Discussion keeps the You're listening to Roundtable with myself, He Young.
I'm joined by Steve Hatherly and Yushan in the studio.
Coming up... From sweeping leg dances to flawless camera spins, or group live stream is China's latest live stream sensation.
Sleek and polished like a K-pop stage, it's creating jobs both in front of and behind the camera. from performers and stylists to lightning crews and operators, we dive into how this fast-growing format is powering up China's live stream economy.
Next on deck, in the US, the Gen Z gaze.
That blank, almost distant stare from young service workers? has sparked plenty of complaints from older customers expecting warmth and eye contact.
And in China, Gen Z hospitality workers don't seem to give off the same vibe.
So what's behind this difference? Is it cultural expectations? social anxiety or simply different ways of communicating without words.
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Now let's move on to the next topic discussion today. in China's massive livestream economy, a realm that now attracts 816 million live streaming users, accounting for nearly 75 percent of Chinese internet users numbers in general, a new phenomenon is taking center stage. group live streaming, or tuan buo.
What was a casual format just a year ago is now very polished with K-pop style choreography, matching outfits, and sleek real-time camera work, all executed live and all designed to capture attention in a matter of seconds on your smartphone.
Behind those synchronized moves and striking visuals, lies a rigorous process of rehearsal, staging, and savvy branding Could this glamorous yet gritty formula be the next star-making engine Yushan, you've checked out these short videos and, uh...
Well, yeah, we looked at snippets of replay and also, you know, these are live streams usually.
So how would you describe 团播? So 团播 or rather group live streaming is just a live stream style let's say that involves multiple hosts performing together like dancings or skits or themed acts together in real time.
And one of the most popular and common style right now is just Some viewers may give a cue or send a gift that represents a certain, say, I'm ordering this dance, please. dance this um theme dance for me and so so dancing is basically the major like a cheeseburger I'll get fries with that, please.
Kind of. Yeah, you get to order. but via presence or in a way as digital presence, let's say, and one of the most say viral one at this point is the leg sweeping dance which She's like... 扫腿舞.
Yeah, 扫腿舞, moving your leg... to an eye-catching, repeatable pattern.
You're seeing my facial gesture. What does it suggest?
Have you not seen this dance before? I have.
So you take your foot. Okay, everybody, if you're driving, don't follow me.
If you're standing somewhere else, go ahead.
Take your right foot, put it in front of your left leg, and then sweep.
And then do it again and then sweep. Okay, but so much faster.
It's done alphabetically. Sweeping your legs sideways across the floor while swinging your arms in a very exaggerated motion. motion and it's done in a group.
So think of this as the 2025 Chinese version of the Great River Dance.
Oh, okay. Fair. But these dancers, they all have like...
Perfect makeup done, and then the camera work, the lighting, everything.
It looks like a K-pop stage. It really does.
Yeah, this is on TV in Korea every week.
But this is different though, right? Because this is more interactive.
This is a live stream. This isn't a television show.
And that's the cool part of this, I think, is, yep, it does look quite K-pop-y.
The dancing aspects, there are other aspects to this, which we'll talk about in a sec.
But yeah, you've got your performers on stage and the stage is Can be really elaborate, right, with elaborate lighting and things like this.
But it's not a TV show. It's a live stream.
And the audience can interact in that way by sending their gifts.
Also making requests, which is much more engaging for the audience than simply watching it on television.
Yeah, well tell us about the various popular styles. of dance, of this kind of that's happening literally every minute, every day right now.
Yeah, the one I watched fell into the anime-inspired or ACG style of where everybody the dancers they all put on say animation style clothing kind of like cosplaying during the during the live stream and also they can do the J-pop or K-pop dances while being imagined as you know animation figures and then there are other styles too like the traditional Chinese Chinese one where everybody just put on hanfu or the traditional Chinese gowns or dresses um that's you know can feature a certain historical period or there are even script role play or mini dramas where they are acting out a piece of story for you during the live stream.
And then there's also a host that's kind of behind the camera that's saying the cue or guiding the performers all the time where he or she can also hosting these interactive games that the teams need to compete in, say, lighthearted challenges, the trivia, the punishment games, or just something to stir up the viewers' interest.
Yeah, and it seems like tuanbo or this group live stream subcategory in the live streaming world is... the new growth point, what do you think contributes to its popularity?
This is similar to the world of tech. Every minute counts and is moving so quickly.
Yeah, because, well, now that we're talking about tuanbo, it's... working to provide higher quality live streams nowadays with more professional, visually engaging, and also interactive contents. because there are now as we mentioned earlier the tuanbo they shows um polished dazzle like there there are flawless makeup worn by the performers that there's the dramatic lighting, the sharp camera angles, and also all the movements syncing so well with the music, timed transitions. all of which are the key to keep viewers hooked and give you that wow impression that I want to see what happens next.
There are so many of the, you said happening every minute of every day.
On Doyen alone, there are more than 50. 15,000 of these live streams every day.
15,000. And what that implies is that the barrier to entry is quite low, right?
Yeah, a lot of these performers will seem like pros, but you don't have to be a celebrity If you've got some sort of performance ability or the ability to engage with fans, then that can be helpful. enough so I think that makes it pretty attractive to the audience And then there's the incentives for the audience with the platform, too, talked about the fans excitement in the fact that they can interact they can give gifts and things like this This is a different style of entertainment, a different access to entertainment. that fans didn't have before.
Absolutely and I watched this documentary of the practitioners in the tuanbo industry, and it was so fascinating.
One dancer, he was saying that he seen how K-pop trainees endure the brutal selection process that they have to train for years.
Well-documented, yeah. Yeah, in South Korea, and it's survival of the fittest.
And I just... In a perfect world, if there's no language barrier, those South Korean trainees would have a field day here.
It would be so much easier to make money. thanks to this huge market and you guys mentioned giving gifts and that's all cash you know you're you're you're buying these gifts with real money and then they um and there's a split between the platform and then the people who the performer who actually did it.
And the agency, if they're signed to us.
And there's that aspect of things. But, All in all, the dancers were saying that they have no other way of finding any real... entertainment showbiz related jobs.
So this you can say is low entry, but it's also creating a maybe an entry, a ticket to fame and a way to earn a living.
And also I saw in that documentary that a number of, very experienced production crew members who used to work for local TV stations.
They're now in this because TV stations don't pay the bill anymore and then This is a new territory for people to pursue new careers as such.
And before we move on to the last topic discussion today, What do you see as the maybe biggest opportunities and challenges for this new pandemic? popular uh live stream subcategory called well i think for um for people to get into to be seen, I think, right?
It's very hard to break into the entertainment industry in maybe every country around the world.
But this offers... path to being visible right and then once you're seen once you're discovered you never know right so that's one advantage but on the downside you talk about the k-pop industry um those trainees work tirelessly and it is really, really hard on them.
And when you have the audience interaction and the fan interaction through these types of live streams here in China, it's going to make for a very, very, very long day because you've got your rehearsal time, you've got your performance time, sometimes twice a day, right?
And then you've got the fan interaction after the performance.
You're looking at 14 hours a day sometimes.
Yeah, and sometimes even more than that because...
During the learning period, I remember watching or reading about it on some reports saying that As a performer, you need to be able to learn a dance really fast in order to join the rehearsal, in order to keep up with everybody, order to be favored by the viewers.
And also apart from the physical demanding jobs, it's a full-time job basically you also have to give your emotional attachment to it too like you need to like smile or give like a certain emotional value to the viewers so that they say, prefer you better and more gifts flows to your way.
So that's all young people kind of need to... look into before you decide if you want to join this full-time job again.
And as a full-time job, it's actually paying pretty well because as it's reported...
It can be paid pretty well. It has a potential for a relatively higher salary and some can even earn over 10,000 yuan or roughly 1400 US dollars a month if the shows perform well.
So that's how you tapped into this industry and be a professional there.
But again, there's a lot of things that you need to watch out for before entering.
Right foot, sweep. Right foot, sweep. I'm ready.
Sign me up. Yeah, and maybe triple the speed of that.
No matter the debates, group live streaming is undeniably a growing force.
Stop sweep shaming me. slow, my friend, but I won't be able to be much faster anyway.
Yeah, we'll work on it. Good luck. And group live streaming is undeniably a... growing force in China's massive live stream economy, which stands at more than 5 trillion Chinese yuan.
Both performers and production crews are tapping into new income streams and career paths.
With so much energy and innovation driving it, this livestream subcategory is clear to keep expanding.
And the hope now is that it develops thoughtfully and sustainably Protecting workers' rights and avoiding unchecked chaotic growth.
Coming up next. Yeah, let's talk about this.
The Gen Z gaze is a viral complaint. That cold, blank look. in apparently young American service job workers.
Interestingly, Chinese Gen Z workers don't necessarily show it the same way.
So we're going to talk about the differences there.
But first of all, Steve, could you explain to us what the Gen Z gaze stands for?
Yeah, so the gaze, G-A-Z-E, right? It's the stare, the blank stare, the dead-eyed stare.
So the complaint about the service industry is this.
For example, you walk into a coffee shop and maybe 20, 30 years ago, the employee working would say, Good morning.
Welcome to XYZ Coffee. What can I get you today?
Whereas now you walk into a coffee shop and the employee just looks at you.
Almost like, what are you doing here? Like that kind of thing.
Really? Not just the coffee shops or the restaurants.
You'll go into a doctor's office and the person working at the desk will look at you like... and they won't say anything.
That's why it's called the Gen Z Gaze. They don't say anything.
They don't greet you. They just stare at you and wait for you to say something first.
And the older generations are not happy about it.
Not even like poking out the head or... facial gesture.
According to the Gen Z gays complainers, it is simply that they just look at you and don't say anything.
No acknowledgement that you exist. So for context, Gen Z... or Generation Z generally refers to those born between 1997 and 2012.
Is this one of another complaint of the older people because you just don't understand the younger generation with new exhibits of habits.
I think we just communicate. differently now and we have different expectations, right?
So Gen Z grew up with tech. And growing up with tech means growing up with social media and texting. instead of calling.
And when somebody texts, there's no need for an immediate reply, right?
So sometimes you'll reply later. So it's just a different style of communication.
I saw one Gen Z guy on TikTok. he was defending the generation, saying the Gen Z gaze comes from stupid interactions. with older generations.
For example, he works in a clothing store.
And he said, sometimes customers will ask me, do you have this size?
And I will say, no, I'm sorry, we're all out.
And they will say, well, what about in the back?
Well that gets the Gen Z gays, because I just told you, we don't have any more.
But yet you're asking me again if we have any more.
Stupid question gets the Gen Z gauge. But in the defense of older people, sometimes you... just need to check double check sometimes they just don't know can you remember event tree like you know just off the the back of your hand.
Not always. Anyway, what... Michelle, what do you think?
Let's say I'm... age-wise I'm between the millennials and the Gen Z since I'm born kind of before 1997 but anyways it's like I understand the take from both ways, but it's understandable that given that now is the time...
And that we're living in a world where people are so bombarded with information and expected to multitask. in a very efficient way.
So for Gen Z, to me, it's understandable that we're trying to minimize unnecessary social impact energy like prolonged eye contact or just say extra greetings and just going to a more efficient and time saving choice.
Here's one more complaint from the older generations about Gen Z. Apparently, this is a new trend as well.
When Gen Z answers the telephone, they don't say anything.
And I asked Yushan, is this weird? Yushan said...
Oh, I do this too. Depending on who's calling, okay?
If it's a salesperson and... the minute i pick up before i say hello or anything he or she already starts to talk or it's obvious it's a bot then i'll just Don't say anything or say that, oh, sorry, I'm busy and hang up.
That's how we deal with phones nowadays.
In the US, some older customers, they feel like they're talking to the wall, especially in service jobs. when the Gen Z is on the other side.
And in China, the approach, is kind of different.
I mean, here service is usually polite professional. culturally not bubbly or over-the-top like some traditional American hospitality styles. but you wouldn't get the Gen Z stare either and in two sentences why do you think is that i think it's just still we're falling to that review ecosystem where people just simply expect you to be enough for the service scenario and receive a relatively good review afterwards but yeah we're just not like that in so many ways we do enough and that's it The thing is, if you get a bad review, that bombs you and you don't want that for any service job worker. because everything is on the platforms these days.
Thank you, Steve and Yushan, for joining the discussion.
I'm He Yang. We'll see you next time.
