This is an All Ears English podcast, episode 304, how to know if you have chemistry with someone.
Welcome to the All Ears English podcast downloaded more than 7 million times.
We believe in connection, not perfection.
With your American hosts Lindsay McMahon, the English adventurer, and Michelle Kaplan, the New York radio girl, coming to you from Boston and New York City, USA.
Today our dating consultant, Jessica Coyle, is back and we'll talk about two different types of chemistry in urban US dating experiences.
Today we have a special guest on the show.
Jessica Coyle is back as our dating consultant at All Ears English.
She is based in New York City and she writes a blog called hopefuldisasters.wordpress.com.
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Hey, Jessica, welcome back to our show.
You are our dating consultant here at All Ears English, and we're happy to have you back.
How have you been?
I've been very well, Lindsay.
How have you been?
I've been good.
I've been good.
And you're back today to talk to us about dating and this concept, this very interesting concept that we hear around the dating world in the US the concept of chemistry and what it actually is and why it matters so much in Western dating.
Yeah, chemistry is such an interesting concept because it's something that I don't even know if it existed for people in the same way a century ago.
I was having a conversation with my students recently and we were talking about how, in some of their countries, arranged marriage is still very common, or if not common, then matchmakers are still very common.
And it's just this thought of This is the number one thing for so many of us, but is it even really objectively important?
Right.
And it'll be really interesting to see what our listeners have to say today, because I think that in different parts of the world, chemistry is either an afterthought or it's not even considered at all.
Right.
So first of all, we'd like to invite you guys to come back to allearsenglishcom, slash 304, and let us know what chemistry is to you, or if you even consider chemistry on a first date or when you think about getting serious about someone in your dating life.
So let's start out with how would you define chemistry, Lindsay?
Oh my God, it's so hard, right?
But it's a certain magnetic pull between two people where you feel like Something inside your heart is kind of understanding the other person.
That sounds so deep, right?
But that's my experience of chemistry.
It's something unique about that person.
And it's hard to put your finger on it, but there's something different about that person to you.
I was doing a lot of thinking about this recently because I find myself going out on dates with Men where it's really nice, it's pleasant, it's a lovely conversation, but I just don't want to see them again because there's not that pull that you mentioned.
There's not that feeling that, oh my gosh, I can't wait to see this person again, or I can't wait to hear this person's opinion about this.
Yeah.
And I think that's why dating is just not something I mean.
To some extent we have to have our head involved.
Right.
We have to be logical and we have to be smart.
But if we have a list of of things that this person has, a resume, for example, the person's an attorney or a doctor or whatever.
All of this stuff really doesn't matter if you're talking about chemistry, because their career doesn't necessarily create chemistry between the two people.
So it really is such a tricky concept.
Yeah, it's one of those things where it might influence you.
You might be tempted to think, oh my gosh, the next guy I have is going to have to have a good job.
I can't stand this kind of person who I have to pay for all the time.
But then it's just...
You might find yourself going on date after date with a financial analyst, and then it just doesn't matter, because every conversation is horrible.
Exactly.
So it's something that goes beyond career, even sometimes goes beyond just intelligence.
For me, it's really about the heart.
It's about the heart.
And it's hard to explain.
So we talked about two different kinds of chemistry, right, Jessica?
Yeah, we talked about the slow burn chemistry, which is where you kind of like someone, you think maybe you could be friends.
I don't know if I'm attracted or not.
And then the instant chemistry.
Okay, so let's go into each one and what that actually feels like.
And maybe our listeners will have something to say about this too.
So in terms of the slow burn, in your experience, how slow can it actually be?
I mean, are we talking about becoming friends with someone for years and then chemistry, developing gradually a couple of experiences with this?
My first significant boyfriend, I remember thinking, can I be attracted to this person?
I would stare at him, which sounds creepy, but I would stare at him when we were with mutual friends, because we started as friends.
I would think, oh my gosh, his teeth are weird.
He has an odd profile.
His hands are spidery, all these like physical things that weren't attractive to me.
But as we became friends, as he made me laugh, as the conversations were fun, those things kind of faded in the background.
And I started really being attracted to him, which would never have happened on, like online dating or kind of a setup or anything, because you just don't have the time.
Right.
And I would say also, sometimes those things like the spidery hands or the strange profile can become quirks that actually become attractive in your mind.
I don't know if that happened to you for him, but for me in my dating life I might pick out something in someone's face that seems strange, or the way they walk.
It seems kind of funny.
But then as I start to kind of develop a sense of chemistry and start to fall in love with them, I find those things just to be endearing quirks.
Oh, yeah, definitely.
Like I this.
This particular person also had a beard that could be described as Amish or Abraham Lincoln like.
Yeah.
And I and I never really came to love it.
I always found it. a bit obnoxiously bougie, but I did come to find it quite cute on him.
And that's, I would never have said that I was a beard person, but it really, yeah, you're right.
It does become attractive.
Okay.
And I know a lot of great relationships that actually start this way as a slow burn chemistry.
You know people start as friends or just getting to know each other.
Feeling a little bit lukewarm, right.
That's another great vocabulary word for our listeners today.
Lukewarm.
What does that mean, Jessica?
Like a cup of water that you leave out overnight.
It's the same temperature, so you kind of feel, eh.
He's all right.
She's all right.
I don't know.
But then you like spending time with them.
And that's that pull.
That's the magnetic pull of it doesn't matter what they look like.
You find yourself wanting to spend time with that person regardless of attraction.
Yeah, I actually think that in the long run, this could build a stronger relationship.
Then the second type of chemistry, although of course it depends on the couple.
But the second type of chemistry we called it kind of a quick chemistry or I would say even like a limerence right.
And how would you define that?
Yeah.
Kind of like infatuation, right?
Limerence to me is infatuation.
It's when we think we're in love, but we're actually infatuated with someone because we don't really know the person.
Yeah, that's definitely the kind that I think online dating and setups tend to reward.
And it can work or it can't work.
I mean, I have an example of this one.
My...
Probably my first successful online date was with a guy and we met for brunch and it turned out to be an entire day date.
We met, we had so much fun that we went and played putt-putt.
That led to dinner, that led to a party with mutual friends, and it was so instantaneous and such a kismetic attraction.
It didn't end well.
So it can be bad.
It didn't end well.
Okay.
Yeah.
Right.
So there was, so was that a mutual attraction between the two of you then?
Very much.
Okay.
And, you know, my most recent boyfriend was the same thing and we ended up dating for four months.
And so, and it didn't end for the same kinds of reasons.
It wasn't as like wild as the first one.
So it can work.
I definitely think it can work, but that's it.
You're right, it's less stable.
Yeah, i think we have to kind of pace ourselves a little bit and it's hard to, you know, if we feel that intensity with someone immediately, it's quite hard to slow down right and Yeah, but it can burn out quickly if we're not careful.
Yep, and it can be off-putting.
Even if the other person feels it, we do have to keep ourselves in check.
My most recent boyfriend.
One of the things he said when we were breaking up was you know, I didn't want to be all that serious and then suddenly we were a couple.
It wasn't exclusively on my end.
He was equal parts in becoming a couple.
But it was because we'd been so enthusiastic and so excited and so attracted to each other that it kind of went too fast.
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Yeah, yeah.
And this is where the dating advice, the famous dating advice, comes into play, where a lot of people say you should try to be careful about when you sleep with someone for the first time, right?
Yep.
And everyone kind of falls on different sides of that perspective, but...
Sometimes it can be a good idea to kind of wait until you really get to know the person, to make sure it's something that's kind of got some staying power, I suppose.
Yep.
I mean, and that can be dangerous too, because as soon as you start sleeping with someone, it gets a lot.
It gets pretty serious pretty fast.
If you're me anyway, I'm not going to be sleeping with a guy if it's not serious.
Right.
Well, we know that chemicals get released in our brain, right?
We know that there are certain things that are out of our control that really, when we are sleeping with someone, can bring us very close to them, feel emotionally attached, especially for women, more so than men, I think, although some men would probably not like that statement.
I don't know.
I can't.
I know that there's dopamine released.
And I think more for women, it's oxytocin.
And I think it is more for women.
So there is a more immediate physical connection with someone once you have sex.
Yeah.
So we really do have to be careful.
Absolutely.
So I'm curious about our listeners.
Like I want to know what our listeners think about, for example, on a first date.
Like what are the criteria that our listeners consider when they think about going on a second or a third date?
I mean, have you talked to any of your students, Jessica, about this?
Like what goes through their mind and what are some of the deal breakers?
Well, it's so different with different cultures.
It's really tough to say.
When we were speaking earlier, I was talking about a good friend of mine in Korea who actually broke off an engagement once her fiancé met the parents because the parents didn't approve.
He didn't have a good enough job.
He hadn't gone to a good enough university.
And what surprised me was that she wasn't bitter about that.
She wasn't angry at her parents.
She just said, oh, you know, they didn't like him, so I didn't want to marry him.
Because I think for part of her culture...
Parents are a deal breaker.
Like for me, it might be a deal breaker.
If you are misogynistic or if you have no interest in travel or culture, that would be a deal breaker.
But for her parents were a deal breaker, and that was her personal deal breaker, not just society's deal breaker.
So it didn't bother her.
Yeah.
Parents and education.
I mean yeah, I know in many parts of the world.
For example, I have a friend who's from India and he's I know that the family is a family of the woman that he's going to be marrying in May.
That's a huge deal for his family.
Right.
So it sounds like from what I've learned from him, it's really about the families getting married.
As much as it is about the couple.
So it really has to be, you know, the family has to be approved on both sides.
And that's a huge deal.
I wonder what some of the other things are.
So job, career, the family, right?
Yes.
I mean, everybody should have not too long but a list of your deal breakers and know what they are, so that you can cut things off fast, you know.
I recently was about to meet up with a guy on OkCupid and I saw on his profile that he was only interested in women aged 23 to 30.
And that, for me, is a deal-breaker because he was 33.
And I called him out on this, and I said, why are you trying to date women who are younger than you?
And he responded very quickly lewdly, with a very sexual comment and I was like, oh well, my red flag exists for a reason.
That's interesting.
That's interesting.
I mean.
One of mine is very simple, although it's not the only red flag, but one of my priorities is the person.
It's probably number one.
The person has to be kind.
It's very basic, but actually unfortunately, for a lot of the people that I encounter, it's not the case.
It's not a huge value of theirs, right?
It needs to be a central value to this person that they're just kind, like they walk through the world in a kind way.
Well, and that's one of those things where if you notice it early, you can save yourself some grief.
You know I, I'm I famously don't always pay attention to red flags, and it's You can.
As soon as their relationship ends, you can look back and the field looks like a bloody massacre for all the red flags that are out there.
Oh, this is so funny.
So let's just kind of go back to some of the vocabulary words that we kind of threw out today in our conversation, Jessica.
So we talked about limerence, right?
This concept.
I don't know if you talk about this on your blog.
You must.
Right.
Oh, about attraction.
Oh, yes, I sure do.
And like the instant because it's for me, it's so it's so rare to happen so rarely.
So it's yeah, I do talk about that.
I'm actually in my upcoming blog post, which I'm sure will be posted by the time this goes out.
I'll talk about chemistry and feeling that instant feeling.
Good.
The limerence.
Yeah.
And at the end, you should be sure to let us know how to find that particular blog post.
We're looking forward to hearing that at the end.
Okay.
Yeah, actually.
And then we talked about lukewarm feelings, right?
When our feelings are kind of not hot and not cold, but somewhere in between.
We also mentioned slow burn, which is kind of a similar feeling.
Absolutely.
The slow burn chemistry, something that gradually increases, but it's not that intense.
Then we talked about quirks, right?
The quirks that, for example, the spider hand, that could be considered a quirk.
Or the way someone I don't know smiles with a, with a curve in their lip or something.
Abnormality.
Personality quirks and physical quirks exist for sure.
Absolutely.
And if we're in love with someone or if we're feeling chemistry, we can really start to fall in love with those little things about them, when everyone else thinks that those things are just kind of a turnoff or kind of silly or funny looking.
And then we had also mentioned deal breakers and red flags.
Oh, yeah.
Big, super common language in urban U.S. dating culture.
Right.
Red flags.
I think that's pretty self-explanatory.
The things that are big turnoffs and things that tell us to stop and not move forward with someone and deal breaker would be the same thing.
Right.
I think a deal breaker would be a little bit more like.
Maybe a red flag you can still go forward, but you're nervous.
But a deal breaker you're not even going to go for it at all.
That's it.
That's it.
It breaks the deal, so it stops movement forward with someone.
Yeah, I like it.
Well, this has been great.
I feel like we've thrown out a lot of awesome vocabulary words and we've talked about two different kinds of chemistry and, most importantly,
We've kind of given our listeners a sense of what we look for, at least here in urban US dating culture in the Northeast in terms of this concept of chemistry.
It's so hard to kind of define it, but we know it when we feel it, right?
Absolutely.
And I hope that your listeners find it as well and that they...
Reach out and say hi.
I know that some of your listeners have come to see my blog, and I'd love to hear from you guys as well.
If you're reading,
Please do.
Yeah, yeah.
Can you let us know one more time how to find you online?
If you just do a Google search for Hopeful Disasters, you'll find me.
Or on Facebook.
I'm on Facebook as well as Hopeful Disasters.
Or you can go to HopefulDisasters.wordpress.com.
Awesome.
So guys, we want to encourage you to check out Jessica's blog, because this is a great way to practice your English and not focus so much on grammar and vocabulary, but go read about a topic that actually interests you, and read about it from a great writer like Jessica.
Thank you.
So excellent.
Thanks for joining us today, Jessica.
This has been interesting.
Good luck and happy dating, Lindsay.
All right.
Take care.
You too.
Good luck.
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