This is the Business English Podcast, Episode 177, How to Brag in the Business World.
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Hey, Michelle, what's shaking? Hey, Lindsay, not too much.
How's everything with you? Things are good.
You know, life has its ups and downs, but we just we try to roll with it as much as we can.
And we're coming back to business English today.
So, you know, that's right. I do, though, want to start the episode with one question for you here, Michelle.
Are you ready? Okay. Okay. So what is your attitude towards bragging about yourself?
How do you feel about that? Oh, I am not good at it.
I don't like to do it at all. But and that's a good thing.
But it's also sometimes a bad thing. You know, I tend to underplay things and not want to talk about i don't know i never want to seem like oh i'm this and i'm that or you know i don't feel comfortable with that but there sometimes is negative because you have to self promote yourself and i would not say that i'm a great self promoter what about you lindsay Yeah, I struggle with this too.
You know, a lot of times my partner will tell me, oh, you have to post that on LinkedIn.
Like when I get interviewed on some other podcast about our podcast, right?
Or when I do a panel at a conference, post it, post it on LinkedIn, talk about it.
And then I go to LinkedIn, I try to do it.
And as I'm writing those words, it's just, it's so hard.
I feel truly honored to have been featured on this panel.
It just feels... Yeah, I don't like it.
We're the same. Because yeah, sometimes also with all there's English, there will be something Yeah, you know, an accomplishment.
And same down will be like, Oh, you should put that, you know, online.
And I'm like, so I usually have him posted on his Facebook or, you know, I'm like, I don't want to. i i don't know i don't so we're similar in that way um yeah but yeah well i mean i think sometimes we have to we have to um it's a skill really yeah i mean it's a career building skill because in the past few episodes michelle 20 episodes or so we've been talking about you know finding a new job right how do you and that is actually that's that's kind of doing your networking and building your brand name so that in a couple of years if you need a new job people already know who you are and they know you're a contributor to your industry so you're not starting from scratch so it's like we need to always be building our network and building our name even when we're totally comfortable where we are so we actually have to do it for sure i think one i just didn't thinking about this now is probably one way to do it is try and separate almost like a separate identity like yeah even if you personally lindsay mcmahon and michelle kaplan we don't feel comfortable doing it we have to kind of separate ourselves and be like no this is the brand this is either either all ears English or just like your personal, like, oh, this is Lindsay, the podcaster.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, no, that makes sense.
Entrepreneur. And this is Michelle, you know, like you have to think of yourself as another person and just kind of do it that way.
That's. But it's hard. That's a great approach.
And one other approach you could take on top of that is having someone do it for you.
You said like your husband or hiring someone that is kind of your promotions manager or something.
And that person, your publicity manager, that person does it.
So they're putting the posts up kind of, even if it's on your account, it's like someone else is writing it.
So you're kind of just seeing it get posted.
Yeah. There are ways around it. Yeah. right i mean what about when you meet people and they ask you what you do are you like do you say it in a strong way or do you kind of oh yeah like kind of just yeah that's what i hear no i do say it um well it's kind of fun saying i'm a professional podcaster but i never say that though um it's like i just because i love what we do at allers english yeah and so when someone so when i start talking about it like my face just lights up and people can see that So it doesn't need to be any false bragging or any pushing anything.
It's totally genuine. You know what I mean?
Yeah, definitely. So we're going to be talking about when you're searching for jobs or going for an interview, because sometimes you have to brag a little to a friend or talk about what... why you think you'd be good for something.
So we're going to give you some expressions today that you can use to talk about your skills or to kind of brag about yourself in a way to share that you have an advantage over the competition as well.
Yeah, it's important. And I know, you know, this can vary across cultures to the way you might go about this.
So obviously, like this advice is for applying for a job in American business culture, right?
We can't speak to business culture in the UK or Australia.
We have done interviews with people in those countries who have said maybe there is a different style of self-promotion.
It's done a little differently. So if you're looking to work in Australia, guys, for this particular topic, you may want to consult with someone there.
But this works for kind of American business culture. yeah yeah and guys we were talking about uh the other episode we did about starting to look for a new job maybe you're leaving your job that was episode 175 ready to leave your job how to talk about it yeah i love it so let's get into it michelle what well first of all let's make sure our listeners hit that follow button before we go any further why should they do that because it's easy.
It's easy to hit the button and then it's easy to get the episodes.
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I love it. Definitely. All right, Michelle, what are the words that we need to know?
Where are we going today? So the first one is a leg up.
Yeah, I love it. It's so it's such a funny one because you just get this image of someone's leg being up.
It's weird, right? But yeah, comment and it's okay to use this in business culture for sure.
Yeah, it's not too casual. Right? No, no, no, no, no.
I mean, and it basically means, you know, something that is an advantage, something that is strong about you.
So for example, you could say, what gives her the leg up is her 10 years of extra experience in marketing.
Yeah, that makes sense. So that's kind of an advantage, right?
Having that, that edge, which I just said the next two words.
Yeah. yeah yeah what's the next one yeah well the next one is the advantage or an advantage so you could say Lindsay how could you use that here it is I know I have the advantage because the hiring manager said we hope to see you soon before I left so clearly this person walked out of the interview feeling good getting some indication that they may be chosen for the job right right right and lindsay what's the next one okay so the next one is the edge right she has the edge because she works in the company already but they may not hire internally so certainly if you're trying to get an internal promotion you probably have an edge over new people coming in because you know the company well if you utilize it correctly in the interview right right right right and then the last one is stand out he stands out because of his outgoing personality yes I love it all right these are really good and these are the building blocks for today's episode guys uh and so write these down you know go back rewind listen again write them down and in just a minute we're going to talk a little bit more and integrate these into our conversation right Michelle Yes.
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So where are we going from here, Michelle?
Well, Lindsay, I mean, let's talk about it.
So when when is it good to brag and when is it good to kind of keep it quiet?
Is there ever a time? I mean, if you're talking to someone and you're like, oh, yeah, like I interviewed this for this job and I have the leg up because of this and that.
Is there ever a time when you do want to keep a little bit quiet about it?
Yeah, I think, well, when people are not really asking you for that information, we always remember like, you know, I always think when I was a kid, I was very aware of braggers, right?
Braggers, kids who would always just brag like, oh, my family bought this car.
I don't know. Things that kids brag about tend to be more objects, I think, or toys they got, that kind of thing.
But I was very hyper aware of that for some reason.
And no one wants to be that bragger in the adult form, right?
No. You can smell it from a mile away. Yeah.
Yes, exactly. Exactly. So I mean, and but but if you also you want to talk about other people, you can use this vocabulary.
If you can brag about someone else, sometimes somebody might say, oh, well, I'm going to brag about Lindsay for a minute.
Right. Yeah. Something like that. Yeah. Yeah.
Because if that person isn't going to do it, maybe they're underplaying.
That's a good word for today. Underplay something.
It's like, oh, yeah. Yeah, I am. I co-host a podcast.
It's like, you know, that sounds very much like I'm underplaying it.
No, I don't want to do that. No. Yeah. So some.
Yeah. I think just being straightforward, just saying what you do, why it matters, why it matters to you and why it matters to the world.
And then that's it. Move on. If people ask you more, they want to know more about like success and numbers and things.
You can go into that if it's the right context.
But just don't hide it, but don't overdo it.
Right? Yeah. Right, right, right. Exactly.
And then let's talk about, I mean, with this bragging or self-promotion, what are things that can give somebody the edge for a job?
Yeah, I mean, certainly experience. So obviously, if you're self-promoting, there better be some substance that you can rely on for data.
We did, I mentioned that I was interviewed on...
Amy from Real Life English podcast, right?
So over there, we talked about this. You really want to back up an interview with data.
What have you done for our company? How have you moved their bottom line forward?
That comes from actual experience in the job, right?
Right. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. That's true.
But the other thing is sometimes it's just who you know.
So we did an episode about Ride the Coattails.
I was trying to find that one, but I was having some trouble.
But we did an episode about writing someone's coattails.
Right. And it's about who you know. So sometimes they say it's not always what you know or it's who you know.
Yeah. And there's. Subtle things you can do to kind of associate yourself with this other person that these people might know, right?
Things you can do to make it clear that this was an introduction through the person they know and that immediately raises the caliber for you, raises your profile in their mind.
So maybe we'll revisit that topic, Michelle, another day in a more subtle way.
Yeah. Yeah. yeah and then what's something else that can give you a leg up obviously good personality i mean it's just it's good to work with people who are empathetic and who just are self-aware empathy and self-awareness is huge in the business world michelle what are your thoughts For sure.
And also you just want to, I think people are interested even when they do a job interview, just in the person's personality.
Oh, would you want to work with this person?
Would you want to get a cup of coffee with them?
Would they be fun to work with? Um, that's a huge layer of, I think why sometimes people get hired over others.
Oh my God. Especially on, well, for all there's English, like that's totally crucial.
You know, right on our show, we have to enjoy each other's company on the podcast, enjoy our conversation.
And we do. And so show your personality.
If you think you're a good personality fit for that company, you know, show that find tangible ways to make that clear.
Okay, yeah, yeah, definitely. But this is also important if you're maybe competing for a client, maybe you're in a marketing agency.
So thinking of a whole team aspect to this.
So, you know, just the people might be looking for the clients might be looking for someone who's organized responds quickly.
Also, The price, lots of things that are important there as well.
So not just thinking about job interviews here, but also when you have a job and maybe you're trying to get something as a part of that job, like a client. yeah sometimes i think that the best way to if you're let's say you're a consultant whether you work for one of the big consulting companies or whether it's just an independent consulting company the best way to self-promote is to actually ask the person about themselves and make sure you truly are asking good questions about the company right because that and that will set you apart from your competitors a lot So it's not so much supplying the information about yourself.
It's more like asking good questions about the company you're about to serve because they're hiring you to solve their problem. right the only reason you have to show that you want to learn about them you want to get all the information yeah like show that yeah right our careers we're here in the in our careers to solve a problem in the world and get something done and so lead with that you know for all ears english we talk about all yours english we are solving the problem of you know connection through english we want you all to be able to connect in global business through english and feel strong about it and we're out to solve that problem so we lead with that yeah yes exactly i love it so on that note should we go into a role play yeah let's do it michelle so here we are managers and we're trying to figure out who to hire so we are maybe maybe we're like ceo cto or something right something like that all right there we go so i really like luke for this position Yeah, he was impressive.
I think what gives him the edge is his background in design.
Oh, definitely. But I mean, Melody does stand out because she has a Ph.D. absolutely her education gives her a leg up she has the advantage there this is a tough choice oh hard hard between you know like a resume of education versus you know experience right that's tough yeah yeah yeah it is it is tough because education might not always yeah equal the amount of experience i mean and that gets into a whole separate conversation about things like college and right um all sorts of things so um which is something which is a conversation we're having in our culture right now i think people are starting to you know think okay you know the price of college has gone up so high just even even just bachelor's degrees and people are starting to question the value of it and i have mixed feelings very mixed feelings about that You know, well, I was just recently we were we were talking to someone who, you know, helping us answer questions about saving money for the future and things like that, because we're thinking about college for our children.
And they gave like we were given given kind of an estimate of what it could cost per year in whatever year it will be many years down the road.
And it was horrifying. And I and I. So it was it was quite frightening.
And so then it did make me think like, well, who knows what the state of it will be then?
Maybe maybe things will be different or maybe not everyone will be going to college.
So something has to break. I think I think we're on the verge of people running away from.
Yeah, something has to change. And I think public opinion has significant.
There is some data showing the public opinion on the importance of a bachelor's degree since 2013 has significantly plummeted. actually wow and so but tbd right but something has to change by the time your kids are in college it's unsustainable the way prices are going up it's just impossible yeah yeah there's just no way something yeah i mean yeah so maybe for my niece who's 10 now so maybe things will be the same for her but another 10 years later i don't think so i think it'll change yeah yeah yeah yeah we'll see anyway should we go back to that another day that's actually a really good conversation yeah let's go through let's go through the role play here michelle um what do we say first um we're talking about luke and i said i think what gives him the edge is his background in design yeah and then i said definitely but i mean melody does stand out because she has a phd right and then i said her education gives her a leg up or you could say the leg up yeah a leg up but yeah gives her the leg up or what would be the difference there just a quick bonus for our listeners What would be the difference?
Gives her a leg up. Yeah. Gives her the leg up.
I think like using the kind of makes it more official sounding.
What do you think? I mean, I think both of them are fine.
Yeah, both are fine. Using the would just make it a little more prominent.
Gives her the leg up. Maybe it's more about the comparison between the two, right?
Yeah. Yeah, when you use the. We can talk about that another time.
So Benai said she has the advantage there, right?
These are all ways of talking about someone's advantage.
So this episode is a little less about self-bragging.
It's about talking about other people's advantages, right?
Like evaluating someone, kind of. True, true.
I guess more of the examples we used were talking about other people, funnily enough.
But it still goes along with this idea of just being able to talk about yourself i mean you can say oh i i have the leg up because i have this this this and that so it's ways to talk about yourself but we can do follow-ups on exactly maybe how to get more comfortable with self-promotion and specific ways you can do it so we'll do a follow-up on that but we wanted to teach these expressions and talk about just like sharing that someone has something special Yeah, exactly.
And this goes across this. Like I said, sometimes my mother-in-law will say, I brag about you all the time, right?
So this could come from your in-laws, your family.
It could come from two people evaluating you after an interview.
It could come from a whole cross-section of society, right?
Yeah. So really cool. Good stuff today. Yeah.
So I guess that's the takeaway for today.
Don't be afraid to brag about yourself, but don't do it too much.
Yeah. And, you know, use these expressions about yourself or about other people.
Very useful for the business world. All right.
Sounds good, Michelle. Good chatting with you today.
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Good stuff. And the Business English podcast.
And Business English. You got it, Michelle.
Take care. Talk soon. Bye. Bye. Thank you for listening to Business English, a podcast just for you, the high achieving global professional.
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