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Back over Memorial Day weekend, my entire extended family went to Myrtle Beach, South Carolina.
And let me tell you, fun and deliciousness were had by all.
We had soul food, fresh caught fish, southern classics, farm-to-table dining, and rustic homestyle restaurants.
Everything from more upscale restaurants, like the place we went to celebrate my mom's 80th birthday, to super casual spots on the beach.
It was all very family friendly.
By the way, did I mention that Myrtle Beach has 60 miles of beaches and so much other fun stuff?
You know, we were a little worried, like, all right, it's a family vacation, but what if it rains?
Well, we got great weather, so it was perfect.
But if it had rained...
There's so much other stuff to do in Myrtle Beach.
All kinds of fun family activities.
Also, these beautiful areas.
One's called Broadway at the Beach.
It's like this lake with sort of shopping and activities and movies and even like amusements, restaurants.
You walk around the lake.
It's really beautiful.
Since we came back, Janie has been telling anyone who will listen that she can't wait to go back to Myrtle Beach.
So you should go.
Head to visitmyrtlebeach.com.
Start planning your trip.
Sirius XM Podcasts.
Hey, it's Dan here, and let me tell you, this reheat has to be one of the nerdiest, sporkful episodes that we have ever done.
And I think about this one all the time because it really delves into the relationship between the foods we eat and crave and our brain chemistry.
And in order to understand all that, I spent a day running all around Philadelphia to sample the classics, cheesesteaks, of course, Scrapple, and the underappreciated Philly pork sandwich.
And then I sit down with a researcher at Philly's Monell Chemical Census Center to talk about the science of appetite and why everything I just ate was so frigging good.
This one's going to stick with you.
Now, remember, if there's an episode of The Sporkful you want us to pull out of the deep freezer and reheat, send me an email or voice memo to hello at sporkful.com.
Tell me your first name, location, what episode you want to hear and why.
Thanks so much and enjoy.
So, John, one of the waitresses sent me over to you to talk to you because they said you come here every week to get Scrapple.
Is that right?
That's right.
There's nothing more Philly than Scrapple and get it well done.
Imagine that you're talking to someone who's never been to Philly, never had Scrapple.
I want you to describe it to this person.
Scrapple is... That's hard to describe.
You got to taste it.
It's better than bacon.
This is The Sporkful.
It's not for foodies, it's for eaters.
I'm Dan Pashman.
Each week on our show, we obsess about food to learn more about people.
Today on the show, we run around Philadelphia eating the city's most iconic foods.
Scrapple, pork sandwiches, and of course, cheesesteaks.
Then, we're gonna take samples of those foods back to Philly's Monell Chemical Senses Center to talk with a scientist about what makes them so delicious.
Why do our brains go crazy for the melted cheese on a cheesesteak?
What is it about the texture of Scrapple's crispy fried goodness?
And how does surface area to volume ratio make the pork sandwich more flavorful?
Wrap this episode up in a paper bag and the grease will soak right through.
My producer, Ann, and I hopped on the train and headed down to Philly.
On the ride, we talked strategy, specifically the proper way to order a classic Philly cheesesteak with Cheez Whiz.
Philly cheesesteak.
Is that a classic Philly cheesesteak?
That's probably.
I mean, I think we got to learn a little bit about the right way to order it, which is intimidating to me, but I think it's just whiz.
You just say whiz, and then they know.
I got to get over that.
Yeah.
That just sounds so wrong.
Yeah.
If you want onions, you say wit.
You say what?
Like with, but as if you have a thick Philly accent.
Oh, okay.
So it's just like if you want a cheesesteak with onions, with cheese whiz, you say whiz wit, and that's all you have to say, and they'll know.
Wow, this is like a whole different language, like code.
Yeah, aren't you taking Hindi?
I am, yeah.
That's not going to help you here.
No, not one bit.
We stepped off the train, two intrepid eaters trying to find our way in a foreign land.
But cheesesteak was stop number three.
First stop, Reading Terminal Market.
It's a sprawling indoor wonderland where you can get just about every type of food in Philly all in one spot.
We made our way to the Down Home Diner,
Which is basically an old-school diner plopped into a corner of this huge market.
It's got a jukebox, shiny metallic finishes everywhere, cozy booths, and a row of stools at a counter.
And we went there to get one food.
Scrapple.
I talked to a middle-aged woman named Susan, who is in from Abington, PA. Do you make Scrapple at home?
Yeah, I do.
Tell me how you make it.
It comes in a bar.
Oh, so you buy it, like, pre-turning to a bar.
Yeah.
And then you, like, fry it up, basically.
Yeah, pretty much.
And do you know what's in the bar?
Or is it better to not know?
I kind of know a little bit of what's in there because I did a...
When I was, like, in fourth grade, they took us to a meatpacking plant.
Couldn't eat hot dogs for a long time after that.
But, you know, they kind of just said that everything that they don't put in the hot dogs goes in the scrapple.
So kind of like...
I'm going to try some scrapple.
Do you want to try a taste of my scrapple?
You can tell me how it measures up.
Sure.
All right, all right, cool.
Okay, I'm going to cut in here.
Enough suspense.
I'm going to tell you what scrapple is.
It's made of pork scraps and trimmings, fat, salt, buckwheat flour, and cornmeal, all pureed together, so it's one consistency.
A single piece is shaped like a thick slice of bread.
Sort of looks like if you took a block of stuffing and fried it.
It's crispy on the outside, soft and creamy on the inside.
Almost like pan-fried polenta, if you've ever had polenta.
Okay, back to the diner.
It's crispy, but it's soft inside, which is why I like it.
It's sort of just like a block of fried salty fat.
My arteries might be hardening, but my stomach goes, thank you.
Next up, the Philly Roast Pork Sandwich at Denick's.
Now the roast pork sandwich is not as well known nationally as the cheesesteak, but it may be just as beloved in the city.
It's thin sliced roast pork, provolone cheese, and broccoli rabe, which is a crunchy, stringy, somewhat bitter member of the broccoli family.
And the real key is they pour the juices from the pork on top of the sandwich.
And that soaks into the bread.
All right, Philly roast pork sandwich from Denix.
I'm going in.
Wow.
It's really good.
I need to eat more.
Yeah, I really like that bitter edge in the broccoli.
I will say...
This sandwich does prove the validity of my objection to all sandwiches on hinged buns.
Okay.
Because they take the hinged bread, they fill it from bottom to top.
They go provolone, then pork, then broccoli rabe.
Yeah.
It's really hard.
So they fill it in that V formation.
Then you kind of, if you can eat it in the V, you're not getting an ideal experience.
If you turn it sideways, now the sandwich is left to right and you have broccoli rabe on one side and provolone on the other.
It's very hard to get a bite with the broccoli rabe and the cheese all in the same bite without rearranging it.
Anne, are you eating the broccoli rabe out of the sandwich?
Yes.
After we finished, we talked to some other eaters at De Nicks.
What's your name?
My name is Carolyn.
And what's your name?
Shamika.
Shamika.
How often do you guys come here?
I come only two times a year because I work actually in King of Pressure.
So I'm down here shopping.
That's it.
I wasn't going home without this pork sandwich with the broccoli rabe and the short provolone cheese.
What do you think makes the one here especially good?
It's the best I ever had.
Why?
Because I love it.
Do you ever, you know one thing I was noticing because I just ate one is I love like over time it sits and the juice gets into the bread.
I love mine's wet.
Do you order it extra wet?
Yes.
I just did.
I can't wait to bite it.
Do you think it would make sense to order it with like extra juice on the side and you could dip it in?
Oh.
No, Shamika says no.
Why not?
It's not the same.
I like it nice, silky, and wet.
Can a Philly pork sandwich ever be too wet?
No.
No.
I got to tell you, before I had one, I would have maybe disagreed with you.
I would have said, but what if it starts to fall apart?
What if the bread turns soggy?
Now that I've had one, I think you're right.
It can't get too wet.
You're right about that.
Before we left, we talked to one of the chefs at Denick's.
He said if he's bringing home a pork sandwich for dinner, he'll make it at four in the afternoon.
So it's got time to get nice and saturated before he eats it around seven.
Oh, man, that sounds good.
Anyway, we left there and headed over to Sunny's in Old City for cheesesteaks.
I talked with the manager, Christina.
What do you think makes Sunny's cheesesteaks better than other cheesesteaks?
It's definitely our ribeye meat, I would say.
Our meat, you don't have to add anything.
It's also the bread.
If you have fresh Italian bakery bread, you're good to go.
And one of the things I noticed is that you guys warm the bread before you put the meat on it.
Is that right?
Yes.
It's getting toasted a little bit over there?
Yeah.
To me, that's so important because I don't like having a hot sandwich.
Sandwich on a cold bun.
Exactly.
I might as well just go get a cold cut sandwich then.
Right.
Exactly.
That's right.
So it's just everything just all blends in together with the cheese, the hot bread, the juicy meat.
It's just a great sandwich.
Then I talked to a guy there named Drew.
He wasn't eating anything.
He said he's going through a vegetarian phase.
He was keeping a friend company.
But he had plenty of opinions about cheesesteak.
Which cheese do you go with?
As an African-American male living in Philadelphia, I have to say American cheese is the way to go.
It's funny because the cheese is a big point of contention.
I actually think this is a great topic to bring up.
Yeah, please tell me.
With race relations, you know, sparking all over the world.
Yeah, I'm going to sit down.
Let's talk.
Go on.
Essentially, I believe that the white man has a predisposition towards cheese whizs.
The African-American male, for some reason, we can only eat American cheese, man.
So you think that Philly cheesesteak preferences break down along racial lines?
It gets that serious.
It gets that serious.
I don't get the whole Cheez Whiz thing.
I don't get it.
I don't understand why it was even started.
What other thing do you put Cheez Whiz on?
Like really bad nachos at a ballpark, maybe.
And that's asking for a two-hour bathroom trip.
Hi, how are you?
Hi.
I think I'm ready to order.
Are you?
Yeah, could I please have one whiz with, one American with?
Okay.
And one provolone with.
You got it.
Pretty soon, the cheesesteaks arrived, and it was time to eat.
See, and look here.
So if people can picture this, these cheesesteaks have been served to us in those sort of paper boats.
And with the American Improv alone, the cheese is starting to cool and congeal a bit.
With the Cheez Whiz, it's actually flowing downward and pooling.
There's a little puddle of Cheez Whiz sauce.
It's sort of like meat fat mixed with Cheez Whiz pooling at the bottom of the boat.
There's a big difference in consistency.
This is going to sound bad.
I think I like the Whiz better.
Why?
Texture
It gets in the crannies and the nooks
It's it's there it's like everywhere
Yeah it's funny you're saying that because i came in here i used to be totally against the whiz and the provolone you would think is sort of like it has the most flavor
But the problem here's the thing with the provolone
Tell me what you think of this and i feel like the provolone
Tastes more like a steak sandwich with cheese on it
Yeah i agree because they're like two separate entities
Right it doesn't taste like a cheese steak and a cheese steak is it's really
You're gonna think of it less as meat with cheese on top more like a cheese sauce
The question is why is cheese whiz so appealing to human taste buds and stomachs
I don't know
But I know someone who does.
Oh man, what a segue.
We've got some real audio professionals running this show.
When I figure out who they are, I'll tell you.
Coming up, I will take samples of Scrapple from the Down Home Diner, pork sandwich from Denick's, and cheesesteak from Sonny's, and bring them all to Philly's Monell Chemical Senses Center.
I'll ask a scientist why Cheez Whiz tastes so good on a cheesesteak, despite all rational arguments to the contrary.
Stick around.
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Welcome back to another Sporkful Reheat.
I'm Dan Pashman.
A lot of times people want to ask me, like, oh, what are you cooking?
What restaurants are you going to?
They ask Emma and Andres and the whole Sporkful team the same questions.
Well, it turns out we provide a listener service to you that includes that information.
It's our newsletter.
We don't send it out all the time.
We're not going to spam you.
We're just going to send you useful information, recipes, restaurant information, links to articles that we're reading, shows that we're watching.
And guess what else?
You'll be automatically entered into giveaways for cookbooks featured on the show as long as you live in the US or Canada.
That's also where I'll email you to tell you about like special sales happening on this Folini website by discounts on pasta and stuff.
So there are a lot of benefits and you can sign up right now while you're listening.
Head on over to sporkful.com slash newsletter to sign up today.
Again, that's sporkful.com slash newsletter.
Thanks.
Now, back to Philly.
I took all the foods we ate around the city, cheesesteak, scrapple, and that amazing pork sandwich, to Dr. Marci Pelshaw.
She's a researcher at the Monell Chemical Senses Center.
She studies where our food preferences and cravings come from.
Her work covers everything from picky eating and food addiction to asparagus pee.
Or as she put it in a 2010 academic paper, excretion and perception of a characteristic odor in urine after asparagus ingestion, a psychophysical and genetic study.
I'll go ahead and translate the title, Asparagus Pee, What's the Deal?
Okay.
The deal is some people notice a smell that's sometimes described as rotten cabbage, sometimes vegetable soup, but a change in the odor of their urine after they eat asparagus.
So we did a study where people peed before the asparagus and after the asparagus.
And then not only did everyone donate pee, but then...
They came and smelled everybody else's pee.
And we were able to show that some people actually have an enhanced ability to detect this odor.
And other people don't get it that much unless you point it out to them and then they kind of get it.
But does everyone get asparagus pee when they eat asparagus?
We think so.
Dr. Palashaw is Philly born and bred, so she grew up with all the foods I brought her.
My father grew up in South Philly on 4th Street, right, you know, near Jim Spakes, which is one of the, I don't know if it was there when he was a kid.
But anyway, he grew up in South Philly and he never did Cheez Whiz, but that is the Philadelphia standard these days.
What kind of cheese do you put on your cheesesteak?
I like a mild provolone.
Marcy, I want you to try a bite with the Cheez Whiz.
Okay.
The Cheez Whiz is sort of like gravy.
I got to tell you, so Ann and I... Mm-hmm.
Went to get the cheesesteaks after having eaten Scrapple and the Philly pork sandwich.
And neither one of us was especially hungry.
And neither of us was expecting to especially like the Cheez Whiz one.
Yeah.
Cheez Whiz is kind of gross.
But we both came away from it liking it.
The cheese whiz, the best.
And I think what helped us is that we thought of it in a different way.
When you do it with provolone, it's like a steak sandwich with cheese melted on it.
Yeah.
When you do it with cheese whiz, it's a cheese steak.
The cheese and the steak become one.
It's really more like a sauce.
I can see your point.
Yes.
Why is cheese so much more delicious when it's melted?
Anything warm releases more aroma than when it's cold.
You get much more flavor from the cheese.
I also think that melted cheese sort of
I don't know.
Somehow the fat becomes more obvious.
The oil comes to the surface.
The oils of the cheese come to the surface.
And what about something like Cheez Whiz, something that's just like totally or almost completely artificial?
That wouldn't appear to be evolutionary and we didn't evolve to love – there was no Cheez Whiz in caveman days.
No, no.
So why do we love Cheez Whiz?
Salt and fat.
Why do we love Nutella?
Sugar and fat.
Sugar, right.
And chocolate.
Should we eat a little Scrapple?
Yes.
With Scrapple, it seems to me that texture is such a huge part of it.
It's crispy on the outside and it's soft, like polenta.
Yeah.
Exactly.
In the middle.
Right.
What is it about crisp?
What is it about that texture that makes us love it so?
Well, there's been speculation by scientists.
One guy was interested in why people like ice cream so much.
He came up with this idea of dynamic contrast.
The idea is that people like textures that change while they're in your mouth.
Ice cream would be something that you'd put in as a solid.
It would melt.
Or you can have a mixture of textures in each bite, and Scrapple is a perfect example of that.
You get the crunchy and the squishy together.
That's why people like their cereal more when they first put it in the bowl and put the milk on.
What I like to do sometimes with cereal is to put some in, pour a little milk in, let it sit for a couple minutes and then put more cereal in and then mix them together and eat it right away.
And then you have dynamic contrast.
Exactly.
More dynamic contrast.
Why didn't everybody else think of this?
Can I be an associate member of Monell now because of that idea?
What else?
Talk to me more about Scrapple and the sensation of it.
It just seems like a salt and fat delivery system.
Yes, it is.
What happens after you eat something like Scrapple is it's sort of rewarding.
You're not necessarily aware of it.
Like it activates the pleasure centers.
Yes.
So after a meal, your brain sort of registers, okay, I liked this.
I didn't like that.
Let's remember to go back to that thing again.
But like after you eat a lot, like after you – I don't know.
Let's say run around Philadelphia eating cheesesteaks, pork sandwiches and scrapple like some people here just recently did and you feel like you ate too much and you feel kind of tired and gross.
Why doesn't your brain remember that and stop you from doing that the next time?
Well, adults have kind of learned to limit themselves.
But it's an intellectual limit.
Yeah.
Exactly.
Right.
You're using your conscious brain to tell your subconscious brain to shut up.
But that's hard.
Yes, it is.
It is.
Now, if you become nauseous, really nauseous, you may learn an aversion to one or more of the components of the meal.
Yeah, that happened to me with tequila at my senior prom.
Yeah.
But did you stop drinking completely?
No, but I couldn't drink tequila for years.
Right.
Like even the smell of it made me nauseous.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I did my dissertation on these flavor aversions and they're very long lasting because.
People can't get near enough to the food to try it again.
If they can make themselves try it again, the aversion reverses very quickly.
Coming up, Dr. Pellshaw and I sample some Philly Italian pork sandwich.
Again, in the name of science.
That's after the break.
Stick around.
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Welcome back.
Let's return now to my conversation with Dr. Marci Pelshaw of the Monell Chemical Senses Center.
Let's move on.
Let's eat some – will you have a bite of an Italian pork sandwich for me?
Yes.
Now, one of the things that the guy at Denix told me, he said the sandwich is better when it sits for a little while, when it gets all soggy like this.
Mm-hmm.
I can see that.
This is a texture thing.
You know, the crust is still a little bit crusty.
It's still a tiny bit crusty on the outside.
The bread has soaked up some of the flavor from the pork.
Cutting the pork thinly is very important, and in a cheesesteak also.
Why is that important on a texture level in terms of perception?
Yeah.
It's almost like caviar, you know, all these little bits in every bite.
Well, doesn't it also give you more flavor because there's more surface area of pork to land on your tongue?
Excellent.
Maybe you can be a member.
Yes.
I'm going to get the jacket and everything.
Oh, my God.
And, you know, so you have the texture of the broccoli, Rob, even though it's cooked.
You know, a little touch of bitter, the salt, the fat, those little flakes of pork, not too much work chewing.
Isn't that wonderful?
And this gets to one of the bedrock issues that we talk about in the Sporkful, which is the debate between bite consistency and bite variety.
Yeah.
Now, there's not always a right and a wrong.
Some foods you want bite consistency.
Some foods you want bite variety.
Okay.
One of the things that I think people who like bite variety argue for is that they say they kind of like a surprise or they like that differentiation.
They like, oh, that was a bite with a lot of cheese.
What can you tell me about the kind of person who is more likely to prefer that eating experience?
I actually have some ideas about that.
Yes, please.
Again, you know, people differ in how much they like new foods.
And people who don't like new foods worry a lot about getting surprised.
There are other people for whom, you know, oh, let's go to dim sum.
That's the best thing ever.
And they like to bite into a dumpling not knowing what they're about to get.
Right.
And where do those differences come from?
Is that because of the way that we were raised or is it partly in our DNA?
Yes.
Yeah, it comes from both.
All right.
Well, Marci Pellishott, associate member and researcher at the Monell Chemical Senses Center.
Thank you so much.
It's been a pleasure.
You can keep that cheesesteak.
Thank you.
I gotta tell you, by the time we were finished recording this episode, I felt pretty full and gross.
But after listening back to it all just now, I am starving.
I hope you are too.
One quick note here, we taped this episode a few years back, and since then, Dr. Pelshaw has retired from the Monell Center.
But she's still living in Philly, which means she's still got easy access to pork sandwiches.
This show is produced by me, along with senior producer.
And Sani.
And associate producer.
We get music help from Black Label Music.
The Sporkful is a production of Stitcher.
Our executive producers are Chris Bannon and Daisy Rosario.
Until next time, I'm Dan Pashman.
I'm Connor Jones from Philadelphia, reminding you to eat more, eat better, and eat more better.
This reheat was produced by Gianna Palmer.
The team that produces The Sporkful today includes me, along with managing producer Emma Morgenstern, and senior producer Andres O'Hara.
Our technical director is Jared O'Connell.
Music help from Black Label Music.
The Sporkful is a production of SiriusXM Podcasts.
Our executive producer is Camille Stanley.
And hey, did you know you can listen to The Sporkful on the SiriusXM app?
Yes, the SiriusXM app has all your favorite podcasts, plus over 200 ad-free music channels curated by genre and era.
Plus live sports coverage.
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And there's interviews with A-list stars and so much more.
It's everything you want in a podcast app and music app all rolled into one.
And right now, Sporkful listeners can get three months free of the SiriusXM app by going to SiriusXM.com slash Sporkful.
Until next time, I'm Dan Pashman.
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