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I have been listening to the Martha's Vineyard Beach and Book Club, which actually Elena recommended to me.
She did not listen to it, but she said, girl, this title sounds so you.
And let me tell you, it did. I've been listening to it while I walk, and I am absolutely loving it.
I love all the Audible. There's more to imagine when you listen.
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I am absolutely obsessed with a sweet treat after dinner, and my favorite sweet treat right now is my mochi.
It's mine now! Not yours. Just kidding.
You can have some too. This is a cool creamy scoop of ice cream. wrapped in a soft, chewy dough.
It's like a sweet little ice cream dumpling or ravioli.
I'm obsessed. It's pillowy. It's satisfying.
I feel indulged. I just love it so much.
I really am obsessed with the strawberry flavor right now.
My mochi is only around 70 calories per piece, which like, hello, that's amazing.
My mochi is gluten free and each box has six perfectly portioned mochi snacks.
Do I eat two a night? Yeah, yeah I do because they're that good.
And guess what? My mochi is the number one mochi ice cream in the US of A.
The strawberry flavor is bursting with fresh picked fruit flavor that tastes incredibly refreshing.
I love, love, love them after dinner. This August, look for the purple box of My Mochi ice cream at your local grocery store. and feel joyfully chill with the coolest treat around, my mochi. still morbid it's probably never gonna be anything else I was just gonna say it's never gonna change so yeah I don't know why I said probably I was like it It might not ever be anything else.
I'm like, what is it gonna be? Nothing. What's it gonna turn into?
It's always gonna be... us it's always going to be us but you know what there's going to be more content More content, more content.
I love you. More content. We're not going to get into the deets because we want to like. surprise you yeah and we're like still planning it yeah we are but there's gonna be more content this year so like get psyched Yeah, we've been working.
We've been working. So I'm excited. I hope you guys are excited because we love you.
Yeah, we love you so much. We want to give you as much content as we possibly can.
All the content shoved on your face. all the content eat it sorry okay we're like super duper like punchy today super punchy you weren't like you were like very just like right i was very subdued and just living my life today and then ash came over and was punchy as fuck and it just kind of like radiated onto me which i appreciate I'm happy.
I don't know why I am this way today, but I'm in a great mood.
That's great. Here's a little bit about me.
I woke up before my alarm this morning. And I made myself a smoothie.
So maybe that's the key to being happy. Honestly, I feel like waking up before your alarm starting the day way earlier, it always feels like it's going to suck.
But when you do it, it sets the tone. I think it's also it always makes me feel good for the day.
Yeah, it does. And I think it's also not hearing your fucking alarm tone.
Oh, yeah. Waking up to something that is not a shitty alarm tone.
You know what's really funny? In my mind now, I was like, oh, don't say that.
Don't say fucking. And then I was like, wait.
This is why did I feel that way? Because you've been around the kids.
Oh, yeah. I've been swearing in front of the children lately.
She's having trouble. And Alina's like...
What is this? Can you please stop? And I'm like, oh God, I'm not ready yet.
I'm not ready. I'm not ready yet. And I just kind of like flow into it because I'm used to it, like not swearing in front of them, which it's like, I'm not like...
I don't really care if people swear in front of their kids.
No, of course not. really it's more just like we don't want the little one to repeat yeah and i just we just kind of always did that with them like we don't really care if other people don't like Do you, man?
Yeah. But it's just funny to hear. was right along with us and then all of a sudden just fell out of it and i was like what happened i don't even know why either like all of a sudden she's just a pirate and i don't know yeah i mean what happened I was raised by like two sailors because my dad was a sailor and Papa was.
So there you go. Anyways, that was a lot about me.
That little tidbit turned into a lot. So let's move on to the true crime part of the show.
Yeah, we're jumping right in. Boom. Let's go.
All right. So I picked this case and I pulled a you.
I was working on another case and then this case was in the sidebar.
I shit you not. Yep. And it has a weird, it's just like a tiny little detail that parallels to yourself. case that you just did and I was like it's not that weird but like I always look into signs a lot and I was like whoa so weird it's a sign we'll get there when we got there um but this case is crazy and it hasn't really been covered by too many of the true crime podcasts that i usually listen listen to other than generation y who i fucking love and quick little sidebar Oh, no, you're like leading me into mine.
If you're not listening to Generation Y...
What the fuck? Why? One, go listen to Generation Y and two, you are going to have a blast because there are so many episodes that you can go through.
They have hundreds and they are great. And I just like their flow together.
Yeah, they've always been one of my favorites.
They did a really good job covering this case.
This case is hard to put together. Because number one, there's a lot of misinformation about this case, which, by the way. if you didn't see the title, is The Mary Morris Murders.
The Mary Morris Murders. Correct. But yeah, there's a lot of misinformation out on there on the internet.
It's out on those internets. out on those internet out on that grid there's so much misinformation there is And it was hard to put together, but Generation Y, I listened to their coverage and I was like, listen to you guys like you found what I found okay because I was like shit like what's right what's not right like am I right am I right Are we right here?
And then I also came across this other podcast, The Prosecutor's Podcast.
They're a great podcast. Yeah, they're really good.
They did a three part series on these two murders, which.
I didn't get the chance to finish listening to, but I did see it credited a lot in the sources that I found for this episode.
I get it. prosecutor's podcast. Yeah, I wanted to shout them out because they were credited in a lot of the sources that I went to.
Well, and the fact that they have a background in law, I feel like that's so helpful for a true crime podcast.
Yeah, you can listen to them and be like, you are credible as fuck.
Yeah, because I'm just a fucking hairstylist.
That's gotten pretty all right at research over the couple years that we've been doing this.
It's gotten pretty all right. all right if i do say so myself so let's get into the story In our coverage of this story, I kind of wanted to start somewhere in the middle, which will bring us to October 16th, 2000 in Houston, Texas.
Marilyn Bullock had just been to her mother, Mary Lou Henderson Morris's funeral.
And her mother, Mary Lou, had been murdered just days earlier on October 12th.
So after the funeral, she called the coroner's office to see if she could get back some of her mother's personal belongings, including some jewelry.
And the reply that she got back left her rather confused and like shook.
The receptionist on the other line said that they still had Mary Morris's body and that the personal belongings could get picked up after the funeral.
Huh. And Marilyn was like, what? Like freaking out.
And she went on to say, quote, I was thinking We just had the funeral.
I saw the remains, and I was looking at something that wasn't my mother?
What? Luckily, that was not the case. The family did have the remains of their loved one.
However, another woman named Mary Morris had been killed and discovered just four days after Marilyn's mother, Mary.
Wow. Two Mary Morrises killed pretty much in the same spot.
I'm already like, all right, who fucked this up?
Yeah, for real. For real. Already. So before we get into the second murder, let's talk about Mary Lou Henderson Morris.
Mary Lou was 48 years old and she lived in the Spring Valley neighborhood of Baytown, Texas. which is in the greater area of Houston, if you're familiar with Texas, which I'm not super familiar with it.
But I know a ton of you are. And I went to Texas once, and I really liked it.
But she and her husband Jay, they had been married for about five years, and they built their house together.
And by all accounts, they were in a really loving marriage.
Of course. Yeah, of course. Mary had been married once before to a man named Jim Henderson, who was Marilyn's father.
Okay. But by the time that Mary and Jay met, through a personal ad in the paper, which I thought was just the cutest thing ever.
Very precious. Marilyn was an adult by this point.
So she remembered that her mother was quote, one of the nicest people that you'd ever want to know.
She acted like she was 20. She was always going somewhere.
She was always doing something. She never missed a day of work.
Just sounds like an all-around amazing lady.
I would want to hang out with her. Of course.
Of course. Carrie liked to garden in her spare time, and I guess she had this really beautiful rose garden, and she also loved to ride horses.
Oh, she's just lovely. Yeah. So when she wasn't busy planting or riding horses, She was working at the Chase Bank in Houston.
She had been with the bank for about 15 years and she worked there as a loan officer.
So the morning of October 12th, 2000 was a pretty standard morning for her.
When she woke up, she got ready for work. she got her things together, she got herself ready.
Jay was kind of still waking up because on this particular morning, Mary was waking up a little bit earlier than usual because she had like a lot of work to do at the bank.
Okay. So he was kind of still getting up, but they like to kind of like talk in the morning before they headed their separate ways.
He was getting up and he walked her down to her car.
He wished her a good day at work and then he waved as she drove away. okay like picturing that in my head is just like the sweetest just a wholesome little morning i love it He remembered seeing Mary Chevy Lumina.
Oh, there's the parallel. the lumina lumina that's the only parallel that's so that's a freaky little parallel yeah But he remembered seeing her Lumina pull onto the street that she would usually take if she was going to stop and get gas.
So he figured that she was filling up the tank before she got her day started.
Didn't really think too much of it. Also, just a quick little side note in case you didn't listen to the last episode and you're like, what the hell are you talking about?
In the last episode that we did, the last two, Brandon Swanson part one and two, he was driving a Chevy Lumina when he went missing.
So boom. I just didn't want to be able to know if you just jumped into this episode to be like...
Huh? What parallel? Where? Chevy Lumina?
That's the parallel. Yeah. That's it. That's it.
So the Lumina pulled onto the street that she usually pulled onto when she was getting gas.
And he was like, okay, cool. She's getting gas.
Whatever. Didn't think much of it. So he goes back inside, kind of like does his thing. not realizing that that would be the last morning he would ever spend with his wife oh that's horrible He had spent a lot of the day actually trying to reach Mary, but he wasn't able to. and around two in the afternoon he got a call from Mary's supervisor at work asking if Mary was home.
The supervisor didn't say who they were.
They weren't like, hi, this is Mary's supervisor.
They were just like, oh, hi, is Mary home?
And he was like, oh no, she's at work or like something like that.
So when I was listening to Generation Y's coverage of this story, I was really happy to hear that they found that as weird as I did.
Yeah, because that is strange. Why would the supervisor not say like, oh, hi, this is her supervisor in the first place?
But especially after her husband said like, oh, she's at work.
Would you not say? Oh, hey, this is her supervisor and that's why I'm calling.
She didn't show up today. 100%, that's what you'd say.
Right. But I guess this call was a simple, hey, is she there?
No, she's at work. Cool, bye. That doesn't make any sense.
No, it makes no sense at all. So weird. You know what's even more stressful than a packed calendar?
Realizing you're out of coffee right before a meeting.
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So after the call, Jay thought he might hear from Mary, maybe to explain who was calling earlier, because again, he doesn't know. or even just to check in, because he said that they talked all the time throughout the day.
And he had been trying to reach her cell phone to no avail, Later on, he would realize that she actually never took it to work with her that day.
It was still connected to the charger. She must have just like left in a hurry. and forgot her cell phone it happens i do that all the time So finally, around five that night, he called the bank and he was told that Mary never showed up for work that day. and immediately the hairs on the back of his neck stood up because in all the years that he had known Mary,
And really all the years that anybody had known Mary, she was not the type to miss a day of work.
And definitely not the type to no call, no show.
Like there's no way she would have done that.
See, this is why it's good to be that way.
Because then when something like this happens, people notice right away.
Exactly. If you're someone who's always calling into work or you're just no calling, no showing, people are just going to assume that.
Exactly. I wish I could tell myself that when I was young. younger, but she had been with the bank, like I said, for about 15 years. pretty good consensus on like who she was and all of them agreed something had to be wrong here So Jay contacted Mary's daughter, Marilyn, who also had not heard anything from Mary that day.
And then the two of them got together and they contacted the police to file a missing persons report.
Now they hopped in the car together and they kind of tried to retrace Mary's steps that day.
I think their first thought was that they were worried maybe she had some kind of car trouble and she's stranded somewhere.
And she has no way of reaching us. Yeah.
But at that point, she'd been gone for a while.
So it's like. We really need to figure out what's going on here.
Something's amiss. Now, while they were driving, they caught wind about a nearby fire in the area.
There was apparently a burned out car reported only about three miles from Jay and Mary's house.
So they made their way there. But once they got close enough, the investigators told them that they couldn't stay and they needed to go home and just wait to hear more.
Oh, man. I wonder if they were able to be like, what kind of car is it?
I don't even think they could tell. Yeah.
So earlier that day at about 10 a.m., a call had come into the local fire station And someone had reported that there was smoke coming from this remote area.
And at the time, Mary hadn't been reported missing yet.
And fires must be like pretty routine in this area because the firefighters didn't send anybody to check over there.
They kind of just assumed that it was like trash burning or like something like that.
Yeah. So... They thought that's all it was and it never really got paid attention to. until around the same time that Jay and Marilyn were reporting Mary Lou missing, another call came in about that area where the fire had been, but this call was a little different and far more sinister.
The caller explained that they had been out on their ATV in this specific area, and that they had come across at quote-unquote an abandoned car that was fully ignited and the fire was like spreading around the car at this point.
Oh, wow. So the police rushed to the scene.
And they were able to confirm after some time that this was Mary Lou Henderson Morris' Chevy Lumina.
What? The car was not abandoned. Mary Lou was left inside.
Oh, man. Now, I've seen it reported that she was found in the passenger seat of the car And I've also seen it reported that she was in the back seat of the car.
But nowhere have I seen it reported that she was in the driver's seat.
Okay. So that's interesting. So she was in a seat that she probably shouldn't have been in.
Yes, exactly. Kind of like makes you wonder, was she carjacked?
Like, had she not been driving the car out here yeah and when we learn a little bit more later you're like there's no way that she was driving so that makes sense So it would take them days to identify what was left of her and they would end up having to go off of dental records.
I had a feeling. That fire had been blazing for at least seven hours by the time they responded.
Yeah. wow like that must have been because the call was reported at 10 that there was smoke from that area this is now like like after five at this point oh wow so that's a long time there was not a lot left a lot of damage yeah A lot of damage.
Kind of concerning that they were just like content with the report of a fire, whether or not that they just thought it was like burning trash, but I guess I'll save that concern for another day yeah i was kind of wondering that myself but you know that was the explanation i it must just be like common in that area i guess Write in if you live there.
Write in. Let us know. So some of the jewelry that Mary had been wearing that day was still with her body.
But one key piece of jewelry was missing.
Her wedding ring. Ooh. Her wedding ring was missing, and so was her purse.
But for some reason the police didn't believe that this was motivated by robbery.
Dear police. What? What? How? I don't really understand.
I did see it reported in some sources that there were other valuables left in the car. but I can only assume that they mean the jewelry that was left on her body and nothing else because I would assume that everything else in that car would just be Yeah, you would think so.
At that point. No other valuables were mentioned by name and the police were like truly stumped because Obviously nothing was left behind by the killer.
And because Mary's body was so badly burned, there was really no way to determine how she died.
And what a way to do it. It's like that is such a Such a planned and very organized way of disposing of someone.
It very much is. And killing someone that it's like...
What happened here? Like this isn't just somebody who's like random like... you know, crazy person on the highway that's just like, I'm going to kill someone today and do this.
It's like, It seems very planned. And this is like a pretty much residential area to a degree.
So like what the hell is going on here? And the weirdest thing too was like obvious.
So they start talking to everybody that is close to her.
They start talking to people she worked with. people who she dealt with at the bank, literally not one person had a bad word to say about this woman.
Everybody loved her and there was no sign of trouble in the marriage.
She had an ex-husband that was actually searching for her before she was found, and he was cleared of any wrongdoing.
Like, it just... There was nothing to go off of.
And this kind of crime scene, like I said, it... like reeks of somebody who is involved in something very shady.
Like very nefarious. Yeah. And it's like and this doesn't seem to be the case here.
No. So it's like what? And usually, like, the first time you do something like this, you're not going to commit, like, arson.
Yeah, you're not going to... Yeah, this just doesn't, it doesn't seem like somebody who's just like, oh, I'm just going to give this a shot.
It's like somebody who has done this before.
And it's doing this for a reason. Absolutely.
Like sending a very real message. And the wedding ring being missing is huge.
And that's going to come back later. Don't worry.
So just put that in your back pocket. I'm going to stay here. cool i'm gonna stick around i'm gonna listen to the rest of this i was hoping that you would yeah it makes it it makes the show a little easier it does yeah So the investigators believed that gasoline or some kind of accelerant must have been doused not only all over Mary in the inside of the car, but around the car too, because the fire had spread pretty widely around the car.
Um, like there was like trees that were singed by all of this.
It was intense. And again, it was burning for at least seven hours.
So that's intense. So they think that it was gasoline.
In some sources, I saw that some people believed Horse manure may have been actually used as the accelerant.
Okay. That's something you can make like explosives out of.
Okay. So I found that interesting because you don't hear that every day and because too, Ah.
So... Horse manure was like kind of like a material that was involved in her life.
Yeah, for sure. It seems to me when I was like first reading it, like one of those weird things that people just add to a story, like, the further like yeah that's like a nasty game of telephone that just exactly Exactly.
I wanted to look further into it to see if horse manure is even somewhat common to be used as an accelerant.
And it turns out that it is. It is. Spoiler alert, Elena.
Sorry. No, it's totally fine. People use dried horse manure and form it into bricks and then they can use it as heating fuel.
And apparently it has a higher heating value than seasoned hardwood.
Yeah. And I guess the odor just like goes away.
Yeah, I don't know how that works, but... It takes, like, a couple weeks, but eventually it just kind of, like, goes away.
It just dissipates, I guess. Yeah. Because if you think about it, like...
Maybe when you smell something, it's because you're getting particles of it inside of your nose.
Yeah. So eventually that's not going to happen anymore.
That does make sense. Yeah. So if that was the case and it was used to start the fire that killed Mary, At first I was thinking that would be mentioned more by detectives involved in the case.
Yeah. But I also could see it being one of those major pieces of evidence because you don't hear about firearm a fire being started using horse manure a thing that would separate the real exactly killer from the somebody claiming exactly part of it i thought you know, maybe they were keeping this close to the chest because how many killers would know that that was involved?
Of course. Exactly. Yeah. But I finally saw in the Baytown Sons report on these murders that the FBI had lab work done and it was ruled out that any kind of special accelerant was used. meaning that it must have just been gasoline.
Oh okay. But what a truly wild ride that was to go on.
I was just gonna say The fact that we just went down that horse manure road is like a real testament to this case.
Yeah, truly. Yeah. So what investigators did say about Mary's murder was this quote, whoever did this took a great deal of time to seclude her in that area.
If you get someone out for drug money, he may kill her and try to wipe off the prints.
But someone went to the trouble to make sure there was absolutely no evidence left.
Yeah, that's the thing. This is like a real professional here.
Right. Now when they say whoever did this took a great deal of time, That is like somehow an understatement because this part this person, according to the Baytown Sun, would have had to drive down two different roads stopped and got out of the car to open a gate, which led them into the Harris County drainage district property. and then drive 300 to 600 feet through the grass and then park the Lumina in a pipeline ditch where it was ultimately found.
Wow. And it's like they must have known that something was out there, that they could do that.
They must have known that there was some kind of clearing. but also this is happening in the middle of the morning.
Yeah. And there are houses lining the roads along some of that route So Mary's daughter, Marilyn, was just shocked that nobody had seen anything suspicious.
Yeah. Nobody had seen somebody driving a car with like a woman in the back looking terrified or you know, seeing somebody pull onto that road and drive through the grass.
Well, that, the thing they drove through the grass so it's like and this is a residential area it's like i don't know about you but I see everything that happens in my neighborhood.
Absolutely. drives through my neighborhood and I'm immediately like what's happening with that I'm gonna find out everything I can about that person I even if they're turning around I'm like yeah what are you doing Right.
And the part where like the area where her car and her body ultimately ended up being found was like secluded.
Yeah. But the way to that area was residential.
You would see that car going in there. You would see that.
And knowing that that car is going to a secluded area, you'd be like, what the fuck is it doing?
Right. I just wanted to, like, make sure that everybody knew, like, that part of it.
So weird. So we can get more into theories about what happened to Mary Lou a little later, because before we get into that, I have to tell you about another murder.
Now this murder was the one that the coroner's office had referenced when they spoke with Mary Lou's daughter Marilyn in the beginning of this all.
That little oopsie. Yeah, big oopsie. They were confused and they thought that Marilyn was calling about Mary McGinnis Morris. who had not been yet laid to rest.
Mary McGinnis Morris was killed the day before Mary Lou Henderson Morris was laid to rest.
Oh, okay. Yeah, and she was actually discovered the same day that Mary Lou... henderson morris's funeral happened whoa this is a lot it is truly something what is happening So Mary McGinnis Morris had moved to Texas sometime around 1998 for work.
She and her husband Mike Morris had been married for about 17 years.
They had a daughter together named Katie.
And they were originally from West Virginia, but they made their way out to Texas when Mary got a job offer out here.
By 2000, Mary was 39 years old and she was working as a nurse practitioner.
She actually ran a couple of different clinics in the area for Union Carbide in Houston, Texas.
She also liked to act in the local plays, and I guess she was a really good actress.
A thespian. A thespian. Her sister Stephanie said that Mary, quote, lived life to the fullest.
She was just very outgoing, very bubbly.
She had a lot of friends and she was like really respected in her workplace.
But her life did have its fair share of stressors, especially around the time that she died. because one of the main stressors in her life was her marriage.
Mike still hadn't found a job since they had moved out to Texas, And I think those money issues were definitely putting strain on the marriage.
And then to add on to that strain, Mike believed that Mary was being unfaithful.
Oh. Yes, he had actually recently confronted her and the man who he thought that she was cheating with. but they both told him that he was wrong and that they were not together.
And he said that he believed them and that around the time that Mary died, they were, quote, back at the point of being best friends.
Okay, okay. Some people beg to differ. Mary's own sister said that Mary had told her she wasn't necessarily in love with Mike anymore. and that she had met someone else and fallen in love with them.
She told her sister that she didn't have plans to leave Mike, But Stephanie believed that after Mike and Mary had gone to like three or four different marriage counselors, that her sister was pretty close to the point of asking for a divorce.
Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah, so this marriage is on the rocks.
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Now, obviously a lot of stress comes along with working in the healthcare field, especially these days.
Um, but there was more to it than that because recently Mary had been having trouble with a coworker, Dwayne Young.
She had told multiple people in her life that he made her uncomfortable.
And she had even talked to the HR department at work about him.
They had like different little interactions that just made her nervous and she just wanted them documented.
Okay. Now, there's not a lot of information about their work relationship, But from the accounts that I read, it seems that the higher ups in the company were on Mary's side of things. and that disciplinary action had been taken against Duane.
Oh, okay. Many sources related to this case suggest that he was fired just two days before Mary McGinnis Morris was murdered. but Dwayne himself back in the day was really active on a lot of online forums.
And he's made a lot of different claims saying either that he was not fired or that his position just came to a natural end.
Okay. Yeah. So the sources that I read associated with this case said that Duane was fired or let go after a pretty intense incident went down at work.
It gets a little confusing between the different sources because they all have like a little extra detail here and there.
But the gist of the story is that Dwayne and Mary had been having problems for quite some time at work. and that one day, Mary went back to her desk and found that all of her photos that she had on her desk we're facing the opposite way, like turned around.
And then she found a note either on her desk or on his desk calendar that said death to her.
Oh. And she obviously assumed that meant her if it was on her desk.
And because if it was on his desk, just based on all the issues that they were having.
Oh, that's ominous as hell. Ominous as hell.
So Mary went to report this incident to HR and they already have like a long list of all this other stuff.
And they told her, you know what, we're going to deal with this on this specific day and you shouldn't come into work. because we're going to go ahead and let him go at this point.
Okay. Like we can't keep dealing with this.
So when they did let him go, It is widely reported that he had to be escorted out of the building. but that he came back and started banging on the doors and windows, demanding to see Mary or at least speak with her.
Oh, that's really scary. So he denies those claims and he says that the banging on the doors and the windows never happened.
Okay. But. It's reported literally everywhere.
Okay. And the events were said to take place just two days before she was murdered.
Eek. Yes. So around that time, and allegedly because of all the issues going on at work with Duane, Mary went home to her husband, Mike, one day and told him that she wanted to learn how to shoot a gun.
And she wanted to carry one for protection because she was just nervous.
Yeah, I would be. Especially, I mean, she finds a note that says death to her and she thinks it's about her.
Yeah. I would want to carry something. Absolutely.
So Mike taught her how to shoot. He gave her a gun that was registered in his name. and he told her to keep it under the driver's seat in her car for easy access should she need it.
Unfortunately, Mary would not have the chance to protect herself with that gun, and chillingly enough, that would be the same gun that would kill her.
Oh, so on the morning of October 15th, 2000, Mary had a pretty typical day.
She went into one of the clinics that she worked at.
She had a morning full of patients to attend to.
One of those patients actually was her best friend at the time.
Lori Gemmel and Lori went into the clinic at some point to get her flu shot.
And while, while Mary was getting the shot together and everything, They were kind of just talking about their plans for the rest of the day.
According to Lori, Mary mentioned that she had to finish up some work for the day, a couple of things left to do at the clinic, She had a couple errands to run and then she was going to go home and make dinner for Mike and Katie.
Okay. Pretty typical. Very typical day. Yeah.
That would be the last time that Lori would see Mary in person, but not the last time she would hear from her.
Around 5.30 that same night, Mary called Lori while she was at a drugstore called Eckerd's.
It was like really nearby. And while they were on the phone, Mary mentioned that there was a man in the store who was creeping her out.
And Laurie later recalled that Mary said she recognized the man as someone who she had actually met before. through Dwayne Young.
Oh, she said she was going to try to finish up there quickly.
And that she actually had to run back to the clinic because she hadn't turned off her computer, like hadn't logged out of it.
So she was going to finish up there, run to the clinic, turn off the computer and just head straight home because she was freaked out.
She was like, I'm done shopping. Yeah. So they wrapped up the conversation, and just 12 minutes later, Mary would be on her cell phone again, this time calling 911. she was in the middle of being kidnapped and brutally attacked.
The 911 call has never been released, and Wayne Coleman from the Harris County Sheriff's Department said that it never will be released.
Oh, is it that like harrowing? His direct quote was, we're not releasing the content of the tape.
It covers the attack that happened to Mary.
And anybody that's ever heard that tape had just had their blood chilled listening to it.
It's a very chilling and disturbing call.
I can't imagine. If they're not releasing it or the contents of it, that must be a truly... truly harrowing call and you have to imagine that it probably has like the last moments of her life oh absolutely on the phone call yeah So Mary's body wasn't found until the next day actually, and she was discovered by a tow truck driver.
She was found in a remote area inside of her car, just like Mary Morris, who had been murdered just days before her.
This crime scene was much different though.
Mary McGinnis Morris's car was a Dodge Intrepid and it was not found on fire.
But Mary was found in her own car and had been shot once in the head. and the gun that she had asked her husband to provide for protection had been the one to fatally shoot her.
Wow. Now it was sitting on the passenger seat.
Now, the scene may have looked to some people like it was suicide, like if you were a rookie or something just stepping on this scene.
But the trained officers who responded knew that they had a lot more on their hands than that.
Because the passenger door was left wide open and had some amount of blood on it.
The keys to the car were dropped somewhere outside of the vehicle.
And not only did the scene tell them that there was more to this, but so did the body. because Mary had clearly been beaten.
When they arrived, there were fresh bruises on her wrists, and her clothing was actually torn in some place.
Jesus. Now, later on, they were also able to determine that she had been gagged at some point during this attack because They found clothing fibers inside of her mouth.
My God. And just like Mary Lou Henderson Morris, Mary McGinnis Morris's wedding ring was also missing.
Wow. Wow. So we have two women. Same name.
Same name. Found in similar locations. Not similar conditions, but found in remote areas in their cars.
And both have their wedding rings missing within days of each other. yeah that's weird really fucking weird that's weird in the same city houston So immediately they want to talk to Mike Morris, especially once they heard that the marriage was even slightly strained.
Mike had an alibi. He told the investigators that he and his daughter Katie were actually at the movies together.
And actually he had called Mary around 7-11 that night, but she didn't answer. and that the call kept ringing, so eventually he hung up.
He gave the police a DNA sample, but I do not believe he gave them fingerprints.
And he refused to do a polygraph test. And he also would not let them talk to Katie. who I think was a teenager at this time, so still a minor, and they would have to have his permission.
I was going to say they need his consent.
So he would not let them talk to Katie. Now, some people found it odd too when he lawyered up right away, but you can't necessarily judge that in a case like this because you pretty much do need a lawyer.
Yeah, like everyone tells you to. Exactly.
So when the investigators looked into Mary and Mike's phone records, they did see the call that he mentioned.
But the phone records showed that the phones had actually connected. and that the call had lasted for four minutes.
Oh, Mary McGinnis had definitely already been murdered by that point in time though. so there was no way that Mike had spoken with her.
Huh. He said that it must have been a glitch on part of the phone company. but I don't really know how often that happens.
I wouldn't say that's likely a common occurrence, but I'm not a phone person.
I'm not a technician. I'm not a phone. I am also not a phone.
I'm not a phone, nor am I a phone technician.
I am. I'm neither a phone nor a technician of phones.
I thought you were going to say I'm not a phone record.
I'm not a phone record either. I'm none of those things.
I don't think they usually lie like usually they're used as proof in cases like this.
Yeah, I feel like phone records you can usually rely on.
Yeah. So this phone record is saying the call connected and lasted four minutes.
He basically said that it kept ringing and ringing.
And I don't know if he's trying to say that the phone rang for four minutes and he sat around and waited. yeah but it just kept ringing and ringing and ringing yeah weird yeah that's definitely strange yeah so people started to wonder did he call and speak with somebody else for four minutes Ooh, maybe somebody who was supposed to do something for him?
Eek! So rumors started to fly around Houston when people realized that two women with the same name were killed in somewhat similar situations and that the murders were just four days apart.
Like, what are the odds? Yeah, this is...
This just isn't coincidence. There's no fucking way.
Yeah. So people started speculating based on the details that they heard from each case.
Specifically... how both women's wedding rings were missing, that was something that people were really hooked on.
Because it's so specific. It's so specific.
I was going to say Pacific. So Pacific. It's so Pacific.
Now, this is something, I don't know if you knew this and I didn't know this, but this is something that tends to happen in situations when a hitman is hired.
Oh, okay. The hitman will take the woman's wedding ring back to no he'll take it back to the the husband to show that he killed this woman yeah and the job is done Oh, that's horrific.
It's horrible, but wow. Yes. So people got the idea in their head that maybe this situation was a hit gone wrong.
It seemed to them that maybe a hitman had been hired to kill Mary McGinnis Morris, and that somehow this was the worst hitman of all time. and he had somehow killed the wrong woman.
Oh. A woman who lived like 45 minutes away with the same name.
Okay. Now they thought that when the hitman and the person who hired the hit realized that the wrong woman had been killed, They only had a short amount of time to off the intended target, Mary McGinnis Morris.
Okay. Now this theory does seem kind of far-fetched, but I'm not going to say that it's the worst theory in the world.
I don't think it's a terrible theory. Because supporting evidence, the two women did bear some resemblance to each other.
I looked at pictures because I had to see they have very similar hair.
Very similar hair, kind of similar eyes if you ask me.
I could see where somebody might get them confused from a distance.
If they have a very general description of these two women.
Mm hmm. And they have the same name. And I think you could easily confuse them.
Now, the other thing is I mentioned the cars that these women drove.
Yeah. Dodge Intrepid, and I'm not sure what year Mary Chevy Lumina was.
But the models from that time do resemble each other.
Okay. If you type in like 2000 Dodge Intrepid and Chevy Lumina, they look like a similar car.
So those are supporting evidence of, yeah, there could have been a hitman.
Yeah. I mean, the only thing that really with that i'm like ah but me again if it's a bad hit man because he messed it up to begin with yeah It's like, would you just go right away and do the intended one?
Or would you put some space between those so that they're not sitting there?
You're making a big splash with two women the same way.
And with the same name. Exactly. You make it a big splash there.
And you feel like you would put some distance and some time between those two things.
Maybe... push off that intended hit a little bit yeah sounds terrible saying all that no it's true though Because I was just going to say, there's a couple things in this case that give me pause about the hitman theory.
The two crime scenes were about 25 miles away from each other.
That's obviously not to say that hit men like don't travel.
But why would one get so confused that he went 25 miles out of the way to kill a woman who he should have had a pretty good amount of information on if he had been hired to take out a hit on her.
You would think. Now, the other big thing for me and I'm sure for you is the manner of death.
Although the police couldn't determine exactly how Mary Lou died, they didn't find any casings at the scene to suggest that she had been shot, like Mary McGinnis-Morris had been.
And it's strange to me that only one crime scene had arson involved and the other didn't.
Yeah, because I feel like if the same person committed both crimes... they would have set fires for both.
You would think so. The only thing I can think of is that Mary McGinnis was killed with the gun that she had.
Yes. So maybe that was just like convenience.
It was there. It was there. And also that could take away that and maybe the arson thing, maybe because they got it wrong.
They were like, well, can't do that again.
Actually, that's probably like a supporting factor because People think that Mike is the person that hired this hit for his wife, obviously.
I'm not saying I believe that, but that's what people believe.
That's a theory. That's a theory. And if that is the case, then he may have told this hitman she has a gun.
Yeah, just use that gun. So maybe this hitman carjacked...
Mary Lou. and realized she didn't have a gun, and then his prints are all over the car, yada, yada, yada, and he panicked.
Maybe. And set the place on fire. It's a big jump, but I mean, this whole thing is crazy.
This whole thing is nuts. I don't think there's anything completely out of the realm of possibility here no So people in Mary McGinnis Morris's life and close circle thought back to the coworker who had made her so uncomfortable that he'd allegedly been fired.
They specifically thought back to the note that Mary had found, the one that she thought was written about her that said death to her.
Did this guy actually have it in him to kill her?
So Dwayne Young, like I said, has maintained his innocence over the years and claimed that most of the stories surrounding him and Mary are untrue.
Okay. He actually said that the only time anything crappy happened between them was when he had to report her to higher ups. in the company for doctoring some of her reports.
Oh. I couldn't find any evidence that that was the truth.
But it's just like, that's what's being said.
That's what's being said. Now, even after that, he said their relationship really didn't change that much.
They were still friendly with each other.
And there was evidence that they had gone to dinner parties with the same groups of people.
They were in each other's circle. Okay. but other people beg to differ about their relationship.
Lori Gemmell has said that Mary was absolutely certain that Dwayne was quote-unquote capable of hurting her.
Now, over the years on different forums, Dwayne has pointed the finger back at Lori and saying that she was the last person to talk to Mary and probably one of the last to see her alive.
And she lived only about five minutes from where Murray's body was found.
This is all just like so convoluted. Yeah, it's so complex because it's like...
You have people being like, no, they were totally fine.
They hung out at dinner parties. They were just like, whatever.
Everything was cool. And then you have other people that were like, oh no, she was 100% convinced he was going to hurt her.
And it's like, whoa where's the middle ground here like that's the thing with this case there's No middle ground.
It just jumps from like he's either a perfectly fine coworker to he could probably kill me.
Like, which one is it? Or even just between the two murders.
Like, we go from one woman being shot in the head and another woman being, like, lit on fire in her car.
Yes, that's true. It's wild. It's a crazy intense case.
So Dwayne not only pointed the finger at Mary's friend Lori, but also pointed the finger at Mary's husband, Mike.
And he has said that he's offered to talk to Mike to clear his name and Mike doesn't want to talk to him but it's like if he thinks you murdered his wife of course he doesn't want to talk to you yeah there's a lot of things that are just like well You know, yeah, a little bit now in those online forums, which aren't like totally dependable, but it did seem in those forums like Mike may have gotten a restraining order to stop the calls from Dwayne.
Okay. And that's based on claims that Dwayne has made.
Now, other than showing deception on some polygraphs, the police really didn't have anything to connect Dwayne to either murder.
All right. And hot dog in a trench coat.
Yeah, 100%. And that's really all they ever did.
And to be honest, there's nothing... And aside from him being angry that he got fired, I'm like, there's not a lot of motive. i don't know like and it just and it's not solid because it's like some people are saying everything was fine and then some people are like oh no And it's like some people are saying he didn't get fired.
Some people are saying he did. He's saying that he didn't get fired.
Yeah, that one's not solid. No. So the people who believed Mike had something to do with his wife's disappearance point to a life insurance policy, of course.
I've seen it reported to be as much as a million, half a million, 700,000, 200,000.
It's all over the place, wherever. all right but allegedly he didn't even get that payout it went to their daughter katie Oh, okay.
So that wipes that out of there. Yeah. But something else that interestingly enough turned up in Katie's possession... was her mother's missing wedding ring.
Yeah. So a friend of the family joined Katie and Mike for dinner one night after the murder. and noticed that Katie had Mary's wedding ring on and he asked Mike about it because it had been missing.
Mike said that he thought it was missing originally but that Mary must not have been wearing it that day because he found it later on in the house.
Oh. which is just like it was a big deal that like the wedding rings missing from both women were a really big deal in this case.
Yeah. And then all of a sudden one of them just turns up and it's like, oh, I guess she just wasn't wearing it that day.
Huh, strange. Okay. So the friend did bring that information to the police, but they still don't really have much of anything to connect Mike to Mary's murder either.
What can you do? So just when you thought we might be wrapping up here, I have a little bit more of a tidbit for this case.
Because months after Mary Lou Henderson Morris was killed, her husband Jay got a bill in the mail for about $2,000.
Now, it was a phone bill associated with her phone card.
Oh yeah. When they tracked down the phone card, it took them to a teenage girl in Galveston, Texas. who said that she got the phone card from her neighbor.
Okay. So when the police were able to talk with the neighbor, she told them that she had found the purse abandoned outside of a convenience store. and she gave the phone card to her neighbor and kept the bag for herself.
Uh, not cool. Not cool at all. None of that is cool.
Not at all. what the two were cleared of any connection to the murder though but the eerie thing to me is that the neighbor gave the purse back to the police so that Mary's family could have it.
And when they got the purse back, None of Mary's family recognized it as being one of her purses.
What? So what was her phone card doing in a random purse in Galveston, Texas, which is about an hour away from Houston?
What? That's strange. I literally can't.
And every single time it gets stranger. somehow it levels up again and then it gets even stranger.
And it's like was that purse belonging to a girlfriend of the person who did this or a friend?
And was given that card. But her purse was missing.
Yeah. I know. I don't know. But it's also like, did her purse just burn to a crisp?
Or did the person who did this take the purse? empty out the contents of what they thought was valuable, take those things, just get rid of the purse.
And then maybe gave it to someone they know.
That phone card didn't end up in that purse.
Maybe. But it's like, why was the purse abandoned? outside of a convenience store.
Like it's so strange. What? This is all so weird.
It's so weird. Now for the eeriest thing of all.
About five months after the murders, Jay Morris started getting calls at he and Mary's house and the caller was asking to speak with Mary.
What was strange about that, other than the fact that everybody in the area knew that Mary was no longer living, was the fact that their phone number was not listed in the phone book.
This was a private line. So, the caller seemed to be a man and would call later in the evening.
The first time he called was around 10 p.m., the second time was around 12 a.m., and then for the last time at 9 p.m.
Now, Jay had spoken to the police about the first two calls, and they gave him the number of a detective. and told him that the next time he got a call from this number, he should say to the caller, oh, you can reach Mary at this number, but really it would be the number of a detective.
Oh, that's smart. So he did just that. The last call rolls in around nine and the caller asks, as usual, to speak with Mary.
Jay said, sure, she can be reached, and this number... is her number here you go yada yada yada eight six seven five three oh nine exactly Now, he's not even done finishing like rattling off the number and the caller interrupts him as he's reading it and goes, yeah, sure, and hangs up.
And that's the last time they ever called.
What? Yeah. What? The police were able to trace back the calls to a payphone that was located in a nearby apartment complex, but they could never trace the calls back to a specific person.
And after that last phone call, nobody called again.
And to this day, nobody has no idea who committed either of these murders.
Nobody has no idea. Nobody has no idea.
That sounded so stupid. Nobody has any idea who did these murders.
And as far as police are concerned... The two murders are not connected.
Honeys. It's the same name. It's the same name.
It's the same circumstances. It's the same everything.
It was like almost the same day. Literally.
Harris County Detective Ronald Hunter said of these two cases and the strange similarities, quote, That was a big coincidence, but as far as we consider it right now, that is just what we consider it, a coincidence.
Bold strategy. Let's see if it works out for him.
Sir what? Wow. How? Who? What? When? Where?
Why? all the questions that were never answered in this case.
I'm baffled. I have nothing. Nothing. Like that Hitman thing sounds...
More plausible to me now. That's the thing.
And that's the theory that most people go off of because it's like...
What else is there? The same name is just wild because it's not like... there's a million Mary Morrises just running around.
It's not like no. And I know Mary and Morris are like, two names that I guess could be considered like somewhat common but together and also it's like it's not like John Smith or something, you know, like it's not that common.
No. And in the same area. And it's... I mean, Houston is a big area.
Like, that's important to point out. But it's like... these crime scenes were 25 miles away from each other.
That's like a 45 minute drive. It's not that far, you know?
Yeah. And their cars looked so similar.
I guess you could say that they looked pretty similar.
Yeah. So that for me, I think the hitman theory is the strongest. but I don't necessarily love it because there's hole, there's plot holes in it for me.
And like motive is lacking here. Yeah, that's the thing.
There's a lot of like, what the fuck? I guess the only motive if Mike had hired a hitman was to get the life insurance policy, but then people say he didn't even get it.
But then it's like, did his daughter get it and give him some of it?
Like... But he couldn't be sure of that.
And then also, Mary Lou was... she was killed like in the morning yeah just like in the middle of the day on her way to work pretty much And it's like, that's bold for somebody to just do with no planning.
Absolutely. And even feels like there was a plan in place there.
Absolutely. And not only was Mary Lou killed in the middle of the day, I mean, Mary... uh mcginnis there was killed like in the afternoon i mean i consider like 5 5 30 the afternoon Yeah, these weren't like nighttime, you know, creepy people come out at night and start doing shady shit.
It was like... literally morning exactly afternoon right so it just does I don't know it's just so bizarre to me wow and there's just like every time you think that you've reached a conclusion which honestly i don't even feel like you ever feel like you've reached to conclusion in this case, but anytime you think that you've gotten somewhere, you read something and you're like, well no that doesn't make any sense blew that up like there's no way that works now exactly yeah i have no idea i have absolutely i really have no idea i'm stumped and i've truly never read a case like this before no i've never actually like at the end of one been like Yeah I literally have no idea what happened here.
Nothing. The hitman thing is the only thing I can think of.
That's the thing that most people think of.
But even that, like I said, potholes. Yeah, and it's like, it just, I don't know.
I don't know. I just don't know, guys. I don't know.
Wow. that you're welcome well as usual we hope that you keep listening and we hope you keep Weird, but not so weird that like any of this happens because this is a really stressful case and it stressed me out.
And it's sad. And it's really, really sad.
Thank you. If you like Morbid, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.
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