Hi, I'm Wendy Zuk amendments to sides versus Today on the show Black Terrell, yes.
I am life Terrell. I'm the editor of the show Wendy.
We are here in the studio for a very important reason I have a story for you.
I came across this story About a year ago actually and I have not been able to get it out of my head.
It is so weird It is so much fun, and it has everything Wendy everything everything.
Yes. It's got dinosaurs Oh, it's got nerd fights.
It's got 1800s New York City politics.
Whoa. Should we get started?
OK. All right. Spanning time and space, where do we begin?
OK, Wendy. Imagine it is the 1870s.
And we are in a room full of massive models of dinosaurs.
These super cool life -size models.
And you're walking among them.
They're towering over you.
We've got a meat eater, we've got a plant eater.
Maybe we've got other prehistoric creatures, mammoth -y giant armadillos and lasmasaurus, one of those water creatures.
These models, these gorgeous super cool models are destined for this museum.
It's the first time ever that most people will ever have seen a dinosaur, and it is going to be a complete game changer.
People are going to - it's going to blow people's minds.
Wow. Okay, but, Wendy, here's why you have to imagine it.
Because before this museum ever had a chance to open, something happened.
I would like to paint a little bit of a picture for you.
So, it's May 3rd, 1871.
Mm -hmm. A group of dudes shows up.
They've got sledgehammers.
Okay. And these thugs bust in and just go absolutely nuts.
They smash everything, every model, every life -sized, half -made dinosaur, every little tiny model of a future life -sized dinosaur.
What? Two smithereens.
And then Wendy, once these thugs have smashed everything up they take all the bits and pieces away, cart them off and bury them.
What? Somewhere under Central Park.
That is so fucking vindictive.
What? Like why? Yes, why?
No, this is a wild story.
And actually this is a story that has mesmerized people for 150 years.
Like a paper Wendy just came out on this last year, sort of turning out new stuff in this story, about what might have happened and why and what maniac was behind this.
So that is what we're gonna get into today.
We're gonna dig into this dino museum mystery.
In this episode that I am calling The Great Dinosaur Smash -Up of 1871.
Do -do -do -do -do. We are gonna get into it.
Shall we get into it after the break?
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Welcome back to down the show, the great Dino Smash -Up of 1871, flies.
We were supposed to have some awesome dinosaur museum, instead we had what, we have dust. What happened?
What happened? Yes.
So New York City, let's head there okay?
New York City, 1850s, 1860s, stuff is going down, the city is growing and they have just built a fancy new park called Central Park.
Now I want to mention that one of the things they did to make this park is kick people off the land, so like hundreds of black New Yorkers were displaced in addition to other New Yorkers as well to make the park.
But New York has this park and they are trying to figure out what to put in it.
And at this time, Wendy, we are like just starting to creep up toward dinosaur mania.
A heart. So again, what do we know about dinosaurs in the 1860s?
Today, I mean, listen, we got tons of dinosaurs, tons of museums. Your average four -year -old can barely wipe their own butt, but they can tell you what a triceratops is.
Right. It's like, dinosaurs are part of our culture, in a way that they totally were not in this period of time.
Right. Yet. So what's going on is, like, over in Europe they've dug up a few big fossils.
They've got an iguanodon, they've got a megalosaurus, some stuff like that.
And in the U .S., actually, we've got our first home -grown US dug up dinosaurs dug up in New Jersey actually, and scientists are just starting to piece these together to get a picture of what a dinosaur might have looked like.
It's so cool to think about what it would be like to be doing that work.
We've got a new park, we've got new dinosaurs.
This is where a British guy called Benjamin Waterhouse Hawkins enters our story.
Okay. Wendy, do you know the phrase BFD?
No. Like, oh, we can use freaking, like, big freaking deal.
Is what BFD stands for?
Because in this story, big freaking deal, in this story Benjamin Waterhouse -Halkins is a big freaking deal.
Okay. So, let me tell you a little bit about this guy.
He's an artist and a sculptor in the UK and who does tons of nature drawings.
He's actually done drawings for, I don't know, a little someone named Charles Darwin.
Maybe you've heard of him.
Okay, okay. All right.
One historian actually wrote that quote, Hawkins almost single -handedly ignited a popular interest in dinosaurs and other forms of prehistoric life that continues to the present day.
Ooh. The big thing Hawkins does is in London.
He designed and built these massive concrete models of dinosaurs.
Right. And actually, they still exist today, so we sent our producer, Michelle Deng, to check them out.
Ooh, there he is. I'm coming up on him.
Oh, there's a lot of them.
So, looking specifically at the agronodon.
Um, I don't know. His hands are, his paws are, his paws are, his claws are too big.
He has no neck. Oh, wow!
Because this is the 1800s, I don't know what dinosaurs look like.
Right. He's got the body of a bear, but he has a very fantastic rump.
He's big. He's big.
A bear combined with an alligator.
It looks like—it kinda looks like a Godzilla.
You know, it was— It was the best they could do.
Best they could do.
And this is actually when we hit a really big moment in our story.
Because get this Wendy, this guy, this artist, Benjamin Waterhouse Hawkins, He just like, happens to show up in New York City in 1868.
Like, just as they're trying to work out what to do with Central Park.
That's like Dinosaur Museum Kismet.
The best kind of Kismet, I would say.
Right. So the people in charge of Central Park, they get wind of this and they're like, oh, this is great.
Like, we want you to build us some dinosaurs.
And thus the plan, Wendy, for the Paleozoic Museum is born.
Do do do dah, duh, duh!
So, the park organizers—the park planners who bring on Benjamin Waterhouse -Hawkins—they basically roll out the red carpet for this guy.
Right. They are like, we're gonna pay you a bunch of money and then they set him up in this massive building on the park property, on the park grounds, called the Arsenal.
It looks like a castle.
Very, very thin windows, I guess.
So I went there with Carl Maling, paleontologist. Did you notice the railing on the stairs?
Oh, is it guns? Wow.
That really completes the imagery.
How did I miss that?
So do you think Benjamin Waterhouse -Hawkins walked up these stairs every day to go to work?
I have no doubt. I mean, there's other ways in the building, but why would you choose a different one if that's your way in.
You gotta use the gun stairs.
So you can imagine Benjamin Waterhouse -Hawkins here in this castle covered in guns.
Yes. And he has got huge plans for this New York museum.
Oh. What kind of plans?
There's a description of this of this dinosaur display from this book called Dinosaurs in the Attic mm -hmm and it says Waterhouse Hawkins quote planned to show the hadrosaurus being attacked by a carnivorous dinosaur, Laelaps, while two other Laelaps feasted on the corpse of yet another hadrosaur.
Ooh! This description goes on to say that nearby, the marine reptile E.
Lasmosaurus would lurk in the shallow water of a pool.
Moving farther along the evolutionary ladder, Hawkins had planned for two giant armadillos, mastodons, giant sloths, and a giant elk.
So, he's like going all out.
He's like, you and me to build dinosaurs.
I'll do you one better.
I got a whole scene of animals that didn't really coexist, well that's fine.
Don't worry about that part.
Would you like to see a picture of this?
I would love to see a picture of this vision.
Okay. Here it is. Oh, wow.
Even today, even today this would, I mean, obviously these dinosaurs look ridiculous.
And like, this one is like - Oh, the Hadrosaurus, yeah.
Look at its legs. Wendy, he likes a thick dinosaur, we know this about him.
And again, this would have been the first time most New Yorkers would have seen anything like this.
Right. So, to get more on all this, I called up a historian who is going to be key to our story.
Okay. Her name is Vicki Cooles and she's at the University of Bristol in the UK.
Can you imagine seeing that for the first time ever?
Like, can you imagine experiencing that?
Oh, I think it would have been very exciting.
I think it would have been the equivalent of somebody in the 60s and 70s going to Disneyland.
It would have transported them into another world.
Here is Carl on this too, our paleontologist. What do you think it would feel like to walk inside of this hall?
Panic in the best way?
I mean, I've heard, I don't know how apocryphal it is, but a lot of these really, really early exhibits, like the first mastodons that were mounted, which was just a mounted skeleton, You know, women would come in and swoon and pass out and people were throwing up and, like, no one had ever seen anything like this before.
And it was probably shocking.
I'm getting very sad that we don't have this today.
I wanna know what went wrong.
Yes. All right. So the first thing that happens is, you remember that beautiful building he was in, this arsenal that we talked about?
Yes. Love it. Beautiful stairs?
Yes, yes, yes. So Benjamin Waterhouse Hawkins, he gets moved from that beautiful space across the park to work in this shed.
instead. That takes us to a day that shall live in infamy, Wendy.
The great dinosaur smash -up.
There was a gang of workmen with sledgehammers just went in and smashed everything up into small pieces.
It's so thoroughly pulverized that you wouldn't recognize it if you found it.
This wasn't just some mindless vandalism.
They were actually sent in.
It is so bananas, even for the time.
It's bizarre. They could have said, you know, sorry, Mr. Hawkins, or get out of here, ass -****.
They could have said that, but destroying everything is bizarre and cruel.
Yeah, yeah. So, what happened?
And why? Why? yeah why yes that is the question why oh there's even before we get into the y there's one thing that I find particularly potentially outrageous one report that I saw said they might have actually not just smashed up the models it's possible they smashed up some real prehistoric fossils at the same time because there were bits of an alasmosaurus that had been loaned to Hawkins that have never been found again what yeah like here it's just here's Vicki I mean I don't know of anything else that compares to this in in the history of museums, in the history of dinosaur discovery, and it
was so final. So done.
So done. We don't know if Hawkins was there at the time.
I did ask Vicky, like, God, how do you think, like, how?
Just, like, how do you think he would've reacted to this?
I think he would've been a combination of absolutely incongescent with rage because of the injustice, absolutely incensed, and also devastated.
to you could argue it would have broken his heart.
I want answers, but we're going to get answers after the break.
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When you join Metro Plus Tacks for a limited time and subject to change max 1 offer per account Okay, welcome back today on the show the museum that wasn't where we left off This artists Benjamin Waterhouse Hawkins was creating the most beautiful dinosaur Museum the world hath ever seen Would have been amazing today We could have seen it at this moment but instead, it doesn't exist and we're finding out why.
Yes. We are. Let's get back to it.
Okay. Why would someone do this?
So that is what our historian Vicky wanted to know as well.
In a bunch of the stuff that she was seeing about this, one guy was getting blamed.
His name is William Boss Tweed.
You familiar? I could say I have, I'm familiar.
Alright, well that's good, that's why I'm here.
So, New York City in the mid 1800's is basically run by this group of corrupt Democrats.
So nothing's changed!
But I'm cheating! And within this group, Boss Tweed, is at the top of the heap.
He owns a bunch of land, he's a politician.
He was a State Senator.
And he's got his mitts in everything around town.
And I think it's fair to say that generally speaking like history has shown this guy to be like kind of a shady character.
He'd been accused of doing all kinds of stuff like vote rigging, extortion, bribery, the greatest hits of your 1800s, mid 1800s, New York, politician.
And here is actually how Vicky describes Boss Tweed.
He was known for being a very, very big man and tall as well.
So, I mean, he would have a very commanding presence.
I mean, he wasn't just fat, he was huge.
And he surrounded himself by his, for want of a better word, flunkies, who sort of did his bidding, and they became owners of the Tweed Ring.
Okay, when I think of Buzz Tweed, I can't imagine him as like a, you know, Hey, here's a bag of cash.
Say hi to your mother for me.
Yeah, and the Tweed Ring is very suspicious.
Like, you made someone to smash up a shed full of dinosaurs.
like Tweed Rings is gonna help you out.
Yeah. Okay, boss. Okay, we got it.
We got it. We're gonna smash it to Smith Reeds.
Like, is that... Yeah.
So yeah, people were suspicious that boss Tweed was behind this dino smash up for a few reasons.
Okay, like, for one thing, before the smash up, Tweed had put some new people in charge of the park.
And these people also eventually, like, they cancelled the museum.
Oh! Yeah, like, they had kind of told Waterhouse Hawkins to back off and they were like, actually, we don't think we want this Paleozoic Museum at all.
So... Suspicious, yeah?
Yeah, interesting. Huh.
Yeah, I mean, as far as motive for Tweed, people through...
Like, people have generally thrown a few of these around.
There were comments at the time about how Tweed probably killed this cuz he couldn't figure out how to make money off of it.
Oh, right, right, right, right.
like one of the books later written about this says, quote, Tweek was angry, because you could find no way to reap illegal profits and kickbacks from the museum's construction.
Right, so petty! And also, Wendy, I'm a little offended at the idea of somebody trying to make illegal money off of dinosaurs.
That's what was the downfall of Jurassic Park.
Oh, you're right! That's right!
There's this other theory that Tweek was mad, because after the museum was canceled, he'd gotten some bad press, like some science nerds said some stuff in The New York Times about him.
So, the bottom line here, is that, like, for decades, you know, nerds have been like, yeah, tweed, the tweed ring, he's the one who's got blood on his hands, or...
They did this. ...concrete dust or whatever.
Yeah, yeah. This is the theory.
But this made Vicky put on her true detective hat.
Okay. Because Vicky came across this story while she was working on her PhD.
She's actually studying art and how dinosaurs appear in art.
Mm -hmm. So, she came across this dino smash -up.
Yeah. And once she started noodling on it, like to her this idea, this tweet idea?
Yeah. Like things just didn't really add up.
And the more I thought this doesn't make sense, so therefore what did happen, it became one of those things that sort of bothers you a bit like an itch you need to scratch. So, Wendy, Vickie scratched that itch. So she started looking into the theories for why Tweed might have done this, and she wasn't buying them, basically.
Like, she just didn't buy that he was that mad about this bad press over the museum.
There's, like, one dinky article on page five of the Times, and it's like, Tweed was under fire for a lot of other stuff, you know?
So she was, like, it just didn't make any sense to her.
But she was kind of like, well, if it wasn't Tweed, then, who was it?
Yeah. So Vicky's digging into all the sources she can find.
I was beginning to get some tantalizing, just little clues.
It was like pulling in lots of different threads.
And she goes back to about the most boring document that I can think of, which is the meeting minutes of the Central Park board. So every time the people running the park get together, someone's taking notes, OK.
Well, I would say I was surprised at how absolutely fascinating it was reading these minutes.
I really was, I was absolutely hooked and all my friends looked at me like I was mad.
So she starts like going through these minutes.
Yeah, the big breakthrough for me was...
I was sitting in a cafe with a cup of coffee going through these and there was very much, ah -ha.
Yes, this a -ha moment.
So Wendy, Vicki knows that the date, she knows the date these dinosaur models got all smashed up.
Right. Right. It's May 3rd, 1871.
And she finds the entry in the minutes from the day before the dinosaur smash up.
So on May the second, there's an entry of the minutes of a meeting in which the board decide it's time they got rid of the temporary workshop.
And that the old barn shed and structures at that place be removed under the direction of the treasurer, Hemi Hilton.
What? So wait, what did she say?
In these boring meetings, it says that we're going to get rid of this crappy shed that he's been moved into.
Yeah. With all the structures in it, so that's like bureaucratic speak for the beautiful dinosaur models.
Yeah. And it's all under the direction not of Buzz Tuede, right?
But of who, this Henry Hilton I didn't leap around the place because I'm British, but, you know, I was pretty pleased.
There's one more piece of evidence, by the way, in Vicki's favor.
And it is that Benjamin Waterhouse Hawkins, himself, blames Hilton directly in a New York Times article in 1872.
Oh, okay. So who is Henry Hilton?
So Henry Hilton is the treasurer of this board that is running the park, and he has this reputation already.
As somebody who is kind of a jerk, kind of an oddball.
And also who doesn't have a ton of respect for artifacts.
Henry Hilton is known for kind of going around Central Park, like bossing everybody around.
Like there's this one story of him coming across this statue made of bronze and he's like, you know what, statues aren't supposed to be bronze.
They're supposed to be white like marble or whatever.
And he tells the sculptor, like you got to paint the statue white, and the sculptor is like no. Like it's a bronze statue and so Hilton's like, no, he like gets somebody, he finds somebody else and gets somebody else to paint the statue white.
He's a good idea. He's a man with a plan and it's that all every statue needs to be white.
Yeah. I mean, another weird thing that he does is they get this collection of whale bones and And he's like, we got to paint these white.
Yeah, right. And he actually like gets made fun of in the New York Times for being this guy with a can of white paint, like running around painting everything white.
There's another clue here that I want to mention.
Because Henry Hilton is also a supporter of a different museum that is in the works at this time.
It's the American Museum of Natural History in New York City.
Very famous, famously does exist, Wendy.
Yes, yeah. And right next to Central Park and, of course, that's in the works.
If you go there, I was there the other day, over the door, it's like, founded in 1869.
And remember, we're talking about 1871, this happening.
This is like an exact same time that these two museums are potentially in the works.
Oh. Do you think conspiracy, like tin foil had time?
Do you think the organizers of the American the American Natural History Museum smashed these dinosaurs.
Cause they were jealous.
Cause they didn't want the competition.
Well, I do know there were a lot of powerful people behind the American Museum of Natural History to go full tinfoil hat.
I did actually reach out, I've reached out to the American Museum of Natural History on multiple occasions to asked them about this and have received radio silence so far.
But couple things, Like we don't have any direct evidence that it was competition between the two museums that caused the dinosaur smash -up.
Vicky is not saying that to be clear.
So why does she think Hilton did it?
Yeah, well, let me tell you.
Let me tell you why Vicky thinks Hilton did it.
So as much as Hawkins, our artist, did some important work, he also like sometimes kind of sucked.
And there's this one story in particular that Vicky told me that I think kind of illustrates this.
He got into some nonsense back in the UK?
He was actually a bigamist. He was married with two families.
And there is some speculation that actually, it would be a good idea for him to get out of there because, I think, one wife had found out about the other wife and it was, perhaps, more of a tactical withdrawal.
Yeah, it was decades, by the way, that this woman did not know.
He had a second family, anyway.
It's a whole ... I mean, it was easier back then, right?
Yes. No social media.
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, none of that suspicious Instagram content.
Yeah, right, right.
So it's not just being sneaky with wives.
Like in general, Hawkins, he could be pretty crusty.
He had fallen out with paleontologists.
He was fighting with scientists.
Kind of thought he knew more than everybody else did.
Kind of thought he was the smartest guy in the room.
So when it comes to Henry Hilton ordering the Dino Smash -Up, here is what Vicky thinks happened.
I actually think it was personal.
I think that we saw Hilton was a strange character.
incredibly arrogant, thought he knew best, but we also know now that Hawkins himself, he could also be incredibly arrogant.
Incredibly arrogant.
If Hilton had tried to criticize Hawkins work, Hawkins was going to be having absolutely none of it.
So it seemed to me that that's where the real root of this happened and of course, we can't be witnesses to history, but I strongly suspect that there might well have been and quite fruity arguments or whatever between the two that might well have eventually triggered this.
If you were making a film, you would have quite a good showdown I think.
Mm -hmm... So she just hubris smashed the dinosaurs, is that what she's saying?
Yeah. I mean... That creates man, man creates dinosaurs, so...
Man just like surface man.
Man smashes dinosaurs.
Yeah, I mean, yeah that's what she thinks.
She's kind of like, you know, we don't have, we don't have like a, we haven't found a ton of like direct evidence of that.
But she's like, look, I know these were two jerks.
I think they were on a collision course.
Right. It is funny, because like our obsession as humans with wanting to be like, why would you do this?
Why would you smash it?
And then how they like, how history had kind of developed this theory about boss tweet.
Maybe he couldn't make enough, like, a legal money from it.
Which seems like there's a total bullshit motive.
And then— and then with Hilton, I kinda love that Vicky was like, you know what the motivation was?
They were both kinda assholes, and Hilton was a bigger asshole.
There's no bigger— There's no bigger idea here.
It's just like an asshole to him.
So last year, Vicky and a colleague wrote this paper laying this whole thing out.
You know, this idea that Tweed wasn't involved at all, that Hilton was the ringleader of this whole disaster.
And while Vicky wasn't the first person to ID Hilton as the culprit, this paper was a big deal for Karl.
I mean, he's been following this dino smash -up for years, and he was just like...
Wow, they put in the time.
They dug so deep. They were obsessed.
They found things that a lot of people missed.
It's pretty amazing.
And there's one more mystery to this story.
So there's actually conflicting reports of what happened to the smashed up bits of models.
There were actually some claims that they were dumped in a lake, or even that the dyno model chunks were used to pave the paths of the park, which just feels like it would be such a dick move.
Like, smashing them up and putting them as rocks down under people's feet for us to walk on.
So, Carl, this is the last thing I did with Carl, he's done a lot of research on this, and he thinks he knows the right spot.
Like the real deal for where the pieces are, if they exist in Central Park.
And it's this place called the Mount.
Oh wait, so. Is it this hill?
It's apparently this hill, yeah.
I think most stories point to this and the building is where.
This is where the smashed dinosaur is like?
Yeah, this is the smash dinosaur graveyard. I would love to see a piece of one of the models I would love to see that so we're walking up this hill so far rocks and grass They don't look does anything look suspicious to you.
No what just a dinosaur head sticking out of the ground know All of it is just gone and there's no there's no marker here.
There's nothing There's no sign that this was anything but a hill but there's a whole story here.
I No, I keep looking at the ground, like, I'm gonna see anything but cigarette butts.
There's probably something here.
I want there to be.
I'm a dreamer, I'm a romantic, but I'm also the scientist addicted to accuracy and those two worlds rarely cross over.
They cross over all the time.
What am I talking about?
I mean, and Carl, he is hopeful that maybe there is something left, Toa Buhadrosaur, maybe one of the thugs took a souvenir home that day.
so that there is stuff that might be out there.
A hundred percent, it has to be there.
Some, somebody's sequestered this stuff in their basement or in some frozen mountain out west...
something. This story's not over.
If you have a dinosaur pore, claw, something in your basement, dinosaur crimes?
Yes. High dinosaur crimes have been committed, Wendy.
We cannot let it stand.
We will not. We will not.
We cannot. Someone's gonna find something cool.
If we wait here long enough, some nerd's gonna tell us what happened here.
That's all I want. I just want to wait long enough for a nerd to tell me what happened.
That's all we exist for.
Thank you, by the. Thank you, Wendy.
That is Science Vice's The Great Dino Smash -Up of 1871.
Hello? Alright. Introduce yourself.
My name is Ariy Netovich. I was an intern at Science versus, and I have been doing science writing ever since then.
How many citations are in this episode?
There are 49 citations in this episode.
49. People can find them in a link to the transcript which is in our show notes.
Ari, what are you most excited about when it comes to this episode?
I'm excited for the audience to get to see pictures of these weird, weird creatures and what they would have looked like.
Oh, yeah, which we're going to put on our Instagram, which is science underscore vs and also something Ari that you don't know about but we need your help with as well, is if you go onto our Instagram there is a survey that we want all of our listeners to fill out which has nothing to do with dinosaurs it's about the last mysteries of sex basically for a future episode I have tried desperately to find scientific answers to some questions and I cannot and we need your help.
And last time that we did a similar survey, we ended up getting it published.
It was our survey on Blue Balls, which is now published in peer -reviewed literature.
So if you wanna help science, totally anonymous survey, please, please help us out, all right?
You should do it too.
You should. Oh, you know I love to anonymously help science.
Excellent, and I hope all of our listeners do too.
It's on our Instagram, science underlying V's.
It's also the link in my TikTok, which is at Wendy Zuckerman, and it'll be in the show notes.
Thank you so much, Ari!
Nice to hear from you.
It's great to hear from you.
This episode was produced by Blyde Terrell with help from me, Wendy Zukerman, Ari Matovich, Michelle Dang, Meryl Horen, Rose Rimmler and Joel Werner.
Editing by Blyde and Me.
Fact checking by Erica Akiko Howard. Mixed and sound design by Bobby Lorde.
written by Bobby Lord, Emma Munger, Sow Wylie, Boomi Hidaka, and Peter Leonard. Thank you so much to everyone that we spoke to for this episode, including Professor Gowon Dawson, Robert Peck, Wendy Anthony, and Jessica Lytton.
A special thanks to Jack Weinstein, the Zuckemin family, and Joseph LaVell Wilson.
Science versus is a Spotify Studios original.
Listen to us for free on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts.
But if you are listening on Spotify, then just tap the bell icon and you'll get notifications whenever new episodes come out.
If you want to fill out our sex survey, and you should do it, head to our Instagram and just there's a link in the bio.
It's also in my TikTok.
At Wendy's Zuckerman, you could be a part of science.
Go fill it out. I'm Wendy Zuckerman.
Back to you next time.
D 'you want me to tell you a New York anecdote to get us in the mood.
Yeah, tell me a New York anecdote.
Tell me New York. I mean, have you missed it.
I mean, there was a human turd on the way here.
You know, I wasn't going to tell you until we were on the mic, but I did leave that for you to help you find your way to the office.
Yes. It was huge! You know.
It was so huge. And saving it up.
Because I just wanted to give you the classic New York welcome, so...
It just wouldn't be right to welcome you with anything but a steaming pile of sidewalk feces.
