How can you use AI agents, MCPs, and a bunch of different tools to make money on the internet?
Today, we walk through it all.
Yes, you can vibe code anything right now, and that's great.
But how can you actually use AI agents to get you customers 24-7?
Well, today we live build it.
We actually spun up 10 cloud code instances and we show you how you can do it to help you get customers on repeat.
I loved this episode.
It's my friend Cody Schneider.
He's an absolute legend when it comes to vibe marketing and growth marketing.
This episode is saucy.
And by the end of the episode, you're going to feel pretty confident you know what to do.
You are in for a treat.
Enjoy the episode and I can't wait to see you in there.
Cody, by the end of this episode, what are we going to learn?
You're going to learn how to build your first agents that allow for you to go and build personal software to do marketing sales growth, customer experience for yourself.
And by the end of this you're going to come out of it with this whole new tool set that allows for you to do all of the middle work without touching a keyboard.
You're just going to use your voice and have agents do work for you in the background, man.
It's going to be crazy.
Okay, and can you list off a few of the tools and pieces of software we're going to use?
Yeah, absolutely.
We're going to touch Phantom Buster.
We're going to use Instantly AI.
We're going to use Riphonic.
We're going to use Railway.com.
We're also going to use a bunch of different other tooling that's in my go to market stack.
So we're also just going to use, like the Facebook ads API as an example, as another, just like you know way that we're going to interact via this this agent harness cloud code.
All right.
And we're going to live build it and everyone, well, you're going to watch the whole thing.
So let's get into it.
Cool.
Sweet, man.
So, just to begin with, do you know like GTM engineering, or like what it even means, or like where it comes from?
No, honestly, I don't.
It's just a buzzword, right?
So this is actually made up by clay.com, which is hilarious.
And they originally did it as a way to explain somebody that does basically cascading workflows for data enrichment to do outbound sales motions over email or whatever.
Slack or, you know, it could be like cold calling.
So that was kind of the origin of this was like it was just basically this term that was given to it.
But it's quickly evolving into something entirely different.
And so let me screen share and I can just like show you like what we're seeing this work as now.
But basically, like what we're like seeing is that the can you see this?
All right.
Yeah.
Cool.
So how I'm thinking about it now is like basically everything that used to be the middle work that we would do, like
All of anything that I would do to touch the keyboard.
I'm now passing it on to some type of agent hardest, whether it's cloud code or it's codex or any of these tools.
And so my job suddenly turns into like I have ideas.
I pass them on to cloud code and then I'm basically polishing the end product, and it enables me to do like things at scale that that were just previously impossible.
And just to give you like a taste of like what I'm talking about, we're going to do this today.
Like build a hundred Facebook ads, publish them to Facebook.
Build a dashboard to track that, analyze the data within clog code.
Have it turn off the Facebook ads that are the low performers.
Have it bump up the Facebook ads or that are the best performers to a new ad set with its own dedicated budget.
And everything that I just described that happening in like literally, you know, 30 minutes.
Anyways, again, not really sleeping.
So this is kind of where it's at now.
And I'm going to talk through like this whole setup process and actually how to do this.
And then I'm going to talk about where it's going like.
How agents are the natural evolution from this?
Basically, as soon as you like start, you have this epiphany of like I can get this thing to do work for me.
Then you suddenly have this like you come to come to Jesus, moment of like oh, I can just deploy this onto a server.
And now it's doing this task for me in the background.
And I'm building out this personal software for myself, for my job, for my my tasks, et cetera.
And this isn't some like hype thing of like, go do open claw and give it access to everything.
I'm talking about like specific, like like jobs to be done, workflows that are custom made for how you want to operate in your day to day.
So that's kind of the high level, man.
Any questions I can try to answer?
Have to go deeper on anything.
No, if you can teach me this by the end of that episode.
I mean, that's sort of the that's, I think, the question that a lot of people have in their heads right now.
Like, how do I how can I do that?
Right.
Because that's going to be an unfair advantage.
So, yeah, let's let's go.
Let's go through it.
Perfect.
Let's jump into it, man.
All right.
So, first off, what you need to do if you're watching right now is I want you to go and I need you to create a folder that you're going to start living out of.
So the one I live out of is called Graft Growth Agents.
So everything I do now or I start my work, it all exists within here.
And the first thing that I'm going to have you do is you're going to set up an environment file.
And this environment file.
It just holds all of your API keys that you're basically going to be working with.
So what I'm doing is I'm basically having and I'm just not going to show this just because it has literally all of our API keys for everything.
But it has I can open up this example one.
So it has like intercom.
It has our SendGrid API, my HubSpot API, my Calcom API, my Perplexity API, my Facebook ads API, Million Verifier instantly.
Everything that I live on top of that is a part of my day to day growth stack.
This is like what I'm working with, basically.
And so what this translates into, or like why you start here, is you're basically starting to interact with everything that you do on a daily basis via the APIs.
And this is actually how I'm thinking about.
Everything I do now, and like how I buy software in particular, is how robust the API is.
It's funny.
I was talking to a friend recently and he's like, If you're looking at Salesforce versus HubSpot right now Salesforce, even though it's like historically a more clunky CRM, it's actually the better product for this AI foundation because it has a more robust API, so you can do more with it basically.
And this is what this like turns into is your all of the work that you're doing.
And we're going to do this together today is going to be happening from this this like repository.
When I say repo, all I mean is just this like folder that we're living in that has all of these files.
And I'm going to be using cloud code, like throughout the rest of the session, to basically be building out this personal software and be building out, you know, actually doing work, if that makes sense.
So that's kind of one component of it.
The last piece is then.
I would strongly suggest getting something like a Super Whisper or any of these other transcription softwares, because it enables you to just so quickly go through the process of building out, like what you're trying to do on the distribution side.
And then optional is just installing the cloud code front end design skill.
I've just found this to be like one of those things that you know, if we're going to generate a UI, it's nice to have it look pretty.
So, all right, that is kind of the foundational pieces.
Now it's actually like, great, that's cool.
You've just built this.
What do you actually do to go get started on this?
So the first thing that I'm going to do to get started is I'm going to go and I'm going to have a cloud code start responding to people on LinkedIn for me that have asked for an asset.
So I've been doing all of these like giveaways, basically.
Here's one that's an email triage.
I wrote this giveaway, you know, Notion document.
I'm now going to go in and I'm going to get this agent to start running for me in the background while I have other work going on.
So I've got the Claude code or sorry, I've got the Claude Chrome extension installed and I'm going to go and I'm going to say so.
I'm working out of this, that directory right that I've already been in.
And I already have built this basically skill, and it's a piece of software that will go and comment on everybody that asked for this asset.
So I'm going to say this right now.
I'm going to say let's run or we're going to transcribe it.
So let's run the LinkedIn respond software.
The keyword that you're looking for is triage.
I'm going to provide the notion documents and the LinkedIn post URL.
And then I'm going to select the post URL and I'm going to put that in.
And then I'm also going to select the Notion document that I want it to do as well.
So I'm going to give it that.
It's going to start running.
So what it's going to do right now is it's going to basically open this up.
I'm going to babysit it for a moment while it starts this process.
And just make sure that it starts on the right path.
And then once it's on the right path, then I'm going to go and basically start on the other things.
And actually, while it's thinking, let's just go to these other places.
So the next thing I'm going to do is I'm going to go or sorry that just opened the LinkedIn profile.
Let's bring that back over here.
So this is now running.
Perfect.
And so this should now start commenting on those responding back to those people.
I'm just going to change this to most recent just so that it works backwards on this.
And then we're going to just let that run in the background.
So, while that's happening, what I'm going to do now is we're going to build a Facebook ads generator.
So I've been doing this where it's basically a and I'll show you an example of what this looks like.
Let's just go over to LinkedIn, and I can give you an example of the output that we're going to actually create today.
So it's basically a bulk generator of ad creative.
We're going to create this template and then I'm going to go and do research, based off of Reddit and other social media posts, for the pain points that people experience.
And then we're going to go and bulk generate all these variations.
So let's get that started right now.
So I've got, again, those API keys are stored within here.
And I've also made that skill.
So I'm going to tell it right now.
I want you...
I want you to create a bulk Facebook ad generator.
It's going to be a 1080 by 1080 pixel image.
What's going to happen is I'll give you an example of what one of these ads looks like.
And then we're going to go and build a template around that.
And then I'll basically create a or give you variations of text, both titles and paragraphs, that I want to be generated at.
It'll be a zip file that we download for the beginning.
Can you make this into a UI as well so that we can visually see the creative?
The first thing I just want to be able to see is like what the actual creative will look like.
For this, you're going to use just React components.
So I don't want you or like I just purely build it with React components.
And then also to actually change those React components into a PNG that's downloadable.
We're going to use HTML to Canvas.
It's just a resource that you have available for you on that.
Ask questions if you need.
So.
I've just transcribed that.
I'm now going to put Claude into plan mode and I'm just going to let that start running in the background.
All right.
So while that's running in the background, let's come back here and let's see the work that it's doing.
So it's going through these and I believe it's now commenting.
So that's happening.
So we'll just let that run in perpetuity, respond back to them.
All right.
So next, I'm just going to just click through this quickly.
I'll share it now.
I'll share it after setup.
And then input method form-based ui.
Let's do both, and then i'm going to hit submit, all right.
So now that's working on that in the background.
I'm going to open up another folder and i'm going to start cloud code again within an entirely another diff or another window.
So i'm going to do documents forward, slash graphs.
Let's go to agents and then demo, All right.
So the next thing that I want to build as an example is I'm going to basically pull information.
So I just I just did this actually, so we could like talk through and about what this ends up looking like.
But basically scraped all of the podcasts that were within the marketing category and then built a workflow that goes and cold emails them.
And then an agent that responds back to book me on the podcast.
This ends up turning into way better performing than I expected.
That's crazy.
Sorry, what is instantly...
Yeah, so Instantly is a cold email software.
And so this is just a part of my stack.
So it's one of the things that is within that environment file that allows for me to build on top of.
And so what I'm...
Like how I can think about this.
Like on the, It's basically like my manual workflows that I would do previously.
We're just like daisy chaining those together, like using this software.
So I'm going to bring this into a new desktop and let's just rebuild that whole thing.
I'm going to say...
You have the Raphonic API key.
I want you to build a software that scrapes podcast host emails from Raphonic.
It then sends it to a million verifier to verify the emails.
And then it also will then send it to an instantly campaign.
I'll provide the instantly campaign that I want it to send to.
All right.
So I've got that now.
I'm going to put that in the plan mode and let that run as well.
And then we have that as its own window.
And so while these two are working again in the background, we can then go and actually do like some other work.
So let me get this going and I'll just say, cool.
So that's a plan.
All right.
So Now, this is my we're in this folder.
This is like my demo folder, which I just like every time I give this presentation, I just nuke.
This is kind of to show you like how to start it from zero to one.
This folder that we're in now is my actual folder that I live out of.
And I'm just going to show you some of the things that like are like capable with this.
So, for example, I have it attached to Notion and I've basically given it a, an example of like how do we write a like a Notion, like giveaway?
Right.
So I'm going to go and we're going to create one of these together right now, because I need to actually accomplish this.
So I'm going to take this URL.
And then copy this over.
And I'm going to say, okay, write a, or create a Notion document based off.
Look at you typing with your hands.
I know the problem here, we can do it in the transcription.
So create a notion document based off of our like current or, you know, our structure.
Look for the skill that has this.
I'm going to provide context on what that should include.
You should incorporate stuff that we have within the repo, like the documentation that I have in the repo on how to do this.
All right, and so I'm gonna copy this over and let that run.
And now it's gonna go and create me a Notion document just like the one that we have being sent in the background here currently.
All right.
So in that folder, I've already created the bulk ad generator.
So I'm just going to go in there just to show you like, what you can do with this, once that it's like you've actually gone through this process of like zero to one making this.
So this is the bulk, the creator as an example.
So that's going to continue working on that bulk Facebook ad generator in the background while that's happening.
Let's go to graphs, growth agents, and then I'm going to start clog code within there.
And now I'm going to start locally the bulk Facebook ad generator.
I just want to bring that up within my local so that I can create some ads.
So, again, it's already created the software for me.
I'm now coming back to it and I'm going to talk through the whole process of the actual creation of this, because it'll just like make more sense momentarily.
But the goal here is basically what we're trying to do is I'm trying to create as many different variations of these ads as possible.
So how did I make this ad?
This is entirely code.
And I think this is something to like double click on.
Everything in here is just it's just React components like that.
This is this is a React component and entirely built by code.
And so I can make an infinite amount of these at scale.
And I've done this already.
So you can see this bulk forward slash or forward slash bulk forward slash HTML component.
So we're going to go through this together, though.
How do we actually do this process?
So I would go and I would give it an example and we'll do this over here, while this one is like working on it.
We'll come back to that.
But I would give it an example of what like ad I'm trying to build.
A way to do this is, if you don't know where to start, go to Facebook ads library and you can see what your competitors or other software companies are doing in your category.
This is actually how I made this initial one was I found like this before and after format.
And then I basically had it build off of that before and after.
But this whole thing, like everything you see here is just code.
It's entirely code.
The other way you can do this is with something like nano banana, where you're like going and bulk generating these.
Right.
But once I found and I built that template, I can now make all those variations.
So let's go back to cloud code and let's say.
OK, I want you to use the Facebook ads API and I want you to go and scrape the pain points that you see.
Sorry.
Actually, let's restart that.
I want you to use the perplexity API and go and scrape Reddit for the pain points and the outcomes that growth marketers wish they could have from like something like a looker.
Studio or any of these other business intelligence softwares that they're using.
We've been focusing on, like the data analyst component of it, of how they can't get bandwidth or it's too complicated to get started or they can't unify their data all into one location.
You can also source from YouTube.
You can also source from Twitter if necessary.
So I'm going to have to go do research on those pain points.
For the ad, sorry for the ad itself.
Wouldn't we want to use Nana banana pro like the best image model that exists?
Like why are we using code when you know when we could?
I'm just doing this purely like.
This was just a way I thought about doing it.
Like absolutely the Nana banana thing.
Um, The only thing I've found with like Nano Banana is that I sometimes have trouble like getting it to stay on brand.
And if I'm trying to just like figure out the messaging variations that I'm trying to go after, this can be a faster way to do that.
Again, there's like a million different ways to do this exact same thing.
I think if you're going to use Nano Banana, you should look at something like...
I think it's like Kai AI, I believe.
Or yeah, Kai.ai.
And you can just like basically it's one of these bulk buys.
But we've been using that for these bulk generations.
This that I'm doing costs me nothing.
Like it's literally, you know. maybe a thousand tokens to do all of these, like these generations.
And so this, that's a reason for it.
So it's like I can go, we can go and create a thousand ad variations right now G and like this literally costs nothing.
Um, but again, well, that's, that's a part of it too.
Right.
Is like your goal is going to be come up with the best ad creative.
That's going to actually, you know, you put in a dollar, you get $3 out.
Once you get that, you can make it, well, there's two schools of thought.
One school of thought is you need the best creative, So you need to send it to Nana Banana Pro to get scroll-stopping creative.
Another school of thought is like well, you actually have some pretty quote-unquote ugly ads that just speak to the pain points that you can kind of get a good understanding of.
This is going to bring you 150 when you put in a dollar, and then you can get it from 150 to 3 once you figure out the ad.
So you're kind of saying maybe it's best to like, Get as many ads as possible.
Start using those.
Figure out the one or two or three creative that actually crushes.
And then go ahead and go crazy with spending tokens.
Totally.
I'm just trying to find the format or the angle that's going to be most receptive.
I'm going to remix that a thousand times after it.
The.
This is like the big piece of this, especially with like how much we can do on the like the, anybody can go and generate as many of these as they want, right?
Like it's literally infinite.
But identifying those winners, like you're talking about now, becomes the challenge that you're going to face with all of this and like we're going to get to that in a second.
But the, the the main thing i want to emphasize with it, is like this is malleable and flexible and the spit, the pace like.
Just think about you manually having to go create 50 ad variations in figma and, like you're, You can just now make those and get those live and test those.
And as soon as I find a winning like format from a language that's being said perspective, I can then go and remix that into all these other different templates.
I can go and find like what are different winning ad formats that I can now port this to.
But this is a way to just like start immediately and then get that basically out in public.
I also think that, like the same ideas can go into different formats, like we're all already seeing this where it's like cool, I made a static format.
I'm now going to port that over to a UGC format and I'm sending that to the HeyGen API to pull in that.
You know like to make that creative, like pull in, pull it in as a video and then bulk upload that to Facebook, if that makes sense.
So I.
Like where I'm going with this or where I'm seeing this head personally is like I'm going to build these tools that an agent is going to have.
And then it's going to be able to run this process in the background, where it's basically has the ability to make new creative.
It can publish that creative directly to Facebook, which I'm going to show you in a second.
It's going to then analyze what is working and then it's going to like basically turn off what isn't and promote what is right.
And this is like everything i'm going to show you today is that, like a small scale, like this is literally like weeks of realization that's starting to happen, like with this, but i just again i want to plant the seed of like what is possible using this tooling to like do your again that middle work that historically, like you wouldn't be able to to do.
So yeah, is there questions about that?
I can try to answer no let's, let's keep cooking Awesome.
All right.
So this keeps like trying to scrape things.
I'm just going to be like.
Instead, I want you to just brainstorm pain points that people have with data reporting, specifically the unification of the data into multiple locations.
Cool.
So we're going to do that.
Once I have all those variations, I can then say, OK, now go bulk generate every one of those.
And then at that point, I can download these as a CSV.
And what I will do is just wait for that while that's happening.
We'll just get this to start downloading.
And that Facebook ads API is going to allow for us to bulk upload all of those pieces of creative that we just downloaded.
So here's all those variations.
I'm going to say now, OK, now use the bulk or let's do the transcription.
OK, now use the bulk Facebook ads generator to go and create these variations.
Put them in the forward slash bulk dot HTML page when you're done with this.
So this is now happening.
I'm going to go back over to see what the other things are going off of.
All right.
So let's see this notion document based off of the current.
We'll continue to let that happen.
Perfect.
We're going to let that go as well.
So I'm looking at the scaffolding to build the bulk ad generator.
And we'll check in on this one to see where it's like basically at in its process of responding.
And it might have completed.
And it did complete.
So that's done.
It ran for 15 minutes on its own in the background.
These are coming back.
So while these are all happening and I'm waiting on them or they're waiting on me, I can then open up another one of these.
I'll just click through this to just kind of get it moving.
But I would then open up another one of these tabs and I would start on the next project.
So the next thing that I want to do is I want to build a LinkedIn engagement scraper.
Um, so I'm going so basically at people that engage on the LinkedIn pro or the LinkedIn posts.
I'm going to pull them out and then send them to a um uh, basically add them into instantly.
So we're going to go, we're going to find their LinkedIn profile using Phantom Buster.
We're then going to, uh, you know, do that whole flow.
So I'll, I'll do that in a second.
Let me just get this up and give that its own section.
By the end of this podcast, you're going to have like 100 desktops.
This is literally how I'm working now.
This is like I'm just jockeying agents across.
And then if I can automate them and get them to do like, if I can figure out.
Okay, this is the specific lane that you can focus on.
Then I'm spinning that up onto a server on railway.
And I'll talk about that in a second on like how you can, on demand, create databases and, on demand, create the servers, so that this software starts running in perpetuity.
So we're going to do this one.
All right.
So I want to make a workflow where it's basically within Slack.
You'll do forward slash LinkedIn post.
And anybody in Slack will be able to just drop in a LinkedIn post that they think is a good fit.
And then that's going to go and it's going to use the Phantom Buster API to extract all of the engagers.
And then it's going to take those LinkedIn profiles.
We're going to go and enrich those with the Apollo API.
And then from there, we're going to send it to the Million Verifier API.
And then finally, we're going to add them to an instantly campaign.
Ask me questions if you need.
All right, so I'm going to turn on plan mode for that.
Let that start running in the background as well.
We'll come back to these.
Let them continue to cook.
Publish the landing page.
Let me get context on what this one is again.
This is the craziest part when you're going from screen to screen and realizing that you're an agent jockey and that you're trying to get context on each one.
You're like, okay, what was this one doing again?
And I find that the context switching is actually difficult.
I did as well, but now it feels like that has expanded.
And again, this is just how I've been working for the last... like six weeks.
And it was like, maybe I could have like two or three of them in the beginning.
And now it's like, I'm comfortable with like, we could have 15 windows open.
I'm about to literally go buy a new computer.
Cause I'm like, I need more Ram.
I need more like ability to do this in the background.
Totally.
Yeah.
Like and comment this video so that, you know, I could send some YouTube AdSense revenue to Cody.
We can get some more RAM.
It's all ridiculous.
I need some RAM.
No, man.
It's like I'm just realizing like what this turns into.
So, OK, we bet we made all those pieces of ad creative.
Right.
Got those variations.
And it's just text variations.
All right.
So now I'm going to go back to Claude.
And I'm going to be like I want.
Now I want to buckle a bulk, upload all of these ads as drafts into a Facebook ad set.
Here is the or here's where the folder is locally for the creative.
And I'm going to provide the Facebook ads ad set URL to you in a second.
All right.
So I'm now going to go back to finder.
And I'm going to copy this, paste that in, and then let's go back to Facebook.
And I have this ad set that I've already created for this demo.
It's basically just here and I'm just going to paste in this URL.
And so now here's that URL.
It's going to basically bulk upload all of those pieces of creative into that ad set.
So while that's happening, I'm now going to go and I'm going to create a dashboard about this.
So let's just pull out the ad set ID.
Let's do the ad set ID.
And I'm going to go over to graft and I'm going to be pull up Facebook ads as the data source.
And then I'm going to be say, uh, this is the ad set ID.
Make a dashboard showing clicks over time.
Also have a scorecard that, or sorry, I didn't do the transcription.
Make a dashboard showing clicks over time as a line chart.
Also within that line chart, can you include the cost and the CPC as lines as well?
And then add a scorecard also that has total spend, total traffic or total clicks as another scorecard.
So those are two separate ones.
And then I want you to also show demographic data as a bar chart of showing the ages.
So that's its own separate chart.
That's a bar chart basically showing the impressions by the age categories.
So I'm going to let that run in the background.
We'll come back to that in a second.
But now that I have this campaign that's running.
And I'm trying to track what's happening within it.
I can basically go and like build out a tracking dashboard for this.
The other thing that I can do.
So once it's got the ad set with destination URL, would you like just put them as a draft?
So while that's working, I can also analyze what is happening in that specific ad campaign.
Um, and I can turn off the losers of that ad campaign.
So I'm going to show you how to do that.
So I do documents forward slash graft forward slash, uh, growth agents and then Claude.
And then I'm going to get that URL again.
And I'm going to say um, Use the graphed MCP to pull in the data for this ad set that I'm about to provide from Facebook ads.
I want to look at the CPM data to see which ones are the lowest performing like the highest CPM price.
All right.
And then let's provide the ad set URL again.
Let's go ad set URL.
And then while that's happening, we can come in and check on the other ones.
All right.
So it's now built that entire bulk Facebook ad generator or sorry, which one is this?
This is the look one.
OK, so it's made the updates to these ads.
These are an entirely new ad set that it's basically pulling in.
So I already did this right of like like downloading these as a zip and bulk uploading them.
So we won't go through that process again.
But this is how easy it is to basically make those variations.
So and not just variations.
These are variations based on pain points that people have said publicly about.
Yes, exactly.
So it has pulled in basically the social dialogue that's happened.
So the best ads that I'm seeing perform right now are basically you're selling outcomes or you're talking to the pain points.
Right.
And so I'm just guiding it to focus on those things, pull me that information and then build the ad sets around those.
So while that just happens, this in the background, just use the graphed MCP to pull in all of the low performers.
So these are the... Let's look at the ones that have the highest CPM.
So these all have high CPM.
So I'm just going to tell it, turn these off.
I'm going to say...
Use the Facebook ads API to turn off these ads with this ad name.
And so now it's just pulled in this live data from my data warehouse.
And this isn't an MCP that's interacting with the Facebook ads API.
I just want to like emphasize this.
So it's not have, you're not running into rate limits.
Like, again, go and publish like a thousand ads and running those variations.
There is literally no way, like if you're spending enough, like there is literally no way that you're going to be able to analyze this data without a data pipeline and a data warehouse.
And so this is like what we've built right at Graft.
So anyways. the, just to get back to the MCP thing, there's like this page nation problem.
So, like we see this all the time, where people are like yeah, I plugged into Facebook ads MCP, I'm interacting with it.
And then I realized that I'm only seeing like 5% of the data that I think I'm actually seeing.
Right.
Um, but so coming back to this, I've now said, Hey, turn these off.
So it went and it paused those ads for me.
And so it's just, just to walk through what we just did, just kind of reiterate this.
We We just did bulk ad creation.
We just analyzed the data for the performers.
We just turned those off and on based on that.
And at this point you're probably starting to have the epiphany like oh, I can just turn this into a repeatable process.
And this is where I see all of this going basically, is you're going to be going to have these agents that are running on top of your live data?
They're analyzing it, making decisions based off of like the model.
So like, for example, how I would run this is, I would have a test campaign where I'm basically testing new creative constantly.
I would have a cron job that's on a daily basis, basically going and turning off the low performers.
And then the high performers they get bumped up into their own ad sets with their own dedicated ad budget for a CPA action.
And then that whole thing could just run automatically in the background.
And then to track that, I'd build out a dashboard that basically is showing me, you know that information.
So I can come back to that like later on and see what's occurring there.
And then the other thing that I would then go do is like potentially have a conversation in the morning.
Say, for example, so I've got the graphed MCP in my cloud application. like chat.
Um, so this is also technically on my phone.
Um, so like in the morning I'll wake up and be like, how much traffic, let's just do this.
How much traffic went to uh the or how many new users went to the homepage of the website yesterday.
Uh, and I'll just say, use, um, the graph MCP and Google analytics for, and we'll let that run.
And so I can basically get a brief each morning, whatever those KPI metrics are that I care about and have a conversation like with my data that's live and being seen continuously within the background.
And you can give this to your whole team as well, so that everybody on your team also has access to this, both from within cloud code within their like, whatever their harnesses that they use, whether that's chat, TPT or cloud.
And then also the ability to like do that tracking within like dashboardings or conversations.
Now.
Coming back to all of this, right, we've just built out basically this whole cycle of funnel.
How would I now go deploy this?
So this is where it gets the most interesting.
So what I'm doing right now, say I wanted to turn this into an agent.
I'm using Railway for this.
And the only reason is just because I saw a tutorial and that's how I figured out how to do this.
So Railway has a really robust API key.
And say I wanted to spin up, for example, this bulk ad generator so that my other team members could use this right.
They could come back and basically like use this software that I've created.
I can just tell Railway via cloud code hey, spin this up into a like a server that I can access.
Or I can just deploy this directly to Vercel or any of these workflows that I have.
So say, for example, we were talking about that LinkedIn funnel.
Let's go see which one of this it is.
All right.
So this is the podcast software.
This is the image generator.
This is the LinkedIn.
So say I want this to be accessible in perpetuity in the background.
I can then take the software that I co-work on with Claude.
And I say OK, deploy this to a server on railway so that my whole team can basically use this action or always be adding.
Like whenever they come across a LinkedIn post as an example, they could be adding that into the queue so that it just automatically goes into the email, like filtering.
Or sorry, the email, like cold email process.
And this even goes further.
So like how I'm starting to use this, Gene, I'm curious, like your thoughts on this.
So basically, like I had to do some data analysis work the other day.
Historically, I would have like downloaded the information, put it into Excel, and then I do a bunch of pivot tables.
Now, instead, what I did was I went directly to the URL.
I had to push it into a Postgres database that I on the fly created using the railway API.
It just pumped everything in there.
I then did the analysis together with Claude.
And then at that point I basically pushed from that Postgres database the outputs to the location that I wanted.
It would have taken me probably five hours historically to like clean the data appropriately.
And I smashed that out in like probably 20 to 30 minutes.
And then as soon as I got done with that database, I just spun it down.
And this was the most like interesting part of this was that, like it was basically like on the fly UI on the fly or the epiphany I had was like on the fly, UIs on the fly databases, like on the fly, software is going to become the standard for these people that are, like you know, working at the forefront of this.
Yeah.
Yeah, man, we could probably, you know, sit here and watch me work for hours if you wanted.
But that's kind of everything I had that I wanted to show you today.
The only other thing I'm just like keep getting asked, like, how do I do this?
Like, show me more technical details.
I bought the domain GTM engineering course dot com online.
I'm going to give this thing away for free to everybody who wants it.
Um, it'll be entirely public.
Um, I've already got a wait list of a hundred.
Um, but basically I'm just in the process of building this out with like step-by-step, and it's everything that I do.
I'm just going to document it into one place.
But anyways, uh, just throwing that out there as a thing, but yeah, And I'd be curious.
I'm like, OK, you see, you just watch this and you're in like a role in some company.
How do you defend against this, like with your job?
Or is it just like you need to learn this now?
And like, I want to hear your thoughts because you're seeing way more than I am with everything.
I'll tell you my answer question, but I want to start by saying, like my biggest takeaway from all of this
Yeah.
So my biggest takeaway of all this is when you connected it with Railway.
And it's a glimpse into the future of autonomous marketing.
So marketing, you know you, basically what you've done, like all those sort of jobs to be done, were jobs to be done that were literally done by human beings, right?
And then you kind of stitched together.
You know, If you've ever run ad campaigns before, you know how painful some of these things are.
Just uploading the ads alone.
I was like, I have literally spent, like I mean, I'm just imagining uploading a thousand ad variations.
Dude.
Don't give me PTSD on the pod.
I did this early in my career.
It was absolutely painful.
It was painful, right?
It was painful and it's not fun.
It's not fun at all.
Removing and figuring out low performers at a creative, not fun, not fun.
And you need to be on it.
So the idea that you can make this an agent that's working 24-7 and that's managing all these different things is the dream.
It is absolutely the dream.
Autonomous marketing, the dream.
I think who are the winners and who are the losers of this?
The winners are going to be one person businesses, small teams.
And then maybe you're your head of marketing that currently you're getting paid one hundred thousand dollars a year.
Now, all of a sudden, if you can figure out how to do all these things and this is where I'm answering your question, if you can figure out how to do all these things, you know, you could make the case like hey, you know, triple my salary easily.
Right.
Like from a value perspective, like if you can do all these jobs to be done, you're one person instead of 10 there is a case to be made that you've added a tremendous amount of value to your role.
The unfortunate thing is, I think a lot of these jobs to be done and this is where I disagree with a lot of people is I think that there is going to be a lot of job loss.
Real job loss.
I think it's going to be extremely rapid job loss and then, like I'm just thinking about, like the early days of, like what we saw, you know, in the industrial revolution, and like the United Kingdom, like they, I mean, you basically have this displacement and then new roles get created.
But like in that interim, still a lot of turmoil.
It's going to be chaos.
It's going to be chaos.
And I like I have a friend who runs a startup and he texted me yesterday and he's like I think I'm going to fire 50 people.
And that's like 70% of his team.
Right.
And I'm just over here and I'm like, how, why, what, you know, tell me the reason.
He's like, I think I can automate all of their jobs right now with like agent swarms.
And I'm like, okay, what's an agent swarm?
Because that's just this term that gets thrown around right now.
And it's like, oh, it's just an agent that does a specific thing.
And then there's an agent that manages that whole system.
And then imagine five pillars under another agent.
And I'm like, oh, I've built that.
That's what an agent swarm is.
And I think that this is the thing that like people are – because now it just runs in the background.
Like I have one that's just like crawling LinkedIn like as we speak.
And it's like looking for like ICP.
And then it enriches them.
It writes a personalized email and it cold emails them.
Yeah.
And like –
I don't think people understand like what's about to happen in like the next 12 months.
So, and I'm excited about it because I think there's like again, if you can build like, it is incredible, like you're so capable right now, especially if you have domain knowledge, is the other thing that I'm finding is like
Just because you can like it can be built doesn't mean that you can build it because you don't have the vocabulary.
Like when I look at like my co-founder, Max right, and his technical vocabulary how he can describe the problem to a coding agent is so much more sophisticated than I'll ever be able to do it.
And so the output quality that he can get from this is at like a level that's in the top 10, top 1%.
So if we translate that to something else like say, you studied graphic design for 20 years and like, you've been working in the industry for 20 years, the vocabulary you have to describe something is going to be so much more sophisticated than what I have.
So I'm like this happened the other day, where I'm like I wanted to put texture on the back of an ad.
And I was like, how the fuck do I do that in the background?
I kept trying to describe it.
It came out terrible.
And then I found this like person giving a description of, like how do you make it have a TV type texture?
Right.
And it was like all of these you know specific, like it was like a specific lexicon to describe the quality.
Literally one shots it, you know, immediately like what I was looking for after that.
And you have that realization that this actually becomes like the superpower.
If you can incorporate these tools into what you're doing for work and have that domain expertise, that knowledge that's like on top of that.
That actually is what makes you like incredible.
And so it's the same thing that we've always seen, where it's like oh, you have one or two skills with like a deep T and then you like that.
What makes you valuable?
This is like that.
But like you know, times a thousand, where it's like, if you have the vocabulary you know and six things.
And you come to this tooling and can basically express and explain what you're needing or what you're looking for.
It changes the entire system in my mind.
But again, I'd love to hear your thoughts on where you And also just what you're seeing within your own companies that you own, and within the market as well.
Well, I think the reality is there's a lot of people, even if they have a ton of domain expertise...
They don't know the tools and how to use the tools optimally yet.
Now I think that the tools are going to get so good that UX is going to be so easy at some point.
But for right now.
For example, if we counted off all the tools that you mentioned in this podcast, you probably mentioned 17, no more 20 tools.
I'll include some of those in the show notes.
Phantom Blaster, instantly.
I'm not even talking about Cloud Code and stuff like that.
You've done your research, you've found the tools.
I think that's why a lot of people listen to this podcast.
It's a way for them to learn a lot of that stuff.
But the point is, I have a lot of respect for the people that Understand they have domain knowledge.
Know that that domain knowledge is super valuable and who are going out there and trying things.
But yeah, the other sort of takeaway I have from this podcast is your insight around APIs, which I thought was really interesting.
So like, In the old way of SaaS tools and stuff like that, an API was a nice to have.
It was about how good is the software that you're using?
How good is the UX?
How good is the brand?
How good is when you press this feature?
How quick is it?
How instant is it?
But now, when you're living in a terminal, for example, and you're using MCPs to talk to LLMs, The nice to have is actually the UI.
The nice to have is the SaaS.
The nice to have is going to this website and looking pretty.
Ultimately what you care about is the output and the thing is running, the agents are running 24-7.
They aren't hogging tokens.
The output is high quality.
It's doing the thing that it's says that, you know, it should do.
And I think Sam Altman said recently something about APIs.
I think he said that every company is going to be an API company.
Totally.
I align with this, like now doing this, like there's a software, like I just won't put them on blast because I know how big your audience is.
But like, There's a thing you can do in their UI I can't do in their API.
And I'm literally about to churn because I'm just like, this is critical for me.
And now it feels archaic for me to go and interact with your fucking UI to do this output that I need.
And I think that this is going to be.
I think there's going to be companies that are entirely just like.
I mean, we literally had this conversation internally.
Do we build a UI?
Yeah.
Because that even a thing that we do, or do we just build the tooling that enables you to see like, where we see the puck going?
And I think that, like you know I, we had to come.
You know, have a come to Jesus moment of like.
Oh, this is a Like where we know the puck is going is entirely different than like where the normie like is right now and like the adoption cycle of this.
And so like having to like meet there to ride this.
But like, I mean, it's very clear.
Right.
Like, for example, like with the graph MCP, that's a live data feed.
So I may like when I'm like, show me my Google ads and Facebook ads paid ad spend.
Right.
That's a live data feed that's happening underneath the hood.
It's like an endpoint that I'm hitting.
It's literally on the fly, generating a live data endpoint that I can pull from my data warehouse from.
So with that, I can basically build whatever I want on top of that.
Yeah.
And I'm like, okay, well, let's just go build a custom dashboard like for what we need.
But what we're finding is that like there's like kind of different use cases.
Like the – I guess what I'm trying to say is like you're basically making your agent so that – or whatever it is your tooling is – so that it fits into any harness.
So whether you're working from cloud, iOS or chat GPT, desktop or cloud code on, you know in your terminal or like cursor, or you know even the UI.
It's unified across that.
And people can basically take that wherever they want and get the same outputs.
And so, from a product standpoint, this is how we're, like you know, focused on it and kind of moving forward.
And I think it Again.
What it comes down to though, is like everything that, like we're talking about this tooling piece like, unless you know what to do, it's very hard to get it to like.
If I, if I didn't know these exact tool sets to use, to like go and do these actions like here's how to do this LinkedIn thing as an example, there would be like a very low chance that it would be able to figure this out.
It's totally possible.
It can, it's just like going to take longer.
And you can do this now with like Claude and with perplexity, where you're like I'm trying to do X list five APIs that can help me do that.
But I think this is how people are going to start building this.
And like I'm finding myself doing this where I'm like I have this like vision of a workflow and I'm starting with the final product.
And then I'm like working back and, like You know, basically piecing together how does this work, and then having the agent go and build that for me.
And so then this comes back to like, how do agents discover the necessary infrastructure for?
And like, how do you be the thing that it picks when it's going to build?
You know X Y, Z thing.
And like again, these are the things I'm losing sleep over now, as we're like getting deeper and deeper into this.
Well, Cody, I appreciate you being so saucy with sharing all the stuff with us.
We do appreciate it.
It's been too long.
You need to come back on again and share some ideas and stuff like that.
So we'd love to have you.
And...
Have a ton of them, man.
You can go for days about Chrome extensions right now.
You can literally have Plot Code One shot them and just turn on Facebook ads in the background automatically.
I also had an agent that was running an Etsy shop for a little bit.
That was crazy.
It just got banned two days ago, which was hilarious.
So people, please, you know, let's beg Cody to come back on the pod and have him on soon.
This is an open invite, Cody.
You can come on whenever you'd like, share ideas.
You definitely get my creative juices flowing, so I appreciate you so much.
Appreciate it, G. Thanks for your time as always, man.
I always love coming on.
Thank you.
