Hey weirdos, it's Ash here, ready to share a little secret.
Have you heard of Wondery Plus? With ad free episodes and one week early access, it's like having an all access pass to our lighthearted nightmare.
So come join us on the dark side and try Wondery Plus today.
You can join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or in Apple Podcasts or Spotify.
You're listening to a morbid network podcast.
Listening on Audible helps your imagination soar.
Whether you listen to stories, motivation, expert advice, any genre you love, You can be inspired to imagine new worlds, new possibilities and new ways of thinking.
Listening can lead to positive changes in your mood, your habits, and ultimately your overall well-being.
Audible has an incredible selection of over 1 million audiobooks, podcasts, and Audible Originals all in one easy app.
Find the genres you love and discover new ones.
Explore bestsellers like my sister's title. new releases, plus thousands of included audiobooks, podcasts, and originals that members can listen to all they want with more added all the time.
I have been listening to the Martha's Vineyard Beach and Book Club, which actually Elena recommended to me.
She did not listen to it, but she said, girl, this title sounds so you.
And let me tell you, it did. I've been listening to it while I walk and I am absolutely loving it.
I love all the different narrators. I love Audible.
There's more to imagine when you listen.
Sign up for a free 30-day Audible trial and your first audiobook is free. visit audible.com slash morbid.
I am absolutely obsessed with a sweet treat after dinner.
And my favorite sweet treat right now is my mochi.
It's Mine, not yours. Just kidding. You can have some too.
This is a cool, creamy scoop of ice cream. wrapped in a soft, chewy dough.
It's like a sweet little ice cream dumpling or ravioli.
I'm obsessed. It's pillowy. It's satisfying.
I feel indulged. I just love it so much.
I really am obsessed with the strawberry flavor right now.
My mochi is only around 70 calories per piece, which like, hello, that's amazing.
My mochi is gluten free and each box has six perfectly portioned mochi snacks.
Do I eat two a night? Yeah. Yeah, I do because they're that good.
And guess what? My mochi is the number one mochi ice cream in the US of A.
The strawberry flavor is bursting with fresh picked fruit flavor that tastes incredibly refreshing.
I love, love, love them after dinner this August.
Look for the purple box of My Mochi ice cream at your local grocery store. and feel joyfully chill with the coolest treat around, my mochi.
Hey weirdos, I'm Ash. And I'm Elena. And this is Morbid.
It's morbid in the morning again. The AM sessions.
We are here and I am a cyclops right now.
Yeah, it's a look. In case you don't know what I'm talking about.
I don't know if anybody remembers a couple years ago if you've listened to this podcast.
My oldest, when they were like two years old, accidentally poked my eye and like... truly demolished yeah my eye did some dimash like did some real damage and like almost had to have surgery on my eye.
It was real bad. And that healed without surgery, luckily.
Or did it? You know, three years later, my youngest comes along and last night decided to dive bomb on top of me. with her talons out and stuck her finger so hard into my eye that it looped around my eyeball and it Almost just like, I don't want to talk about it anymore.
She almost just like popped it right out of my head.
Bop, bop. So I look like I got in a prize fight.
You know what else? tell you though it's starting to look better I hope so it is and you can see like a scratch on my on the sclera it's also very clearly Very swollen.
It's definitely swollen. I look like I got hit in the eye.
So that was a fun night of sleep, of like not sleeping.
Because every time I close my eye, I can feel it tearing around my eyelid.
Yeah, so that's a lot of fun. But we're going to do this today either way.
Yeah, I mean, I got my second shot of Moderna yesterday, and I, like, also didn't sleep last night.
I was, like... sore as hell but get the shot but yeah definitely I mean it's very much worth it I can't wait to go out to eat But yeah, so I think that's all that's new with us.
Really good news. So what's new with us is we both feel like shit, but here we are. um but i yeah i don't think there's any new news there's been some like movement in the delphi the um you know, down the hill in the Delphi case.
Liberty and Abby. And I don't want to go too far into it because I think Libby's sister is like, let's wait and see how this plays out.
Yeah, I've seen that on twitter but i know a lot of people have asked about it we're gonna just we're gonna like wait see how it plays out yeah Because so far there's no new suspects, so we don't want to throw anything out there.
But just answer the people that are like, oh, what's going on here?
We see it. We're like watching it. We will let you know when we think it's time to like talk about it. yeah but i think other than that there's really not much going on so this is going to be part one of a two-part series of which you are getting the two parts, boom, boom.
Bing, bang. Right at the same time. So that's our gift to you.
Happy Mother's Day. You don't even have to wait.
Yeah, happy Mother's Day weekend. You're all our moms, I guess.
You are all our moms, each and every one of you. though some of you call us mom so we're gonna call you mom right back mom there you go hey mom So this is our gift to you, moms.
Yeah. All of you. And especially our Australian moms.
Because this is another Australian case.
You know I love the land down under. I come from a land down under.
Now, this is a really bad one. I just want to throw it right out there right in the beginning.
This is Gnarly. It's really rough. There is rape involved.
These people are... just terrible people all around so you know just be ready for that this is not going to be an easy one So, but stick with us.
I love that it's like 830 in the morning right now.
Yeah, but stick with us because in the end. there's like good that comes out of it.
So just stick with us. Well, I love that.
So we're going to be talking about David and Catherine Burney.
All right. Which I know everyone in Australia right now is like gasping for air.
Gross. So they are known as the Morehouse murders because they lived and committed most of their atrocious crimes at three more house road in willigie and that's where you know they abused raped tortured their victims Horrific shit.
So let's talk about them first. Let's talk about David Burney.
What's up with him? A lot, I feel like.
What's up with him? Not a lot anymore because, spoiler alert, He's dead.
So feel good about that. So he was born February 16th, 1951 in Waddle Grove.
I looked it up because I'd never heard of Waddle Grove.
It's in Western Australia and it's in New South Wales.
Ah. You guys have really interesting... It's so funny to look at other... to like other continents and other countries and stuff and see how they do things because it's just so different like you know name places and all oh yeah So it's like, it's hard to like figure out.
You're like, where's New South Wales? What is that?
I don't know what it is. Where though? So he was born to John and Margaret Burney, a priest who married the two of them, his parents. said when he performed the marriage, he knew it wouldn't lead to anything good.
When his parents got married? Yeah. Oh, great.
The priest literally said when I married these two people, I was like, nothing good is going to come out of this.
Well, priests, why did you do it then? I think he had to.
But all that's really known about John, his father, there's not a lot known.
He was really... quiet, kind of like a meek man.
He was a Baptist and he was known to have a very pronounced stutter. which made him very nervous around people, so that's sad.
And he was very quiet. He was the quiet of the two.
He wasn't the yeller and the screamer. That one went to Margaret.
Margaret's the yeller and the screamer. Marge?
Margaret's like a... she's a fucking monster i want to say like i think she that would be a good way to describe her Um, she was like a chain smoking alcoholic.
She abused her children emotionally and physically.
She was a legit demon. He had four younger siblings, so he was the oldest of five.
His home growing up was filthy. Why would you have five children if you don't want them?
That's the thing that bothers me because these two... like for sure did not want these kids right so it's like there's ways to not and it's like maybe just don't have them right i don't like that's it's if you're gonna mistreat the children like don't have the children And it's like, that's fine.
You want to live in your filthy house alone?
Have at it. Go for it. yeah once you involve kids that's fucked up shit's getting worse for you you can sit there in your own filth all day i don't give a shit But yeah, she's terrible.
So the house was filthy, completely unkempt.
They would just leave the refrigerator open all day because they didn't feed their children.
They would just let the refrigerator be open.
And if you wanted food, even at like two years old, you waddle over to the refrigerator and pull something out and eat it.
What? Yep. Well, and I'm assuming that things were rancid then.
Oh, yeah, I'm sure. actually being refrigerated that's just using the refrigerator as like a fucking pantry yeah So she was just like a witch who didn't want to do anything for her kids, like not change them, not bathe them, not do anything.
How did she give them up? for adoption exactly and she that included feeding them apparently she wasn't willing to actually do anything like that There were rumors that there was incest in this home.
The kids were in and out of foster care.
Which it's like, just give them up. Oh, yeah.
Like you don't want them. This is not a case of I can't take care of it.
This is a case of I don't want kids. I don't want them.
I mean, she's screaming. People said she would scream and yell at these kids all the time.
I think there's... There's a YouTuber named Bella, and I can't remember her last name.
She's a true crime YouTuber. She's really great.
I'll look it up. Her name is Bella. I think her last name begins with an F. We'll look it up.
She's really great. You should go listen to her.
And she had said that she found a story where... uh david's mother had like a was on a bus with one of her like when her child was a baby one of them And the baby was like screaming.
And she just got up, handed the baby to a random stranger.
Went to the like another part of the bus, like sat there, just like hung out, read a book. like did what she did then when it was her stop she just took the baby back and like got off the bus If I was the person that she gave that baby to I would be like I'll just keep it.
I'd be like I'm calling CPS right now. Are you kidding me?
Also, it is Bella Fiore. Fiori, yeah, she's really good.
So go listen to her. I just happened to watch a thing of hers.
I'd watched hers like a while ago and I, that's when I wrote down, I was like, I got to do this case.
Oh yeah. And I remember her relaying that story somewhere in there.
But yeah, I thought that was insane. So yeah, it's insane.
So he, David, attended Sunday school and a local Baptist church.
That's the only thing she did do is bring her children to a Baptist church.
His teacher, when he was three years old at the Sunday school... said she recognized right away that something was off with him.
At three years old. That he was way more violent than other kids.
Yeah, at three. And he would just sit there at three years old and just tear into papers with pencils.
What the fuck? Yeah. And the teachers just could see.
They were like, he was clearly, like, emotionally in pain and, like, a very angry child.
Like... right off the bat. I almost said right off the dock because...
I thought you said right off the dot. My next thing was in a documentary and I was like right off the documentary.
I love it. So in a documentary I saw one of the teachers said that they looked at him and just said, you don't even have a chance.
Oh, that's sad. Yeah. A lot of people said the same in this documentary.
They said that there was like a real stigma around the... the Bernie family.
I mean, yeah. Yeah, they said people would see them and just be like, ugh, the Bernies.
Like, they were that family. It's like the Pictons.
They literally were. It was like the Pictons of Australia.
Oh, man. Yeah. He started committing petty crimes at the age of eight.
What the fuck? That's like when people like smoke weed for the first time at like eight years old.
You're always just like, how though? Like.
Who do you have ties with at eight years old?
That's the thing. Like what drug dealers are you meeting at eight?
That's insane. Right. You know those photos sitting in your phone, the ones that make you smile every time you scroll past them?
Well, at smallwoodhome.com, they believe that you deserve better that smallwood home transforms your favorite memories into stunning gallery quality artwork that tells your story All you have to do is upload your photo to smallwoodhome.com, choose your style from classic framed prints to elegant wrapped canvases, and they'll handle the rest with natural wood finishes like stained almond black or white plus options for sleek acrylic fronts, there is a perfect match for every home.
And the best part? Every small wood home piece is handcrafted right here in the USA by real artisans who care about quality.
No assembly lines, no shortcuts, just beautiful, personalized art that is made to last.
I love a handcrafted thing. Over 3 million happy customers have already discovered why smallwoodhome.com is just different.
They deliver gallery quality at prices that make sense and ship in just days.
I have so many photos in my phone that I'm about to send over to them that I can finally hang up on my walls and I'm really excited about it.
Right now, get 30% off when you use code MORBID at smallwoodhome.com.
That's promo code MORBID to get 30% off your first order at smallwoodhome.com.
Give your memories the showcase they deserve.
You know that person in your life who just can't stand mayo?
Call them traumatized. Call them close-minded.
We get it. They're stuck in their ways. But here's the thing.
They just haven't tried Hellman's flavored mayo.
We're talking bold flavors that will flip even the biggest skeptics.
Spicy mayo that adds the perfect kick to your burger.
Garlic aioli that transforms ordinary fries into something extraordinary.
Chipotle mayo that turns your basic wrap into a smoky sensation.
So to all the mayo haters out there, Yes, we're looking at you.
It's time to eat your words. Because with mayo this flavorful, any hater is just a mayo lover waiting to be convinced.
Hellman's Flavored Mayo. Get ready to eat your words.
Yeah, he repeated grades five and seven, and his mother, of course, later blamed his teachers, saying they held him back intentionally. for they were holding back his educational development yeah and it's like they just you know teachers love that I think it was you, you fucking monster.
Right. So, Katherine Burney. Katherine Burney was born Katherine Margaret Harrison.
Oh, that's weird. I was going to say, isn't that interesting?
Her middle name is Margaret. That is a little weird.
She was born, because she's an even worse monster, so that's good.
She's worse than him? Oh, she's worse than his mother.
But, you know, on a different level. So she was born May 23rd, 1951 in Perth.
Her mother died during childbirth when she was only two years old.
Oh, that's sad. She was having her little brother and her little brother died only a few days after that.
Stop. So that's rough. She moved with her father Harold to South Africa for a little while.
Oh shit. But he was not able to care for her.
Some of the things I saw said he was abusive.
Some said he just didn't want to take care of her. or couldn't take care of her.
So either way, not a good situation. No.
So she was sent back to Australia, to Perth, to live with her maternal grandparents.
Okay. No, unfortunately, they were super crazy, super strict.
She wasn't allowed to play with other kids, and no kids were allowed in the house.
Okay. That's weird. She of course became like super, you know, socially behind her peers.
Yeah. She was teased. She gave off like weird vibes.
She was just like a weird kid. She gave off a vibe that other parents really didn't want their children around.
So other parents were like, yeah, you can't play with her.
That's like really sad, though, because like from the sounds of it, she hadn't done anything.
Yeah, she was a kid and it's not her fault.
We feel bad for the kid. But not the adult.
Correct. And the thing was, like, her grandparents would take care of her, but then they'd pass her off to another family member for a while then back to them.
So she never had a stable home. She was always passed off to somebody and then like her father is just like in and out being like, yeah, I'll talk to you.
No, I won't talk to you. And then at 10 years old, her father was like, you know what, I'm ready to give it a go.
At 10. At 10 years old. So for 10 years, she's been, you know, her father's pulling her, pushing her, pulling her, pushing her.
Family members are shoving her around and she's just like, I don't belong anywhere and nobody really wants me.
Like, I'm just... Oh, that makes me want to cry.
And also, I don't have any friends. She has nobody.
She's just in herself. So she did move back in with her father, Harold, and it seemed to be going all right when she moved back in with him in Perth.
Okay. at 12 years old, so now David and Catherine both were the same age.
They turned 12 within months of each other.
Oh, okay. At 12, David moved to Perth with his family. and moved next door to Catherine.
Oh, shit. Well, I said that like I was excited.
You're like... I was like, a meet cute.
You're like, I think they're going to meet.
Oh my gosh. I think something's going to happen here.
Meanwhile, I'm like, wait, I don't want them to meet.
Why did I just say like, oh yeah. The world lit on fire the moment that they met.
Like the devil. was just this was a not this was a match made in hell so she was so desperate to have friends though yeah that when he showed any kind of vested interest in hanging out with her she was like i love him yeah he's amazing And he did, like, he really liked her.
Right. So they, like, dated for a little bit, like a 12-year-old date.
I don't want to like this. I know. It's in this terrible clip. like cute and then don't worry no don't worry don't you worry because right now feel it Feel it.
Marinate in it. Because for a little bit, you're going to be like, die.
Yeah, it's going to be really quick. So they dated for a little bit.
Her father, Harold, hated David. Like, hated him. thought he was bad news, like bad news bears.
He was like, he's already getting into trouble.
I mean, yeah, when he was eight. Yeah, like at this point, he already had like a rap sheet at 12.
Like he had already been in trouble with the police a lot.
Bananas. And he was starting to get Catherine into trouble, like take him on these little excursions.
So she's getting in trouble now. I... I don't blame her dad.
So weirdly though, David's mom who we should totally believe because she's awesome.
Oh yeah. Yeah, for sure. She claimed she was like, no, all these parents, all the parents knew each other.
David's like us and Catherine's parents.
We knew each other. They said some of them had worked together like previously in the laundry room at the Perth Hospital.
Uh-huh. And they all thought David and Catherine would marry someday.
Because they knew each other. I think she's a bullshitter because they met at 12.
Right. Like that is a thing. And also like Harold's like, no, I fucking hated David.
Like I didn't want them to get married. No, I feel like she's just trying to be like, I'm a good mom and I always wanted my kid to marry that sweet little Catherine.
Exactly. Which brings us right to the next point of the story, which David and David's parents divorced. like as soon after they moved to Perth.
Yeah. And neither of the parents wanted any of the kids...
So they all just became wards of the state.
So they divorced and then they said to, like, hey, judge, I don't want the kids.
Yeah, they literally got divorced and they were like, we don't really want them anyways.
Yeah. And the judge was like, cool, so they all have to go to different foster homes.
So they all got split up, the five siblings.
That's gut wrench. Isn't that horrific? I hate when you hear about siblings being split up in foster care.
It's horrific. I don't understand why that's allowed.
I don't think it should be. I don't get that at all.
No. It's so unhealthy for development. So detrimental.
Yeah. I mean foster care no matter what is a trauma that a kid is being taken away from their parents regardless of who the parents were or how it went down. and it's like if they have a sibling that might be their only lifeline like literally give them that it's so sad but in this case I think it was just like yeah Neither one of us want them.
Remember when my mom used to tell me that she was going to drive me to foster care?
Yeah. Like it was a building. Literally.
I remember that. Like we would fight and she'd be like, that's it.
You get out from school. Foster care. And I'd be like. me that i was like what sounds good friend that's so fucked up oh yeah development Drama.
Drama, drama, drama. We're just seeing where we're connecting it right now.
See, I gave you a little piece. Everybody's like, what's wrong with Ash's mom?
I'm like, that's what's wrong with Ash's mom.
What's wrong with Ash's mom and your sister?
That right there. She wanted to drive you to foster care on multiple occasions.
She wanted to drive her to the building.
Which I don't think is fair. It's just a building that says foster care here.
No, not a thing. Cute. Well, either way, David and Catherine lost contact after this because he got moved to another family.
And all the five kids got separated. Yeah, they all got separated.
And a lot of them didn't speak again. There was a couple, I think him, we'll see, him and his younger brother do get in contact, which is...
We don't want that, I feel. Because I don't think these, you know, at least these two didn't turn out so great.
Aww. So when David was 15, he left school because he was just like not attending anyways.
And he started working as an apprentice jockey for Eric Parnum at Ascot Racecourse.
Okay. So he's taking care of the horses.
He's helping the jockeys. I don't want him to be near the horses, please.
You don't. No. Because I'm not going to say anything like what happened, but he did hurt the horses.
Yeah, I don't want that. The other apprentice jockeys thought he was an asshole, and they thought he was weird as fuck.
Like, some of the documentaries are like, the dude was like...
Never smiled. Was always nasty and mean.
He treated the horses... Yeah, like, he treated the horses poorly.
And then they said he would sometimes, like, he became kind of, like, an exhibitionist.
Toe fire? me up he would sometimes ride up on his bike to like near the race course in just a jacket, and he would be wearing nothing underneath.
What the fuck? Why, though? Yeah. Why, sir?
It's his thing. Did he, like, bring pants in his bag to change into?
He just wanted to flash everybody. Oh. Alrighty.
And then while working there, he intentionally hurt three horses.
I don't want to know that. I'm not going to tell you anything about it, but he was able to stay for free while he was working there in a boarding house. owned partially by the stables.
And in 1966, he broke into a 70-year-old woman's home who was his landlady, and was naked, Wearing only a stocking on his head.
What the fuck? David, what is wrong with you?
He tried to rape her. a 70 year old woman yep but then got scared away and he's like 15 at this point yeah he was like 16 i think What the fuck?
And yeah, then luckily he got scared away before he could do anything.
But that's when he was let go from the racetrack.
That goes without saying, I guess. Yeah, his boss talked to a newspaper and said, quote, He was a bad kid.
He had a shocking home life. He had no chance at all.
So even these people see, like, he's a bad kid.
But he had no chance of becoming anything different.
Well, and I feel like the people at the stables probably...
I said earlier, like, oh, how did you get hired?
But they probably felt bad and like wanted to give him a place to stay.
I think they just wanted to give him a chance.
They were like, maybe we can turn his life.
Because some people just need that. Right.
Even with the trauma they have. Yeah. give somebody a chance.
Maybe they just need that routine and that responsibility.
It was well known at this point too that he had become like addicted to porn.
Well, yeah, he's doing weird things. Yeah, he had some like sexual deviances, like shit was going down.
He was also a perverted would-be rapist.
Yeah. attempted to rape somebody. He was getting into a ton of trouble with the police at this point.
Tons of shit. Yeah. That's when Catherine and David re-met.
Oh, goody. Yeah, they came back into contact and they fell in love again as teens.
Was it love? At this point, he had been in and out of prison a couple of times.
Uh-huh. He had a rap sheet for assault, burglary, robbery, all kinds of like petty crimes.
And she was just... enamored smitten smitten by this guy so david and katherine start to commit crimes together Because he thinks this is going to be like really hot.
Let's commit this together. Trying to Bonnie and Clyde it up.
Yeah, let's natural born killers this. It's going to be great.
No. Their first crime happened on June 11th, 1969.
And they were trying to steal a safe from a local drive-in movie theater.
And they ended up being arrested and charged with 11 counts of theft and breaking and entering.
Whoa. They both pleaded guilty. And David was sentenced to nine months in prison.
And Katherine got a little less of a sentence because she was currently pregnant at the time.
Oh, no. With another man's baby. Yeah, there was a lot going on.
Okay. A lot going on. So they actually went up in front of the Supreme Court and their sentences were actually increased when they went in front of the Supreme Court.
David got three more years on his sentence of nine months.
Oh, damn. And Catherine got probation, and it was actually increased by four years, her probation.
I love that they were like, appeal. Yeah.
Appeal! And the judge was like, nah. So June 21st, 1970, David actually escaped prison.
And where did he go? You know, I felt that.
I felt like we were headed that way. Of course.
And where did he go? To Catherine's? He went straight to Catherine.
Because they love each other. Love. And they went on a crime spree together.
Bonnie and Clyde type shit. You know? Home invasions, burglaries, robbing people, like all that fun stuff.
It's like, if you're going to escape jail, why not lay low?
No, they're not going to do that. They're going for it.
They're natural born killers. I don't know if you know that.
I hate it. They went in front of the court again in July of 1970 and This was after their crime spree.
And when they were caught, they were charged with 53 counts of trespassing, illegal operation of a motor vehicle, burglary, robbery, like all kinds of stuff.
Jesus. And when they caught them, they had like weird shit with them, like disguises.
They also had dynamite. So I don't know what they were planning to do with that.
What? Yeah. And David was sentenced to two and a half months in prison.
For having dynamite on them. Where does one purchase a dynamite?
Yeah. I have no idea. I always thought it was just like a tick, tick, tick, tick, boom, dynamite.
Like, that's all I thought of dynamite. Maybe it is.
Maybe when you go pick it up, you have to be like tick, tick, tick, tick, boom, dynamite.
We're here tonight. We have one of those.
Here you go. Wow. The dynamite store. That's where you go.
Dynamites are us. I feel like it would be at Costco.
Personally, it's like the pool place, the dynamite den.
I love it. Love it. Here we go. Well, Catherine got six months in prison and she had the baby while in prison.
That stresses me out a lot. The baby was taken away right away.
That's what makes me really terribly sad. any contact with David at the time, no writing letters, nothing.
Wow. They cut it right off. Damn, they even let Ira, Ira.
Myra and Ian. Oh, yeah. Well, they do later, so don't worry.
You know what's even more stressful than a packed calendar?
Realizing you're out of coffee right before a meeting.
That actually happened to me the other day. and it's exactly why I stocked up during the Thrive Markets back to school sale.
Even if you're not going back to school, I'm not, it's the perfect time to reset.
Thrive makes it easy to shop for high quality pantry staples, snacks, vitamins, even skincare without the errands or the ingredient label deep dives I just restocked with Aloha protein bars, Simple Mills crackers, and my favorite poppy drinks.
I love Everything is delivered super duper fast, and I saved up to 25% on all of that.
Their filters make shopping by diet or lifestyle a breeze and their healthy swap tool actually helped me upgrade my usual buys with zero label stress.
I love the Lesser Evil popcorn. I get my chomp sticks from there.
I love Thrive and you will too. Now's the best time to try Thrive Market.
You'll get up to 25% off select items. and new members get 30% off their first order plus a free gift.
Who doesn't love that? Go to thrivemarket.com slash morbid to start saving.
The sale ends 831. Don't miss it. but either way she was still obsessed with david obsessed She even said at this time I would do anything for him regardless of whether it was wrong or not.
Wow. But it's like, I mean, I'm not okaying her behavior, but it's like this is the only person who's ever shown her any kind of love or affection. so it does make sense.
Yeah, she just attached herself to him. Yeah.
They did convince her while she was in prison, I guess some of like the, you know, parole officers and guards and all that, like people around her.
We're like, listen, you need to stop talking to him and like get your shit together.
Like you have a chance. chance. Like you're in here because you attached yourself to him.
Right. It's not even anything that like you did.
Yeah. So when she got out of prison, the parole officer They did give her, she did get custody back of her baby that she had.
Yeah. And they were able to convince her to go get a job, stay away from David.
So she did. She became a housekeeper for the McLaughlin family.
She had custody of her baby. Seemed to be going okay.
She's only 20 years old at this point. Oh, man.
A rough go to say the least. Yeah, rough go.
So while she was there, she actually ended up falling in love with one of the children.
Who was actually an older? Oh, I was like, what?
He wasn't an actual child, but like one of the family's children.
Sure. The oldest son named Donald. And they ended up getting married that year on her 21st birthday.
The end. And she had a baby with him named Donald Jr.
Okay. Yeah. So when the baby was seven months old, though, they had some friends over.
They let the baby crawl around in the yard and on the driveway, and trigger warning, I'm going to give you a second.
Somebody backed out of the driveway and ran over the seven month old and killed them.
How does that even happen? Yeah. I don't know.
Here I am. I don't understand why you're letting your baby crawl around on the driveway when cars are moving.
I don't get that. No, just ended at let your baby crawl around on the driveway.
I mean, I... no that's dirty and unsafe not something i would do baby skin is so like so so delicate sad So devastating.
But somehow they moved past it. They were able to get through it.
And they had six more kids together. What the fuck?
I was not expecting us to go there. Six more kids.
This woman... Has six kids. Damn. Well, seven, right?
Yeah. Technically seven. Yeah. Yeah, you're right, the baby in prison.
So Donald was actually in and out of jobs, but they seemed pretty chill and pretty happy together.
Was he like a okay dude? I think he was like a pretty decent dude, but they were living like paycheck to paycheck.
They were struggling financially. The only issue was that she didn't seem to like being a mom.
Well, maybe she shouldn't have had six children because like we just said.
Did you hit the sixth kid and you were like...
I don't think I want this. I don't know if I love this.
I don't know. Let's try it one more time.
Let's try that seventh and see if it really kicks in.
If it's not kicking in by the first kid, You don't want it.
It's like seven kids in and you're like, I don't really like this.
I want kids so bad. I can't imagine like it's fine if you don't want kids, but I can't imagine having a kid and not wanting it.
Oh yeah, just knowing the three years it took us to have the twins.
Yeah. and all the IUIs and IVFs that we went through just to have them.
Literally. And how badly we wanted them.
Yeah. Like hearing this kind of shit goes up my ass.
That she's like, I'm just going to keep popping out kids, but I don't really like them.
Right. And she just let them run wild, didn't give a shit.
So fucked up. Never took care of them. And she didn't really care about keeping her house clean either.
It was just like filthy and disgusting. Yeah.
Kind of like the host David grew up in. Yeah.
And, yeah, she was just letting them run around the neighborhood.
She never knew where they were, didn't care.
Oh, my God. Then Donald hurt his back and couldn't work anymore.
So they had to move to an even smaller house.
With six children. Yeah. And I think it's called council housing there.
And it was not a great situation. So there was too many kids in that house.
It was a mess. She wasn't happy. I think Donald was trying to do what he could do, but, you know, it was just like disaster.
So then David gets out of prison for the second time.
And he gets out of prison and he doesn't go straight for Catherine.
Because remember, they have not had contact, allegedly.
Some people think they have had contact like part of this time.
I can't imagine they went how many years without contact.
I know. That's the thing. But when he got out of prison, he met a woman named Carrie through his brother.
Apparently, she knew his brother. They went out and literally the next night, He proposed to her and she was like, yes, that sounds very rational.
Let's do it. And they got married. That was a great reaction.
Yes, that sounds very interesting. I think this will turn out great.
Yes, I know you so well. Yeah, she's like, I don't know you.
Fun. What is your last name? Your last name's Bernie.
Haven't heard of it. Let's do this. So they got married.
All right. Him and Carrie. All these choices.
They did have a baby together. Everybody's got to chill out with the babies.
I'm not going to say her name, even though it is in articles and stuff.
I don't know. She doesn't really deserve to be attached to this.
And by all accounts, he was a great father to this baby, according to her, according to Everybody.
She said he loved her, took care of her.
They were married for six years and they were happy for six years.
All right. And according to the ex-wife and everything, she was like, we, it was fine.
That's just very interesting. I know. And then he got a head injury.
Oh. And he completely flipped his lid. He was suddenly out of nowhere treating Carrie like shit, cheating on her all the time.
But even then, the daughter says he never abused her.
Huh. Yeah. She was like, I don't. In fact, later, and I have like a quote from her.
She says later like I have so much trouble reconciling what he's done with who I knew.
Yeah, which I mean, I can't imagine. Yeah.
And I feel like it's like BTK's daughter, Carrie.
That was on the tip of my tongue. I was just about to say that.
Like she, it must be so hard to process.
Yeah. That this man who like. you know maybe they're not the most perfect father in the world who is but it's like They're not like a terrible father to you, you know, like you're, you have good memories with them and they're your father.
Yeah. And you have, like, no inkling that this is going on.
And they didn't do anything to you, you know?
Like, they didn't hurt you. They didn't abuse you.
They didn't hit you. And then you have to reconcile that they are this absolute monster outside of this.
Because it's like you have to decide whether you're going to have a relationship with them or not based on something that happened to like so many other people.
Exactly. Technically. didn't involve you and you get all this judgment on you like you had something to do with it and it's like No.
Yeah, like that's your father at the end of the day.
Children of murderers have nothing to do with it.
And it's like they shouldn't be expected to try to sit there. and psychoanalyze what was going on with their parents.
They shouldn't have to sit here and explain anything to anybody no like they are they're their own a different kind of victim they're a different kind of victim of that person Absolutely.
That just sucks. It does. Like, it's crazy.
So yeah, I feel like she's dealing with the same kind of thing now. but yeah he started cheating on Carrie though constantly that was his new because remember he's addicted to porn and sex oh I forgot So that always was a thing.
Yeah. But now it's becoming a real thing.
Well, and it seems like the head injury kind of... Yeah, it really exasperated his... it's like prison knocked sense into him and then the head injury knocked it out yeah yeah So he started actually advertising for affairs in the paper. which Carrie didn't know about, obviously, at that time.
That's like Ashley Madison before Ashley Madison.
Literally. It was like... OG Ashley Madison.
Yeah. So four years after the injury... For four years, I'm surprised she stuck with him for this long. uh this is like 10 years of marriage she's dealing with the first six years being all right and the last four years being horrendous And she finally it came to a head because he came home one day and he was like, here's my 16 year old girlfriend.
I'd be like, why the fuck is she like, why the fuck?
And then he moves his dog. daughter out of her room and into the room with his wife and is like, that's your bedroom now with your mom. this is my bedroom with my 16 year old girlfriend now.
And Carrie said what? And Carrie was like, no, sir.
And she left and was like, bye. I took her daughter and was like, no, no, bye-bye.
That was it. Like, that's when she had enough.
Yeah. That poor child, too, is probably just like, what? what dad because at that point she's like excuse me like you can't have a girlfriend and definitely not one that's a minor and you can't take my bedroom Like, what the hell?
So David finally... So, you know, now his wife and his daughter have left.
David then is like... Time to find Catherine.
Time to find Catherine. The one that got away.
Because things are going great. So I think we should really put the whipped cream on this sundae and go grab Katherine.
He's like, you know who will fuck things up to the extreme with me?
Catherine. She's the one I got to get. Yeah.
These two, by the way, like when you look at them together, you're like, wow, I have rarely have I seen. two gnarlier looking human beings to have found each other.
Like they are both just miserable looking. crotchety, miserable, just like, bleh.
Oh, yeah. Golly. They both have hollowed out eyes and just like dead eyed, frowny faced. demon faces really is what they have.
Yeah, his nose is a lot and her vibe is a lot.
Both of their vibes, just if I saw them, I'd be like, no, thank you.
Especially this pic, like, no thanks. Yeah, I'm telling you, go look it up, guys.
I mean, we'll post a photo, but woof. Younger her is terrifying.
Yeah, it's no good. Now, so David... tracks down the love of his life there.
Here they go again on their own. Did he ditch the 16?
Yeah, he's just a 16-year-old, apparently.
That was not built to last. apparently.
No. Now, this is four weeks after Catherine has had her seventh child. whoa yep look barely recovered yep she was actually in the hospital having a hysterectomy That's good.
When David tracks her down. At least there's that.
Exactly. Exactly. And at one point, her husband, Donald, was coming to visit her in the hospital and David was there holding her hand.
And he just walked in on that, like, who the fuck is this guy?
And David was like, uh, what? You guys wanna talk?
What? what that's going on hello hey there hi my name is donald are you her cousin what's your name what's going on why is your nose like that what why do you look so angry who are Are you angry, sir?
Your vibe? No. Off. Okay. But yeah, so she, so she, apparently Donna was like, that's weird.
And just like. went about his life and she got out of the hospital and then she immediately went to visit david oh yeah And while she was there, she was like, you know what?
This is the life I want. This is it right here.
This disgusting life with this horrible man is what I want.
So she said... She calls her husband Donald and she's like, hey, Donnie.
Um... I'm gonna leave you and all the kids.
I don't give a shit about any of you. What?
All seven kids. All yours. That's like sociopathic type shit.
Don't want anything to do with them. Her youngest was three, by the way.
Wow. Well, and the baby. I was like, but what?
And the baby. She had a fucking new... She left a newborn and a three-year-old.
And who knows how old the other ones were.
Like... Probably so young. When you say someone can be called a cunt...
Katherine can be called a cunt. And so can David, for that matter.
Two cunts. Yeah, because he's just like, oh, OK, cool.
I'm going to abandon my child, too. And you abandon yours and we'll get together. like fun.
So they moved in together because they were like, oh, cool, we're going to start a new life.
We don't have kids. So did Donald Jr. take her first child, too?
Because the first child wasn't even his.
Yeah, she left him, too. And so they moved in together, David and Catherine, at the house on Morehouse.
She immediately changed her last name to Bernie, but they were never married.
She just changed it to that. Alrighty. Yeah, because she's nuts.
Because she's her. Yep. And she just wanted to, like, seem like they were married, you know?
Okay. So we're married. Alrighty. I'm Katherine Burney.
I mean, she legally bound herself to him when she was like 12, so... That's true, and she legally bound herself to him when she was like, I'm gonna abandon my... small village of children literally live with you now yeah and i just love that they were both like oh cool we don't have kids We're childless people.
And it's like, no, between you, you have more children than I've seen on any given day. different so it's like you that's insane that you guys just decided you're just childless now Yeah, like she originally had eight children.
Even though you have very much had children, all of you.
Now, yeah. So, of course, their house was like really clean, really organized, like really, I'm totally kidding.
I was like, what? You did it. I was like, what?
I was like, how did they just change their pathology all of a sudden?
Their house was an absolute cesspool of like shit.
I don't understand it. I don't get it. They lived...
Disgusting. Like they picked it in style.
I can't. Disgusting and dirty just like they were.
Like they're disgusting and dirty. Last night, I baked a shit ton for Mother's Day coming up.
And I was like, you know what? I'm going to leave those pans in the sink.
I just can't right now. I took a shower and I went back out and I was like, I can't leave those.
No, I can't go to sleep with pens in this.
I cannot do it. Luckily, neither can John, so we're both crazy that way, so there will never be dishes in our sink at night.
The town of Agde in France is famous for sun, sand, sea and sex.
But lately, life on the coast has taken a strange turn.
The town's mayor, a respected pillar of the community, has been arrested for corruption.
His wife claims he's been bewitched by a beautiful clairvoyant.
Then there's the mysterious phone calls that local people have been getting.
I am the Archangel Michael. The whole town has been thrown into chaos.
The mayor is unable to carry out his duties.
I would like to address you all. Legal proceedings have been initiated.
Join me, Anna Richardson, and journalist Leo Schick for The Mystic and the Mayor as we investigate a story of power, corruption, Binge all episodes of The Mystic and the Mare exclusively and ad-free right now on Wondery Plus.
Start your free trial in Apple Podcasts Spotify or the Wondery app.
And it's I can't imagine just leaving. And it's like filthy, like dirty.
And so they spent their time there doing heroin and pills and chain smoking and smoking weed and just like just doing their thing.
Doing their degenerate thing. They're childless now.
They don't have to worry about anything.
Just throwing shit on the floor. This is so sad.
Yeah, David got a job as a car parts salesman, and it was close to his house where he was working.
He was in and out of prison still. He was still doing all kinds of shit.
I could imagine. And during one of his small prison stints, he was in the cell with some guy he knew. his little brother, James.
Awesome. Yeah, he ended up being in the same cell as him and they were like, oh my god!
Bro! They were like, Yeah. And they hadn't seen each other for a while.
So they were like, oh my God, we're both getting out of here soon.
And David was like, cool, you should move in with us.
Like, you can stay with us for a little while while you get back on your feet.
That sounds like a really good idea. So nice.
Like so, so nice of a brother. her house it's beautiful there's a housekeeper yeah Catherine cooks dinner every night she's an amazing chef Yep, and he was like, you know what, you're probably a good guy because James was in prison for sexually assaulting his six-year-old niece.
I don't even want to go there. And when asked about it, he said she led me on.
Six. Yep. Six. These are the Bernies. I just physically got nauseous.
Yeah, I literally like had to stop myself from heaving when I saw that.
What the fuck? What the fuck? What the fuck is wrong with people?
You can't even begin to unpack that. No, never.
I never want to. Never in my life. I don't ever want to understand that.
Yeah, an island. Let's get an island. Let's throw all of them on the island and they'll all just die out eventually.
I think we should do that. I'm not even kidding.
I would happily be like, let's put all pedophiles on an island.
6,000 gajillion percent. I'll never waver out of that stance.
That's why they deserve to rot on an island.
You have children. Yeah, fuck those people.
Yeah. So he was sleeping on their couch.
So already this house is just getting warmer and warmer by the day.
This house is it. We're just straight up nasty.
This house is a very, very, very bad house.
This house is leaking oozy cesspool poopy.
Yeah, you walk by it and it like... I guarantee you walked by this house on Morehouse Road and you were like, why does it glow green?
Like, why is there just a green hamster house?
Yeah, it's just like, what's happening in there?
All of a sudden you're walking and it's like sunny, but like there's like a cloud and it's raining over their house.
It's just like hailing over. And you just hear like the Jaws theme song as you approach the house.
You're just like, what's happening in there?
Yeah, it's no good. So James is sleeping on their couch and he quickly learned more and more about his brother.
Because now he's obviously, you know, involved, fucked up sexually.
And now he's learning his brother also is.
He's addicted to porn and sex and he's... very aggressive about it.
Please don't tell me that they bond over this. had a huge collection of porn around the house that was just like strewn around the house.
Because he's fine. He doesn't have kids or anything.
He can just throw it anywhere. And Catherine's like, this is so cute.
I love it. And he needed to have sex five to six times a day.
That's hilarious. Everyone's like, ah! LOL.
That's insane. I think I would physically die.
I should, like... No, that's a lot. that's a lot the fuck and this is one of those things where like It's not like, no, I want to have sex five or six times a day.
This is like, I physically need to and I'm going to lose my shit.
How old is at this point that's the other thing he's like kind of he's in his like late or I think early 30s at this point or late 20s early 30s I mean, so that's very that's pretty surprising.
Yeah. I mean, it's this is what it is. He's like addicted to porn and sex.
And he was always that's why he had all those like weird proclivities where he would want to like dress in a in a you know a jacket and just oh yeah you were like what are you gonna get i was like there's more there's more No, I mean, there is.
But he would dress in just a jacket and just ride around to exhibitionist shit.
Weird as hell. Feel the breeze on your booty.
And, you know, there was those rumors growing up in that Bernie household of, like, incest and, like, fucked up shit happening. i know there was also rumors that like his mom would you know get a taxi to take the you know to go to the store and she would just like fuck the taxi driver for like payment in the house like in front of the kids.
Yeah. So There's a lot of... Really messed up, messed up ideas of sex that happened in that house, I imagine.
Absolutely. That manifests itself in these children here.
Because I mean, look at James, look at him.
Yeah. That doesn't just come out of nowhere.
That's... There's some deep psychological issues happening here.
That's a learned behavior. Which is by no means like an excuse for them.
But this is definitely something that was planted early on in their development for sure.
Because it's too extreme not to be. This is not just... And for one family to have this...
Yeah. And all the rumors and like knowing how those parents were, it's just like no good.
So, yeah, he needed to have sex five or six times a day.
And he kept a small mattress in the living room, like next to the couch.
Where James was sleeping. Stop this. For him to have sex with random women on.
And Catherine, did they have like an open relationship?
Well, because I guess he would have, he started with Catherine and then they broke up for like a brief period of time. oh and he would also just bring girls in because he was like no i need to have sex six times a day and if you're not around i'm gonna find someone who is Oh, right.
That's how intense he was. And also James said that he noticed that he would use a numbing spray on his like hoo-ha. before sex.
And it was basically that, like a numbing spray so that he could last longer.
Because it would make it like you can't feel anything.
That's what numbing is. you know i think it's because i was just blankly staring you were like i was just processing you're like numbing i was like it's you don't you don't feel it like numbing makes like they do that so you can't feel stuff i was like i got it you were like no i don't That was great.
But yeah, he just, like, and so he was really... You know, this episode is truly something so far.
It's really something and he went hard. He went hard.
I don't want you to say the word hard again, please.
Yeah, that was a poor choice of words. I apologize for that.
But yeah, so, you know, we're here. We're here.
Here we are. We're in it. This episode is squalor regardless.
It's squalor. It's filthy. It's his unkempt house.
That's what this episode is. Damn nausea at this point.
We haven't even gotten into like the... Anything about the...
This is just who they are as people. So then, you know, Catherine and him got back together.
They got back on the regular bullshit. Was the mattress still there?
The mattress was still there. Still there, ready to go.
I feel like it's so stinky. Yeah. And so for his 20, so for his, I almost said his sons, his brother's 21st birthday.
He said, hey, James, come here. No. And James was like, what?
And he was like... Do you want to have sex with Catherine?
No, no, no, no, no. For your 21st birthday?
I thought you were going to say that like he got him like a sex worker or something.
No. His gal. No, he was, like, here. Catherine's here.
Which reminds me of, like... Yeah. You know, Carla Homolka.
Yeah. I don't know how she was like, do you want my sister?
Or like I can just like pretend to be her.
Like we can just, I can just give you that.
Like, this is... No one has any autonomy, like, besides them.
Like, Catherine's just like... Would you like her?
Well, and honestly, like, that's weirdly incestual.
It is. Like, there's weird shit happening here.
So that was actually the first time that James had had sex with a girl was with Catherine.
Oh. And at one point, David went without sex for like a night.
Like a whole day and a night. So he was insane.
Like literally like James was like he was off his rocker.
And he was begging James to just let him have sex with him.
That's how like out of control he was. He wanted his brother to have sex with him.
Which, in case anybody was wondering whether incest happened in that house growing up...
That's your answer. That's your answer right there.
Yeah. So that just shows you what was happening in this house before they even began murdering people.
Wait, so do you know if they did or not?
I don't know. I don't know. I just know it was a thing.
It's better to have not known. It's better to not know.
It's better to just know that that's how desperate he was and how much he couldn't go without it. in his own mind.
Now, because his sexual appetite was clearly so insatiable, Like insane.
Yeah, to say the least. They quickly just like became bored of having sex with each other.
Catherine and... Uh, David, especially, more, more so David.
Like, Catherine was... doing what she could to keep up.
But David was like, eventually I need more.
So he was like, I'd like to like spice things up.
So David, David and Catherine, they talked about it and they were like, what can we do to really make things different here?
And David was like, well, I've always had like this thing about like abducting and raping a woman. which is like very interesting when you're a partner.
You know, it's good to communicate with your partner, I think.
Definitely, talk about what you want, talk about what you need.
But when your partner says, I've always had this fantasy of abducting and raping a woman, Yeet yourself out of the situation.
Yeah, it's time to go, you know what? This was fun.
Bye. And then leave. Maybe call authorities and say, I don't know what's going to happen here, but it seems like something's brewing.
I don't know. But Catherine was like, that sounds great.
And not only that, she was like... I'd actually love to watch that.
Yeah. So Catherine was like willing, totally into it.
What? Yeah. So, again, how two people found each other...
I always wonder how these people find each other.
That's how it happens. The devil. So the first thing they could think to do was put an ad in the paper to try to lure girls to their house.
Why are they being so upfront about this?
Yeah, they love ads in the paper, too. They're like, let's just paper trail.
That's what we're looking for here. I mean, the 70s, hi.
So the ad that they put in the paper. They put a patent out in the paper that said urgent.
Looking for a lonely person. Prefer female, 18 to 24 years.
Share single room flat. So they're making it like, oh, do you want to live in our house?
Why do you have to be lonely to live there?
Lonely person. 18 to 24. Just to live in our house.
That's the roommate we're looking for. Luckily...
Everybody who read that thought the same thing we did because they didn't get any bites off.
Also, why would that be put into print? Like, why was the newspaper like, you know what?
Zoop. The newspaper was like, this is probably fine.
Yeah. This won't, no. You know that whoever was typing it up that day went home to their wife or husband and was like, get this.
It was like, what the fuck is this? You thought that my job was boring.
Get this. Well, and it's like they pay for a spot.
They paid for it. I think they just have to print it.
They're technically not threatening anyone.
They're not like... a lonely lady it's a weird one but you just gotta be like all right there it is that no one answered that The most ominous ad.
Right? Urgent. I hate that part. Apparently, the two of them didn't really have a specific girl in mind or anything.
They just said, you know, they would like an 18 to 24 year old, preferably.
I can't say that word. But they just wanted to find a girl alone.
They were looking for a girl alone because they weren't getting anybody biting off of them. that really good ad in the paper that was like super subtle.
Prima. So they were like, wow, that's crazy that that didn't work.
So the first victim who did not... Who ended up not being...
You know, I say victim because she was like stalked, but she survives.
Okay. Okay. But it's still like a story that is very scary.
Okay. Her name was Audrey. He would stalk her outside of her workplace at a real estate company, David would.
He found her. He just saw her and he tried to get her to leave with him many times.
He was like, oh, I'll drive you home. No.
And she said he came back every day for at least a week. making suggestions like, I only like brunettes with brown eyes.
As soon as I was alone, he came in. and she said she was super creeped out by him right away and this was happening for a week straight and she was like it was escalating to the point i was like something bad's gonna gonna happen yeah now she called her husband and her husband came in and scared him away I love it and he never came back again and But I mean, it's 100% positive that that was intended to be their first victim.
He was 100% going to try to take her home.
That's so scary. So she got away. She wasn't lonely, David.
She wasn't lonely. I love that her husband came in and was like, no, no, you're not going to happen.
And smart of her to be like, I'm going to call someone else in here and scare the shit out of you.
Hell yeah. So Catherine would now, when they would like look for a person, their little, they had a code system.
Of course, very Myronian. Exactly. Now, there's a lot of parallels to Myra and Ian in here and like we'll see and so Catherine would give David the go-ahead that this was the person she wanted by saying, because usually what they were thinking after this, they were like, all right, he's just stalked someone, didn't work.
They put an ad in the paper, it didn't work.
We're just going to have to pick people up and give them rides home.
So they said, when we get someone in the car, if both of them are down because David said Catherine had to approve... the person.
So Catherine would say, I've got the munchies.
And if David thought the person was a good match as well and was into it, he would say, quote, I've got the munchies too, darling.
That's foul. And that was how they sealed whoever's fate never never again you i hate that you ruined munchies sorry it wasn't me it was katherine and david they ruined them So October 6, 1986.
No, thank you. Mary Nielsen, 22 years old.
She was a student at the University of Western Australia.
She was majoring in psychology. She worked part-time at a deli in Attadale.
She was like a really just like good, hardworking girl.
Like doing her thing at university. She was adorable.
Like they were all so pretty. Of course.
Like, every girl. Like, they were so adorable.
And all of them were, like, really sweet from good families.
Like, just... with like futures and yeah just like real futures ahead of them just not doing anything they shouldn't have been doing at the time it's like Literally just living.
Just living their lives. It sucks. And she met David while shopping at the spare parts yard that he worked at. she was looking for a tire and he was like, hey, he like pulled her aside and was like, hey,
I can get you cheaper tires for your car.
Here's my phone number. And you're 22. You're like, hell yeah, brother.
Exactly. You're like, yes, I want part time at a deli.
Of course I need like cheaper time. If I was 22, I'd be like, awesome.
I'll call you. Exactly. And his co-workers at this yard, by the way, said that they thought he was very smart and Which a lot of people said he was smart.
Well, unfortunately, I feel like you would have to be to pull something like that.
Yeah, I feel like he was very like he read on his own time and kind of educated himself a little bit because he wasn't getting it at home, obviously.
So he was very. very well spoken to a lot of people, which can trick a lot of people into thinking you're... which it doesn't correlate, like very smart or very well-spoken or well-read does not correlate with good person.
And not well-smoken, not well-read, you know, doesn't correlate with bad person.
No. But a lot of people, unfortunately, do correlate the two things.
Yeah. So that's a lot of the reason he was able to manipulate a lot of people and charm them.
Yeah. And so his co-worker said, yeah, he was really smart.
You just got so Boston. Did I really? His co-worker.
Did I really? I didn't even realize. I was like, who are you?
They said he was really smart, really smart.
He was really normal. Wicked smart, wicked normal.
He was a great worker. And yeah, they said he was always on time, he never missed a shift, like nothing out of the ordinary.
He really changed it up from the from the racehorses he really did and you know what it was it's like they said he didn't stand out He didn't fade into the back, but he didn't stand out.
But he probably learned how to blend in because he had to.
Exactly, because they were like, he was there.
He was never late, so we never had to think about him much.
He did his job. Yep. He talked to us. Yep.
And that was it. I wouldn't sit there and say I want to like hang out with him every night.
I wouldn't say I don't. Yeah. He's there.
He's there, yeah. David. Oh, that's my co-worker David.
No big deal. Which is interesting, because I feel like a lot of these people either... are shit at their jobs or they go above and beyond and are like, oh, he was my friend. favorite worker and I can't and it's like he really just floated in that middle which is interesting I don't think a lot of them really do that Wait, I just realized that not once have I said, ew, David.
Ew, David. Oh, my God. How have I not said that?
Wow. What a missed opportunity for both of us.
I know, but I'm going to really up the ante in part two probably.
Ew, David. You're giving me that a lot.
Oh, that's so perfect. Die bad. Die bad.
I'm so good at it. Do you want to watch me do the entire a little bit of Lexus dance later?
I think everybody listening does, so we'll put that on the Instagram.
I'm a Lamborghini. Guys, if you haven't watched Schitt's Creek, do it.
You have to. Poor Mary. Let's go back to Mary.
Yes. Her parents were out of town and she didn't have somebody that, you know...
Normally she would probably call her parents and be like, Hey, can you pay for these tires?
Or like, help me out. Yeah. and they were like we would have like she knows we would have but they were out of town And she's probably like, oh, you know what?
They're gone. I want to do this myself. When they come home, they'll be so impressed. impressed that I did this exactly she's like you know what I'm gonna get this done yeah and she's like what luck that he's going to do this for me.
So she called him because he gave her a number and he was like, cool, come to my house.
No. And I'll give you, you know, we can do the tire thing.
He's like, we just can't do it there because, you know, they want to charge you a lot and I don't want them to know.
Which, honestly, I, like... Now, obviously, I wouldn't just based on the job that we have.
But younger, you can get why she would be.
Absolutely. Yeah. So on October 6th, she went to his house to pick them up.
David answered the door as soon as she got there.
And he immediately held her at gunpoint.
Immediately? And he pulled her right in the house.
Now, they immediately, Catherine was there.
They immediately chained her to the bed in the bedroom. david raped her as katherine watched uh katherine apparently did like research before they did this because she wanted to know exactly what they were doing. like exactly how to make this as like undercover as possible she wanted to make sure they didn't leave any like evidence.
She was like all about this. And then she took the time while he was raping her. to take notes on what he liked and what he didn't like. what yeah the how in your like how in your mind do you what yeah What?
And she also took pictures. No, the fuck that.
Now, according to Catherine herself, she said this is when David was like, oh.
Maybe we should also kill people? No. He was like, this is fun.
This is nice. But I'd really like to kill people too.
Like, can we kill her? Like saying this in front of her, like was literally like, do you think we should kill her? oh my god this poor girl yeah she and she said he had never said he wanted to kill someone before that he had only talked about abducting raping That was it.
But she was like... whatever david wants right well and she just you said she did so much research on like not leaving evidence when you fucking rape someone there's a whole lot of evidence I think we should do it.
Whatever David wants, David gets. This is horrible.
Yeah, so they took Mary out to Glen Eagles National Park. where he raped her again and then used a handmade garrote made out of a tree branch and rope to strangle her.
Oh my God. He then stabbed her in the chest because he read somewhere that stabbing someone speeds up decomposition.
What the fuck? They like researched this before.
And they buried her in a very shallow grave in the forest.
That's so sad. After that, they took Mary's car and left it near the police station.
Yeah. And this was apparently something that, like, they... read somewhere that all of the things that they did they were like well i read it somewhere that like you're supposed to do this where the fuck are you reading this shit I know.
Like I understand like speeding up decomp like that.
I understand there's probably sources on that.
Yeah. leave their car near the police station like exactly well and that's not right how to they would leave the cars somewhere else like they would bring them somewhere else So that was their first victim.
It's horrific. Mary Nielsen, 22 years old, 22 years old.
October 20th, only two weeks after that, October 20th 1986, They, you know, they're like, we're in the clear.
Right. No one's like finding her. It's fine.
So they started looking for their next victim.
Because they're like, it's been two weeks.
What are we doing here? Right. And they'd been driving around for a couple of hours that night on October 20th, and that's when they spotted Susanna Candy.
She was 15 years old. Oh, my God. She was hitchhiking along Sterling Highway when they found her.
I say hitchhiking. Some sources say she was hitchhiking.
Some say she was just walking. Okay. So...
I'm not sure which one is correct because there's plenty of sources on both of them, so I'll say both.
She was a student at Hollywood Senior High School and She lived at home with her parents and her siblings.
She lived in Nedlands. She was said to be a great student, straight A honor student.
Of course. Super sweet, happy personality.
She's adorable. If you see her picture, she... she looks like a 15 year old like she's just cute and just you're just like man you're just wholesome and you're a baby And her father was actually one of the top surgeons in Western Australia.
He was very protective. He had all daughters and he was very protective of them.
In fact, he didn't like that she was working at all, at the restaurant she was working.
He was like, I really would rather you not be working.
And then he was like, if you feel like you have to work, because she was like, I don't want to like be independent.
Yeah. Yeah. And he was like, okay, cool, but I want to pick you up from work and drive you home.
I understand that. I don't want you walking.
I don't want you taking rides. Yeah. So he would always do that.
Now this one night, he couldn't pick her up. oh my that poor man yeah so and it's literally and i think he would like come walk her home i think it was close enough that he could walk her He just couldn't, so she tried to get home herself.
Stop. Now, of course, the Bernies see her. offer her a ride, and once she got in the car, they immediately held her at knife point and tied her hands together.
They brought her back to their home where she was gagged, chained to the bed, and immediately raped by both of them.
My God. After David raped Susanna, Katherine got on and they assaulted her some more together. uh they decided that they weren't gonna kill her right away because they were like we killed you know mary right away And Deva was like, I'd really love to try to have, like, a sex slave.
So they were like, yeah, let's do that. So they kept her alive for several days.
I don't understand that. Horrific. Horrific.
Her parents immediately reported her as missing, obviously, but it was treated as a runaway situation.
It's so... Insane to me. Oh my god, it makes me so angry.
How can police assume to know people's children more than they do?
We say it all the time. It's beyond me. When they just immediately go to run...
It's like the Daniel Morcombe case. He was 13 years old and like his mom was like, no, he was at the bus stop to buy us Christmas gifts.
He wasn't running away. And it's like, why not just... exhaust all the resources and then go, shit, we didn't need to exhaust all those resources.
Yeah. You're better off just fucking up in that sense than going, let's not put any resources towards this and then somebody dies.
Right. I feel like I would much rather be like, oh, you spent a lot of money and resources and they were a runaway.
That's okay. Right. I'd rather you... do that right the other way it just it doesn't compute to me it really doesn't While she was there, they had her write letters to her parents and even called them on the phone.
That is like a whole different level of fucked up.
And she had them tell them that she ran away and just needed some space.
And they probably were like, that is not the case.
Well, her parents said they knew They heard it in their voice.
That something was wrong. And they brought the notes that they got to the police station and were like, this is not...
How she speaks. Like, this is not, she would not run away.
I can tell. I know my child. Yeah. And the police were probably like, no.
It's fine. They just said they looked at the notes and they said nothing looks weird.
And they were like, well, we know our child, though.
And, like, we know how she writes and how she talks.
And they were like, yeah, we don't see anything.
Sorry. Okay. Cool that you don't. I raised her.
So finally they decide. that they were going to kill her and David tried to put a nylon cord around her neck to strangle her in the bed.
Um, but Susanna started fighting, like fighting back and he was not prepared for that.
Well, and he's not a very large guy. He was like thin.
He's like a slice. man yeah and so and she was fighting back she was like fuck you and it had been days which like good on her because it's like she's probably weak as hell depleted of energy and she's fighting back so what ended up happening was they forced sleeping pills down her throat so she would calm down When she was unconscious, David picked up the cord. handed it to Catherine, and said, prove that you love me.
And Catherine went, okay, and immediately strangled her to death with it.
Now before this, she was involved in the rape, involved in the abduction, but she did not do the murder.
But now she's now she's officially right in there with him.
Yeah. She murdered her. She murdered Susanna.
Prove you love me. Prove you love me. I hate it.
So they ended up taking Susanna to the same state park.
They buried her in a shallow grave as well.
They were apparently planning on having like a graveyard that they could go visit.
That's very Myronian too, though. Thank you.
The Moors. Yes. And it's funny that this is called the Moor House and they lived on Moor House Road.
Yes. Whoa. Yeah, it's a little too much.
Too much. Over the next couple of weeks, they sent more of the letters that they had her write to kind of keep it going that she was alive.
So her parents were still getting letters from her after she was dead.
Thinking she's alive. Later, Catherine said about this murder, quote, It was like I expected.
I was prepared to follow him to the end of the earth and do anything to see that his desires were satisfied.
She was a female, females hurt and destroy males.
Right? I don't. I don't have anything. What the fuck?
You are also a female, ma'am. It's exactly, we say it again, it's just like Myra and Ian.
It is. She was willing to do fucking anything for him.
And she didn't give a shit who had to go down for it.
Yeah, it is. Wow. I love that females hurt and destroy males.
And it's like, Huh? What? I don't personally do that, I feel.
Excuse me? You're also, what? You're, you, why didn't you say we?
What is happening? Like, what the fuck? And also you picked her up.
She didn't come into your life. She wasn't destroying you.
She wasn't destroying you. But I wonder if she was like getting jealous of these girls too.
What? Well, funny that you say that. I feel like I keep segwaying really good for you.
You are. You're killing it. You're welcome.
I really appreciate it. Anytime. For someone who hasn't heard this case, you're doing a great job leading me right through to the end.
But I didn't know how you set it up. Yeah, you didn't know that this was it.
So speaking of that, I think we're going to end part one right here.
But don't worry, we're just going to press stop and then continue.
So you're going to get part one right now.
And when we come back, we are going to talk about the next two murders that they... commit.
And we are also going to talk about a survivor tale.
I love when it is a survivor tale. And it is quite a survival tale.
Well, and at the end of this case, I'm like... Yeah, you need it.
You know, actually, another thing that I was going to say, like we were pointing out all the parallels to Myra and Ian.
This also has a lot of parallels to Fred and Rosemary West.
It does. And actually, Fred and Rosemary are on the docket for the next few couple months, I think.
So... We're going to get to them too. I just love hitting those killer couples.
I just realized that I've hit like all of them. i just realized yeah honestly i did what i got like you did the erica and i always forget his name Yeah, and I did the Ken and Barbie Killers, Ian and Myra. i'm doing the fred and rosemary right now i'm doing this but yeah i like i like a killer couple I like old Hollywood.
You like murderous couples. Yeah. It just horrifies me so much.
Yeah. That two people find each other like that.
It's crazy. And they're also... It is interesting to...
Look at the pathology of two people coming together and morphing into one.
It really is. So we're going to stop there and we will pick it back up with some more murder, but we will end on hopefully a little bit of a positive note so stay tuned guys and we hope you keep listening and we hope you keep bit weird but that's the way they don't come back for part two Thank you.
If you like Morbid, you can listen early and ad free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.
Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music.
Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
