this specific person and see them doing well, see them making good decisions, see them thriving and being at ease and at peace.
and then you can send them those phrases like, may you be peaceful, may you feel ease, may you be free from suffering and pain.
And it really soothes us in that moment because it feels like we're doing something and we are, we're changing our neurochemistry, we're changing our physiology in that moment but we're also orienting to the person differently which will affect how we treat them in real life, non -meditation life.
So that orientation shift is really powerful and it puts you in a state of ease, it allows that anxiety and that urge and that clinging to something else to settle.
I just had such an image, as you were saying, that of a person who is sending joy and happiness and well wishes to someone, how I would actually show up in conversation with them that day.
Like if I show up joyful loving and supportive we're gonna have one conversation if I show up Critical judgmental pushy trying to move you somewhere They're probably gonna dig their heels in and do the exact opposite of what I say just cuz Exactly, that's so true.
And I sometimes I even like to tell people that I sent them loving -kindness You know see them and go I just sent you some wishes today And I don't know to be told that someone out there or someone close to you is wishing you well.
It's this, it's almost like a something you can.
It's almost something tangible.
It's how I experience it.
It's like something that was given to me it's a gift. And just someone holding you in that space of love is really powerful.
And it does shift relational patterns that can be there and be reinforced through defensiveness and pushing and you know, this push -pull that we get locked into sometimes with loved ones.
Well, Carole, I can tell you this, whoever you are going to be practicing lovingkindness, I'm going to be doing it right alongside you.
I'm going to be practicing this with my kids and seeing if I can shift, because I do think there's many times where they're just like, oh, she's talking again.
Because I'm just, you know, I'm coming at them with a list of things they need to do and how they need to be in their life, and they're at an age where they want to start to figure out who they are in the world, like they're not quite there yet, but they are wanting to, and you can feel when someone doesn't want your words anymore.
And god that's such a great practice.
So, Carol, I will be practicing right alongside you.
Thanks, Carol. All right.
I am so excited for our last question.
As I mentioned, we've got a question from someone who's a younger person listening to Dear Headspace.
Let's roll this one.
My name is Lev, I'm from London.
My question is, why is it so hard to fall asleep at night?
Love! Your tiny little voice, that's such a delightful question.
I feel like love is just discovering like, wait, the sleep thing isn't working?
You know, that moment where it's worked, worked, worked, and then all of a sudden.
Or maybe you didn't know it didn't work because you were younger and you just, you know, did what you did.
But now you're like, oh, I don't always have control over this.
So curious how old you are, love, because there's certain things that happen in our brains as we get older, as we move from like 910 into 1112.
Yeah, but regardless, it's sometimes really hard to fall asleep, because we have so many busy thoughts.
We have so much kind of the momentum of our day, you know how much happened in our day, and what we were doing like if we're running around or we're, you know, being really active or on our phones or playing a video game.
So much of that busyness is still there when we're trying to fall asleep.
So it can feel really hard to make that transition for your body to go from being really, really busy and really, really active into like completely asleep.
But there are a lot of things you can do to help yourself in that transition.
I don't know when this term came out, but I love it anyway, but the term sleep hygiene.
We think of, like, hygiene for our bodies.
We have to make sure we smell okay, our hair's clean, our bodies are clean, but we don't really have a great understanding or knowing how important sleep hygiene can be.
So maybe I would say to Lev, write down a couple things you can do to help yourself transition into sleep.
So maybe that's having something warm to drink so your body feels a little warm.
Maybe it's taking a bath.
Yeah, just having kind of a list and being fun with it, like you can go onto Word or Google Docs and just like create a nighttime routine for yourself and add in elements that feel fun for you.
Maybe it's reading a book before bed or listening to an audiobook or having like your favorite blanket nearby, but just having kind of a plan for how you're going to wind down in the evening.
You know, what's funny, Lev, I would I would venture to guess that when you were a tiny baby, your parents had a whole routine of how to, how to get you ready for sleep.
Like when when my kids were born, there was at seven o 'clock.
We brought the lights down.
The TV became quieter.
We spoke quieter. There was always three books that we read after the bath.
There was a whole elaborate, probably an hour long sleep routine.
And it's funny how as we get older, maybe the parents get a little busier or your life gets busier or your school starts to get busier.
Like Sam mentioned, you have hobbies now, and like maybe you have electronics around you that you're able to use.
And I think that that routine is the first thing that goes out the window sometimes, and not just for you, Lev, could be for anyone.
That we forget that that's something we should do for ourselves.
And we all, at some point in our lives, are guilty of throwing that out the window and then wondering why we can't sleep.
And like you said, with the routines and school and things that you have to do, that the adults are telling you, you have to get this done, you have to do your homework, the nighttime can feel like this really magical free time where you get to do whatever you want.
and it's a natural urge to wanna extend that out as long as possible.
Like staying up late is kind of a reflection of that, where like, ooh, I get to do whatever I want and I have freedom.
So, yeah, but just kind of thinking about how that'll affect the next day, too.
You know, if you push it a little too far, it might be hard to wake up, might be hard to focus at school.
There's actually a, I created a tucking in practice in the app.
Yeah, where you think about— it's a reflection on the past, the future, and the present.
So you think about the day that you just had and what went well, what was a little bit like—what pinged you, I use the word ping—and then what are you looking forward to tomorrow, just maybe one or two things that you— you know, seeing a friend or having something in your lunch that you look forward to eating.
And then it brings you back to this moment, right, like taking in what around you feels cozy.
Maybe it's a blanket, maybe it's a stuffed animal, maybe it's like something about your room that makes you feel really safe and cozy.
And having something like that, you can even, with or without the help of an app or guided meditation, but just think of, Lev, something in your day that you enjoyed, something tomorrow that you'll enjoy and then something right now that you enjoy.
So three points of joy, we'll call it.
That's a fantastic little practice.
It's almost like a walking meditation or meditation where you're taking the sounds of the room, it's like bringing yourself back to the present so then you can, you know, it's like you're cueing yourself, and now, goodnight.
Like, it's almost like our bodies are going, going, going, and we need to give them a little cues to say, I'm telling you, the way I parent sometimes is like, I'm letting you know that your screens are ending in an hour, I'm not gonna just pull it out of nowhere, I'm telling you that's coming.
And it's like, let's tell our bodies the same thing, I'm gonna be sleeping soon.
Exactly and giving your mind time to because it wants to process and think about what happened today or what's going to happen tomorrow so giving it like a little container where it gets to do that instead of trying to stop those thoughts and make yourself focus on sleeping because we all know this that the more we try to go to sleep the more ramped up we get.
First it is. Yeah. Well let's say goodnight to Lev.
Thank you for your question, Lev and we Sleep tight and goodnight.
Yeah, goodnight, Lev.
I hope you sleep well.
Oh, well, those were just, those questions were so fun today, Sam, weren't they?
They were. They were.
I love how as we answer them, we're kind of reminding ourselves of our own innate wisdom.
It's wonderful. It's so true.
But before we go, we have, like, a little behind the scenes bonus question from Megan.
She's asking about the Headspace Sleep Cast and we brought in someone from the production side to give us a little answer.
so let's take a listen to Megan's question.
Hey, Headspace. This is Megan Sabato from Atlanta, Georgia.
Just curious, are any of the sleep casts real places, and if not, Where do you guys get the inspiration for?
They're great. Oh, good question.
All right. Well, we got Scott to answer that.
Go ahead, Scott. Hey, Megan, this is Scott.
I'm the director of audio here at Headspace and also one of the co -creators of Sleep and Sleep Casts.
So great question. Are these places based in reality?
to some degree I would say they are, but they're more what I like to call audio diorama.
They're fictitious places based on a real place.
For instance, with a cat marina, it would be really hard for me to go to a marina and record what a marina sounds like without a bunch of other sounds coming in to disrupt the listener.
I live in a busy place, there could be helicopters and cars and all these things, not very conducive to sleep, right?
So what I do is I create an environment that would sound sort of like a marina, and then we put in other sounds like the cats and the bells and the chatter of a walkie -talkie and things like that.
The idea being that by creating these extra sounds, we kinda help to create that visual experience that you're having while you're listening to the story.
That being said, I did go to some places and record sounds that are in these sleepcasts.
For instance, Sleeper Mountain, there's an owl.
I was in the forest one night, and I recorded that owl.
Or for the aquarium, I actually went to a fish store and recorded a bunch of sounds, pumps and bubbles and all these things.
So we do use the real world to help create these sleep casts, but we also use other sounds to help emphasize it.
Hope that answers your question, and thanks for listening to the Sleep Cast. Oh my god, that's so cool.
Well, that was just so wonderful.
All those questions were great.
And I just want to say thank you to Taylor, Meghan, Carol, and especially Little Lev for your questions.
And if anybody out there who's listening, you're a Dear Headspace listener and you have a question and you want us to answer it, just head over to SayHi .Chat slash Dear Headspace.
All you have to do is follow the prompts to record your question and if we use your question on the show, which would be very exciting.
you are going to get three months of headspace for free that you can use, or you can share it with somebody else who you think might enjoy it.
It's really pretty wonderful.
And that address is going to be in the show notes as well.
Yeah. And it's another part of the show that I love that we're going to head into.
And it's this time that we built in for you to process all you just heard to really digest the wisdom and everything we talked about.
And it's also a time to transition from whatever you're doing now—listening, being present for what we're talking about—into the next part of your day.
So as you listen to the sounds of the jungles of Cameroon at night, just let your mind do whatever it wants to do.
Until next time, stay happy, stay healthy, and be kind to each other.
. . Dear Headspace is a Headspace Studios original podcast. It's produced by Robin Hopkins, Ash Jones, and Scott Sorensen.
It's executive produced by Morgan Selzer, Sarah Cohen, Baron Farmar, and Danny Chirsumi.
It's hosted and produced by Robin Hopkins, Keisanga Giskombe, Dora Kamau, Samantha Snowden, and Eve Lewis -Prieto.
Sound recording and post -production is by Dan Krall, music is by Scott Sorenson and Chris Murgia, and a very special thanks to Colleen Lutz.
Thank you.
