That would be good you could do like a Andrew Huberman's morning routine, a my morning routine compared.
Well I think we started pretty similar by messaging 5 different women.
Are we recording? I hope that's in.
Cut that in. Yeah, that's in.
All right man, hello, welcome back.
How are you? Good to see you mate.
I'm still alive unfortunately.
Last time together was CJI 1.
And I think I left you at a strip club around 7 a .m. No, that was someone else that looked like me.
James Smith. That was James Smith.
How did you celebrate after CGI?
Oh, shit. I mean, we went to Cartagena, Colombia and went on a five -day bender, pretty much. Came out very unhealthy, but survived it.
Direct from Vegas? Yeah, so we left the after party, flew straight in there.
The secret investor threw us a party, and it was the hardest five days of my entire life.
It was grueling. In Columbia?
In Columbia, yeah. Heavy times down in Columbia.
Right. So it was like the, like an endurance sport, an endurance racing.
Like the David Goggins of parties.
Pretty much. I mean, we didn't sleep much. The guy had it set up so we had IVs every morning.
That probably kept me alive, quite honestly.
And we brought Volkinovski's coach, Joe Lopez, 73 years old.
Didn't sleep. Did not sleep for three days.
He used his poor Spanish on any woman that would listen to him, but somehow still alive, return to his family safely.
Every time I take him away, Volkanovski calls me and it's like, please bro, bring him back alive.
He's going to die. And I'm like, that's what his family wants.
They keep asking me.
Right. Okay. Jesus.
Fuck. Uh, how would you, what's your synopsis of how the first one went?
I mean, I think it really couldn't have gone much better.
You know, like it actually surprised me.
I had my personal assistant Seth take care of a lot of the more mundane activities in preparing us for the event.
But yea everything went off without a hitch as far as I'm concerned.
What did you think of the show?
I enjoyed it man, I think my lifetime watching of Brazilian Jiu -Jitsu was multiplied by about 10 over that single weekend.
I saw more Brazilian Jiu -Jitsu in that one weekend that I think I had my entire life up until that point.
Date day one was a marathon that's for sure.
Day two hit the sweet spot.
I think for this next one we're going to try and make both days a little shorter.
I mean like no matter how much you love something ten hours of it unless it's a Colombian after party is a lot in my opinion.
What was one of the best bits or the worst bits in your opinion?
I mean to be honest my favorite part was the crowd turning positive on Gabby Garcia. Cause she's been the villain the entire time we made her the villain in the lead up.
She's been the butt of the joke and then everyone's Buddha whenever she's won, so then there was that heartfelt moment, I was quite happy for her to get that.
That was cute, yeah.
Okay, you finish up CGI, you go to Colombia, but it took 4 months for you to get back into the US?
Longer? It took, honestly… I don't know what it was, you might be able to imagine but something about Colombia really struck up my heartstrings, something about the culture down there.
So I went back to see my family in Adelaide, they were quite surprised I survived Colombia and then basically went straight back to South America to continue the adventure.
Okay. What did you adventure?
We went to Brazil, we went to Argentina, we went to back to Colombia and I was back in Colombia for a good five to six weeks, but this time instead of Cartagena, straight into Medellin.
Okay, did you meet Pablo Escobar's sister?
I did, and this is actually a weird story.
So, I put up a post, I think I actually made quite an insensitive post. I was using the cocaine sunglasses to pour some powder, a prop, onto Pablo's grave, like one for the fallen homies.
But, a guy messaged me on Instagram and he's like, do you want to meet the sister?
And I was like, you're full of shit, for sure, you know, you get one of those DMs. But then he sent me a picture of a large quantity of substance that made me assume that he was the real deal.
So I ventured off down to meet him on a Saturday night in Columbia and he showed me some pictures with his sister.
And later that week we went out for dinner, she took us on a bit of a tour of Pablo's old house, and then we got hammered together on red wine.
And everything was going good until I tricked her into putting the sunglasses on for a photo and then we explained to her what the sunglasses were for, and it took a bit of a turn, but still we...
Why, what happened then?
I mean, obviously she's not into the heritage of the Eskabah name, you know?
Oh, right. She's completely just disparaged and gotten rid of that illustrious history.
The family empire, yeah.
I was grilling her on a lot of questions about Pablo but obviously a lot of the notorious nefarious activities were shielded from the family life.
But they still got access to the house is one of his houses.
Yeah I think that's actually something she was trying to clarify me and the guy that sort of help connect as well was published all driver and I was trying to clarify that the large stacks of cash where people talking about like.
What was holding the cash together was disintegrating and stuff was like largely a myth that most of the cocaine transactions with the land.
Or for houses, so I believe they did get to keep a lot of the proceeds of that.
As opposed to it being, he spends $10 ,000 a week on rubber bands to put all of the cash together.
That wasn't true? She says no. Brilliant PR move.
You know what I mean?
The government's not coming for that land if they don't think yeah, but they're just looking for that buried cash.
Oh yeah, that is interesting.
Do you get drugged?
Did you unintentionally get drugged?
I did unintentionally get drugged.
So, to set up a story, obviously, we're there on a bender, but I went down there for four or five weeks and all my friends had hit me up, being like, you're in Columbia, I'll come down.
And it's like when you live in a tourist spot, people are like, they want to do all the tourist shit when you come down.
So, every time a new friend comes down, they put my body through the ringer, but those last two weeks, I tried to pace myself for a bit of survival.
And then again my personal assistant Seth, he came down there exploiting my name for some stem cells at a stem cell company because they get the real shit down there in Columbia.
So he comes down and we decide to hit the main strip, and usually I would stay at the house, we'd get obliterated and then we'd adventure out into the streets of Medellín and see what we could find right?
But this night we went out just for a couple casual cocktails, because of course you have stem cells, you're not meant to drink, you're meant to stay healthy.
So we're actually on the main street of Columbia, and Seth had stem cells in his neck, so I definitely positioned him with his back towards the crowd at his stiff neck every time I pointed at an attractive Colombian woman who was in paralysis trying to turn around.
And then... so I don't know who drugged me, but have you heard about the drug scopolamine?
The devil's breath?
No. You haven't heard of it?
No. All right, so basically there's a substance it's kind of mythical in its nature because it quite often is guys heading to a strip club or something and what happens is they wake up with no money in their account so it's a bit of a it's a great boogeyman of a story for the Misses.
Mmm get out of here.
Oh no it was the devil's breath.
It must have been drugged so like I think it's largely exaggerated but still a lot of people die down there.
Two Jujitsu guys sat next to me rambling while I was having a couple of cocktails with Seth.
They met with a couple of Tinder dates, and Tinder down there is pretty dangerous.
Because obviously these druggings and stuff.
And then I don't know who put it in my drink, it could have been the bartender.
It could have been the guys Tinder date I tried to steal that night.
Could have been him, but from that point on, just basically, and usually I can handle a few drinks, I probably only had three, four drinks.
And I remember just distinctly the last memory I have, we had two shots there and Seth was trying not to drink because of the stem cells.
And I was like, you're a pussy.
So I drank my shot and his shot.
And ordinarily, that's something I would do because given his 5 foot 3 size, a full margarita might kill the man.
So usually I'm jumping on bullets for him as it is.
But what ended up happening was we went to our next destination.
It was obviously a family friendly location, as you can imagine in Medellín.
Seth walks into the bathroom and finds me, basically pants down.
I've pulled my shirt off.
I've gone to the bathroom, I'm overheating.
He thinks it's a dream come true, his family in the bathroom unconscious with my pants down, but he has to get me out of there.
And the funniest thing is he had to carry me out of there with his stem cell rhythm.
Damaged neck. So he could, uh, I mean, he could barely lift me as it is, but with the stem cell injury.
So really he carried me home, tucked me into bed.
Apparently I was clothed.
I woke up fully naked, suspicious, but he wouldn't, he obviously wouldn't have done much damage if he did, but we checked, uh, we basically checked the security camera footage the next day.
And really the reason we realized it was scopolamine, because it has this, you're sort of like the walking dead.
I couldn't walk because I took two hits but you remember all your banking detail.
You remember your numbers very well.
So it like messes with your head, but it's great to rob people because you remember the details.
So we've got the security camera footage where Seth's dragging me to the front door.
We get to the Airbnb and I like perk up, put the code in, and pass back out.
You kidding? Yeah. He takes me to bed.
That's insane. So it's able to completely incapacitate people apart from their ability to do fucking mental arithmetic on numbers.
Exactly. So it's that shocked me.
Seth obviously thought I just drunk too much, but when we put it together, it was definitely a hit of scopolamine.
We are constantly having this argument really.
Who saved whose life?
He obviously rescued me from the bathroom floor, but I jumped on the bullet of his drugging shot.
Yeah, so stem cells, plus scopolamine would have been, can you just sort of run the game tape forward?
What would have happened if the shots had been reversed and you'd have to look after Seth?
Do you think you'd have been… Seth would not be sitting there awkwardly in the corner, looking at us.
He'd probably be in a grave, six feet under the ground somewhere.
Okay, so what was the day after?
Is there a come down?
You know what? Honestly, I woke up naked and saw a trash can there, and I was just like, fuck, what happened last night?
But I felt pretty good, to be honest. I was like, because obviously you usually hang out, as you well know, can be very ugly the next day.
But I remember being like, I don't remember anything that happened.
And then I started to piece it together.
Obviously, the camera guy that was with us at the time, he showed me the videotape he took of me, basically entering the house, I called Seth, we're trying to piece it together, really, it was a mystery.
Where were you living?
Were you just Airbnbing around?
Just Airbnbing. Luckily, Airbnb and the guy at the front desk showed us her security camera footage to piece it together, and he thought it was the funniest thing he's ever seen.
No pity at all from the security guard. Well, had he not known that you guys were friends, he could have assumed that it was a very forthcoming, very tanned Native American man, using scopolamine.
That's how many of Seth's dates go, they don't call him Bill Cosby for nothing, same complexion.
Bad time for that joke with our team but we'll go on.
No, to be fair, Bill Cosby was taller significantly.
Okay. What else do you get up to in Colombia?
Tell me. Honestly, I think that's all you can do down there is just get obliterated and try to find true love with a Colombian woman, you know?
Which is very, very, difficult.
The fantasy ends quite quickly and expensively.
Someone asked me a question on a Q and A.
They said, which country has the most beautiful women?
And I said, that's the wrong question.
The question that you should be asking is which country has got the ugliest men.
And I actually think that Colombia ranks, probably top five for the delta between the quality of the women and the quality of the men.
There is no difference.
Now, Dubai has a massive difference, but that gets compensated by all of the wealth that the guys have got.
But very, very attractive women, very, very ugly men.
I honestly broke the average down for the men over there.
I think and I was I was doing it my world of good.
All right. And then you went to Ethiopia.
Where'd you go there?
So we w we got this.
Um, obviously we've got that Fair Fight Foundation, despite everything I've just said, I do do charity work.
I'm for the greater good.
You know what I mean?
And we partnered with a guardian program, which has jiu -jitsu schools all around the world for sort of kids that wouldn't have access to those programs and they provide them clean drinking water in some of the places food.
English lessons so we went out there actually where was I was actually in Peru.
And with the Guardian guys because it would be in a school out there in Peru and one of the guys in if you appear the runs a guardian program there.
One of the guys getting got me to send a video message to him and I just winged in I was like because he's a fan of me I don't know why but I'm a message I was like I'll see you soon.
In ethiopia and then i just pursue back to the end visit school and we went out there with guardian and these kids are basically training on concrete sin at us and we went out there when a bit adventure but train concrete.
What you mean training on concrete yeah just like concrete would like maybe three or four puzzle mats select real harsh conditions for the kids are there in ethiopia so we.
Generously. fitted out their gym with mats and show roll hooked them up with some ges for them to train in, but they're yeah, tough conditions for them training.
So they're doing, they're trying to do Brazilian jujitsu, essentially on concrete?
Not a heavy guard pulling culture as you can imagine.
Well, yeah. I mean Ethiopia was absolutely wild, just the sheer scale of the poverty out there was mind blowing and we went to visit a couple of the tribes out there.
We went to, honestly, I can't remember the name of the tribes, but we went deep out there to see two different tribes.
One of them we rolled into, and they were doing a whipping ceremony, which is a coming of age ceremony for a man in the tribe before he disappears for a while on some hunting expedition.
But the way they celebrate that is, the male part of this is, they line up seven or eight bulls, and he just runs naked across them back and forth.
So that's his contribution.
Across what? Across bulls, like the animal.
Right. So, they had a little set of steps or something like that?
Yes. It just helped him out.
Well, actually, they had a smaller bull to kick a little stepping stone of a bull.
A stepping bull. He made it.
He fell at the very ends, but I couldn't post any of that footage because he was naked, unfortunately.
Okay. Well -endowed. Naked, well -endowed teenager running across a bunch of bulls?
Yep. And then they whipped him?
No they didn't whip him.
They whipped a bunch of women in the tribe.
So we roll in, we're on this full drive adventure.
It is like B -Team. It's basically a grading ceremony at B -Team, you know?
It doesn't come easy.
There's a lot of balls, a lot of whipping.
Okay, so why are they whipping the women?
So you get this right, and again, from my own perspective, not a problem for men like me and you, but the women are whipped to show that they can handle physical pain to show that they're ready for sex. Okay.
What are they whipped with?
So the girls, this is a crazy thing to watch. They go and they have to find branches and they run, like they're doing this song and dance and stuff.
It's a celebratory day for the dude, for the women.
They're suffering. They go find some long branches and they present it to a man and he like tests it to make sure it's thick enough and then just slams them with it and they have to poker face it, absolutely brutal.
They can't make any noise or show any pain.
No, that's the— like, if they show any pain they're sort of, like, failing their part of the test, they just have to eat it.
That's seen as, like, lack of resilience, not sufficiently strong.
But again, it's, like, it's to prove they can endure the physical pain that would come with sex, which is— How old are the women that have been whipped?
Honestly probably, like, as young as 12.
So it's pretty heavy shit to watch. And it's boys and men as well, I'm going to guess.
Yeah, fool men just whipping them.
And the girls are like, giving them branches.
And if the guy's like it's not thick enough, they're like insulted and they just like run away.
Like the men are insulted like, fuck this branch, throw it away.
And the girls have to run and find a new one.
But fool like welted up backs and just blood.
this is all to celebrate the guy that ran across some bowls.
Yeah, it's a bit unbalanced, yeah, right?
He got a stepping bowl and then six more bowls.
And the girls had the shit whipped out of them.
Yeah. But presumably they have to do that each time, because there can't be like 10 new girls ready to be whipped each time that one guy becomes of age.
Yeah, someone had some serious scars on their back.
Already from previous times doing this.
So that was pretty heavy to witness.
And then we went to another tribe, and this tribe was a tribe – we didn't see this, it only happened once a year, but this was heavy when he was telling me about it, about the genital mutilation.
So they were telling me about how they remove the clitoris, some parts of the vagina, so that the women will not enjoy sex. And again, that was something that was mind -blowing to me because I just assumed they weren't meant to anyway, but they actually used things like anything to get their hands on, so some The tribes don't have scissors, he's trying to keep it together.
I'm talking about a heavy thing here, Chris.
Scissors, glass, some tribes will have to use fingernails, like anything to basically mutilate so they don't experience the pleasure of sex, I think to encourage in their minds - Chastity.
Chastity, yeah. But I remember the guy, he gave me this big plug about that.
Then he was like, but it's a celebration, we'd kill a lot of animals that day and have a big face.
And I was like, oh f**k, let's find that now.
Yeah, ok, yeah, evens it out.
How did you, uh, were you...
Like, that sounds quite disturbing to see and hear about.
Is that the sort of thing that affects you?
I know that you seem like quite a resilient guy, but does stuff like that get to you?
Yeah, I mean that's, yeah, that's pretty heavy to witness, it's just the scale of it.
I think if you haven't visited Africa you don't understand the scale of that, really that continent.
so it's like just to see that within one country and how many people are in that country, the scale would be the most affecting, just the realization that pretty hard to make a difference out there, you know what I mean?
Like, how are you going to...
You see that tribe participating in that and it's like, you kind of would want that to not happen.
But how are you going to intervene?
You know what I mean?
Like, there were dudes rolling around with guns there and stuff, he was pointing his gun at me, pretending to shoot me and stuff.
After Ukraine, that's just half the course for you, right?
That's pretty much. But yeah, it's definitely affecting, but it's pretty bleak.
It's a bleak outlook on the world.
It's a strange one.
I think we talk about the difficulties in raising up working -class areas of America, or the UK, or Australia, or whatever.
And we need investment.
We need to have cultural interventions and role models and upward aiming and all this sort of stuff.
I'm not convinced that that is the same solution that would work when it comes to tribes that for generations and generations have done the same sort of thing.
I wonder how wide spread that is, I don't know how many Ethiopian people are still in a tribe of that type versus a slightly more contemporary version of living with huts and farming and stuff like that.
Yeah, I mean yeah that was like that was just two tribes I think it was like thousands and thousands of tribes just within Ethiopia and then like uh what we learned when we were with the kids at the uh sort of the the gym they've set up there that we matted out was that like there's this whole thing where guys will go to these tribes and either abduct kids or tell the family that they're going to bring the kids to the big city give an opportunity and send money or resources back and really they just take him and oftentimes so like mutilator kids or heard the kids and for some to become.
Biggest city is full of sort of life is escaped kids from the tribe.
End to make like just how crazy it is it's like overran with highness.
Is actually quite another factor on that is quite a bit of corruption the police so the police if they see any of these homeless kids sleeping.
They come after him and if the homeless kids don't sleep in packs, the hyenas eat them even in the capital city.
Inside of the city the hyenas will pick off a stray child.
Yeah I don't think they'll generally attack like an adult, but if they see a stray child, especially like a dehydrated or hungry, weak child, the hyenas will come for them so the kids have to form these gangs to protect themselves from both hyenas and the police and some of these kids were showing up to training.
So they generally sleep in the daytime because the police would give them less grief.
And then at night they would be escaping the police and the hyenas.
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That's insane. that's crazy to think about that… I don't know, you think about that being a real outlier, you know, the worst poverty in the world.
But I don't know, something tells me this is probably pretty representative for a lot of areas maybe around Africa that have got this kind of poverty.
Yeah, and Ethiopia is like Addis Ababa is quite like… I've flown through there.
There are some nice areas of that city so there's definitely significantly worse parts of Africa.
What was training the kids like?
One. Nah, it was cool.
You mean the crippled haina -chased, ex -tribe children, you managed to best them in the that you're a professional, it's honestly, uh, when I select matches, that's the type of match. I would, opponent, I would select myself.
Someone who's been chased by a hyena for the last couple of weeks.
Yeah, pretty much. No, the kids were awesome, you know, we're trying to just try to, they're like they're trying to use Jujitsu to give them a foundation of like, uh, discipline and they're teaching them English at the same time.
They have sort of a safe environment there, but there were so many difficulties even us filming there.
Like we were trying to film it.
The Jujitsu Academy itself is within this apartment complex and we were trying to film the kids stories as they were speaking to the camera and even they're like guy that ran the apartment complex comes out being like ask it like grill and I was asking us questions interrupting the filming like not wanting us filming it like the I don't want to say too much to get the guys back there in trouble obviously have to deal with a lot of corruption as well so it's really like I mean it's it's more important to thank Lake who runs a program out there like for him to see his country and try to have a positive
impact on her Despite the scale of problems they have to overcome, it's pretty mind blowing.
Yeah, he's got an appeal done.
What was the ketamine thing?
Oh right, so I won't tell where we got it.
Maybe I smuggled it in, but at one of the campfires, when we were out of the tribes, we were obviously trying to entertain ourselves.
Some of the stories you've told me off camera, for sure.
We're trying to entertain ourselves.
So we had this ketamine nasal spray and we were sitting around this fireplace, just being idiots.
We would drink in the local moonshine, so I thought that'd be a cool experience, but it basically tasted like gasoline.
The local guy was like, I'm going to go get you guys some of the moonshine, I was like, fuck, sick, let's get drunk, and he came back.
And it was in a plastic bottle and basically smelt like pure ethanol.
I had to put that down, I wasn't going to turn it away.
Then we busted out the ketamine nasals spray and we were hitting that and being quite reflective of the fireplace.
And there was a dude there that had just left goat herding.
Goat herding had been his thing for generations, his family's thing.
Very proud of the culture of goat herding out there.
And he saw what we're doing being idiots.
And he looked at the sprayer and he was like, he didn't even speak the same dialect as the guys were with, but definitely you see a face that's interested and wants to try something, he hits the ketamine and he sat looking at the fireplace for two hours, not moving.
And then the translator came out and this guy was like, never give that to me again.
And then 15 minutes later, he's like, he's like passed that back.
And then, uh, yeah, it'll put you in a hole, in a dark place when you come out of it.
And then this guy basically gave us his speech to a translator afterwards, how he's had all these like visions and he's like, he was working for the, I wouldn't even It's a hotel, there's really no electricity or anything, like we're sleeping in some tents.
But he would sorta cook for us, and he'd only just started doing this cooking role.
And following the ketamine experience, he's like, I have to live, I have to return to my roots of goat herding.
He's like, I'm gonna cook you breakfast in the morning and then I'm outta here.
You gave a guy an existential crisis with ketamine?
I've given a few people an existential crisis with a few substances, but Ethiopian goat herding, in the middle of the desert, it's definitely a first for me.
Yeah. Yeah, I mean, look, he's returned to his roots.
I'm sure he's probably enjoying that more.
I don't think the cooking life was for him.
All right, okay, so you're a life coach now, as well.
More than wisdom, that's what we're here for.
Uh -huh, yeah. Well, it's a hard pivot, but I wonder how many people would sign up to be life coached by you.
Can you imagine what the sort of outcomes of clients that were life coached by you would be?
Probably be a few large divorce sediments, I'd imagine.
Uh -huh, yeah. All right, who got arrested in Bali?
What was that like?
Yeah, I mean, like, honestly, I don't know how high.
Haven't ended up in a prison, really, in some of these travels.
Yeah, you're kind of like, you've been dodging very effectively, it's impressive.
The Teflon Don, you know, we're getting to airport security.
Obviously, I look, I don't look suspicious at all.
That's what I like to think, you know?
But I've managed to dodge it, but yeah, I know tons of people, tons of British guys getting popped, even recently in Dubai.
The large - Two kids just got popped, the clothing company owners, right?
For having this big party going on.
A friend's girl friend was someone who's just in the room next door or like nearby.
Like if you're at a party, and there's somebody that has drugs, it's like, we'll just lock you up for two weeks and we'll see what's going on here.
So not good. Really, really, really not good.
Yeah, yeah. You gotta be careful in some of these countries partying.
That's the problem with.
I wonder whether it's the same with Aussies but I certainly know that British people have this like disregard a lot of the time for the laws abroad because British people are very orderly.
If you've ever driven in the UK, you'll notice if I'm front of you.
And I indicate I get your lane, like you back off as opposed to in America, you guys protect the lane that you're, you actively speed up to not allow that person to get in.
It's very territorial.
They defend the lane like the southern border, basically.
Correct. Well, now.
Yeah. Whereas the British defend the lane like the southern border a year ago.
So it's very, very opened up.
So in some way, 97 % I think, compliance with The first COVID vaccine, like, 90 % with the second one, quite a rule following the type nation.
Apart from when we leave and we go elsewhere and the sort of party culture.
I remember, I was at, fuck, I can't remember the name of the hotel.
It was during COVID.
So he'd fled the UK, me and a friend had fled the UK because another lockdown was coming and we weren't gonna be able to fly anywhere.
And we just went to Dubai.
And we were watching MK play a rooftop pool thing in Dubai.
Everybody there was British because they'd all done the same thing that we've done and fled the UK.
And you think if there's one place you really don't want to be caught with drugs, it's fucking Dubai.
I mean also maybe Bali in Thailand and stuff like that, but they do not fuck about.
And it was just this classic sort of leery British culture passing bags around, leaving them out on the table.
I think, you know, bottle of Grey Goose, bottle of Belvedere, bottle of like unpronounceable pink fucking like powder.
What was the name of this place?
I can avoid it? That's on the UAE.
I honestly can't remember what it was called.
But I just remember thinking this is during fucking lockdown.
So it was supposed to be social distancing, it was supposed to be masking.
Okay, so you get through the new rules that you can maybe say are a little bit silly, but then you get to the ones where you go, they've been around for a long time and they're gonna fuck you up.
And yeah, British people, are Arosis like that?
Are they kind of this still go degen disregard the laws abroad mode?
I would say for sure, we're pretty reckless as well.
Definitely take some chances.
Eye for one. Ok, I'm aware that you might be, I was assuming that you weren't representative.
I think pretty representative, yeah.
Ok, this is just normal.
You're not anything different, you're just Australian.
Normal Bergen culture, yeah.
Ok, alright, cool. What about this school in Peru that you're building?
Yes. So, uh, again, with the Guardian program, whose run these, uh, schools around the world for kids, we're building one in Peru because we visited a, I wish I can remember the name of the city, but it's basically a surf spot, Peru has some of the best surfing in the world.
So it's kind of like a, a bit of a tourist spot.
So there's a lot of, uh, foreign tourists coming in, having a good time partying, hitting the bars and hitting the surf spots.
And it's created a culture of like a lot of kids dealing drugs, um, in the poverty stricken areas around it, so where I know it sounds a bit hypocritical, but we're building a school down there.
They basically reach capacity as it is, so we're trying to build a bigger facility for them to expand so they can take in more kids.
But like some, I mean, Peru, the poverty was really quite severe, quite shocking.
I think most people just go there visit Machu Picchu, Lima, get out of there.
But we went up to the Northwest, and yeah, the poverty was real bad.
Like lack of clean drinking water, lack of opportunities.
through jiu -jitsu teaching kids discipline and they teach me English provide a clean drinking water the new facility providing food as well hopefully make a difference within that little city.
What's driving this other than tax incentives what's balancing the moral?
This is karmic retribution yeah okay basically yeah.
After you've done what you've done to Gabby Garcia you feel you need to repay the world?
Oh, I would say I was the victim of the Gabby Garcia thing to truth be told, but there have been many victims of Gabby Garcia, as I've told you off camera.
But yeah, I mean, it does feel good to do, to, to make a change like that.
And I'm trying to like, uh, change the narrative a bit on charity cause most of the time people tune in to watch some sort of charity documentary, it's almost like sadness, porn or something, you know what I mean?
Where it's and then the ...
Pointing at the heartstrings, making you feel bad, here's some guilt.
And then there's the guy that's like almost the saviour, too -good -to -be -true type character.
So I'm trying to balance it out by at least providing some entertainment value, some realness and most importantly going to these areas where kids are selling drugs and buying those drugs so that they don't have ...
Oh that's where the money goes?
Yeah, that is actually tax deduction I believe.
Right. To reinvest into the local community?
To reinvest into the community.
And improving exports.
Okay, good. Very good.
What is it when you're sort of building these places… who's actually on the ground, doing it?
You've got to find some fixer, local person to actually operate all this stuff.
It's not like you can all be fucking sat there?
I wish I could, but yeah obviously, I'm an incredible judge of character and I've never made any mistakes hiring or associating with people in the past so it is very difficult.
Luckily Guardian really chooses the right person.
Because again, you're running a charity program for kids, you've got to be very careful— Discerning.
—you've got to be very careful who you put in charge of those kids.
So it's like it's very, I would say that is more difficult than like, um, than any other part of the process is finding the right person for the job.
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I mean, even just helping one kid.
Once you go down there, you meet the kids, you sort of like, obviously some of the kids are really talented, charismatic.
And you see them and you think with a little bit of help, maybe they have a chance to change their life.
But on the flip side of that, if kids drop out of the program that you're aware of, that's Quite devastating as well.
What about Brazil? sealed some time now.
Yes, we went to Brazil.
We did a clothing released with Street X, and it was basic Brazil things and we are basically trying to take some cool photos and videos.
So we're trying to recreate the Gracie origin story back in the day where the Gracie's would go to.
There is a famous video of Hix and Gracie going to the beach and slapping this dude that have been talking shit and they are brought on the beach. Our version of that was to go to the beach, get extremely drunk with the local bartenders, and then have challenge matches against the bartenders and that was that was our reincarnation of it.
And then the bar, we were trying to get into the favelas, you know you want to see, you want to see the favelas, I've heard so much about them while places.
So, we, I just trusted this bartender, this guy was like, Oh, you want to go to the favelas?
I will take you. Drunk at the time we agreed to do this.
next day, picks us up, takes us into one of the favelas, drops us right at the top and on the way out, we had to stop filming.
You don't have to film any of the dudes with guns, they take photos with the guns despite me asking many, many times and they have some fucking impressive weaponry out there, even like RPG launchers to take out police helicopters and stuff.
And remember, we get to the top of the hill, he drops us off at the very top, turn around, there's a guy with gun and he's like looking at us.
And he basically, the local bartender introduced us and then he saw the cauliflower and was like, oh, jujitsu, jujitsu and he's like, I competed in the last world championships when it used to be held in Brazil.
So we got the free pass from there and then I realized behind him, this was the motorcycle pickup point for all the drug pickups, so people make orders right?
And he goes, oh, do you want anything?
And I was like, I went to say obviously, yes.
And he's like, no, you're a jiu -jitsu athlete, not for you.
Okay. So first off, you were saved by being a BJJ athlete and then disappointed by it too?
Yeah, basically. The Lord giveth and taketh away.
We were like the ketamine goat herdsmen at that point, you know, back to our jiu -jitsu roots.
But I mean, we had the free pass.
I mean, I think it's a lot safer.
and like the guys were quite insistent on.
Wanting us to show that the favelas can be safe, you know, cause they just have such a bad name.
So they're quite appreciative when you show the favelas in a positive light.
Cause it's not, it's not as bad as people think like really when we were walking around up there, we realized there are safe points, like especially this one favela I forget the name, but it overlooks basically the Rio coastline and it's like the favelas have a bad name, obviously some of them deserve that, but for the Most of the people out there were super cool, super welcoming, super nice.
So this is one of those super narrow streets, rickety, corrugated iron tin roof type places?
Yeah, and at the very tip, near the very top, I would say there's some like clubs and some restaurants that are probably pretty tourist friendly.
And then, but as you do the walk down, you kind of need someone there with you.
So he had given us this kid, that must have been 15, who threw the red shirt over the shoulder which was the signal to the people above.
that don't rob these guys I assume, because we had some expensive camera equipment with us.
So that's the pass to get through.
So now anybody who's got a red shirt thrown over their shoulder walking through favela, unless they change the color code in which case that means something else?
They tend to be a blood and you're all good hey?
WOW. So it seems like you've been capturing a lot of the content from this.
I haven't seen shit tons of favela, Brazil content, is there some latent documentary thing coming at some point?
Yeah, I mean we have the content, we have a lot of it out there, but I mean mostly just social media you know, like unfortunately I would say, people like you have ruined the YouTube experience where it used to be incredible vlogs, cinematography, well artistic sort of things and then there's just been taken over by the podcast gods who have gained the algorithm for maximum ad revenue.
But yeah, so I mostly use it for socials or photos, things like that.
Memories when I struggle to remember.
What about Venezuela?
Yeah, so Venezuela was another interesting destination obviously, sanctioned country.
US citizens can't visit there.
You're not allowed to visit there?
Yeah, US citizens are not allowed to visit there.
Because the Venezuelans say that you can't visit there, or the American people say that you can't visit there.
I think America's sanctions on Venezuela, have caused Venezuela to basically block you.
I think there is a path that's very difficult path for U .S. citizens to get into.
So, just the sheer thought of a country without Americans, I was like, sold!
That sounds brilliant, that sounds like a peaceful oasis.
So, I set up sort of a charity seminar down there, and the jiu -jitsu scene was actually quite big.
So, we went down there, and pretty heavy experience when you get to the airport and stuff.
Where did you fly from?
I fly from Medellin, I think it was straight after Medellin.
I think I went up to Cartagena again, say I've heard of some old friends and then flew straight from Medellin to Venezuela airport, and I had some guys on the ground that would help me out, but like it's bizarre, like the airport security, the immigration part of it is like, obviously all the Venezuelans are going through and then I'm just standing there alone for two hours while they're using WhatsApp to message the security people to work out whether So they wanted to tame me or not.
And I assume they probably looked at my Instagram and thought this guy's fucking idiot.
He's not gonna do any harm, let him in.
And then we went on a bit of an adventure there.
We went out to Angel Falls, world's tallest waterfall.
Beautiful experience out there.
We stayed at a lovely resort, taken care of pretty damn well.
The only thing is that obviously my friends and family, Venezuela is typically a pretty dangerous country.
10 ,000 ,000 people fleet it over the last X amount of time because we let Venezuelan immigrants getting around and it has a bad reputation so.
When I went to angel falls I had already smashed my phone in a drunk incident and I remember.
I find a waterproof so we're walking through waterfalls and she not to start a film phone died.
And I'm like, I was off the grid for three days for people just not knowing where I was, how was I okay, what happened?
I think I got an SOS signal out there at some point to say everything was all good.
And then my cameraman met me at a later date in Venezuela and we're able to get basically communication.
Reacquainted. I imagine that was finally bliss for you.
So that has to have been liberated from having to look after him for three days.
I was getting calls from some Wales.
Oh, I see. Yeah, we had a companion send out SOS signals.
I mean, I was okay, Seth had to get me a new phone and get it hand delivered to me, I think at a later location.
And then again, it was another location I brought using Volkanoski's coach, Joe Lopez to...
You brought him to Venezuela.
Went into Venezuela.
Fantastic. And he...
Again any excuse for him to use his Spanish on unsuspecting women, That is like the bat signal for him, he will arrive.
And yeah, we had a bit of a blowout the last night, it was good.
What's Venezuela like generally?
I mean, honestly, one of the most beautiful, if not, the most beautiful country I've ever seen in my life, incredible, Angel Falls area, amazing at the north, along the coastline there, some of the most beautiful coastline in the world.
I think it's a tragedy that it doesn't have a tourism industry for Americans because it's right.
It's so close. But yeah, I would say, and I'm not just saying this to offend Americans that can't visit there, but it is the most beautiful country I've ever been to.
So, you were allowed, because you would have come back into America with a Venezuela stamp on your passport, presumably?
Yeah, and you know what's funny?
I got cleared for global entry.
I don't know how. Like if you looked at my part, Ukraine, Venezuela, whatever it is, the test, is not working.
because I passed the initial stage when I had to have the interview and I just left Colombia and Venezuela and they forced me to do the interview at that border entry.
And the guy was like, well yeah, pass.
And I was like, you'd think you'd leave a sanctioned country?
I'm really testing the limits, I do have a tattoo reveal for you.
You've got a tattoo reveal?
Yeah, I'm really testing the limits of US deportation here.
And really, it's based on the idea that really there is an avenue out there for an all expenses paid trip to the beautiful country of El Salvador.
And it just comes at the small price of a tattoo.
Just stand up for a second for me.
Put that. Oh, you want me to get it out?
Marvel at the size of the quad too.
Thank you Piers. You got the connections though, if I get sent to El Salvador.
You want Tim Candy to come and fix you?
Yeah, well I mean we need to put on some government favors on that deportation when they come for me.
So you've got an MS13 tattoo.
I know it's a bold choice, we were just down in Mexico the other day and I thought it'd be a funny idea.
And then you got your feet tattooed.
Yeah that was a mistake, honestly.
He was my vision, right.
In Jiu -Jitsu, people often criticize guard pullers.
People that scoot on their butt along the ground, right.
And they always do this.
Stand up, stand up, like you're a man if you can wrestle, right?
So then I had the idea that, oh, I'll lay flat on my back, it says, fuck you.
I stole this tattoo idea off a guy that trains at Scrappy MMA and just didn't credit him at all, but...
He had it as well? I was waiting to share at Scrappy, where Jack Delatran's in this guy comes up to me in the hallway and goes, check this out.
And I was like, that's fucking genius.
So, when I was in Perth, I was like, if I could get the same tattoo.
So that was one of the most painful experiences of my entire life and it didn't heal.
It was the dumbest idea ever.
Jack Deller's fighting for the belt.
And I'm like, oh fuck it.
I've got my feet tattooed.
So then I had to train with him for his title, while my feet were in excruciating pain healing.
I was, it's a bad spot.
Usually the tattoo is the worst part.
This was like, the tattoo was very fucking bad, but the healing process was significantly worse.
We're just walking on it all the time.
You know, it's like...
You can't rest and you're on mats and it's ripping it back up.
And I'm not going to be like, oh, sorry, Jack, I can't help you prepare them because I'm a fucking idiot.
You know what I mean?
I got two stupid tattoos.
I just kept taping it up, putting socks on and training.
I've been debilitated by seven letters.
Yeah. That's one of the, one of the worst decisions of my life.
And that says a lot.
Well, I mean the MS -13 one is yet to be.
Yeah. We'll see how that goes.
Breaking News. First Australian man, in El Salvadorian prison.
That's a part of MS -13.
Fuck, I got in Mexico too, which I was in Nuevo Laredo, which is not the safest place, and I remember being like, should I be getting another gang tattoo in Mexico?
But the guy thought it was hilarious, so we're good.
Okay, what's the nomadic life like for you?
It seems like you like it.
I get brief windows when you're back in Austin for two days to like wash your pants and then turn around and go back again.
What's sort of, what's the best and what's the worst about it?
What's good and what's bad?
I mean, I don't know, I just get bored in a place.
I don't go to a place too long and just get a bit stir crazy, want to go somewhere else.
Someone sends me a message, there's an opportunity, an adventure.
I like the idea of an adventure.
Maybe it's a midlife crisis.
I don't know, but I do love living out of a suitcase and just being able to travel.
I think it's a totally different experience.
If you're staying at hostels, I think that's the vision people have. Living out of a suitcase, doing a European backpacking trip on a South American backpacking trip.
Enter -railing… Yeah, but if you can afford a semi -decent hotel, it's actually not too bad.
And what's the worst part about it?
What are the things that you don't like?
Carrying a fucking massive suitcase around the entire time.
That's where Seth again, the personal assistant, comes in.
He meets me in destinations for wardrobe changes and Xanax resupplyers.
That basically keeps me going.
It's hard to back pack full of climates you know?
Hard to fit a gay cowboy hat in there too.
That's true, that's true.
What's happening with CGI2?
We're not far off now.
CGI2 is back August 30 31 in Vegas.
Thomas Mack event center.
This time we're mixing it up.
I think the first event, we won that battle.
We proved, sort of, that Jujutsu can be exciting.
Ah, I'd have to fight a woman to do it, but it can be.
That's what lured you in, you heard about me fighting a woman, you were like, I'm there.
Yeah, yeah. Well, it's weird because I got all of this inspiration from an Ethiopian tribe about how you should treat women and then thought right, I'm going to get to see this play out on the big screen.
Honestly, the worst thought I have when I saw, like, I saw the women get whipped was really like, oh, I want to be like, guys, we can do this emotionally.
I was going to say gaslighting, I was like save your shoulders, you'll need stem cells in gl Libya.
But yeah, CGI 2 will be a teams event.
So the most exciting event I've ever participated in was a Japanese event called Quintet.
Who made up Quintet as a format?
Kazushi Sakuraba, famous Japanese MMA fighter.
And it was his contribution to grappling.
enemy it's it's sort of a iteration of a like a wrestling meet where guys are fighting off of different divisions.
But it had the last man standing sort of dynamic tour and I didn't just want to do CGI one same format again.
What's going to be two million dollars fucking expensive I thought how can we.
Cheaping out of it on this event I was like alright teams event one million dollar prize ball is really a lot of people.
CJ one sort of showed who the two best athletes in the world were and there's a lot of contention about really who's the best team in the world so is like let's try and do real teams. You pick your five best guys five sort of 80 CC Olympic divisions and we do a last man standing style event we're going to add in with some of you heavily inspired by quintet quintet would banæ your hooks.
MMA fighters are terrified of leg locks, I don't know why they always do that.
So, leg locks are allowed for us.
And we're borrowing obviously from wrestling.
So Royal Rumble style entries, entrances.
So it's basically like when we do quintet, the team lineup will already be predetermined.
So you kind of like, last man standing like, you submit your opponent, you know who's next.
We're going to leave that a mystery.
So the coach on the sideline can basically be like, He's gonna get submitted and he's like, Oh, send in whoever it's gonna be, like, it's going to be a big impact for the creative below.
Oh my God, who's coming next.
Oh, that's cool. So it's one person from each way category.
Yeah. So like basically the ADCC way divisions.
Like you take your five best guys.
We take our five best guys and we'll see it will be eight teams mashup over two days.
I'll be competing as well unfortunately I'll be facing a character that somewhat rip robust resembles gabby garcia i would say but that would be gable steveston use this guy the wrestling olympic gold medal wrestler american wrestler key would be hundred and twenty five kilos or for the unintelligent two hundred sixty five pounds.
Massive size discrepancy i think i won't think i'm wearing like.
Man, real light right now, it's been a tumultuous couple of months and I skipped a few meals.
And a desiccated diet.
Yeah, I mean part of that is handicapping myself, because I am facing a wrestler.
And wrestlers, all they have is takedowns.
Once it hits the floor, they have no idea what the fuck's going on.
And we basically we've tried to prove that when Volkhonovski out grappled Islam Makhachev and Jack DeLau, out grappling Beerao Mohamed, Australian jujitsu trumps all forms of wrestling with founder the queue of the antidote so really for me I'm gonna face off against this giant absolute giant human being.
Only has wrestling 3 by 5 minute rounds woman break up between.
All submissions legal, he's going into a career in MMA in the future, so.
Oh he's pivoting? He's pivoting, yeah.
Okay. So should be a fun one if my spine doesn't get broken.
I'm really testing the boundaries of insulting his life -long work of wrestling, tearing apart wrestling and some slight racial innuendo jokes in there as well.
So I'm scared he's gonna snap one of these days and actually do some damage to me.
This seems like a good sport.
Yeah, he has been excellent sports so far.
We are, we're going to release it soon, but we just recreated the Dirty Dancing scene together.
Me lifting him obviously.
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Yeah, I've heard that you fixed the UFC's wrestling problem.
I heard that you've solved it.
Yeah. I mean, yeah, everyone was UFC's on the decline.
Too many boring ass wrestlers taking over the divisions.
So UFC basically called me and they said, Hey, they're like, can you help us out?
Can you help Jack Della beat Bela Mohamed?
And we just fixed his wrestling overnight.
So now we've got exciting strikers taking the belts.
What's the strategy?
How do you beat wrestling?
I mean, first of all, you're not going to have the most intelligent human being in the sport of wrestling, like some of us articulate, high social skills, people in jiu -jitsu, you know what I mean, as basically jocks versus autistic people.
We're going to win the war, you know what I mean?
And really, they have the takedown, they have the initiation, but they have No, no follow up.
They're confused. They were, it's like a dog chasing a car.
They don't know what to do once they get it.
In wrestling they get the pin, it's over, the referee saves them, they stand back up.
That's where jiu -jitsu takes over.
So it's a huge hole in their game.
We'll forget about American folk style wrestling completely and we'll just talk about the broader type of wrestling.
But yeah, for me it's not a big problem.
Get taken down, that's what we take over.
Sit down. So is sitting down a solution?
Yeah, that's kind of the joke of the sport, imagine if you spend your whole life dedicated to an art where the goal was to take the other person down, but you never spend any time, thought or effort into thinking what you'd do if the fight continued on the ground.
That's the most funny, humiliating thing to me about the sport or effort.
So how do you think a fight with Gable Steveson is going to go?
Just roll the clock forward for me?
Roll the clock forward. Again, handicapping myself, I've decided to not train for this match, just like I've been training for the Gabby Garcia match on the same level of respect for both Goliath opponents here.
Really, I'm just going to come out, sit down.
He's going to come forward. First of all, he's going to just be like – if he could read, he'd be angry.
You know what I mean?
But he's a wrestler.
So he's going to see that feed.
He's going to be trying to read it, a bit confused, maybe a bit aroused.
He comes forward and gets leg locked straightaway.
That's basically my vision.
And, uh, I'll try and show some mercy here, you know, like, um, we've done a lot of damage this year to wrestling, Americans in general as well.
So maybe we let him out of a few.
But we'll definitely, we'll definitely take him out.
But he's 265 pounds.
How heavy does he need to be before it becomes hard for you to do as a wrestler?
Well, that's, I mean, that's part of the training protocol, you know?
We're finding heavier and heavier dating partners to fill the experience of being under such a heavy creature and I know you've pointed me in the right direction of some bars in Austin where we'd find that.
And Gable is just the next iteration of this.
Yeah, basically he's a giant athletic woman that can do hands down backflips.
He can do some athletic maneuvers.
So unless he, in the midst of trying to read for the first time falls over and learns.
Alright I see, so your feet tattoos are an attempt to try and confuse people?
To confuse them, yeah.
No, so it insults the people that can read and confuses the ones that can't.
Yeah, little known fact, a lot of wrestlers are dyslexic.
Okay. Does that change the way that they wrestle?
I don't know, but the feet will definitely throw out.
Spanner in the work -stream I think.
What was the fallout from ADCC around...
because presumably that happens every 2 years.
Every 2 years. So that's not going to be a competition this time around, so it'll be easier to get more teams, more people, more spectators, etc. Yeah, so last year we went head to head, we were mildly offended by petty things the owners said, so we decided to host an event the same day on someone else's.
with someone else's money, which is always the best tactic as you know at Nutonic, but really the fallout was I think we decisively won, but this is a good opportunity actually.
ADCC is on the flow grappling and I have just signed, I would say, and it's not saying much, the most lucrative contract in grappling history to now join forces and essentially take over flow grappling.
So So it's kind of a corporate takeover, so Flow Grappling hosted ADCC, they had the subscribers, I went on a malicious onslaught of an attack against ADCC, and as a result Flow Grappling as well.
We tore them down to a point of vulnerability that now the only person they could call for help was me, essentially a corporate takeover.
And now they've basically given me the reins to save grappling.
So what have they done what's the deal?
I can't talk too much about it.
Flow graphing usually is a streaming platform to host events and original content.
CJOI will remain free on Youtube.
I mean, I'm basically gonna run the operation now, we're going to fix the damage we did.
We're going to try and get the fan base back.
OK, you've caused the problem and now you're selling them the cure.
Exactly. Sounds like my dating life as well, really.
That's the gaslighting coming back in.
Gaslighting coming back in.
Yeah, nah, but we're working together with Flow now you know, because they're a Big enterprises trying to enter the support of grappling and they're trying to lock athletes down to exclusive contracts again like they're going to try to monopolize the sport of grappling and grapples weathers barely $3 to throw together as it is.
If this big organization were to monopolize a sport of grappling, the athletes themselves would lose the leverage for negotiations and getting their true value from the different events out there.
Obviously, we've got one championship as well.
The big three would be one championship, flow grappling, and UFC fight bar.
So if one of these were to take over completely and create a monopoly, then they would not have any incentive to pay the athletes more.
You're able to negotiate where else you're going to go?
Or even put more effort into the spectacle of grappling.
My thoughts are, if fake grappling is one of the most entertaining things in the world, like WWE, why can real grappling not be that?
I believe that's the root of professional wrestling, is that they used to actually have real matches, but it was too boring for the fans to watch. So they decided to have real matches behind the scenes.
And then the winner of that would determine the winner of the professional show.
Yeah. And so we were trying to steal, I want to steal the theatrics, obviously Vince McMahon, personal hero of mine.
I'm really trying to steal what he did for professional wrestling minus his personal life and bring that to the sport of jiu -jitsu.
And I think if we borrow from professional wrestling with the spectacle, even in the history of MMA, like in Japan, they used to have an event called Pride.
Pride ultimately got shut down because of the Yakuza connections, but they used to put on an incredible spectacle of an event.
They used to put a lot of effort into the production, into creative ideas to hype an event.
So me, being a promoter of this event, I'm trying to push the envelope in creating excitement in the event, and I'm worried that if any one of these organizations were to get a monopoly, Well, then there's really no, there's no reason for them to push the envelope on the events, athlete pay, because they've already controlled the market.
What else can be done to make grappling more exciting?
I mean, here's the thing, anything's exciting if there's a storyline, you know, like, so the more we invest in the story, That, whether it's fake or real, the more we get people invested in each of the individual athletes or the teams or whatever, the more excited you are going to be to watch it take place.
There's been some boring MMA fights and boxing fights out there, but the hype has been so good that even when you're watching the live event, you're on the edge of your seat.
As long as we invest in the storyline and build up the event.
CJI 1 had a huge benefit because the story was basically CJI vs ADCC, so we created this division, and people were invested in picking a site.
So we need to leverage storylines like that to invest people's time and energy into actually watching the event, whether the match is exciting or not.
Yeah, look, I enjoyed some of the fights at CJI.
I think one of the issues that you have, the art forms are subtle, but for a muggle like me, to fully be able to understand the nuance of exactly what's going on.
This is where actually being within earshot of the commentators made it way easier because they were able to translate for me what was going on.
You can tell when people are on their feet and they're spinning around.
It's like, you know, Tacket Ratolo.
That fight was fucking spectacular, right?
And I, total idiot normal person, I can tell there's something exciting going on here.
But I do wonder what, and I think that you guys helped with slanted walls, with tighter time limits, with different modes of scoring.
I think that you spoke about this last year, that that helps to incentivize people to not fight in a more boring manner, to make make it more of a spectator -friendly event.
Yeah. And really, I mean, like, that would be one angle of really why I'm trying to fight these exclusive contracts is like Tacovus, Cade Retolo is one of the most exciting matches in history.
If both these guys get locked down to exclusive contracts, we may never see that rematch. But in terms of making grappling exciting, yeah, that is a t all order to do, but I believe the Quintet format Is what will make it exciting, the last man standing style where we have teams, right?
Because if there's inactivity in Jiu Jitsu, it's boring.
When nothing's happening, it's boring.
However, imagine, like – because it's going to be different weight divisions – imagine it's Nicky Rod versus a smaller guy like Fabrizio Andre.
So it's a massive weight discrepancy.
But when you're taking the weight of the team on your shoulders as that small a guy, suddenly him surviving, simply surviving against the bigger opponent now becomes exciting.
I think we can – what Sakuraba did that made Quintet so exciting, is you can create a style of rules that someone makes the boring parts exciting just survival but mean the your team wins this series we're trying to reinvent.
How grappling is viewed to even make those boring parts exciting who are going to be the teams. So we've got Atos, New Wave, Tenth Planet, B Team, Pedigo, and then we decided just due to the difficulty like there's a lot of teams out there, but they might not be able to fill five divisions, we decided to add in three Region based Teams, so the Americas, Australia and Asia, and Europe and the UK.
So it will be filled with region based guys because it was about making sure that we get all the good athletes in there.
Because if a lot of teams like say a classic example would be Levi who made it to the final against, blue guy, blue hair?
The blue hair guy against chad ritola last year he trains at my old team Absolute MMA.
It would be tough for them to put in 5 guys.
So we're like we don't want to lose a guy like Levi.
So we're going to have region based teams, and then, Oh, that's cool.
So you'll have this sort of Avengers assemble of people that aren't usually together.
Yep. Maybe even fought against each other, maybe from rival gyms?
Yeah, exactly. Exactly.
So they have to come together and basically take on these powerhouse team names.
And then one other thing we threw in there was kind of like this idea of a wild card because really there were maybe two or three teams in the world that would have five contenders at each weight division.
So we said to each team, listen, we need four of your guys to be authentic members of your team, but you can pull in a wild card. So, so we're still keeping to the team versus team nature.
Some of it's region -based, but also you can pull in a wild card. And we exploited that fully.
Who's your wildcard?
Victor Hugo, who's one of the biggest, best guys in the sport today.
So we exploited that.
We exported it out.
We told all coaches out there early that you can pull in a wildcard, we just got ahead of them.
We jumped on Victor straightaway.
Right. I saw a photo of you and John Donohoe.
Talk me through that meeting of the minds.
So we had our falling out.
We had the Donohoe Death Squad, which I jumped the board sort of late to the party, which was Eddie Cummings, Gary Tonin, Gordon Ryan, Nikki Ryan, Nikki Rod, I jumped in.
I tore that team apart piece by piece from the inside, turning everyone against each other to exploit that into an opportunity to create the B -Team, which we have here today.
And that's obviously left a bad taste in John Donohoe's mouth.
But in the effort of getting them in the event, because for CJI 1 they supported ADCC instead.
They were going after the legacy medals and they did very good at ADCC.
I will say it was a bit of an easy ADCC.
We took most of the guys, but we've managed to put our differences aside for the greater good.
So new Wave will be submitting a team.
Me and Gordon on the other hand have not put our differences aside, but John Danaher is El Jefe.
He's the boss over there.
So me and him have reconnected.
What was that like?
Getting to chat to him for the first time in awhile.
That was good. I've ran into him a couple of times.
We've never had a full conversation, but yeah, it was definitely good to make the pass the pass.
You know what I mean?
You know, part of that conversation was Craig took things a little too far.
I was like, I'm guilty of fucking around sometimes, you know.
But when we had the conversation, yeah, we were friends again, for sure.
What do you think is the likelihood of Gordon turning up and fighting at CJI?
I mean, I've got a special cuck chair waiting for him there in the audience.
So like, I think that's going to pull him in.
You know, that's going to cool him.
Just made it however likely it was, I think you just made it slightly less likely.
The, the porcelain throne will be there waiting for him.
I'm going to guess that you think it's quite unlikely it's going to happen then.
I think you'll be there, Hay.
I think ultimately, as much as you hate me, you should love your team mates more, and he is a great team member, great training partner, in my opinion horrible human being.
But in an effort to support his training partners, I imagine he'll want to give them the best opportunity to win and his presence and coaching ability.
But not competing. Not competing.
You don't think that he would compete?
As far as I know he's never going to compete again.
Yeah and although I don't like the guy.
A great competitor, Drew in the fans, sad to see him leave, and although I persistently harassed and bullied his teammate Nicolas Marigalle who competed at ADCC and ultimately lost. He got injured in the process of losing.
It is sad to lose two of those guys in the sport.
Nicholas Marigal his shoulder injury is gonna keep him out for quite a long period of time what did he have happened.
So after after posting many pictures saying is going to be the champion he's going to win double gold.
Attacking everyone else criticizing everyone else he got defeated by a bluebell bluebell.
Fix it was aShe did that back cut I got to be a purple belt in the process.
of the hip toss, he posted his arm on the ground, destroyed everything in his shoulder.
Really really bad injury.
I think unfortunately couple of the surgeries, difficult thing to come back from.
Might need a trip to Columbia with some stem cells.
Yeah. Yeah, devil's breath.
Yeah. We could all use some devil's breath from time to time.
But really, yeah. He's out for a while too.
So we can't have him in the next CJI.
I mean, most of his theatrics, You know, like, I just like, first of all, I pick it on Meri Gahli because English is second language, is coming in on the quips, Gordon, easy target, most American human being on earth, you know what I mean?
With the banter. So it is sad to lose them, not just from the banter perspective and the insult perspective, but they are great athletes and it would have been great to have them to display people.
People, people think I have a vendetta, I'm vindictive.
There's only, and I won't say his name.
There's only one person that can't compete in CJR too.
but I don't give a ****.
What you've said about me, anything." Go for it.
Kiss the ring. Kiss a few things and we'll put you in the event.
What is the sort of future ambition for CJI?
Like what would be a great place for it to come in to land?
More money, bigger brackets, more viewership, like where are you trying to end up?
Where do we wanna end up?
I mean, my goal is just to grow the sport, you know what I mean?
Like, I've put so much effort into this sport, I've humiliated myself, I've been injured.
I've wasted my life on jiu -jitsu maths, talking to people that have can't hold a conversation.
So I want this to amount to something.
So I failed as an athlete.
So the pivot would be as a promoter.
And, um, we've had, we had some enemies that have now become friends for the first event.
We have some, I wouldn't say enemies, but some big challenges coming up at the second event in terms of, I think...
I contributed to the sport of jiu -jitsu in a way that brought so much attention and eyes that one competition that now we've got some sharks circling, trying to take it over and monopolize it.
So for me, now it's kind of a battle to make sure that we don't end up being monopolized than just some other product on the shelf.
So really, it's like, for me now, it's to ensure that there's a viable event that doesn't have exclusive contracts, that just wants the best athletes in the world to participate, put on a spectacle, exciting, sell out for the fans and that they have that alternative.
But surely there's only so, there's going to be what, five people that win ultimately, which means that there's going to be 40 people that don't win or whatever, or 35 people that don't win.
So how are the 35 going to keep taking over?
Is it that while there's a lot of exposure at this sort of an event, you can monetize on the back of this?
Me, being the man that's never won anything, I would say losing is just a marketing pivot, you know, it's how you—it's not winning or losing that matters, it's how you lose, how you sell that loss.
So really, I mean it's a great opportunity for exposure.
I don't want to just be talking about we're paying them in exposure.
But everyone, last year we paid everyone $10 ,001 to show up this year, 10 ,002 dollars to shop so for the athletes that sadly is a significant amount of money for a lot of them.
Jiu jitsu is like a top heavy payment structure but there are organisations out there that will overcome and say the top of the bill and severely underpay.
The bottom part so really like me it's like um.
Protecting the next generation of athletes that might get caught up in the allure of being attached.
to big brands and organizations and let that blind them from what Jujitsu really is and how it's different to other sports, and we have an opportunity here to kind of prevent it being monopolized.
It's interesting that a flagrant personal vanity project has now become some stalwart protective fortress against big business coming and ruining a sport.
I mean that's the thing really it's like everything I do is completely self -interested selfish and for my benefit but when it comes to a talk show, we can sell it anyway.
Like you say it's not really what you're doing or why you're doing it it's why you say you're doing and whether or not people believe it.
Which is in the politics to run against it.
I only found out about greg souders recently.
He seems like an interesting guy what do you know about him.
Interesting character yeah he's the coach of the misfit steam for america so he's putting together american squad so like you haven't gone too much into this.
It's it's a difficult conversation to listen to you know people talking about different models and jiu jitsu but yeah i believe from my understanding his.
thought process is that you don't need to be just doing static, repetitive drilling and being taught techniques.
He's sort of given the credence to people's ability to solve problems themselves, to the positional sparring.
So, I mean, I think the way, just like we do with cgi -1, the way we sell is to create the vision and create sides for people to choose on, choose to be on.
and a lot of hipsters will choose to be on the unorthodox side of things so it's like I think basically a balance of the two is usually the best approach here.
But I believe his persistence in his argument is making people reevaluate how they teach so I think ultimately he's a good influence in the sport.
Hmm, is there too much you know, you're looking at somebody who has done a total of one session of Brazilian Jiu Jitsu in his life.
But from a lot of my friends, it seems like a lot of time is spent drilling a sort of carefully deconstructing moves and then slowly sort of building those back up.
Is there a sort of tactical training hole in the world of most Brazilian Jiu Jitsu coaching at the moment?
Yeah, I would say that most Jiu Jitsu coaches aren't actually coaches.
they're just instructors they show moves.
Whereas a coach would be something different, that's something I sort of realized being involved in MMA camps, is that like a coach doesn't necessarily need to be better than the person they're training.
And Jiu -Jitsu has a historical thought process where the better the competitor was, they assume that he's going to be a better instructor or coach for them.
And I think that's sort of like a bit of a fallacy where like some of the Best guys teaching boxing even wrestling wasn't necessarily the best competitors without a great way to break things down jontana would be one of the best coaches ever.
No history of jiu -jitsu competition i think that's a massive floor in the sport of jiu -jitsu but I personally would say that like a.
The early stages you need you need to understand those moves you need to be taught those moves and then ultimately as we get to the higher level, I believe problem solving for yourself is much better because if I give you the answer quite often I think people forget it but if I had to create a situation in which you figure out a solution and I always said guys I'm like.
Look at the people leading this sport and how dumb we are making if they can figure it out you can figure it out.
You know what I mean?
Come to me with a more in -depth question than, how do I escape side control?
Give me exact circumstances in which I can give you guidance or set you on the right path.
What have you learned from all of the time that you've cornered in the UFC?
How's that sort of informed the way that you look at coaching generally and the world of fighting?
I mean, all competition has an element of performance anxiety.
But any combat sport with strikes, I think adds a severe element of risk, traumatic brain injury, right?
So for me, the stakes are just that much higher.
So when you're dealing with an athlete in those circumstances, you really do have to be very calculated and thoughtful about how you approach coaching them.
And you really have to be careful about how you build confidence.
Like a lot of people, I'm brought in as the grappling coach in a lot of fights where the goal is that they don't use their grappling.
I'm just carrying the bucket, right?" But what really I have to try to do is give them the confidence that if it were to hit the floor that what they're doing is good and that they're going to be okay.
And once they have that confidence when they're on their feet in those other positions, they aren't as scared to take risks.
Right. Because the fear of the thing that they don't feel the best at happening is stopping them from doing the thing that they are the best at with full commitment.
Exactly. like Volkhonovski against Islam.
It's like most people would have gone to an Islam makiche fight and been like, at all costs do not get taken down.
Totally different thought process to be like, we're going to play our game.
If it hits the ground, we know how to get back up.
We're going to get back up.
Obviously, Dagestan has this thing about them due to Khabib and so many undefeated fighters.
Some of those guys, I will admit, do have some padded records, but they are very talented fighters.
Like you might see a guy that was 16 and 0, but he's for 8 bus drivers and there's not many bus drivers in Pakistan.
So we really had to shatter that myth.
No one's superhuman.
No one's unbeatable.
Everyone loses. If you didn't lose, you retired too early.
So I think, yeah, just building confidence in the athletes.
But I would say the flip side of that is truth be told, I really don't like cornering MMA fights because you more feel relief that your guy got out of there healthy.
And I think one thing MMA doesn't show enough is how badly hurt these guys are after the fight.
Quite often the camera will avoid the guy that's unconscious for three minutes.
So from a coach's perspective from a friend's perspective when you see your guy unconscious for concerningly long amount of time.
that's a dramatic experience as well.
So for me coaching, you're second guessing everything.
You know, you don't want to completely change someones game because you don't have a lot of time to work with them.
But you also want to build, you need to build that confidence with them and stuff.
So it's like it's a lot on the line and how you approach helping these guys.
out to be honest it's more me doing slight adjustments or giving them confidence by reinforcing what they already do.
When it comes to selling instructionals I will tell people that I taught them everything they know but truth be told these guys are already very very good in what they do.
Like Jack Deller is one of the most incredible grapplers I've ever trained with and he's predominantly known as a striker so it's like I've learned things from him.
So these guys are obviously already very talented athletes.
How do you come to think about confidence in the world of fighting?
How can you help to build that up when it comes to yourself?
How can you sort of help to embrace that more?
To be more confident?
You need reassurance from people you trust, you know what I mean?
Like the bluebird at your gym that's hitting on the females in the gym telling them they're doing a great job, You don't miss i'll be there and i'm gonna have that much for your insurance but the only.
The more you respect someone's ability to teach or their ability to perform when they tell you doing something right.
That's gonna add a hell of a lot of confidence i think it's always better to be overconfident than underconfident in any sort of combat area i would say more fights than lost you to under confidence and overcompetence you think that's okay.
Well, I mean, walking out with that many people looking at you and so much on the line – and it's a good point to make it about striking that – I would guess that in Brazilian jiu -jitsu or sort of grappling stuff you're never – it can't happen that quickly.
There's at least a little bit of lead in.
You go, OK, I made like two mistakes here.
I made one big mistake but there was a point that this sort of went through as opposed to it does come out of nowhere when striking is like the fucking Ben Askren Masvidal thing.
It's just one incident that occurs and it's like, okay, now it's over.
But it is still… a lot of the time it's like… obviously there are some lucky shots, but like say Masvidal, he knew that if he applied pressure he knew the way Askren would lean.
So you sort of his habits right I mean that was definitely mistake on Askren's and you know.
Use a great approach on Masvidal as well you know like he sprinting towards him at a period of the flat where usually, pretty time usually are feeling out process using your hand touch who's breaking soda the rhythm there, so I think there was a bit of planning in what looked like.
a brilliant accidental lucky strike but it was well yeah i think that was calculated they knew what ascorin's reaction would be and had you have been in his corner you could have sold a instructional i would have told him how to wrestle yeah yeah so i'm just interested a little bit i again have very little understanding about what's going on but i'm pretty fascinated about different periods within sports how would you describe sort of the world tactically that BJJ is in sort of what's the trend what are the popular things that seem to be working in where do you think things are going next.
I mean you know what like it's sort of based on what competition is popular at the time so what I mean by that is.
ADCC would allow heel hooks and there was a guy that called who's my power, who's notorious for thrown on heel hooks and not letting go when people tap and just breaking their legs.
So that created an urgency even myself when I thought I might be his weight division to now learn leg locks because of us you don't want to be loose.
You want to be embarrassed by having a sort of a hole in your game there and in that particular circumstance, I was quite concerned he was going to just. Get it, rip it and not let go.
He got banned from the UFC, I'm pretty sure, for doing that.
This guy's notorious for just being a caveman and just ripping shit, but jiu -jitsu is sort of like, you're looking for holes in the sport to take advantage of it.
So once I started training that heel hook game then a tournament appear called EBI, which became like sort of a Eddie brothers event, became sort of this cultural movement.
Where we had the stars from the original Danner Hood Death Squad, like Eddie Cummings and Gordon and Gary Tonyan who we're using moves a lot of the preexisting black belts had never played with because they were banned in those competitions.
So these guys got. Basically a head star on an area of the game that was going to become very important later.
And then once people were so scared of their leg locks and created opportunities for other parts of their game.
So it's kind of like you're trying to get ahead of the curve.
So it's just trying to recognize vulnerabilities and exploit them at the right moments.
But there's been like a 50 -50 guard was a position.
Generally speaking, if the older generation of Blackbelts hate it, they hate it for a reason, because it's working.
So 50 -50 guard, deep half guard. We had a move called the biren bolo.
We had all the leg locks.
We had sort of arm traps from the back.
As ADCC became more popular and wrestling became more important.
We had this scrimmage style wrestling, which basically just scrambling for top position.
So, and that would be more reminiscent of MMA where the goal on bottom is to get up, but obviously, we don't have to worry about strikes.
So we can be a bit more creative in what we do.
So really there's a whole lot of eras and usually there's like a person that made those moves popular because they came in and beat people that they shouldn't have beaten, because they were using moves.
I was sort of cutting edge or innovative move and wants that you are the word now.
Good question I'm watching this and I don't know where we're in now to be honest I mean like again like I think we'll probably see some new emerging trends based on.
How event because it's so much at stake is a great am enterprise money there's a lot of prestige and you can get claim your team is the number one team in the world so I think a lot of coaches gonna be.
Especially a guy like Greg Seidre is gonna be trying to think of some really creative way.
Has he got a team that's going to...
He's going to control Team America, the Americas team.
Oh ok, oh right because you've had to gift coaches, who's looking after the other two?
We've got Lachlan Giles who gave me my black belt.
He did a fantastic run at at ADCC and he was helped with a medal as a 77 kilo guy in the open weight division and he hill hooked 3 monsters.
He honestly hooks within the game of your hooks that were different positions which people can invite this record any calling sixty to get outside hooks insecurity outside Oshie.
Gary tony good around with a dude getting are the agile sentaku off strong japanese times gotta confuse people and they invited that area.
And then lock and jars came in and innovated this position called backside 5050 create a massive trend so he was really influential this boy and he's made bank off the back of that respect to him and then in the uk we have a guy called faris who, I think because he's got good banter he riles up the brazilians and some excited to see some of that take place.
What do you think. it's exactly the same in terms of the walls gauntlet style thing same size pit but people in the next competitor is gonna be on the street yeah after the side and no one knows and then the coach sends them out yeah and actually that the pit itself is like guys that figure out how to utilize a pick is like we've had the UFC cage forever people worked out how to wrestle against the cage people change strategies of the cage typically speaking when guys got taken down in the early usc's to try to get away from the cage change would use the cage to get up so I think the pit and how
you use it. There's a huge opportunity for innovation now with innovation construction all cells.
How much you got to train of the last 12 months.
I'll be honest know it's I been in my position because I love training and I just want to go in and have a roll.
But when you're no, an athlete and where you're a known promoter, people see that as their opportunity to if I can impress the lack.
Oh, now's my time. And that's how you shout out to the new general manager.
Ben Kovacs a flow grappling.
I would say if you guys see him at an open mat, fight him to the bitter end, to the death.
If you submit him multiple times, I'm sure you'll get a spot on the flow grappling.
You're there. That's what everybody thinks.
That's what they think.
Yeah, they come for me, so I don't train too much. I'll shop a random gym and some dude will be there just trying to kill me.
I'm just like, what have I done to you brother?
Or a Brazilian beach. Up against the bartender.
Yeah but we choose our battles there, that guy was set or what you know what I mean?
Alright so what do the next few months got in store up until CJI?
Oh, do I want to say what I'm doing?
I don't want to say, alright we're going to London.
We're running the CJI trials where we'll do three divisions, three four -man divisions.
The winners are those who represent Team Europe and the other two guys Owen Jones and… who am I forgetting?
Bing. Cut that. Owen Jones is in there, and the other divisions will be decided by the trials.
And then I'm going to do a bit of a European Seminar run.
So hit up Europe, we'll get some content, I'm going to try and raise a bunch of money for a cause, but I'll keep that cause secret now because it might cost me my life.
If people don't run around Europe with that much money to give to a certain group of people.
Fuck yeah. Greg Jones, ladies and gentlemen.
Dude, I'll see you at CJ.
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