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Hey weirdos, my name is Ash. And my name is Elena.
And this has been and always will be Morbid.
So morbid right now. It's a hot red hot.
How are you? Hi, everybody. We're back with a brand new wrap.
Yep. Actually, that goes very well with my topic today.
Oh, I didn't even think of that because you just told me what you were doing.
Maybe that was like a subconscious thing that just came out of my mouth.
You know what? Let's just pretend that it just happened naturally and organically.
God knows I don't prepare anything, I say.
I'm sure everybody knows that. Fly by the seat of my pants kind of gal.
That's right. So today's going to be a fun.
I say fun. I always say it's going to be so fun.
You do always. It's a real brutal murder case, so that's not fun, but it's one that's like, whoa.
Sometimes the details and the lead up is just like, oh, okay.
Yeah, it's fun in the way that you're going to be like, what?
Huh? Huh? Yeah. But not fun. Like as in people got murdered.
I'm trying to think of like a real life situation it could relate to. yeah I don't really know it's like doing your taxes it's horrible but you get a reward at the end I don't know yeah if you enjoy numbers maybe it's fun I don't know I don't think it applies but either way you know what we mean and if you don't know what we mean then I don't know.
You will at the end of this. Yeah, you'll get it at the end.
So I think that we really don't really have any... you know no business to attend to it's kind of we're having a nice little calming couple of weeks maybe Yeah, there's no announcements or anything like that.
No big announcements. The one thing I would say was we have new merch on...
Morbid pod. What is it? My God. Shop.morbidpodcast.com.
It's because I'm the one that. Yeah, you're the one who always says it.
It's in our store. Yeah. And it's new murder apparel stuff and it's really fun.
Yeah. So go check that out for the holiday season.
And all the designs are so funny. Unfortunately, unfortunately, right now the booty one is sold out, but I'm sure we'll restock it soon.
Yeah, so keep an eye out for that. for that.
Oh, and I actually wanted to say one of the podcasts on our network called That's Spooky, our good friends, our good Canadian boys.
We love them. Johnny and Tyler. They just released an episode on Wednesday, and it's episode 112, Jerry Beats.
And it is hilarious. They're talking about Kenneth New and the Legend of the Banshee.
And when I actually just sent them both a text message, I was cackling like full on.
I love that. ash cackle crying in my car and you know what that spooky is real good for that oh my god they're so They're real good.
They're spooky gay bullshit. Just like, I thrive off of it.
It's great. so go check that out go check it out because we love them and we know that you'll love them they're our canadian brothers Our Canadian brothers.
Our brothers up north. So I think that's it.
Yeah, I think that's really it. Just some love.
Just as a little side note, because since we just plugged another podcast, Over on Scream, me and Caleb are doing some Thanksgiving movies this week, this month.
Thanksgiving horror movies. Okay. So go check those out because it's going to be fun.
I'm excited. We've hit some... Some real interesting ones.
I heard you're going to have like this really famous guest on soon.
Yeah, it's going to be so much fun. So keep an eye out for that. i'm looking forward so go check us out on scream and uh yeah i think that's really all we wanted to like be like about I weren't worrying about everything I can think of.
So let's dive into this. I'm really excited for this, and I know that's fucked up.
Excited because this is just one that's going to be like, what?
Crystal Wilden. Yeah, it reminds me slightly, it has like a flavor. of the Jasmine Richardson and Jeremy Stanky kind of thing.
It has a little bit of that flavor to it.
I love that flavor. But yeah, it's pretty bad.
Cool, cool, cool. This is called the Farmville murders already in.
That sounds like a movie. It does. And it's also I immediately thought of that game that everyone plays Farmville and like facebook oh yeah i never play i have no idea what it is but i remember people playing it all the time or they'd send you notifications that were like play Farmville with me.
And you were like, fuck off. That's not how these people met, is it?
No, it's not. I thought that when I saw the Farmville murders, I was like, whoa.
That would be a trip. Turns out it doesn't have anything to do with Farmville.
But then I quickly saw another case, which I won't cover, but so I just want to mention it here.
That does have to do with the Farmville thing on Facebook.
And it's a mom who killed her baby for interrupting her playing Farmville.
Oh yeah, we don't cover that. So we won't cover that.
There's nothing to cover. She's a shit stain.
What the fuck? She'll die someday, so that's good.
I have to feed the cows and kill you? Yeah.
I was like, what? All right. So the reason this is called the Farmville Murders. is it takes place in Farmville, Virginia in 2009.
You're taking us back to Virginia. Taking you back to Virginia.
We love Virginia in here. You got a lot of stuff going on, Virginia.
And I say taking us back because you did that for one of the live shows.
Yeah. So, you know, Virginia, we're back in you.
Hey. Happy to be here. you you got a lot going on so we will dip our toes into you a lot All right.
You're disgusting. It's got real gross. All right.
So. We're going to talk about the, this has to do with some teenagers and some online.
Oh, fuck those. Shenanigans. Oh, the best.
Some MySpace is involved here. Shut the fuck up.
We're really taking it back. I'm going to be 13 again.
So we're going to talk, first of all, we'll talk about the three teenagers that this has to do with and how they met, really. quick and just what they're about.
So the first one is 20-year-old Richard Samuel McCroskey III.
Not a teenager. He's a teenager. Honestly, when you hear about he has won the maturity level of a young teenager and he looks like a teenager.
Really? Well, Jeremy Stanky wasn't a teenager, so.
Same deal. But they act like a teenager.
They have the mentality of one. Yeah. And you're 20.
You might as well be. Honestly, 20, I kind of still consider you a little bit of a teenager.
The sequel. Yeah, exactly. So he's from California. he was he's kind of like a meek and mild kid he's he's always described as someone who is very passive, doesn't fight back, is teased a lot, doesn't really... just doesn't really get along with a lot of people.
And it's not because he's aggressive. really but like like outwardly or anything he's very passive just very shy Keeps to himself.
Everyone who describes him says he would never fight back when someone teased him.
He would just shut down and that's it. I already feel like this is gonna ruin me.
Which is very interesting when you find out who he is as a person later.
So he's also... So this meek, mild kid who looks much younger than 20...
He has an online persona. Okay. As a lot of people do. online is a place to curate who you are you know like if you're not happy with who you are in real life You get to be whoever you want online.
We've all seen it. We've all seen the couples that are obsessed with each other and like constantly posts like crazy in your face like dripping with goo stuff.
But you know them in real life. You're like, you guys literally hate each other.
You hate each other. And or like the person who's just constantly like, you know, showing all these pictures of them and all these wild places.
And it's like. Meanwhile, they took it on like the side of the highway and like a bunch of bushes and made it look like they were in a field of flowers.
Or the people involved in pyramid schemes.
Those are my favorite. Exactly. So everyone, you know, we all know people like this.
Yes. And especially teenagers, especially in like the early aughts and stuff, Online was a place you can go, you can have your own little fantasy world, you can be who you want to be.
Right. You know? And honestly, a lot of people made a lot of friends online during the heyday of this i'm sure people still are but during like the heyday of it people were really like Holy shit, I can talk to people far away.
Yeah, like, Myspace? Holy shit. Like, that was crazy.
So very into MySpace, very into social media.
And he was very into the horror core scene.
I had no idea what horrorcore was. It's very hard to say as well.
It is because you honestly just end up saying horrorcore.
It's like the rural juror. It's hard to say.
It's really hard to say. It is. So horrorcore is like a rap scene, a music scene.
It's kind of akin to the Juggalo scene where it's like ICP.
Those kind of musicians who... Horrorcore is rapping about like, I don't know if there's a lot of singing involved.
I've only seen rapping from what I've looked into it.
And I've only just looked into it for this case.
Who knows? I was going to say, I've never heard of it.
I've only seen rap, but it's basically rapping about the darkest shit you can imagine.
Like murder, mutilation, torture, rape. Okay.
It's just the dark shit that you can pull out of the... depths of your psyche is what they rap about.
Yeah. Which, in and of itself, is fine, in my opinion.
In my opinion, because it's like... You know, people are shitheads are shitheads.
Well, that's the thing. I don't believe that like music makes you do something.
I think if you're, you are going to do it.
Like, you know, it's like when we talked about the kids that were, um, like quote-unquote satanist and then the parents like sued the rock bands yeah like you can't blame the music in my opinion i agree So he was very into this scene.
It's a very like big scene, like very underground though, you know, Because it has to do with the macabre and the morbid, if you will.
Oh my god, I know about that. Now he himself, now this meek, mild kid who gets teased a lot, is an amateur horrorcore rapper.
I love that part. Who goes under the name?
Oh my god, hit me with it. Psycho Sam. Hell yeah, Psycho Sam.
Spelled. S-Y-C-O, Sam. Okay, I hate that.
That's not how you spell psycho. That's actually very incorrect.
I did look on the MySpace pages, though, because even though MySpace is not a thing anymore, you can find the... the front page of people's Myspaces, I think.
Oh shit. And I found all these kids, their front pages of theirs, and I could see their friends list and a lot of people, like you can tell that these are from like 2009.
Oh, hell yeah. A lot of them had those names, like their nicknames in the scene.
And like the asterisks on the side. And a lot of them began with like Psycho.
And spelled like that. So it seems like that might be a thing in the scene.
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Start your free trial in Apple Podcasts Spotify or the Wondery app Now, he said he named himself Psycho Sam because he was obsessed with Son of Sam.
Oh, weird icon. What a fucking icon. First of all, serial killers don't, like...
Don't look up to them to begin with like but say a son of a son of Sam like the lamest David motherfucking Berkowitz is your pick of the litter yeah he looks like a like a wretched like again Don't pick any serial killer as your idol or your role model, but definitely don't pick David Berkowitz out of the Do you know what, though?
I feel like if David Berkowitz was like, Like, I feel like he would fit.
You know what I mean? No. Like, his horrorcore name would be Chubby Bohemoth.
Yeah, that's true. Psycho chubby behemoth.
He would fit into this. I still don't understand why anyone would idolize him.
No, I don't either. either. There's nothing.
I mean, whatever. So his family, again, described him as two different people somebody online and somebody in real life and they didn't know a whole lot about his online persona they just knew that he was online a lot And he kind of stayed to himself.
He definitely used horrorcore in his online curated persona to portray himself as hardcore a real tough guy, somebody who doesn't give a shit.
It was a fantasy world. He could literally be whoever he wanted to be.
He could make friends in this scene. He became very close with members of this scene, like other artists and stuff, which in and of itself seems like it would be a positive thing.
He's a member of a community that he feels good about.
Like, I know a lot of, like... you know in the juggalo scene and all that like they feel like it's a community like a family where they feel accepted and all that so that is positive to me.
I agree. Of course there's going to be members of any community that are dicks and take it into a different...
That's literally anything you can think of.
Anything. Anything. So he also really liked photography and web design.
And I guess he was pretty good at it. That's cool.
So that's cool. So he did a ton of web design and concert photography for small horrorcore labels in the area because again he was an aspiring artist himself so this is his like foot in the door and these little labels his screen name was Lil Demon Dog.
And it's capital L, lowercase I, capital L, lowercase. capital E, lowercase m, and it goes on like that.
We love the SpongeBob writing. Well, it's all obviously another reference to Son of Sam, Little Demon Dog.
Yep. That's who we have for Richard Samuel McCroskey, aka Psycho Sam.
Cool, cool, cool. then we have 16 year old emma niederbrook she was born and again 16 years old yeah he was 20 very young She was born October 15th, 1992.
She was described as sweet, smart, and beautiful.
You look at pictures of her. She is beautiful.
She was homeschooled, like... Pretty early, I think from the time she was like 11 or something, she was homeschooled.
She was very into fashion, particularly goth fashion at the time, like the scene look and all that.
She wanted to be a fashion designer when she grew up.
She was also very interested in the occult.
Okay. She grew up in a very strict, pretty religious home.
So I think she just went that way. Going against it.
Like I said, her MySpace is one that I went on.
Her MySpace is still up with photos and you can see that she dyed her hair bright pink.
She wore very intense makeup. I love it.
Like she did this like it's pretty cool actually.
Like I was like, kudos to you for rocking that like confidence girlfriend.
Cause she did this like, eyeliner that like went all the way down like it like pointed down towards her nose oh that's cool so it made her eyes look even like almost like ominous I don't know how to describe it but I'll like link all these pages if you want to see them But again, she rocked it.
Her photos are the typical like hot topic kind of.
Yes. You know, it's very hot topic in there.
This whole scene seemed to me very hot topic.
Yeah. But you know, that's just. You know what's hilarious?
I remember like wanting to do that so badly, but I am not of that mold at all.
Like, I would walk into Hot Topic and all of the employees would walk to the back and be like, why the fuck is that girl here?
I would have... die like i remember suddenly we're like i am this girl like i remember thinking scene girls were so cool i like They were cool.
I mean, they were. I remember like cutting those bangs and everything.
I love that shit. Oh, yeah. But I did not fit that scene at all.
I didn't fit the scene scene at all. But I love you for that.
So she went by the name, especially online, Ragdoll.
Cute. Because they all go by those nicknames.
And she wore a necklace all the time with the word doll on it.
Cute. I looked through her MySpace, a lot of her friends were similar, like juggalos and horrorcore people.
Very emo and scene-looking. A few of them, again, had the psycho moniker before them.
Most of them had nicknames as their names, so I think that's just part of the culture.
Even though she was deeply entrenched in this horrorcore world.
So hard to say. It is. You should just say HC.
HC. She was also... like into mainstream music.
She liked NSYNC and the Backstreet Boys.
Hell yes. So she liked... All of it. I think she just was really into this scene and probably liked the aesthetic.
She was into the people. She felt good with these people.
But she also liked to rock out to Backstreet Boys and NSYNC, which is kind of fun.
She also played soccer. So she was a very well-rounded individual.
We love an eclectic gal queen. Now she met... one of her best friends who she was inseparable from online.
Okay. who was an 18 year old girl named Melanie Wells.
She was born on February 13th, 1991 in Louisiana.
She lived in West Virginia at the time when she was 18 years old.
She had dropped out of high school and ended up finishing her education through homeschool as well.
All three of them had been homeschooled in some capacity or another, which is interesting.
Sam too, or Richard Sam. Sam, I guess Richard slash Sam, he did like a half... thing where like he would go to school certain days a week and then homeschool the rest.
Yeah, so all of them in some capacity had, which I think is interesting.
Yeah, that is interesting. I'm not saying it has anything to do with what happened, but it's just a very weird and interesting thing.
So Melanie was described as very sweet, very kind.
Her and Emma were like best friends immediately.
They just totally bonded and I think they were very alike.
Melanie was also very entrenched in this scene, so they had that.
Now, Melanie and Emma, the way they met, they met Richard.
They met each other online through another horrorcore artist.
Okay. Hard to say, but I'm going to keep trying.
Good. You're doing it. They liked this artist who I'm going to talk about in a second.
Her name is Razakal. i think cool and she ended up talking to the two of them separately melanie and emma like through dms on on Myspace, like Myspace messaging.
And then she ended up talking to them. They were saying how much they loved her music.
And then she was like, oh, you two should meet because you're in the same area and you're both really cool.
And I think you would like each other. I love that.
So she kind of just like set them up and they became friends.
They met Richard also through this kind of scenario.
All three of them had become part of an online promotional team for Razakal.
And this, now, she, Razakal, is also called the queen of the wicked shit.
Fuck yeah. Which I was like... Awesome.
Okay, Razakal. Same, Razakal. Right? And her promo teams were called the Unholy Apostles.
Yeah. Is she you? Are you Rosical? Am I Rosical?
Are you pretending right now that you're not?
I'm going to be honest, the unholy apostles, as awesome as that sounds, it's also like the over-the-topness of this whole scene.
But it... fits so perfectly for this time period.
It totally does. Everything was so over the top online.
It's over the top in like an endearing way.
Like you're like, yeah. Like, I love that you have a team.
What did you say? They were a marketing team?
Yeah, they're a promotional team. I love that.
I love it. And she's still doing music, by the way.
I will talk about Razakil later. Is it good?
Because she... not in your opinion but like maybe for someone else you know what she's making it okay It's fine.
You know what? You guys might dig it. Yeah.
Who am I to say? It's just not my thing, but like... get it well some of that i mean like i like music that you don't like so yeah i mean you definitely wouldn't like it but somebody might like it so So I will definitely say that.
And she's doing the damn thing and I respect her for that.
Hell yeah. But I will talk about her reaction to this whole thing later.
Now, the three of them talked online for a long time.
Emma and Richard... began being very like they got into kind of a romantic thing okay they Now, Richard thought that Emma was his online girlfriend.
Emma never said she was his girlfriend, but they were flirty and like were talking for up to a year.
Okay. so she was also posting at times saying like she loved him and blah blah but then she'd tell people like no he's not my boyfriend Which I get because it's online.
Well, that's the thing. And that was like so of that time.
So of that time. Like I was flirting with like four different dudes on MySpace.
Like I was such a little hoe on MySpace.
I get it. Yeah, everybody had an online boyfriend or girlfriend.
And it's so difficult because you would talk to somebody for the whole summer and be like, oh my God, we're going to date freshman year.
And then you'd go to school and they'd be like, not for you.
Yeah, exactly. I feel like, yeah. And these two are from opposite sides of the country.
It's not like... And they're 16 and 20. Right.
It's not like... I think he, unfortunately, what happened was he built this relationship up in his mind and had certain expectations and certain... of what it was.
And she looked at it as like a fun, I'm flirting with this cool guy who's into stuff I am.
Lighthearted. And she kind of went with it because she's writing like, I love you and we're soulmates.
But then she's telling people like, no, we're just...
Talking online. Okay. Which I can't blame her for that.
No, I respect it. It's an online thing. I did it.
I did it. So yeah, so they... After about a year, they wanna all three of them, Melanie, Emma, and Richard, They want to meet up and go to this concert slash festival with a bunch of horrorcore artists that are going to perform.
It's in Southgate, Michigan, and it was called Strictly for the Wicked.
Hell yeah. Which sounds awesome. We should start calling our live shows that.
Yeah, like this is strictly for the wicked.
Strictly for the weirdos. Yeah, like, that's amazing.
So, I get it. And they were like, we want to do this.
Of course, it's like... 1500 miles away or something from where, uh, Melanie and Emma live.
Right. And Richard would have to fly across the country.
So there's that problem. Now... Her parents tried to... They tried to be good parents.
Emma's parents? Yeah, Emma's parents... really tried here.
And I just want to give them like they I feel like they did what they thought was right and they tried really hard and it kind of backfired on them in the biggest way it possibly could.
Oh no. So her parents are 53-year-old Deborah Kelly and 50-year-old Mark Niederbrook.
So they were in the process of divorcing.
That's why. Debra took back her last name.
Oh, okay. So Debra was born September 28th, 1955 in Richmond, Virginia.
She was a sociology and criminology professor at Longwood University.
Good for her. She had like a doctorate. She was brilliant.
Wow. Her father was a reverend, Reverend Mark Niederbrook.
He was born March 20th, 1959 in Illinois.
He was the head of the Walker's Presbyterian Church in Hicksburg, Virginia for six years.
Wow. So parents are a professor and a reverend.
Yes. So, and of course, like, she's like a preacher's daughter, you know, like she's a tip. to rebel against it.
She was their only child too. Mm-hmm. Now, in 2009 when this all went down, they weren't divorced, they were just in the process of separating.
Okay. They were trying to like, trying to make it work, but they had separated out of the, like, they had stayed in the home, Deborah and Emma.
Mark had moved out. They were going to counseling.
They were trying to like get back to it.
Okay. And it seemed by all accounts that things were amicable.
They weren't like a... It wasn't this awful thing.
And they were also very respectful of each other and co-parenting.
They wanted to make sure that they made decisions together.
Yeah, so it was like, it seemed like it was a good thing.
But Emma was having a little bit of a... issue with it.
She's 16. When your parents divorce at 16 years old I imagine it must be tough.
At any age, but 16, you've gone through 16 years of having... them together and that's just like such a fucking horrible it's a hard age anyway so you know i feel like it was bad so this is when she got like really into horrorcore i think she just kind of like threw herself into it yeah it was an escape right um Now, they knew Emma was into this scene.
They hated it. Yeah. But... And in fact, they hated it so much that Deborah was going to counseling with Emma to try to make sure that this was like, safe okay and safe okay and trying to keep an open channel of communication with her about it Because the lyrics are very like... Very... They're a lot.
And they're very violent. And especially for a mom off the...
It would be scary as a parent to hear your kid listening to this.
I will say that. Yeah. Like, I... I get, I can see all sides of this.
And again, they weren't telling her forbidding her from listening to it or being a part of it.
They just wanted to make sure they were they were a part of it too.
Which is smart. Which I think is really smart.
And they were determined to remain in her life and an open channel of communication.
So they wanted to kind of just not push her away by saying like, no, I'm going to chain you up and not let you go out.
So they were trying. But they figured we need to be aware of everything, we need to try to support her.
We hope this is a phase that she's going through.
Let's ride it out together, you know? So they agreed together that they would participate in this meetup that they wanted to happen for this festival.
That's cool as hell. So they said you know Richard has to fly here.
He has to figure that out. Yeah. We're not finding him out.
Like, figure that out. But you and Melanie can stay in our home and...
And we will take you to that festival, the three of you together.
Wow. And as we will drive you there, we will pick you up so we know where you are.
We're going to be there to see what's going on.
That's great. I get why they thought this was the best way to go about it.
Yeah, I myself would not have a 20-year-old I didn't know stay in my house.
But I understand. So Richard was going to be staying in the house too.
Richard and Melanie. Oh, I thought just Melanie.
Okay, so yeah. That is not... I wouldn't do that, but I can see that they were...
That they were trying. Well, and it's their house, so they're like, we're going to see everything.
Yeah, and I feel like they thought that they had a handle on this.
I can see what they were going for. I just feel really bad because they really gave it a shot to be like... you know, parents that are there and listening and supportive.
And I think it just they should have been a little harder and I think it would have been a little better but I don't know but they were trying to do what they thought was 2020 yeah you do what you think is best and they thought this was best So they were going to pick Richard up from the airport, and then they were going to drive straight to the concert.
Okay. And then he would stay with Melanie.
He must have been tired. I know for a couple of days at the house.
So they could all just like get to know each other and hang out.
So September 12th, 2009. Okay. He arrives at the airport.
They go to pick him up, Melanie, Emma, and Debra.
Uh-huh. Immediately, the online persona has fallen away.
Yes. And now it's real people meeting each other.
Which is always awkward. Always awkward, no matter what.
But when you don't have that perfectly angled...
MySpace photo or the mirror shot. It's like you're naked.
You look a little different. Yeah. just look a little different emma was immediately not attracted to him because she was like oh no And when you look at the pictures he posted, you can see that like different because then you see him afterwards and you're like, yeah, you you really angled those pictures.
We all know a MySpace angle. We all know.
We all know. And so she was immediately not attracted to the school who walked off the plane. you know, he's portraying online this tough guy, this hardcore psycho sam rapper right she was like oh i'm into that and then he walks off the plane and he's like And he just like has no self-confidence.
Right. Is very meek, very quiet. And she's like, what the fuck is this?
Right. This is not what I signed up for.
I'm not into it. So he immediately felt the rejection, like right off the bat, because she was like, yeah, no, this isn't going to happen.
And we all know how 16 year olds act when they're like, oh, fuck.
Well, that's the other thing. She's 16 years old.
Mm hmm. She's 16 years old, so you know she was like, nope.
I had a very similar experience to this.
Did you really? I did. And I actually got in trouble.
I was very, very mean to somebody that I went on a family vacation with who I like had a crush on.
I was a little twat. And it's actually one of my biggest regrets to this day.
Oh, my God. Yeah. Oh, I feel bad. That's sad.
I know. But I totally understand exactly how she feels.
The mentality of just like, no, I don't like this person now.
Like, it doesn't fit my fantasy of what the online persona was.
And she's, like, she's with her best friend and her best friend is older.
This exact thing happened to me. And her best friend is probably like, ugh.
I met this other girl on the family vacation and she was older and she was like so cool.
We had a lot in common. And you both were like.
And I think I acted like a lot older and cooler.
It was, it was exactly the situation. I know.
Oh, that's so sad. And I got into so much trouble.
I was like grounded. You deserved it. I did I did I absolutely did Kyler if you're listening I'm a horrible person and it looks like you're doing great these days Also, I'm gay now.
So it's fine. In the end, everything was where it should be.
But this didn't. So let's get. back on track so so basically it's same thing so it's literally you know she's got her best friend with her at The two of them are sitting there like, no, this is not Psycho Sam, this is Richard III.
Just walked off the plane. Oh no. So that's not cool.
So. Again, he's immediately feeling that rejection.
He's immediately feeling like he's not with his people.
He's not he has not just met his like online, you know, and that sucks.
Yeah, I can imagine. So then they go to the concert and they had to drive hours in the car.
So it was probably the most fucking awkward shit.
And with her parents, like, that already was gonna be awkward, and then you had this layer and then you add that like they're not into him and they're probably acting like shitty to him because in that situation you just don't want to be yeah you don't even want to be near them because you're like gross i've been flirting with him for like a year and now i'm really not attracted to him yeah Like, that's a rough situation.
I know this. So at the concert, people at the concert said that she was... very flirty with other guys like in front of him.
There's rumors that she was like flirting with a band member of one of the like groups which like honey if you get that opportunity get it like if i could have flirted with one of the members of like yellow card or like All time low.
Seriously, like if I, Ryan Key from Yellow Card.
Yes. If I could have flirted with Ryan Key from Yellowcard at one of the shows we went to, I would have taken that opportunity.
I threw my bra at Jack Barakat. That's something I didn't need to know.
You're welcome. but it's funny because now i'm dating a woman but like i know that is amazing but i had like a stupid boyfriend in high school like yeah uh sorry about it listening but like he sucked and i honestly if i had that opportunity to like flirt with andrew mcmahon hello like I would have taken that in a second.
Sign me up, sister. So I get it, Emma. I get it.
You know, these are your idols. She is very relatable.
But. he's pissed and he's getting more and more and he's feeling slighted He's feeling slighted because again, not just this rejection.
But the fact that he has built this relationship into something different for him than it was for her.
Yeah. And the two of them did not communicate this to each other, so I think they were both Thinking different things about what this was.
And then it became a rejection thing. And now it seems to him like it's being thrown in his face.
Yep. That's what he's taking it as. So September 13th, 2009.
They're back at home now. They went to the concert.
Everything seems to be fine. They're like getting along.
Everything's fine. They're all hanging out.
Melanie posts on her MySpace that she's going to be back in West Virginia on the 16th.
Okay. So now Melanie's family all of a sudden stops hearing from her.
At the concert? No, this is when they're home.
Oh, they're home, okay. Because she's staying at their home.
Oh, Melanie, Melanie. Gotcha, gotcha. Now, Melanie's family just doesn't hear from her.
Right. And they're like, wait, she's staying at these people's like, why isn't she answering all of a sudden?
Oh, no. So Wednesday, September 16th, when she's supposed to be going home, Melanie's father Thomas showed up at the home of Deborah Kelly to get his daughter because he was like, why isn't she texting back?
No one's answering the door. He can't see in any of the windows.
He's calling, no one's answering. He stayed out there for hours because he was like, they must not be home, but where are they?
Oh, my... I can't imagine this poor man's feeling.
Literally, like, hours outside to wait for them or just to get a hold of someone...
Can you imagine that feeling? He's panicking.
Yeah. I can't even fathom this. He leaves because he's like, I don't know what else to do here.
And he leaves to go home. to talk to the mom and be like, what do we do now?
Should we call the police? They're both very upset.
Her mom had texted the night before at the concert, like, texted Melanie.
Okay, have fun. Love you. And Melanie wrote back, we will love you too, mom.
And that's the last text she sent. Oh, God.
Now, the next series of texts that goes to Melanie is just her mother, and it says, Honey, where are you?
Please call me. Are you okay? very worried, where are you?
Question mark, question mark. Is something wrong?
And then melanie please call me oh god and none of them go answered oh god so kathleen melanie's mom starts calling everyone they know to see if they know where Melanie is.
Yeah. Because the other thing is she's 18.
So this becomes a little more difficult for them.
Absolutely. Because she's not a child, technically.
So they call to the mom, which I'm like, Kathleen.
Melanie's mom, I'm like, you are a sleuth.
And I'm very impressed by her. She must have been up on what, and it seemed, I mean, you can look at those text messages and see they loved each other.
They're close. They had that relationship that they said that and where it seemed like they were close.
Yeah. So I think she was keeping tabs on what she was doing and at least knew who she was talking to.
When you're 18, you're still a child. And like good for her mom for like knowing these things.
Right. Because you know, you can use them in these situations.
So she calls this guy Andre Schrimm. And this guy... runs serial killing records in New Mexico.
Obviously. She knew that Melanie was friends with this guy and talked to this guy.
I love that mama called Serial Killing Records to find where her kid was.
And she knew that Richard and Emma were also friends with this guy.
So she was like, they're all connected here.
I'm gonna start calling people in this scene.
We love a mama bear. She's deeply involved. involved in this scene so I'm gonna start calling people good for her wow and by all accounts Andre was very helpful It was like very like, I'm glad she called me.
This is his community. This is his family.
So like good for them. And he himself raps under the name Sictanic the Soulless.
Obviously. What? The soulless. The soulless.
Sicktanic. Sicktanic. Oh, I'm not going to shit you right now.
I was about to ask you what a tannic was.
No, at first, it took me a second. Okay, cool.
And then I was like, oh, satanic. Satanic.
Yeah, Syctanic the Soulless. He is actually the boyfriend of Razakel.
Oh, we love this. So see, we're all connected.
This is so cool. I know, right? But not.
When she talked to him, when Mama talked to him, he said, I didn't see them all day.
But he said, I did see them at that music festival.
Yeah. The day before. So he was like, I did see them.
They were all fine. And he was like, and they went home with, you know... the parents mom and dad like like you don't have to worry i don't think like i saw them and they were fine oh no so she's like okay Now, the way that Andre knows Psycho Sam is because Psycho Sam was a web designer for his rap label. for the serial killer records.
And obviously he was aspiring himself, so we figured if I could help out with web design, maybe he'll sign. me again fun and adore so she then so then mama kathleen melanie's mom calls Debra's home some more, like, just, okay, she's gotta be there.
Yeah, like, they're gonna get home eventually.
They gotta be out somewhere. And maybe I'm just maybe her phone died.
I don't know. But then suddenly she gets an answer. when she calls richard answers i knew psycho sam i motherfucking knew psycho sam answers She's like, hey, where's Melanie?
Can I talk to her? Why are you answering the phone at a house you don't live in?
And he was like, oh, you know... They're out.
They're at like a movie and I stayed in and they just told me to like answer the phone if one of you called so I could tell you.
No. And she was like, okay. That would not sit right with me.
He's like, that's weird. So then she calls back like two hours later and he answers again.
And she's like, where are they? And he gives them a different excuse.
What's it? Do you know what it is? I don't know what these were, but so far every time she calls, he keeps giving different reasons why they can't come to the phone.
It's also like, why are you still answering if you know that they're clearly not there?
Exactly. And it's always different every time.
It's just, oh, this is why they can't come now.
Right. They went to dinner. Now they're this.
Now they're that. Now the parents are getting super stressed and they know he's lying.
Yeah. So September 17th, Kathleen called Mark, Emma's father.
Sure. Because Mark doesn't live in that house.
Right. So she calls Mark and she's like, can you go check on your fucking wife and, like, daughter?
Like... In my child, like, I don't know what's going on.
And I'm sorry, how long was this? A day after?
This was, so this was on the 17th. and the last they had talked was...
On the 16th, Melanie was supposed to be home.
Okay, okay. So, I mean, it was on the 13th that she posted on MySpace, so she's been there since... the 12th oh okay uh so this is the 17th and she was hearing up until the 16th from her okay So then Kathleen's like, you know, Mark, can you go check?
And Mark's like, oh my God, yeah, like... absolutely like what the fuck sorry so he's like holy shit so he says at 5 p.m he's gonna go check because he's He's on his way.
I think he was on his way. I think when they talked, it was close to 5 p.m.
So he's like, I'll drop by there. on my way to this other thing for work.
And they're like, okay, cool. Now, Richard's mother later would say that the last time she talked to her son was when he called her that same night. on the 17th, at around 7 p.m.
And she said, quote, he sounded perfectly fine.
My mother's intuition is pretty strong. He said he was having a good time and he loves me.
Just putting that out there. Now midnight rolls around.
Kathleen has not heard back from Mark. Uh huh.
So now she's like, what the fuck is going on?
So she calls the police. Oh no. Richard, what have you done?
So she calls the police and she's like, can you do a welfare check? because and she explains the whole thing i've been calling for days this kid is answering the phone i don't know who this fucking kid is like he's an online kid and then i sent the I send the dad and I'm not getting anything from the dad.
The police were probably like, what the fuck are we going to find?
So the police show up to the house. Oh, my God.
This story is fucking insane. This blew my mind.
Richards answers the door. And they're like, hi.
Hi there. You don't live there. And he goes, oh, no, I don't live here.
All the women are out at the movies. And where's daddy?
And they were like, where's the dad? And he was like, oh, he stopped by here, but he left.
Like, I don't know. He's not here. No, he didn't.
The police are just like, okay, cool, thanks.
And they leave. Okay, so that was the LAPD at the door.
They don't go in the house. They're like, what the fuck?
Okay. Really? They just are like, okay, cool, kid who doesn't live in this home.
And can't offer us any real explanation for where these people are.
I mean, but you think about it, it's like they would have had a search warrant to go any further.
Exactly. So it is tough. But they couldn't even ask?
Can we look inside? yeah if he had said sure but then i do wonder maybe he couldn't have given permission i I don't know, but either way, if they had probable cause to believe anything...
And they definitely do. They have missing people.
They could say, like, you know, we need to know where they are.
So they tell Kathleen everything's fine.
And she's like, no, it's not. And Kathleen's like. no he said they were at the movies before like what the fuck they're not just going out to the cinema every four hours like that doesn't make sense right So Kathleen calls the house again and it's like, what the fuck?
Richard answers. Oh my goodness. Again.
And this time, he can't really tell her where they are.
He doesn't have an explanation. He just says no, they can't come to the phone.
And she's like, where are they? And he's like, ah.
I don't know. They just can't come to the phone.
They're just busy. Uh-huh. Because they're dead.
Seriously? So she's like, all right, Richard, something seems wrong.
You should call the police. I can't believe she's been talking to him this whole.
Because at this point, she's like, okay, the police aren't helping me.
No one's helping. I'm like, can I talk to this guy?
I've called here. So now she's like, Richard, why don't you call the police?
Because something seems wrong here. Yeah.
And Richard's like, yeah, you know what?
You're right. So she's like, OK, bye. She's like, all right.
Richard calls the police and says. Hey, I hear some noises in my basement.
Can you come check it out? And so the police come.
They check the basement. Apparently didn't go in the rest of the house, just checked the basement.
Don't find anything weird in the basement.
They're like, oh, I don't know. Okay. Weird.
This is the most bizarre story of all time.
I told you it's so bizarre. What? So they leave.
Friday, September 18th at 3.20 p.m., Virginia State Police come again because Kathleen keeps calling them.
Yeah, good. Good on Kathy. She's like, oh, hey, go to that fucking house again.
Are you insane? Like, there is clearly something going on. hasn't heard from her daughter in what like days oh my god i think i think it was five days now So it's five days now and she's like, get the fuck back to that house.
Something is wrong. This poor woman. Like, how do you get through your week?
So they listened. They went back to the house.
They knock on the door and immediately they said through a locked door. they got a horrific smell.
And they said they knew exactly what that smell was, obviously.
So they forced themselves in. Because the smell of decomposition is probable cause to enter a home.
Oh, it is? Yeah. So they were like, we smell dead people.
So let's go in. So, they go in, Richard is gone.
Of course. He's nowhere to be found. Because he probably couldn't handle it at this point. was three dead bodies.
Three. Three bodies that were horrifically murdered in a downstairs bedroom.
Oh no. So they leave to get a search warrant because now they were able to go in.
But now if they want to touch anything or do anything, they need a warrant.
Right. So they go, they immediately get a warrant because they're like, oh, there's three dead bodies in there.
And they come back and this is when they find a fourth body.
Oh, okay. dead upstairs in another bedroom.
An officer later said it was quote, the most gruesome crime scene I have ever attended.
They identify the bodies as Mark, Debra, Emma, and Melanie.
Oh, no. So Melanie, Emma, and Debra were killed in their beds as they slept.
Melanie had been sleeping on the couch downstairs.
They were beaten with what they initially thought was a sledgehammer.
Oh, my God. because of the amount of damage done.
And they did find a sledgehammer in the house, so they were like, I think this could be it.
Mark was murdered with the same object as he arrived at the home to check on them.
Right. He was snuck up from behind. and like slammed in the head.
This is like a horror movie. Mark's attack was so bad that the hardwood floor under him was almost destroyed.
Are you kidding? And was soaked through with blood.
Oh my god. Yeah. Psycho Sam again is nowhere to be found, so now they're on the hunt for this tool.
Right. They use social media to track down friends and such because, again, this horror core community.
They're all connected. They're all connected.
So they end up speaking again with Andre, because Andre actually called them.
Oh, the police. Called the police and said, hey...
A friend of mine spoke with Richard like yesterday or something like that.
I think it was the Thursday. Yeah. And he told this guy that he murdered people.
Oh. So Andre, good on him, called the police and was like, yeah.
I think something's weird here. He and his girlfriend Razakel also told police that This is where you can find recent pictures of Richard on MySpace.
Awesome. So they led them to the pictures so that they could distribute the pictures.
Even though. is that what Richard even looks like?
Which is not really good pictures, I guess, but they tried.
So apparently Richard... From what they could tell from time of death and all that, he had sat in the home for days.
Well, and he's been answering the phone.
Yeah. Then they killed when then he killed Mark when he showed up and sat with his body as well.
And just left it right there. He didn't change clothes.
He didn't shower the entire five days. He just sat there in the thick stench of decomp.
The fuck? so badly that he, and we will find out later, everyone who came across him afterwards was like, he smelled so bad.
Yeah. You could smell him coming from like a mile away.
Well, and again, you said he didn't change his clothes.
He's obviously got some kind of like blood and shit on.
Oh yeah, people said there was like gore and shit on his clothes.
What the fuck? He then stole money from Mark's wallet and stole Mark's car, a 2000 Honda, and left.
He immediately got like run off the road or something.
He like ran into a ditch. Oh. The police ended up being called.
Good. It was like 4 a.m. when this happened.
And the police came. didn't realize they were looking for him yet.
Shut the fuck up. Because remember, when they showed up, Richard was gone.
Right. So this was the night before that he wrecked the car and the police show up.
At this point, they don't know that they're looking for a killer.
Right, right. But they had them right there.
So... He just gets ticketed for driving without a license.
That's it. Why wouldn't they not realize that the car is not registered to him?
Whose car is this? He says, oh, it's my girlfriend's dad.
Oh. And they're just like, okay. I like that he's still going with the story that Emma was his girlfriend.
My girlfriend's dad. That I just... He maintains that for a long time.
Ew, that poor girl. She's probably, like, beyond the grave, like, motherfucker.
No, I was not. Yeah, she's like, never. Never was your girlfriend.
So they do set up the car to be towed when it got run off the thing.
So they give them the ticket and They're like, we're going to tow the car, so figure it out.
Like, where do you want to go? So he... gets a ride with the tow truck driver.
Yeah. Who said he reeked so badly, and drives Richard to a convenience store.
Wait, and you said that there was gore on his clothing.
How did the police not fucking realize that?
Maybe they couldn't see it. And he was wearing a sweatshirt, a zip-up sweatshirt over his really baggy clothing.
Sure. So maybe they just didn't see it. Okay.
He then took, so he drove him to the convenience store, and that's where he took a taxi to the airport to get back home to California.
He was trying to get out of here. Are you kidding me?
And the taxi ride was like an hour or something long.
Oh, that poor taxi driver. The taxi driver... later said he was almost retching because of how bad Richard smelled of death.
Oh, gross. He had to roll down the windows the entire time.
He said he quote, smelled like the devil.
He also opened up to him slightly. Richard did.
Oh, my God. Can you imagine being this poor taxi driver?
And he said he was very calm, a very nice kid.
Like, very came off, very sweet. And he told him he got in a fight with his girlfriend, Emma.
Mm-hmm. because she caught him going through her phone and she was pissed.
And he said, well, what I found was I found this guy texting her.
And telling her he loved her. And I got angry.
But we just got in a fight. And we're going to get over it.
No, like telling him this. And then he's like, I don't want to deal with it.
So I'm going back to California to like cool off.
Oh. And he's like, cool. And he described him as, quote, he spoke calmly and never raised any of my suspicions.
He said he even gushed about Emma saying like how beautiful she was. how their first meeting was everything he wanted it to be.
No, it wasn't. Her smile was unlike anything he had ever seen.
He's not in love with this girl. He's fucking obsessed obsessed and he's talking about how you know we got you I'm gonna have to sweet talk her but we'll get over it I feel like... Do you think he believed that, though?
No, I think that he... I think... I don't know.
I think... I think he has like weird different like detached parts of his personality or something.
Yeah. But either way, witnesses, like I said, who saw him in passing said his clothing had like crap all over it.
And I mean, at this time, it's dried blood, so it's going to look dark.
It's going to look like almost brown. at this point, like oxidized.
And then anything else is just gonna be like caked on.
It's gonna look like he's just dirty. So Saturday, September 19th, 2009, at 1 a.m., police have given the rich...
Richmond National Airport Richard's photo.
Oh good. Because they're like he's going to try to hop on a plane and go back to California.
Absolutely. So he's found asleep in the baggage claim at the airport.
They have surveillance cameras. photos of this we'll post them yeah of this little fucker like sleeping in the baggage lane and they just come and get him and he's just like yeah like whatever So again, he was ready to just skip town.
So they arrest him. He's charged with the murder of Mark.
Because again... They usually only charge, like, they're not going to throw all the charges on him.
They want something that they can hold him on.
And they know they can hold him for Mark because he stole his car.
Because he stole his car. So they did that just initially to hold him.
And they also charged him with the grand theft, like larceny auto of the car.
And robbery for taking money from his wallet.
Right. So we can definitely keep him. Yeah.
So the autopsies were done Monday, September 21, 2009.
They showed that blunt force trauma to the heads with what they thought was either a sledgehammer, a ball peen hammer, or a wood splitting ball. which I had to look it up.
I was going to say, what is that? It's basically an axe, essentially.
Oh, okay. Like a really intense axe. They said they couldn't determine exactly.
Do they ever find out? Does he say? They do.
He says what he says. Thank you. Thank you.
None of them could be identified from sight because all of them were literally demolished.
Like, nothing was left. Rage. They think Debra, Melanie, and Emma were killed on that Wednesday.
So pretty quick. Was that the night of the concert?
That was a day after the concert. Okay. So the same night at 1 a.m. that they're arresting Richard from the airport, They get a search warrant and enter Richard's home in California.
Okay. So they're taking his computer, they're taking everything.
So his family is just waking up at 1am to police being like, hi, we have a search warrant because your son murdered.
Four people. Oh my goodness. And they're like, what?
And he's in West Virginia. Excuse me? So they get his computer, they get everything.
October 19th, 2009, he was indicted on six counts of capital murder He got the two extra counts, not sure for what exactly, but it was because of how brutal the murders were.
They tacked on two extra ones. I didn't know you could do that.
And possibly because he might have done something after the deaths.
We don't know exactly. The reason we don't know... is because they didn't go to trial.
So we don't have court documents to tell us all the details about this.
We're just getting leaks from like little things.
Yeah. So there was copious amounts of evidence and witnesses against him.
Yeah. I mean like It was a slam dunk of a case.
He would be fucked. So he got an attorney and the guy was like, yeah, you have to plead out.
We're not going to trial because you're going to be put to death.
And it will just be a waste of time. Yeah.
They were like, it's a waste of time and money and they're going to kill you.
Like they'll put you in the electric chair.
So no trial, which is how we don't have all the information.
I don't know if this is a stupid question.
Even if you plead guilty, like... You're still sentenced.
So even if he like didn't go to trial, could he still be sentenced to death?
No, because part of the plea deal is to avoid death.
Oh, okay. Gotcha. That's part of the plea.
So he pled guilty to two counts of capital murder and two counts of first degree murder.
Four life sentences is what he got. And he waived his right to an appeal.
Okay, so he's there forever no matter what.
Now, just a few little like last things talking about Myspace.
On September 15th, so on the Three days after the concert, I think.
So yeah, he must have killed them four days after the concert, I think.
So he hung out there for a while. So he hung out there for a few days.
Because on September 15th at 7.52 a.m., who was it?
It was Emma wrote on MySpace, I made so many friends that night, haha, and Sam says hi. and then she wrote I can't wait till next year I'll be driving next time Oh my goodness.
That's really sad. And that was just like really like, oh, it just got me.
Like you're not even going to make it until tonight.
Like, I'm pretty sure that was the night.
Oh, that gave me chills. So just going into like the horrorcore rap thing, I just want to go into it a little bit.
Of course, people immediately blamed Horror Corps for this.
Yeah. Which is not fair. thing that happened.
This is just some slighted asshole. Exactly.
And his stuff is still up. You can listen to his raps.
You can hear his stuff. I don't want to.
They're terrible. Yeah. He's not good. No matter.
It's no wonder that you weren't signed, Psycho.
So one of the lyrics that I just wanted to put out there that just gives you an insight into maybe his psyche you're not my you're not the first just to let you know I've killed many people and I kill them real slow It's the best feeling watching their last breath, stabbing and stabbing till there's nothing left.
Oh, wow. And that was written before? Before.
And it's a song called My Dark Side. He also took, there's a YouTube video where he's taking pictures laughing at a Marine's grave.
What the fuck? And defiling soldiers' graves and laughing about it.
So he was a piece of shit. Yeah. He's not this like passive little guy.
Exactly. That's the thing. So it's like he was putting this little persona out to who he needed to.
And then in real life, Like, I think that was the real him was the psycho Sam.
I agree. It was this meek. passive person that he was portraying as a facade.
That's how I feel. I think so too. You can't defile a fucking grave. call yourself a soldier's grave right like what the fuck thank goodness he has four life sentences Because God only knows what he would do.
I'm thankful for him, too, because if you ever walked out of there, fucker, do you know you would have so many people after you?
Seriously. So back to Razakel, the artist that kind of brought them all together.
Yeah, you were going to say how she reacted.
She said about the killings, she said, although hardcore music is, you know, all about murder, all about that stuff, she said, No one in my circle and me are going to write a rap about this because she's been asked this like a million times.
That would be so fucked up. up in my opinion and she said quote people can call it hypocritical but I call it respect I'm not going to talk about people I loved like that it would be disrespectful she also said we rap about it and it finally happens it should be like a slap in our face right well no shit happens Which I was like, love that.
Um... Razakal? I think... I think it came out poorly.
It didn't come out, I think, how she meant it.
Definitely came out poorly. Like if you could maybe go... Like you definitely shouldn't say shit happens about four people being brutally murdered.
What you should say is... Was it our fault?
No. Is it Richard's fault? Yes. The end.
Like, that's it. Like, you don't say shit happens.
No. This isn't shit happens. This is Richard happened.
Right. And the only person to blame here is Richard.
Right. 100% Richard McCloskey III is to blame.
Either way, Ra's al-Khaw was really close with Melanie and Emma.
She says she knew that Richard and Emma were talking for a long time and were like flirting and that there was something there.
But she said she never once heard Emma refer to him as her boyfriend.
Yeah. But But she said she did hear Richard refer to Emma as his girlfriend.
Which is annoying. Now about Psycho Sam, about Richard.
Yeah. This is interesting, because this is what a lot of people said, and I'm almost like... I almost feel like he did let a lot of people, like, push him around in his life in this... contributed to a buildup of aggression.
Because she says... quote, this sounds kind of messed up, but to me it would make more sense if some random person would have broken into that house and did all that. before it makes sense that sam did it you could push over this kid and walk all over him yeah So it seems to me like he just was that.
Now Razakal herself is now part of Shrunken Head Entertainment, and she's still doing her damn thing.
So Sam's own sister said, quote, really blows my mind.
Yeah. Passive. That's the one thing everybody in his life described him as passive.
Letting people walk all over him. Weird.
So... Richard's lawyer did release finally a statement from him, because again, no trial, we don't get anything.
It kind of... It's good for the victim's families.
Right. Because they don't have to go through the trial.
That's great. But they also don't get...
To hear any kind of information that could maybe help them.
Or get any apology. Understand or apology.
Anything. So he did get a statement from him about what happened.
Basically, what he said was that he was in a full rage after that concert.
Uh-huh. He admitted he saw texts between Emma and another guy, she was flirting with other guys, she had rejected him. he was fucking angry.
So he said September 14th or 15th, He was drinking, smoking weed, and taking pills.
And he said by himself at night. It's also like, can you not do that in my house?
Exactly. Like, you're a fucking house guest.
And he said he killed Melanie first because she was asleep on the couch.
So she just collateral. They're all collateral damage.
Emma was the one he wanted. He can't just kill Emma though.
No. And then Deborah Kelly was killed upstairs and then Emma was killed in the bedroom downstairs.
They were all dead before 3am that night.
That's creepy. He then attacked and killed Mark September 17th when he showed up.
The bodies were in the rooms dead during those welfare checks.
He had dragged Melanie and Mark into Emma's room.
He said he thought about killing himself, but no, he didn't.
Because he fucking hung out in the... No, you didn't.
No, you didn't. Like, fuck right off with that.
I thought about that. No, you didn't. I hate when they throw that in there.
And even if you did, like, shut the fuck up. took a tool and demolished four people's heads into their ground and then left them and sat in their house for days.
And you couldn't kill yourself? Right. I don't believe that.
I don't either. You didn't want to. Right.
And you're fine with it. Like, he's an actual piece of shit.
I agree. So, yeah. So he's like, I thought about killing myself, but I didn't.
He then confirmed that what he used was a wood splitting ball.
Oh, so the worst of the worst that you could possibly imagine.
And his whole thing for this was he said it's a very heavy item, which it is.
It's the heaviest out of all I think it's like eight pounds or something.
Oh, wow. And he said he thought it would knock them out quickly and they wouldn't suffer.
What do you mean they wouldn't suffer? They were like, they were sledged up beyond recognition.
They were bludgeoned to death. While sleeping.
And you thought that was going to be quick?
Like, no, you had no... Just like his regular life, he doesn't know what persona to go with.
Am I the evil, you know, horror core guy who just lived out my fantasy of killing people?
Or am I like, whoops, I'm so... self-conscious and meek and passive and everybody rejected me and I was sad so I got mad so I just wanted to kill them but I wanted to do it really humanely.
What? With a, what is it called, a wood splitting axe?
And then during a hearing that he was at, he was smiling at reporters.
That's disgusting. They took him out of the prison van.
He was smirking. Yeah. Like, go fuck yourself.
And his lawyer was trying to be like, it was a nervous smirk.
No. Fuck right off. No. There is a very big difference between a nervous smirk and a smirk.
Exactly. tell the difference. I don't believe for one second that a guy who can brutally bludgeoned Two adults and two, like, girls that he was friends with is nervous ever.
And I don't believe that at all. If we really want to go with that theory, if you're somebody that nervous smiles, you know that you nervous smile.
Exactly. fucking head down as you get out of that exactly that's the thing because i'm in i'm terrible you are I'm terrible with that stuff.
Like at a funeral, I will literally have to sit there and like stop myself from laughing.
I'm terrible. And it's just... My brain goes to a weird place.
You're like the Joaquin Phoenix Joker. But I know that.
And I know it's offensive to those around me and people that understand it. your head down so I keep my shit together and then I just like let it loose in the car like I just scream or something I don't know so Another little quick aside, three of his letters that he had written in 2011 from prison He did it for a murderbilia crime collector called Serial Killer Inc.
And they brought $15 in for him. So they were priced at $15.
What? And then a site called Dark Vomit put them up on their site for twice that price.
$30. Yeah. So an autographed photo of him went for $25.
I'm sorry. Isn't that disgusting? I know.
I understand like to a point wanting to buy like one of those John Wayne Gacy paintings, I guess.
I can... In a weird part of my mind, I understand that one.
Not this little fucker. This is... Like, I don't get that.
Really? This... This one I don't get. Like, ew.
I don't get it. And I don't... I have a weird relationship with that, like, murderbelia shit anyways.
Like, I... I personally am so not for it.
Yeah, it's one of those things that's just like...
I just don't know. There's little things that I guess I can find excusable.
In some recess of your mind, you can kind of put yourself in someone else's head.
They're the one that can kind of explain it to me, but it doesn't sit right with me.
Yeah. In this particularly, these kind of things, it's like, no.
No. No. And if that's your thing, okay, live your life.
But fuck, don't buy his shit. No, no. Don't do it.
And there's a law that he can't profit off of it.
I was going to say. But still. Well, that's the thing.
Where does that money go? Whoever does profit off of it can give it.
They could try to give it back to him to use for like commissary money to like buy cigarettes or something.
That's stupid. But just to leave you on like a, that's kind of a sad, but also like the victim's note.
Yeah, I like to do that. Deborah was remembered as a kind and caring professor who would push her students to greatness. had devoted her life to understanding criminals and their victims.
Weird. People said it's very ironic that she ended up in this situation.
As a kid, people who knew her said she would pretend to be a professor to her dolls.
So she wanted to be one for her whole life.
She would also have her students over for cookouts to her home.
That's precious. And started the criminal justice fraternity at her college that she taught at.
So good for her. Yeah. About Emma, people said her smile came from her mother.
Beautiful, genuine, and radiant. Aww. And as for Mark, Mark was known as like this amazing guy.
He was known as an amazing father. People loved him at the church.
He was just a kind person. Yeah. They said Deborah and Mark were... wonderful couple even though they were going through this issue right now they were working together on it and they were like it was kind of like impressive to They seemed just like very understanding people.
They did. And they seemed like they were just- trying to learn how to deal with this thing that neither one of them, I'm sure, had any idea how to deal with.
And then Melanie was also known as like a super sweet, super caring girl, made tons of friends, Super close to her parents, obviously, like her mom was like going to the ends of the earth for her.
So it's so tragic. Yeah, I've never heard of that case before.
It's a case of this kid getting his ego bruised when he had built up a fantasy world that no one else knew about.
It's like another incel. It's truly like that.
It's like he just. he blamed her for his own delusions of this relationship without even, he didn't even talk to her about it.
These are the kind of cases that infuriate me on like a different level.
Because these men think that they're owed something.
Oh yeah, this guy definitely thought he was owed...
He was owed something. Yeah. And a lot of people from his home town said that he was bragging too about like...
He was going to go out there and he was going to finally be able to sleep with his 16-year-old girlfriend.
Which is also like, ew. So... This is all ego.
It's all ego. It's all bruised ego. It's a... kid who has this tough guy persona who thinks that he deserves what he wants.
And I don't like that whole passive thing, because if you're sitting...
Around town, like talking about how you're going to sleep with your 16-year-old girlfriend, you're not passive.
No, you're not. And also, you're going to get charged for statutory rape.
You and four, you know, six counts of capital murder.
That too. So there's that. Wow. So yeah, that's the Farmville murders.
Nuts. It blew my mind that I had never heard of it.
Wow. Me either. Yeah, I look deep into the recesses of the internet for this.
We love that. Well, if you would like to see some of the pictures that Elena mentioned we will be posting, you can do so on Instagram.
At Morbid Podcast, where I will not be. Yeah, seriously.
Hit us up on Twitter, where we definitely will be.
At amormidpodcast. and you can send us a gmail at morbidpodcast at gmail.com we hope that you keep listening And we hope you.
I don't know why I joined in. I don't know.
Keep it weird. Bye. That's so weird that you forget how you do an outro.
Yeah, that's weird. It was. It really was.
It felt really wrong. Bye. Thank you. If you like Morbid, you can listen early and ad free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.
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