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I have been listening to the Martha's Vineyard Beach and Book Club, which actually Elena recommended to me.
She did not listen to it but she said girl this title sounds so you and let me tell you it did.
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Hey, weirdos. I'm Ash. And I'm Elena. And this is Morbid.
It's a big ol' morbid addition. Spook spook, bitch.
In fact, this one's gonna be a two-parter.
One-two. Hope you're ready. Can you count to two?
I think you can. I think most all of you can.
I feel confident saying that. Well, this is the Canadian edition.
Canada. So, and a lot of people have requested this case.
Along with another Canadian case that we are going to cover, I want to promise everybody, because I think people were worried that since we're covering this one, we won't cover the other one. no we're gonna cover all of the cases we got plenty of time until we die exactly until morbid meets a morbid end Which hopefully will be when we're like 200 years old.
I don't want to live to 200, but you can.
Well, today's case... is the Ken and Barbie Killers.
Carla Homolka and Paul Bernardo. The grossest humans this side of the Mississippi.
Can I just say? Ew. Yeah. Both of them.
This is one of those cases that a lot of people know about.
A lot of people were like, oh shit, I don't know if I can listen to this one because it's that bad.
This one is right up there with the Toy Box Killer.
It's tough. This is a tough one. Because it involves family.
Yeah. And I just want to put it out there.
If lots of sexual assaults and rape is... something you are not comfortable listening to warning this is an entire episode about it so we just want to let you know i mean i hope you stick around but i get it if you don't It's okay.
We have plenty more. Skip an episode. It's totally fine.
But if you're here, great. Hey, everybody listening still.
You're brave. We'll let you know when the super gnarly stuff is coming, by the way.
So if you want to give it a shot. and you're a little weary about it i'm gonna let you know like this is gonna get gnarly guys should i say something should i have like a word that i say like a trigger warning word I mean, I'm just going to say it's going to get gnarly, guys.
Not a code word. It could just be like, hey!
I mean, yeah. I'm going to do that every time something gets rough.
So I'm going to say this is going to get gnarly, guys.
And I'm going to say, hey! So I'm not going to do that.
Just know that. But yeah, so this is a crazy case.
Get ready. And we really only have one piece of business we're going to get to because we're going to thank our Patreons, our Patronuses, our beautiful Patreons.
Patrons. Donators. Tequilas. Tequilas. Patron.
Our Don Julio's. Yeah, you know. We're going to do that in Ashes Minisoad this week.
So, which I believe will be coming out on Saturday.
So keep up for that. Only piece of business is we finally packed up your little gift packs, Patreons.
So be on the lookout for those because we are sending them out.
It's going to be Ash-centric. and elena centric and you're gonna open it and love is gonna fill your morbid house exactly Okay.
Okay. All right. So without further ado, Carla Leanne Homoka was born on May 4th, 1970 in Ontario, Canada.
I like how you went southern. Which is not how they speak in Canada.
Ontario. You know us in Ontario. ha it's canada ha canadians are like literally go fuck yourself ash we don't sound like that eh we're just gonna do that a lot just kill us later because also by the way we love canadians yeah just want to put that out there we do you guys are like the nicest people that's ever existed you were obsessed with their prime minister for a time um for a time I mean, hello, Justin Trudeau.
But anyways, her mom's name was Dorothy Seeger, I believe.
I don't know how to say that. Still is. Yeah, you're right.
And her dad's name was Karel, I believe is how you pronounce it.
I think it was actually Karel. Cool. But I'm not positive you might be right.
I didn't look up pronunciation. It's K-A-R-E-L.
I think it's Carol. I think I heard it that way at least.
Okay. So, Carol was a Czechoslovakian immigrant.
Cool. And he worked as a traveling salesman.
So he was like away a lot. He also had a really bad drinking problem.
And was really mean to her mom and to the kids.
And he was like really verbally abusive.
Cool. So that's a really great start. Yeah, I mean, we're flying off the starting line right now.
Yeah. Carla had two sisters. and they kind of would just like run off into their rooms and like comfort each other when they were younger but then when they got older they kind of like fought back yeah they're down but i'll get into that later uh carla suffered from asthma from a young age and she was actually hospitalized on and off throughout childhood Pretty much anytime she got too excited or, like, scared of something, it would trigger an asthma attack.
Oh, damn. Just a little sad fact. A little tidbit.
Not, like, a fun fact. It's like... I mean, now, I'm super glad she suffers from asthma.
I'd scare her all the time. Yeah. Boo! I would literally, like, stomp on all her inhalers right now.
Yeah. Bitch. growing up she liked to read nancy drew and the hardy boys like mysteries like that so did i if you ever read those never admit to it again yeah She was really bossy.
She liked to boss around her friends. She would like always decide what games they were going to play, what activities to do.
And she just like delegated everybody around her like a big, biatch which it's like if you didn't know what she was gonna be later you'd be like good good for you girl like way to be a powerful woman and just like take charge but now you're it's like fuck that bitch.
Yeah, exactly. Like, why are you so bossy?
Yeah. Another not fun fact, one day she decided to make a parachute for her friend's hamster. and they tossed it out the window what obviously the parachute didn't work and the hamster died i am shocked And then, a couple weeks later, Carla decided to dig up the dead hamster to see what a decomposing body looked like.
Oh girl. That's from a book. Oh girl. Yeah, it's fucked up.
So that's kind of like the first incident.
I mean, again, if she didn't do horrible shit later, I'd be like, that's weird, but like, whatever.
Yeah, but... She did horrible shit later.
But now it's getting... All these things are so much worse when you put them in context with what she does.
Into perspective and like... But yeah, so that was like the first incident that kind of showed a side of Carla that was a little dark.
Yeah, a little dark. It's also interesting, though, because Carla showed a huge love for animals from a really young age.
I was going to say, I remember reading that.
She had dreams of becoming a vet and one of her first jobs was actually at a pet store.
So then you wonder if, like, who knows how old she was when she did that.
Yeah, I don't exactly know. Maybe she was young enough that she thought it was going to be an experiment.
I don't know because kids are dumb and crazy.
Yeah, they're really dumb. And like maybe she dug it up because she was interested in animals and she wanted to see what happens later.
But it's like... That's still weird. Yeah.
I don't know if all vets started out that way.
I don't think they did. I'm going to bet $20 that they didn't.
I'm willing to bet they didn't. Yeah, no, I don't think so.
But anyway, so, yeah, in high school people said that it was obvious Carla did not give a single shit what anybody thought of her.
Yeah. Friend said that she liked to yell swears just to get reactions out of people.
Or, like, pretend. Yeah, I don't even know.
But. Just to be a dick. Yeah. with her parents a lot and she was super mouthy toward her parents like her friends were like yeah even i wouldn't be that they're like chill girl yeah like calm down She didn't dress like the other kids.
She didn't want to conform to like any like societal norm or like social norm.
Which, that's cool. Yeah, it is. Again, without the context.
Yeah. I go, yeah. Totally. I suppose. Our friends from high school remembered her having super high highs. where she would talk about college and becoming a vet or even a police officer, which, like, if you put... just ever i'm just gonna tell you to keep putting things into fucking perspective and then later you're gonna look back at all of this and be like whoa what i'd be like what carla what's happening.
But when she wasn't having her high highs, she would have her low lows.
She would seem super depressed, introverted, and She actually showed close friends a cut on her wrist where she claimed that she tried to kill herself.
Oh boy. And she had also claimed that she tried to OD on sleeping pills.
So she talked a lot about wanting to kill herself and like showed people like cuts and stuff on her arms.
Oh, okay. She definitely like had a lot that she was going through.
Her friends were confused, though, by her personality changes and felt like her apparent suicide attempts were just like to get attention.
Especially because she's, like, showing them off, like, badges of honor.
And people also are, like, she's, like, wicked full of herself.
Like, she thinks she's the shit. Yeah. So, like, she's not going to kill herself.
Yeah. Like... That, like, that's how she came off.
Yeah. Like I mentioned before, Carla's parents had a rocky relationship.
Another fun fact. her mom found out that her dad was having an affair one time and her like idea of solving it was that they just like have a threesome with his mistress.
Whoa. Yeah. That is every dude who's ever had an affairs dream.
Wildest dream. Literally. I was like, wow.
Like, damn Carla's mom. Yeah. But also it's like, you can kind of look at that and be like, is that where she got her idea of what was okay?
Oh, I mean, if you're looking at that as, like, your model here... Yeah, like...
Like some kids won't look at that as their model, but some kids take it in as that's how I live.
That's how I need to live. think of everything else that she saw from her parents she was like oh okay this is yeah so yeah that was rough um yeah so she was pretty angsty as a teen obviously Even though her parents had a rocky relationship, Carla was pretty close with her dad, which is interesting because he was, like, pretty abusive toward the whole family.
But whenever she needed or wanted something, she asked him for it.
But when they fought, it was, like, lethal.
She and her sister Lori were known to yell, At their dad, fuck off when fighting with him.
And they would call him a dumb check all the time.
Whoa. That's how I say that, right? Yeah.
Yeah. So yeah. Damn. But like you have to think like I'm sure like their mom like yelled shit at him too.
Yeah that's true. I mean if you learn it.
They were just in a crazy ass, sad ass. What a family.
House ass. Like a house sass. When Carla wasn't in her woes, she was definitely very confident and interested in flirting with dudes.
Before Carla met Paul Bernardo, she dated a guy named Doug, and she said that they had sex and experimented with drugs together.
Doug told his friends that they engaged in like pretty normal sex.
Yeah. But Carla told an elaborate story involving like heavy BDSM, like, handcuffs, dog collars.
And he's like, yo, it was ver-vanilla. ver vanilla missionary is my preferred position like that's what duck said we should make a shirt that says yeah Anyways.
That's what Doug said. It says, for vanilla missionary is my favorite position.
Dash, Doug. I love it I love it Anyways And friends were alarmed to hear that from, like, a sweet young girl like Carla.
They were like, damn, Carla. Again, they were all Southern.
I don't know why I keep doing that. Aside from enjoying your typical Nancy Drew mystery novel. and casual hamster resurrection, Carla was becoming more and more interested in the occult.
She did typical shit with her friends, like fucking burning candles and seances and trying to find Ouija boards.
Same girl. Yeah. literally re-fucking-tweet.
I'm gonna be on that one. And that's it.
That's as far as we go together. I won't even go toward Ouija boards.
Fuck that. I know I won't either. I did, though.
I never did. I've never touched a weed before.
Really? I fucking refuse. And the day...
My dumb ass kid, my dumb ass future kid comes home with a goddamn Ouija board.
They're evicted. I never had one, but I definitely did. at parties.
You're evicted if you've done a Ouija board.
Alright. Future kid, take note. But friends also report seeing small circles carved into her arms, colored in with different nail polishes.
Whoa. And she wrote in a book, Michelle Remembers.
That's, like, the title of the book. It's about, like, Satanism, sexual abuse... repressed memories wow um she wrote in the book there is always something more left to say whoa yeah so I wonder if she was sexually abused.
I wonder. Obviously before she met Paul.
Yeah. I didn't read anything about that.
Yeah, I haven't read anything either, but I do wonder.
I definitely wander based on a lot of shit in this case.
Like, I'm not going to accuse anybody, but.
No, me either. I'm just saying. 100%. Maybe all these strange tendencies and seemingly darker fantasies are what made her so interested in Paul.
Maybe. So, Paul Bernardo was born August 27th, 1964 in Scarborough, Ontario.
To Kenneth and Marilyn Bernardo. Kenneth was a disgusting beast of a human.
Yeah, he had a real bad childhood, huh? Yeah, his childhood is actually...
I don't excuse anything he did because of it, but it's really sad if he hadn't turned into a garbage human.
But yeah, his dad was a beast of a human, if you can even refer to him as a human.
Just human garbage. Yeah, not even human.
He faced charges for pedophilia, child molestation, being a peeping Tom, and he was also molesting Paul's sister.
Jesus. Yeah. Guys. If that wasn't enough, he also verbally and physically abused the entire family and was horrible to Paul's mother.
He calls her like every name in the book, like bitch, fat cow, whore, sad, sad, mean names.
We're really setting up some winners here.
For real. For real. paul's mom suffered from depression oh crazy i know yeah why wow i don't know if it was before or because of everything but but that definitely didn't help yeah And she tended to remove herself from the family.
She would go away for the weekend by herself to visit her family or...
Like, just, she was, like, gone all the time.
And eventually she moved into the basement of the family's home.
Like, she moved to the basement. Oh my lord.
Interesting. Somehow, after all of that, Paul was described as pretty happy and normal.
Adults around him thought that he was super well-mannered.
Wow. He was a well-adjusted child. A la Ted Bundy.
His happiness and innocence took a turn at 16, a la Ted Bundy, when he learned that his father was not actually his biological father. and that his mother had an affair.
Which resulted in her becoming pregnant with... So one, the guy who you thought was your father is like a... awful pedophile child rapist peeping tom wife abuser yep and you're like upset That he's not your biological parent?
That's what I said. Because I'd be like, oh, mom, you had an affair?
Good for you. Awesome. Yeah. Super glad I don't share that dude's DNA.
Yeah. That just shows how fucked up Paul is from the get-go.
Because I would literally be like, oh, thank God.
Breathing a sigh of relief. I'd be like, no, none of that dude's DNA runs through my veins.
That's great. I don't need it. Yeah. Great news.
Pop the champagne. Paul was like, I'm mad and you're a whore.
Oh, so he already had that like women are the problem thing from the beginning. yeah oh paul wonder where he learned that wonder uh he started verbally abusing his mom and called her all the things that kenneth did and he called her a whore a slob and a bitch and all those fun things he started working at amway after high school he pretty much started using the sales tactics that he was learning to flirt with women okay So he would like practice his sales techniques at bars and like pick up women and bring them home.
Except it didn't last very long with these women because he was a fucking psycho.
He had super dark sexual fantasies. You don't say.
Hi, Carla. He was abusive. Carla's like, hey.
She's like, me too. Did you hear about me and Doug?
Doug's like, no. Vervanilla. Vervanilla.
Vervanilla missionary, Carla. Ugh. God. So he was abusive to these women and threatened to kill women if they ever spoke of what he did to them.
Hey, cool. Yeah. Yeah. October 17th, 1987, Paul and Carla cross paths.
Oh, the romance began. She is 17. He's 23.
And also a rapist, which Elena will get into.
Sure will. The two meet at a hotel restaurant and just a few short hours later, they are having sex in a hotel room.
Wow. True love. True love. Live your best life.
It's an instant connection for the absolute worst.
Yeah, absolutely. They start dating in Carla's family. fucking loves paul that's what i read they're like obsessed with paul yeah like um her sisters say that he was like the brother they always wanted Yeah, he's a true psychopath, sociopath.
He learned how to win everybody over. He lived more than two hours from Carla, but he would make the drive all the time and just come over and visit her.
What a gent. But all of that short-lived because a year in, she tells her friends that he's already verbally abusing her.
Cool. But she forgives him, and on December 24th, Christmas Eve of 1989, they become engaged at Niagara Falls.
Oh, snap. But he's already a rapist. He sure is, guys.
He sure is. This is my friend Elena. Hey.
I'm new. Be nice. So I'm going to fill you guys in on all the terrible rapey things here.
So things are about to get gnarly for a minute.
Slightly gnarly. They're going to get even gnarlier after that.
Just strap in, everybody. Hold on to those butts.
Hold on to your butt. Glue, super glue your butt together.
So by this point, by the time that Carla and Paul had met, had started dating, all that good, delicious, romantic stuff...
Paul was already a pretty well-established rapist.
Great. Obviously, no one knew he was a rapist.
But his crimes were being attributed to what the media and police were referring to as the Scarborough Rapist.
Scarborough Rapist. obviously they didn't know it was him but you know they find out later don't worry so in 1987 is when he began really on this Scarborough rapist path.
Mind you, 1989 was when they were engaged.
So he had been a rapist for two years. Now, he began a series of up to 24 rapes or attempted rapes during a five-year period at this point.
Insane. Yeah. He mostly was after teenage girls.
He liked very young girls. Gross. And very young women, basically.
Most of the attacks happened outside, which is very odd.
I'm going to get into a couple of them. Obviously, I'm not going to name anybody.
Uh, I'm just going to give you an idea of where, how these things happened.
Tons of them happened outdoors and in very crazy, like scary, spooky ways.
But at least one time he did break into a victim's house and tried to rape her in her room.
Goodbye, goodbye, goodbye. And I'll get into that.
The attacks also came along with beatings, intense verbal abuse.
And then he would threaten the victim, if you tell anyone about this, I'm coming back here.
Because usually he would do it around their house.
And he even stole one girl's ID, right? Yeah.
And he would do it around their house, so he knew where they lived.
So he said, I'll come right back here and I'll murder you and your whole family, if you say anything.
That's so funny. So that's why a lot of these people, a lot of them did report it, luckily, but some of them didn't until way later.
So I'm just going to go through a couple of these, a few of these, just to give you an idea of what a fucked up monster he is.
Great. May 4th, 1987, he raped a 21 year old in Scarborough.
He did it in the front of her parents' yard.
Oh my god. After he followed her home. Wow.
Like, literally raped her in front of her parents' house.
May 14th, 1987, so only a few days later. raped a 19-year-old woman in the backyard of her parents' house.
Yep. July 17th, 1987, he attempted to rape a young woman, but he like beat the hell out of her, but she fought the hell back and he abandoned it.
Shit. So good for that girl. I was going to say, you go girl.
September 29th, 1987, he attempted to rape a 15-year-old girl.
Ew. He did this. This is the one that he broke into her home.
Oh my God. And he entered into her bedroom, a 15-year-old who's asleep. he jumped on her back put his hand over her mouth threatened her with a knife bruised the side of her face and bit her ear my god he then but he fled before he was able to do anything else because her mother came in the room and started screaming jesus christ See, hold on.
That girl would literally never go to sleep again.
No. How would you ever fall asleep again?
The worst thing is with this one. is a 19-year-old named Anthony Hannah Mayer was convicted of this crime in 1989.
And he served a 16-month prison sentence.
Wow. But he was exonerated after Bernardo admitted to this.
Oh, my God. So this poor guy got nailed for this.
Yeah. May 25th, 1988, he was actually very close to being caught and it's like, It's like so frustrating because so many lives could have been saved.
He was almost caught by a uniformed Metro Toronto investigator who was staking out a bus shelter.
Because he had picked up another 15 year old from like a bus stop.
So they were staking out the bus stops. The investigator noticed him hiding under bushes.
Like, what the fuck? Pursued him and he got away.
He, like, was just, like, too fast. Yeah, he was able to run away.
Wow. isn't that crazy in october 4th 1988 he attempted another rape in scarborough But his victim fought him off.
But he was able to stab her in the thigh and buttock.
And she required more than 12 stitches. Oh, my God.
So he wasn't afraid to actually stab people already.
No. If you were going to fuck with him, he was going to kill you.
He just didn't do it yet. November 16th, 1988, he raped an 18-year-old woman in the backyard of her parents' house.
November 17th, 1988 is when the Metro Police finally formed a task force to get the Scarborough rapist.
In 1989, around August, he raped a 22 year old woman that he had stalked her outside of her apartment window the night before and then waited for her to come home.
Are you serious? That's terrifying. Like he BTK'd it.
Literally BTK'd it. Fuck BTK. So in 1990, May 26, 1990, he raped another 19-year-old woman.
But his victim had a very vivid recollection of what he looked like.
Yes. And the police were able to create a computer composite portrait of him.
They released it two days later by the police.
They published it in Toronto, all the Toronto area newspapers, all over the news.
And they got around 16,000 responses to it.
And three of those responses were from people who said it was Paul Bernardo in that portrait. investigators did question Bernardo twice because he lived in his parents' Scarborough home at the time.
Right. He was interviewed November 20th, 1990.
It only lasted about 35 minutes. He voluntarily provided samples for forensic testing.
Yeah. That's scary. He was ballsy. When they asked Bernardo why he thought he was being investigated for this, he said that, I guess I look like the picture.
Wow. He was fearless with this. He was like, sure, you can have my semen.
And then he was like, yeah, sure. I look like the portrait.
Like he was not at all. Well, because in his mind, he probably was like, I'm never going to get caught because he's a fucking psychopath and probably a narcissist.
The detectives said he was super credible and they believed him.
So he was released. That's so scary to me.
And again, they took samples of his hair, blood, and saliva for DNA testing, which you'd be like, okay, well, they can nail him right away.
How did they not? Well... This was back in 19, what was it?
1987. This was 1990 when they brought him in.
DNA testing was super new in Canada. The Center of Forensic Sciences in Toronto only had one qualified scientist and one technician that could do this.
So the samples taken were among dozens of other samples that they had taken to compare to the Scarborough rapist case.
And I think they had around like 50,000 samples collected at this time.
So it just took a long time. He just kind of got put in the backlog and they were making their way through.
Right. It's crazy, though, that he was like, yeah, I'm gonna get away with this.
Like, they're gonna test it eventually, dude.
He didn't give a shit. But whatever. So like Ash said, Carla's family fucking loved Paul.
They really fucking did. Especially her sister, Tammy. who was her younger sister at the time.
She was around 15 years old. She really loved Paul.
Paul took a special liking to her as well.
Because he's a fucking pervert. Now, at this point, he had lost his job as an accountant and was actually working smuggling cigarettes across the Canada-United States border.
His family, her family did not know about this.
But like we said, Paul had a very weird obsession and infatuation with Tammy.
Gross. In 1990, Paul started to pressure Carla to allow him to have sex with Tammy.
What? You know normal relationship issues, right?
No. You're, you know... Your fiancé at the time is just like, you know, I'd love it if you would let me have sex with your younger sister.
Ew. Like, what the fuck, dude? That really grosses me out on like a whole, like a galactic level.
So this, just again, another warning, this is about to get real gnarly.
So get ready. This case is so fucking stressful.
Now, one of the main issues that was in their relationship, because Carla was all about pleasing Paul.
Right. Carla would do anything he wanted.
They established like a sub-dom kind of relationship pretty early on.
And she was fully the sub. Doug was not into it.
No, Doug was ver vanilla. And Paul was like, let's do this.
So she called Carla called Paul like her King, all that stuff, like treated him like a King, like whatever he wanted, he got.
Yeah. So she was all about pleasing him.
That's all she lived for. And one of the things that he was really upset about... was that Carla had had sex with Doug before they met.
So she was not a virgin. Shit. And he was real upset about that because he had a real thing for taking girls' virginity.
Like what? Because Paul is a fucking splatter on the canvas of life.
That's what he is. That's funny. He's a shit splatter on the canvas of life.
Yo, Paul, you a shit stain. You are a shit splatter, Paul.
Now, obviously, at this point, we're in 1990.
He loved taking girls' virginity, usually without their consent.
Yeah, I was going to say. Let's be real about this.
He had a real knack for that. He did have a knack for that.
So Paul was so infatuated with Tammy that... that he would make Carla dress up as Tammy and act like her during sex.
Yo, that's, like... And Carla did it. What?
Like Carla did it. This is her little sister.
And she's like, sure. You need so much family counseling.
So much. So much. honestly you need euthanasia but like and she still needs euthanasia like this is bonkers He also took to watching Tammy undress outside of her window, and Carla... always wanting to please Paul, would actually leave windows open and broke Tammy's shade so that he would have better access to do this.
And he would literally stand out there and jack it.
And Carla would like help him. I don't want to know any of this information.
What is the human race, everybody? What are we?
What's happening? Where did we go wrong?
I don't get this. So this was, to her, to Carla, this was her way of giving him Tammy.
And hoping that he would be satisfied with this.
That's so horrific in and of itself. Because remember, he was pressuring her to have sex with her, to take her virginity.
So she was like, maybe I'll just do this and he'll be satisfied.
But it's like, nope, he wasn't. No. Like, spoiler alert.
I was just going to say spoiler alert. Breaking news.
He was not. Oh, God. now weird little side note in july he took tammy across the border to get beer for a party And Bernardo later told Carla that they, quote, got drunk and began making out. oh and carla's like okay cool i'm surprised i'm like i don't even know if i'm just surprised he didn't rape her I know.
I think he was trying to groom her. Yeah.
I don't think he wanted to forcibly do it.
I think he wanted it to be easy. Yeah. As we'll see.
So this is when she was like, all right.
I'm going to give Paul Tammy's virginity because it's obviously hers to give, right?
Yeah, totally. Yeah, obviously. At this point, Carla was working at a vet clinic because she loves animals so much, guys.
Remember, she's such a great person. So weird.
So she had access to all kinds of tranks, sedation methods, and stuff they use on animals, not humans.
So in July of 1990, she stole a bottle of Valium from the clinic in order to sedate her sister to give her to Paul.
That's really fucked up. On this particular night in July, she made Tammy a plate of spaghetti, which was apparently something she did often for her younger sister because...
Carla was such a great big sis. Totally.
But this was not the typical plate of spaghetti because this one contained a dose of the Valium.
Oh, shit. So Tammy went out cold because Valiant will fuck you up in big amounts.
And Paul was able to begin to rape her while Carla watched. she watched oh yeah oh she does much worse i was really canadian i feel yeah oh yeah no that was no that was minnesota minnesota yeah yeah I'm everywhere.
I know there's more later, but I didn't know that you watched.
There's much worse later. Well, I did know that, but I don't know.
But unfortunately for them, Tammy woke up because Valium will not knock you out cold for too long.
So she woke up, but by that point, Paul had like removed himself from the situation. so they just pretended everything was fine they were like oh yeah like weird you fell asleep you're crazy weird that i'm in bed with you yeah totally fine Over that same summer, it was said that he supplied Tammy and her friends with gifts, food, and soft drinks. and her friends said that it was weird because the soft drinks had, quote, a film and a few white flecks on the top.
So pretty sure he was trying to drug all those girls.
Oh my God. Yep. Now they put a pin in this one for a while, but he wanted more.
Yeah. So in December 1990, on Christmas Eve, which they got engaged in 89 on Christmas Eve, right?
So a year into their engagement. Yeah. To the day.
Now six months before their wedding, by the way, they put another plan into action.
The whole family was over. They had a one over the Homolka's house.
They had a great Christmas dinner. They were celebrating.
Paul had his famous video camera out and he filmed a ton that night because You know, this tool bag loves to take videos of stuff, as we'll see.
Once the whole family went off to bed, Paul and Carla told Tammy that she should hang with them for a bit and watch a movie. now they all went down to the furnished basement and they offered her some rum and eggnog so some spiked eggnog and if anyone is a little sibling who is listening right now You would be so excited.
All you want is to hang out with your cool older sister or brother.
Yeah. And especially if they have like a cool girlfriend or boyfriend that you love.
Yeah. And I was a younger sibling, you know, so like I get it.
All you want is to be like... And, like, included.
And you're 15 years old and, like, you want some spiked eggnog, you're gonna be like, yeah, I do!
Like... You think you can trust these people.
It's your older sister. And her boyfriend who you love.
Poor Tammy, man. Well, so Tammy was super into it.
Well, Carla laced that drink with halothane.
Which is? Which is a much stronger, it's used for anesthesia for like dogs.
Oh my God. And obviously when they use it for anesthesia in dogs, it's pretty well...
You know, it's dosed for the weight, for the breed, for the type, you know, everything.
But Carla didn't know what the fuck she was doing.
No, and this wasn't dosed. This was just, here's a shit ton of halothane. uh halothane also is like um it it decompresses your like airways and stuff if you take too much like it's a really intense drug I looked up a bunch of stuff about it.
There's a lot shit ton about it, but it's a really intense drug.
You shouldn't be shoving it in someone's face.
Just don't do it. So Tammy soon went unconscious.
Just don't do it, guys. Yeah, don't do that.
So Tammy soon went unconscious. And this is where things get really bad.
Really bad. So this is when Paul began raping Tammy while Carla filmed it on the video camera.
Which is beyond... Fucking human comprehension.
And this is the same video camera and the same tape that they just filmed Christmas on.
Like... An investigator said it literally goes from Christmas celebration to raping an unconscious Tammy.
That's insane. So just know, Carla is just as bad as Paul.
Oh, she's worse. You will see. This bitch should not be out right now, which by the way, she's out.
Yeah. Anybody listening in Canada, I'm sure you know that she is out.
Now, all the while, whenever Tammy would kind of like stir awake because she had just been dosed with it.
Mm-hmm. They would hold a halothane-soaked cloth over her face to knock her back out.
So they were just like re-dosing her. So then she was inhaling it.
She had just ingested it and now she's inhaling it into her airways.
This whole thing was filmed. It wasn't just Paul raping Tammy.
Oh, oh, oh, oh. Paul would rape Tammy, then he would encourage Carla to rape Tammy, so he would take the video camera and he filmed her raping her younger sister. who is unconscious.
And they took many turns. It is all on film and it was used against, well, mostly against him later.
But yeah, they're fucking monsters. That made me like actually nauseous.
Eventually, Tammy began vomiting and started to aspirate on her own vomit.
Because no one was fucking helping her. She's just laying there being brutalized and she's choking on her own vomit.
So Paul and Carla, instead of trying to help her, just got her dressed, cleaned her up, and called 911. what oh and brought her up to her room to make sure that it wasn't weird that she was in the basement So Tammy had a gnarly chemical burn on her face from the halothane being pressed onto her face with the cloth.
Like, crazy burns. Like, there's autopsy photos of Tammy Homolka.
And I've seen them. I'm sure a lot of people have.
They're like part of the case. They're intense.
I mean, one whole side of her face is just a red blotch.
Oh my God. It's insane. So, obviously, you would think that when the ambulance people, when the EMTs and when the police said, they'd be like, what's that about?
They would be like, uh, it's a fucking chemical burn.
Right. They both just claimed they were like, oh, she got drunk and crazy.
And, you know, like that's how she started choking on her own vomit because she just was super drunk.
And the Niagara Regional Police asked them about the burn mark.
And Bernardo said that it was a carpet burn that she got when he dragged her into her bedroom.
And they were like, oh, okay. And they were just like, oh, okay.
Like what? That's clearly a chemical. How they didn't realize that was a chemical burn?
Like how the pathologist didn't be like, hey.
Apparently they didn't have their best people on on Christmas.
And that just blows my mind that they just let that go.
I mean, that is some fucked up shit right there.
They should have looked at that. It was on her, like, lips and on her cheek.
It's crazy. I would say I'm going to post pictures from this case like we always do.
I might post a photo of that for anybody who does want to see it.
I will put a warning before that photo so it won't be just you flicking through and you're going to see it if you don't want to.
Yeah. So don't worry. But it's crazy. So she was rushed to St.
Catherine's General Hospital. was pronounced dead right when she got there.
Her death was ruled an accident, despite the copious amounts of evidence to the contrary.
And how did they not find the, what was that drug called?
Halothane. That wasn't found in her system?
No idea how none of this was found. Like what?
Yeah. And maybe, who knows? I don't even know.
I don't know if they did a full autopsy, if they did a talk screen.
Because they wouldn't have found it if they didn't do a talk screen.
And if they're just saying, yeah, she just drank a lot on her sister, what the hell?
They might not have asked for it. So it's just, it's bonkers.
Now this is where things get even crazier.
If that's even humanly possible. Crazy. Three weeks after Tammy Homolka's death, Carla and Paul filmed a video that is now referred to as, quote, the fireside chat.
They did this in the Homolka house. The video was viewed as court evidence.
And so the poor people, the poor jurors had to like listen to this.
And it's. There's a transcript of it online.
Maybe I'll post that somewhere so you guys can read it if you want to.
No thanks. I just want to put it out there in case anybody, because I know I said everything about the Toy Box Killer transcript and people hadn't found it.
I'll put it out there if you want to. It's pretty crazy.
It starts in the basement where... They killed him.
Yeah. And the two of them are naked and are laying in front of the fire.
And they're, you know. I don't think I've ever heard this part.
Doing various sex acts. while Carla literally says multiple times how much she loved watching him rape Tammy and that she loved raping Tammy.
And it's graphic as fuck. This Carla is a scary, scary lady.
And so is Paul. They're both, I mean, terrifying.
What happens in the human brain? And she also says that she loved watching him rape the other young girl a few days before that.
So she's already implicating that he's done this before.
She then says she wants to do that for him every weekend and get him all the virgins he wants.
She even says, and this is awful. So get ready.
Hey! Gnarly stuff coming up. She even says she wants four kids with him so he can rape them all.
Whoa! Yep. Like actually is saying this in like a sexy kitty voice as she's like performing fellatio. what the fuck yep then she takes a long stand there's a lot more to it but Then she takes a long stemmed red rose and puts it all over his naked body.
Then says she wants to leave this rose at Tammy's grave because it's been all over his intimate places and it would give him pleasure to leave it at her grave after that.
So she was real sorry about what happened to Tammy.
I am having an anxiety attack on air. Maybe we need a palate cleanser.
I need to be done. This is your palate cleanser with Annie.
I've been to Disney World 11 times. My favorite ride is Splash Mountain.
This has been your palate cleanser with Annie.
So if that wasn't bad enough, guys. I want to go home.
At some point, the filming of this fireside chat moved into Tammy's bedroom. tammy's room yep were they at carla's house yeah they were at the parent the homochal residence remember because they were in the basement where it happened oh fuck Paul goes into this weird soliloquy about how much he loves Tammy and calls her his baby. taking all these, like, shots of pictures of her in her room.
And he's saying, like, hi, Tammy. Love you, Tammy.
Bye. And then Carla shows up in the frame dressed up in Tammy's clothing. pretends to be her, and even talks in her voice.
Excuse you? Yep. And says things like, I hope Carla doesn't find out about us and shit.
And then they eventually have sex on Tammy's bed.
No, no, no. Is it over? Are we done with part one?
Almost. No. I need a palate cleanser again.
Pretty rough. Are you fucking, where were her, where was her family?
Like, where was the sister? I don't know where they were.
I mean, I think they were just like away at some point, so.
Yeah. Yep. And the poor jurors had to watch this.
How did she not die in prison? Because she didn't get enough time to, I don't think.
This whole Tammy situation obviously gave them a taste not only for sexually assaulting and raping young girls, but also killing them.
When it felt like they had to. It seems like their criteria for whether or not someone lived was whether or not they could identify them at this point.
Oh, okay, okay, okay. So they decided to start using Carla.
Like, she offered to... lure young girls for them to rape like she said in the video i want to do this for you someone should just punch her in the face every single day multiple times a day until she dies Luckily, I think people make her life pretty miserable.
She has to move, like, everywhere. Do they?
Trust me. And again, we'll get into that later because we'll give you the whole shebang on where she is right now.
Carla, before she worked at the vet clinic, worked at a pet store.
When she worked at the pet store, I think it was two years before that, She kind of befriended this girl who was 15 years old who worked there.
Normal. On June 7th, 1991, she invited the girl who is only referred to as Jane Doe.
Mm-hmm. She invited her out for a girl's night out.
They went out, they went shopping, they had dinner.
And then Carla was like, hey, do you want to come back to my house and we can have some drinks and just hang out? because you would never fucking think that's weird I can't even tell you how many times I've done that exactly And it's like, and it's a girl.
It's another girl. It's another woman. That you work with.
You would never think anything about that.
So she laced her alcohol with halothane.
And when the girl lost consciousness... She called Bernardo and said, Hey, I have a surprise wedding gift for you.
Come over. He got there, they undressed Jane Doe, and Paul videotaped Homolka raping her first.
And then he raped her. Now, the next morning, Jane Doe woke up and she was throwing up.
She was nauseated. She was sick from... the halothane but she thought it was because that was the first time she had ever drank alcohol oh my god which how sad is that i've ever fucking heard in my life So she had no idea that she had been sexually assaulted.
And she just thought that she like had like a cool girl fun night.
Yep. She thought she had a cool girlfriend night and she was like, yeah, it's the first time I drank alcohol.
I guess I got sick. Oh my God. Yep. Now Jane Doe left none the wiser.
She was invited back in August to spend the night.
And they did basically the same thing they did to Tammy again.
And Jane Doe stopped breathing after she was drugged and after Paul had began to rape her.
So it was basically the Tammy thing. Carla called 911 because she stopped breathing and she was like, oh shit.
But then called back a few minutes later and said, everything's all right.
Because they had revived her. The ambulance was called back and there was no follow-up.
That's totally fucking standard. So Jane Doe survived, but what the fuck?
Was that the last time they fucked with her?
That was the last time they fucked with her.
Now, this is just a little side thing. In 2001, the magazine Elm Street published an article that they kind of implied that forensic evidence said that Tammy's death was definitely not an accident.
Like that not... Not that I'm saying, you know what I mean?
Like that it was intentional on Carla's part.
Like she wanted to kill her sister. Yeah.
That this wasn't like, whoops, we overdosed you.
They said that she deliberately administered an overdose of halothane, and the magazine said that Carla was, quote, a malignant narcissist. who was so pissed off that Paul was so fucking infatuated with her younger sister and not her.
That she had to go. That she had to remove Tammy from the equation.
Oh my god. It makes fucking sense. It makes total sense.
And it's like, but then she continues to dress up as her and everything.
But maybe it's like now she doesn't have to worry about Tammy being the thing.
Right. She can just role play. And she's so psychotic that it's her.
Exactly. So I just thought that was like an interesting, because I believe that.
Oh, I 100% believe that. Because as a vet, if she was a veterinary assistant, a vet tech, if she was working in a vet office at all... she would know that what she was giving her was an overdose.
I'm sure she wouldn't know the exact dosage because...
You would have to, you know... Study that.
It translated into human dose, too, from animal dose.
Yeah. But you know that, like... If you're giving this much to a 30 pound dog, 110 pounds, like, I don't know how much she weighed, but like she was 15.
Yeah. like a 110 pound girl you're not gonna give the same dose to but it's like you're also not gonna give her like 40 times that dose you know what I mean it's like So I think she knew what she was doing.
And I do believe that she would want to remove her sister and that it would be no skin off her back.
And she would probably know that she was going to burn her fucking face.
Oh, yeah. She would definitely. Because you would know that you don't fucking put that right on top of skin.
Well, and I'm sure they would have to when they administered it.
Yeah. gloves and shit exactly i'm sure they knew like don't spill that and that they didn't put it directly on the animal skin right It's like they probably did it in some kind of intubation kind of thing.
Yeah. She knew what the fuck she was doing.
But we're going to stop here for part one.
Bye. We will take it back up. next week with part two where we will talk about the brutal rape and murder of Kristen French and Leslie Mahaffey Oh, you know, it's weird.
I have some sick time that I haven't used yet.
So I'm going to use that for next week. Okay.
Oh, yeah. Yeah. The sick time for the morbid podcast.
Yeah. I'm going to have to say no to that sick time request.
Sorry. I'm sick that day. Sorry. Sorry. I'm really sick that day.
I know I'm going to be You know what? I think we're all going to be really sick that day.
Yeah, I think so too. I'm pretty sick this day.
So yeah, so this was a doozy, guys. And it's only going to get worse.
No. So stick with us. We're going to get through this together.
We're all going to hold hands. We got through the toy box killer together.
We're going to get through this. I think this is worse.
I think it's worse in like a different way I think it's as bad they're on different planes of bad Yeah.
They're on the same wavelength. Yeah, I don't think one is worse.
I think it's just different wavelengths of bad.
It's because it's like family. Yeah. Yeah.
And Carla is just, I mean, Paul is a fucking monster.
I'm not. letting him she's a monster in a different fucking but they're just too you raped your sister for your man oh yeah Nothing's good about this.
And just as a little side note, we will be hitting Robert Pickton's, which is the other Canadian series. that a lot of people want to hear.
I promise we're going to hit that one. It's on our list.
We just wanted to hit this one first. uh fear not canadian listeners and yeah so i think we all got through this together and we're gonna get through part two In the meantime, you can follow us on Instagram at Morbid Podcast.
You can tweet us. A Morbid Podcast. Send us a Gmail. morbid podcast at gmail.com donate to our fucking patreon patreon.com morbid podcast if you feel so inclined your facebook group Morbid colon a true crime podcast.
And go check out the website that my lovely co-host so beautifully designed.
Morbidpodcast.com We hope you keep listening.
And we hope you keep it weird. want to make this one hold on i'm thinking But not so weird that when you find out you're adopted, you start to verbally abuse your mom just like your dad did, and not so weird that Carla Homolka is your spirit animal, and not so weird that want to be like Carla Hermoka or Paula Hermoka because I don't even want to say anything more about these people and I have to go now bye yeah because this one isn't funny guys it's not funny it's not funny Sorry.
Well, none of them are. This one's like real not funny.
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