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This is World Today.
Hello and welcome to World Today.
I'm Zhao Yang.
Coming up, the 22nd China-ASEAN Expo is underway in Nanning.
What are the highlights of this year's event?
The U.S.
Federal Reserve has cut interest rates for the first time this year.
What does it mean for the U.S. and global economies?
And Saudi Arabia and Pakistan have signed a mutual defense pact.
What's behind the decision?
China has called for joint efforts with the Association of Southeast Asian Nations Countries to bring the building of a China-ASEAN community with a shared future to new heights.
Chinese Vice President Han Zheng made the remarks while addressing the opening ceremony of the 22nd China-ASEAN Expo and the China-ASEAN Business and Investment Summit in Nanning.
Han said, the China-ASEAN Comprehensive Strategic Partnership has been continuously deepened in recent years, bearing the most dynamic model of regional cooperation in the Asia-Pacific region.
The Vice President urged the two sides to strengthen the alignment of development strategies, jointly advance belt and road cooperation and work together to implement global initiatives proposed by China.
For more.
We are joined by Dr Zhou Mi, Senior Research Fellow with Chinese Academy of International Trade and Economic Cooperation.
Han Zheng described China-ASEAN relationship as the most successful and dynamic model of regional cooperation in Asia-Pacific.
What's your thought on this and what factors do you believe have contributed to this success?
Well, we know that China and ASEAN countries, we are neighbors.
I think that kind of relation started thousands of years ago.
So I think that the relation is coming from the.
You know, the recognition about the common merits and also a lot of complimentary advantages by both sides.
So if you're looking at trade investment, the people's communications and also a lot of other areas, I think China and ASEAN will have natural advantages of doing more to try to address the other side's demands.
And in the recent years, we are seeing that China and ASEAN countries have established several mechanisms, including the free trade agreements.
The China and ASEAN free trade agreement is the first free trade agreement for both sides.
So we discussed this kind of possibilities of addressing the challenges from the other side.
If you're looking at the free trade agreement, I think that we started by the most required areas of development by the earlier harvest.
That is, kind of reduce the tariffs on the agricultural products, especially the fruits imported from other countries.
And then we move on to the trading goods and the trading services and investment.
We are moving on to the version three.
That is kind of things to discuss about the real leading areas and some of the very important new areas.
So the trade relations between these two sides are really coming from history and also strengthened by the modern technology.
And we have similar ideas that is to trying to provide the both sides, the people more choices.
And I think that is really helpful for us to understand the relation between these two sides.
Yeah, and Han spoke of synergizing development strategies and building a closer community with a shared future.
How do you think China and ASEAN can better align their development strategies?
Yeah, ASEAN countries, they are diversified in the development stage.
Some of these countries, like Singapore.
They are more developed, but they are smaller and they are mainly focused on the finance, or logistics or the transportation.
But for some other countries, like Myanmar Laos Cambodia, they really want to move upward in the global supply chains.
So for us, how can we try to have a more inclusive development?
That also are kind of very important issues and topics that both of us are trying to address.
I mean, that is kind of ideas that we can try to follow this, following several aspects or paths.
The first one, we should try to commit to our promises as openness and also trying to reduce the barriers for the trading goods and the trading services or investment by improving the transparencies among the administrations.
And the second.
I think that is also we have to listen to the market requirement, to try to help the enterprises if they are going to establish the existence or companies in the other side, and trying to help them to understand the cultures, the different requirements or laws by the respective countries.
But the third one is that we have to do more to concentrate on the advantages of a different economy.
Like for the country of Malaysia, they are really good at electronics, so we help them, to support them by supply chains.
We are not just trying to control everything.
I think that the relation between our two countries started from the demand of the market, so we help them to improve their certainty about the supply chains.
So this is kind of ideas.
I would say that is also our very limited examples.
We can even do more to share our future, to share our experiences and also to help the other side to overcome their disadvantages.
Yeah, and Han also mentioned China's global development initiative, global security initiative, global civilization initiative and the global governance initiative.
How might these broad initiatives shape China-ASEAN cooperation and practice?
Well uh, these different kind of initiatives are proposed in the different times.
Maybe in the past we know that development issues uh, you know, the civilization issues are kind of idea that you know lead us to think about what can we do to uh to deal with the relation with other countries.
But now, when the world is facing more challenges, like this year, the governors becoming more and more important see, the multilateral system are under uh, very uh serious attacks by some country and that is definitely, you know, will harm the economies.
So if you're looking at the other end country, i think that singapore is one of the countries who are trying to do more connections with the rest of the world and by the free trade agreements actively.
So I think that they really are giving us some kind of ideas that if you are going to have more stability and you can assure that enterprises can benefit from the cooperation you should provide them with a better and a certain environment.
And I think that those initiatives are welcomed by the ASEAN countries and all of us are not just trying to define the way of moving forward.
We are trying to discuss that and that is the way we are going to support the initiative and also to benefit from those.
Yes um, and also you mentioned the version 30 of china asean free trade area.
What specific upgrades or changes can we expect in this version 30 and how could they benefit businesses and economies across the region?
Well, I mean, that is a kind of requirement actually from the market, because China and ASEAN we have fulfilled almost every traditional commitments on the rules of trade covering the traditional areas.
But now we are seeing that the digital economy has changed everything.
It has injected so many new elements in the way of doing businesses.
So something to do with the digital economy, something to do with green energy or something to do with how can we protect the intellectual property or strengthen the global supply chains, or at least in the regional level.
So these questions are really are, you know, challenges we have to give for the enterprises, otherwise i don't think the enterprises will have the clear idea about what the government really want to do.
So, based on this kind of idea, the three version of the China at the end, free trade agreements are trying to start some of the new rules, and those rules are not being seen in any other free trade agreements in the world.
So we are trying to discover a better space and also trying to give the the market enterprises more confidence if they are going to holding, you know, head for what they are really want to pursue in the higher technology and the new ideas of doing business is they can just do it and we will help them to.
To have a stable expectation and also some of these guarantees about the possible risks.
Yes, and Han Zheng emphasized safeguarding the stability of global industrial and supply chains.
What specific vulnerabilities are China and ASEAN seeking to address?
And how crucial is their cooperation in strengthening supply chain resilience?
Yeah, it is kind of the biggest threat this year by the so-called reciprocal tariffs by the United States.
I think the United States has put a very high and unreasonable requirement to impose additional tariffs on all the trading partners, including China and ASEAN countries.
Well, you know, the supply chains are originally are reflecting the demand and the supply relations in the market rules, but now they are putting more strengthen.
So we will know that the cooperation between China and ASEAN maybe are just in one side, while United States as a market power, they are trying to do more things to change the supply side.
So I mean that is really our impact for all of us to adapt to.
Well, the further one, the further threat is coming from the rules.
If we are not able to be sure about what the rules we have committed will still prevail in the future, we will not have the direction for the future development.
So, in this regard, China and ASEAN can discuss about What can we do in such kind of circumstances?
Can we still stick to our principles or we can just try to reconstruct the supply chains, to improve the benefit and the welfare of doing business in such an important way in China and also in other countries, to address the demands of the people.
So there are so many possibilities and a lot of topics we have to discuss under such kind of circumstances.
Okay, and this year's expo has added some new exhibition zones, such as areas for AI, new quality productive forces and marine economy.
How significant is the focus on these emerging sectors for China-ASEAN cooperation?
Well, it is true that this expo is very outstanding.
I mean, it's brand new to bring the AI as a key element to this expo.
So I think it's really a good signal that it's addressed, a kind of ideas coming from the development.
The AI and also, like you mentioned, the marine economy a lot of issues we share, the same interest by China and other countries.
So China, some of the Chinese companies are really leading in some areas.
But we also want to learn more from our partners from other countries.
Maybe these exhibitions or some kind of ideas can inspire our trading partners.
Maybe we can do something more together.
So, based on this kind of new ideas, we can Just trying to give the people and the economy more forces of development and reduce the impacts on the environment, which is a very important issue when we have to deal with the climate change challenges globally.
That is Dr Zhou Mi, Senior Research Fellow with Chinese Academy of International Trade and Economic Cooperation.
This is World Today.
Stay with us.
You're listening to World Today.
I'm Zhao Ying.
The U.S.
Federal Reserve has cut interest rates for the first time this year, reducing borrowing costs by a quarter point.
This puts the target range for its main lending rate at 4 to 4.25 percent.
The central bank signaled that it viewed a deteriorating labor market as a more immediate risk than a rise in inflation triggered by Donald Trump's tariffs.
Fed officials indicated they expect two more rate cuts this year.
For more.
We are joined by Dr Yao Shujie Chang Kong, Professor of Economics at Chongqing University.
Dr. Yao, thanks for joining us.
Hi, nice to invite me.
What are the main reasons the Fed decided on a quarter point rate cut now, even as inflation is edging higher?
The Fed basic interest rate has been maintained for a fairly high level for quite some time and it has achieved the main principle target of reducing the headweight inflation over the last few years.
Now the inflation is brought down to 2-3%, which is quite low compared to a few years ago.
On the other hand, I think the domestic economy of the US has shown market and also the economy activities which are weakening.
This approach is to I think from the US perspective and from the Fed perspective is to prevent further economy decline to a point which is not acceptable.
So, in a sense, a cutting rate is to maintain the balance of inflation and the economic dynamics for the US economy.
So it is the time over the last nine months I think the Fed had made a difficult decision to cut the rate.
But this rate is moderate just a quarter point and there may be some action to be taken in the future.
Yeah, and Powell highlighted a sharply cooling labor market, even though unemployment is still low.
But he described the labor market as one of low hiring and low firing.
So what does this mean for workers and what factors may have led to this phenomenon?
Politicians' statement, you have to read it with some caution, low firing and low hiring.
You should pay attention to the second half, low firing and low hiring.
Low hiring means firms are reluctant to hire new labour.
And this is not good for the macroeconomy stability, because you should have a situation where the firms are willing to hire more workers to replace the older one.
All the change of the structure within the domestic economy from the more promising one to the less promising one.
So the high interest rate actually has prevented this process of shifting in the labor market and in the production system.
So by lowering the interest rate, I think they give a scope for firms to change the direction, to expand in the area that they can expand.
Although in the meantime I think the less competitive enterprises and economy sector would slow down, but the more energetic promising sector would be able to go.
Okay, but in the meantime we see inflation ticked off to 29 in August, and that's partly due to Trump's tariffs.
So how does the Fed balance this inflationary pressure against the need to support employment?
Yeah, the ideal target is 2 for most of the industrialized countries, including China, UK and Western Europe and the United States.
I think a general consensus is 2%.
But 29, although it is significantly higher than 2, but it's not beyond some unacceptable level, such as 3 or 35 and so on.
During the COVID-19, I think the US inflation reached as high as 3.5%.
From 8.5%, the Fed started to increase the interest rate to bring the inflation down to this level.
And if the interest rate continues to be high, I think the inflation rate would also, you know, blow down.
But in the meantime it will also harm the real economy, the manufacturing, the service sector and also the consumer sector, where most people would find the borrowing cost is too high, too bad.
And this is why we have to have a balance of choice.
Despite the inflation is still on the higher side, but it may not be a disastrous situation.
The potential risk is production expansion, which is now the key concern for the Fed and the US government.
Okay, so how is the Fed rate cut likely to influence global capital flows?
Like, could we see significant investment moving from U.S. assets into some emerging markets, maybe?
Yeah, if you look at the negation of the market over the last 24 hours or 48 hours, there is a significant activity, for example in the Chinese stock market.
And also, you know, the Chinese listed company in the New York Stock Exchange.
They are performing relatively better than the domestic firms in the US market.
This means that there is a market sentiment, a quick market sentiment toward major trading partners and competitors such as China, and that could be duplicated in other economy as well.
So there will be slight movement of capital towards outside the United States, especially United States, major trading partner and industrial competitors.
However, I have to put a cautious note because market sentiment sometimes could be very short-lived.
One day, two days, and after a few days, investors have to digest the potential consequences.
So it is a little bit too early to indicate how big and how far, how fast this kind of cross-border capital movement.
But if the delay continues to be cut in the US, I think there is more tendency that capital will be more moving towards outside the United States.
Okay, but how might the Fed's decision influence the monetary policies of other central banks around the world?
Yeah, if the United States lower the interest rate as it did over the last two days, impossibly in the rest of the year there will be some further recut.
That means that other countries especially in my case I'm more concerned about China that gives some bigger scope for the monetary authority to have more legalization in the money market.
For example, China will be able to even brought down the topic about the interest rate further and also even give more liquidity to the market without too much concern about the external challenges.
And this would give more flexibility for the domestic economy within China.
Similarly, I think Japan, South Korea, Western Europe, the major, you know, the world major economic bloc, they would have the same situation.
Yeah, the Fed signaled the possibility of two more cuts by year end.
But what economic triggers would push them toward that path or make them hold back?
In my view, I think there are two principal indicators.
First is the CPI, which is the inflation rate.
If the inflation rate is stable or even decline, then there is more certainty that the interest rate will be cut.
But if the interest rate is stable but on the up let's say by next month or a couple of months later the inflation rate is to go beyond the 3 then the possibility of cutting the rate further in the short term would be reduced.
Another indicator which is quite different, or it is a mirror reflecting the CPI or the inflation rate, is the economy activity index.
If the domestic economy becomes a solid and robust gap, the interest rate cut will be reduced.
If the economy is slowed down and weakening, there will be further interest rate cut.
Whether the rate, whether the Fed will cut the interest rate or not, it depends on these two major counteractive forces domestic inflation and domestic economy activities.
There will be some other concern.
For example, you know, the external environment change, the trading system change.
But they are probably minor factors compared to the two factors I just mentioned.
Yeah.
But what about the political factor?
Because Trump has been vocal in criticizing the Fed and Powell, even attempting to fire Governor Lisa Cook.
So how might political pressure influence the Fed's decision making?
Personally, I don't like Trump as the president.
But what he does, I think he has some point.
He wants the US economy to expand steadily and strongly.
So from the US perspective, I think he's probably doing the same thing.
And he wanted the Fed to cut the interest rate because he wanted the US economy not to be slowed down.
So he wanted to maintain a relatively stable, decent economic growth rate.
And this, to a great extent, I think it is understandable.
OK, thank you, Dr. Yao Shujie, Chang Kong Professor of Economics at Chongqing University.
And coming up, Saudi Arabia and Pakistan have signed a mutual defense pact.
You're listening to World Today.
We'll be back after a short break.
You're listening to World Today.
I'm Zhao Ying.
Saudi Arabia and Pakistan have signed a mutual defense pact.
Pakistani Prime Minister Shabazz Sharif and Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman witnessed the signing ceremony on Wednesday.
The cooperation comes as Gulf Arab states are re-evaluating the reliability of the U.S. security umbrella after the U.S. turned a blind eye towards Israel's attack on Qatar last week.
A statement from the Pakistani prime minister's office says the pact stipulates that any aggression against either country is to be considered aggression against both.
For more.
We are joined by Dr Wang Jin, associate professor at Northwest University in Xi'an, China.
Dr. Wang, thanks for joining us.
It's my great pleasure.
So Saudi officials said the agreement institutionalizes a historic partnership.
Can you provide some historical context on the defense and security ties between Saudi Arabia and Pakistan?
Well, the two countries actually share very close ties over military cooperation and defense relations.
We know that actually they are two countries complementary with each other because Saudi Arabia is very influential, particularly over religions, over political and diplomatic and particularly economic dimensions in the Islamic world.
Well, Pakistan is also very important, not only from the political level, but also it has a very strong military capabilities in Islamic countries.
So that's why the two countries had a very long history over military cooperation.
Actually, in the history, the two countries shared very close ties.
For example, Saudi Arabia once uh ask the the the assistance from pakistani military personnel to train and to uh defense their national security.
And also on many occasions particularly, for example, in 2015 in the yemen war when, when saudi arabia started to uh to decide it to enter uh to to to enter the german civil war, and saudi arabia, at the very beginning, hopes that the pakistani military forces could help Saudi military forces to join the war, which has already been rejected, had been rejected by by Pakistan.
But actually we should understand that the two sides are very close with each other.
And also another incident that we cannot forget or ignore is that was that in 1979, when the Mecca mosque incident, on which that the group of so-called terrorists, they entered and taken a lot of hostages in the Mecca mosque And then it was Pakistani military forces entered and rescued the hostages and helped the Saudi military forces repress this kind of uprising.
So that's why the two countries had very close ties.
And after decades of cooperation discussion, now the pact came to verse, which could be understood as a very milestone for the bilateral military cooperation and relations.
So the security ties have long been there.
But what do you think are the reasons that Saudi Arabia decided to sign this official mutual defense pact with Pakistan at this particular moment?
I think we should understand that the very new understandings of saudi arabia over its defense cooperation with other countries because we know that traditionally saudi arabia always emphasized its military cooperation with the united states uh it actually there were military bases in uh united states military bases in saudi arabia and also that united states uh was understood as saudi by saudi arabia as the most important uh pillar for its defense system.
But now I think Saudi Arabia tried to transform and try to reconsider its policies and its relations with the Pakistani military forces was highlighted much more by Saudi Arabia Kingdom as well as Saudi Arabia's the, the decision makers right now.
So that's why, against this back particularly moment, particularly we know that the count this, the whole region, the Middle East now is actually experiencing the very, very moment of turmoil and the chaos.
So that I think Saudi Arabia decided to try to bring the more assistance and the more cooperation over military levels from Pakistan and also the two countries.
Now they share a lot of common interests.
So that's why the agreement came into verse and this is a very important timing.
Okay, so could this be a subtle signal to the US regarding Riyadh's dissatisfaction with American response to recent events like the Israeli attacks on Qatar?
And how do you think this is going to influence Saudi-U.S. ties?
Well, of course, I think it is an important response from Saudi Arabia to United States incapable or incapabilities over Israeli attacks against Qatar, because Qatar is very close to Saudi Arabia and also similar to Qatar, which has a very strong military base there.
And Saudi Arabia also has a lot of United States military personnel and several United States important military bases.
So, and during the past decades, Saudi Arabia, like Qatar, they bought United States weaponry systems, a lot of weaponry systems every year and try to maintain it or take it as an important bridge connecting Saudi Arabia and the United States military systems.
But as you mentioned that Israel attacked Qatar, United States did nothing.
And also maybe Saudi Arabia also worried about it.
So I think it could be understood as a very suggestion of the division between the United States and Saudi Arabia.
And also it should be understood as Saudi Arabia's latest attempts to try to keep its military independence.
It's an important effort to do that.
Okay, so as we know, Gulf states have traditionally relied on the U.S. for security.
But could this pact suggest a broader move toward diversifying alliances in the region?
I think it's for sure.
I think it's for sure, because it's actually, as we mentioned, that traditionally the Gulf monarchies, the Gulf Arab monarchies, they always and maintain or always cherish the relations, particularly military cooperation, with the United States, so that the United States becomes the only choice for the original countries, for the original powers, for the original monarchies.
But now, as we mentioned, after Israel attacked Qatar, the United States did nothing.
The United States not only didn't intercept the missiles and the airplanes from Israel, but also didn't follow or didn't try to shoot down the Israeli fighters after this attack and didn't very seriously blame Israel for the activity.
So I think these things, anger, not only Qatar, but also other Gulf monarchies.
So that's why I think, against this backdrop that suggested that the more diversifying alliances in this region.
They try to find new allies, try to find new friends.
And Pakistan becomes a very, very favorable choice for the Gulf monarchies right now.
But what does this mean to the US efforts to push for normalization between Israel and Arab states?
I think it is suggested that maybe the influence from the United States towards the Gulf Arab states would be much more limited is actually declining.
Because we know that traditionally that the United States, under the United States Middle East strategy, they hope that the Israel normalization with the Gulf monarchies, Arab monarchies, could become the example for the more broader levels of Israeli Arab states normalization.
But now that, given that the division started to emerge, I don't think that this trend would be maintained.
So that's why I think it's a very important milestone in the historic moment that we should remember.
Maybe we will realize how important it is after decades, I mean, several years later.
Thank you, Dr. Wang Jin, Associate Professor at Northwest University in Xi'an, China.
This is World Today.
Stay with us.
You're listening to World Today.
I'm Zhao Ying.
A Kazakhstan expert specializing in China studies says China-Kazakhstan ties have grown into a multifaceted partnership spanning trade investment energy, transport and education.
Golnar Shymurgenova, director of the China Studies Center in Kazakhstan, noted this in the context of Chinese President Xi Jinping's global governance initiative.
She emphasized the importance of regional stability and voiced strong support for China's efforts to advance multilateral cooperation, sustainable development and practical partnerships across the region.
She also added that cultural and educational exchanges, including Confucius Institute and Luban Workshops, are strengthening mutual trust and laying the foundation for long-term cooperation.
For more, here is the conversation between Shai Murganova and my colleague Song Ruixin.
Ms.
Shai Murganova.
China and Kazakhstan have elevated their ties to a permanent, comprehensive strategic partnership.
How can this relationship contribute to shaping a fairer and more effective global governance?
This relationship, described by our President Tokayev as one of eternal strategic partnership, has already evolved into a multi-faced framework encompassing sustainable bilateral trade, record level investments and intergovernmental coordination in energy, transport and in education sphere.
And through the expansion of Belt and Road Initiative.
Through this cooperation, Kyrgyzstan has become a central Eurasian hub for connectivity and inclusive development.
And also this upgraded partnership directly contributes to improving global governance mechanisms in several core dimensions.
First, this is joint advocacy and multilateralism.
The second is a model of regional integration.
The third is high level economic and infrastructure partnerships practical results such as the 44 billion bilateral trade and 27 billion in Chinese investment and over 6000 operating joint enterprises.
All these demonstrate how equitable collaboration accelerates shared prosperity and builds resilience against systemic shocks, also setting standards for other cross-border economic relationships.
The next is societal and cultural engagement, which includes expanding cultural, academic and people-to-people exchanges.
All this including streamlined visa regimes and tourism initiatives, strengthening mutual understanding and trust at all levels, crucial for sustainable international cooperation.
Okay, so Kazakhstan is a key hub in the built and rolled initiative and a founding member of the SCO.
With the recent collaboration between Kazakhstan's federal regional government and enterprises in Ningxia on desertification control.
How can those platforms and local level partnerships work together to promote this kind of regional stability and sustainable development?
Well.
Kazakhstan stands as a central bridge in both the Belt and Road Initiative, also in the Shanghai Cooperation Organization, leveraging its strategic position, robust infrastructure and commitment to regional cooperation.
As a leading economy in Central Asia, Kazakhstan facilitates Eurasian connectivity by hosting major BRI-linked industrial logistic, also financial hubs, such as Astana International Financial Center and key railway corridors essential for trade between China, Europe and the Middle East.
And through the SCO, Kazakhstan actively shapes multilateral policy agendas which focused on security, fair economic integration and sustainable development, as seen during its Energetic 2024 and 2025 chairmanship, which advanced environmental protection.
Also digitalization and collective stability for the wider region.
And I think these two platforms, BRI and SCO, reflect a deep synergy between Kazakhstan and China in creating shared prosperity and mitigating challenges.
For example, Kazakhstan received 23 billion dollars in BRA investments in early 2025, positioning it as the initiative's largest regional recipient and a model for high impact infrastructure and logistic development.
Also SCO cooperation channels, regional stability and policy coordination through regular dialogue on trade and energy and ecological security, as outlined in recent summit declarations and strategic action plans.
So let's move on to people-to-people exchanges, such as joint universities, Confucius Institutes and Luban workshops.
I'd like to say they are flourishing.
So what benefits do they bring to local communities and how can these cultural and educational initiatives contribute to building a more just and balanced international system?
I think these platforms not only facilitate the exchange of knowledge and skills, but also strengthen mutual respect trust, solidarity between countries, laying the foundation for long-term peace and cooperation.
Chinese President Xi Jinping has repeatedly emphasized that kinship between people is the key to relations between countries and that youth exchange and the development of educational initiatives lays the foundation for the continuity of friendship between countries.
At the Tianjin summit, Xi Jinping noted the importance of educational workshops for ensuring sustainable development, inclusiveness and fairness of the global system, as well as the need to build platforms for dialogue among civilizations and the exchange of best practices.
During his visit to the Luban workshop, President of Kazakhstan Kazimzham Artukaev emphasized that he highly appreciated the contribution of Chinese universities and expressed hope that similar workshops would be established in Kazakhstan in the future.
He also expressed support for the expansion of cultural centers and educational programs as a tool for strengthening intercultural ties, considering this an important part of the implementation of Kazakhstan's national goals and successful integration into multilateral mechanisms, including the SCO and the United Nations.
You know, Kazakhstan is the only country in the world where three Luban workshops are already operating at the East Kazakhstan Technical University, also the Eurasian National University and the Academy of Logistics and Transport.
Despite the fact that there are more than 34 Luban workshops around the world in 30 countries, but only in Kazakhstan they are represented on such a large scale and taking into account national industry needs, which reflects the on equivalences of Kazakhstan's experience.
So these initiatives create bridge of trust, shifting the focus from competition between civilizations to cooperation and creative partnerships.
And these.
They provide equal opportunities for the development of talents and unleashing of potential, and thereby contributing for the formation of a more just, balanced and peaceful world system.
American scholar Barry Saltman first had the opportunity to visit China's Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region in 1999, and he has been fortunate enough to return frequently over the years.
Through his academic studies, he has closely observed the region's development and changes.
Professor Saltman conducted a comparison of various quality of life indicators between the Uyghur population in Xinjiang and people living in Western countries.
His findings are quite interesting.
What exactly did he discover?
Liu Xin spoke with Barry Saltman, emeritus professor at Hong Kong University of Science and Technology.
Let's start with the background of what we're talking about the situation in xinjiang.
Between the 1990s and 2016 to be exact, the region suffered thousands of terrorist attacks, killing a large number of innocent people and hundreds of police officers, But the situation has improved greatly ever since.
It can be said that during the past decade nearly a decade almost none terrorist attacks ever happened.
How do you assess, from this result, the effectiveness of China's efforts in combating terrorism extreme violent extremism?
Basically, the situation of terrorism has been dealt with effectively in Xinjiang.
I say basically because since the end of 2016, as you noted, there has not been any significant murderous terrorist incident in the whole region.
That's not to say, though, that there still are not people who want to carry out such incidents.
In fact, in my recent trips to Xinjiang, I have talked to officials, policemen, etc. about that.
And they have indicated that there still are groups within Xinjiang that do conspire to carry out terrorist acts.
And they have managed to foil those acts.
So they're doing their job in that regard.
But the other job that's being done, which I think is very significant in terms of reducing the threat of terrorism in Xinjiang, is to address the root causes of terrorism.
This is the official policy of the Chinese government.
And what this means in practice is, of course, to reduce the gaps that have existed in Xinjiang among ethnic groups, to see to rapid development in all of its various aspects, that is, to increase employment, to increase levels of education, to further develop health care, etc.
And if you look at statistics from say, 10 years ago and you compare them to those today, you can see a dramatic improvement in that regard.
You have published this paper this year titled Securitizing the Uyghurs?
Comparative Socioeconomic Indicators in China's Approach in Xinjiang.
But before we go into the specifics, what motivated you to study this particular topic and where did you base your findings on?
Where did you get the information to support your conclusions?
Well, I'm interested in this topic, of course, because of the mainstream discourse that exists in primarily the Western world but spread from the Western world to other parts of the world, about Xinjiang.
And that discourse is almost entirely erroneous in terms of its empirical statements and the interpretations it gives to data and to events in Xinjiang.
So I wanted to address that discourse and make a contribution to a counter narrative about Xinjiang.
The way that I've gone about doing it is both through the use of documents and through field work.
And although there is not enough data available to we scholars about Xinjiang, nevertheless there is some data available.
And I've made use of that through not only official publications that emanate from the Chinese government, but also the many studies that have been carried out by very serious-minded Chinese scholars.
China, of course, is the world center for Xinjiang studies, contrary to what some people in the West might believe about themselves.
And there literally are hundreds of scholars in China who do work about Xinjiang.
They produce some very useful studies.
So I make use of those studies.
And of course, I have visited eight of the 14 prefectures in Xinjiang in the last two years.
So that gave me some chance for observation, also to carry out some interviews with officials and particularly to interact with scholars in Xinjiang.
Well, let's dive in to the main comparisons you have made, as I said, quality of life indicators.
I have picked some of them because of the time constraint, but I'm interested in first of all the live expectancy comparison, meaning the gap between ethnic differentials in countries.
But by and large.
If you look at the United States, for instance, white people in the US versus the life expectancy between white people in the United States and Native Americans, there is 11 year gap versus white people in the US and black people in the US.
There's a six years difference in Australia between Australians and indigenous people.
I mean, non-indigenous people and indigenous people.
There is a gap of 10 years in New Zealand.
That gap is 7.4 years in Gaza.
Before the Gaza destruction, it was nine years already.
Whereas in Xinjiang the difference between the ethnic Han people, which is the ethnic majority of all over China, nevertheless the ethnic minority, if I may put it this way, in terms of population in Xinjiang.
The gap in life expectancy between the Han people and the Uyghur people in Xinjiang was only four years.
Am I understanding it correctly, Professor Southman?
What does that say about the quality of life in Xinjiang?
Well, you are understanding it correctly.
And what it says, I think, about the quality of life in Xinjiang is that the state is very serious about delivering quality health care to ethnic minorities in Xinjiang.
And they've become more serious over the years.
That delivery of healthcare can overcome the very large difference in terms of urbanity or rurality that exists between Uyghurs and Han people.
That is, Uyghurs are about 70% rural.
Han people are no more than 30% rural.
Everywhere in the world.
If you look at life expectancy, there's a big difference between urban people and rural people.
In Xinjiang.
This creates some particular difficulties because Xinjiang is a huge area, one sixth of China.
Settlements in Xinjiang are often a great distance from each other.
So the delivery of health care is difficult.
And if you talk to doctors in Xinjiang including, of course, Uighur doctors, they make this point again and again that it's hard to provide health care in the particular circumstances of Xinjiang.
Yet it's been provided to the extent that there is a much smaller gap that exists between Uyghurs and Han, that exists between the majority peoples in the countries that you mentioned and minority peoples.
And not just in those countries, because since I published that article, I've also looked at other parts of the world where the gaps are even larger.
So obviously, the fact that Uyghurs in Xinjiang are still mostly rural provides an obstacle to closing the gap entirely.
But the Chinese government has announced that by the year 2030 it intends to entirely close the gap between Han people and minority people in Xinjiang and have average life expectancy of 79 years.
And, of course, that average life expectancy of 79 years would be higher than the life expectancy in the United States.
That is Barry Saltman, Emeritus Professor at Hong Kong University of Science and Technology, speaking with Liu Xin.
And that's all the time we have for this edition of World Today.
I'm Zhao Ying.
Thank you so much for listening.
See you next time.
