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Hello, everybody. Welcome back to the show.
Welcome back to the podcast.
New listeners, old listeners, wherever you are in the world, it is so great to have you here back for another episode as we, of course, break down the psychology of our 20s.
Before we get into this episode, a little disclaimer, if you couldn't already tell from my voice I am indeed a little bit sick with some mystery bug mystery illness but of course the show must go on I'm in Wyoming at the moment in the U .S.
visiting some friends and as an Aussie gal the cold weather does not agree with me one bit and I seriously feel like I landed spent like two hours in Wyoming and my body was like, we don't like this.
Let's bring up any dormant viruses that you may have and bring them all to the surface.
So if you can, please bear with me while I manage this cold virus, whatever it is, I would really, really appreciate it because I'm just really glad to share this episode with you.
It's one that I have wanted to do for a long time.
I feel like I say that a lot, but it's because I always have these ideas on the back burner.
Today I'm really happy to have you here for a very in -depth, dare I say, fun and fascinating episode on the difference between introverts and extroverts.
Or should I maybe say what you think the differences are, but which we may have been misled to believe by the oversimplification of human personality.
Extroversion and introversion seem to be this weird thing that divides society.
Who are the social butterflies?
Who are the hermits?
But it is so much more complex and nuanced than that.
You know, I consider myself an extrovert, but I don't really party.
I cancel plans probably way more than I should.
I feel tired a lot.
So maybe I'm an introvert.
you know there's all these like different ways of seeing it and I really want to explore what it actually means and you know I also have friends who are most certainly introverts who really need a lot of alone time but you know for the two hours that they're at the party like they are the life of the party
basically what I'm trying to say is that it's complicated and what I really want to do is break down the origin of this concept like historically in the psychology community what the research really tells us about each personality type and why that simple version that we probably all know is is incorrect
we're going to start at the very beginning and then explore how levels of extroversion and introversion have maybe even changed in recent years more specifically how it differs within individuals based on factors like gender and culture I also want to discuss the myth to do with so -called ambiverts
why do you feel that you might not be either an introvert or extrovert and is the term ambivert appropriate but ultimately what is it that makes us more like one than the other scientifically.
And I also want to finish out the conversation by talking about how we can accept the introverted or extroverted part of ourselves, especially in a world, you know, in a career, in a friendship, maybe even an environment where certain parts of being an introvert or being an extrovert don't feel accepted.
So there is a lot to cover if you are like me and really fascinated by you know just personality in general.
This is definitely the episode to open your eyes and give you some cool facts that you may not have known.
I hope you're ready.
I am definitely ready.
Without further ado I'm going to give you a short break from my sick voice and get into the episode.
Get into the psychological historical differences and perhaps similarities between introverts and extroverts.
Let's get into it. I want to get straight into it and talk about the major differences between introverts and extroverts some of which we're probably already familiar with some others of which you may not have heard of but before that we do need to know where this idea came from.
I feel like these terms introvert extrovert have become parts of our shared language now like they're parts of the psychobabble we throw them into conversations left right and center but i do think it's really important to also know how they came to be it's an important piece you know even if trivia if nothing
else so the person you really want to know about in order to explain these concepts is Carl Jung.
He is a legendary Swiss psychoanalyst and psychiatrist.
He is, he's famous.
He can be credited with more concepts than I think I could even count and extroversion and introvert is just one of them.
He basically saw these as central traits to each of our personalities and, you know, something that we could use to categorize people in society and categorize their personalities you were either high in introversion or high in extroversion something that a lot of us actually get wrong though is that you
have to be one or the other explicitly at all times not true according to Jung, we actually all have an extroverted and introverted side.
One is just more dominant more of the time.
And to be honest, you know, I have never actually met somebody who is entirely 100 % introverted or entirely extroverted.
You know, maybe the only example, like I was thinking about this and I was like no there must be someone the only example I can think of is like that philosopher who lived on an island by himself for 20 years I've completely forgotten his name if you know who it is leave a comment because it's it's
going to annoy me but you know perhaps the only people who we could accredit as being 100 % one over the other are people who are so -called hermits, people who are socially reclusive.
But again, that is very, very rare.
And, you know, it's not the case that you can only receive energy from ourselves or you can only receive energy from others.
Humans require different things, different sources of fuel, different sources of motivation and energy.
This here is actually the most important distinction between an extrovert and an introvert.
It rests on how we each prefer to gain energy or recharge.
Do we seek inspiration and stimulation from within ourselves or out in the world?
It's a spectrum that we all sit on and where we sit can actually change day to day but we do tend to lean more one way than the other.
Now people who sit right in the middle, they're known as ambiverts.
they have a perfect balance some would say of extroverted and introverted traits or desires it's actually important to note that this idea of an ambivert is actually a modern addition to the original theory so Jung he himself did not introduce that term he didn't believe that ambiverts existed so of course
he wouldn't have given it a name he really did say you are you You have both, but one is dominant, therefore no one is an ambivert because that would suggest a complete balance, a perfect unison or blend of them both.
Anyways, basically what makes you an introvert versus an extrovert depends on where you primarily seek gratification or stimulation.
So a primarily extroverted person seeks it from human interaction.
Hence this idea that they're quite talkative, they're social butterflies, they have many friends, they make plans, they're enthusiastic, they really thrive from the energy of others or in a group.
In contrast, people we would consider introverts derive gratification and peace from solo activities, from that alone time that they crave so much.
they're a bit more reserved, quiet, passive maybe.
If you're an introvert you may also find that if you have been around people for too long, for too many days in a row, you do get a bit irritated, you can't focus, you want to just kind of fade into the background and you can't wait to like get back to your room, get back to your space, get back to
a place where you can just be in your own company in comparison like an extrovert may never want the party to stop like they're the ones who were like okay like we finished the main event come hang out at my place like let's go watch a movie let's go out for another drink they're people who really need
multiple social touch points throughout the day so they need to see someone in the morning they need to have a call someone in the evening and you know they like to have a full social calendar and they will find that they feel less satisfied less purposeful less creative less fulfilled when they go
too many days without seeing people or really like having nourishing conversations or interactions some introverts though do have like um I don't know what the term is but like introverted pals let's call them that people who they can be around constantly and not feel the need to have a break from in order
to restore their energy normally it's another introvert right it's someone who you can do what we call parallel time with where you're like both sitting in the same room but you're doing different things but you enjoy like the physical presence that's a little caveat a little small addition to the introverted
nature some psychologists have suggested that introverts are people whose energy tends to expand through reflection and dwindle during interaction but active interaction so they can be around other people if it is not something that is going to cost them all their mental resources they can be silent
they can be thinking they can be introspecting now introversion is not the same thing as being anti -social or shy or even having social anxiety it's a common misconception but extroverts can be just as shy and just as socially anxious as your everyday introvert I am somebody again who was incredibly
extroverted in fact you know I was reminded of that fact very recently like I spent a few days in a row without seeing anyone and I did feel low I felt a significant dip in my mood but I also have my fair share of moments of feeling awkward um of feeling like I shouldn't go to this thing I don't know
anyone I'm not confident all the time because extroversion and social ability or perceived social acceptance are not the same thing this is a whole other facet of personality if we look at it another way an introvert can be the most confident self -assured person you know counter to what people may think
they just need more space in their day for themselves but you could put them in front of a big crowd in a big group and they would still feel at ease it's just that it's not their preferred way to seek validation gratification and energy again it's two different dimensions so continuing on with this history
lesson after Kaoyong first introduced this idea in a piece of writing almost 100 years ago it was then adopted by many others in the field many other psychologists and psychiatrists were like huh he might be right and they wrote papers finding things that were very very similar to what he was noting,
that we could identify people in this way.
And so extroversion slash introversion became what we now know as one of the defining personality traits that we use today.
Famously it is now part of what we call the big five.
Now we've spoken about the big five many times before and if you're a psychology student I'm sure you have heard of this before many many times so apologies for being boring but let's just consider this a refresher if you're new to the idea the big five is basically the attempt of psychologists to categorize
us as humans by categorizing our personalities it's basically the closest thing that we have to a formula for describing someone based on five core traits and where they sit on the spectrum of these traits so consider like five scales and you can sit you know in different positions on each of those
scales and where you sit on those different positions will end up giving you your personality type if you've ever done you know the Myers -Briggs test like you'll be very very familiar with this let's talk about the traits though the first one is openness to experiences so you can either be someone who is very
curious very creative is really accepting of new things is really hungering for new sensations maybe takes risks is happy with the discomfort of experiencing something new or you can be someone who is quite happy in the normalcy and happy in the comfort of their routine.
Next we have conscientiousness this is organization how efficient you are your general sense of responsibility you can be someone who we would call quite type a it was very efficient very organized very productive or you can be someone who kind of you know operates more by like the seat of their pants
is a little bit more on the go then we have extroversion which we've already talked about one side of the scale is extroversion the other one is introversion are you social are you are are you assertive?
Or are you more reserved?
You gain energy from reflection.
Then we have agreeableness.
This is compassion, respectfulness, trust in others, basically your ability to get along.
We all know there are people who like, they just start fires, they just create conflict.
And then there's another set of people who are very, I don't know what the word is, but they're just very easy to be around.
They don't really want to disagree.
It's not that they don't have opinions, but they'd know the time and place.
Like they're just an everybody person.
Then finally, we have neuroticism.
So this is probably the biggest area where we would talk about mental health.
It's a very slim part of it, but do you lean towards being quite anxious and depressed or um yeah quite neurotic is the term they used to use for it or are you someone who was not really afflicted by those things so individual personalities are thought to feature each of these like all of us sit somewhere on this scale
you can't be like zero in any of these like you sit somewhere so you can rate high in extroversion but low in openness to new experiences so you like the people you like, but you find it hard to open up to new friends.
You may also be low in extroversion, so you're an introvert, but high in agreeableness and low in neuroticism.
So you come off as really friendly and open, but that doesn't necessarily mean that you want to be around people all the time.
Basically, what I want you to conclude from the big five is that personality is bigger than introversion versus extroversion, and it's also most certainly bigger than the big five.
The big five is a great structure to explain how someone might react in a certain situation, why they are the way they are, but it doesn't include things like interests, specific hobbies, passions, our self -concept, our self -concept, how we think about ourselves.
That's actually a big flaw that people find with the big five.
It's that it doesn't really explain this.
It doesn't explain you know our perspective on ourselves it just explains how we may appear to others but personality you know it is also a requirement to describe personality that we reflect on our own emotional patterns our certain abilities our behaviors our likes our dislikes like the list goes
on and that's why I really warn people against thinking about themselves as either entirely introverted or entirely extroverted and more than that wrongly assuming that it defines who you are in its entirety because I promise it doesn't it's just one component.
So moving on from that I want to answer a specific question now that we have largely ignored for the first part of this episode what actually makes someone introverted versus extroverted like is it something that we just pop out of the womb being like is it like a weird harry potter sorting hat what makes
us who we are so there are a few explanations of course it's never straightforward in psychology the first is that it's largely but not entirely inherited so there's a huge genetic component and we can see that in twin studies in one series of twin studies conducted in 2020 researchers looked at more than 600
different genes and found that blueprint genetic blueprint contributed somewhere between 30 to 60 percent to whether you were extroverted or introverted.
So basically if you had an extroverted parent or you had an extroverted twin there was around a 30 to 60 percent chance that you would also be extroverted not introverted.
So that is like heritability.
What's the likelihood that if we took a million people, how many of them in the same circumstances would end up as extroverts?
How many of them would go the other way and end up as introverts?
Honestly, you know, if it's at the low end of like 30%, that's actually pretty minimal in my eyes, but you know, it's bigger than nothing and it still does point to the fact that who your parents are really does influence who you will be so the reason that genetics has an influence is because of how
genetics can influence how certain systems in our brain work so we all know that when we get a genetic blueprint that genetic blueprint influences a lot of things one of the things that it influences is cerebral or brain development and that's what makes the next two theories important.
A big theory is that whether you are an extrovert or an introvert comes down to arousal and we're not talking about sexual arousal but the extent to which our bodies and our minds are alert and ready to stimulation.
So this explanation was first proposed way back in the 1960s and basically it suggested that the brains of extroverts are chronically under aroused.
leading them to seek out stimulation from the environment.
Extroverts need to basically work harder to get themselves up to the level that others find normal and pleasant, hence why they really like novel social experiences.
They like being around people.
They may even be more boisterous and risk taking.
in contrast introverts already have a naturally lower threshold so it takes less for them to feel kind of overstimulated you know a really good book a movie night that provides just as much stimulation and fun to them as a club because they don't need as much to bring about enjoyment and too much stimulation actually
makes them quite overwhelmed whereas for extroverts sometimes the limit doesn't exist so really what this all comes down to this is a suggestion is our brains and their inner workings specifically the activity of neurotransmitters like dopamine serotonin adrenaline or norepinephrine now this theory
of arousal was presented almost 60 years ago.
And since then, we have obviously become a lot more advanced in our scientific technologies.
So we've been able to test what was once a bit of a wild guess.
Turns out it was a pretty good guess.
In 2005, researchers from the University of Amsterdam set out to test this theory, specifically by looking at whether extroversion versus introversion is really determined by how active our dopamine systems are now a lot of us think of dopamine as the happy chemical that's true but it's also responsible
for motivation learning concentration sociability so it's going to play a role in this personality trait they got a huge sample of people and they grouped them based on a simple personality test and then they got them to participate in a game of sorts where they had to place bets and they had to be
it was in like a social environment and they were either rewarded for their gamble or not here's what they saw the reward centers of the brain displayed a lot more activity when the individual was an extrovert they also paid attention to the game for longer they seemed more keen to keep engaging in the game
maybe because of that social element but all of this this whole experience they were receiving a more positive more rewarding reaction from it the introverts on the other hand or who the people who the scientists imagined were introverts based on this personality test they displayed a whole lot less
activity in those same areas suggesting that extroverts are the way they are because they just have a heightened sensitivity to reward, highly reactive dopamine systems, and they already receive a baseline of reward just from being around people that introverts don't get.
So it makes sense that these people would be happier in big social situations or taking social risks or even personal risks because of what happens deep in their brains.
That's one side of the coin, but it also comes down to environment specifically culture socialization how we were raised and that's one further piece of the puzzle that we were going to explore after this short break hello psychology of your 20s listeners if you're like me you love feeling confident
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This is My Legacy. Looking at the origin behind introversion and extroversion, specifically like the biological underpinnings, is one thing, but humans I don't think can be reduced to chemical messages in their brain.
I think doing so misses a really important part of the picture and that part we miss comes down to social influence and environment.
it seems that where you were born and where you grew up will also determine whether you are more extroverted versus introverted if you grew up within a culture that values outward social engagement and being outgoing and loud and very forward extroversion rates will seemingly be higher because more
people learn that this is what it's what is kind of expected of them they're also kind of raised to adapt to these environments.
They mimic the behaviors of those around them, so they may appear to be more extroverted.
Or when we compare that to quite reflective, peaceful societies where children are taught and raised to be quiet, to be reserved, to be introspective, we're definitely going to see a difference in overall rates.
Consider the difference, for example, between individuals from a country like Japan versus the United States.
Obviously, not everyone within those countries are going to be the same.
You know, no one group is completely homogenous.
But if we took the median of each, I would expect the US to be higher in extroversion and the Japanese people higher in introversion.
So the research shows that levels of extroversion seem to be divided by whether a country or a culture is actually individualistic or collectivist.
So individualistic cultures like the United States, they prioritize individual expression and outward displays of confidence that's linked to extroversion.
Collectivist cultures, on the other hand, they value harmony, they value group cohesion that might lead to more introverted behaviors you know i would love to see like at what point being removed from that culture and placed in the other one would maybe change who you are like if you grew up in the united
states until you were six and then you moved to a place like japan would that change who you are like would it have to be when you were three could it be you know as late as 15 it would just be very very cool like whether it would be a really great way to see whether it's something you're born with or something
that you learn like if there's a certain direction you're going that's then like completely turned around by primarily exposure to a different culture a long ramble apologies I'm just very interested in that like it'd be cool research project gender also influences us a whole lot because it impacts
how people choose to see us and how we are raised I feel like I don't have to do a whole revision or history lesson but you know there's this real sense that loudness in young girls is definitely policed it isn't seen as attractive whereas for young boys like it's totally acceptable they are raised
to be boisterous, loud, a lot more social.
So there are actually higher rates of introversion amongst women compared to men.
It also kind of brings me to a crucial question of this episode, maybe one that you are asking yourself at this point.
You know, if you were raised in a specific culture, if you were raised as a woman to be quite timid, to be quite shy, to be quite silent, can we change that the older we get is there an opportunity at some point to become more extroverted or is it forevermore a permanent part of our identity I think
from my research and also experiences it is really possible for us to obviously momentarily slip into an introverted or extroverted state if our environment requires it sometimes even for more than a moment obviously we were discussing before Jung's theory that actually it's just that one is more dominant
but you do still have introverted and extroverted parts and when it's appropriate that part of you might switch on I've heard stories from friends but also in case studies of people who after trauma especially a social kind of trauma they were extroverts and they become introverted they no longer get
the same energy we also see people who are quite introverted who enter a new environment perhaps a new workplace or a new relationship and become quite extroverted but if you do believe the psychology and the personality theories what they say is that you should always return back to the state that is natural
for you even when the trauma has hopefully been addressed even when you're in that workplace that demands this from you at some point your true nature is going to come out and you're going to return to what we call like emotional or I guess even social homeostasis.
I think beyond that though people do change as they get older and as their situation changes as well.
So yes it might be a momentary lapse into introversion or extroversion but over time if a situation demands it or if you just change as you grow you will see that you're skewing perhaps more towards the other direction you know consider someone who is really isolated in a retirement home maybe they
become more introverted out of necessity you know it's quite a sad example but in the state like it's harder for them to change their nature entirely so maybe this part of them just becomes more present it means that they are forced to be okay with being alone because of their situation and so maybe
some small part of them adapts to that what we what we're really wanting to discuss here is can we change our personality like that's the real key question of the hour and i actually have an interview coming out with someone in two weeks and it's this amazing author from the atlantic and she tried to
change her personality over the span of a year and she was really really diligent she enacted all of these lifestyle changes and habits and she did find like some great success so I'm not going to spoil that episode but yeah I do think that persistent intervention or major lifestyle events can permanently
shift you even though like there is a theory that you'll always come back I think depending on the magnitude of the event or how intense and diligent you are with your exercises to become more introverted or more extroverted I do think it can work but what I would ask is why would you want to you know
if I'm talking about this and you're really paying attention why is it that you feel like it's so necessary for you to change who you may fundamentally be if this is who you are and where your energy levels your socialization levels your stimulation levels naturally sit, what would push you to try and strongly
change that part of you?
I think I have an answer right?
I think it really does come down to the fact that it often feels like society is made for a very specific type or level of extrovert, not someone who is introverted and definitely not someone who is too extroverted and I actually received a message from a listener about this, which really inspired me
to do this topic where she was talking about how difficult it is to feel like you'll be successful when you are naturally quieter or naturally less assertive or naturally less interested in networking in a world where all our depictions of CEOs are quite brash, bold, loud leaders with big personalities
or, you know, every job in the spotlight seems to involve a great level of socializing.
you know, that doesn't look appealing if you are an introvert.
I will say, introverts aren't often in the spotlight because, you know, typically they're going to keep away from it because it's very exhausting.
That doesn't mean that they don't exist and that there isn't representation, recognition, great appreciation for the introverts in our society, even if they're not the front runners, even if they're not the people that are put on the main stage, they are still, there are still sorry, so many examples
of people who are incredibly successful.
Barack Obama famously has talked about how he is an introvert.
Albert Einstein was an introvert.
Bill Gates, introvert.
Steven Spielberg, also an introvert.
Eleanor Roosevelt was apparently quite introverted as well.
Warren Buffett, Marissa Meyer, she was the founder of Yahoo.
Like there are so many examples don't let you know modern media and our very individualistic depictions of success make it seem like you are either too quiet or too too loud to find what you really want i want to talk about how we can actually manage our natural state or our natural level of energy
and desire for socialization in a world that really favors extroversion and even better how to balance friendships and relationships when personalities differ how to network how to be socially active and do what's socially necessary without being you know drowned out by that constant like noise in your
brain and that constant like perhaps tiredness i think if you're an introvert and you're struggling with this the first thing i want you to do is really devote your energy to those and what matters most.
Try and figure out how many hours is your maximum amount for socializing before you become perhaps you know not someone who's that fun to be around you know someone who you don't really like.
When you start to hit a wall take notice.
How many hours have you been in this situation?
How many days in a row have you felt like you've needed to do things really trust your intuition and trust your body when it is asking for refueling time and almost figure out okay is it five hours a day that i can socialize is it two i'm going to use those hours as best as possible and not try and go
over them i think this obviously takes some trial and error but i've had people tell me how um keeping a journal for three weeks where they track hours around others, hours socializing versus their mood was very very helpful for them to identify their specific cutoff.
Basically you want to follow the very simple principle of make time for what matters and don't feel like you're selfish, don't feel guilty for saying you know I don't have space for this on my plate right now, especially when it's things that you know perhaps are a little bit unnecessary or perhaps
is leaning more into a people -pleasing territory where you're only doing it to make somebody else happy if you're only at the social event if you're only in the meeting that was voluntary because you think it's going to make someone else happy making yourself miserable is not going to make that person happy
like making yourself miserable as well is going to bite you in the tush so have strong boundaries around that know your limits i also think in terms of keeping up conversations or giving the appearance of meeting energy levels especially when you you know you put your wall but like there's no way out
here are some tips i use as like primarily as an extrovert that i think are a small lift in those situations so that you can still be present you don't feel like you're being rude but also maintain some sense of peace like when you don't want to be in that situation or when you do but you're you are like
getting quite tired firstly I would say ask people about themselves people love that a recent study I was reading said that most people spend the majority of their days thinking about themselves so if they can bring that to a conversation and talk about themselves even better like literally my secret
is just to be like why to everything they say but with a few more words like if you ask someone what their job is at a party and they say oh i'm an accountant sometimes that can really stump people because you're like you know what what do i talk about with that but you can ask the why question okay
why are they account why are they an accountant and then be like oh what made you want to do that and then say they say what it is and you know it's because my parents did that and blah blah blah blah oh and why did your parents inspire you so much why did maths seem like so much fun literally embody
a four -year -old who just has endless curiosity and ask why but just with a few more words and ask open questions smile nod make eye contact you don't have to do even half of the talking if you engage in active listening so it might save you a lot of energy resources and I promise you like someone will leave
that interaction with you and be like wow they were so interesting because they just found themselves interesting like that's the whole secret i will also say kind of on a different note but quality over quantity is something that i think we extroverts could learn to do better when it comes to saying
yes yes to friendships to plans and whatever it is and my introverted friends are definitely experts at this so if you found your balance keep doing it don't think that just because someone else's life looks different to yours that it's any better than yours that is a fallacy that we very much love
to lean into as humans we think everyone is happier than us just because they do it differently or just because they present as being happier not realizing that i think happiness is deeply individualistic and personal if you know that you're an introvert don't try and fit into an extrovert skin if you
know you're an extrovert don't try and shut yourself down to be more like an introvert because you think it's going to be more appealing to people both individuals are going to end up unhappy the thing is when we talk about extroverts and introverts at whatever point on the spectrum you sit in the moment
or across your life each of us contributes a perfect amount to humanity and each of us in whatever form we come I think is balanced by someone else out there who is hopefully being their most authentic self and who is you know filling the bit that we don't feel so if you're an extrovert you have your
introverted um balancing act like there's someone else in the world who provides what the world needs in an opposition to you basically like we need everyone you play a role even if you think that you're too much or you're too little i truly believe in like the harmony and the balance of this world
and maybe even the universe at large and this is one aspect of it a tiny tiny micro aspect of it but it's an important one you know I hate ending on something as cliche as like be yourself but this is so so true like I hope you take away from this episode how much value we each bring how we need extroverts
we need introverts whatever you are we need everyone to make the world go round so if you are questioning can I change myself can I be happier can I be more like that person please really contemplate whether being more like that person a person who you were not born to be is going to make you any happier
or whether really leaning in to the strengths of your introversion or the strengths of your extroversion, what it makes you amazing at, what it makes you so talented at, what it brings to society, whether that is actually going to make you happier.
Like a real sense of a stubbornness to yourself, a sense of surrender, a sense of complete acceptance.
I think that's all we have for this episode.
Thank you so much for bearing with my sick, gross voice for this many minutes.
I appreciate it if you've made it this far.
In the comments below, I want you to leave your Myers -Briggs or your big five personality kind of traits, whether you are an extrovert or an introvert.
I really want to hear whether people in my audience lean more one towards the other.
Maybe I'll even pop a poll down there because I would be very, very fascinated by that information.
I hope you learn more about yourself from this episode.
if you feel like there's someone else in your life who could get something out of this feel free to share it with them start a conversation share it to your Instagram story and see what people think it's also really a great way for me to reach new people and to hopefully build this community which we
always love make sure that you are following along you leave a five -star review only if you feel called to do so and you can also follow me on Instagram at that psychology podcast if you have questions queries qualms conundrums further comments or even episode suggestions my dms are always open and as
always until next time stay safe be kind be gentle to yourself and we will talk very very soon at david's bridal love is in every stitch from the initial sketch to the final details each style is designed with exquisite craftsmanship turn those prom dreams into reality with david's bridal every prom
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