AUDIO EXTRA: Unsolved Mysteries Part 1 & 2｜Crime Junkie

Hi, Crime Junkies, and Happy Crime Junkie Thursday.

I love this new little summer thing we have going.

I hope you do too. Well, today, let me give you the spiel just one more time.

Mondays are Crime Junkies days, but for the rest of the summer, we wanted to celebrate five years of the Crime Junkie fan club by celebrating you, our fans.

And to do that, we wanted to release some fan club vault episodes to you.

We've been making bonus episodes almost as long as we've been making wide release episodes, and every single month in the fan club, we do one fulling episode, one mini episode, and one piece of bonus content.

And you might ask, what does bonus content mean?

Well, today, I'm going to show you.

Now, I don't need to tell you that I'm obsessed with unsolved mysteries, right?

Like, that's a universal thing built into the DNA of all crime junkies, I feel like.

I love me some Robert Stack, and I love me, the new Netflix reboot.

So much so that back when the first season of the Netflix Unsolved Mysteries came out, Britain, I did a recap type episode about the whole series, case by case.

And I thought, what better time to share this bonus content with you?

Because PSA, a new season of Unsolved Mysteries is coming out on Netflix at the end of this month.

So this is your time to catch up.

Listen to us chat about season one, and if you enjoy it, watch the new season of Unsolved Mysteries, join the fan club, and come listen to us talk about the new season.

If you sign up for the fan club directly through our website, you can use code free summer, and new members get to join whatever tier you want for free for the rest of July and all of August.

All right, so here you go.

Here is your unlocked vault episode.

Hi, crime junkies. I'm your host, Ashley Flowers, and I'm for it.

And personally, I am incredibly offended that you are not also the host of Unsolved Mysteries on Netflix.

You are right here. You don't have time, but you could make time.

Listen, I can't tell you how many times I told Netflix, I have a trench coat.

Like, if that's what you're waiting for.

Exactly. And it's not like they found someone better.

There was no host. So that's actually part of what I want to talk about.

We want to give you guys the Unsolved Mysteries recap crime junkie style.

You're watching it. We're talking about it.

You're talking about it.

Let's all talk about it together.

So what I'm thinking is I kind of want to just get your thoughts on the series as a whole first, and then we can kind of talk about each episode.

So to be fair, I was way more of America's most wanted person than an Unsolved Mysteries person.

So I was going in a little bit, maybe less biased than someone like a diehard like you.

Okay. But the lack of a narrator was super jarring for me.

Okay, right? And like obviously no one could ever hold up to the late great Robert Stagg.

But I mean, they tried to replace him.

It did not work. So they had to bring him back.

Right. But like, there's still like no one kind of like telling spooky story, which is half of the like I hate to say fun, but like half of the allure, maybe, maybe episode is someone kind of like leaving you on those like cliffhangers.

And maybe it's also like a little bit of like millennial bias.

I miss the commercial breaks where you're like, oh, I didn't even think about that.

And then like your local grocer is like, hey, we have bananas on sale this week.

Like I see you're kind of missed like the nostalgia factor of having like a solid commercial break.

I mean, even in like shows from, you know, a few years ago that are Netflix, they still have those kind of like commercial break moments.

You just don't get the commercials.

And this felt way more stylized towards Netflix, which obviously they produced it.

I get that. But this is nostalgic in me.

Like I really wanted some of those like gaspy moments where I could run, you know, get a Capri Sun before it started back up again.

So I actually kind of agree with you.

Like I mean, I grew up on Unzal mystery.

So I have that like appreciation and miss the nostalgia of it.

But I definitely was an America's most wanted girl.

I've said it a thousand times.

John Walsh with my boyfriend, we spent every Saturday night together.

And I, I don't know, maybe this has always been big.

I'm about to say something that might sound silly, but like I feel like nostalgia is very in right now.

And it might always be. Oh, always be.

But I'm just like finally at an age where like I have something to be nostalgic about.

And I think here's my like quick hot take on Unzal mysteries.

If you would have called it anything else, I would have loved it.

I would have given it on the 11 out of 10.

It was wonderfully produced.

The stories were super compelling, so well told, loved like the compassion for the victims and the families.

And really, I mean, Unzal's mysteries has always been about trying to solve cases.

I think I read somewhere that of all the cases they've covered, they've actually helped solve like 260 of them.

I love the mission of Unzal mysteries.

So 11 out of 10, if you would have called it just like Netflix's mysteries.

However, what I was waiting for, what I was wanting was that kind of, you know, the same, same things, same appreciation and same storytelling.

But like cheeky, campy vibe that it had is what I miss so much.

Do your point having that narrator to walk you through the story and tell you about the cases and having Robert Stack asked you like, maybe you can solve a mystery.

And like, and again, like coming back to what you said, like I appreciate hearing the stories of people involved or people close to the case or, you know, the victims family and friends.

I appreciate them in me having like a louder voice or a more prominent voice in the episode.

That was amazing and that was something that maybe we didn't get as much of in like the old school one.

But it's a double edged tour, right?

Exactly. We don't get that because we have one case per episode where as part of what I missed about Unzal mysteries is they could take a case that no one else could cover because there wasn't an hour of content.

So they would do like three cases per episode.

And I think that's what made it so great.

And I think that's why, you know, I mean, so many podcasts still use Unzal mysteries to even talk about the crime cases we're talking about now because Unzal mysteries for a lot of cases was only ones talking about it.

Exactly. Because again, they were like, okay, we just need to fill 10 minutes of content, not an entire like 40 minutes of content with each story.

The episodes were almost told in like vignette style.

So you have multiple stories within one, you know, 43 minute television episode.

Was there a lot to go off of?

No, but that's why Unzal mysteries could cover it.

Like you said. Yeah, so I'm a little bit not concerned isn't even the right word.

I am, well, maybe it is. I'm a little bit concerned that as we continue to go on, it's still going to just be these bigger cases.

Now granted, most of the ones from this first batch of episodes they put out were fairly unknown.

So if they can keep that up, I think that's really awesome.

Because again, that's like what I what I loved about it is you could tune into Unzal mysteries in here case that you had never heard about.

And it just like blew your mind.

But these cases, I mean, true to that.

They did blow my mind. So I think we should kind of run through the six episodes that they did.

Maybe we'll call it Netflix's Unzal mysteries.

Yeah. And for again, for the 11 out of 10, how much I loved it, I want to talk about the episodes and all the things that I loved about them and talk about theories.

So, you know, we split up the episodes.

I'm going to do one through three.

You're going to do four through six.

Let's dive in. So like I said, part of what I want to do with our review is to give you a quick overview of the cases.

Let you know if there has been any updates what the internet is going crazy over because new theories have emerged in some of these stories already.

But we are going to be skipping over episode one, both because we already did a full length episode on this case.

But also because certain parties that were mentioned during our episode on Ray Rivera sent us a letter through their lawyers threatening legal action because they believe that our episodes suggested that they may have had something to do with Ray's death.

So in an effort to stay safe and to be on the up and up, we aren't going to talk about this case until our lawyers have worked with theirs to sort this out.

And I know that isn't a lot, but that is really all I can say about that.

Okay. So episode two on to episode two.

So in episode two, which was titled 13 minutes, we learn about a woman named Patrice who went missing.

And again, we've all seen it, but I'll just give you like a short recap and then we can kind of talk about the things that stood out to us.

So Patrice drops her son off at school, goes to work, she works at a hair salon, and literally in a 13 minute window, hence the name of the episode, she goes straight up missing, which right off the bat blew my mind.

Yeah, I mean, we talk about this a lot.

I feel like it's more common than we even believe where like these things happen in almost these unbelievable windows of time.

Impossible. Yeah. So when police get there, once they realize she's missing, something's a miss, they realize that money had been taken from the register, but not from her purse, which did have cash in it, but the purse was actually rafal through.

And this is something that I got stuck on for a long time.

Like if you're there to steal the money, steal all the money, no?

Right. Like, it's a robbery for a reason.

But is it? And that's the big thing is what was the motive for this crime?

And that's something that to this day, I don't think the public really has an answer to.

One of the things that I thought was super interesting is, you know, they make a big deal in the episode about where her car was parked.

So normally she like backed in, she was right on the side of the building.

But the day that she goes missing, her car is like kind of in front of the building.

So the one thought I had is maybe they're rifling through her purse to get the keys.

Again, I don't know if you're going to bother to take the register money.

I don't know why you don't take the purse money, but maybe they were looking for the keys?

Yeah. Or even like the person general, like credit cards, cash, whatever is in there.

Like why not just like throw it over your shoulder and take it along?

Yeah. And that is to me like what makes this looks like a staged robbery.

Because again, I'll just take everything out of the cash register and all I need are the keys.

And that's what this person leaves with.

So she's missing. And do you want to talk about Rob?

I mean, where to start, honestly.

I mean, we should start by saying this dude probably should have passed on doing the documentary.

Because even though police have openly said like he has an alibi, it seems to check out.

So sketch. We're looking at other possibilities.

Yeah, he looked so bad. And there were like a couple of quotes of his that I literally like had to rewind and write down because I was just so like taken aback by them.

Like there's one time when you know, they're talking about her being missing and people are like, you know, they didn't have a great relationship.

Pistol is saying pistols for some.

Pistol saying. And he's like, I'm not going to talk about that.

I'm not going to talk about that.

I don't know if he's a narcissist.

I don't know what it is. I don't know if he's a narcissist.

I don't know if he's a narcissist.

And he was abducted like in 97 after like writing a bike from one friend's house to another, disappeared and he ended up being found in those woods and he was shot, I believe, to death.

And then Patrice is 2004.

And then in 2008, there is the case of this woman named Meredith Emerson.

And she actually is someone they like briefly brought up in the episode because one of the suspects in Patrice's case is Gary Hilton.

And he is like for sure convicted of murdering Meredith who were found in the same woods.

So I think that's one of the reasons they're like kind of connecting the cases.

Yeah. And if you guys want to hear an entire episode on Meredith and Gary Hilton, that's actually one of the first episodes we did in our new series Park Predator.

So I highly recommend it.

It might give you a little more insight into this guy who was a suspect and you know, just kind of into the area at the time.

Because it's hard to tell if any of these are connected not knowing how Patrice died.

But they're far enough away that I think it's unlikely this might be like the leek and park of this area.

It just seems that again over the course of a few years, like multiple bodies have popped up there.

Now we don't know how she died.

They're keeping that information like for law enforcement only.

I assume to like rule out people who might confess or whatever.

But they did make a huge point in the unsolved mysteries segment of noting that her ring wasn't found.

Like this is the piece of evidence that they're looking for.

It was found nowhere on the floor of the woods, which doesn't mean it wasn't there.

It wasn't picked up. It wasn't taken away.

It's still there. You know, who knows?

Right. But now that the ring is gone, is robbery back on the table as a possible motive?

I mean, but that's the only thing.

I don't know. Yeah. And neither do I.

And again, was it like a personal thing that someone wanted to take it?

Was it a money thing? Was it again to try and throw off the scent of something in a robbery?

It was weird. It's something that everyone is looking for.

I assume in pawn shops, in people's homes, whatever.

But this is like the standout piece of evidence that unsolved mysteries released.

But after we find out that Patrice is dead, again, we get some weird comments from Rob, who basically just says, maybe they're out with that weird.

But he says, I have no comment for people who think I did it.

So he doesn't really like defend himself.

He's just, which I know you're tired of me defending Rob, but I kind of get at some point because it's like, I've said everything I can say.

I'm not going to say anything else.

Like, believe me or don't.

Yeah. Like, put up or shut up kind of thing.

But just as I'm about to defend Rob, you know, weirder.

His like last farewell.

Do you want to talk like, what was that?

Ah, that's all I have to say, I think.

Yeah. So for anyone listening who hasn't seen it, or maybe it was days ago, you can't remember.

So Rob's last farewell is he asked the person who worked at the funeral home to take all of Patrice's bones and lay them out and like basically reassemble her so that he could come and say goodbye.

And what he says is, quote, reassemble her.

Lay her out for me. And when they do that, they like give him a moment alone.

And he picks up her skull and just like carries it around with him for a while.

Is what he says, like, which is what he says, which is like the, honestly, one of the wildest things of this episode because he flat out says it.

Oh, is it the wildest thing?

Because, well, first of all, before I go to the next banana thing he did is he had a line at the end of that where he says, you know, he kisses her goodbye.

He puts her skull back with her body.

And he says, quote, that's the last time I saw Patrice anywhere near intact.

End quote. I rewound this twice.

What a weird thing to say.

That's the last time I saw her intact.

What does it mean? Why is he saying it?

Why is he saying it out loud to like on a mic?

Like there are so many questions.

Intact. Did you have, when did you ever see her not intact?

Like that's, that's my question.

And again, we don't know how she died.

I don't know if she was ever.

I'm like the last time I saw her intact.

Did I see her? Did you see her unintact later?

Like, mm-hmm. So he has her cremated.

He gets her home. And then he says that he sleeps with her ashes, like she was his teddy bear.

It just makes my stomach turn a little bit.

Again, I don't know what it's like to lose a spouse.

I don't know the kind of grieving.

But like you just walked around with her skull.

Now you got like a build a bear of ashes.

That's a phrase. It's weird.

Yeah. One that I never thought I'd have to say.

There's just so many questions as like, is reasoning even for some of these things.

Even, again, coming back to defend him.

Even if he had nothing to do with anything.

This is all- Well, we said this all the time.

Like, I mean, police are saying he has an alibi.

Like, we're really not looking at him anymore.

I don't feel like I heard the words like we totally clear him.

But what they said was like it would be really improbable that he could do it.

So, I mean, if we're going off with police say, I don't think he has anything to do with it.

But this kind of shows you it reinforces like how many episodes have we done on like bad husbands.

And we've said before, being a bad husband, being like a kind of a gross guy does not make you.

Well, and on top of that, like, you coming back to another thing that we say a lot too, like you never know how you're going to respond to the loss of someone close to you.

If and when that happens.

Yeah. And here was something I found interesting though, because again, he says he's sleeping with these ashes like a teddy bear.

But when the producers ask to actually like see them, a grand that it's been years, I'm sure he doesn't sleep with them anymore, but he like has to go to his hall closet and he's like, oh, she should be in here and it's like digging around it and like there's his box on the floor that looks all beaten up and tattered.

And he even tries to point up like, oh, this is how beaten up it looks and you can tell that whatever, whatever.

But it's old and it's been here for ages, whatever.

Yeah, but he pulls out this box from within the box.

It looks more like it was made out of plastic or water, something it's black.

So out of this cardboard box, he pulls out this other thing that looks completely pristine.

And to get her ashes out, he actually like in front of camera has to like cut open that black box.

Which is wild in the moment.

Yeah, because I'm like, okay, so you've been, you've had these for years and years and years and not that you need to look at them.

But for someone who carried around the skull and was sleeping with them, I find that very surprising.

You would kind of expect it to be, you know, like on an urn, on a shelf, on a mantle, somewhere displayed.

Not at the bottom of the closet floor.

And that's what's so upsetting to me is because he clearly, you know, whatever he did with them before, however he treasured them before.

Now they're sitting on the floor in his hall closet.

And Pistol has said like he won't like share them with him.

He's never been able to see his mom's remains.

He's literally like getting joy out of keeping it from her son, which even kind of alludes to when he's like doing an interview.

And I, yeah, it's kind of like a spiteful thing for him.

And so bizarre. It is so bizarre.

But again, police have said he has an alibi that seems almost irrefutable to break.

He had a receipt, right?

Like a timestamp receipt from getting gas.

And then some kind of like automated thing at his work when he like comes in and out.

Now the thing I don't know that I tried to look up but couldn't find is, is he on camera?

Were they able to verify that it was him who got these receipts?

And he was driving the car that went through.

I don't know the answers to that.

But again, we all we can do is trust that police did their due diligence when they investigated him.

And we cannot legally say anything beyond that.

Like we have to hope that they did a good job.

Now one of the pieces of evidence, like something specific that I had looked for over and over is in the episode they kept talking about Patrice's car, how it used to normally on any other day that she worked.

It would be like backed in on the side of the building right by the side door.

Right. So on the day she goes missing, it's like in front of the building.

And there were witnesses that came forward that said they saw this like blue sedan.

And they all think it's like a different type of sedan.

And maybe there were people.

Maybe they weren't. Maybe it was a man.

Maybe it was a woman. Whatever.

Whoever it is, I think this blue car could be the key.

Do you know how hard I tried to find out what kind of car Rob drove at the time Patrice went missing?

I feel like that's why we're recording this episode today and not four days ago.

Yeah, but I can't. I don't know.

I mean, I honestly would like anyone in her life because one of the witnesses said no one said they saw a man matching Rob's description to be completely clear.

They see like a long hair.

One person says it's a man.

One person says it's a woman.

But it actually matches Patrice's description.

And then like an older woman, which they gave no explanation for who that older woman could possibly be.

I mean, again, maybe this car isn't related at all.

But I can't think of a scenario in my mind blue car totally aside where the position of her car makes a ton of sense.

Unless they liked whoever came had to come on foot, used her car to take her away somewhere and then came back and just dropped the car off.

But like why even bother in like a completely different area and setting?

Yeah, I just don't I can't think of a scenario that that makes a lot of sense.

Like I think some people had brought up like, oh, maybe she was in a hurry or maybe she was coming back.

And I'm like, I don't think there's a scenario where Patrice was driving.

Do you? No, I don't think so either.

It just seems completely unlikely for that to be the scenario.

But I mean, there's this is going to be a theme in like every single episode to be covered.

But like there's so many unanswered questions.

Yeah, it's hard to say yes or no either way, you know.

Yeah, so I don't know again unsolved mysteries.

We don't know why her car was parked there.

We don't know who was in the blue car if the blue car is relevant.

We have no idea what happened to her in those 13 minutes and beyond that day.

We have no suspects, no persons of interest, just a lot of unanswered questions.

Alright, episode three.

When I started, I knew nothing about this case.

You know, did I? And I did not see this coming.

Based on the title of the episode, I literally was expecting like some kind of crazy bloody massacre of an entire family.

Yeah, and like I don't do well with those sort of like spooky things.

So I was like, racing myself hardcore.

Yeah, so we like open in this cute little French town.

By the way, it mad hard to take notes when also reading subtitles.

And again, I knew like nothing going in and I'm like, again, this is like a whole family.

And then I'm like, oh my gosh, no, this is a straight up Robert Fisher situation except this dude couldn't even be bothered to spare the dogs.

And before he like up and left.

Yeah. So basically what we find out is the house just goes like quiet shutters are closed.

The family gets all these weird letters from from the parents who are like, hey, we're spies in the DEA.

So we're not going to be here anymore.

The kids schools all get letters that are like, hey, we're in Australia.

And they put a note on the door.

It's like, hey, just don't deliver mail.

We're not here right now, which buys so much time.

And police are coming back day after day because there's this nosy neighbor.

Thank God for nosy neighbors who was like, something's not right.

Something's not right.

So they finally discover the mom and her four kids and their two dogs buried underneath the house.

And it's almost like a crawl space kind of like underneath a porch or something is like the best way I can describe it.

If you have a scene for like Midwesterns, maybe like kind of like a Michigan basement, but even a little bit different because it's under a porch instead of the building.

Yeah, like, I mean, I would have to crawl in my hands and knees.

I think to like go under there like nobody, even if you were short, it's not you can just stand up and walk and go in.

But they find all five people and the dogs like wrapped in trash bags and buried in the ground.

But as they're uncovering all these bodies, guess whose body isn't there?

Dad. Dad. Yeah. And it becomes pretty clear, pretty quick that he's on his own.

And he had inherited this rifle from his father when his father passed away.

And we kind of learned that his whole facade of like who he was, who he put off to everyone, who his kids, like thought they were is all kind of a lot like he was almost in financial ruin and was going to be discovered, which is what we see so many times like over and over again.

And it's I understand like situations I dire, but God, why kill your family because of it?

I cannot get past it. And it's all like with these family and I leaders, it's all like the psychology of it, right?

Like it's they part of them things that they're saving their family this shame or something or it could really be, I mean, I think it's different for each person.

Some people think that they're saving family shame.

Some people it's all about their own shame and they don't want almost fixing the problem by making it disappear.

Yeah, like, okay, I don't have to answer to my family because my family isn't here anymore.

Right. One thing that I had a hard time picking up from the documentary is I really couldn't tell where his friends like stood on the matter because at the beginning of the episode, I feel like they spent a lot of time being like, I knew him, he couldn't have done this.

He had a bad back. There's no physically.

There's no way he could have like gone under that what we're calling a Michigan basement and buried them.

Like there's just no way.

But then they kind of waffle a bit.

Yeah, but like, but yeah, and then towards the end of the episode, like, you can tell it's a separate interview.

They're like, this is, I just can't believe it.

I this is so hard to believe so they almost have come to the realization that listen, this is real.

Right. And it's hard to argue with the evidence because he is seen after his family dies and you know, they finally realize what's going on.

He is seen on camera. He's using his credit card.

He's buying dinner. He's buying gas.

He's at a hotel. They catch him on hotel footage like parking and then just kind of like walking off into the vast open.

But I have to think that that was so planned.

I mean, in my opinion, it almost has to be.

And I think we talked about this even in, you know, Robert Fisher.

And like you said, a really good example is like, you don't just do this without knowing your next like three steps.

Yeah. And I, you know, they said it.

I think in the episode. And I think it's something we've talked about too.

And we did a little research on family and Iulators is that often family and Iulators will take their own life as well.

Or like in the case of Robert Fisher, like he went on the run, but he was like really trying to hide.

It literally felt like this guy was leaving bread crumbs almost.

Like I want you to know where I'm going, but, but he wasn't found.

So it was it like was it specifically to lead them down the wrong path.

Now what I found interesting is I was reading in Newsweek.

There was this question posed on Reddit.

And it said quote, a man in his 50s with supposedly a bad back moving for dead bodies worth of dead weight and two dogs outside.

Placing them in trash bags and burying them the way that he did is close to impossible to do alone.

Ever try moving a 50 pound bag of what leaves or grass into a trash bin.

And on top of that, he did it all over the course of a night minus one son.

End quote. So this kind of poses the question of was there another person.

Right. Like was he acting alone and like to answer this Reddit user's question.

I just had to move my 34 pound daughter from the floor to her bed in span of three feet at the age of 31.

Very difficult. Well, yeah, I mean, and again, you have four almost adult sized teenagers and some in their 20s.

And you aren't I mean not that I'm I'm sly by any mean, but you have a back injury like impossible.

Yeah. And so today to have it all done one night seems a little bit improbable to do alone.

But I also found in this same article.

So again, this is on Reddit take it with a grain of salt.

Apparently there are a few users that have been quote discussing alleged sightings of the deceased family members after the dates that they were believed to have been killed.

What? Yeah, so I'm going to continue to read so quote one person who claims to have found a French blog posted by Xavier's family speculates up to nine people saw and the wife alive after the date police said that she was killed.

Some of these people state they spoke to her and she was normal some say a bit agitated.

She was seen walking the dog after the fourth April and was also seen with Ann and Bertrand the two youngest kids end quote.

So okay, yeah, so I don't know in any of that means and I can't verify a French blog.

So again, Reddit grain of salt.

But was this some sort of like I don't even know what they're applying some sort of like family suicide packed or like or maybe the mom helped them or him or again, I don't know what this means.

It's just is saying that maybe the timeline isn't what we thought it was.

Maybe there is someone else whether that's a family member, whether that's an outside person.

Because one of the other things I can't get over is the fact that they said there was no blood.

How is every person killed execution style.

But there is no blood. Yeah, it just seems not only unlikely, but impossible.

In the same news week article that I had, I found it super interesting because they had said that specifically the bullets were found inside their bodies, meaning that they didn't like leave, but there wasn't exit wound.

So what that is suggesting is that the bullets would have had to like exit their skulls, but like hit something and bounce back in.

So in this article, they theorized, well, what if they were killed in a bathtub.

And that would explain like the no blood.

It would explain the exit wounds, but the bullets still being inside of them.

But what it doesn't explain to me, and I guess we don't know the levels of sleeping pills in their system, but it doesn't explain like this isn't you didn't just kill like one person or even two like little kids.

How do you get five adults in like I guess one of them was gone.

So four adults in a bathtub, presumably one at a time and not wake anyone up not startle anyone.

There's no I just little and again like coming back to the fact that this is like a crawl space Michigan basement situation.

The bathtub would have at least been on the main floor above that if not you know a second floor.

I don't remember the outlay of the building, but like again like you said one at a time in the bathtub bang take them down at least one flight of stairs in theory to this crawl space.

And then do it all over again with no one stopping you and even if you like even if you made it like again there's a silence or a guest, but even if you like kill them in the tub cleaned up the blood moved them out moved the next person in the tub like it's still.

I mean you can know blood and like no blood trail like if you shoot them in the tub.

Yes, like the majority of the blood is going to end up in the tub that you can rinse and clean out but like you have to move them then.

But yeah, you don't want to wait for them to like bleed out in there exactly it doesn't make any sense.

Again, unsolved mysteries like I don't we don't know that there's been no sightings of him no confirmed sightings one of the things I thought was super interesting was the fact that he told his one son he could go back to university and then he called him back.

So I had gone to this like training with this guy named Richard Walter who is like this world renowned crime assessment.

Oh my gosh, he is and I remember one thing specifically I learned from him about family annihilators and he said that often what you'll see is a family annihilator if they have a first born son they have a very hard time committing the act and they still will.

But like often you'll see that the more communication or more connection or more like information.

Well, I'm saying like not even that no just like the carnage is totally toned down so whereas they might totally like bludgeon their wife for their daughters or even younger sons like the amount of damage to the body specifically to the face you will see will be far far less because they see that first born son as like an image of them.

And so when I heard this whole thing I kind of wondered if he sent Thomas like off to university because he like was trying to spare him but then like after everything was done he realized he couldn't.

Right. Or even it was just like the one that he was dreading the most or he like you know never wanted Thomas to wake up or kind of putting it off.

Yeah. Yeah. So so crazy.

You know he's still on like Francis like most wanted men list no one has seen him no one knows where he could be people have talked about Latin America people have talked about Europe who only knows this guy could blend in anywhere he could be anyone.

Okay, so episode four is the death of Alonzo Brooks and basically on April 4th 2004 Alonzo goes to this farm party with some friends about 50 miles away from his home and garnered Kansas and like as a farm kid like I totally get exactly what kind of party this was.

It was in this abandoned house in this tiny town called Lacey in Kansas and he was one of the older guys there he was like 23 and on top of that he was also the only person of color which will come up later and he went to this party with one of his friends.

That friend went to get some supplies got lost and basically was like you know I'm going to go home just right home with one of our other friends and whatever.

But Alonzo never made it home after the party and the next morning his friends calls mom is like hey is so there which so is a nickname just like broke my heart because it's so cute I know.

Hey is so there and his mom was like well he should be she takes his room he's not there she takes the basement he's not there and then like this huge network of friends who were at the party who weren't at the party just people who knew Alonzo calling each other being like hey where is he have you seen him have you heard from him anything.

And there's nothing even people who are at the party after the friend who took Alonzo there like they were like well we thought he left before us we thought he was going to go home with someone else like no one actually knew like when or how Alonzo left this sort of barn party and that's like the thing that stood out to me the most is I was like crime junkie life where there's a reason this is a rule like you come together you leave together.

Because I understand like I you know I heard all of them say like you know I got stuck somewhere or I got lost or I was going to leave early and he said he had a ride and I get it like but once you get passed off so many times like no one is looking out for anyone at that point.

Right and I think we talk about this a little bit in some other episodes but you know that's kind of like at least to me like a girl code like you do not let your friend walk home by yourself you do not let your friend walk to her car by yourself and I feel like it's getting more prevalent now across the board.

Between like genders and stuff but like in 2004 like especially in Kansas in the middle of the Midwest like they're in the middle of nowhere and guys are tough guys like they don't need someone to make sure they're going to get home in like that's the person you're saying that's the perception that's a perception yeah like as someone who grew up in a similar area.

A little bit younger but with the same sort of like attitude of people like I totally get that like yeah it would be very surprising if like one of the guys I grew up with would be like are you going to text me when you get home to another guy like that would never happen in this time frame in this area in this mindset so I don't want to fall his friends too much because I think that's just where they were in that moment and based on this episode they've you know drastically changed their mindset and their feelings on that.

So they all kind of band together go back out to this house where they had this party and they start looking for him and they don't find him but on the property where the party was they found one of his boots and within walking distance across the street they found another boot that belonged him along with his hat and at this point you know Alonza's mom is like up to 11 she calls long for his parents.

She calls law enforcement she's like my son is missing what next like what can you do what do we need to do etc and they're like you need to wait like 48 hours like we've heard a million times and she's like I'm sorry you know I know I'm filing a missing persons report right now so you're going to take it and I love that about her she just fights from the very beginning and I like her.

She was she's like my favorite person 100% so law enforcement like goes out they search for him they bring out you know tracking dogs and helicopters and even really early on the FBI gets involved and there was even a dive team who went through a sort of creek that ran through the property and they find nothing and even a ton of people get interviewed but no one knows anything like people from the party.

I was just like I don't know and law enforcement is basically like well he must have just gotten drunk and started walking home but at this point we we know that so doesn't have any shoes because we found his shoes on the properties and on top of that he had recently messed up his ankle and had like a pretty significant limp and actually you know me I messed up my ankles constantly and I personally cannot imagine like all of that.

I'm not imagine like walking any considerable length of like I'm just going to go home 50 miles away on my bum and go without shoes.

No not happening no no like I can you've seen me I can barely make it through an airport sometimes.

So all that happened again like at the beginning of April it was like April 4th 2004 and this entire time his family is like you know can we help can we do anything in law enforcement is like no no we're fine like we're doing everything possible.

But finally on May 1st they're like okay fine you guys can go out and search this property but it's definitely more of like a we've already looked I don't know what you're going to find like we've been there we've been through everything like did they though well and that's the kind of the question is like in it might be in the documentary they're like yes like we pulled out all the stops to like make sure we checked everything but the family was like okay but you didn't find him.

But the thing is like his family finds him right off the bat and in the creek just like steps away from where the party was and so there's this whole debate on like how thorough was the law enforcement search like there were like dogs and helicopters and stuff.

And even law enforcement is like well like maybe he like fell into the creek and floated away or floated back.

I feel like I'm out of my element like clearly this is not my expertise I don't I've never conducted a search I've never found anyone right but I don't I understand the family's frustration because if I went there like again like you said steps away from where this thing happened and I find my son and you said you looked here the I'm not any less angry even if there is some explanation which I do not understand which I hope was explained to the family but it sounds like maybe it wasn't because they're still upset I get why they're upset 100% and obviously an autopsy is reformed and the Emmy can't really determine a clear cause of death there's no you know penetrating injuries based on not only the body but he was also completely close so like there's no like rips or tears and there's no bones fractures there's no evidence of drowning there's no water in his lungs or airways there's no evidence of gunshot wound like obviously strangulation is still a possibility well yeah but it is it's high-oid bone intact well and that's something like the Emmy said that there were no broken bones so I would assume that that would be included in that yeah but the decomposition of his body is severe enough to not let him go and he's not going to be a good guy the decomposition of his body is severe enough to not really be able to determine if there was like you know like bruise marks on his neck or anything like that that makes sense but I mean here's a thing like you said supposedly law enforcement was crawling all over this place and even the divers said like if he was here the water wasn't even that deep when we searched it like we would have found him very very quickly if he was here on top of that his personal effects are completely intact he had papers and like paper dollars in his wallet they weren't you know moldy they didn't even look like water locked and even the people who found him said that his body wasn't bloated like he had been in the water for almost 30 days at that point so so then we have to kind of assume that he was kept somewhere else which which would make sense like if law enforcement did the search they said if someone knew okay they're going to be coming in and searching so let's make sure there's nothing for them to find and what we've seen I mean this is not the first time I've seen this where a body is found in an exact place someone has searched because the perpetrator knows like hey they kind of already like check this area off the map so if I put a body here it's unlikely to be found or if it is found it's probably going to be a long time but they weren't counting on the family being sober letless right and I brought up that he was one of the only people of color at the party because there have been some rumors that maybe a white girl at the party had flirted with Lonzo and he flirted back and some of the guys at the party you know didn't like that took him out jumped him and and actually killed him and a lot of members of the Brooks family believed that Lonzo was the victim of a hate crime and even some of them have stated that while at the party he had been you know called derogatory terms and had even been told quote he wouldn't make it out alive and quote which again maybe this was hard for people to believe a few years ago but in the climate that we're living in now to me this isn't hard to believe at all I mean exactly literally here in our own state in Bloomington I don't know if you have read about this Brit but I have I have yet there there was a group of white guys who got into it with a person of color and they tried to lynch this person like in 2020 so we can't act like this stuff doesn't happen like people don't get mad and stupid and racist and mean and then it didn't happen 16 years ago you know if it's happening today we have to believe and have to know that it was happening 16 years ago 25 years ago 40 years ago 400 years ago as of March 2019 his case was officially closed by the Kansas Bureau of investigation with a statement that there was no evidence that Alonzo was a victim of a crime and there was no reason to continue the investigation which is bananas because like if you're saying he's not a victim of a crime then there you need to have like a logical explanation for how he died then tell me tell me how he died tell me how he wound up there if there was no foul play it's not fair to just say man we don't think so we're going to close it because we just have this like feeling right and as far as I could see his death certificate still says his cause and manner of death are both undetermined so if they're undetermined you can't rule anything how you know and but the thing is the FBI is currently offering a $100,000 who's in dollar award for information leading to the arrest and conviction of anyone involved with Alonzo's death and have officially federally reopened it thank God yeah so anyone with information is encouraged to call the FBI at 816-512-8200 or 816-474 tips or to even submit online at FBI.tips.gov and the family also has a Facebook group justice for Alonzo Brooks and there's actually an independent filmmaker working with the family on a documentary just about Alonzo called the mysterious death of Alonzo Brooks and I will link to both of those in our show notes.

Okay Ashley you gave me one of the UFO ones and you know that is like not my jam yeah I'm all about it.

So I watched it I watched it a couple times it's interesting but I'm just not I'm just like such a skeptic about these things I don't know so this is going to be quick because again like I'm not a huge fan or even like convinced about a lot of things when it comes to real I do realize you were not a believer.

I mean I will say like in the past couple of months I have become more accepting of the theories so this happened back on September 1st 1969 in Berkshire County Massachusetts and like not just in one area like across the entire county multiple people had potential interactions with UFOs.

The episode goes through like a handful of people by a handful I mean like a lot that I like had to race to write down you know some of them are driving and there's like a huge flash of light and then it's gone.

One was like a kid who was at a neighbor's house and felt like he needed to go home and he started running home and the neighbor like observed him running in place and then disappearing the kid remembers being on a ship with another person from the community the other person remembers being on the ship but doesn't remember seeing this other kid.

I just know what I thought was so interesting is of these accounts it seems like a lot of them involved kids because if I remember incorrectly and I didn't take notes because this was one of yours but I watched it twice.

If I remember correctly they mentioned something about kids like multiple kids being on the ship and I know that some adults had some kind of interactions or at least saw something but it seemed like it was very whatever had happened was very focused on kids.

And like if you could bend your mind for a minute and pretend you think aliens are real like what is it about kids that they're like going for it's just that they know something about our culture and like we wouldn't believe them I mean that's kind of like my only explanation is like or like maybe they know that their minds are more malleable at that age and like they that's what they want that's my yeah maybe they're more receptive on top of the fact that like if they were to experience this and tell someone who would believe them.

What are your thoughts on so again I want to believe it's real I kind of believe it's real what are your thoughts on it being the whole town in on a conspiracy theory because one of the things that's that to me is bananas is that like everyone in 69 just kind of assumed no one would believe them so no one talked about it the newspapers didn't even report on it's literally like it never happened and then like they could a small town get together and fake something like this.

Well here's a thing it's actually been like acknowledged as a historical event in this city since and one of the children one of the boys who is said to have experienced this phenomenon like even raised money with other people in the area to erect a monument commemorating the event it's since been torn down and he's like petitioning the city to like re erected.

But it's still technically on the books as like something that happened in this city as of right now now whether or not the people who lived in this town and like I say city when they talked about it reminded me of the town that I grew up in which was tiny like everyone knew everybody that's what I'm saying it reminded me like a little steaming king town exactly and like one person even said like if you usually got roast beef and got a chicken sandwich the next day like people would talk about it like it was very very small.

And everyone was connected.

I don't know it's just such a again like I'm such a skeptic I was probably not the right person to like recap this episode because I'm just like very very so I'm so unborn like I either need a big conspiracy in this whole tiny town is in on it to like make their town some kind of like tourist stop or whatever.

But honestly what I really want to be real is I want this to be real and I'm so down to believe they got abducted I just I'm unwilling to believe that we are the only life form out there we had earlier this year we already talked about it like the government was like hey yeah lots of UFOs we see well I was going to say I was going to say the only reason I'm giving this like 14 grains of salt instead of one is because of what like the department defense put out with the video you trust them of all people and they are the biggest liar I know but like this was a reenactment and that was supposed footage like I will give them like and like maybe maybe it was just a distraction from coronavirus I don't know but like someone higher up than a couple of people in Massachusetts said this happened and I don't know it's just a little bit more confirmation that like it could be possible.

I'm not saying it's real because again huge skeptic over here but it might not be fake aliens are totally real we can move on to the next one there we all.

Okay so the last episode that Netflix released is the disappearance of Lena Chapin.

This one was crazy yeah so it kind of starts out with you know her sister stopping by Lena and her boyfriend's house asking where Lena is and her boyfriend's like oh like she ran off with someone else and they're in Florida now.

And her sister's like okay but her son's here that's weird all of her stuff is here all of her pictures but she was like a huge like picture person all of that still here.

And she felt immediately not okay because not only was her son still left there but her son was actually with their mother Sandy and at that point like everyone was sketchy of Sandy and they were sketchy of Sandy because Lena was not the first person to just up and leave or disappear from Sandy's life.

Sandy had a husband who disappeared when the girls were younger and Gary was actually the brother of Sandy's second husband Albert.

Yeah it was so funny at the beginning of the series when her daughter was explaining you know she liked to go for men I can't remember what the first thing she said or the ones that have brothers and I was like that's oddly specific.

And then she married a brother and then his brother.

Yeah Albert was like this really laid back dad.

So laid back in fact that he couldn't even put away his boob for the interview with unsolvenistory.

I'm sorry I love Albert.

I loved him too he seemed like the sweetest the girls loved him but like he reminded me of my papa.

I would be lying if I said do that the entire time I was like the hell are just but your shirt but your shirt.

So Sandy leaves Albert for his brother Gary and Gary is a different kind of stepdad he's kind of more of a drill sergeant he's more structured he's he probably buttoned his shirt I don't know.

Oh we don't know Gary probably but no shirts.

But he like had the girls on like chore schedules and made sure that they were like you know kind of progressively like improving their life through like different experiences if you will.

And he would also be kind to them in the way that like if you complete your chores we can go get ice cream like there is like a reward for your hard work.

And I appreciate that honestly seems pretty legit but less than three years after Sandy married Gary she starts having a fair with his other guy Chris he's younger than both Sandy and Gary he's more well off and Gary's really hurt by this affair.

And on top of that he finds out that Sandy was actually passing bad checks under his name not cool but then Gary goes missing and he was reported on May 13th 1999 that he'd been missing for a couple of days and you know law enforcement comes out they check his place.

And Sandy and Lena actually show up at that time and you know law enforcement is like hey this is what we're here for.

And you know it was like oh yeah like I should probably have reported him missing they search the entire house find zero evidence of Gary even having ever been there.

Yeah he's like been like wiped from his own property basically yeah like there's none of his stuff none of his clothes nothing but there is a checkbook that belongs to this Chris guy.

And he actually moved into the house like days later and law enforcement you know ask Sandy to take a polygraph and she's like you know what if you find a body I'll take one.

That was the thing that's about to me the most and like of course that means there's a body to find exactly but of course what we end up learning like later in the series or in this episode is like she can only be that bold and brazen because she knows there will never be anything found.

And what is happening exactly and you know the police interview the kids and everyone is just kind of like I don't I don't know except for Lena she gets really defensive and you know she even told her sisters like not to talk about things not to say anything.

One of her sisters brandy remembers that when they got home school that day that Gary first went missing their mom was like hey you know I think I think the cat had kittens out in the field why don't you go look for them and they all go out and she was finally like I have chores to do I have to get stuff for my chores she goes in the house and she finds her mom like scrubbing what looks like diluted bleach off the floor.

And her mom said get out get out get out and that's it but Lena actually told Albert three button Albert that her mom had killed Gary she had used hay strings which I consider like a twine to tie him up in the bedroom and not only that that together she and her mom had burned Gary's body and she even says on the recording of the conversation like what was I supposed to do and how was like no I get it you are just a kid like I know for you now birdie so sweet you're taught at a young age to listen to your parents and you that's what you were doing like it's not an Albert I think your fault Albert has to realize what a scary person that her mother is 100% and who knows and I mean again as the series goes on we learn that this woman would honestly have no qualms with like taking out one of her kids if she felt like they were getting in the way so I mean I think it's again it's Gary's brother brother who you know but trade him slightly but like I love the compassion that he shows for her in that moment when he's just like listen you you had no choice I understand right and Lena was only you know 13 when Gary went missing and immediately after sandy lawyers up and actually gets Lena to retract her statement but you know she eventually tells her sister Brandy everything about how sandy killed Gary and brandy even brought it up to sandy and was like hey what's going on and sandy and Chris her new husband you know take Brandy out in the middle of field and threaten her life because of you know what she couldn't go claims to know about this for me this was one of the most like got ranging points in any of the episodes that I saw when brandy is literally talking about how her mother her own mother who she earlier told stories about her putting her to bed every night and being there every day is driving her out to a field where presumably her boyfriend is going to shoot her daughter I mean I know she talks about getting in the car and just like the only thing I can think to do is just a hold on to her because he can't kill us because being close to her was the only thing that would save my life and it wasn't immediate she even says like I oh my long to my mother for minutes I have no way she said don't shoot her I have no idea like how Brandy went on like because again they go home together and she knows from then on her mom is willing to kill her like how do you not walk on egg shells how do you live in that environment and grow up normal is I just want to like reach out and hug Brandy I basically like cannot even comprehend what that has to do to a person as if that wasn't like as jarring and as evidence as we could find for the potential guilt of sandy at one point time another one of leaner sisters Robin was posting missing persons flyers around town yes and it was later found out that sandy their mother was paying a younger sister like five dollars a poster yeah to take them down I could what kind of mother what's so interesting is I I felt like I knew nothing about this case coming in but something about that resonated with me so I don't know if I heard that in another story or if I had heard this story in passing at another time but I think that is so bananas and so outlandish like also if she's missing and you did something if you got rid of her in a way wouldn't you want to just keep the missing posters out there so people are looking for quote unquote her when you know where she is already and even if she doesn't know where she is like it also just a bad look all around like what is the missing persons posters have to do the only way a missing person poster works is if the person is actually walking around and someone's going to spot them if that's not the case with Lena why why what's the point of taking them down other than like other than like a power move right right so there was eventually a civil suit heard in the wrongful death of Gary against sandy and Chris but the taped confession that Lena gave wasn't admissible at all and the sisters as well as law enforcement really believe that Lena was aware of what happened to Gary and had maybe even helped sandy and Lena would not only put her mother in prison for the murder but sandy was also obsessed with Lena's son culture and once Lena was missing she petitioned the courts to grant custody of culture to herself because Lena had abandoned him and the courts were like well you know she's not here to defend herself so sounds about the night which is so bananas I mean it is as someone who has worked in and around family law it's not crazy but in this case it seems completely outlandish Sandy and Chris were found guilty of wrongful death in silver court in order to pay seven million dollars to Gary's daughters but there have never been any charges in the disappearance of Lena and based on the documentary Lena sisters seem to be completely estranged from their mother and continue to seek answers and justice or anything on the disappearance of their sister and they've even conducted searches on the property where sandy and Chris lived when Lena went missing but they've never found anything even using like ground penetrating radar with zero luck Sandy and Chris have divorced back in 2014 and she's remarried now but she still has custody of culture Lena's son and from what I could tell researching there are no updates on Lena's disappearance or whereabouts yeah this is one of those crazy cases that I think that I pray that unsolved mysteries brings a ton of attention to because I just can't believe that the case stands where it does it seems like there's so much it seems like it's so clear it's one of those cases where like we have a recording of somebody who say exactly what happened but like because of you know legal who polls were not allowed to use it it's just all so unfortunate and I hope this case really does get the attention it deserves because I again I don't think I had any clue about this case before unsolved mysteries and hopefully this puts a little bit of pressure on to get things moving in the case again because I mean they ended on such a strong note I feel like they really book ended this series with two cases that were just so unbelievable definitely and I'm really excited to see you know they're supposed to be 12 episodes and what I heard is they broke it into two segments so we should be getting episodes 7 through 12 some day TBD and something that was at the end of every episode which I'm sure you noticed Ashley was if anyone has any information on any of these cases they usually post something specific to the case but you can also go to unsolved dot com and submit your information there and hopefully we'll be back with more review stuff if you guys like it when the next episode drop and we'll see you then you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you

[Netflix '풀리지 않는 미스터리(Unsolved Mysteries)' 분석 및 범죄 전문 팟캐스트의 시선]-[AUDIO EXTRA: Unsolved Mysteries Part 1 & 2]

📋 Summary

넷플릭스 '풀리지 않는 미스터리'에 대한 범죄 전문 팟캐스트의 비평

1. 13분의 실종: 패트리스 엔드레스 사건

2. 가족 몰살범: 자비에 뒤퐁 드 리곤네스 사건

3. 알론조 브룩스의 의문사: 증오 범죄인가?

4. 레나 채핀의 실종과 어머니 샌디의 그림자

결론

🎯Key Sentences

📝Key Phrases

📖 Transcript