Get people who are smarter than yourself, get the right people and always pay them, and then let them do their thing.
If I had to hit that deal in 1979, it'd be over a billion dollars.
So that's the one that, you talking about one that got away?
Oh, man, I'm sure.
That's the one.
Don't be afraid to partner.
We got to get rid of that myth. that you gotta be the only one.
It's okay to collaborate.
That's right.
What's the next growth opportunity for me and my company, right?
Because we want to continue to evolve, grow, and think outside the box.
Magic Johnson went from five NBA championships to building a billion-dollar empire.
His business education started early, working with Michael Ovitz at CAA and involved into a portfolio that now includes the Dodgers, the Commanders, LAFC and businesses across real estate insurance, infrastructure and technology.
Along the way, he found his way into venture capital and into a relationship with us here at A16Z.
So today we're talking with Magic about how that happened, what drew him to venture as an asset class and how he thinks about tech investing differently from the rest of his portfolio.
Let's jump in.
Magic.
Hey, Chris.
Good to see you, man.
Good to see you.
It's a pleasure.
I'm glad you're able to come through today, man.
Well, thank you, man.
It's all the great things that you and I have been doing for these years.
Years.
And now we get a chance to sit down.
I think this is important for a lot of people and a lot of different reasons, too.
Absolutely.
Look, I think that you know, like you said, this is a culmination, I think, almost 10 years, from investments to conversations, to having you come up to San Francisco talking about venture, expanding the portfolio.
And we wanted really just to take the time today, because you are one of the ultimate dealmakers businessmen entrepreneurs, and that's also the same ecosystem that we have here at A16Z.
And I felt like there was no better way to have a conversation that bridged both worlds than to have you come on today.
So I appreciate you.
Again, thank you because you brought me in though.
You know, I think a lot of times, Somebody has to pull your coattail.
Somebody has to make sure that you can see deals or you can see opportunities.
And I want to thank you for 10 years of making sure that I've had a chance to see these great opportunities that I have a chance to invest in.
So again, you being in there, being an executive, being a deal maker yourself, and then bringing in so many different artists and athletes.
Absolutely.
Who now can say they're businessmen or businesswomen because of you.
Well, I might have played a big part on the investment side in terms of getting people into Silicon Valley and understanding the benefits of equity versus endorsements.
But you were the one that actually pioneered, you know, getting into business itself.
And a funny story that actually inspired me, and I think that we have one tie-in from the very beginning, and that's actually one of my first mentors when I first got into Silicon Valley, and that was actually Michael Ovitz.
Yeah.
And so I don't know if you know that, but the firm was actually built off of CAA's model and Ovitz was on the board of Mark and Ben's company.
And so that's where they originally got the idea for A16Z and having a service-based model.
And so when I first got the job and started working at the firm, I got a chance to meet Mike and my position was actually it was a code word, it was called mini Ovitz.
Yeah.
And so I was like, I don't know.
Ben was like, we can't call you many of it.
So we got to, and this is never, no one knows about this.
So it's like, we got to figure out a very specific strategy.
And the funny story is that he told me he was like look Chris first sitting down, and I came from the entertainment industry as well too.
And so I needed a gap in order to understand how to think about things.
And he was like, you need to first order a business.
I need you to have a breakfast, lunch, and dinner meeting every single day for a year.
And then come back to me and let me know what you learned.
I was like, this is the craziest idea that I've ever, like, why are you telling me this?
But then, after going through that journey and understanding how to build a network and understanding how he thought about things was really important.
But I say that because he also first talked to you when you were thinking about getting into the game.
Right.
And sitting down and having that same conversation.
So I don't know if you could just go flashback, because obviously he's always on to something.
He knows how to pick the talent.
That's right.
Just to share that story with everybody.
I think that'd be super fun.
Yeah, I told Dr. Jerry Buss, the owner of the Lakers, that I wanted to become a businessman.
He became my first mentor.
But then he told me, listen, you need to meet a guy named Michael O.
Yeah.
The king deal maker.
Of course, of course.
In Los Angeles and in the country, right?
Yeah.
And so...
I said okay.
So I reached out to Michael Ovitz and I said hey, I would like to take a meeting with you because I want to become a businessman after my playing career is over.
And he said, all right, come on in.
So, Chris, I get there, and I think the meeting was around 2 o'clock.
Of course, I'm early for everything.
So I got there about 1, and I'm sitting in the lobby.
It's 3 o'clock.
It's 4 o'clock.
And now finally it's five, so the assistant come out and get me.
And I go into his office and he shakes my hand.
And the first thing he says, you know, I don't know about representing you.
Athletes, they spend more money than they make.
I don't know if you're serious.
I don't know if you have what it takes to become a businessman.
I represent everybody in Hollywood.
I got all the producers, the directors, the actors, actresses, the writers.
He said, you know what?
Nice meeting you.
And he threw me out.
You're like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.
What?
I came here for a five-minute meeting.
I thought I was going to get something done.
I had a pain in my pocket.
And so a couple weeks later, he calls back.
And he says, I checked you out.
And Dr. Buss told me that you were serious.
And he says, okay, come back.
So I came back, and he had a stack of magazines.
And he said, here, you read these, and I'm going to give you a test.
And if you pass the test, after reading all these magazines, then I'll think about representing you.
So, of course, I went back and read.
That same day, I read them all, right?
Yeah.
Right.
And then whenever he called me a couple weeks later, I went back.
He did the test.
I passed the test.
And he said, I see you're serious about becoming a businessman.
So he took me all around town.
Yep.
Meeting everybody.
We met for lunch a lot.
He loved meeting at his favorite restaurant.
And this is, he taught me so much, not just about business.
Yes, the art of it.
Deal-making and also making sure you have a long and big Rolodex.
Yep.
And you might not need the people today, but you may need them tomorrow.
And so what he did, I remember we'd go to his favorite restaurant.
That's when Morton's was the place to be.
And he had the table.
He had the one table.
The table in the middle.
So he says, watch what happens when I sit down.
So he sits down.
We sit down.
And after two minutes, everybody came and kissed the ring.
They came over to him.
Hey, Michael.
And so as he was talking to him, he would always introduce me to him.
Yep.
Everybody that came over, he would always also make the introduction to me.
And Chris...
About six months later, I'm meeting all these CEOs of companies through Michael.
And so then here comes the Pepsi deal.
Yep.
When I became a franchisee of Pepsi, he put Earl Graves and I together.
And man, that took off.
Here comes Starbucks, all these things.
Yep.
Because he was right in the middle of everything.
And then the last thing he did he reworked my contract to make me one of the highest paid in the NBA.
But he did it.
And then I said, well, how much I owe you?
He said, I don't want nothing from you.
Yeah.
That's who Michael Ovitz is.
Exactly.
Right.
And so I wouldn't be where I am today without Michael Ovitz.
About everything that he did for me making me smarter, made me understand business, made me understand deal making.
Also, make sure that you go in and you ask questions and you really get the knowledge.
He was big on making sure you had the knowledge, right?
Being an expert at not only deal making but also understanding the deal, also understanding the sector, whatever you're getting involved in.
Well, I mean, because even on our business, there's three different sides.
First, you have to be able to see the deal and say, and then, okay, the deal that comes in.
Then after that, the next stage is saying, okay, I actually want to make that investment.
But the third stage is actually the most important stage, which is winning the deal.
And that's kind of like how you're talking about in terms of being able to identify those right opportunities and then being able to then execute and do a right deal on top of that.
Execution, execution, and more execution.
Yeah, yeah.
That's interesting because I mean, when we look at kind of doing deals and thinking about opportunities, a lot of it really does come down to relationships.
And so how do you think about your network and how that's kind of cultivated into your the relationships and the deals that you have been, because oftentimes in venture it's a very long-term game.
You're not just thinking about just doing the deal immediately.
There's a lot of steps and process that come into it and you have to give first in order to have these things happen.
And so How has relationships and the EQ of the business really kind of became?
It seems like that's a superpower for you that allows you to have these opportunities come your way.
Yeah, you're right, because...
I build a fabulous relationship, when you think about, with Ron Burkle and Yucaipa and we did the equity deal, the private equity deal we had.
We did some amazing, we bought some amazing companies.
But I knew Ron for 10 years before we actually did a deal together.
Yep, yep, yep.
When I think about Starbucks and you know really understanding when you think about customer service.
That's what really.
It taught me everything I needed to know about customer service, you know.
And so having a great partner And going into Starbucks stores and really understanding the business side of it.
And, you know, a cup only cost— you know, less than 10 cents or 15 cents at that time.
And then the sugar, the beans.
And it all started to add up.
And so your margins were incredible when it came to that, you know.
And so I've been blessed to create not only great partnerships, but also having these people as friends as well, you know.
And so then I just carry that on to all the other things.
Mark Walters today.
Yep.
You know, Peter Gruber, you know, all these guys who I'm in business with.
But Dr. Jerry Buss treated me like I was his son.
And I think that when I think about our relationship and him opening up the door for all these other people, for me to meet them and them to become my partners,
So I really look at it like When you come into business with these people, you have to play your role and do your part.
As I tell them, what role do you want me to play in this partnership?
So I'm going to over-deliver to you and to the company and to this partnership.
It's like a team.
That's right.
Yeah.
That's right.
And instead of me being the point guard and the leader like I'm normally.
Exactly.
You know, hoax.
Tell me what you need.
Now I'm playing a role player in business with these men.
Yes.
And it's okay, you know.
And so I am happy about that.
And...
These partnerships have been huge and lucrative, but I learned so much from each individual.
And so they taught me so much.
And I was like a sponge.
I wanted to get up under them and learn a lot.
I think one of the things that you can be a sponge of is not just one specific industry, but multiple different verticals, right?
So you said, from food and beverage to hospitality, to now the insurance business, and now you know, sports media entertainment.
There's so many different variables, but all kind of having that one consistent vehicle or mindset in terms of service and really over-delivering is important.
Yeah, I think you're right.
And so...
Sometimes people want to be in one industry.
And I think for me, that was never my mindset.
And so, And then there was nothing sexy about anything that I invested in.
Yeah, no, but that's where it is.
Foreign businesses, that's a secret.
That's a secret right there.
Everybody wants to find the hottest company.
Yes.
And sometimes that might be—it might go up, and then next thing you know, it could be a trend.
You're absolutely right, Chris.
You're absolutely right.
And it's more of those— that fail, or like go start up and then go down, yep and so, but the ones that are boring and people don't know about or care about.
Those are the ones who are on a consistent, making money or going up.
You have growth, yeah and uh so uh, that's where i want to be absolutely, And so you've done a great job, and I want to say this while it's on top of my mind of teaching these entertainers and athletes long-term investing.
You know, it doesn't come immediately.
You invest it to the fund.
They're like, call you back 18 months later.
Hey, I need this back.
I got to go out this weekend.
No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
It doesn't happen like that.
Yeah, hold on a second.
But thank you for that, because they learned a lot from you and the deal-making expertise that you have.
And so, yeah, it's... Thank you for that.
I appreciate it.
No, no.
It's building your network.
It's building, like we talked about your Rolodex, and then it's going to lunches and breakfasts and dinners that you probably don't want to go to, but you should be there.
And because those places are where the dealmakers are.
Absolutely.
Those places are where the billionaires are, the multi-millionaires are.
And so...
I learned that early on.
And so when I got invited, I went.
And then I went early.
Ovis said, go early because all the richest people.
Exactly.
They know about their time, right?
Exactly.
They ain't trying to hang out.
No, they're not trying to hang out.
They come early and they want to leave early.
Absolutely.
And you'll get that quality time with them if you go early.
See, that's a gem right there.
See, early is to be on time.
That's right.
That's right.
Absolutely.
Not CP time.
No, no, no.
Oh, you don't get nothing for that.
Exactly, exactly, exactly.
No, but I think that you know even how we it's a lot of the soft skills that really kind of you know really lead into these real investment opportunities and being in the room and having the right time.
And so, like I'm curious when I mean when we first met.
We met in Silicon Valley when we were doing the Skydio deal.
That's right.
I think it was the Series A at the time.
What was that interest in?
Because you were, that was almost 10 years ago.
What was the interest when you were thinking about expanding your business portfolio to get into startups?
Okay.
And to think about why Silicon Valley was an interesting opportunity to explore when nobody else was really, you know, literally one of the first people that we did a co-investment with.
That gave me the idea to realize, oh my goodness, like this is a huge opportunity not just for our portfolio companies to have access to someone like you and your network and the relationships that you have, but also for the portfolio companies to learn from you.
And you know I called it like share genius, where you have the best of both worlds really just coming together and you getting a chance to talk to the CEO, and how that's kind of conspired.
But what was your original interest in terms of like – thinking that this was actually something that you should be exploring?
Well, first of all, when you go back.
So I did the movie theaters with Peter Gruber and Madison Johnson Theaters.
Howard Schultz and I did Starbucks in 125 stores in 40 different markets.
And I just told you how he taught me so much about customer service.
And so I was looking for what's the next thing a growth opportunity for me and my company, right?
Because we want to continue to evolve, grow, and think outside the box.
So I said, wow, all the money is going towards Silicon Valley.
And so how do I get into that world, right?
And then here you come.
This little old five foot.
Hold on a second.
The smart young man.
Let's go.
And so I just needed that foot in the door and you provided that foot in the door for me.
And also Ben as well, knowing him.
So here comes this opportunity with Scotio and the drones and to be able to be An early investor.
The product wasn't even, it was still in prototype state.
That's right.
That's right.
And so that really excited me.
And I think it took me and my company to a whole nother level because that brought me into Silicon Valley.
I didn't have that in Silicon Valley.
Yep.
Now I had it everywhere else, a great track record of success, but I didn't have it there.
And so that that deal provided me with a track record in Silicon Valley and then opened up the doors for me to see other opportunities that I didn't get a chance to see.
And so, again, I want to thank you, thank Ben, for the opportunity that I had.
You two also my friends.
Absolutely.
Sometimes it's about...
Timing.
People forget about that part of it.
It's about sometimes it's just not your time to do that deal or have that opportunity.
And it just lined up perfect with the right people being you and Ben.
And the timing was right when Scotty was just coming out with their product.
And it was a consumer product at the time.
That's right.
And then you know, with you just now making a couple of the investments into the sports teams and seeing how an autonomous drone could potentially be the future for sports and entertainment.
And then when we were outside the four seasons.
That's right.
And a prototype was going up.
Exactly.
But to that point you just made, who would have ever thought now?
They used drones for everything.
It's crazy.
I mean, so we were way ahead of the curve.
I know, man.
That's what we thought.
That's what people don't understand.
We were way ahead of the curve.
And now you think about every sports league, every fire department, every police department, on and on, and on.
Defense contracts are now going very crazy off of it.
That's right.
They are using it around the world.
Yeah, yeah.
Well, I think then, for us, one of our investment strategies is a simple one, but it's a tough one, which is like good ideas that look like bad ideas.
And so sometimes you have to think outside the box and see around the corner when you're making these investments.
And oftentimes a good idea looks like a good idea.
That means everybody can really do it.
So you have to kind of find that intersection to where there's – and what is your earned secret in terms of like –.
You know from the fact, like Adam, for example, like he grew up, just you know, doing RC racing and he eat, sleep and breathe this and used to work at Tesla.
And so knew the opportunity around autonomy and really kind of creating that opportunity.
And so, you know, that's what we look for when we're looking at founders.
Yeah.
What do you see?
Because now we opened up the box.
Everybody's, you know, hitting you and your team trying to get you to invest into the next Series A, the next Series B.
What do you look for in founders or the next entrepreneur that's trying to have you become an investor?
Well, I think, first of all, you're right.
You know, is it something that is not in the marketplace?
Mm-hmm.
Can we really look at this 10 years from now that it's going to still be here?
It's going to still, it has growth potential, hopefully year in and year out.
And then do we have a chance to exit or sell down the line?
And so, and then the partners I want them to make sure that these founders and these great people, they have skin in the game.
They also are great and they're experts at what they do.
Yep.
And, you know, we then also look at it, can we bring added value?
Right.
Being Magic Johnson, all the things that we have in our toolbox.
Can we bring added value to the deal or to that founder and make that company grow or take off and fly?
One of the things that I always tell founders, because they always, you know, whenever we might either get you into a co-investment or present the opportunity, and they have the opportunity to sit in front of you and your team, initially they always think okay well, we need to get Magic and have him be the face of this or tweet this, and you know.
And I think that people are now finally starting to understand that, you know, the iceberg tip of the iceberg is magic and Irvin the face, but the enterprise and the networks and the introductions that you can make to, whether it's the sports teams, whether it's to, you know, the insurance companies, whether it's, you know, strategic businesses,
Now I think that people are really starting to understand the true value of talent and when they're thinking about having somebody on their cap tables.
Yeah, because we... See, we're... we're politically strong we're yeah we're uh ceo strong and you know we we um our rolodex is huge and long and powerful and so we know how to grow businesses we've been doing it for a long i've been in business over 30 30 years and i tell them all the time utilize us utilize our network our expertise uh and so Then once they get into partnership with us, then they say, oh, he didn't know.
Exactly.
You're like, what did you think?
It's called Matthew Johnson Enterprise.
That's right.
That's right.
And that's what we talk about when we say the added value.
Yeah.
You know, you want my check.
But also, too, you should want everything else that we bring to the table.
Because I'm used to winning.
Yep.
I'm used to winning.
I mean, you just got another little championship.
That's right.
That's right.
I got a little championship on my shoulder.
So to that point, Chris, I don't just want to win in sports because I have 18 championship rings.
I also want to win in business.
So I have a mindset of winning and I'm going to do everything I can to make sure that deal or that partnership wins.
And so that's why you'll get my whole team and everything that we have to hopefully support what you're doing.
Yep.
The next generation of talent, the next generation of whether it's athletes, entertainers that are interested in business, that are looking to invest into Silicon Valley.
How should they think about structuring a team in today's time?
You just said it.
You just said it.
What they fail to realize is structuring a team.
Just what you just said.
Because that's so important.
See, you're great at what you do.
Yeah.
Basketball player, football player, singing, being an entertainer.
But you're not great at business.
So you have to get a team.
Mm-hmm, that is great at business that you control.
That is a part of your entire enterprise that can help you achieve your goals in business.
And Michael Ovitz always pointed that out to me.
Get people who are smarter than yourself, get the right people and always pay them, and then let them do their thing.
And he was absolutely right.
So I'm telling all of them out there You got to get a team of people who can help you that while you're on the stage singing, they're conducting business somewhere.
Exactly.
Right?
They're making deals for you.
And remember, these are not people you're going to hang out with.
Nor do you need them.
That's right.
Because if they're in the club next to you... Then who's signing that check?
Exactly.
They're spending your check.
Exactly.
They're spending your money.
So to that point, I've always looked for...
When we're in the infrastructure.
Okay, let's get some experts in infrastructure.
You know, on and on and on.
So that's what you've got to do.
So I would tell them that.
That would be the first thing I'd tell them.
Make sure you get a great team around you.
And also those can tell you no.
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
See, they're not used to somebody telling them no.
Yeah, yeah, no, they don't even know.
That word's not even in the vocabulary.
Yeah.
They'd be like, no.
No.
No.
No, you can't do that.
Or no, you can't write that check.
Or your friends are bringing you deals that make no sense.
No, don't invest.
You know, and so that's important as well.
Yeah.
I'm curious, when you think about deals, I mean especially, you know, when it comes to venture capital, no one bats a thousand.
No.
You know we have that it's called the Babe Ruth effect, where you have the highest number of strikeouts, but you also have the highest number of home runs, right?
And so you got to swing for the fences for every deal.
But there's some deals that you might miss.
And, you know, within any venture capital firm, you've missed a deal.
And just that's just the nature of the beast in the industry.
Do you have one in that you can remember where you like either looked at the opportunity wrong, or you missed the deal or, like that one, just either got away?
Like you know, just because you got 30 30, 32 years plus in the business, you know if you were striking 1000 then you know, I'm just curious kind of if you can— and what did you learn from that?
Yeah Chris, there's always deals that you know you wish— that you had wrote the check and you didn't, or deals that you know you heard about too late between the Ubers, and all the deals like that that you say wow, you know you had an opportunity, but you just didn't pull the string to write the check right.
Yeah.
And then you have a deal like, Nike when I was young, and they wanted to sign me, but give me stock.
Why did I meet you by 40-something years ago?
Hey, well, you got to call my mom and call my dad.
I would have loved to negotiate that one.
Exactly.
Phil Knight said, I don't have the money they have, but I got stock.
Wow.
And they just ran the analytics.
If I had a deal, did that deal in 1979, it'd be over a billion dollars.
So that's the one that, you talking about one that got away?
Man, I'm sure.
That's the one.
Michael owes you a billion favors.
Exactly, exactly, exactly.
So again, you know there's deals that you always will think back and say man, I wish I had did that deal.
But at the same time, I'm not a guy who goes backwards a lot.
I move forward.
I'm always constantly moving forward.
What I have is what I'm supposed to have.
And so I'm not, the great thing is being 66 now, I'm not the same young guy I was then.
So I can see deals different today and better.
And I have a team of people who vet those situations where I didn't before.
So things have improved.
I've gotten better.
And so, again, what you don't have, you don't have.
Yeah.
But you learn.
You learn.
And you won't make that mistake again.
That's right.
That's right.
I think one of the things that I mean but you learned this extremely quickly was the power of equity.
Mm-hmm. versus just, you know, writing a check and getting endorsements.
And so have you seen that continue to change in terms of just more people outside of the industry that are now starting to look at equity-based deals versus, you know, instead of just trying to get traditional endorsements.
I think you're seeing it now across the board.
And you're seeing it.
Well, look at it from actors.
All these actors now are doing equity deals instead of taking the money.
Creating their own brand.
That's right, creating their own brand and making a lot of money.
And then you see the same thing happening with the athletes. and just everyday people too.
And so yeah, it's changed a lot where before you were brought up and you were coming up and you're supposed to say get the most money.
Get the check.
Get the check.
And well, things have changed now.
And I think there's a lot of people who were able to help people understand that's not the way to go.
And so now you're seeing some of the most high profile people celebrities, now owning, like you said, their own brands, their own companies.
I mean, we see it on our end when people are wanting to invest into the next big companies and understanding now that you know it's not.
Hey, I'd love to work with you.
You should write me a check.
It's like, I'd love to work with you.
Here's, you know, some money so I can get on the cap.
That's right.
And I think that's what's really changed.
Yeah.
Before, after, they said, no, I'm not going to write no check, you know.
I know.
Give me, give me, give me.
Yeah.
And you were like—
You know, they was like, no.
But also the founders.
It doesn't happen like that.
It's two totally different worlds.
We're in Silicon Valley.
People, you know, it's a Series C or a Series A company.
They don't even have a marketing budget like that.
But it's like, well, we do have stock.
Right.
You know, and then wonder how that could play out.
That's right.
No, everybody changed, right?
Yeah.
So let's try to make it happen.
Mm-hmm.
And, but. hey, celebrity, hey, athlete, hey, you got to be driven by the equity now.
And sometimes the equity, and you got to write a check to be a part of that as well.
Absolutely.
But they're willing now.
They're more educated, I think, today.
But because of people like yourself who are their age and can help them understand and teach them how the game is played today versus yesterday, when I came around.
Yeah, and I think one of the reasons and you kind of talked about it around creating that halo effect is that when we make these investments now and I think that before it used to just be on Wall Street Journal or TechCrunch
Now when someone makes an investment or the new companies are being built in Silicon Valley, they go across mainstream media, from Complex to Essence Magazine to you know all on social media like boardroom.
You know, there's whole entities now that are being created that are really expressing the business of investing.
And I think that it's, and now people are, it's in their conscious mind and they're thinking about the next generation of those companies.
Yeah.
And that's what's so cool about 2025.
Yeah.
Right.
And so I look at, Steph Curry, you look at LeBron, the companies that they have built off the court.
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Right.
Snoop, Dr. Dre, on and on and on.
Kevin Durant.
Yeah.
I mean, these guys are just doing—they're owning teams now while they're still playing.
Crazy.
Crazy.
So—
It's just beautiful.
And you see Tom Brady and on and on and on, you know, the Manning brothers.
So you see all these former athletes and current athletes and again— there's so many others who are just taking advantage of their brand and star power, but turning it into a successful company.
Absolutely, yeah.
And I mean, you were literally the first one.
I mean, like you said, is that you know people were saying why are you even interested in business?
And now you fast forward 25 years.
Like the cool thing to do is have you know a company that you can actually go and invest into and you can build your own brands.
And I think that with you know, even like when we think about the world of crypto and AI, you know, one of our thesis is that at one point, one person will be able to build a billion dollar business with the tools that are available right now.
You know, being able to use prompt engineering to actually create a business plan or think about different strategies, and all those things.
And so I'm curious where do you see kind of the evolution of what these next generation of technologies coming?
I mean, everyone talks about technology.
What's going on with AI?
I mean, we're very big believers in the future of blockchain technologies.
Like, how are you seeing those worlds kind of develop and what you have going on?
And if you have a specific thesis?
Well, technology, it just keeps going and growing.
I mean, man, you and I way back investing in technology and still investing today in technology.
And like you said, AI now is... it's going to blow people's mind.
It's already blowing our mind where we are today with it, but it's only going to get better.
Yep, yep, yep.
So I think everybody now have changed and said, okay, I'm moving money from over here.
Exactly.
Investing in this to invest in AI.
And I say to everybody and everyone, You got to get in early.
So to a lot of today's young, successful people, look who else is investing when you look at a deal.
And that's going to tell you everything you need to know.
Right.
I mean, I can't tell you the amount of times someone's reached out to me been like oh hey, should I do this?
And I'm like, well, who's leading the deal?
And then they're like...
They don't have a lead yet.
I'm like, well, then you're the lead.
Yeah.
And they're like, oh, that's a good point.
And you don't want to be that.
You know, and so for me, I always look at who is the lead, also who else is investing.
And then I say, okay, they got a track record of success.
They've already vetted this deal frontwards and backwards.
Yep.
And if they wrote a check, I'm writing my check.
100%.
Also, the industry is super important.
And I think you know, you've recently had an opportunity to join the cap table on Alchemy Health and also with Function Health, which actually just announced their Series B today.
You know you're developing an amazing portfolio in the intersections of AI, bio and where the future of innovation is going from there.
How do you think about that in terms of just that, specific sectors, especially with and now people are the next big companies, are all coming and saying okay well, I see, Magic has invested in these businesses.
Like, I think that this is the next big one.
Yeah, because you take Alchemy and building pharmacies in places that they don't have pharmacies.
Yep.
And we were just at a conference in D.C., and we made multiple deals just in D.C.
They told me.
Yeah, yeah.
They said, thank you.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
So, you know— And they're doing amazing.
They're doing an amazing job, and—
Heavy demand for pharmacies.
A lot of them are, all the big boys are closing a lot of their pharmacies and drugstores.
But they're still in need, especially in specific areas that aren't in the mainstream ecosystem.
Well, that's the key.
Yeah.
Right?
Yeah.
Rural America.
Yep.
Right?
The inner cities.
Yep.
There's plenty of opportunities for Alkabee to take advantage, and they are.
Yeah.
And these cities are courting them, right?
They need it.
They need it.
That's how I look at it.
If the sector, if there's demand and heavy demand, Just like you look at AI, it's heavy demand for it across every industry.
It's going to help everybody, right?
Lower your cost.
You're going to be more efficient.
You're going to be faster.
Yep.
And you literally have the world's information just right there on your fingertips.
That's right.
Ready to help build you the next product.
Exactly.
Code the next company.
Faster, quicker.
Yep.
Less money.
Yep.
That sounds like a win to me.
And you make more money.
Exactly.
So again, you know, I want to make sure you know, companies are on the cutting edge and are doing –.
Things we've never seen before.
Or there's a huge demand, like alchemy, there's a huge demand.
And man, it's almost you can't miss.
Well, you see, I mean, the funny thing is, is that you've seen it before.
You think about the theaters, you think about Starbucks, all the things that we did.
There was heavy demand for it in the inner cities, but nobody was going in there building them.
So it was supply and demand, right?
So we met that, and man, everything just hit a home run.
And then we just kept that business thesis going.
And then here come companies came in and said, oh, wow.
That's a huge marketplace.
Minorities do have a lot of spending power, right?
And right now we're over a trillion about 14 trillion.
Spending power between minorities African-Americans and Latinos is a couple trillion.
100%.
Exactly.
And so nobody was going after their disposable income.
So that's why I built my business in those communities.
And to your point, so I will continue to look there, but because now...
My company is more global and we're doing bigger, bigger deals.
So that's sometimes a problem, that you and I have our friends and people that we know who are great people, who are celebrities.
And so, you know, they bring you deals and they're too small and they don't understand.
I've outgrown those deals, you know.
What did you say?
You said, like, the same amount of time I'm going to work.
That's right.
That's right.
For a small deal, I could be working on a big deal.
Yep.
And we got to put our efforts in those big deals.
But there's nothing wrong.
And so everybody has to start somewhere, and they have to understand that.
Don't think that you have to start where I am or where LeBron is or Steph or whoever it is.
It's okay to start small and grow your business.
Exactly.
And grow your company.
But for me, you can't get mad at me because I said, hey, my deal's got to be here.
Yeah.
Because, again, that's where my company, my brand is.
And that's the cause that I'm getting today.
Yep, yep.
Where yesterday I was getting the other cause, but not today.
All these big...
Big deals, they call me and say, hey, we want you to be a part of it.
That's how I got into the sports team.
Exactly.
I remember when I went to your annual conference down in Laguna, you had your whole team around and you were just pointing out look at my portfolio.
This is the portfolio.
This is the value in billions.
That's right.
And so you emphasized, like, we're going to keep growing this.
We're going to need exponential value.
That's right. you're going to have to, you know, swing for the fences and think bigger continuously.
Yeah, because, Chris, we look, let's just break down.
When we bought the Dodgers, $2.2 billion.
Well, everybody said that was, we overpaid, right?
And today...
This is not from me.
This is from Forbes and all the companies.
Now it's $8 billion.
Yep, yep.
Right?
Billion.
Dr. Buzz bought the Lakers for $65 million.
They just sold for $10 billion.
Lakers show, baby.
Yeah.
The Commanders, just two years old now.
Going great, yeah.
Six billion.
Now they just said we're closer to eight billion.
And now that the new stadium, that's going to go even up higher that we're building today.
So sports...
I know we always talk about it.
Why do I invest?
Well, it's easy, because the valuations are so high and nobody's ever going to stop watching sports in America.
That's where we get away.
Exactly.
That's our release.
Exactly.
Our getaway from our everyday work life is to watch sports.
And that's why it's always going to be these teams.
The valuations of these teams will continue to skyrocket because of that.
The sparks.
Yeah.
I mean, you did that deal super early.
Yes.
Before people, the WNBA wave even really took off like that.
And we were losing money.
Exactly.
So why did you decide to hold on that?
Well, because, first of all, we thought that someday it would change.
And we wasn't losing a lot of money, but we were losing money.
But stuff that we could—okay.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's okay.
We're comfortable with the loss.
Yep.
And—
We didn't know it was going to turn around like this.
Yeah.
No, exactly.
From now, the team is worth like $300 million and growing, right?
Crazy.
But we only paid a few million for the team.
Yeah.
And now it's where it is.
But give a lot of the players a lot of credit.
Give college basketball women's college basketball— took off, and then that fan base came in to the WNBA and started watching that as well.
So, no, we're still blown away about the growth of the WNBA and where it's going.
Soccer in America, same thing.
LAFC, we're... Let's go.
Valuation over a billion dollars, I think, or one, two.
Yep.
Man...
It just keeps growing.
The NWSL, the Women's Soccer League, same thing.
It's just skyrocketing.
Now they all have great TV contracts.
The WNB, that's the reason why.
They have great TV contracts.
100%.
And so it's just amazing.
So that's why I invested in sports teams.
And they're growing.
That's right, growing.
Growing and growing and growing.
And then streaming came in.
All those companies really allowed these leads to grow because they all want sports content.
So much, even like what happened with YouTube a couple weeks ago YouTube TV, when they shut off ESPN for a couple weeks and Disney and everybody was like no, hold on a second.
We got to get this deal right.
Yes, yes.
Yes.
Because that's how important it is.
That's right.
And young people get everything on their phones.
Oh, yeah.
You know how many times you'll be eating dinner and then you just go out to eat and you got the game on.
They told me.
A lot of people told me they were watching the World Series when my Dodgers won back-to-back and they said they'd be out to dinner.
Absolutely.
And it was awesome.
They wasn't listening to their wives or girlfriends.
They were like, wait a minute.
And one guy told me they were at a wedding.
Yep.
And said all the guys sort of went out somewhere.
Y'all good?
Y'all going to be good?
Hey, we going outside to watch the game on our cell phone.
Oh, man.
But that's how they consume their content is on their phone.
Well, even when you were talking about sports, when we were upstairs, you said one of the secrets to why these teams are growing and obviously with the success of the Dodgers when you purchased them and everything and the Sparks and you know continuing.
And now you know with the Commanders and so many other teams, is that you have to not be afraid to spend money.
You got to spend money in order to make money.
That's right.
So break that down, because I mean even from our portfolio companies and founders, thinking about, you know, always just conserving the cash versus going out and really putting the money to work.
Yeah, Chris, that's a great point.
When we bought the Dodgers We put a couple hundred million into the fan experience, into the stadium.
We had to increase the fan experience.
What is every league and every team talking about today?
Yeah.
How to increase the fan experience because then the money will come back to the owners, right?
And so because of that, now the Dodgers is just we're making money that no major league baseball team has ever made in revenues.
It's been crazy.
Yep.
Unbelievable.
So it came back to us.
And so I can tell you so many different situations that you have to invest in the team in the stadium because it will come back.
And the players, because that's the number one thing.
You have to put a great product out on the field.
Yep.
That's where...
We're growing the commanders.
That's the next step for us.
How do we get better?
And so we're going to do that.
We finally got our quarterback in Jaden Daniels, but we have to surround him with more weapons.
We have to get better on the defensive end.
So we're taking steps.
But every team...
Got to put money into the player development, players itself.
And then, last but not least, making sure that the fans are happy, because you're asking them every year.
To come back.
Yeah, come back.
And ticket prices go up.
Absolutely.
Yesterday's price was not today's price.
Exactly.
Exactly.
And so, and they're going to say to us okay, if we're going to pay more money for our season tickets, then what are you going to do as the owners?
Yep.
And as an owner, I mean, it really boils down to, you know, it's not just the team itself.
Like you're working with operations.
You're working with so many different people.
And obviously when you were playing, you were the captain of the team.
For the founders that are thinking about building and scaling their teams, like what is it that you think that they should keep in mind or what would be?
You know what's your methodology of thinking when it comes to keeping a team together as you're going towards these goals.
Yeah, I think first, you know, making sure that you do... invest in player development, analytics.
Yep.
Yep.
When I played, no analytics.
Today, you got to have a whole staff.
Yep.
Because that's how you win in today, right?
Right-hand pitcher versus left-hand pitcher.
That's right.
This percentage.
That's right.
In basketball.
This guy shoots from the right side on threes and he makes them more than he does on the left side.
Mm-hmm. or a foursome left because he doesn't score well.
I mean, on and on and on.
So I never seen...
Analytics come into every sports now.
NFL, football, basketball, baseball.
Baseball actually started analytics really in sports.
So invest in analytics and then marketing, because you got to have a great marketing team to help you go out.
And tell your story and what you're about.
That's right.
Your way, what you're about.
And so between that marketing PR team, you got to have a great one.
And then I would tell them identity.
Okay.
See, people going to latch on to your identity.
What is your identity?
Why do I even need to even be with you?
That's right.
Right.
What is your identity?
Who are you?
Players also going to ask you that.
What's the identity of the commanders or the Lakers or the so-and-so?
Yep.
And then, do you want to win?
Because a lot of players and a lot of fans are going to be saying hey, Mr Owner, do you really want to win?
Exactly.
Ben says it.
You're either playing not to lose or you're playing to win.
It's either one or the other.
And he's right.
And every group I'm with, you know, they're playing to win.
And that's why, you know, every team I have but the Sparks.
And this year now the Commanders won't be in the playoff, but every team was in the playoff.
Absolutely.
And so we're playing to win.
Yeah.
And so the fans see that.
Free agents see that?
Yep.
Yep, yep, because they're like, hold on a second.
I'm tired of going to Cabo.
And I want to be in the playoff.
Why did old Tony leave the Angels to come to the Dodgers?
Yep.
He had never been in a playoff, and he wanted to be in the playoff.
That's why he signed with the Dodgers.
And he's back-to-back World Series champion.
That was one of the best World Series.
I was on the East Coast, man.
You guys had me up until 3 o'clock in the morning watching that game.
That 18-inning game.
Crazy.
But I'm locked in.
Yeah.
And everybody says the same thing.
I couldn't believe it.
That series changed baseball in the MLB for the better.
And I think that we brought in fans that normally didn't watch baseball.
Absolutely.
And so, again, that's what can happen sometimes.
When superstars play like superstars.
Yep.
Ohtani performed well.
Yeah.
Guerrero from their side performed well and on and on and on.
They all played like superstars.
That's what made it so entertaining.
And the highs and the lows, that's what sports give you, right?
One minute you're up 3-0, the next minute they tie you and they take the lead.
I mean, that series was going back and forth, so it's a beautiful thing.
That's why, again, we love sports.
And we... pour so much money into sports.
Right now, you got companies looking for opportunities in sports.
Individuals who didn't think about investing in sports.
Now they're looking to buy teams.
It's always been an asset class, but now people really see the long-term real value.
And can I add this?
The WNBA got so many people willing to invest and own teams and bring them into markets.
They're not in.
Exactly.
The NWSL got so many more people wanted by a soccer team today that wouldn't have been interested in one two, three years ago.
Exactly.
I mean, I think Atlanta just got added recently.
That's right.
Because they know that behind everything, there's real business that's associated with it.
And a lot of revenue streams.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
And, I think, a lot of even our companies, when we're thinking about even like the next generation of AI video right, and being able to be able to work with these companies and find unique ways to bridge technology and innovation.
Because if you're building a business from the ground up in 2025, you're starting a brand new company.
You're not going to do things the old way.
Oh, you can't.
And you think about, with the tools that are available now, like that means just by default, you can say, instead of us having a you know 100 person team, or we could actually do this with 10 people
And now we have, we can still operate at 10x the speed.
That's right.
Because of where you know, whether it's the you know, from AI to using blockchain and all these different resources is really helping push innovation forward on the business side.
And that's, And everything.
Just think about my journey.
You couldn't pay an athlete in high school, college, and now NIL.
Now high school players are getting paid a couple hundred thousand.
College players getting paid millions of dollars, which I'm so happy.
Because when I came through Michigan State and I was dating my girlfriend, who is now my wife Cookie, I didn't have no money to take her to get something to eat, right.
And they couldn't pay me because that was illegal.
But today, these young men and women, these college athletes, these high school athletes, student athletes, I should say, are getting paid a lot of money.
So name and likeness is so amazing.
And now you got companies.
Yeah, building products specifically for that.
That's right.
That's right.
So things have really changed.
And this show right here today, this has been the best show because we've covered everything.
There's nobody else on TV that can cover all the things you and I just covered.
That's amazing.
Well, I think one of the main reasons is because we both are passionate about this and we're both actually in it, you know, every single day.
That's right.
Like, we're not, you know, just on the outside reporting in.
Right after this you going back to your business, call.
I'm running back to go to the next meeting and we're going to keep it going.
And our phone's going to be ringing because everybody's going to say how can I get down with you guys?
Hey, well, listen, you got to start getting 10 years in the game.
Yeah, yeah.
In order to help make it happen.
Yes, yes.
Exactly.
But I think that, like you know your journey and this is why we just wanted to make sure you were the first one that we shared this with, because you did it.
Like you said, we talked about the NIL deals.
You talked about all those things.
Like, you know, the contracts were way different.
Yeah, back then when you did it and you see, you know I think there's only four billion billionaire people in sports.
I mean you have LeBron, you have Jordan, you have Tiger, and then we got Mr Magic in the building.
You know so and Irving like in terms, but how you did it was not just on the sports, but all majority from business.
That's right.
And a number of deals that led you into going.
Taking one thing taking your investment in Starbucks, flipping it into Dodgers, just continuing to build.
And so I think that you know, as much as we love you as the Hall of Fame athlete, you're a Hall of Fame entrepreneur.
Well, thank you.
Thank you, Chris.
Are you a risk taker?
Absolutely.
You see, and I think a lot of times that's what they have to ask themselves.
Are you willing to take the risk from the money that I did make from Howard Schultz and Starbucks?
And again, thank you, Howard, because he made me legitimate.
Yep.
That Starbucks deal... sealed the deal for me.
And so, but I was a risk taker.
I put up my money.
Yeah, exactly.
You know, I put up a lot of money.
You got to pay to play.
That's right.
And Dr. Bush said, I love you.
He said, I love you as a son, but you got to write a check.
That's all I'm saying.
I said, yes, sir.
And so.
But that's real.
Yeah, that's real.
And think about this.
And all these athletes and entertainers out there that we're talking to and, of course, other people.
I was in a position, see I saved my money.
So every deal that came that I had to write a check, I was ready to do that.
Exactly.
So that's what's important.
Interesting, that's a gem right there.
That's what's important.
And so, while you blowing it on so many other things, remember when that deal come and you have to put equities.
You had to put skin in the game.
You got to be ready for that.
Stay ready soon.
Got to get ready.
That's right.
That's right.
So I wanted to throw that nugget out there.
And that's so, so important.
And man, my journey, you know, the best compliments I get is from all the current guys, the current hip hoppers, Rick Ross, all them.
Common.
They all say, man, you couldn't do what we're doing today.
Yeah.
But we can do it because of you.
Absolutely.
You showed us the way.
And I said, man, that's a great compliment.
I remember a comment pulled me aside.
He said, man, we don't respect a lot of people.
But every time I get into any concert, we talk about money.
We talk about owning something.
They all say you.
Absolutely.
They point to you.
And I say, well, thank you.
And I'm just so happy that Michael and I can say hey, now look at KD, look at Steph, look at LeBron.
It's more than them.
It's so many other, Draymond, Iguodala.
I mean, I can keep going.
There's so many great businessmen out there and women, because the WNBA, those young ladies are doing great things.
100%.
And so I want to also shout them out.
And it's been a blessing man to sit here with you so that we can educate and also help others who want to get into investing or Silicon Valley, owning their own company.
It's not easy.
Nope.
But it's doable if you put the time in.
You got to be willing to put the time in.
Yeah, 100%.
Because like you said, after this, you and I running, and I'm going to be on the phone in that car.
Exactly.
All the way back to the office doing deals.
You and I was separately on the phone doing deals before.
You ready?
Exactly.
And that's what it takes.
And then last but not least, I got to say this.
Yeah.
Don't be afraid to partner.
See, that myth, we got to get rid of that myth. that you got to be the only one.
Yeah, yeah.
It's abundance, man.
That's right.
You and I are partners.
So, see, you didn't have to bring me in.
You could have just said, oh, I'm good.
Exactly.
But you brought me in.
And so I want...
All these young people to understand that it's okay.
To collaborate.
That's right.
It's okay.
And then do multiple deals.
Keep going.
Because they, Chris, you're so needed in today's culture.
I appreciate it.
See, because I'm older.
You're young.
So they're looking at you saying, dang, I want to be like you.
I want to partner with you.
I want to teach me.
See, sometimes we're afraid to say, hey, somebody say, teach me.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Right?
And you know so much, and you've helped so many, and that's been your blessing and your purpose.
Of course, you're rich and going to be richer, but You're rich by a lot of different ways.
You're rich by money, but you're rich also with your roll of debts and your knowledge and your willingness to spread that and give it to somebody else.
The downfall of minorities have been most of the rich people before us took the knowledge with them.
They share it.
Exactly.
So I wanted people to know, this is the man right here.
I appreciate it.
Look well, I wouldn't be here if we didn't have the opportunity to soak up your wisdom and just the foundation that you've created.
And you know, you've been my inspiration behind everything in terms of taking business and bridging these worlds together.
And so I appreciate you taking the time to have me. have this conversation.
You know, you're a friend.
You are always there whenever we need anything.
And in return, we just want to keep on running it up.
That's it.
That's it.
Keep on winning them reigns.
Come on, 19, 19, 20.
I appreciate you, man.
This is super needed.
Yes.
And, you know, I'm glad we were able to get this wisdom down.
Thank you.
You're the man.
Thank you.
I appreciate it.
And so are you.
Oh, thank you, bro.
Thanks, everybody.
All right.
Signing out.
Signing out.
But not signing off.
No, no, no.
Out.
Exactly.
No, that was amazing.
This was great, man.
Yeah.
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